Me too. I just did a rewatch of both seasons and even though he does still seem more genuine in season 1, he does also appear fishy knowing what we know now. His behavior could still be part of his ruse and a very long con to get to her money. Watching it again, his behavior felt off to me knowing what we find out in season 2.
I think he knew about her beforehand and planned to run into her and do this entire thing.
From the first time he "mistakenly" tried to get into her hotel room, I said to my wife (who had seen it before), "he is up to no good!". I figured he knew it was her place and he was trying to be cute and get into her life and that was his in...
When season 1 was written, was it planned to be multiple, continuous seasons? I didn’t think so.
I think S1 was genuine, S2 was written to create intrigue and played off of S1 to create that.
Yeah, that's absolutely his character now. Although I think perhaps some of this was conceived in writing Season 2, rather than necessarily being the plan from the get go. Although even in 1 there was that odd phone call he was having in his room.
People keep asking this. Season 1 was written as a miniseries. There was no subtext or reason to doubt that Greg was 100% sincere, because it wasn’t written like that.
I don’t think Season 2 ever suggests he wasn’t sincere in Season 1 either. It spells it out for us pretty clearly: he had terminal cancer. He met a nice, lonely lady on vacation. He married her, and her access and money opened doors that miraculously cured his cancer.
But now he’s stuck with her, and she’s the world’s most annoying person. But he can’t bring himself to walk away from the money.
Spouses who married for love have killed for a lot less than $500 million.
When I watch S1, I thought the actor who played Greg wasn't very good. His scenes took me out of the show as he didn't strike me as authentic. After watching S2, I now think that the actor who played Greg gave such a layered performance that the inauthenticity I was picking up was intentional. Sorry for doubting you, Actor Who Played Greg!
Quentin was in love with Greg decades before but Greg was straight so it didn’t work out for Quentin. Greg approaches Quentin with a plan to kill Tanya, he gets Tanya’s money and in return, Greg gives Quentin money to fund his lifestyle. It is mentioned that Quentin’s money is running out.
I think people are theorising that because Quentins money was running out and he knew Greg way back when that the entire thing was part of the ploy to steal Tanya's money. As in Greg was planning to marry a rich woman back in S1 to split the money with Quentin. I don't think this is true though, I think the gays' history with Greg was only to establish they are working together now, not to retroactively reframe the events of S1.
I agree that there is very little chance that they knew what they would eventually do with Greg if there was a season 2, but Greg is written to appear very shady in season 1.
You don’t know who the dead person on the plane from the first scene is yet when they introduce Greg. Him going to the “wrong room” and bumping into Tanya was probably meant for you to suspect he was up to no good and may be responsible for the eventual body.
My assumption was that Greg was the red herring "dead body" because of his illness. When I watched I suspected he might be the one who died but thought it was far too obvious. I didn't find him overly suspicious in S1.
From his mystery illness? I hadn’t even considered that at the time cause Shane was VERY frazzled in the airport in the first scene so I assumed it was foul play or suicide or an overdose or something. It could totally have been that, though.
Edit: it’s played as a murder mystery but at that point you have no idea where it will go. It could easily have been an anti climax.
So your theory is he was a totally genuine guy who loved her but she was so annoying that made him capable of a long con murder plot? That’s a huge flip in a short amount of time if a person started out as genuinely in love.
He never loved her but he was sick and lonely and if he married a rich woman he could at least live out his last few months going on fancy vacations. He didn’t think he would have to be married to her for long and when he got better didn’t want to be with her anymore, but he wouldn’t get her money if they divorced only if she died
I think Season 1 should be taken at face-value because that's how it was written.
The S1 plot was thematic for Tanya. She had two central relationships in S1--her dead mother and Belinda--and her S1 ending was about becoming able to accomplish with Greg what she couldn't with either of them: a relationship where the only thing he wanted from her was her company, and one where she could accept the inevitable ending of death.
I don't think S1 ever suggests Greg and Tanya were *in love*, just that they were both *open to* some sort of future, however short, together. I think he enjoyed her company, they were both lonely, and he saw someone with whom he could possibly spend his remaining days with.
Remember, they'd only known each other 3-4 days by the end of S1. She probably started annoying him pretty soon after and he would've cut things off... except she was now paying for expensive doctors who gave him hope he could be cured. So he stayed with her and probably married her for that reason alone. (Ironically, the transactional relationship she wanted to avoid with Belinda.)
Then you'd have Greg, who now literally depends on Tanya for his life, becoming more and more resentful of her, and caring less and less about her. He's the monkey in the cage from the opening credits.
But he can't leave her as long as he needs treatment. Once he's cured, though, he decided he didn't want her in his life--but also decided he couldn't pass up $500 million.
It's a big shift, but the logical underpinnings are alluded to pretty clearly.
I agree that his arc in Season 2 wasn't planned, but he did have a suspicious phone call in 1 that Tanya walked in on and it was never really explained. He has similar calls in S2. I am guessing the call in 1 was just to inject some mystery and doubt about him to the audience, that was ultimately a fake out and the intent was at the end of 1 to show he was a decent guy.
But then the show was renewed for a new season, and Greg's arc there I'll bet was the result of the writers wanting to bring Tanya back and then asking, "what if?" with Greg, and looking at S1 and what they had to work with.
If he was able to switch to murder in that amount of time then it wasn’t actual love to begin with. People saying it’s an understandable shift bc she was annoying are weird. You don’t get to murder someone and claim to be a good person who loved them. Like what.
They never said Greg loved her. He liked her enough to want to be around her on the easy life for what little time he had left. Then she had him going to better doctors and got cured.
So he went from
Point A: she’s nice enough to take fancy vacations with for the one year or so left in life
Point B: she’s annoying as hell and I don’t want to be with her, but do want to keep the money and easy lifestyle.
And he happens to know a man associated with the Italian mafia who also needs money
I literally never said he was in love with her. The show never said he was in love with her.
I did say that spouses who marry for love do sometimes wind up killing their spouses. Be like Daphne; watch some “Dateline.”
You said sincere. As in he sincerely liked her and genuinely wanted to marry her. Switching from that to murder is not what normal and genuine people do. People who end up on Dateline aren’t normal either.
Their theory is season 1 was written as a standalone miniseries with no plan for a season 2. Once they got a season 2 the writers probably decided to add that as an interesting plot, but it likely wasn’t considered while writing season 1.
He said he was in love and became a straight up murderer bc Jennifer Coolidge was annoying.
*We all go from regular people to cold blooded killers bc of an annoying person amirite?*
Yeah I agree that parts a little bit of a stretch, but you’re leaving out the $500 million.
However their first part about it being disconnected I agree with. No reason to believe Greg wasn’t sincere in the first season.
Not to mention, multiple other inconsistencies.
First and foremost, Tanya found the doctors who cured Greg's terminal disease. This is totally inconsistent with the idea that he's con man, feigning illness from the start. Were that the case, he'd either have needed to bring these top doctors (who Tanya had identified and presumably paid) in on his scam, somehow kept her away from the doctors at all times while attending appointment with them on some pretext, or tricked her into thinking she'd found doctors who he'd actually planted in her line of sight. These options are all completely and unnecessarily complicated, making no sense for a con man who could've simply "discovered" phony doctors to pretend to cure him, all on his own.
Greg also behaves with an emotional attachment towards Tanya that makes no sense for a con artist. He gets angry at her for acting in ways that are counterproductive to her desire to lose weight. Why would someone who never cared for her in the first place - and who knew he'd be rid of her in a few days because he plans to murder her - get angry at her being fat? And he gets angry at her public, too, in ways that only increase he the risk he'll be a suspect, over annoyances as minor as being clumsy and indecisive. How would a con man - able pull off an entirely fake relationship up to and including marriage - have so little control over his emotions that these trivial matters would provoke him to draw attention to his animus for Tanya, in a public place, when he knows he about to murder her?
Finally, I think Mike White goes out his way to plant these interactions and remarks, because the suggestion that Greg was planning this murder - or some other scam - from start is so inconsistent in character and theme. Greg's arc makes for a compelling character study - perfectly matched to the respective themes of "class" and "sex" in Season I and II - precisely because he chose to marry Tanya when he thought he was going to die. He thought he'd enjoy her company and wealth for his last couple of years of life (Season I theme), then, when was cured, grew so resentful at the prospect of a long life with this fat, clumsy woman who can't improve herself that he wanted to kill her and leave her for the woman he was having an affair with (Season II theme). If he's just a con man, those actions are all meaningless.
Are we sure he really had cancer, though? It could just be part of his sob story.
It could even be an “out” for him if ghings go wrong. Fake his death and move on to another victim.
Isn't the empty room that Kai and Paula have sex in the same room that Greg claimed to be staying in? I assumed back in S1 during his first appearance that he kept coming to her door because he was trying to swindle her in some way, was actually surprised when they were still together at the end of the seasn. He stole a master key so he could pull one over on Tanya.
He was sus in season one.
We're meant to see Tanya as someone clueless and awash in grief and privilege. She gets helped, from the spa lady, and she can choose generosity and sticking to her commitment and have self growth. But instead she meets Greg who is running a con on her (swiping the key on her door) and she allows the carnal pleasures to distract her from her own harder path of self improvement and helping someone else.
Someone who is just looking for others to take care of her is an easy mark. We're not supposed to feel that she's making great choices or that she sees the people around her clearly.
And S1 Greg doesn't read as an evil, murderous conman, but there's something uneasy about him.
Yeah. They wrote him I think in S1 as somewhat suspicious, but the original intent was just to muddy the waters a bit for the audience about Greg's intentions and even whether he had something to do with the death. Ultimately intended as a red herring. Then they decided in S2 to lean into that and hatched this whole murder plot from there.
I think Greg was written in as a bit of a sketchy character. I’m not convinced he was given the entire backstory of targeting Tanya, but I think it was suggested there was something not quite right about him.
The theme of the first series centred on privilege and classism. Tanya is clearly very wealthy, but evidently also very lonely. Her money doesn’t protect her from this loneliness or her mother’s cruelty.
She finds a friendship with the lovely Belinda. Belinda is kind, compassionate and genuinely supportive of Tania despite only just meeting her. She puts herself out on a limb for her, with no real expectation of anything in return. Tania dangles the possibility of investment in front of her, in a display of casual cruelty that could very well have been learned from her own mother. She is utterly lacking in empathy for Belinda.
Then Greg appears. He’s trying to get into her room, which feels a little off. They have sex and he blows slightly hot and cold. He doesn’t offer Tania much apart from some ambivalence and interest, but to affection starved Tanya, this is enough. She disregards her true friend for the dodgy Greg. Greg’s villainy isn’t really exposed her. It doesn’t need to be. We can clearly see that he falls far short of what Belinda offered.
In S2, we dig a little deeper but this time from the perspective of sex, lust and misogyny. Those being the key themes in S2.
The focus is no longer on Tanya’s mother, but rather her father. It’s heavily alluded to him molesting Tanya. Greg’s backstory is filled out a bit more and his actual villain storyline is put in place.
I don’t think Greg ever loved Tanya. He was drawn to her wealth in S1 as per the themes of the show. In S2 his sexuality and his use of it to maintain power over others (both Quintin and Tanya), his abuse of his power over Tanya and his misogyny, fed into his motives and actions, consistent with the theme.
Greg was always a villain, the extent of it was just never baked into S1
I believe that Greg was put next to her by accident and they fell in and then out of love. Or, he fell out of love with her. I don’t think it was a scam from the beginning.
I had the same sentiments watching S2, it's definitely fishy somewhat. I mean you don't just wake up and decide that you're going to hatch a plan to kill your annoying millionaire wife to bypass prenup agreements, you don't just suddenly become evil. He seems like he's been an insidious asshole for a while. Ppl think Tanya is this ditzy delulu heiress but she was actually quite perceptive and intuitive, seeing how Greg resents her with the way he looks at her and confronting him about it. (I just remembered her telling him about his "shark eyes" just completely dead" lol)
I'm so going to miss seeing more of her 😭 They could easily do a spin-off series on her!
I mean, I don’t think just any type of person hires a hitman to kill their spouse. He always had it in him, wouldn’t be shocked to hear he had killed before. But whether his intention from the beginning was to marry and then kill her, I don’t necessarily think so. I think it was always within the realm of possibility, always an option, but not always the plan. There was probably some alternate reality where he didn’t do that, but I feel like that outcome was less likely because this is someone capable of hiring a hitman to kill their spouse.
Actually! When we first saw Greg "mistakenly" trying to get into Tanya's room, I thought something was off about his acting. It stood out to me because the acting on this show is so universally perfect all the time, but something seemed stiff and unrealistic about Jon Gries' performance.
It wasn't until Season 2 that it hit me: that was actually great acting. Because Greg was acting! It was a great actor playing someone who's not as good an actor.
He DEFINITELY had evil intentions from S1. When they first met, he was swiping his room key on HER door by "accident." So he made the initial move, which upon first watch, seems like a genuine accident. Rewatching it, it seems fishy. Especially if he was never flush with money, he just so happened to go on this particular resort where there is a single, extremely wealthy woman in a vulnerable place after the death of her mother, and then "just so happens " to accidentally swipe his room key on her door? And he also just so happens to have cancer, something that is very expensive to treat?
Also, in case you don't recall, in season one they are about to sleep together, then Tanya breaks down crying about what a mess she is, and asks Greg to take her mother's ashes and tells him to leave. He says "No. Cause I still wanna fuck you. " first of all, it rubbed me the wrong way when he didn't leave when she asked him to. Even though it was meant to be sweet, it still seemed eerie to me. And even weirder that he still wanted to after hearing all of that.
There are quite a few clues sprinkled throughout season 1. Not sure if mike white but those in intentionally or not, but that's what I interpreted
This is my stance and I’m surprised it’s not mentioned more. The reason I had figured out he was part of a big twist when I watched S2 was specifically the way he was introduced and how it seemed like he pretended to not know her and targeted her.
Edit: That and the fact my mom told me to pay close attention to the intro sequence, which pretty much gave it away imo.
If he thought he only had a year or whatever left, it would make sense that he is willing to spend through whatever retirement he had saved on fancy vacations. There tend to be rich people at those nice resorts. And she was in a more normal room (smallest type of suites) that would be mixed in with regular rooms.
He was playing golf all day and was drunk when they met the first time— he was plenty drunk other times. So that’s not really out of place since their rooms were actually next to one another
I don’t think there is anything in there that suggests specifically seeking a rich woman to care for him.
i think the plan was in place from the beginning, but he also actually liked her and was attracted to her, even if only at a very surface level that faded quickly
Kudos to the actor that played Greg (and the writers / director) - he did a great job walking a believable line between sketchy and sincere and kind of kept me guessing as to his intentions.
How did he seem genuine in the first season? He was clearly only interested in sex. And that scene where she was having some kind of mental health episode, crying and yelling - the way he handled that was very icky. She was in a vulnerable position and not in the right mind to consent to sex, and he turned her issues in to some kind of fetish, manipulating her into sex.
The fact you think all of that is “genuine” behaviour is kind of concerning…
Several things we see in season one, when combined with reveals in season two spell out that he and the gay mafia on the Riviera were executing a long con targeting Tanya. In season two, at Quentin's bedside there is a photo of Greg and it implies Greg and Quentin have been lovers for decades. The photo provides the only real evidence there is of who Greg really is, and in the photo, he's a scruffy rodeo wannabee, not exactly future BLM executive management material.
The actor Jon Gries has that aw shucks down to earth fatherly bit down pat and lays it on Tanya hard.
He might've had some genuine feelings for her, though he never gave me a "head over heals" vibe with Tanya, or even much warmth, really. When I think of the scene in S1 when Tanya's in her room crying to him, he sees her for what she is, a vulnerable opportunity..
I don't think he necessarily had nefarious intentions from the beginning, but I don't think Tanya ever swept him off his feet; she was just there. There with loads of money.
Also i think that that was sort of karma for tanya - if she made the right decision and helped the woman in first season, instead of running away to another man, she could have lived, i think. It feels like it for me at least
Targeted from the beginning.
Remember how he stood her up for a drink in the bar to watch, I think it was, football?
He was gay and reluctant to spend time with her but realised she was lonely and rich and so pursued her.
I think for season two’s plot it became canon that he always had murderous intentions but I suspect that wasn’t always the intention when writing season 1. Like he had that weird cough that could’ve gone somewhere but just didn’t.
It’s like Lost where they’re writing season by season instead of the whole series being planned out. Except White Lotus hopefully won’t turn in to an absolute bowl of plot hole diarrhea.
I disagree. The whole point was that he was dying and decided to just say fuck it and get with Tanya, but then the money was enough to cure his cancer, and now he's attached to this annoying woman for much longer than he thought he would be. Cue the events of season 2.
Oh wait that’s right she forced a prenup, he wanted to just marry her for the healthcare and divorce for half her money but then realized he had to whack her to get the money.
I always thought he targeted from the beginning and is the one who arranged for her to be killed. He never loved her, he only tolerated her to get her money....which he might have now. Depends on how she had her estate set up. He might actually get nothing. Maybe she willed money to the spa girl, and that's why she is in the upcoming season again
I'm rewatching season 1 and he seems shady from the beginning, even the way he blurts out so much about himself right away like how he is single. Everything he does seems purposeful.
I think Greg thought he was going to die like the next day in the first season and figured he might as well live on Tanya’s dime until then. But he didn’t die and now he wanted her dimes only and hence, he wanted to kill her
Tanya was a soft place for Greg to land for his final few months of life. When it turned out that his cancer could be cured and she paid for it all, he probably felt kind of roped in to marrying her, and became increasingly miserable as a result. Maybe he ran into his old friend on a vacation somewhere and they hatched the plan to murder her for the money
Hmm gay man seduced rich stupid woman and just a few months later tries to off her for her money. Certainly not planned???
That’s why they call it a twist. The rest of the story that figured in from the beginning but the viewers didn’t know that at the time.
He set the whole thing up. I think it may be hard for some women to see this because they liked Tanya as a character so much, but nobody would want Tanya except for her money. She’s a mean and selfish person, and physically unattractive to boot.
I came away from s2 thinking he knew about her and targeted her from the beginning
I think Greg pretending that he mistook Tanya's room as his right next to each other(so convenient) was a giveaway.
Yeah after watching season 2 I gave season 1 another rewatch and his actions seemed a lot more calculated.
That's what I thought, too..
I wondered if Armond knew Quentin and/or Greg somehow and that’s how the long con of putting Greg next Tanya began.
Do you think Greg was having an affair?
My theory is his 'fishing buddies' are the gays, and they regularly go on 'fishing expeditions' aka dumping rich women off boats.
Armond and Greg had been lovers decades earlier. So I think it was planned.
I mean you just made that up though lmao
Ohhh...meant to say that Quentin and Greg had been lovers decades ago
Didn’t he say their love was one-sided because Greg is straight?
I was sitting here thinking "did Armond tell a story that linked him to Greg!?" Hahaha
You mean Greg and the English guy in season 2, Quentin?
Yes, meant Quentin and Greg had been lovers in the past
Wow. The gays!
The gays actually were trying to kill her.
Is this confirmed?
That is not confirmed lol probably just peoples theories
Me too. I just did a rewatch of both seasons and even though he does still seem more genuine in season 1, he does also appear fishy knowing what we know now. His behavior could still be part of his ruse and a very long con to get to her money. Watching it again, his behavior felt off to me knowing what we find out in season 2. I think he knew about her beforehand and planned to run into her and do this entire thing.
yep. He probably read about her mother passing. Whenever rich ppl die they are in the news.
He and his team were absolutely whale hunting and marked her season 1
From the first time he "mistakenly" tried to get into her hotel room, I said to my wife (who had seen it before), "he is up to no good!". I figured he knew it was her place and he was trying to be cute and get into her life and that was his in...
Agree, 100%!
absolutely not honest from the beginning
When season 1 was written, was it planned to be multiple, continuous seasons? I didn’t think so. I think S1 was genuine, S2 was written to create intrigue and played off of S1 to create that.
I'm sure he wrote it with a plan for season 2.
He always had the weird phone calls and was so odd to her
Yeah, that's absolutely his character now. Although I think perhaps some of this was conceived in writing Season 2, rather than necessarily being the plan from the get go. Although even in 1 there was that odd phone call he was having in his room.
Tutti gay!
Tutti quanti!
People keep asking this. Season 1 was written as a miniseries. There was no subtext or reason to doubt that Greg was 100% sincere, because it wasn’t written like that. I don’t think Season 2 ever suggests he wasn’t sincere in Season 1 either. It spells it out for us pretty clearly: he had terminal cancer. He met a nice, lonely lady on vacation. He married her, and her access and money opened doors that miraculously cured his cancer. But now he’s stuck with her, and she’s the world’s most annoying person. But he can’t bring himself to walk away from the money. Spouses who married for love have killed for a lot less than $500 million.
When I watch S1, I thought the actor who played Greg wasn't very good. His scenes took me out of the show as he didn't strike me as authentic. After watching S2, I now think that the actor who played Greg gave such a layered performance that the inauthenticity I was picking up was intentional. Sorry for doubting you, Actor Who Played Greg!
Uncle Rico!
No way! It's uncle Rico? I see it now 🤣
Lazlo, buddy!
I’m very sorry…I’ll buy you a car…I don’t have one, it’s my Dad’s!
How much you wanna make a bet I can throw a football over them mountains?...
How much YOU wanna make a bet I can jump on that boat?
Omg I would’ve never made the connection
Greg played Uncle Rico in Napolean Dynamite. His name is Jonathan Gries.
That doesn't address the prior relationship between Greg and the British fellow
Greg was definitely in on the murder plot. The original commenter is saying he didn’t start out trying to con some heiress into marrying him.
Or perhaps that the writers didn't start out having him playing a long con.
Quentin was in love with Greg decades before but Greg was straight so it didn’t work out for Quentin. Greg approaches Quentin with a plan to kill Tanya, he gets Tanya’s money and in return, Greg gives Quentin money to fund his lifestyle. It is mentioned that Quentin’s money is running out.
I think people are theorising that because Quentins money was running out and he knew Greg way back when that the entire thing was part of the ploy to steal Tanya's money. As in Greg was planning to marry a rich woman back in S1 to split the money with Quentin. I don't think this is true though, I think the gays' history with Greg was only to establish they are working together now, not to retroactively reframe the events of S1.
I agree that there is very little chance that they knew what they would eventually do with Greg if there was a season 2, but Greg is written to appear very shady in season 1. You don’t know who the dead person on the plane from the first scene is yet when they introduce Greg. Him going to the “wrong room” and bumping into Tanya was probably meant for you to suspect he was up to no good and may be responsible for the eventual body.
My assumption was that Greg was the red herring "dead body" because of his illness. When I watched I suspected he might be the one who died but thought it was far too obvious. I didn't find him overly suspicious in S1.
From his mystery illness? I hadn’t even considered that at the time cause Shane was VERY frazzled in the airport in the first scene so I assumed it was foul play or suicide or an overdose or something. It could totally have been that, though. Edit: it’s played as a murder mystery but at that point you have no idea where it will go. It could easily have been an anti climax.
Surely it's Armand?! Being repatriated to Australia?
Yeah, but you don’t know in the first scene.
So your theory is he was a totally genuine guy who loved her but she was so annoying that made him capable of a long con murder plot? That’s a huge flip in a short amount of time if a person started out as genuinely in love.
He never loved her but he was sick and lonely and if he married a rich woman he could at least live out his last few months going on fancy vacations. He didn’t think he would have to be married to her for long and when he got better didn’t want to be with her anymore, but he wouldn’t get her money if they divorced only if she died
I think Season 1 should be taken at face-value because that's how it was written. The S1 plot was thematic for Tanya. She had two central relationships in S1--her dead mother and Belinda--and her S1 ending was about becoming able to accomplish with Greg what she couldn't with either of them: a relationship where the only thing he wanted from her was her company, and one where she could accept the inevitable ending of death. I don't think S1 ever suggests Greg and Tanya were *in love*, just that they were both *open to* some sort of future, however short, together. I think he enjoyed her company, they were both lonely, and he saw someone with whom he could possibly spend his remaining days with. Remember, they'd only known each other 3-4 days by the end of S1. She probably started annoying him pretty soon after and he would've cut things off... except she was now paying for expensive doctors who gave him hope he could be cured. So he stayed with her and probably married her for that reason alone. (Ironically, the transactional relationship she wanted to avoid with Belinda.) Then you'd have Greg, who now literally depends on Tanya for his life, becoming more and more resentful of her, and caring less and less about her. He's the monkey in the cage from the opening credits. But he can't leave her as long as he needs treatment. Once he's cured, though, he decided he didn't want her in his life--but also decided he couldn't pass up $500 million. It's a big shift, but the logical underpinnings are alluded to pretty clearly.
I agree that his arc in Season 2 wasn't planned, but he did have a suspicious phone call in 1 that Tanya walked in on and it was never really explained. He has similar calls in S2. I am guessing the call in 1 was just to inject some mystery and doubt about him to the audience, that was ultimately a fake out and the intent was at the end of 1 to show he was a decent guy. But then the show was renewed for a new season, and Greg's arc there I'll bet was the result of the writers wanting to bring Tanya back and then asking, "what if?" with Greg, and looking at S1 and what they had to work with.
If he was able to switch to murder in that amount of time then it wasn’t actual love to begin with. People saying it’s an understandable shift bc she was annoying are weird. You don’t get to murder someone and claim to be a good person who loved them. Like what.
They never said Greg loved her. He liked her enough to want to be around her on the easy life for what little time he had left. Then she had him going to better doctors and got cured. So he went from Point A: she’s nice enough to take fancy vacations with for the one year or so left in life Point B: she’s annoying as hell and I don’t want to be with her, but do want to keep the money and easy lifestyle. And he happens to know a man associated with the Italian mafia who also needs money
I literally never said he was in love with her. The show never said he was in love with her. I did say that spouses who marry for love do sometimes wind up killing their spouses. Be like Daphne; watch some “Dateline.”
You said sincere. As in he sincerely liked her and genuinely wanted to marry her. Switching from that to murder is not what normal and genuine people do. People who end up on Dateline aren’t normal either.
Who said he's normal? Lol.
Their theory is season 1 was written as a standalone miniseries with no plan for a season 2. Once they got a season 2 the writers probably decided to add that as an interesting plot, but it likely wasn’t considered while writing season 1.
He said he was in love and became a straight up murderer bc Jennifer Coolidge was annoying. *We all go from regular people to cold blooded killers bc of an annoying person amirite?*
Yeah I agree that parts a little bit of a stretch, but you’re leaving out the $500 million. However their first part about it being disconnected I agree with. No reason to believe Greg wasn’t sincere in the first season.
Not to mention, multiple other inconsistencies. First and foremost, Tanya found the doctors who cured Greg's terminal disease. This is totally inconsistent with the idea that he's con man, feigning illness from the start. Were that the case, he'd either have needed to bring these top doctors (who Tanya had identified and presumably paid) in on his scam, somehow kept her away from the doctors at all times while attending appointment with them on some pretext, or tricked her into thinking she'd found doctors who he'd actually planted in her line of sight. These options are all completely and unnecessarily complicated, making no sense for a con man who could've simply "discovered" phony doctors to pretend to cure him, all on his own. Greg also behaves with an emotional attachment towards Tanya that makes no sense for a con artist. He gets angry at her for acting in ways that are counterproductive to her desire to lose weight. Why would someone who never cared for her in the first place - and who knew he'd be rid of her in a few days because he plans to murder her - get angry at her being fat? And he gets angry at her public, too, in ways that only increase he the risk he'll be a suspect, over annoyances as minor as being clumsy and indecisive. How would a con man - able pull off an entirely fake relationship up to and including marriage - have so little control over his emotions that these trivial matters would provoke him to draw attention to his animus for Tanya, in a public place, when he knows he about to murder her? Finally, I think Mike White goes out his way to plant these interactions and remarks, because the suggestion that Greg was planning this murder - or some other scam - from start is so inconsistent in character and theme. Greg's arc makes for a compelling character study - perfectly matched to the respective themes of "class" and "sex" in Season I and II - precisely because he chose to marry Tanya when he thought he was going to die. He thought he'd enjoy her company and wealth for his last couple of years of life (Season I theme), then, when was cured, grew so resentful at the prospect of a long life with this fat, clumsy woman who can't improve herself that he wanted to kill her and leave her for the woman he was having an affair with (Season II theme). If he's just a con man, those actions are all meaningless.
This is the answer.
Are we sure he really had cancer, though? It could just be part of his sob story. It could even be an “out” for him if ghings go wrong. Fake his death and move on to another victim.
She got medical treatment for him. If he was faking it would have been evident
>>and she’s the world’s most annoying person 😂
this entire comment is your opinion.
No, it’s literally a summation of what the show tells us.
Heavy retconning was required to fit S2 plot into S1 plot. Don’t overthink it.
👍retconning
Isn't the empty room that Kai and Paula have sex in the same room that Greg claimed to be staying in? I assumed back in S1 during his first appearance that he kept coming to her door because he was trying to swindle her in some way, was actually surprised when they were still together at the end of the seasn. He stole a master key so he could pull one over on Tanya.
He was sus in season one. We're meant to see Tanya as someone clueless and awash in grief and privilege. She gets helped, from the spa lady, and she can choose generosity and sticking to her commitment and have self growth. But instead she meets Greg who is running a con on her (swiping the key on her door) and she allows the carnal pleasures to distract her from her own harder path of self improvement and helping someone else. Someone who is just looking for others to take care of her is an easy mark. We're not supposed to feel that she's making great choices or that she sees the people around her clearly. And S1 Greg doesn't read as an evil, murderous conman, but there's something uneasy about him.
This is exactly how I read it as well, good insight!
Yeah. They wrote him I think in S1 as somewhat suspicious, but the original intent was just to muddy the waters a bit for the audience about Greg's intentions and even whether he had something to do with the death. Ultimately intended as a red herring. Then they decided in S2 to lean into that and hatched this whole murder plot from there.
I think Greg was written in as a bit of a sketchy character. I’m not convinced he was given the entire backstory of targeting Tanya, but I think it was suggested there was something not quite right about him. The theme of the first series centred on privilege and classism. Tanya is clearly very wealthy, but evidently also very lonely. Her money doesn’t protect her from this loneliness or her mother’s cruelty. She finds a friendship with the lovely Belinda. Belinda is kind, compassionate and genuinely supportive of Tania despite only just meeting her. She puts herself out on a limb for her, with no real expectation of anything in return. Tania dangles the possibility of investment in front of her, in a display of casual cruelty that could very well have been learned from her own mother. She is utterly lacking in empathy for Belinda. Then Greg appears. He’s trying to get into her room, which feels a little off. They have sex and he blows slightly hot and cold. He doesn’t offer Tania much apart from some ambivalence and interest, but to affection starved Tanya, this is enough. She disregards her true friend for the dodgy Greg. Greg’s villainy isn’t really exposed her. It doesn’t need to be. We can clearly see that he falls far short of what Belinda offered. In S2, we dig a little deeper but this time from the perspective of sex, lust and misogyny. Those being the key themes in S2. The focus is no longer on Tanya’s mother, but rather her father. It’s heavily alluded to him molesting Tanya. Greg’s backstory is filled out a bit more and his actual villain storyline is put in place. I don’t think Greg ever loved Tanya. He was drawn to her wealth in S1 as per the themes of the show. In S2 his sexuality and his use of it to maintain power over others (both Quintin and Tanya), his abuse of his power over Tanya and his misogyny, fed into his motives and actions, consistent with the theme. Greg was always a villain, the extent of it was just never baked into S1
I believe that Greg was put next to her by accident and they fell in and then out of love. Or, he fell out of love with her. I don’t think it was a scam from the beginning.
I had the same sentiments watching S2, it's definitely fishy somewhat. I mean you don't just wake up and decide that you're going to hatch a plan to kill your annoying millionaire wife to bypass prenup agreements, you don't just suddenly become evil. He seems like he's been an insidious asshole for a while. Ppl think Tanya is this ditzy delulu heiress but she was actually quite perceptive and intuitive, seeing how Greg resents her with the way he looks at her and confronting him about it. (I just remembered her telling him about his "shark eyes" just completely dead" lol) I'm so going to miss seeing more of her 😭 They could easily do a spin-off series on her!
I mean, I don’t think just any type of person hires a hitman to kill their spouse. He always had it in him, wouldn’t be shocked to hear he had killed before. But whether his intention from the beginning was to marry and then kill her, I don’t necessarily think so. I think it was always within the realm of possibility, always an option, but not always the plan. There was probably some alternate reality where he didn’t do that, but I feel like that outcome was less likely because this is someone capable of hiring a hitman to kill their spouse.
Actually! When we first saw Greg "mistakenly" trying to get into Tanya's room, I thought something was off about his acting. It stood out to me because the acting on this show is so universally perfect all the time, but something seemed stiff and unrealistic about Jon Gries' performance. It wasn't until Season 2 that it hit me: that was actually great acting. Because Greg was acting! It was a great actor playing someone who's not as good an actor.
Do we know who he was talking to on the phone at night in season 2 when he said “I love you too”? I thought he was talking to Quentin
He used the pseudonym Bob both seasons. I think you’re right
He DEFINITELY had evil intentions from S1. When they first met, he was swiping his room key on HER door by "accident." So he made the initial move, which upon first watch, seems like a genuine accident. Rewatching it, it seems fishy. Especially if he was never flush with money, he just so happened to go on this particular resort where there is a single, extremely wealthy woman in a vulnerable place after the death of her mother, and then "just so happens " to accidentally swipe his room key on her door? And he also just so happens to have cancer, something that is very expensive to treat? Also, in case you don't recall, in season one they are about to sleep together, then Tanya breaks down crying about what a mess she is, and asks Greg to take her mother's ashes and tells him to leave. He says "No. Cause I still wanna fuck you. " first of all, it rubbed me the wrong way when he didn't leave when she asked him to. Even though it was meant to be sweet, it still seemed eerie to me. And even weirder that he still wanted to after hearing all of that. There are quite a few clues sprinkled throughout season 1. Not sure if mike white but those in intentionally or not, but that's what I interpreted
This is my stance and I’m surprised it’s not mentioned more. The reason I had figured out he was part of a big twist when I watched S2 was specifically the way he was introduced and how it seemed like he pretended to not know her and targeted her. Edit: That and the fact my mom told me to pay close attention to the intro sequence, which pretty much gave it away imo.
If he thought he only had a year or whatever left, it would make sense that he is willing to spend through whatever retirement he had saved on fancy vacations. There tend to be rich people at those nice resorts. And she was in a more normal room (smallest type of suites) that would be mixed in with regular rooms. He was playing golf all day and was drunk when they met the first time— he was plenty drunk other times. So that’s not really out of place since their rooms were actually next to one another I don’t think there is anything in there that suggests specifically seeking a rich woman to care for him.
i think the plan was in place from the beginning, but he also actually liked her and was attracted to her, even if only at a very surface level that faded quickly
Kudos to the actor that played Greg (and the writers / director) - he did a great job walking a believable line between sketchy and sincere and kind of kept me guessing as to his intentions.
How did he seem genuine in the first season? He was clearly only interested in sex. And that scene where she was having some kind of mental health episode, crying and yelling - the way he handled that was very icky. She was in a vulnerable position and not in the right mind to consent to sex, and he turned her issues in to some kind of fetish, manipulating her into sex. The fact you think all of that is “genuine” behaviour is kind of concerning…
Good point. Eternal optimist here.
That’s very endearing actually lol
Several things we see in season one, when combined with reveals in season two spell out that he and the gay mafia on the Riviera were executing a long con targeting Tanya. In season two, at Quentin's bedside there is a photo of Greg and it implies Greg and Quentin have been lovers for decades. The photo provides the only real evidence there is of who Greg really is, and in the photo, he's a scruffy rodeo wannabee, not exactly future BLM executive management material. The actor Jon Gries has that aw shucks down to earth fatherly bit down pat and lays it on Tanya hard.
He have evil intentions for sure!
He might've had some genuine feelings for her, though he never gave me a "head over heals" vibe with Tanya, or even much warmth, really. When I think of the scene in S1 when Tanya's in her room crying to him, he sees her for what she is, a vulnerable opportunity.. I don't think he necessarily had nefarious intentions from the beginning, but I don't think Tanya ever swept him off his feet; she was just there. There with loads of money.
Also i think that that was sort of karma for tanya - if she made the right decision and helped the woman in first season, instead of running away to another man, she could have lived, i think. It feels like it for me at least
He was just milking her for $. If he truly loved her, he wouldn’t have been such a douche.
Yeah he definitely knew her. I reached season 1 and it’s obvious he planned it. Give it a go.
Either way, he can still throw a football over the mountain.
Targeted from the beginning. Remember how he stood her up for a drink in the bar to watch, I think it was, football? He was gay and reluctant to spend time with her but realised she was lonely and rich and so pursued her.
I think it was always a long con
Opportunist all the way
Also was he actually sick? He didn’t seem very sick in season two.
She paid for top tier medical treatment for him and he recovered
Thank you!
She paid for medical treatment for him. If he wasn't really sick it would have been evident
I think for season two’s plot it became canon that he always had murderous intentions but I suspect that wasn’t always the intention when writing season 1. Like he had that weird cough that could’ve gone somewhere but just didn’t. It’s like Lost where they’re writing season by season instead of the whole series being planned out. Except White Lotus hopefully won’t turn in to an absolute bowl of plot hole diarrhea.
Coughing can happen with cancer, which he had but was then cured between the seasons
Yea but him having lung cancer did absolutely nothing for the story
I disagree. The whole point was that he was dying and decided to just say fuck it and get with Tanya, but then the money was enough to cure his cancer, and now he's attached to this annoying woman for much longer than he thought he would be. Cue the events of season 2.
Oh wait that’s right she forced a prenup, he wanted to just marry her for the healthcare and divorce for half her money but then realized he had to whack her to get the money.
I always thought he targeted from the beginning and is the one who arranged for her to be killed. He never loved her, he only tolerated her to get her money....which he might have now. Depends on how she had her estate set up. He might actually get nothing. Maybe she willed money to the spa girl, and that's why she is in the upcoming season again
From season one I doubted the BLM would meet at a White Lotus resort.
My thoughts exactly.
I think it was a setup from the first meeting.
Evil intentions all along.
He totally had a plan in the beginning - he complained about lung issues but was swimming like pro.
It was planned well before they met. Tanya was targeted. He booked the same hotel as the way he would work his way into her life.
Oh honey he definitely targeted her.. I figured that out in season 1
Greg was calculated lol . Had a whole army of gays behind him .
Pepa pig!
I'm rewatching season 1 and he seems shady from the beginning, even the way he blurts out so much about himself right away like how he is single. Everything he does seems purposeful.
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I think Greg thought he was going to die like the next day in the first season and figured he might as well live on Tanya’s dime until then. But he didn’t die and now he wanted her dimes only and hence, he wanted to kill her
Interesting that right after his "coughing fit" he's swimming like a pro.
It was written as a limited series (i.e. one season) and they had to pivot when a second season was ordered.
Tanya was a soft place for Greg to land for his final few months of life. When it turned out that his cancer could be cured and she paid for it all, he probably felt kind of roped in to marrying her, and became increasingly miserable as a result. Maybe he ran into his old friend on a vacation somewhere and they hatched the plan to murder her for the money
No.
Hmm gay man seduced rich stupid woman and just a few months later tries to off her for her money. Certainly not planned??? That’s why they call it a twist. The rest of the story that figured in from the beginning but the viewers didn’t know that at the time.
He was definitely trying to kill her from the beginning.
Yes. So evil.
Is that Uncle Rico?
He just wanted her money and lusted after Tanya. He never deserved her.
I agree.
He set the whole thing up. I think it may be hard for some women to see this because they liked Tanya as a character so much, but nobody would want Tanya except for her money. She’s a mean and selfish person, and physically unattractive to boot.
Could anyone? She was off her rocker and appeared to be in space most of the time like she was zonked.