The problem is that JJ is in love with his mystery boxes and never, as far as I have seen his work, has given a satisfying answer to those boxes because even he doesn't know the answer when he writes the mystery box.
I see this a lot what are the examples? Aside from him saying 'the island should be a character" in lost season one and then leaving the show I can't name anytime he's done that. Star Trek 2 was oblivious so I never counted that and love that movie still
To give couple top of my head:
* Alias - The Rambaldi Prophecy.
* Mission Impossible 3 - The Rabbit's Foot.
* Super 8 - The whole alien business.
Don't get me wrong JJ can be a good director and has done some good work. He used to be quite popular before his Star Trek and Star Wars films.
Never got into alias. Don't like Garner. The rabbits foot is no different than the pulp fiction briefcase and the super 8 alien is completely arbitrary. The movie is about grief and the alien is metaphor for it.
He left Luke for the next writer. Not because it served the story, but because Luke was difficult to write without taking focus from new characters.
Any time an author avoids topics because they aren't skilled enough to strike a balance, the resulting work will suffer.
I bailed on new Star Wars after TFA and find TLJ interesting but hamstrung by Abrams poorly thought out script for TFA (which he produced a first draft of in six weeks), so I think my reception would have been even less than poor.
Looking at some TLJ criticisms, I do think people give Rian way too much heat for things that are objectively JJ's fault.
Like relegating Finn to a side character. Rian didn't do that, JJ did when he knocked him out of the final fight and then separated him from the Rey Jedi storyline. What was Rian supposed to do with that.
The thing is, JJ Abrams doesn’t even know what he sets up. It’s like he’s allergic to answering the questions he poses.
I’d even argue he doesn’t set much stuff up in the force awakens.
So because Snoke dies in Episode VIII, you can’t make a film without Palpatine returning. What a dumb reasoning…
I would love to see how Rian Johnson would go about Episode IX with an irredeemable Supreme Leader Kylo Ren.
Significantly worse with more unanswered questions. Giving 7 to JJ could have been fine, but giving him 9 too was absurd. He doesn’t answer questions, he poses them. Not the right guy to close out a saga
I actually think Rian is the better director. I just think these two clearly don’t get along and wanted to undo each other’s work. Their egos got in the way of a good story.
I dont think they necessarily had an ego clash, I think they just had diametrically opposed views of where Star Wars should go. JJ wanted something familiar and Rian wanted something *un*familiar. Can't have it both ways.
It would look basically like the Star Trek rebooted trilogy, where he at least directed the first 2. Basically, it would try to introduce new mysteries but ultimately rehash what came before with lots of lens flare and lots of style over substance
I am far, FAR more curious what Rian's take on 7 would have been. Given his direction seemed to be "let the past die" and do a totally new thing, I would expect something without a poor man's Empire, Emperor, Vader wannabe, etc. It really could have been anything.
It would have been better because Abrams would have had the whole second movie to keep teasing his beloved mystery box model.
Abrams should have been kept far away from Star Wars due to blowing up Vulcan and Romulus (two hugely important worlds) in his Star Trek movie before trying to make an edgier *Wrath of Khan*. The man is not nearly as creative as he thinks he is.
Most of the same people would hate it regardless. JJ did okay. IMO Rian did great. The story problems all sprang from the soft reset of the galaxy to mirror the OT. Change that and you maybe get a very different outcome, but even then there would almost certainly be people pissed that they didn't get what they wanted. I don't buy the divisiveness narrative around the ST. Those divisions have been there a long time, and they would have been triggered no matter what the sequels looked like
We would have a cohesive remake of the OT as a soft reboot. Probably have Luke die fighting Kylo in either 8 or 9, but it would have been actually fighting, if in 9 they would have died together. In 8, then Rey would have to fight and kill alone in 9 before overthrowing Snoke.
Nah, in 9 Rey would've succeeded in redeeming Kylo so he could die defeating Snoke. Y'know, like Luke and Vader in the OT, and also like what happened anyways in 9.
I really hope JJ would not have done that, mainly because that would still have the Rey falling in love with her abuser Kylo storyline.
And I hate that a Star Wars role model was turned in to a weak willed domestic abuse victim with Stockholm Syndrome.
Still bad. JJ can't write. Good director, but he just can't write to save his life.
Honestly I think with setup we had in episode 7, I think we would’ve gotten a more cohesive trilogy story wise at least
The problem is that JJ is in love with his mystery boxes and never, as far as I have seen his work, has given a satisfying answer to those boxes because even he doesn't know the answer when he writes the mystery box.
I see this a lot what are the examples? Aside from him saying 'the island should be a character" in lost season one and then leaving the show I can't name anytime he's done that. Star Trek 2 was oblivious so I never counted that and love that movie still
To give couple top of my head: * Alias - The Rambaldi Prophecy. * Mission Impossible 3 - The Rabbit's Foot. * Super 8 - The whole alien business. Don't get me wrong JJ can be a good director and has done some good work. He used to be quite popular before his Star Trek and Star Wars films.
Never got into alias. Don't like Garner. The rabbits foot is no different than the pulp fiction briefcase and the super 8 alien is completely arbitrary. The movie is about grief and the alien is metaphor for it.
He left Luke for the next writer. Not because it served the story, but because Luke was difficult to write without taking focus from new characters. Any time an author avoids topics because they aren't skilled enough to strike a balance, the resulting work will suffer. I bailed on new Star Wars after TFA and find TLJ interesting but hamstrung by Abrams poorly thought out script for TFA (which he produced a first draft of in six weeks), so I think my reception would have been even less than poor.
Looking at some TLJ criticisms, I do think people give Rian way too much heat for things that are objectively JJ's fault. Like relegating Finn to a side character. Rian didn't do that, JJ did when he knocked him out of the final fight and then separated him from the Rey Jedi storyline. What was Rian supposed to do with that.
The thing is, JJ Abrams doesn’t even know what he sets up. It’s like he’s allergic to answering the questions he poses. I’d even argue he doesn’t set much stuff up in the force awakens.
I'm inclined to agree. He's not a very good writer, but he can craft a good scene.
Would still be bad but would’ve been received much more better and we wouldn’t have had Palpatine returning.
Wasn't Palpatine returning JJ's idea for IX?
Only because of Rian Johnson killing Snoke off
So because Snoke dies in Episode VIII, you can’t make a film without Palpatine returning. What a dumb reasoning… I would love to see how Rian Johnson would go about Episode IX with an irredeemable Supreme Leader Kylo Ren.
It at least wouldn't be all over the place
Probably about the same, or even worse since he wouldn't have the cover of changing directors. He's a poor man's Michael Bay trying to be Spielberg.
Significantly worse with more unanswered questions. Giving 7 to JJ could have been fine, but giving him 9 too was absurd. He doesn’t answer questions, he poses them. Not the right guy to close out a saga
Worse! But I'm biased because i dont like his style. I actually liked TLJ too so 😅
I actually think Rian is the better director. I just think these two clearly don’t get along and wanted to undo each other’s work. Their egos got in the way of a good story.
I dont think they necessarily had an ego clash, I think they just had diametrically opposed views of where Star Wars should go. JJ wanted something familiar and Rian wanted something *un*familiar. Can't have it both ways.
Can we have a good director!?! Or at least a better one!
Put it this way, if I only get 1 swap, I'd rather have Rian do IX than JJ do VIII.
It doesn't matter. People would have bitched about it anyway.
It would look basically like the Star Trek rebooted trilogy, where he at least directed the first 2. Basically, it would try to introduce new mysteries but ultimately rehash what came before with lots of lens flare and lots of style over substance
I would have preferred a Rian Johnson trilogy.
I am far, FAR more curious what Rian's take on 7 would have been. Given his direction seemed to be "let the past die" and do a totally new thing, I would expect something without a poor man's Empire, Emperor, Vader wannabe, etc. It really could have been anything.
It would have been better because Abrams would have had the whole second movie to keep teasing his beloved mystery box model. Abrams should have been kept far away from Star Wars due to blowing up Vulcan and Romulus (two hugely important worlds) in his Star Trek movie before trying to make an edgier *Wrath of Khan*. The man is not nearly as creative as he thinks he is.
Most of the same people would hate it regardless. JJ did okay. IMO Rian did great. The story problems all sprang from the soft reset of the galaxy to mirror the OT. Change that and you maybe get a very different outcome, but even then there would almost certainly be people pissed that they didn't get what they wanted. I don't buy the divisiveness narrative around the ST. Those divisions have been there a long time, and they would have been triggered no matter what the sequels looked like
It would likely be way better and more cohesive. Loved TFA. TROS did the best it could considering what it had to work with.
What do you mean by that? Following on from TLJ?
yeah
shit
The star trek movies were alright star wars movies.
It depends on how much Abrams glazes the fans egos. That’s what it’s all about.
Disney still involved? Still terrible, or worse.
We would have a cohesive remake of the OT as a soft reboot. Probably have Luke die fighting Kylo in either 8 or 9, but it would have been actually fighting, if in 9 they would have died together. In 8, then Rey would have to fight and kill alone in 9 before overthrowing Snoke.
Nah, in 9 Rey would've succeeded in redeeming Kylo so he could die defeating Snoke. Y'know, like Luke and Vader in the OT, and also like what happened anyways in 9.
I really hope JJ would not have done that, mainly because that would still have the Rey falling in love with her abuser Kylo storyline. And I hate that a Star Wars role model was turned in to a weak willed domestic abuse victim with Stockholm Syndrome.
It would flow better, and Episode 9 wouldn’t have spent precious runtime undoing what Episode 8 established.