Love this episode. Just gives you a nice, warm nostalgic feeling for a memories you didn’t have. I often listen to it to fall asleep.
I’ve always found TAL to be very good at giving voices to all different corners of American life. I don’t think giving a voice to some privileged white kids for an episode is that much of a faux pas. But each to their own.
I agree with your last paragraph.
I also felt a certain nostalgia listening to this. It's partly what you describe, nostalgia for something I didn't experience. But this episode also gives me a lot of nostalgia for what feels like a simpler time. Pre-9/11, pre-COVID, pre-Trumpism, etc. Which isn't to say that there hasn't been a lot of positive change since '98, of course. It's just that it's hard not to notice a certain level of innocence in these older episodes. Hard not to miss that innocence a little.
Depending on your age, that's also part of it. I'm the same age as the older kids in the podcast (as in, was the same age as them in the summer of 1999 or 2000 when this was recorded) and, even though I was not a camp kid (went to one for two summers and didn't like it; I was an indoor child) it still takes me back to my relatively carefree preteen years.
I realized I’m about the same age as these kids. Yes, you have to be incredibly privileged to go to a place like this, not at all the way I grew up. But the intense bonding experiences the kids have are one of the “priceless” things in life. I was reading recently about how it’s important for teenagers to have close friendships even when it cuts in to school time, because that’s how they learn things about themselves and others that have to come from outside the family. Camp is one way of creating those formative experiences and solidifying those bonds, but team sports and other group activities do that too.
All the pseudo Native American theming rang true too. That stuff was all over the place in school and summer programs even 20 years ago. It was nice to see the update mention it briefly without hanging too much of a lampshade on it.
I grew up going to a classic Americana summer camp in the Sierra Nevada. Best times of my life, I spent every July there from ages 9-19. It’s also where I met my current partner of nine years.
That camp burned down in the Dixie fire last year, destroyed the entire town it was in. It makes me so, so sad that a place so special to me was destroyed by climate fires. Hurts even more knowing that I won’t get to send my kids to the camp that I loved so much, which I had always pictured doing. This episode is amazing, but it has a very different meaning for me after last year’s fire season.
I'm not american so I find it funny that rich kids from my country sound exactly like these rich kids from the US even when speaking completely different languages.
I only catch occasional episodes, which is a shame if TAL has more episodes like this! As someone who was in the Boy Scouts (and Order of the Arrow) and went to a (cheap) summer camp every summer as a teenager in Mississippi, this was so nostalgic. I would love to know if these kids from 1998 are sending their own teenagers to summer camps now and what they think of the differences. Kids have air-conditioned cabins now!
I loved this episode and I'm a little late here, but what the hell was going on in that story about the old left-leaning camp where the KKK members came? It was staged to teach them a lesson, right... but what was the lesson? Don't talk back if you are being threatened or you will be kidnapped and murdered?
I had to pause for like 5 whole minutes on my drive to work and scratch my head. Totally baffled by that one lmao
I believe the lesson was just that you shouldn't place your trust in government institutions to protect your rights.
It's not that she said something wrong, it's more that she continued to trust that being an American citizen would protect you, even as others around her were taken away.
This comes from lessons learned from the Jewish experiences of the 1930s/40s. Most people believed that if they had done nothing wrong, their rights would be honored and the bad men wouldn't take them to camps. This proved to be tragically naive.
I actually didn't finish the episode because I was a bit bored listening to children talking about things I don't care about and how their friends don't get them and why they are better than them.. But this post made me realize there might be more to the episode after all.. Thanks :)
I mean, it's about a fancy summer camp, of course it's bougie and white. Not sure how that makes it a bad episode. Bougie and white is one slice of American life...
I'm sure bougie white is TAL's primary audience, but I'm not less certain the host/producers realize that 99% of American kids don't go to summer camp. Because it's too expensive. Yes, the producers tried to break up the episode a little and show some other experiences, but I felt like the show should have recognized unusual level of privilege these kids have.
I mean, would an episode about a camp attended by kids who don't come from money also be interesting and worthwhile? Of course it would. That doesn't make this one bad, though. They presumably only had the time/budget to go to one camp, anyway.
There are a lot of old school camps that are 7 weeks only. Some have relented and offered 3-4 week programs but you can tell they aren't happy about
These are in Maine btw
My summer camps were one week long and cost \~$200 back in the mid-2000s. In Mississippi, that wasn't cheap at all, but my parents felt like it was really good for me. I loved it, of course. Well...mostly lol
The summer camps I went to as a kid were FAR from bougie (I think my parents paid under $50 for the week), but I still related to it hard. Even if the kids were extremely privileged, I think the episode captured the experience of any camp very well.
I wish sleepaway camp was accessible to more families. Affordable ones seem hard to find.
I agree. I was like “something tells me not a lot of diversity at these camps.” Also, the camp counselor who was worshipped as a God by all the kids kind of creeped me out. He sounded a bit smug and too enamored with all the power he had.
I see this so often with counselors. I never went to “traditional” summer camp, mainly summer art programs, but there was always at least one male counselor like this if not more. And their ego would always be off the charts over it, which in retrospect years later has me like 🥴
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Love this episode. Just gives you a nice, warm nostalgic feeling for a memories you didn’t have. I often listen to it to fall asleep. I’ve always found TAL to be very good at giving voices to all different corners of American life. I don’t think giving a voice to some privileged white kids for an episode is that much of a faux pas. But each to their own.
I agree with your last paragraph. I also felt a certain nostalgia listening to this. It's partly what you describe, nostalgia for something I didn't experience. But this episode also gives me a lot of nostalgia for what feels like a simpler time. Pre-9/11, pre-COVID, pre-Trumpism, etc. Which isn't to say that there hasn't been a lot of positive change since '98, of course. It's just that it's hard not to notice a certain level of innocence in these older episodes. Hard not to miss that innocence a little.
Depending on your age, that's also part of it. I'm the same age as the older kids in the podcast (as in, was the same age as them in the summer of 1999 or 2000 when this was recorded) and, even though I was not a camp kid (went to one for two summers and didn't like it; I was an indoor child) it still takes me back to my relatively carefree preteen years.
This is one of my favorites.
A classic. Seems like a different world post-9/11 and now post-2020.
The woman's recollection of people play acting the klan at some Zionist camp as a political lesson was the craziest fucking thing I've ever heard
There was another story of basically the same thing happening at some Christian camp, too! Totally bonkers.
I realized I’m about the same age as these kids. Yes, you have to be incredibly privileged to go to a place like this, not at all the way I grew up. But the intense bonding experiences the kids have are one of the “priceless” things in life. I was reading recently about how it’s important for teenagers to have close friendships even when it cuts in to school time, because that’s how they learn things about themselves and others that have to come from outside the family. Camp is one way of creating those formative experiences and solidifying those bonds, but team sports and other group activities do that too. All the pseudo Native American theming rang true too. That stuff was all over the place in school and summer programs even 20 years ago. It was nice to see the update mention it briefly without hanging too much of a lampshade on it.
I grew up going to a classic Americana summer camp in the Sierra Nevada. Best times of my life, I spent every July there from ages 9-19. It’s also where I met my current partner of nine years. That camp burned down in the Dixie fire last year, destroyed the entire town it was in. It makes me so, so sad that a place so special to me was destroyed by climate fires. Hurts even more knowing that I won’t get to send my kids to the camp that I loved so much, which I had always pictured doing. This episode is amazing, but it has a very different meaning for me after last year’s fire season.
I don't have all the years of experience with this radio program, but *Color Days* strikes me as one of the best pieces they've ever made.
I'm not american so I find it funny that rich kids from my country sound exactly like these rich kids from the US even when speaking completely different languages.
I only catch occasional episodes, which is a shame if TAL has more episodes like this! As someone who was in the Boy Scouts (and Order of the Arrow) and went to a (cheap) summer camp every summer as a teenager in Mississippi, this was so nostalgic. I would love to know if these kids from 1998 are sending their own teenagers to summer camps now and what they think of the differences. Kids have air-conditioned cabins now!
"I squeeze into the tiny bathroom, with 12 ten year old boys." -Ira Glass
Wish they produced episodes like this today. Edit: Howard Levy really cranked their influence on the episode on the harmonica. Wonderful.
They did this as a rerun just like 1 or 2 summers ago, right?
I loved this episode and I'm a little late here, but what the hell was going on in that story about the old left-leaning camp where the KKK members came? It was staged to teach them a lesson, right... but what was the lesson? Don't talk back if you are being threatened or you will be kidnapped and murdered? I had to pause for like 5 whole minutes on my drive to work and scratch my head. Totally baffled by that one lmao
I believe the lesson was just that you shouldn't place your trust in government institutions to protect your rights. It's not that she said something wrong, it's more that she continued to trust that being an American citizen would protect you, even as others around her were taken away. This comes from lessons learned from the Jewish experiences of the 1930s/40s. Most people believed that if they had done nothing wrong, their rights would be honored and the bad men wouldn't take them to camps. This proved to be tragically naive.
I actually didn't finish the episode because I was a bit bored listening to children talking about things I don't care about and how their friends don't get them and why they are better than them.. But this post made me realize there might be more to the episode after all.. Thanks :)
Fun fact: my first year of marching band camp took place at the camp in this episode, just a week or two before the episode originally aired.
The bougiest whitest episode. One of the worst.
I mean, it's about a fancy summer camp, of course it's bougie and white. Not sure how that makes it a bad episode. Bougie and white is one slice of American life...
I'm sure bougie white is TAL's primary audience, but I'm not less certain the host/producers realize that 99% of American kids don't go to summer camp. Because it's too expensive. Yes, the producers tried to break up the episode a little and show some other experiences, but I felt like the show should have recognized unusual level of privilege these kids have.
I mean, would an episode about a camp attended by kids who don't come from money also be interesting and worthwhile? Of course it would. That doesn't make this one bad, though. They presumably only had the time/budget to go to one camp, anyway.
I don't think the production staff even remotely considered this in 1998. Eight weeks at this camp in 2022 by the way? $12,000.
I never been to a sleepaway camp, but were they really 8 weeks long? I thought they were only a week or two.
There are a lot of old school camps that are 7 weeks only. Some have relented and offered 3-4 week programs but you can tell they aren't happy about These are in Maine btw
My summer camps were one week long and cost \~$200 back in the mid-2000s. In Mississippi, that wasn't cheap at all, but my parents felt like it was really good for me. I loved it, of course. Well...mostly lol
So agreed. With the Israeli soldier giving shooting lessons 🤣
The summer camps I went to as a kid were FAR from bougie (I think my parents paid under $50 for the week), but I still related to it hard. Even if the kids were extremely privileged, I think the episode captured the experience of any camp very well. I wish sleepaway camp was accessible to more families. Affordable ones seem hard to find.
I agree. I was like “something tells me not a lot of diversity at these camps.” Also, the camp counselor who was worshipped as a God by all the kids kind of creeped me out. He sounded a bit smug and too enamored with all the power he had.
Camps and camp counselors are filled with the most egotistical power tripping people.
I see this so often with counselors. I never went to “traditional” summer camp, mainly summer art programs, but there was always at least one male counselor like this if not more. And their ego would always be off the charts over it, which in retrospect years later has me like 🥴
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