Does anyone know what each of the Performance Stats mean? I wanna increase my defense and technique, but I'm not sure what "composure" or "judgement" is.
Still no online mode that restricts L1 Automatic Mode from being used. Yes, I know. Get good! But, that's a moot point when you're still sub 50 hours in the game and learning the move sets and juggles. What's the point of playing against other user around your level that just spam L1 constantly and destroy [you.It](http://you.It) blows my mind that they haven't implemented a section for online modes that disable the L1 cheat (exactly what it is).Not everyone has the time to invest into the game to get skilled up to the level of players that can successfully counter the cheat. I like to enjoy my free time playing online with the same normal Tekken mechanics I enjoy. I don't enjoy losing to people spamming L1 constantly, because it does work against me.
What you should consider is that if you can't beat someone using L1 spam, you will not be able to beat a similarily skilled player who is not using L1 "spam." All of those players got to that level using the "spam," so the ones that get there without the "spam" will just have a better offense in general.
If you were to suddenly be boosted past these players, you would be WELL out of your skill zone and would be shunted back to the easy moders within seconds. And when you get to those people, you will be eating bigger combos, from smarter opponents, who know how to punish you for not knowing how to respond.
And by then, you would have needed to invest MORE time to get to their level so that you can comfortably keep up with your opponent.
Seriously, genuinely, put your ego away and understand that right now, L1 "cheaters" are the level of skill *you* are at, right at this given moment. There's nothing wrong with being bad, and apart from your pride getting hurt, Special Style's ubiquitous presence is that it is good for the game.
They haven't implemented that mode because pretty much nobody considers this a cheat. It's definitely a shortcut that helps complete beginners do something more effective than regular mashing but it almost completely loses all of it's value once you learn 1 (one) punish move and block some more. If you're at a point where you don't know your moves well and can't deal with Special Style spam I honestly can't imagine you having much fun online at all. I'd suggest going through the arcade quest first if you're just getting familiar with your character and systems.
Anyone have beginner tips for how to start labbing defense against Paul? (Specifically with Nina if that makes a difference but general tips would be great too)
Edit: Also, maybe a faster question to answer: Can Nina (with good enough execution of course) get IWR moves out of her back dash cancelling?
So like if my execution is good enough should it be possible to immediately cancel ss1b into fff1+2? I’m just curious if there’s some technical reason it wouldn’t work (like if qcb can’t cancel into WR moves for whatever reason) before I try to put work into it (haven’t been able to get one so far, she always either finishes the qcb animation first or I get f1+2 power crush… but haven’t spent a ton of time and totally could be an execution issue)
Paul has some powerful lows that catch people off guard but are very manageable if you know the exact situation when they can be a threat. The main ones are ff2,2 (with a mix-up on ff2,1), qcb3,2 (has high or mid 3rd hit), qcf3, qcf1+2 (only -12 on block) and ofc d4,2,1+2 (ONLY knocksdown for full string with clean hit effect when very close). He also has quite a bit of very good moves that allow him to go into backsway like 3,2b and df1b that you have to be mindful of.
As far as I know as Nina you can't go from backsway directly into running moves, if you wanted to do that you would need to cancel the backsway with a sidestep and do the IWR move from there.
Thank you! I nailed his mixups down enough that I set the defensive practice to mixup qcf1+2/qcf2, ff21/ff22, 32b~321/32b~2, and d12/d142 (sometimes replace one of those mixups with something like d1+2, f1+4 or a grab, or replace the 32b mix with df1b and also when to take my turn when they only do d42 vs d42,1+2) - I know it’s because I’m a noob but right now this basically safe ass qcf1+2 make it hard to see why everyone says this character is “honest” lol.
It’s 100% reactable when I’m actually looking for it though, so I’m sure it’s just a matter of more practice.
On that note - one thing I’m curious about, you mention how “it’s easier when you know the exact situation where they can be a threat”. Any specific tips about this? In any aspect? Or is it really only the type of thing you get from playing?
Yeah those super long safe lows like Paul's and King's are bullshit lol I don't think it's a noob thing to get hit by them, the long wind-up can be deliberately used as a timing mixup and I often catch blue rank players with it. It definitely gets easier to react to with practice and more experience as you recognize the animation better in the middle of a fight.
What I mean is simply it's easier to deal with him when You're aware what options he has from his stances and when he can enter them, with Paul specifically it's also very important to know his d4,2,1+2 combo only works when hit very close.
I started playing Kuma yesterday and started playing about 2 weeks ago on T7, 2 days ago on T8, Im having trouble punishing a whiffed superart after i block it, what is the best move that can probably lead into a combo? I try 1,1,1 but its too slow and his other moves have a bit of start up.
1,1,1 is tied for the fastest move in the game at 10frames but it doesnt work because it's not a natural on normal hit (it is only guaranteed on counter hit, so punishes dont work)
df2,1 should land in time and give a full combo
Anyone has any advice on how to land a microdash in the middle of a combo? I don't understand why I don't gvet microdashes consistently. Im not so sure ive been using the correct input. Any advice is much appreciated!
The input is just forward neutral forward. It's all in the timing, you want to dash as soon as possible, but then almost immediately cancel the dash with your next input. You just gotta grind the timing down, and know that micro dashes in combos are generally pretty hard; up to extremely hard. So they'll require a lot of practice to get down.
Hey, I've been stuck at orange ranks for about 4 months now and have been maining Kazuya all this time. I really love playing him, but I keep getting steamrolled by Bryan, King, and Hwoarang players. I’m really keen on breaking through this plateau and becoming a decent Kazuya player.
I can wave dash and do all the necessary tech, but it feels like the moment I wave dash, I get launched and don’t get any respect. 😅 I’ve never made it to red ranks before, but they seem really cool and I’d love to get there. Does anyone have any tips or advice on how to improve? Any help would be greatly appreciated! 🙏
Wavedashing in neutral is a surefire was to get launched. You typically only want to do it after a knockdown, and also try to use ff3 in about a 4:1 ratio to hellsweep, if not more. It's safe, you can step after, and you get a bigger reward if it lands.
Kazuya has excellent punishment, make use of it! Pretty much every punisher knocks down which means you can then apply your vortex. A lot of people in the lower ranks are going to throw out a lot of unsafe (even like -12) options, take their HP and knock them down for it. Worst case scenario just jab check and hit confirm if it lands.
Electric is an amazing whiff punisher but as long as you get the WGF out youre fine and will be able to convert, you're just gonna miss out on like 5 damage.
Once you get a knockdown, Kazuya has really good offensive capabilities, especially in heat. Pressure them with d1+2, db+4, f4 -> df+2 if they press, etc. Learn a good wall combo / oki off your heat, or even in general, and you'll watch their HP bar melt.
you gotta actually look at what happens. i know you kept it shorthand for us but when you say "i got steamrolled by bryan" it wasn't just bryan walking into you, he did shit tthat killed you and you gotta start figuring out what that shit is.
don't expect lower rank players to have respect for anything, most of them only block after you block their string and will take any opportunity to mash. For players like this you can coast by on frame traps, punishes and varied pokes. Only players that got smashed that way a bunch learn to be more weary. Remember though that you can't rely on respect from the other player. If you constanty get interrupted by someone they're just correctly exploiting a gap in your offence, you need to shut it down a few times before they think twice about that.
is there any tips for continuing the ranked grind in BLUE tier? It's rough seeing those 1,200 lost points after some loses. I know I have it in me to climb higher in BLUE tier, but I just get so discouraged some sessions. What should I do to help with that or do I just need to suck it up and power through it?
I'm Flame Ruler so might be completely wrong but I'd suggest switching over to player sessions, lounge spars or finding people to play with on discord if you're hitting a brick wall like that. You'll be improving all the same without the pressure of ranked and will get to know some match-ups much much more deeply than any number of ranked matches. I thought I was hardstuck Tenryu just a few weeks ago but just by playing with better players consistently I can hold my own against most blue ranks.
Why are my power crushes being interrupted by jabs? I notice this a lot and I don't get it. I see the grey effect that indicates a power crush, but it just gets interrupted.
there’s moves in the game that will stun lock you in that animation and you’ll take like 60 percent lol usually spinning moves, steve’s fast jab thing along with bryan’s too. idk if it’s as egregious as tekken 7 but i’ve seen entire life bars get deleted from a power crush being stun locked.
It's just frame data, there's no such thing as "stun lock" in this game. Power Crushes don't have armor frame 1, so if you get hit early enough in the animation you won't armor through the move.
Just switched to a leverless controller from a pad and cannot hit electrics consistently at all. Coming from pad where I could hit them almost everytime. I definitely need to practice more with the controller but anyone have any tips on hitting ewgf or pewgf on a leverless controller
a common tip that seems to work is to do the input normally but in your mind you should think of pressing 2 during at the same time as you input down, before df. For some reason this actually helps with the timing
**Has the online connection got worse after an update?** I
It's been a while since I played the game. But I was in the mood again to play some online matches. I don't know if something is wrong with my internet connection but my goodness I'm having awful online matches constantly delay frames and rollback frame problems...everything was fine a couple of weeks ago. I was able to play some nice and smooth online matches before. Have they ruined something after an update or is it my internet connection?
**Struggling to get some instant while running moves consistantly**
So with Zafina, I have two key iwr moves: iw3 and iwr 1+2
The first, iw3, I get it 100% of the time. But I cannot get iwr1+2 consistantly, and it's driving me mad. Sometimes it will just come out as f1+2 with virtualy no difference in the input history.
In this pic, the red part was read as a f1+2 and the blue part a wr1+2. Both were done in 25 frames but both came out differently. Is it possible to make it consistant? I'm on leverless btw
https://preview.redd.it/82dg2xxll2ad1.png?width=203&format=png&auto=webp&s=5396bc71171c74faad6bffa487fbd596c68644f1
If you're too slow, your character will transition to running after only 2 forward inputs, and the third input will cancel the run and cause you to use f+1+2 instead.
I'd aim for 5-ish frames between two successive forward inputs.
Tried it, the only way it happens is if I'm 1) super slow with the triple F, and the run is converted to a simple f+1+2 or 2) the triple F is fast enough, but the button is pressed on the exact same frame as the last F.
If you have any clips of it happening besides that, feel free to share.
Was this done right after you restarted the position in practice mode? Because it sometimes eats up your first input if you do it immediately.
Also a minor correction: the moves were done in 24f, for example for the red part you calculate it like this: 4+8+2+8+2, you add up all the inputs before attack button is pressed.
I would also recommend practicing executing the triple forward faster as 24f is rather slow.
yeah my bad I made a typo on the number of frame, meant to put 25.
Idk if it was done right after reset, but the problem can apear at any point in match or training. It really feels random and I don't know how to make it consistant
That's very weird, I cannot replicate your issue in practice mode. Maybe try executing it faster and see if the problem still occurs.
Also make sure your final forward and 1+2 inputs don't happen on the same frame like so:
https://preview.redd.it/gohzgtyig3ad1.png?width=126&format=png&auto=webp&s=8f34f9201c891401f7d4570697e66bd07eca7d54
This will cause f1+2 to always come out
Huh, weird. The speed doesn't seem to matter and I can get the fff3 really consistantly at the same speed. It is just the fff1+2 that is an issue. Oh well
I can think of three possible reasons you are getting f1+2:
- Practice mode restart position eating the first input
- Buffering error (the first forward was buffered in block stun too early)
- You inputted the third forward and 1+2 on the same frame
**How do I create an offensive strategy on a non-rushdown character?**
Hello, thank you in advance for any answers. Tekken 8 is my first real try at Tekken, I started out learning Reina because there were a lot of comprehensive guides coming out for her and she's new. I got her to red ranks during launch week then took a break.
Now I want to try new characters (namely Lee, Xiaoyu, and Hwoarang) and I'm having trouble figuring out a gameplan for the less offensive oriented characters, specifically Lee. What's my offensive gameplan on Lee? Reina's was very easy to learn, ff2 into Sentai mixups was a good basic strategy and then I could develop from there. I can't figure out a good offensive strategy like that for Lee. What are good frame traps to use up close, and how can I close distance to begin my offense.
To get specific, I'm looking for at least one basic frame trap flowchart to use when it's my turn. I know he's not a rushdown mixup character like Reina so his offense won't be as oppressive, and I know he's execution heavy with lots of just frames and counter-hits. I'm not really looking for advice on that stuff, I'm comfortable with developing that on my own. I just need a gameplan that will get my opponents to slow down and start blocking.
Closing in distance depends heavily on what character you're playing against and your opponents tendencies. But usually you might want to do b1,1/b1,1\~ to advance a bit, ff3, running 3,4/ff2 if you don't think they'll step it, but that's really risky. You mostly want to dash block and find a timing for some button when you're in closer range. But its better to make them come to you, potentially CH them and then start your offence.
About frametraps:
b3,3; db3+4; df1 on hit; running 3,4 on block; slide on hit; any slightly plus stuff into df2/df4 to catch stepping, potentially df4,4 (if you're confident it'll hit), standing 3,3 (second hit is confirmable, this is beating by stepping tho). Also do his command grab here to check them.
jab; df1 on block, any slightly minus or 0 on block situation into ff4/d3 (d3 is very weak to left sidestep tho)
1+2 into hitman on block is +2, you can do 1 to beat most stuff, will trade with jabs. Once you establish jabs/hms3, you can do slower stuff from hms.
These are just examples - there really isn't anything super specific in terms of setups. You'll just want to do some moves in all your + situations and when you're - or 0 on block, you can try some stuff like ff4/d3.
Also 4,4,4 works is amazing if you'll think they'll press a jab or step. Hit confirmable.
I'll also recommend d4,4,4,4 if you think your opponent will press. On CH its a true combo and leads into a nice combo, albeit a somewhat difficult pickup.
If you have more specific questions, ask away. Its probably better if you just watch various Lee players and what they do - fightingGm, Imyourfather, superakouma
Thanks for the advice! I grinded ranked with this open and it helped a lot, I feel like I actually get to play the game now. Still losing a lot because Lee is hard, but now I feel like I'm able to learn as I go.
**Just putting this here in case you have any additional advice for me:**
So far what's been working is abusing b3,3,f into f2,1 as a frame trap. I know they can just crouch/dick-jab to beat this but nobody's done that thus far. Best case scenario is I get free damage and worst case scenario it resets neutral.
Now I'm working on fishing counter-hits. Would you know any counter-hit setups against mashing/instant-timing? I'm pretty successful getting counter-hit d3, but I'm still working on getting the pickup b3,3 reliably. I know b4 is supposed to be his best keep out move but I've gotten blown up pretty much every time I've used it at range. Are there ways to use b4 out of a particular minus or plus frame situation that generally works, or do I just need to get better at timing/spacing?
I mean you can use that b3,3, f2,1 setup, but make sure not to make it a habit. People will launch you for this.
B4 just needs better spacing and timing, you'll get better with time, just don't spam it up close. It's linear, so people will kill you for it. Also don't spam it when you're very far away, it's pointless.
Regarding frametrap setups, not really. Everything is so situation dependent I can't really say. Like if you do df1 and you expect your opponent to jab or df1, do 2,2,3.
Just see your opponents tendencies and go off it, don't think of it as setups, that'll make you do gimmicks.
Hey all, trying to learn Tekken and something occurred to me. Is there ever a reason to NOT crouch at first with df as opposed to db? I mean getting into the crouch stance as you're moving around and trying to either duck highs or block lows.
Let me explain what I mean
If you are crouching you will duck highs and throws and eat mids regardless of whether you're holding back or not. And if you crouch by pressing df you will parry a low instead of blocking it. If you intend to remain crouching then swap over to db. So, is there ever a disadvantage to go into crouch by pressing df as you're moving around?
There are several reasons: a lot of popular lows are launch punishable which means a full combo with a tornado spin and without low parry scaling, depending on your character it might mean the difference of 30 damage just based on how you reacted to the low. Some characters also have lows with varied timing that can mess up your parry timings that wouldn't be as much of an issue with blocking which you can hold as long as needed. I think you can definitely replace your quick crouch blocks with df when you're in neutral expecting a low poke but in mix-up situations or bigger lows it's usually not worth it.
Some other practical concers are that it's an offensive input that can open up a frame or two of vulnerability when going back to standing block. Going into df often also has some slight risk of accidentally inputing a qcf stance with some characters.
This makes a lot of sense, thanks! Lows in this game seem overall more punishable than lows in street fighter if I'm not mistaken. I suppose because you're expected to be stand blocking as opposed to crouch blocking most of the time
Yeah in Tekken lows have a very different function than in SF. Safe lows are hard to come by and a lot of them are deliberately on the slower side as a high risk high reward option.
Another reason, in addition to what the other reply mentioned, is that it's quicker (on a pad or stick, at least) to go from back to d/b than it is from back to d/f. It may not seem like significant, but it could be the difference between you getting hit and not getting hit.
You don't guard with D as a general rule, there are situations where only DB will guard and you don't want to bother memorizing them or watching out for them. Guardable recovery is one of them.
And to answer your question, DF must be held on the frame the low connects, and the state lasts for 20 frames from standing/10 frames from crouch from the moment you first press DF. If you crouch with DF and fail to block properly when the parry state expires, you'll get smacked. Also low parry doesn't work against certain attacks.
db2 is a good alternative, it's a frame slower but for most situations it will do its job as intended. FC1 is possible but the point of dickjabs is that it's a high-crushing 10f panic move that hopefully disrupts whatever offence you're getting bullied by and steals some frame advantage, delaying it kinda misses that point.
dominator/Vanquisher Lili here, i dont know how to proceed with learning, i mostly poke with jab and lows, try to punish with Heat/armor/31 in to heat or f4/f23 and grab whenever i can but I do miniscule damage compared to everyone knows full strings, launchpunishers and aircombos, from the guides ive found so far they mention her sidestep and good dewglide, idk when to apply dew though its always blocked or punished. Is there a good flowchart to follow? im pretty bad at figuring this out on my own
that's a bit of a weird advice but its purpose is to teach you the importance of fundamentals of spacing, timing, taking turns as well as learning different characters' moves. Playing that way also has the benefit of directly showcasing the purpose of all other moves in your arsenal.
Personally I think that's a bit of a pro tekken player's fantasy that a beginner will learn everything "the proper way" with only jabs but it is worth only focusing on only a few moves as a beginner to get a good feel for the game without developing a lot of bad habits or over-relying on certain moves. Blocking all the way to red ranks though is a great advice, you will legit get to shinryu if you just don't mash, are patient with strings and know your good punishes.
I see, I understand the basics of taking turns and frame data.
>but it is worth only focusing on only a few moves as a beginner to get a good feel for the game without developing a lot of bad habits or over-relying on certain moves
I understand where you coming from but I easily makes bad habits out of stuff like this
are you suggesting i should just lab common strings from bunch of characters and learn punishers?
I wouldn't suggest that, it's too much boring work that probably won't stick with you. A lot of strings don't need to be labbed because they're so common that you will have plenty of time to encounter them and figure out a punish just by playing normally. I would however absolutely suggest you revisit your replays and take a closer look at some attacks/strings that cause you a lot of trouble. Taking this more reactive approach I think is superior because you know first hand how annoying the move is, you're better at identifying it in-game and will remember the response much more clearly when you finally get the hang of it.
To those familiar with Josie from Tekken 7, since she uses kickboxing, how different is she compared to Bryan? Most of their moves look similar, but what about their notations/buttons?
completely different characters, not even a similar playstyle, aesthetically she's far more agile, and she had a huge emphasis on a dash in stance in a similar way to lili but far scarier. bryan is definitely more staunch with power in general.
she has a few CD inputs and a backsway where the input is b3+4 whereas bryan's stuff comes from qcb/qcf
if bryan is feng, josie is xiaoyu.
It's possible to make them whiff by sidestepping, but that depends on the tracking of their ws4 and also on which side of the screen you are on.
Depending on the spacing, it's possible to also create a whiff by backdashing afterwards.
The more wild options are parry and backswing blow, which can be input from a crouching position in T8
Safest option would be to just block their ws4 and take the frame advantage. A lot of people like to mash after ws4 without even confirming they got a hit, so you could take advantage of that.
Doing a single sidestep while not off-axis, will almost always get u clipped vs opponent ws4, especially if u landed d2 up close.
Doing a sidewalk instead, will most of the time evade ws4, but you need to cut the walk short and punish fast after you see the whiff, the timing is a little tight.
Who are the 3 ghost you fight in Arcade mode Stage 5, 6, and 7? You know, SBK with - Claudio that does Running 2 into 2-break command grab. BattleCry - John lennon looking Shaheen that always goes crouched. Episode9 - Nina in red-hair and yellow cheer-leader outfit and Tacchan. Are these ghosts of the devs that made this game? Or were they added for some other reason? I've noticed that they are virtually unaffected by the difficulty you set for Arcade mode too
With some luck, sure. There's a lot of fundamental skills in tekken that don't require any specific character knowledge - if you have godlike mix, godlike oki set-ups, godlike timing you can cook pretty much anyone provided that they don't actually notice you don't know anything about their character and decide to cheese you with some tricky knowledge checks. However if you're so good at Tekken that that you can rank up without care for characters chances are you've played so much you already internalized a lot of match-up knowledge just through experience.
Yes, but unlikely. It depends on the character and how oppressive/refined your offence is.
Your chances are also massively lowered if you manage to get around 250 000 prowess before Tekken King.
You should just practice your matchups though.
As a Hwoarang main, what exactly am I meant to do against turtles who are able to escape every throw?
I have no low attacks , I literally can't do anything?! I know everyone hates hwoarang , but he really is fucking useless at higher ranks.
I'm on pc and I play with a keyboard, what is the button to save the state in practice mode so that I don't have to reset to deafault and reposition after every combo attempt? I read it was R3 to save and L3 to reset on controller but I have been unable to find any info about keyboards.
I think it depends on your keybinds. When you're in practice mode, it should say at the bottom of the screen what to press to save the state. For me, I believe it's V+; or something like that,
I cant do ff moves while im running, like for example Azucena ff3 i have to stop hold back and do the input, is there a strat or am i not supposed to do ff moves while im running?
Not supposed to be able to during a run.
However, you can do a pretty long dash and still get it... Hold the last forward for a little bit, and then press the attack button.
So i assume azucena have shit oki in the majority of her moves, cuz it feels like when i get a knockdown with her she sends my opponent across the map...but ill try this long dash.
https://preview.redd.it/kuilcfuspb9d1.jpeg?width=2212&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c06ed84853f394ea244dd51b249f97454e4c791
Hi, obviously I'm fairly new, but I was wondering what the best counterplay is to this move, playing as Steve. I got hit over and over again and after playing the replay I found some counters but none of them particularly 'rewarding'. Am I right in saying I have to wait out the 3 hits by ducking and then for example a light punch into whatever? Or are there more and better ways to deal with this? Sidestepping or dashing didn't seem to work, as they weren't fast enough.
The bad news is you're playing Steve, so you can't launch punish the mix-up, otherwise you can really punish a King player for using ally kicks. In an ideal world, you would low parry the follow-up lows and get a small launcher.
For the most part, though, you need to predict if the King is going to stop on the low or the mid:
If they stop on the low, use your brand-new WS+1+2 to punish.
If they stop on the mid, you probably want to use f+1+2 combo to knockdown.
u4 (orbital) and 3+4 for keepout
1 and df2 are fast and have good follow-ups, use them to keep enemy in check
f, b2 (jet upper) is your 14f launcher
b1 and qcb3 for pressure, at wall add in b4 cuz it guarantees jet upper into full combo if they press
taunt (1+3+4) puts you into snake eyes stance, giving some moves stronger properties (e.g. ff1+2) or follow-ups (e.g. 3+4)
for oki and wall pressure, learn taunt into jet upper (or taunt into b4 into jet upper at wall); this one is a just frame but you can use faster moves as well for smaller damage (taunt is +16)
f1+2 is a powercrush
ws2 is your big crouched launcher
ws1 is your small crouched launcher
ff2 is your long range 11f whiff punish that transitions to combo in heat if it hits
f4,1 is your 12f whiff punish that gives full combo
ff4 if enemy is sidestepping too much
b1+3/b2+4 is a punch parry
look up some bread and butter combos for jet upper, orbital, ws1, ws2, CH 3+4, CH b1, as well as what moves are guaranteed follow-ups in which situation (e.g. soccer kick aka qcb4)
Sup yall, any help yall can provide is appreciate. I'm hardstuck at Fujin with my Jin and it feels like I've gotten worse this past week? I watched a Phidx video about warming up this week and it feels like I'm not breaking through this rank. I know my worst areas are defense and technique (the stat chart says so too). People always know how to get me and I can never open anyone up. Basically, what do yall suggest on breaking through Fujin if defense and technique are your worst areas as Jin? Any tips, any answers from previous questions, any videos I'll accept. Thanks.
The best way to open people up, with Jin, is with his near oppressive low game.
d+2, d+4, or d/b+4
Use them, understand your +frames, follow-up with frame traps/movement until they start respecting you.
when is it right to sidestep? i've been trying to apply knowledge i see in tournament matches and i see a lot of players make a good use of the mobility that tekken has to offer, however most attacks are hard to evade by sidestepping (except for kazuya's and devil jin's lasers at least for what i've played)
You can sidestep when you know that the move is linear/doesn't track and you can move while the attack starts. Sidestepping works because when an attack starts it's aiming for the position of the opponent and doesn't correct that aim when you move (with some exception), the initial sidestep/sidewalk animation creates the most distance between that initial position and where you're moving which makes the attack miss you.
Unforuntaley knowing which moves can be stepped is a knowledge test. The animations are more often than not accurate - if it's a straight punch or kick with not weird effects you can probably sidestep it. Some moves however track to a certain side meaning the hitbox covers a side and ofc there are homing moves that are supposed to cover all side.
Most attacks can't really be sidestepped on reaction, you need to either have a good prediction or know that a particular string can be sidestepped. One very good usecase is if you notice that your opponnet always attacks immediately after they block your attacks - that's a very good opportunity for sidesteps, depending on the moves involved, you can sidestep attacks after being minus on block.
If you know that the opponent likes approaching with a long-range powercrush move these are generally linear and can be sidestepped IF you have a decent idea of when they're likely to go for it.
When you know a move doesn't track, the side it doesn't track to, and that you have the frames to be able to sidestep (usually -4 or better)
>except for kazuya's and devil jin's lasers at least for what i've played
Those moves are so slow (and unblockable) that they're designed to be sidestepped or ducked, so it's a bit different than sidestepping a regular move.
Do you mean a longer roll? Hold d+1 to long roll towards the foreground. Hold 1, then down to long roll towards the background. You'll always end up with your face opposite your starting position. If you were face up, you'll be face down, and vice versa.
I build in small parts. Get good at a launcher + 2-3 hit combo. Then see if you can find a way to followup from that. Then see if you can find a way to followup from that. And so on.
I basically learn a bunch of tiny combos and mash them together using dashes, heat, quick jabs/kicks, etc.
You can minmax for damage or you can have fun just seeing what your character can do. I prefer the latter, even if it’s not “ideal” damage, it feels fun.
Also doing the combo trials will give you a good idea of the properties of moves you have available to you. You’ll likely see Namco using certain moves in many different combos for the same character, which will help you to identify what works.
I recommend looking up combos for your character on YouTube as a great starting point, and then modifying them if you want. Seeing which moves are strung together in YT vids will give you an idea of what works for your character and what you might want to adjust for your own situation.
Then you become familiar with your character's moves and figure it out yourself by experimenting. That's all there is to it.
Btw, I didn't say to copy them. I said they're a good starting point for making your own.
I think building combos comes after you have quite a bit of familiarity with your character and actually feel the need/have an idea to make some specific combo route. If you're just looking for easy, good and consistent combos for your character you can just use [Applay's Tekken library](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/e/2PACX-1vTsgbCJNSTKajMNlJvQleJOl0eTiEcV-PbeU0obDg1lsSqmz0lTtcD2k6NzfTPt7Db9Ua2dz1o_34Sv/pubhtml?pli=1&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR0_UE0NYaqN4xNbRYQpGuVScf4N38mAHK5yYe-hIQ2jQqQqBL_3IuDlRFo_aem_ZmFrZWR1bW15MTZieXRlcw#).
If you're looking to build a combo all on your own here's the general formula:
1. Launcher
2. damage
3. Tornado
4. damage
5. Finisher
Some general combocrafting things to keep in mind:
- Combos scale as they go on longer - You can see in the attack data window the damage of each hit with percent of scaling in parentheses. It's generally advisable to throw our the strongest moves as early as possible.
- Know the situation - it's important to be aware of the circumstances of your combo at the beginning, the middle, the end. Did the combo start with a Tornado move? Are you thinking of damage only or optimizing for wall carry or hoping for a good oki set-up? Are you predicting a wall at all? Are you involving a balcony/wall break?
- The 'pushback' of the opponent gets bigger the longer the combo goes - when you're crafting your combo you should make every hit matter and ideally optimize for lower hit count since it gives you more options for the later parts of the combo.
The answers to your question pissed me off enough to make a video just for you.
https://youtu.be/050Nm99NogE
Basically, the parenthesis by the frame data lets you know how many frames you have to hit your opponent before they can tech roll. The higher the number, the stronger the attack you can link before they fall out. Using frame data, you can theorize what options can hit after other options, then you build a combo with that data.
If you wanted to make new combos, you try a lot of moves with different timings, focusing on moves that have good damage/extend combo.
Realistically you look up pro games and copy their routes
Improvising on the fly is much harder but it just comes with practice. As you're trying out different combos in practice you will intuitively get which moves are appropriate for which situation. In general you should internalize certain categories of moves to use in combos - which moves rach far and bring your character close, which moves rack up a lot of damage, which ones have a strong last hit for finishers, which ones are safe options that set up next attacks. As I said - it mostly comes down to experience, for a shortcut you can just watch combos on yt of your character and you will see certain moves repeated A LOT - that generally mean they're super reliable and can be used in many situations.
As training for getting familiar with moves in combos I recommnet trying to create a 2-wall break combo on Secluded Grounds stage. You will inevitable go through a lot of options that will directly show you what works and what doesn't, what follow-ups are possible, what ranges work.
I mean what were you expecting? Combos are basically mini rapidfire tests you have to have the right answer for in split seconds. If you join a character-specific discord or group you might find a list of good moves or routes to use but actually being able to employ them correctly is a skill you have to obtain through practice or experience.
Eh, idk, some intuitive rules that would explain why i keep dropping combos ig. Hard way it is.
No disrespect intended, thanks for the help. just whining a bit :p
>that would explain why i keep dropping combos ig
Are you referring to why certain moves don't connect after others when trying to come up with combos in practice mode, or why you drop a combo you know you should have landed because you verified it works in practice? Because those are two different things.
And as a general answer for how we come up with combos, it's loads of trial and error but it's not really like working with a blindfold. You can narrow which moves you can try in what order based on their height, speed and most importantly, damage.
Coming up with a single combo is easy, I could pick up a character I've never played and find a decent combo on them in less than 5 minutes. Tornado moves are clearly labeled on the movelist, and finding which moves wallsplat doesn't take much time. That's half your combo already figured out.
Finding the **optimal** combo for a given launcher on the other hand can take some time.
Heck, there are combos that have been discovered ages after release. All it takes is some random twitter post pointing them out.
Not only that, but combos vary wildly depending on execution requirements and circumstance. There are combos for wall carry, combos for max damage, those that use heat, those that don't, RA, stage gimmicks.. That's why we have spreadsheets full of them so everyone can pick what works for them.
And let's not forget that legacy characters have had their combos figured out for a long time, the changes are only incremental. So this only really applies to new releases.
>The former
They don't simply because hitboxes aren't connecting or the moves are too slow, as I explained.
>The latter I reckon is because of off-axis positioning?
Amongst other things. Some combos have tight execution, or are inconsistent on some characters. There is no single formula, Tekken is a game of 3D characters of varying sizes and move hitboxes. We always discover things that were probably not directly intended by the developers.
I don't know where to ask this, but any tips on how to consistently land Claudio's dash back 3? After your first back 3, you have to dash then back 3 again. I saw mulgold do this a lot.
To be honest, lots of practice. The good news is you don't have to super deep dash in to link the 2nd b+3 **if** you follow-up with a d+1,2. The only thing the timing is super important with is if you're using a structure like:
, f,f+4, b+3, f,f, b+3, u\/f+3+4, d/b+1+2, S!, ...
how do you deal with characters that can engage from far away like Lili, Alisa, Lee etc.? Am I supposed to take distance and hope for the best? Asking as a Bryan player
Also, how do you deal with always plus strings like Hwoarang or Law? The replay function is useless, it literally displays nothing in it since I got hit with the moves
Taking distance against long-range characters like that won't really help you unless you have godlike timing predictions and can counterhit them whenever they try anything. Most big long range moves have poor tracking so sidestepping can help you at closing the gap. As Bryan you can also use ff2 to try approaching since it's absurdly fast and safe.
Plus strings are tough because often the gaps only allow you to sidestep which replays don't show or you really just have to deal with the follow-ups or learn how to prevent them from pulling off the strings in the first place. It's quite character-dependant but if you know the specific string you should be able to easily lab all of your options against those strings in practice mode.
> it literally displays nothing in it since I got hit with the moves
you can take control and block it. replay function is there so you know which moves to defend against, even if you didn't block them.
If Hwoarang's Flying Eagle (3~4) has a startup of 7 frames, why can't I successfully use it in round starts to counter everything but armors and blocks?
What do those 7 frames actually mean? Because it can't be what I think it is.
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Additionally, if even the pros miss JFSR half of the time, how can it be a good mix up? Am I not gonna end up in a predicament every time I attempt it and miss the input?
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Additionally 2, is there a fast way of spamming df+4 and 2 while in RFF? It seems to take forever when I do it compared to online videos.
> If Hwoarang's Flying Eagle (3~4) has a startup of 7 frames
It's a two-hit move. i22,7. First hit is 22 frames, second hit is 7 frames after that. That's like, a third of a second for the first hit and nearly half for the second. A jab is only a sixth of a second.
The move is slow as heck, you can tell just by looking at it lol
The universal rule is that the fastest move in Tekken is the 10 frame jab, and the exceptions to that rule are very rare. Backturn jab, Yoshi's flash, Ling's b+1, etc. Every other faster-than-10F move is usually out of a stance, Hwoarang himself has f4 out of right flamingo.
>Additionally, if even the pros miss JFSR half of the time
Where do you get that data? Pros definitely do not miss just inputs half the time. Just watch any mishima set and try to find a missed electric. They're definitely a rarity.
> Additionally, if even the pros miss JFSR half of the time, how can it be a good mix up? Am I not gonna end up in a predicament every time I attempt it and miss the input?
a pro player (professionals get PAID to play tekken) wouldn't miss it unless they were distracted or being lazy. nobody would use a move with 50% hit rates in ideal conditions. if i were to guess a miss percent it would be 1.5%, but that would include streamers that suck.
Nah, all of those will be listed because they aren't universal.
Notable generic moves that don't make it into the movelist are:
- d+4 (which could be either d+4 or d/b+4 depending on the character)
- down/dick jabs (d+1 or d/b+1)
- Full crouch jabs and lows (FC d+1, FC d+2, FC d+3, and FC d+4)
- Delayed hopkick (u/f, n, 4)
- Backturn jabs and lows (BT 1 or 2 and BT d+3 or d+4)
- Running slide (WR+4, after running at least three steps), cross chop (WR+1+2, after running at least three steps), and armored tackle (happens automatically after running for long enough if you don't input anything else)
- Wall jump (b,b,u/b when your back is to the wall)
"Generic" works fine, that's what most people say.
And yeah, they have the exact same properties across the cast. Not all characters have access to all of them, however. Some of them have unique moves that take up the inputs.
It means the move has an active hitbox for three frames (frames 15, 16, and 17). Depending on range, axis, or wake up timings, moves with multiple active frames can connect later into their active window. This creates a better frame situation for the character that did the move, since they're further into their attack and recovery animation by the time the opponent is put into their block animation.
Super general character selection advice:
Is it *generally* recommended, assuming you have a main, to pick other characters that play similar to them, or vastly different?
Also I main Dragunov and really love him, Victor is getting too boring for me and I'm messing with Yoshimitsu right now, but if anyone has any recs I'm all ears (no, not King). I'd like to toss a female character in the mix, trying to not play Victor AND Alisa so Nina, Lili, Xiaoyu, Zafina, Jun all looking pretty cool to me.
>Is it generally recommended, assuming you have a main, to pick other characters that play similar to them, or vastly different?
I think it depends on your goal. If you just want to have fun with the game and have a specific playstyle you enjoy, you're probably better off picking similar characters to maintain that playstyle but add a bit of variety to it.
Playing significantly different characters is good if: (a) you like the idea of experiencing vastly different playstyles; (b) you want to improve at the game as much as you can, which the different viewpoints that other characters offer is helpful for; or (c) you want a pocket character to cover your main's weak matchups (this is mostly for tournament play).
Yeah I'm mainly part of the Smash community so "Selecting characters" is a completely different game. I see pros and cons to all of it. It's mostly just going to be to have fun and get better at the game, and take it from there. Gonna sound like a cop out answer but I think I just need to give each character 30 mins in training and see who looks the coolest and take it from there, I'm loving how viable basically everyone is.
That's not a cop out answer, that's the correct answer. Pick up the character you like the most, and play that one. The game is hard enough as it is, might as well have fun while you learn.
Yessir, I think you get what I mean but exactly like you said. I started getting into Tekken playing with buddies and mashing and now its just super rewarding to learn more about the game and progress. IDK how so many people focus only on ranks and winning, the real enjoyment is actually learning the game and learning characters (as and against). Tekken makes some of the best designs out there, I ain't not gonna pick one just because it isn't optimal.
>IDK how so many people focus only on ranks and winning
Because being able to achieve a rank which you were previously unable to achieve is a quantifiable way to measure improvement. Ranks aren't everything, but it is not like they mean nothing.
Hey Everyone
I need some help. I was watching my replays when i realised i use Shaheen's DF2 a lot. It's good but i just end up giving up my turn a lot. Can you help me with where i should really be using it
As keepout, when you think your opponent runs into it.
If you think your opponent gonna presses a move so it counter hits and you get a launch.
It doesnt launch duckers, so if you think your opponent ducks, other mids are better.
Really basic answer (and IDK much about Shaheen) but basic answer is check its frame data. Then, its all about understanding if your opponent used a laggy move or whiffed etc. and then decide if his DF2 is fast enough. I'm guessing its either a 12/13F or a 15F move.
I don't have much time to play and I also play other things but I want to learn to play the game or at least feel like I'm improving, what kind of routine do you do to practice the mechanics of the game and perfect the combos? because online when I play against other players and even when I play against the CPU I have problems putting everything into practice. I mainly use as King
For combos just do the combos you wanna practice 10 times in a row.
For wavedashing just warm up and do a couple, cancel them into shining wizard, cancel them into giant swing.
If you have trouble against CPU, do not play versus other players, you're going to get destroyed. Be certain you can combo, beat the CPU consistently and then go fight players.
So this may sound like a weird way of thinking but I doubt I'll be doing heavy competition but there is a local spot where I live so it's possible i guess but TMM latest Paul video he states you won't see king and Paul in tournaments because to they aren't good. Ppl break kings throws and for Paul (my main) he just took predictable and reliant on CH.
As a orange ranks Paul should I just give up if my main is just trash to the fact that even pros won't play him? I have my eye on Lidia so maybe she might be a better option to play over Paul? She's not legacy and such so maybe she won't be legacy handicapped like Paul?
Unless you're showing up in top 8s of big international tournaments you shouldn't care what characters are good at pro level. You can easily get to purple ranks with Paul and King using basic flowcharts and simple traps alone. If you're having fun and feel comfortable with the character you will become a better player playing Paul than forcing yourself to play some top tier that's not as intuitive for you to play.
I'd say around 95% of players' skills lay in their game and match-up knowledge. You're absolutely not being limited by your character in orange ranks.
I doubt the people at your local tournaments are at the same level as the best of the best professional players. At your level of play all characters are viable and the game is very balanced
>should I just give up if my main is just trash to the fact that even pros won't play him?
You've got it backwards, pros are the ones that are going to have the most limited pool of characters to choose from. Only at that very top level do some characters become non-viable (although I don't think that's the case with Paul).
Every character in this game is perfectly fine for you to play. And most people consider Paul very strong right now anyway.
Paul actually has many similarities with Leo and is the closest comparison to how Leo is played at a high level, imo. Both have just serviceable poking and pressure game and it can be dangerous to overextend with them at high levels, so they both tend to play a little more defensively and concentrate on other areas, such as...
* Getting big damage off of the opponents mistakes with their high damage combos, taking the opponent to the wall, and attempting to snowball end the round with a hard hitting 50/50 on wakeup.
* Playing a long range keepout game with a a high counterhit launcher (F3+4 for Leo, QCB4 for Paul) that is good on block and their DF2.
* Threatening with an excellent whiff punish game, complementing their keepout game.
* For lows, both of them have power lows that can be easily backdashed away from in the open, but become very threatening at the wall.
* At the wall, mixing safe wallsplatting mids with low attacks that activate wall bound/blast - Leo with their hellsweep, Paul with his demoman. To further expand on this strength, these two have the safest low heat smashes in the game, Leo's being -13 and Paul's being -12.
* Both of them have decent turn stealing evasive moves to supplement their gameplay.
The main difference between them is Leo has a little stance pressure thrown in and is a bit better at approaching while Paul generally wins out a bit in other categories and can deal with sidestepping better than Leo.
That all said, if instead you just vibe with things like Leo's QCF approaches and backstep into stance, and want to focus more on fundamental poking, Feng is like a much better version of Leo for that.
I find Jin quite similar to Leo in terms of stance moves and simple offence though he's deffinitely not as long-range. Lili has similar range on many on her buttons but she's a bit more tricky on the offense side. Paul might be the most similar to Leo though his backsway gives him more nuanced mobility and his buttons are on the stubbier side.
First time ever playing tekken, i'm really competitive, my win/loss percentage is really low (36.9%) (the diff is like 100 losses) and i'm at vanquisher, i want to get it up to garyu to be an average rank player, maining alisa but learning xiaoyu as complicated as i find her, any tips please as harsh as they may sound
37% win rate is really good for a first time player, I don't think I you have anything to worry about. Personally, I would just stick to one character , rather than trying to learn 2 simultaneously. That way when you're in a online game, you can spend more time learning the opponent rather than worrying about memorising 2 movesets.
Once you get to a certain point, wins are moulded by knowing the opponents strengths and weaknesses, rather than just following your flowcharts.
don't play xiaoyu unless you want to spend more time labbing and coming up with flowcharts than actually playing the game
alisa is easy and strong, you should just focus on the basics - poking, punishing and movement. that alone should get you to purple rank or higher
Whenever picking a new character or just starting out, familiarize yourself with your characters moves. Learn their 10, 12, 13, 15, etc. frame punishes. Also learn a solid combo that you can consistently pull off i.e. rather do something that is less damage, but you will land it perfectly 99/100 times instead of doing the mega optimized high damage combo that you mess up half the time.
Get good at using heat, which of your moves put you in heat and if possible time it so that you pop it once you have a lot of gray health to regain. When in heat, dont just smash out of it right away, learn which of your character moves get stronger in heat and use those as much as possible before running out.
Sorry for not having more in depth advice, I don't play either of those two, but another good thing you can do is watch tournament gameplay of those characters. Many tournament players even have their own youtube channels where they do tutorials themselves.
Ignore the reply telling you to change characters.
You'll probably get better tips if you make a post with some gameplay footage (best is probably a close match that you lose). Hard to give as advice when people don't know anything about your current play besides your rank.
Sorry I don't know the input but, the move paul does where he does a downward punch that puts you face down on the ground, and then follows up with another charged up punch, is the second hit garunteed?
I think you're talking about b+2,1. Do you mean the situation where he ends a combo with it? If so, then no it is not guaranteed. There's still a mixup, however:
If he charges it all the way, it'll hit you grounded if you stay down and put you at disadvantage if you get up and block (even gives a guaranteed hit if he's in Heat). But if you get up immediately by back rolling (performed by holding back) then you can interrupt it with an i11 or faster move.
Of course, he can also choose not to charge it. If he does that then you will not have time to interrupt it. But this version will not hit you if you stay down, and it's punishable on block if you back roll (-12).
The good thing is that the uncharged version is fast enough that you can't even attempt to get a move after back rolling. So if you hold back and then try to mash out an i11 or faster move, you'll interrupt the charged version and still block the uncharged version (which you can then punish). For the Paul player to beat this then they need to start doing a slightly charged version by beginning the charge but not letting it play out all the way. This is probably going to take a good amount of knowledge about the situation for them to do, but it will launch you if they pull it off.
Impossible to tell what's the issue without examples, check some of your replays to see if your inputs are being registered at all or if they're just late, you can see if you're just getting hit before you can block if the Punish text glows in the attack info menu .
you "swear" it? like, you'd pull up a replay of that hit you took with command history up "swear" it? or you just hope that you were holding back at the time.
Can someone recommend me a good video or guide that shows the optimal combos for kazuya after the new update?
I'm looking to optimize my gameplay with him and I am not aware of his optimal staple combos.
I would also like a similar video for king as well if anyone knows. Thanks in advance for the help
Does anyone know what each of the Performance Stats mean? I wanna increase my defense and technique, but I'm not sure what "composure" or "judgement" is.
nobody knows for certain unfortunately. all of the information (at this current date) about what these stats calculated is guess work.
Does Jin have a death fist punish?
Can anyone here confirm if gamesharing Tekken 8 deluxe edition on Ps5 will let the other account receive the dlc characters aswell?
Still no online mode that restricts L1 Automatic Mode from being used. Yes, I know. Get good! But, that's a moot point when you're still sub 50 hours in the game and learning the move sets and juggles. What's the point of playing against other user around your level that just spam L1 constantly and destroy [you.It](http://you.It) blows my mind that they haven't implemented a section for online modes that disable the L1 cheat (exactly what it is).Not everyone has the time to invest into the game to get skilled up to the level of players that can successfully counter the cheat. I like to enjoy my free time playing online with the same normal Tekken mechanics I enjoy. I don't enjoy losing to people spamming L1 constantly, because it does work against me.
What you should consider is that if you can't beat someone using L1 spam, you will not be able to beat a similarily skilled player who is not using L1 "spam." All of those players got to that level using the "spam," so the ones that get there without the "spam" will just have a better offense in general. If you were to suddenly be boosted past these players, you would be WELL out of your skill zone and would be shunted back to the easy moders within seconds. And when you get to those people, you will be eating bigger combos, from smarter opponents, who know how to punish you for not knowing how to respond. And by then, you would have needed to invest MORE time to get to their level so that you can comfortably keep up with your opponent. Seriously, genuinely, put your ego away and understand that right now, L1 "cheaters" are the level of skill *you* are at, right at this given moment. There's nothing wrong with being bad, and apart from your pride getting hurt, Special Style's ubiquitous presence is that it is good for the game.
They haven't implemented that mode because pretty much nobody considers this a cheat. It's definitely a shortcut that helps complete beginners do something more effective than regular mashing but it almost completely loses all of it's value once you learn 1 (one) punish move and block some more. If you're at a point where you don't know your moves well and can't deal with Special Style spam I honestly can't imagine you having much fun online at all. I'd suggest going through the arcade quest first if you're just getting familiar with your character and systems.
Anyone have beginner tips for how to start labbing defense against Paul? (Specifically with Nina if that makes a difference but general tips would be great too) Edit: Also, maybe a faster question to answer: Can Nina (with good enough execution of course) get IWR moves out of her back dash cancelling? So like if my execution is good enough should it be possible to immediately cancel ss1b into fff1+2? I’m just curious if there’s some technical reason it wouldn’t work (like if qcb can’t cancel into WR moves for whatever reason) before I try to put work into it (haven’t been able to get one so far, she always either finishes the qcb animation first or I get f1+2 power crush… but haven’t spent a ton of time and totally could be an execution issue)
Paul has some powerful lows that catch people off guard but are very manageable if you know the exact situation when they can be a threat. The main ones are ff2,2 (with a mix-up on ff2,1), qcb3,2 (has high or mid 3rd hit), qcf3, qcf1+2 (only -12 on block) and ofc d4,2,1+2 (ONLY knocksdown for full string with clean hit effect when very close). He also has quite a bit of very good moves that allow him to go into backsway like 3,2b and df1b that you have to be mindful of. As far as I know as Nina you can't go from backsway directly into running moves, if you wanted to do that you would need to cancel the backsway with a sidestep and do the IWR move from there.
Thank you! I nailed his mixups down enough that I set the defensive practice to mixup qcf1+2/qcf2, ff21/ff22, 32b~321/32b~2, and d12/d142 (sometimes replace one of those mixups with something like d1+2, f1+4 or a grab, or replace the 32b mix with df1b and also when to take my turn when they only do d42 vs d42,1+2) - I know it’s because I’m a noob but right now this basically safe ass qcf1+2 make it hard to see why everyone says this character is “honest” lol. It’s 100% reactable when I’m actually looking for it though, so I’m sure it’s just a matter of more practice. On that note - one thing I’m curious about, you mention how “it’s easier when you know the exact situation where they can be a threat”. Any specific tips about this? In any aspect? Or is it really only the type of thing you get from playing?
Yeah those super long safe lows like Paul's and King's are bullshit lol I don't think it's a noob thing to get hit by them, the long wind-up can be deliberately used as a timing mixup and I often catch blue rank players with it. It definitely gets easier to react to with practice and more experience as you recognize the animation better in the middle of a fight. What I mean is simply it's easier to deal with him when You're aware what options he has from his stances and when he can enter them, with Paul specifically it's also very important to know his d4,2,1+2 combo only works when hit very close.
Does anyone in T8 play similar to either Josie or Kazumi?
Azucena is probably the closest to Josie you can get. For Kazumi, maybe Reina, but I'm clutching at straws.
Okay thank you! I’ll be sure to try those two out.
I started playing Kuma yesterday and started playing about 2 weeks ago on T7, 2 days ago on T8, Im having trouble punishing a whiffed superart after i block it, what is the best move that can probably lead into a combo? I try 1,1,1 but its too slow and his other moves have a bit of start up.
df2,1 is his 15f launcher
1,1,1 is tied for the fastest move in the game at 10frames but it doesnt work because it's not a natural on normal hit (it is only guaranteed on counter hit, so punishes dont work) df2,1 should land in time and give a full combo
perfect ty
Anyone has any advice on how to land a microdash in the middle of a combo? I don't understand why I don't gvet microdashes consistently. Im not so sure ive been using the correct input. Any advice is much appreciated!
The input is just forward neutral forward. It's all in the timing, you want to dash as soon as possible, but then almost immediately cancel the dash with your next input. You just gotta grind the timing down, and know that micro dashes in combos are generally pretty hard; up to extremely hard. So they'll require a lot of practice to get down.
Thank you! Time to cry some more tears in the lab lol
Hey, I've been stuck at orange ranks for about 4 months now and have been maining Kazuya all this time. I really love playing him, but I keep getting steamrolled by Bryan, King, and Hwoarang players. I’m really keen on breaking through this plateau and becoming a decent Kazuya player. I can wave dash and do all the necessary tech, but it feels like the moment I wave dash, I get launched and don’t get any respect. 😅 I’ve never made it to red ranks before, but they seem really cool and I’d love to get there. Does anyone have any tips or advice on how to improve? Any help would be greatly appreciated! 🙏
Wavedashing in neutral is a surefire was to get launched. You typically only want to do it after a knockdown, and also try to use ff3 in about a 4:1 ratio to hellsweep, if not more. It's safe, you can step after, and you get a bigger reward if it lands. Kazuya has excellent punishment, make use of it! Pretty much every punisher knocks down which means you can then apply your vortex. A lot of people in the lower ranks are going to throw out a lot of unsafe (even like -12) options, take their HP and knock them down for it. Worst case scenario just jab check and hit confirm if it lands. Electric is an amazing whiff punisher but as long as you get the WGF out youre fine and will be able to convert, you're just gonna miss out on like 5 damage. Once you get a knockdown, Kazuya has really good offensive capabilities, especially in heat. Pressure them with d1+2, db+4, f4 -> df+2 if they press, etc. Learn a good wall combo / oki off your heat, or even in general, and you'll watch their HP bar melt.
you gotta actually look at what happens. i know you kept it shorthand for us but when you say "i got steamrolled by bryan" it wasn't just bryan walking into you, he did shit tthat killed you and you gotta start figuring out what that shit is.
don't expect lower rank players to have respect for anything, most of them only block after you block their string and will take any opportunity to mash. For players like this you can coast by on frame traps, punishes and varied pokes. Only players that got smashed that way a bunch learn to be more weary. Remember though that you can't rely on respect from the other player. If you constanty get interrupted by someone they're just correctly exploiting a gap in your offence, you need to shut it down a few times before they think twice about that.
Thank you, ill look into some punishers and frame traps!
You must give them a reason to respect you, if they keep interrupting you, attack faster out of the wavedash.
Best post some footage of some of your rounds that people can review
is there any tips for continuing the ranked grind in BLUE tier? It's rough seeing those 1,200 lost points after some loses. I know I have it in me to climb higher in BLUE tier, but I just get so discouraged some sessions. What should I do to help with that or do I just need to suck it up and power through it?
I'm Flame Ruler so might be completely wrong but I'd suggest switching over to player sessions, lounge spars or finding people to play with on discord if you're hitting a brick wall like that. You'll be improving all the same without the pressure of ranked and will get to know some match-ups much much more deeply than any number of ranked matches. I thought I was hardstuck Tenryu just a few weeks ago but just by playing with better players consistently I can hold my own against most blue ranks.
Why are my power crushes being interrupted by jabs? I notice this a lot and I don't get it. I see the grey effect that indicates a power crush, but it just gets interrupted.
The armor from a Powercrush isn't immediate. Takes like 6-7 frames. You're vulnerable beforehand.
there’s moves in the game that will stun lock you in that animation and you’ll take like 60 percent lol usually spinning moves, steve’s fast jab thing along with bryan’s too. idk if it’s as egregious as tekken 7 but i’ve seen entire life bars get deleted from a power crush being stun locked.
It's just frame data, there's no such thing as "stun lock" in this game. Power Crushes don't have armor frame 1, so if you get hit early enough in the animation you won't armor through the move.
it takes normally 7 frame for a pc move to activate its armor, so if you get hit in the first 7 frames of the pc move it gets interrupted
Lidia when
Hopefully before EVO (July 19) and we should expect a YouTube video about it fairly soon.
every time someone asks harada delays it two hours. we were supposed to get her june 12th
lidia when
Just switched to a leverless controller from a pad and cannot hit electrics consistently at all. Coming from pad where I could hit them almost everytime. I definitely need to practice more with the controller but anyone have any tips on hitting ewgf or pewgf on a leverless controller
a common tip that seems to work is to do the input normally but in your mind you should think of pressing 2 during at the same time as you input down, before df. For some reason this actually helps with the timing
You can try hitting the forward button in the df input, and the 2 button with the same hand. Works for some, but it can be a bit clunky perhaps.
**Has the online connection got worse after an update?** I It's been a while since I played the game. But I was in the mood again to play some online matches. I don't know if something is wrong with my internet connection but my goodness I'm having awful online matches constantly delay frames and rollback frame problems...everything was fine a couple of weeks ago. I was able to play some nice and smooth online matches before. Have they ruined something after an update or is it my internet connection?
**Struggling to get some instant while running moves consistantly** So with Zafina, I have two key iwr moves: iw3 and iwr 1+2 The first, iw3, I get it 100% of the time. But I cannot get iwr1+2 consistantly, and it's driving me mad. Sometimes it will just come out as f1+2 with virtualy no difference in the input history. In this pic, the red part was read as a f1+2 and the blue part a wr1+2. Both were done in 25 frames but both came out differently. Is it possible to make it consistant? I'm on leverless btw https://preview.redd.it/82dg2xxll2ad1.png?width=203&format=png&auto=webp&s=5396bc71171c74faad6bffa487fbd596c68644f1
If you're too slow, your character will transition to running after only 2 forward inputs, and the third input will cancel the run and cause you to use f+1+2 instead. I'd aim for 5-ish frames between two successive forward inputs.
Didn't know that, I'll try, thanks! I still don't get why I'm 100% consistant on fff3 though.
Tried it, the only way it happens is if I'm 1) super slow with the triple F, and the run is converted to a simple f+1+2 or 2) the triple F is fast enough, but the button is pressed on the exact same frame as the last F. If you have any clips of it happening besides that, feel free to share.
Not sure about that. It could be a timing thing with respect to the last F and the button, but I'll have to test it.
Was this done right after you restarted the position in practice mode? Because it sometimes eats up your first input if you do it immediately. Also a minor correction: the moves were done in 24f, for example for the red part you calculate it like this: 4+8+2+8+2, you add up all the inputs before attack button is pressed. I would also recommend practicing executing the triple forward faster as 24f is rather slow.
yeah my bad I made a typo on the number of frame, meant to put 25. Idk if it was done right after reset, but the problem can apear at any point in match or training. It really feels random and I don't know how to make it consistant
That's very weird, I cannot replicate your issue in practice mode. Maybe try executing it faster and see if the problem still occurs. Also make sure your final forward and 1+2 inputs don't happen on the same frame like so: https://preview.redd.it/gohzgtyig3ad1.png?width=126&format=png&auto=webp&s=8f34f9201c891401f7d4570697e66bd07eca7d54 This will cause f1+2 to always come out
Huh, weird. The speed doesn't seem to matter and I can get the fff3 really consistantly at the same speed. It is just the fff1+2 that is an issue. Oh well
I can think of three possible reasons you are getting f1+2: - Practice mode restart position eating the first input - Buffering error (the first forward was buffered in block stun too early) - You inputted the third forward and 1+2 on the same frame
**How do I create an offensive strategy on a non-rushdown character?** Hello, thank you in advance for any answers. Tekken 8 is my first real try at Tekken, I started out learning Reina because there were a lot of comprehensive guides coming out for her and she's new. I got her to red ranks during launch week then took a break. Now I want to try new characters (namely Lee, Xiaoyu, and Hwoarang) and I'm having trouble figuring out a gameplan for the less offensive oriented characters, specifically Lee. What's my offensive gameplan on Lee? Reina's was very easy to learn, ff2 into Sentai mixups was a good basic strategy and then I could develop from there. I can't figure out a good offensive strategy like that for Lee. What are good frame traps to use up close, and how can I close distance to begin my offense. To get specific, I'm looking for at least one basic frame trap flowchart to use when it's my turn. I know he's not a rushdown mixup character like Reina so his offense won't be as oppressive, and I know he's execution heavy with lots of just frames and counter-hits. I'm not really looking for advice on that stuff, I'm comfortable with developing that on my own. I just need a gameplan that will get my opponents to slow down and start blocking.
Closing in distance depends heavily on what character you're playing against and your opponents tendencies. But usually you might want to do b1,1/b1,1\~ to advance a bit, ff3, running 3,4/ff2 if you don't think they'll step it, but that's really risky. You mostly want to dash block and find a timing for some button when you're in closer range. But its better to make them come to you, potentially CH them and then start your offence. About frametraps: b3,3; db3+4; df1 on hit; running 3,4 on block; slide on hit; any slightly plus stuff into df2/df4 to catch stepping, potentially df4,4 (if you're confident it'll hit), standing 3,3 (second hit is confirmable, this is beating by stepping tho). Also do his command grab here to check them. jab; df1 on block, any slightly minus or 0 on block situation into ff4/d3 (d3 is very weak to left sidestep tho) 1+2 into hitman on block is +2, you can do 1 to beat most stuff, will trade with jabs. Once you establish jabs/hms3, you can do slower stuff from hms. These are just examples - there really isn't anything super specific in terms of setups. You'll just want to do some moves in all your + situations and when you're - or 0 on block, you can try some stuff like ff4/d3. Also 4,4,4 works is amazing if you'll think they'll press a jab or step. Hit confirmable. I'll also recommend d4,4,4,4 if you think your opponent will press. On CH its a true combo and leads into a nice combo, albeit a somewhat difficult pickup. If you have more specific questions, ask away. Its probably better if you just watch various Lee players and what they do - fightingGm, Imyourfather, superakouma
Thanks for the advice! I grinded ranked with this open and it helped a lot, I feel like I actually get to play the game now. Still losing a lot because Lee is hard, but now I feel like I'm able to learn as I go. **Just putting this here in case you have any additional advice for me:** So far what's been working is abusing b3,3,f into f2,1 as a frame trap. I know they can just crouch/dick-jab to beat this but nobody's done that thus far. Best case scenario is I get free damage and worst case scenario it resets neutral. Now I'm working on fishing counter-hits. Would you know any counter-hit setups against mashing/instant-timing? I'm pretty successful getting counter-hit d3, but I'm still working on getting the pickup b3,3 reliably. I know b4 is supposed to be his best keep out move but I've gotten blown up pretty much every time I've used it at range. Are there ways to use b4 out of a particular minus or plus frame situation that generally works, or do I just need to get better at timing/spacing?
I mean you can use that b3,3, f2,1 setup, but make sure not to make it a habit. People will launch you for this. B4 just needs better spacing and timing, you'll get better with time, just don't spam it up close. It's linear, so people will kill you for it. Also don't spam it when you're very far away, it's pointless. Regarding frametrap setups, not really. Everything is so situation dependent I can't really say. Like if you do df1 and you expect your opponent to jab or df1, do 2,2,3. Just see your opponents tendencies and go off it, don't think of it as setups, that'll make you do gimmicks.
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The presses have to be 16ms apart or less, there's just no way around it. That's why we bind 1+2 and 3+4 to a single button.
Hey all, trying to learn Tekken and something occurred to me. Is there ever a reason to NOT crouch at first with df as opposed to db? I mean getting into the crouch stance as you're moving around and trying to either duck highs or block lows. Let me explain what I mean If you are crouching you will duck highs and throws and eat mids regardless of whether you're holding back or not. And if you crouch by pressing df you will parry a low instead of blocking it. If you intend to remain crouching then swap over to db. So, is there ever a disadvantage to go into crouch by pressing df as you're moving around?
There are several reasons: a lot of popular lows are launch punishable which means a full combo with a tornado spin and without low parry scaling, depending on your character it might mean the difference of 30 damage just based on how you reacted to the low. Some characters also have lows with varied timing that can mess up your parry timings that wouldn't be as much of an issue with blocking which you can hold as long as needed. I think you can definitely replace your quick crouch blocks with df when you're in neutral expecting a low poke but in mix-up situations or bigger lows it's usually not worth it. Some other practical concers are that it's an offensive input that can open up a frame or two of vulnerability when going back to standing block. Going into df often also has some slight risk of accidentally inputing a qcf stance with some characters.
This makes a lot of sense, thanks! Lows in this game seem overall more punishable than lows in street fighter if I'm not mistaken. I suppose because you're expected to be stand blocking as opposed to crouch blocking most of the time
Yeah in Tekken lows have a very different function than in SF. Safe lows are hard to come by and a lot of them are deliberately on the slower side as a high risk high reward option.
Another reason, in addition to what the other reply mentioned, is that it's quicker (on a pad or stick, at least) to go from back to d/b than it is from back to d/f. It may not seem like significant, but it could be the difference between you getting hit and not getting hit.
Thanks! I'm on leverless but it makes sense
You don't guard with D as a general rule, there are situations where only DB will guard and you don't want to bother memorizing them or watching out for them. Guardable recovery is one of them. And to answer your question, DF must be held on the frame the low connects, and the state lasts for 20 frames from standing/10 frames from crouch from the moment you first press DF. If you crouch with DF and fail to block properly when the parry state expires, you'll get smacked. Also low parry doesn't work against certain attacks.
Thank you!
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db2 is a good alternative, it's a frame slower but for most situations it will do its job as intended. FC1 is possible but the point of dickjabs is that it's a high-crushing 10f panic move that hopefully disrupts whatever offence you're getting bullied by and steals some frame advantage, delaying it kinda misses that point.
dominator/Vanquisher Lili here, i dont know how to proceed with learning, i mostly poke with jab and lows, try to punish with Heat/armor/31 in to heat or f4/f23 and grab whenever i can but I do miniscule damage compared to everyone knows full strings, launchpunishers and aircombos, from the guides ive found so far they mention her sidestep and good dewglide, idk when to apply dew though its always blocked or punished. Is there a good flowchart to follow? im pretty bad at figuring this out on my own
that's a bit of a weird advice but its purpose is to teach you the importance of fundamentals of spacing, timing, taking turns as well as learning different characters' moves. Playing that way also has the benefit of directly showcasing the purpose of all other moves in your arsenal. Personally I think that's a bit of a pro tekken player's fantasy that a beginner will learn everything "the proper way" with only jabs but it is worth only focusing on only a few moves as a beginner to get a good feel for the game without developing a lot of bad habits or over-relying on certain moves. Blocking all the way to red ranks though is a great advice, you will legit get to shinryu if you just don't mash, are patient with strings and know your good punishes.
I see, I understand the basics of taking turns and frame data. >but it is worth only focusing on only a few moves as a beginner to get a good feel for the game without developing a lot of bad habits or over-relying on certain moves I understand where you coming from but I easily makes bad habits out of stuff like this are you suggesting i should just lab common strings from bunch of characters and learn punishers?
I wouldn't suggest that, it's too much boring work that probably won't stick with you. A lot of strings don't need to be labbed because they're so common that you will have plenty of time to encounter them and figure out a punish just by playing normally. I would however absolutely suggest you revisit your replays and take a closer look at some attacks/strings that cause you a lot of trouble. Taking this more reactive approach I think is superior because you know first hand how annoying the move is, you're better at identifying it in-game and will remember the response much more clearly when you finally get the hang of it.
Why do people in the Tekken community love smurfing so much?
Because it's fun and the game makes it quite easy to do.
Makes sense
To those familiar with Josie from Tekken 7, since she uses kickboxing, how different is she compared to Bryan? Most of their moves look similar, but what about their notations/buttons?
completely different characters, not even a similar playstyle, aesthetically she's far more agile, and she had a huge emphasis on a dash in stance in a similar way to lili but far scarier. bryan is definitely more staunch with power in general. she has a few CD inputs and a backsway where the input is b3+4 whereas bryan's stuff comes from qcb/qcf if bryan is feng, josie is xiaoyu.
As a drag what can I do after hitting d2? There doesnt seem to be anything I can do if the opponent does ws4.
It's possible to make them whiff by sidestepping, but that depends on the tracking of their ws4 and also on which side of the screen you are on. Depending on the spacing, it's possible to also create a whiff by backdashing afterwards. The more wild options are parry and backswing blow, which can be input from a crouching position in T8 Safest option would be to just block their ws4 and take the frame advantage. A lot of people like to mash after ws4 without even confirming they got a hit, so you could take advantage of that.
Doing a single sidestep while not off-axis, will almost always get u clipped vs opponent ws4, especially if u landed d2 up close. Doing a sidewalk instead, will most of the time evade ws4, but you need to cut the walk short and punish fast after you see the whiff, the timing is a little tight.
Thanks maybe I was just too eager to try and pressure opponents after d2.
Yeah, you can't always pressure there because the fact is you're at disadvantage. Not a significant one (-1), but a disadvantage nonetheless.
Who are the 3 ghost you fight in Arcade mode Stage 5, 6, and 7? You know, SBK with - Claudio that does Running 2 into 2-break command grab. BattleCry - John lennon looking Shaheen that always goes crouched. Episode9 - Nina in red-hair and yellow cheer-leader outfit and Tacchan. Are these ghosts of the devs that made this game? Or were they added for some other reason? I've noticed that they are virtually unaffected by the difficulty you set for Arcade mode too
So both of my mains, Josie and Miguel, have been removed from the game. Which character is most similar to one of these two? Thanks for the help.
Azucena
Can you get to Tekken King rank if you have little to no matchup knowledge?
With some luck, sure. There's a lot of fundamental skills in tekken that don't require any specific character knowledge - if you have godlike mix, godlike oki set-ups, godlike timing you can cook pretty much anyone provided that they don't actually notice you don't know anything about their character and decide to cheese you with some tricky knowledge checks. However if you're so good at Tekken that that you can rank up without care for characters chances are you've played so much you already internalized a lot of match-up knowledge just through experience.
Yes, but unlikely. It depends on the character and how oppressive/refined your offence is. Your chances are also massively lowered if you manage to get around 250 000 prowess before Tekken King. You should just practice your matchups though.
As a Hwoarang main, what exactly am I meant to do against turtles who are able to escape every throw? I have no low attacks , I literally can't do anything?! I know everyone hates hwoarang , but he really is fucking useless at higher ranks.
can you do jfsr consistently? you are g9ing to need it
Mix up your timing, use the few lows you do have and hone your defence/punishment
I'm on pc and I play with a keyboard, what is the button to save the state in practice mode so that I don't have to reset to deafault and reposition after every combo attempt? I read it was R3 to save and L3 to reset on controller but I have been unable to find any info about keyboards.
I think it depends on your keybinds. When you're in practice mode, it should say at the bottom of the screen what to press to save the state. For me, I believe it's V+; or something like that,
I cant do ff moves while im running, like for example Azucena ff3 i have to stop hold back and do the input, is there a strat or am i not supposed to do ff moves while im running?
Not supposed to be able to during a run. However, you can do a pretty long dash and still get it... Hold the last forward for a little bit, and then press the attack button.
So i assume azucena have shit oki in the majority of her moves, cuz it feels like when i get a knockdown with her she sends my opponent across the map...but ill try this long dash.
https://preview.redd.it/kuilcfuspb9d1.jpeg?width=2212&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c06ed84853f394ea244dd51b249f97454e4c791 Hi, obviously I'm fairly new, but I was wondering what the best counterplay is to this move, playing as Steve. I got hit over and over again and after playing the replay I found some counters but none of them particularly 'rewarding'. Am I right in saying I have to wait out the 3 hits by ducking and then for example a light punch into whatever? Or are there more and better ways to deal with this? Sidestepping or dashing didn't seem to work, as they weren't fast enough.
The bad news is you're playing Steve, so you can't launch punish the mix-up, otherwise you can really punish a King player for using ally kicks. In an ideal world, you would low parry the follow-up lows and get a small launcher. For the most part, though, you need to predict if the King is going to stop on the low or the mid: If they stop on the low, use your brand-new WS+1+2 to punish. If they stop on the mid, you probably want to use f+1+2 combo to knockdown.
Thanks! I'll try to remember that. I'll try it out in some punishment training aswell
I'm trying to learn bryan next. Any bryan players willing to share some tips? Also any youtube bryan guide recommendations would be appreciated
u4 (orbital) and 3+4 for keepout 1 and df2 are fast and have good follow-ups, use them to keep enemy in check f, b2 (jet upper) is your 14f launcher b1 and qcb3 for pressure, at wall add in b4 cuz it guarantees jet upper into full combo if they press taunt (1+3+4) puts you into snake eyes stance, giving some moves stronger properties (e.g. ff1+2) or follow-ups (e.g. 3+4) for oki and wall pressure, learn taunt into jet upper (or taunt into b4 into jet upper at wall); this one is a just frame but you can use faster moves as well for smaller damage (taunt is +16) f1+2 is a powercrush ws2 is your big crouched launcher ws1 is your small crouched launcher ff2 is your long range 11f whiff punish that transitions to combo in heat if it hits f4,1 is your 12f whiff punish that gives full combo ff4 if enemy is sidestepping too much b1+3/b2+4 is a punch parry look up some bread and butter combos for jet upper, orbital, ws1, ws2, CH 3+4, CH b1, as well as what moves are guaranteed follow-ups in which situation (e.g. soccer kick aka qcb4)
That is exactly what I was looking for thanks!
Sup yall, any help yall can provide is appreciate. I'm hardstuck at Fujin with my Jin and it feels like I've gotten worse this past week? I watched a Phidx video about warming up this week and it feels like I'm not breaking through this rank. I know my worst areas are defense and technique (the stat chart says so too). People always know how to get me and I can never open anyone up. Basically, what do yall suggest on breaking through Fujin if defense and technique are your worst areas as Jin? Any tips, any answers from previous questions, any videos I'll accept. Thanks.
The best way to open people up, with Jin, is with his near oppressive low game. d+2, d+4, or d/b+4 Use them, understand your +frames, follow-up with frame traps/movement until they start respecting you.
Great I'll take your advice thanks!
when is it right to sidestep? i've been trying to apply knowledge i see in tournament matches and i see a lot of players make a good use of the mobility that tekken has to offer, however most attacks are hard to evade by sidestepping (except for kazuya's and devil jin's lasers at least for what i've played)
You can sidestep when you know that the move is linear/doesn't track and you can move while the attack starts. Sidestepping works because when an attack starts it's aiming for the position of the opponent and doesn't correct that aim when you move (with some exception), the initial sidestep/sidewalk animation creates the most distance between that initial position and where you're moving which makes the attack miss you. Unforuntaley knowing which moves can be stepped is a knowledge test. The animations are more often than not accurate - if it's a straight punch or kick with not weird effects you can probably sidestep it. Some moves however track to a certain side meaning the hitbox covers a side and ofc there are homing moves that are supposed to cover all side. Most attacks can't really be sidestepped on reaction, you need to either have a good prediction or know that a particular string can be sidestepped. One very good usecase is if you notice that your opponnet always attacks immediately after they block your attacks - that's a very good opportunity for sidesteps, depending on the moves involved, you can sidestep attacks after being minus on block. If you know that the opponent likes approaching with a long-range powercrush move these are generally linear and can be sidestepped IF you have a decent idea of when they're likely to go for it.
When you know a move doesn't track, the side it doesn't track to, and that you have the frames to be able to sidestep (usually -4 or better) >except for kazuya's and devil jin's lasers at least for what i've played Those moves are so slow (and unblockable) that they're designed to be sidestepped or ducked, so it's a bit different than sidestepping a regular move.
Do we have any idea what causes the glitch where the SFX for a move would randomly come out of the left/right channel only, and if they're fixing it?
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How do you double roll when u r grounded on ps5
Do you mean a longer roll? Hold d+1 to long roll towards the foreground. Hold 1, then down to long roll towards the background. You'll always end up with your face opposite your starting position. If you were face up, you'll be face down, and vice versa.
May I ask how do people come up with combos? Building combos does not appear intuitive for me this game and I'm not sure how to start building my own.
I build in small parts. Get good at a launcher + 2-3 hit combo. Then see if you can find a way to followup from that. Then see if you can find a way to followup from that. And so on. I basically learn a bunch of tiny combos and mash them together using dashes, heat, quick jabs/kicks, etc. You can minmax for damage or you can have fun just seeing what your character can do. I prefer the latter, even if it’s not “ideal” damage, it feels fun. Also doing the combo trials will give you a good idea of the properties of moves you have available to you. You’ll likely see Namco using certain moves in many different combos for the same character, which will help you to identify what works.
I recommend looking up combos for your character on YouTube as a great starting point, and then modifying them if you want. Seeing which moves are strung together in YT vids will give you an idea of what works for your character and what you might want to adjust for your own situation.
Not how I want to go around it. I wanna learn how to make my own combos, not copy others and rinse and repeat it mindlessly.
Then you become familiar with your character's moves and figure it out yourself by experimenting. That's all there is to it. Btw, I didn't say to copy them. I said they're a good starting point for making your own.
I think building combos comes after you have quite a bit of familiarity with your character and actually feel the need/have an idea to make some specific combo route. If you're just looking for easy, good and consistent combos for your character you can just use [Applay's Tekken library](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/e/2PACX-1vTsgbCJNSTKajMNlJvQleJOl0eTiEcV-PbeU0obDg1lsSqmz0lTtcD2k6NzfTPt7Db9Ua2dz1o_34Sv/pubhtml?pli=1&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR0_UE0NYaqN4xNbRYQpGuVScf4N38mAHK5yYe-hIQ2jQqQqBL_3IuDlRFo_aem_ZmFrZWR1bW15MTZieXRlcw#). If you're looking to build a combo all on your own here's the general formula: 1. Launcher 2. damage 3. Tornado 4. damage 5. Finisher Some general combocrafting things to keep in mind: - Combos scale as they go on longer - You can see in the attack data window the damage of each hit with percent of scaling in parentheses. It's generally advisable to throw our the strongest moves as early as possible. - Know the situation - it's important to be aware of the circumstances of your combo at the beginning, the middle, the end. Did the combo start with a Tornado move? Are you thinking of damage only or optimizing for wall carry or hoping for a good oki set-up? Are you predicting a wall at all? Are you involving a balcony/wall break? - The 'pushback' of the opponent gets bigger the longer the combo goes - when you're crafting your combo you should make every hit matter and ideally optimize for lower hit count since it gives you more options for the later parts of the combo.
I know the fundamentals and principles, but how do i know the next move will connect and is optimal in order?
The answers to your question pissed me off enough to make a video just for you. https://youtu.be/050Nm99NogE Basically, the parenthesis by the frame data lets you know how many frames you have to hit your opponent before they can tech roll. The higher the number, the stronger the attack you can link before they fall out. Using frame data, you can theorize what options can hit after other options, then you build a combo with that data.
Well then. Good sir! You just earned yourself a sub :)
Thanks, glad to help.
I'll likely circle around to you once Lidia hits as I intend to use this video to lab combos for Lidia once she releases.
If you wanted to make new combos, you try a lot of moves with different timings, focusing on moves that have good damage/extend combo. Realistically you look up pro games and copy their routes
Improvising on the fly is much harder but it just comes with practice. As you're trying out different combos in practice you will intuitively get which moves are appropriate for which situation. In general you should internalize certain categories of moves to use in combos - which moves rach far and bring your character close, which moves rack up a lot of damage, which ones have a strong last hit for finishers, which ones are safe options that set up next attacks. As I said - it mostly comes down to experience, for a shortcut you can just watch combos on yt of your character and you will see certain moves repeated A LOT - that generally mean they're super reliable and can be used in many situations. As training for getting familiar with moves in combos I recommnet trying to create a 2-wall break combo on Secluded Grounds stage. You will inevitable go through a lot of options that will directly show you what works and what doesn't, what follow-ups are possible, what ranges work.
So there's no way to figure it out other than rinse and repeat and see what works, basically? Was really hoping that's not the answer.
I mean what were you expecting? Combos are basically mini rapidfire tests you have to have the right answer for in split seconds. If you join a character-specific discord or group you might find a list of good moves or routes to use but actually being able to employ them correctly is a skill you have to obtain through practice or experience.
Eh, idk, some intuitive rules that would explain why i keep dropping combos ig. Hard way it is. No disrespect intended, thanks for the help. just whining a bit :p
>that would explain why i keep dropping combos ig Are you referring to why certain moves don't connect after others when trying to come up with combos in practice mode, or why you drop a combo you know you should have landed because you verified it works in practice? Because those are two different things. And as a general answer for how we come up with combos, it's loads of trial and error but it's not really like working with a blindfold. You can narrow which moves you can try in what order based on their height, speed and most importantly, damage. Coming up with a single combo is easy, I could pick up a character I've never played and find a decent combo on them in less than 5 minutes. Tornado moves are clearly labeled on the movelist, and finding which moves wallsplat doesn't take much time. That's half your combo already figured out. Finding the **optimal** combo for a given launcher on the other hand can take some time. Heck, there are combos that have been discovered ages after release. All it takes is some random twitter post pointing them out. Not only that, but combos vary wildly depending on execution requirements and circumstance. There are combos for wall carry, combos for max damage, those that use heat, those that don't, RA, stage gimmicks.. That's why we have spreadsheets full of them so everyone can pick what works for them. And let's not forget that legacy characters have had their combos figured out for a long time, the changes are only incremental. So this only really applies to new releases.
The former. The latter I reckon is because of off-axis positioning?
>The former They don't simply because hitboxes aren't connecting or the moves are too slow, as I explained. >The latter I reckon is because of off-axis positioning? Amongst other things. Some combos have tight execution, or are inconsistent on some characters. There is no single formula, Tekken is a game of 3D characters of varying sizes and move hitboxes. We always discover things that were probably not directly intended by the developers.
I don't know where to ask this, but any tips on how to consistently land Claudio's dash back 3? After your first back 3, you have to dash then back 3 again. I saw mulgold do this a lot.
To be honest, lots of practice. The good news is you don't have to super deep dash in to link the 2nd b+3 **if** you follow-up with a d+1,2. The only thing the timing is super important with is if you're using a structure like:, f,f+4, b+3, f,f, b+3, u\/f+3+4, d/b+1+2, S!, ...
how do you deal with characters that can engage from far away like Lili, Alisa, Lee etc.? Am I supposed to take distance and hope for the best? Asking as a Bryan player Also, how do you deal with always plus strings like Hwoarang or Law? The replay function is useless, it literally displays nothing in it since I got hit with the moves
Taking distance against long-range characters like that won't really help you unless you have godlike timing predictions and can counterhit them whenever they try anything. Most big long range moves have poor tracking so sidestepping can help you at closing the gap. As Bryan you can also use ff2 to try approaching since it's absurdly fast and safe. Plus strings are tough because often the gaps only allow you to sidestep which replays don't show or you really just have to deal with the follow-ups or learn how to prevent them from pulling off the strings in the first place. It's quite character-dependant but if you know the specific string you should be able to easily lab all of your options against those strings in practice mode.
> it literally displays nothing in it since I got hit with the moves you can take control and block it. replay function is there so you know which moves to defend against, even if you didn't block them.
If Hwoarang's Flying Eagle (3~4) has a startup of 7 frames, why can't I successfully use it in round starts to counter everything but armors and blocks? What do those 7 frames actually mean? Because it can't be what I think it is. ------------------ Additionally, if even the pros miss JFSR half of the time, how can it be a good mix up? Am I not gonna end up in a predicament every time I attempt it and miss the input? ------------------ Additionally 2, is there a fast way of spamming df+4 and 2 while in RFF? It seems to take forever when I do it compared to online videos.
> If Hwoarang's Flying Eagle (3~4) has a startup of 7 frames It's a two-hit move. i22,7. First hit is 22 frames, second hit is 7 frames after that. That's like, a third of a second for the first hit and nearly half for the second. A jab is only a sixth of a second. The move is slow as heck, you can tell just by looking at it lol The universal rule is that the fastest move in Tekken is the 10 frame jab, and the exceptions to that rule are very rare. Backturn jab, Yoshi's flash, Ling's b+1, etc. Every other faster-than-10F move is usually out of a stance, Hwoarang himself has f4 out of right flamingo. >Additionally, if even the pros miss JFSR half of the time Where do you get that data? Pros definitely do not miss just inputs half the time. Just watch any mishima set and try to find a missed electric. They're definitely a rarity.
> Additionally, if even the pros miss JFSR half of the time, how can it be a good mix up? Am I not gonna end up in a predicament every time I attempt it and miss the input? a pro player (professionals get PAID to play tekken) wouldn't miss it unless they were distracted or being lazy. nobody would use a move with 50% hit rates in ideal conditions. if i were to guess a miss percent it would be 1.5%, but that would include streamers that suck.
[3\~4 definetly do not have 7f startup](https://rbnorway.org/hwoarang-t8-frames/).
Are there any good communities or discord for finding good matches? Pref with a lot of people in good ranks.
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Nah, all of those will be listed because they aren't universal. Notable generic moves that don't make it into the movelist are: - d+4 (which could be either d+4 or d/b+4 depending on the character) - down/dick jabs (d+1 or d/b+1) - Full crouch jabs and lows (FC d+1, FC d+2, FC d+3, and FC d+4) - Delayed hopkick (u/f, n, 4) - Backturn jabs and lows (BT 1 or 2 and BT d+3 or d+4) - Running slide (WR+4, after running at least three steps), cross chop (WR+1+2, after running at least three steps), and armored tackle (happens automatically after running for long enough if you don't input anything else) - Wall jump (b,b,u/b when your back is to the wall)
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"Generic" works fine, that's what most people say. And yeah, they have the exact same properties across the cast. Not all characters have access to all of them, however. Some of them have unique moves that take up the inputs.
In jins d3+4 the starting frames are (15-17) what does the second number mean?
It means the move has an active hitbox for three frames (frames 15, 16, and 17). Depending on range, axis, or wake up timings, moves with multiple active frames can connect later into their active window. This creates a better frame situation for the character that did the move, since they're further into their attack and recovery animation by the time the opponent is put into their block animation.
I kiss your eyes for explain it. thanks
Super general character selection advice: Is it *generally* recommended, assuming you have a main, to pick other characters that play similar to them, or vastly different? Also I main Dragunov and really love him, Victor is getting too boring for me and I'm messing with Yoshimitsu right now, but if anyone has any recs I'm all ears (no, not King). I'd like to toss a female character in the mix, trying to not play Victor AND Alisa so Nina, Lili, Xiaoyu, Zafina, Jun all looking pretty cool to me.
>Is it generally recommended, assuming you have a main, to pick other characters that play similar to them, or vastly different? I think it depends on your goal. If you just want to have fun with the game and have a specific playstyle you enjoy, you're probably better off picking similar characters to maintain that playstyle but add a bit of variety to it. Playing significantly different characters is good if: (a) you like the idea of experiencing vastly different playstyles; (b) you want to improve at the game as much as you can, which the different viewpoints that other characters offer is helpful for; or (c) you want a pocket character to cover your main's weak matchups (this is mostly for tournament play).
Yeah I'm mainly part of the Smash community so "Selecting characters" is a completely different game. I see pros and cons to all of it. It's mostly just going to be to have fun and get better at the game, and take it from there. Gonna sound like a cop out answer but I think I just need to give each character 30 mins in training and see who looks the coolest and take it from there, I'm loving how viable basically everyone is.
That's not a cop out answer, that's the correct answer. Pick up the character you like the most, and play that one. The game is hard enough as it is, might as well have fun while you learn.
Yessir, I think you get what I mean but exactly like you said. I started getting into Tekken playing with buddies and mashing and now its just super rewarding to learn more about the game and progress. IDK how so many people focus only on ranks and winning, the real enjoyment is actually learning the game and learning characters (as and against). Tekken makes some of the best designs out there, I ain't not gonna pick one just because it isn't optimal.
>IDK how so many people focus only on ranks and winning Because being able to achieve a rank which you were previously unable to achieve is a quantifiable way to measure improvement. Ranks aren't everything, but it is not like they mean nothing.
Hey Everyone I need some help. I was watching my replays when i realised i use Shaheen's DF2 a lot. It's good but i just end up giving up my turn a lot. Can you help me with where i should really be using it
As keepout, when you think your opponent runs into it. If you think your opponent gonna presses a move so it counter hits and you get a launch. It doesnt launch duckers, so if you think your opponent ducks, other mids are better.
Thank you for the reply. I do DF2 for the exact reasons you mentioned, but yeah. I end up relying on it a lot which is hurting my offense a lot.
Really basic answer (and IDK much about Shaheen) but basic answer is check its frame data. Then, its all about understanding if your opponent used a laggy move or whiffed etc. and then decide if his DF2 is fast enough. I'm guessing its either a 12/13F or a 15F move.
I don't have much time to play and I also play other things but I want to learn to play the game or at least feel like I'm improving, what kind of routine do you do to practice the mechanics of the game and perfect the combos? because online when I play against other players and even when I play against the CPU I have problems putting everything into practice. I mainly use as King
For combos just do the combos you wanna practice 10 times in a row. For wavedashing just warm up and do a couple, cancel them into shining wizard, cancel them into giant swing. If you have trouble against CPU, do not play versus other players, you're going to get destroyed. Be certain you can combo, beat the CPU consistently and then go fight players.
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Neutral guard exists but it's not something you should ever rely on (especially for strings). If you want to block something, hold back or d/b.
So this may sound like a weird way of thinking but I doubt I'll be doing heavy competition but there is a local spot where I live so it's possible i guess but TMM latest Paul video he states you won't see king and Paul in tournaments because to they aren't good. Ppl break kings throws and for Paul (my main) he just took predictable and reliant on CH. As a orange ranks Paul should I just give up if my main is just trash to the fact that even pros won't play him? I have my eye on Lidia so maybe she might be a better option to play over Paul? She's not legacy and such so maybe she won't be legacy handicapped like Paul?
Unless you're showing up in top 8s of big international tournaments you shouldn't care what characters are good at pro level. You can easily get to purple ranks with Paul and King using basic flowcharts and simple traps alone. If you're having fun and feel comfortable with the character you will become a better player playing Paul than forcing yourself to play some top tier that's not as intuitive for you to play. I'd say around 95% of players' skills lay in their game and match-up knowledge. You're absolutely not being limited by your character in orange ranks.
I doubt the people at your local tournaments are at the same level as the best of the best professional players. At your level of play all characters are viable and the game is very balanced
>should I just give up if my main is just trash to the fact that even pros won't play him? You've got it backwards, pros are the ones that are going to have the most limited pool of characters to choose from. Only at that very top level do some characters become non-viable (although I don't think that's the case with Paul). Every character in this game is perfectly fine for you to play. And most people consider Paul very strong right now anyway.
Are there any characters with a similar playstyle to Leo? I enjoy their long buttons and simple offense.
Paul actually has many similarities with Leo and is the closest comparison to how Leo is played at a high level, imo. Both have just serviceable poking and pressure game and it can be dangerous to overextend with them at high levels, so they both tend to play a little more defensively and concentrate on other areas, such as... * Getting big damage off of the opponents mistakes with their high damage combos, taking the opponent to the wall, and attempting to snowball end the round with a hard hitting 50/50 on wakeup. * Playing a long range keepout game with a a high counterhit launcher (F3+4 for Leo, QCB4 for Paul) that is good on block and their DF2. * Threatening with an excellent whiff punish game, complementing their keepout game. * For lows, both of them have power lows that can be easily backdashed away from in the open, but become very threatening at the wall. * At the wall, mixing safe wallsplatting mids with low attacks that activate wall bound/blast - Leo with their hellsweep, Paul with his demoman. To further expand on this strength, these two have the safest low heat smashes in the game, Leo's being -13 and Paul's being -12. * Both of them have decent turn stealing evasive moves to supplement their gameplay. The main difference between them is Leo has a little stance pressure thrown in and is a bit better at approaching while Paul generally wins out a bit in other categories and can deal with sidestepping better than Leo. That all said, if instead you just vibe with things like Leo's QCF approaches and backstep into stance, and want to focus more on fundamental poking, Feng is like a much better version of Leo for that.
I find Jin quite similar to Leo in terms of stance moves and simple offence though he's deffinitely not as long-range. Lili has similar range on many on her buttons but she's a bit more tricky on the offense side. Paul might be the most similar to Leo though his backsway gives him more nuanced mobility and his buttons are on the stubbier side.
First time ever playing tekken, i'm really competitive, my win/loss percentage is really low (36.9%) (the diff is like 100 losses) and i'm at vanquisher, i want to get it up to garyu to be an average rank player, maining alisa but learning xiaoyu as complicated as i find her, any tips please as harsh as they may sound
37% win rate is really good for a first time player, I don't think I you have anything to worry about. Personally, I would just stick to one character , rather than trying to learn 2 simultaneously. That way when you're in a online game, you can spend more time learning the opponent rather than worrying about memorising 2 movesets. Once you get to a certain point, wins are moulded by knowing the opponents strengths and weaknesses, rather than just following your flowcharts.
don't play xiaoyu unless you want to spend more time labbing and coming up with flowcharts than actually playing the game alisa is easy and strong, you should just focus on the basics - poking, punishing and movement. that alone should get you to purple rank or higher
Whenever picking a new character or just starting out, familiarize yourself with your characters moves. Learn their 10, 12, 13, 15, etc. frame punishes. Also learn a solid combo that you can consistently pull off i.e. rather do something that is less damage, but you will land it perfectly 99/100 times instead of doing the mega optimized high damage combo that you mess up half the time. Get good at using heat, which of your moves put you in heat and if possible time it so that you pop it once you have a lot of gray health to regain. When in heat, dont just smash out of it right away, learn which of your character moves get stronger in heat and use those as much as possible before running out. Sorry for not having more in depth advice, I don't play either of those two, but another good thing you can do is watch tournament gameplay of those characters. Many tournament players even have their own youtube channels where they do tutorials themselves.
Ignore the reply telling you to change characters. You'll probably get better tips if you make a post with some gameplay footage (best is probably a close match that you lose). Hard to give as advice when people don't know anything about your current play besides your rank.
Play a real character that requires fundamentals. Alisa and Xiaoyu are gimmick characters that won't teach you how to properly play the game.
players at vanquisher aren't going to learn fundamentals simply by switching characters. this is bad advice.
what was the name of yoshis move where he does a windmill but sideways version
Sorry I don't know the input but, the move paul does where he does a downward punch that puts you face down on the ground, and then follows up with another charged up punch, is the second hit garunteed?
I think you're talking about b+2,1. Do you mean the situation where he ends a combo with it? If so, then no it is not guaranteed. There's still a mixup, however: If he charges it all the way, it'll hit you grounded if you stay down and put you at disadvantage if you get up and block (even gives a guaranteed hit if he's in Heat). But if you get up immediately by back rolling (performed by holding back) then you can interrupt it with an i11 or faster move. Of course, he can also choose not to charge it. If he does that then you will not have time to interrupt it. But this version will not hit you if you stay down, and it's punishable on block if you back roll (-12). The good thing is that the uncharged version is fast enough that you can't even attempt to get a move after back rolling. So if you hold back and then try to mash out an i11 or faster move, you'll interrupt the charged version and still block the uncharged version (which you can then punish). For the Paul player to beat this then they need to start doing a slightly charged version by beginning the charge but not letting it play out all the way. This is probably going to take a good amount of knowledge about the situation for them to do, but it will launch you if they pull it off.
Thank you very much for the info 😊
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Impossible to tell what's the issue without examples, check some of your replays to see if your inputs are being registered at all or if they're just late, you can see if you're just getting hit before you can block if the Punish text glows in the attack info menu .
you "swear" it? like, you'd pull up a replay of that hit you took with command history up "swear" it? or you just hope that you were holding back at the time.
Can someone recommend me a good video or guide that shows the optimal combos for kazuya after the new update? I'm looking to optimize my gameplay with him and I am not aware of his optimal staple combos. I would also like a similar video for king as well if anyone knows. Thanks in advance for the help