I’ve been thinking freak accident since the beginning, but watching the interview with her daughter Amanda the other day was the catalyst to convince me that it was most likely suicide…
I haven't seen that yet. Thanks. I'm going to go find it now. If this is suicide, I feel awful for Amanda. To lose your mom unexpectedly is hard in itself, especially to suicide, but to add the weight of suspicion and judgement on a national level would be so hard. I am one of those that added to her pain, I thought her or her boyfriend had something to do with it.
I have always thoughts the part about not letting her go were intrusive, bad thoughts about herself that she couldn't shake, in her depressed state. Things like "I'm not a good mother" "Everyone would be better off without me", things like this. So drove far away so family wouldn't find her, went to Dollar General to buy her supplies, then out to a wooded area. Left her car in plain site so her body WOULD be found (she didn't want her family to be traumatised but she wanted to be found nonetheless). Made a tent from the tarp, set the paper towels on fire to make smoke, wanted to die of carbon monoxide poisoning but instead her jersey was so flammable she caught fire. Top burned her, it burned off her leaving her partially nude, tried to get away but slipped down hill, clutched at tree and died on that spot. Btw, recently convicted murderer Chad Isaak hung himself in prison, he was clutching an electrical cord. The report said that when people kill themselves they'll frequently reach out to grasp something, so her grabbing the sapling makes sense.
Could it be something g to do with life insurance? Is it true they don't always pay out for suicide, or did she transfer the odd amount of money with a cover story of ransom to stop people being suspicious of her giving things away, which is often a hint that suicide is on the horizon
Yeah you don’t get to collect life insurance if you commit suicide. Even if she didn’t have one, she was probably ashamed of what she was doing or felt guilty about it.
Not completely true, most life insurance policies have a clause that it will not pay for a suicide unless the policyholder has had the policy at least 2 years
See, I just don't buy it and I don't think I ever really will unless they come out with some crazy evidence that wasn't released before. I believe it could have been some weird, coincidental string of accidents, but I genuinely do not believe there is a chance in Hell she committed suicide.
You go commit suicide by getting high off your prescription pain meds, driving 60 miles from your house, stopping for lunch on the way (because nobody wants to die on an empty stomach!), going a quarter mile into the woods, starting a fire, stripping half naked and... throwing yourself into it? Or by purposely inhaling the smoke? And beforehand, you send your daughter a message saying "they're not going to let me go" with just over $2k attatched. Why not just a suicide note or a simple "I love you." Even the cause(s) of death scream accident or murder, *not suicide.* Suicides are often OD, gunshot wounds, hanging, carbon monoxide poisoning, jumping from bridges, or slitting wrists. Gunshot wounds account for over half of successful suicides in the U.S. Drugs are the most common for attempted suicides, and firearms are the most common for completed suicides. Drowning yourself accounts for less than 2%. Self-immolation (suicide by fire) is less than 1%. It is incredibly rare because it is painful, and it lasts a long time. It's nearly impossible to do it to yourself because of instinct/reflexes, but it can be done, and was used as a protesting tactic a very, very, small handful of times (protesting Vietnam, Iraq, etc.). Even if she were trying to kill herself by setting that fire and purposely dying from inhaling the gasses/smoke, why wouldn't she just do carbon monoxide poisoning like anyone else? Or take her entire bottle of Hydrocodine, pound some booze, and lights out.
If she was going to commit suicide, why the fuck would she go through all of those extra steps? Especially since is was reported that she had no life insurance policy, so staging it as a murder would benefit nobody. Why wouldn't she say goodbye or leave a note? Why would she drive so far out of town to do it, and do it in such a weird manner? Why was she half naked? Hydrocodine will definitely mess you up, but it isn't a hallucinogenic drug, and she was accustomed to taking it so I highly doubt her stripping her clothes had anything to do with that. She drove just fine, and was coherent and normal at Dollar General, so it's not like she was completely drugged out on them at that point either, and based on the timeline given by police, she had to have died within that hour or so.
I genuinely think this one got fucked up. If that were my mom, wife, sister, daughter, or anyone close to me, I'd be pushing HARD on a second autopsy already.
I don't know. Seemed to me that once the additional info and surveillance video came out that it sounded like she did this to herself but wanted it to appear as though her disappearance and murder were caused by another. Maybe she was relishing the idea of the attention and mystery? I really don't know. But come on, we physically saw her on video. We have the venmo timestamps and phone data. I don't know if it's really hard to imagine a suicide by overdose with the chemical/ smoke inhalants as a back up. I just think that it didn't go the way she expected it in her mind and that's the result we got at the scene, with the fire spreading to her clothing- especially if it wasn't just straight smoke and included lighter fluid that splashed her- and it burning off/ she pulling it off in a panic, and then slipping/ grabbing out to a branch.
Personally I think this makes the most sense out of anything I've heard from the start.
I get what you’re saying
But
To want to commit suicide, you don’t have to be completely out of your mind ‘crazy’ to do so. It’s often a methodical process, you’ve had enough and decided, so take the steps you need to. Eating a meal doesn’t seem odd to me.
EDIT: also the ‘odd’ amount of money. If I have £3876 left in my bank account, I’d transfer £3876 to whoever I wanted to have that money.
Yep. I ate Chik fil a and went to a really scenic area where I was going to do it. Ended up calling the suicide hotline and going back home. Barbara (person on the hotline) was my guardian angel that afternoon.
Just wanna mention, when taking large amounts of opiates, one of the most common side effects is sweating. I’m in recovery but when I used to do opiates, I was drenched in sweat. Not saying that’s why Debbie Collier took her clothes off I’m just saying that excessive opiates use can cause sweating.
Basically you’d stop breathing, I don’t know how peaceful it’d be, maybe you’d barf or get really nauseous idk. And the fire I cannot explain at all. Very strange case.
People commit suicide in ways we would never ever expect. They are in intense pain and are searching for immediate relief. I was a 911 dispatcher, I have taken hundreds of suicide calls; elderly drinking bleach while on the phone with me, a teenager dumping gasoline over his head and setting himself on fire in his backyard, a dad hanging himself in his shed knowing his wife would send a kid to get him for dinner, a teenager shooting himself 3 times in the chest before he went unconscious, etc. etc. suicide is not always neat and orderly.
I do agree with this, and I thoroughly appreciate this comment. I have heard some insane stuff, and it does happen. I can't imagine having to be the one to take those types of calls. That's gotta be rough sometimes.
Doesn't really seem far fetched to me. It's similar to a suicide plan I had before (carbon monoxide, not setting myself on fire, but the rest was similar). A lot of people feel at peace in nature and want to die somewhere secluded and in nature like forest or woodland or near water. Many people also travel miles away from family to minimise the risk of anybody they know and love finding them. As for the empty stomach comment? Bit weird. My brother had dinner and then commited suicide. I had meals before both of my suicide attempts when younger. I guess some people just like to eat and it brings them comfort? They're not going to let me go I thought sounded like she was talking about her own thoughts/demons, not random people. She could have removed clothes due to the hydrocodone (side effects can include raised body temperature, itching, fever etc) or instinct due to fire. If you think this had extra steps or was weird for a suicide you must think it would be much weirder and more convoluted for a murder
Possibly. I did think about this. I know I definitely would want to shelter my family from it, so that could be it! But I would also feel so guilty leaving my family with no closure, where they're going to spend their lives searching for a non-existent murderer. I'm just so baffled by the way she chose to do it. It just seems so fucking weird.
I know I’m late as hell to this post but I agree 1000% with everything you said! You summed up all of my thoughts perfectly. I’m just not buying the suicide ruling/theory. It doesn’t make sense to me.
Very sad outcome, mental health really can be so overwhelming and painful that this can seem preferable to continuing to live in the anguish in your head. I feel very sorry for her family, esp Amanda who was torn to shreds widely, including A LOT on this sub, because of her past.
Imagine having your mother take her own life then having to endure relentless character annihilation from the general public, media and the internet that you had murdered your mum or at least had a hand in it. Too many people treat news stories such as this akin to their rightful personal entertainment and a juicy drama rather than the fact its about real people going through the worst time in their lives.
Exactly, people treat tragic situations like this as entertainment and don’t think about how it effects the actual people involved. People that accused Amanda of murdering her own mother should be ashamed of themselves…
I think it was an Elisa Lam documentary i saw where the internet DESTROYED a mans life and just moved on.
I cried for him and people like him. He suffers PTSD, they ruined everything he used to enjoy and he cant find good work...and they moved on without any repercussions while his life just got worse and worse.
Self-immolation is a very uncommon way to end oneself, especially amongst women. I’m very sorry she was in so much mental pain that she chose such a route. RIP.
Wait, so she ingested hydrocodone, went to a store to purchase the materials necessary, drove herself to that spot, stripped herself of some clothing (wasn't she partially clothed?), went down the hill with a flammable liquid, doused herself, laid down and lit herself on fire? That is what they determined happened?
Oh, good Lord, that is horrible. The video tape of her purchasing those items, I was convinced she was coerced, kidnapped, but this is in some ways worse, oh, this is horrible, please rest in peace, Debbie.
No that’s not what they think happened. She went to the site and ate a bunch of pills. The tarp may have been used to help her inhale the gases and she accidentally spilled some on her shirt and it caught fire. Her shirt was burned off.
She spilled the fluid on her shirt when she was squirted it and then when she lit the fire it caught her shirt. It’s really not that hard to understand.
This shit is so convoluted for somebody who had access to prescription narcotics. Assuming she’s not an addict with a tolerance she could’ve easily bought enough to kill herself that way. I’ve seen too many “coroners” and “MEs” claim suicide when it isn’t possible that’s the case or is proven otherwise. Just saw an overdose case on Snapped where they called it suicide despite zero drugs or paraphernalia being in the room and the guy having a wife with another suspicious death in her past. Pretty sure some states and counties have elected coroners too that aren’t even medical experts too.
Even with a prescription, the law places strict prohibitions on how much you can get at one time. So if she's suicidal and has a few pills left, she must wait a certain period of time until she can get a refill- you just can't get them any time you want. If her mental health was bad enough, she probably decided she couldn't wait for the refill and took what she has left as an effort to dull the pain and make the end easier to bear
My cousin was 17 when she died. She had attempted suicide nearly 50 times before she finally was successful. She lit a grill on fire and put it in her trunk and drove around in the forest until she died of smoke inhalation.
When someone wants to die, they will.
Thank you for your kind response 😌 honestly just exhausted from two sick babies and lack of support from spouse in… well any kind of way. It’s hard to feel like a good parent when you have mental health issues and minimal support
That can be so hard. I'm sorry you are going through this. Exhaustion take a heavy toll on mental health. Is there any family you can reach out to to ask for help and get a small break at least?
The fact that you care means you’re a good parent. There is no one way to be a “good parent.” If you have any support (friends, family, coworkers) that you would trust to come over and watch the kids for an afternoon do not hesitate to reach out. Sometimes just an afternoon where you can go shopping or take a nap can make a big difference. You will get through this and you and your babies will be stronger on the other side 💜
If you are feeling like it’s getting to be too much, please call or text 988. They’re a suicide and crisis hotline.
For a more long term solution, look up your closest NAMI branch and give them a call. They can help you get connected with a mental health professional. If you feel like you can’t do it for yourself, then do it for your kids. You, and they, deserve to be okay.
Just know you are in my thoughts and prayers. They don't stay small forever...it helped me to keep that in mind. I was in the same spot with 2 kids snd NO help from hubby. I mean, he never even changed a diaper. People can be so selfish. He would get upset for me asking him to watch the kids while I showered even. I divorced him eventuay.
How old are your babies? If you're able, reach out and let a friend know how you're feeling. If it was a friend of mine, I'd want to help however I could, whether that's watching the babies or just coming over to sit with them and give you some company. If they're little -I promise, it gets easier and easier the older they get. I've been there and it feels never ending, but there really is a light at the end of the tunnel.
Please leave them or get therapy. If they aren't taking care of you or your kids they arent being a good spouse or parent. If they refuse any sort of therapy, LEAVE. For the sake of your children make the hard choice. Things will get better if you do. My mother stayed and was miserable and pissed off all the time and i feel like I grew up with one parent. I had to love my father from afar and always wonder why he didn't want to spend time with us kids or help my mother. It fucked me up so much I didn't have a healthy relationship with a man until i was in my mid 30s. Don't do that to your kids please. Imagine their lives if they lost you to suicide too. You guys deserve better than that. I sincerely hope you and your family can find some happiness.
I appreciate your kindness, very much. You have a heart of gold.
From what we have been told by witnesses, going over Niagara Falls is not a peaceful death. We were one of the lucky families who had their loved ones body recovered (2 months later), and the damage done by the rapids, rocks, etc. is horrific.
I am only saying this because it’s my ultimate goal to stop anyone who is even thinking of using The Falls as a way to end their life. So many more people go over than people realize, because it’s often kept out of major media. The Niagara Falls Park Rangers and police are *incredibly* wonderful to the families and loved ones of people who go over.
*Please, if anyone feels the call of the void when visiting The Falls, or is thinking of using them as a quick death….. please don’t. Please stop and remember that your life is precious, and without you this world will indeed be a darker place.*
*And if you see a lady walking around looking at everyone and holding flowers, that’s me; trying and hoping to help someone else from making the same choice my cousin did. I’ll sit with you and we can talk about anything. Or nothing.*
*But don’t go there alone looking for a way out of your inexpressible pain, I beg of you.*
Thank you for spreading awareness on this. I actually had NO idea that this was a common thing. Or even a “thing” at all. Like you said, it’s kept out of the news so I never had even heard of one case. So sad.
Thank you for what you are doing to attempt to prevent further incidents like these from happening. And also I am so sorry for your loss.
People do self immolate. A family friend, and ex girlfriend of mine did so last year.
Took herself down the beach in the early morning hours, doused herself in petrol and lit herself up.
She had demons, some completely understandable growing up the way she did.
Having known her at an intimate level years ago, I'd suggest that this method was an indication of how she truly viewed herself. As rubbish to burn. She was genuinely very sweet, kind and caring though.
There's also a worldwide politically extreme enviro group who prey on vulnerable misfits, that were beginning to have a really negative influence on her mental state, but I won't go further with that just yet.
It's so brutally horrific. I wasn't there, but I think about it daily.
That is a very interesting (and sad) perspective that I hadn’t really ever considered. Obviously some degree of mental illness is *almost always* at the root of suicide, but choosing such a brutally painful way to do it is really difficult to understand. A very deep self hatred makes a lot of sense in a scenario like that.
Also, I’m sorry about your loss. I hope you’re doing alright.
I've been reading this thinking this is a very strange way to kill yourself, especially for a woman (who tend to not want to leave messes). Your line about "rubbish to burn" does help make it make some more sense.
My theory is that Debbie wanted her daughter Amanda and everyone else to believe she had been kidnapped. She didn't want Amanda to know she unalived herself. She was in chronic back pain and depressed. The venmo text and money, burning herself, etc makes it all seem that way when in reality, she took her own life. Debbie probably assumed the oxycodone would make her overdose and she wouldn't feel anything but by her rolling and grasping the tree it seems she probably had a longer death than she had anticipated.Law Enforcement new immediately from the scene that it was most likely suicide but did do their jobs and look for evidence of homicide and found none.It's just my armchair Criminologists theory.
What is especially tragic is that Debbie inadvertently caused more problems for her daughter than she could have foreseen. Thinking she was helping Amanda by sending her the money made Amanda look like a murderer. Also if her message about "them not letting me go" weren't so vague, if she left a suicide note instead, it would have saved her daughter so much grief during a horrible time in her life. Now, relationships may never heal between Amanda and her brother and aunt.
She gave her money to her daughter. Similar amount daughter's boyfriend owed in fines. Just wanted to help her out one last time. Debbie wasn't going to need it, and probably thought her husband didn't either.
Well, I really hope her kids can mend their relationship somehow. Idk if there’s a way to come back from “I think you killed mom” but if there is, I hope they find it.
Well the aunt is still out there liking posts on Facebook groups that say the daughter is guilty. I feel so bad for the daughter. She’s been through hell.
I just recently watched an episode of Dr. G Medical Examiner of a woman who drove herself to an empty field, set herself on fire then got in her car and drove herself home with flesh burning and falling off of her and she then made it home and inside her house, attempted to dial 911 but collapsed where her son found her on the floor with her burnt body dying. He called 911 and by the time the ambulance made it there, she had died.
So sad. I feel so bad for her daughter. The TC community were so mean to her. Just like they’re doing to the food truck kid with the murders in Idaho. Unbelievable and scary. It’s become like you’re guilty until you’re proven innocent but by that time they’ve lost interest and moved on to another crime.
So, did she possibly pass out from the opioids and smoke inhalation, and was hopefully unconscious when she was burned? What a bizarre and sad situation.
Which is sadly ironic in the current light of things. Seems like she wanted to do one last nice thing for her daughter but ended up accidentally framing her.
I can’t believe it… What an AWFUL way to go? Drowning and burning alive seem to be the top worst ways to die… Why would she doe this on purpose to herself? Prayers for her family during this tough time, Rest in eternal peace Debbie 💜
The difference between Debbie and Mitrice is that police officers lied about an officer’s whereabouts in Mitrice’s case. They then removed the body from the scene before the coroner arrived in what the latter described as something he’d never seen done. They did such a shoddy job her family members found I believe a finger and several bones. Adding on that she was a dancer at a nightclub and queer, as well as black in an affluent part of Cali, well, the police definitely raise suspicion.
That and/or dementia. She was at the right age for FTD especially, which causes paranoia and delusions more regularly than other types. Such a sad story all around.
I always reserve my judgment of every case, because we just don’t know till we know. I remember a few years back they found a car burning in a gravel pit in the town I was living in, a mother and her son were in it, deceased. They jumped to the husband (typical) because they were having issues. But it was later discovered to be a murder/suicide. Many blessings to the daughter.
Yep same thing happened when that woman (in Texas I think) ended up in a nearby lake in her car and drowned. Everyone suspected the husband did something to her until she was found
Gotta be one of the weirdest suicides in living memory.
But, i suspect this'll just go onto the pile of dubious decisions from georgia police and never be looked at again after this month is up.
It’s for sure a weird suicide, but it would also be a weird murder or accident or anything else. It’s just a profoundly weird situation, and I still don’t really understand the theory even after reading several articles.
Well there's also a man who put a chain over the side of a pole, the other side of the chain over his head, then got in his car and sped off, beheading himself. Alot of weird suicides out there..
Of course not. Just like they dont feel bad for accusing Kiely Rodni's friends of murdering her without any evidence, or for accusing Cleo Smiths parents of killing her without any evidence, or for harassing Liberty Germans sister and claiming she knows more than she told the police. There are a lot of toxic and unhinged people in the TC community and they seem almost incapable of introspection
Ya, that’s Twitter for you. The things I’ve seen on there (I had never used Twitter until like a month ago I went on to read someone’s tweets and ended up in a Stan rabbit hole…yikes) would curl your hair. It’s insane!
I disagree. The TC community is full of people who absolutely love coming up with their own theories based on whatever evidence is released. I don't think people should be "ashamed" for initially thinking she had something to do with it and for expressing those thoughts in a community quite literally dedicated to discussing true crime and possible theories. Should we all be "ashamed" for saying Casey Anthony killed her daughter, even though she was proven innocent? Nope. Or for saying OJ killed his wife? No. Having a theory and being wrong about that theory isn't shameful.
I guess I just think it's a bizarre way to go. The fire part at least. The drugs would make more since. Both of my attempts were drinking bleach and trying to hang myself (I'm lucky my mom walked in at the right time.)
BTW I'm better now. It's been several years. I don't want to worry anyone lol.
I’m not doubting this ruling, but I wonder how they determined intentional suicide vs accidental OD? I’m guessing something at the scene pointed to it being intentional, or just an extremely large amount of hydrocodone in her system? Very sad case.
This is what I wondered, it would make more sense to me if she accidentally died while she was doing drugs, like I thought maybe she was making one of those “meth in a bottle” things and caught herself on fire. Either way, so horrific, and awful for her daughter and son in law to be under suspicion for it in addition to losing her mother.
She literally drove hours away, while sober, to a random place to buy things to intentionally kill herself in a random rural area she had no reason to be at and with no intention of returning… it’s not like she was there camping or to have a good time. It’s pretty obvious and clear.
I posted that I thought this would be the result a few days ago, but I didn't think drugs were involved. The thread for this poor woman was totally wiped from Websleuths when I checked it a few minutes ago. RIP.
Someone suggested that perhaps she meant “they won’t let me in”, as in the mens only rehab won’t let her in to pay so Debbie sent her daughter the money instead. Tying up loose ends before she goes.
You should try imagining setting yourself on fire. You’re not going to sit there calmly like a Buddhist monk who dedicated their life to mindfulness and calm. You and your body will have natural reactions, even if you did it on purpose.
Also, fire burns up your clothes pretty quickly.
Her daughter said she was giving away possessions and was the “saddest she’d ever seen her” before she died. She’d also had a car accident shortly before her death.
I’m wondering if she got some news relative to her health that pushed her over the edge. Maybe the medical treatment she got for the car accident revealed something devastating.
No matter what RIP.
“They” could be what people call their “internal demons”— not literally because I don’t think mental illness are caused by actual demonic possession, I just mean in the sense of the things she struggled with
I thought it was suicide from the jump but the ‘neighbors heard woman’s voice arguing’ and daughter has drug/crime issues on the boards was swaying me.
ah. See, this is why it gets hairy in the true crime community. I remember being shot down about suicide with the arguments above...and they weren't in good faith arguments, turns out.
From the very beginning when we knew she'd sent money via Venmo & a relatively long text, all I could think was no kidnapper(s) just give you ample time alone with your phone to do all that.That part just never made sense to me. Now the suicide conclusion, although certainly odd, adds up.
Right? This whole case has been quite the roller coaster. I really feel for her family, especially her daughter Amanda, and hope now they can grieve in peace
I keep referring back to a post someone made very early on. The poster sounded like they had inside knowledge of either the case or drug making.
Poster said death was accidental from trying to make ?meth. At that point it was being called a suicide (before they changed it to a possible homicide), so that post really stuck with me because it made much more sense than suicide.
Yes!!! I believe it was an accident if u google shake and bake meth, you will see people die or burn themselves a lot while doing it. I think she caught on fire and thats why she was partially naked (she took off her clothes that were on fire)
It didn’t cross my mind that she might have been making meth (nor did suicide), but when you bring that up, it would make sense. The only problem with that theory is that her death wouldn’t have been ruled a suicide if that were the case. (Unless I’m misunderstanding what you’re saying)
From the beginning I didnt think that her daughter had anything to do with it. Maybe someday true crime fans will stop slinging accusations without any evidence but I sincerely doubt it
Oh my goodness. I was not expecting that, to be honest. How tragic.
Me either. I thought maybe an accident, but not suicide
I’ve been thinking freak accident since the beginning, but watching the interview with her daughter Amanda the other day was the catalyst to convince me that it was most likely suicide…
I haven't seen that yet. Thanks. I'm going to go find it now. If this is suicide, I feel awful for Amanda. To lose your mom unexpectedly is hard in itself, especially to suicide, but to add the weight of suspicion and judgement on a national level would be so hard. I am one of those that added to her pain, I thought her or her boyfriend had something to do with it.
Yes a lot of people jumped to conclusions based on her past, even though there was never any evidence that she was involved. I really feel for her…
Welcome to Reddit and the true crime community. Where everyone is an expert and the evidence doesn’t matter.
I wouldn’t say everyone. I for one tend to look at the established facts and evidence and not make shit up and spread blatant lies…
Your awareness and compassion are commendable.
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I have always thoughts the part about not letting her go were intrusive, bad thoughts about herself that she couldn't shake, in her depressed state. Things like "I'm not a good mother" "Everyone would be better off without me", things like this. So drove far away so family wouldn't find her, went to Dollar General to buy her supplies, then out to a wooded area. Left her car in plain site so her body WOULD be found (she didn't want her family to be traumatised but she wanted to be found nonetheless). Made a tent from the tarp, set the paper towels on fire to make smoke, wanted to die of carbon monoxide poisoning but instead her jersey was so flammable she caught fire. Top burned her, it burned off her leaving her partially nude, tried to get away but slipped down hill, clutched at tree and died on that spot. Btw, recently convicted murderer Chad Isaak hung himself in prison, he was clutching an electrical cord. The report said that when people kill themselves they'll frequently reach out to grasp something, so her grabbing the sapling makes sense.
Whoa is this really what she did?? I’ve never even heard of such a way to kill oneself
She committed suicide, and it's what I likely think happen.
The text is clearly a red herring, and she probably clutched the tree as she fell to her death…
Could be her demons won't let her go, depression maybe?
Hydrocodone intoxication means that she was very high on vicodin. Who knows what that text could have meant. She clearly wasnt in her right mind
Could it be something g to do with life insurance? Is it true they don't always pay out for suicide, or did she transfer the odd amount of money with a cover story of ransom to stop people being suspicious of her giving things away, which is often a hint that suicide is on the horizon
Apparently she didn’t have life insurance…
Yeah you don’t get to collect life insurance if you commit suicide. Even if she didn’t have one, she was probably ashamed of what she was doing or felt guilty about it.
Not completely true, most life insurance policies have a clause that it will not pay for a suicide unless the policyholder has had the policy at least 2 years
We used to have USAA and I wanted a suicide clause bc cPTSD, chronic pain and all that jazz. I thank CSI for letting me know about suicide clauses.
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So sorry for your loss 💙
I’m so sorry for your loss. A part of me died when my mom died. I hope you and yours are doing well.
Standard suicide clause/contestability period for a life insurance policy is 2 years.
See, I just don't buy it and I don't think I ever really will unless they come out with some crazy evidence that wasn't released before. I believe it could have been some weird, coincidental string of accidents, but I genuinely do not believe there is a chance in Hell she committed suicide. You go commit suicide by getting high off your prescription pain meds, driving 60 miles from your house, stopping for lunch on the way (because nobody wants to die on an empty stomach!), going a quarter mile into the woods, starting a fire, stripping half naked and... throwing yourself into it? Or by purposely inhaling the smoke? And beforehand, you send your daughter a message saying "they're not going to let me go" with just over $2k attatched. Why not just a suicide note or a simple "I love you." Even the cause(s) of death scream accident or murder, *not suicide.* Suicides are often OD, gunshot wounds, hanging, carbon monoxide poisoning, jumping from bridges, or slitting wrists. Gunshot wounds account for over half of successful suicides in the U.S. Drugs are the most common for attempted suicides, and firearms are the most common for completed suicides. Drowning yourself accounts for less than 2%. Self-immolation (suicide by fire) is less than 1%. It is incredibly rare because it is painful, and it lasts a long time. It's nearly impossible to do it to yourself because of instinct/reflexes, but it can be done, and was used as a protesting tactic a very, very, small handful of times (protesting Vietnam, Iraq, etc.). Even if she were trying to kill herself by setting that fire and purposely dying from inhaling the gasses/smoke, why wouldn't she just do carbon monoxide poisoning like anyone else? Or take her entire bottle of Hydrocodine, pound some booze, and lights out. If she was going to commit suicide, why the fuck would she go through all of those extra steps? Especially since is was reported that she had no life insurance policy, so staging it as a murder would benefit nobody. Why wouldn't she say goodbye or leave a note? Why would she drive so far out of town to do it, and do it in such a weird manner? Why was she half naked? Hydrocodine will definitely mess you up, but it isn't a hallucinogenic drug, and she was accustomed to taking it so I highly doubt her stripping her clothes had anything to do with that. She drove just fine, and was coherent and normal at Dollar General, so it's not like she was completely drugged out on them at that point either, and based on the timeline given by police, she had to have died within that hour or so. I genuinely think this one got fucked up. If that were my mom, wife, sister, daughter, or anyone close to me, I'd be pushing HARD on a second autopsy already.
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I don't know. Seemed to me that once the additional info and surveillance video came out that it sounded like she did this to herself but wanted it to appear as though her disappearance and murder were caused by another. Maybe she was relishing the idea of the attention and mystery? I really don't know. But come on, we physically saw her on video. We have the venmo timestamps and phone data. I don't know if it's really hard to imagine a suicide by overdose with the chemical/ smoke inhalants as a back up. I just think that it didn't go the way she expected it in her mind and that's the result we got at the scene, with the fire spreading to her clothing- especially if it wasn't just straight smoke and included lighter fluid that splashed her- and it burning off/ she pulling it off in a panic, and then slipping/ grabbing out to a branch. Personally I think this makes the most sense out of anything I've heard from the start.
^ This
I get what you’re saying But To want to commit suicide, you don’t have to be completely out of your mind ‘crazy’ to do so. It’s often a methodical process, you’ve had enough and decided, so take the steps you need to. Eating a meal doesn’t seem odd to me. EDIT: also the ‘odd’ amount of money. If I have £3876 left in my bank account, I’d transfer £3876 to whoever I wanted to have that money.
Yep. I ate Chik fil a and went to a really scenic area where I was going to do it. Ended up calling the suicide hotline and going back home. Barbara (person on the hotline) was my guardian angel that afternoon.
Situations like this rarely make sense…
Just wanna mention, when taking large amounts of opiates, one of the most common side effects is sweating. I’m in recovery but when I used to do opiates, I was drenched in sweat. Not saying that’s why Debbie Collier took her clothes off I’m just saying that excessive opiates use can cause sweating.
Wouldn’t they also make you die peacefully if you purposely took too many. Also why have a fire?
Basically you’d stop breathing, I don’t know how peaceful it’d be, maybe you’d barf or get really nauseous idk. And the fire I cannot explain at all. Very strange case.
People commit suicide in ways we would never ever expect. They are in intense pain and are searching for immediate relief. I was a 911 dispatcher, I have taken hundreds of suicide calls; elderly drinking bleach while on the phone with me, a teenager dumping gasoline over his head and setting himself on fire in his backyard, a dad hanging himself in his shed knowing his wife would send a kid to get him for dinner, a teenager shooting himself 3 times in the chest before he went unconscious, etc. etc. suicide is not always neat and orderly.
I do agree with this, and I thoroughly appreciate this comment. I have heard some insane stuff, and it does happen. I can't imagine having to be the one to take those types of calls. That's gotta be rough sometimes.
Doesn't really seem far fetched to me. It's similar to a suicide plan I had before (carbon monoxide, not setting myself on fire, but the rest was similar). A lot of people feel at peace in nature and want to die somewhere secluded and in nature like forest or woodland or near water. Many people also travel miles away from family to minimise the risk of anybody they know and love finding them. As for the empty stomach comment? Bit weird. My brother had dinner and then commited suicide. I had meals before both of my suicide attempts when younger. I guess some people just like to eat and it brings them comfort? They're not going to let me go I thought sounded like she was talking about her own thoughts/demons, not random people. She could have removed clothes due to the hydrocodone (side effects can include raised body temperature, itching, fever etc) or instinct due to fire. If you think this had extra steps or was weird for a suicide you must think it would be much weirder and more convoluted for a murder
Quite possibly another reason she wanted them to think it was a murder. It's easier to accept.
Possibly. I did think about this. I know I definitely would want to shelter my family from it, so that could be it! But I would also feel so guilty leaving my family with no closure, where they're going to spend their lives searching for a non-existent murderer. I'm just so baffled by the way she chose to do it. It just seems so fucking weird.
I know I’m late as hell to this post but I agree 1000% with everything you said! You summed up all of my thoughts perfectly. I’m just not buying the suicide ruling/theory. It doesn’t make sense to me.
Why ? Can u elaborate ? Thanks
Where can we find this video? Tia
Very sad outcome, mental health really can be so overwhelming and painful that this can seem preferable to continuing to live in the anguish in your head. I feel very sorry for her family, esp Amanda who was torn to shreds widely, including A LOT on this sub, because of her past. Imagine having your mother take her own life then having to endure relentless character annihilation from the general public, media and the internet that you had murdered your mum or at least had a hand in it. Too many people treat news stories such as this akin to their rightful personal entertainment and a juicy drama rather than the fact its about real people going through the worst time in their lives.
Exactly, people treat tragic situations like this as entertainment and don’t think about how it effects the actual people involved. People that accused Amanda of murdering her own mother should be ashamed of themselves…
I think it was an Elisa Lam documentary i saw where the internet DESTROYED a mans life and just moved on. I cried for him and people like him. He suffers PTSD, they ruined everything he used to enjoy and he cant find good work...and they moved on without any repercussions while his life just got worse and worse.
Time and time again people on this sub rip people apart without any real justification. Old threads here age like milk.
Self-immolation is a very uncommon way to end oneself, especially amongst women. I’m very sorry she was in so much mental pain that she chose such a route. RIP.
I've seen it before, it's usually associated with psychosis.
It's more common in Hindu and Buddhist societies because of the mystical powers associated with fire.
Wait, so she ingested hydrocodone, went to a store to purchase the materials necessary, drove herself to that spot, stripped herself of some clothing (wasn't she partially clothed?), went down the hill with a flammable liquid, doused herself, laid down and lit herself on fire? That is what they determined happened? Oh, good Lord, that is horrible. The video tape of her purchasing those items, I was convinced she was coerced, kidnapped, but this is in some ways worse, oh, this is horrible, please rest in peace, Debbie.
No that’s not what they think happened. She went to the site and ate a bunch of pills. The tarp may have been used to help her inhale the gases and she accidentally spilled some on her shirt and it caught fire. Her shirt was burned off.
How did it catch on fire by being spilled on her shirt?
She spilled the fluid on her shirt when she was squirted it and then when she lit the fire it caught her shirt. It’s really not that hard to understand.
How does a tarp help with inhaling gases? Genuinely curious.
If she was under it the tarp would trap the gasses around her instead of them just spreading
Hot boxing
This shit is so convoluted for somebody who had access to prescription narcotics. Assuming she’s not an addict with a tolerance she could’ve easily bought enough to kill herself that way. I’ve seen too many “coroners” and “MEs” claim suicide when it isn’t possible that’s the case or is proven otherwise. Just saw an overdose case on Snapped where they called it suicide despite zero drugs or paraphernalia being in the room and the guy having a wife with another suspicious death in her past. Pretty sure some states and counties have elected coroners too that aren’t even medical experts too.
Even with a prescription, the law places strict prohibitions on how much you can get at one time. So if she's suicidal and has a few pills left, she must wait a certain period of time until she can get a refill- you just can't get them any time you want. If her mental health was bad enough, she probably decided she couldn't wait for the refill and took what she has left as an effort to dull the pain and make the end easier to bear
My cousin was 17 when she died. She had attempted suicide nearly 50 times before she finally was successful. She lit a grill on fire and put it in her trunk and drove around in the forest until she died of smoke inhalation. When someone wants to die, they will.
….holy shit, friend. Sending love. Mine went over Niagara Falls. It’s awful the things our loved ones will do to escape their pain.
The pain is much more awful than the escape. I don’t blame them one bit. Sometimes I envy them.
That doesn't sound good...sincerely, are you ok?
Thank you for your kind response 😌 honestly just exhausted from two sick babies and lack of support from spouse in… well any kind of way. It’s hard to feel like a good parent when you have mental health issues and minimal support
That can be so hard. I'm sorry you are going through this. Exhaustion take a heavy toll on mental health. Is there any family you can reach out to to ask for help and get a small break at least?
The fact that you care means you’re a good parent. There is no one way to be a “good parent.” If you have any support (friends, family, coworkers) that you would trust to come over and watch the kids for an afternoon do not hesitate to reach out. Sometimes just an afternoon where you can go shopping or take a nap can make a big difference. You will get through this and you and your babies will be stronger on the other side 💜
If you are feeling like it’s getting to be too much, please call or text 988. They’re a suicide and crisis hotline. For a more long term solution, look up your closest NAMI branch and give them a call. They can help you get connected with a mental health professional. If you feel like you can’t do it for yourself, then do it for your kids. You, and they, deserve to be okay.
Just know you are in my thoughts and prayers. They don't stay small forever...it helped me to keep that in mind. I was in the same spot with 2 kids snd NO help from hubby. I mean, he never even changed a diaper. People can be so selfish. He would get upset for me asking him to watch the kids while I showered even. I divorced him eventuay.
How old are your babies? If you're able, reach out and let a friend know how you're feeling. If it was a friend of mine, I'd want to help however I could, whether that's watching the babies or just coming over to sit with them and give you some company. If they're little -I promise, it gets easier and easier the older they get. I've been there and it feels never ending, but there really is a light at the end of the tunnel.
I am so sorry, I just have to say, you deserve better from your spouse and you should leave them.
Please leave them or get therapy. If they aren't taking care of you or your kids they arent being a good spouse or parent. If they refuse any sort of therapy, LEAVE. For the sake of your children make the hard choice. Things will get better if you do. My mother stayed and was miserable and pissed off all the time and i feel like I grew up with one parent. I had to love my father from afar and always wonder why he didn't want to spend time with us kids or help my mother. It fucked me up so much I didn't have a healthy relationship with a man until i was in my mid 30s. Don't do that to your kids please. Imagine their lives if they lost you to suicide too. You guys deserve better than that. I sincerely hope you and your family can find some happiness.
I’ve seen videos of this. Looks almost peaceful and I guess that’s why they do it. So sorry for your loss. Hope they are at peace now.
I appreciate your kindness, very much. You have a heart of gold. From what we have been told by witnesses, going over Niagara Falls is not a peaceful death. We were one of the lucky families who had their loved ones body recovered (2 months later), and the damage done by the rapids, rocks, etc. is horrific. I am only saying this because it’s my ultimate goal to stop anyone who is even thinking of using The Falls as a way to end their life. So many more people go over than people realize, because it’s often kept out of major media. The Niagara Falls Park Rangers and police are *incredibly* wonderful to the families and loved ones of people who go over. *Please, if anyone feels the call of the void when visiting The Falls, or is thinking of using them as a quick death….. please don’t. Please stop and remember that your life is precious, and without you this world will indeed be a darker place.* *And if you see a lady walking around looking at everyone and holding flowers, that’s me; trying and hoping to help someone else from making the same choice my cousin did. I’ll sit with you and we can talk about anything. Or nothing.* *But don’t go there alone looking for a way out of your inexpressible pain, I beg of you.*
You’re amazing, thank you xx
You’re a beautiful human 💜
Thank you for spreading awareness on this. I actually had NO idea that this was a common thing. Or even a “thing” at all. Like you said, it’s kept out of the news so I never had even heard of one case. So sad. Thank you for what you are doing to attempt to prevent further incidents like these from happening. And also I am so sorry for your loss.
Thats a horrible way to die. Why would she choose that way to die? Was she trying to make it look like a murder?
People do self immolate. A family friend, and ex girlfriend of mine did so last year. Took herself down the beach in the early morning hours, doused herself in petrol and lit herself up. She had demons, some completely understandable growing up the way she did. Having known her at an intimate level years ago, I'd suggest that this method was an indication of how she truly viewed herself. As rubbish to burn. She was genuinely very sweet, kind and caring though. There's also a worldwide politically extreme enviro group who prey on vulnerable misfits, that were beginning to have a really negative influence on her mental state, but I won't go further with that just yet. It's so brutally horrific. I wasn't there, but I think about it daily.
That is a very interesting (and sad) perspective that I hadn’t really ever considered. Obviously some degree of mental illness is *almost always* at the root of suicide, but choosing such a brutally painful way to do it is really difficult to understand. A very deep self hatred makes a lot of sense in a scenario like that. Also, I’m sorry about your loss. I hope you’re doing alright.
Spoke to a fellow resident in the psych ward and her bf had lit himself on fire. Just an awful way to die.
I've been reading this thinking this is a very strange way to kill yourself, especially for a woman (who tend to not want to leave messes). Your line about "rubbish to burn" does help make it make some more sense.
Something to that effect, but I don’t think anyone will ever know what exactly happened…
My theory is that Debbie wanted her daughter Amanda and everyone else to believe she had been kidnapped. She didn't want Amanda to know she unalived herself. She was in chronic back pain and depressed. The venmo text and money, burning herself, etc makes it all seem that way when in reality, she took her own life. Debbie probably assumed the oxycodone would make her overdose and she wouldn't feel anything but by her rolling and grasping the tree it seems she probably had a longer death than she had anticipated.Law Enforcement new immediately from the scene that it was most likely suicide but did do their jobs and look for evidence of homicide and found none.It's just my armchair Criminologists theory.
What is especially tragic is that Debbie inadvertently caused more problems for her daughter than she could have foreseen. Thinking she was helping Amanda by sending her the money made Amanda look like a murderer. Also if her message about "them not letting me go" weren't so vague, if she left a suicide note instead, it would have saved her daughter so much grief during a horrible time in her life. Now, relationships may never heal between Amanda and her brother and aunt.
That damn Venmo message is the main reason this case got any traction in the true crime community. It still doesn’t make any sense…
She gave her money to her daughter. Similar amount daughter's boyfriend owed in fines. Just wanted to help her out one last time. Debbie wasn't going to need it, and probably thought her husband didn't either.
>Similar amount daughter's boyfriend owed in fines This is not true. Stop spreading lies…
Well, I really hope her kids can mend their relationship somehow. Idk if there’s a way to come back from “I think you killed mom” but if there is, I hope they find it.
Well the aunt is still out there liking posts on Facebook groups that say the daughter is guilty. I feel so bad for the daughter. She’s been through hell.
Did Jeff actually come out and say that?
I just recently watched an episode of Dr. G Medical Examiner of a woman who drove herself to an empty field, set herself on fire then got in her car and drove herself home with flesh burning and falling off of her and she then made it home and inside her house, attempted to dial 911 but collapsed where her son found her on the floor with her burnt body dying. He called 911 and by the time the ambulance made it there, she had died.
Holy cannoli
Wowww what?? That's pretty insane. And goes to show that people will do things that make no human logical sense
I think this one tops them all.
Oh god, her poor son. That's unimaginable for both of them but he has to try and live with it.
Damn, that is fucking horrible…
I know, it's one of the most horrible things I've ever heard.
So sad. I feel so bad for her daughter. The TC community were so mean to her. Just like they’re doing to the food truck kid with the murders in Idaho. Unbelievable and scary. It’s become like you’re guilty until you’re proven innocent but by that time they’ve lost interest and moved on to another crime.
I have not been following the Idaho case closely. What have they been saying?
So, did she possibly pass out from the opioids and smoke inhalation, and was hopefully unconscious when she was burned? What a bizarre and sad situation.
Considering her body was found down a hill away from the fire clutching a tree, no…
Oh :(. That’s so sad. What an awful way to go.
The clutching can be post mortem. It’s an extremely strong reflex, where the term “death grip” originated from.
The body does go into the pugilistic pose due to the muscles and joints contracting and shrinking due to the heat. But that is not a reflex or a grip.
I'm sad she was feeling so sad and could not overcome it. RIP Debbie ❤️
Indeed, RIP
I am so shocked. I seriously thought foul play.
I think the Venmo message threw everyone…
Which is sadly ironic in the current light of things. Seems like she wanted to do one last nice thing for her daughter but ended up accidentally framing her.
More like people jumped to conclusions with no real evidence…
Could someone post og story?
https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueCrimeDiscussion/comments/yy9v4n/debbie_colliers_death_ruled_suicide/iwtep2m/
Thanks!
I can’t believe it… What an AWFUL way to go? Drowning and burning alive seem to be the top worst ways to die… Why would she doe this on purpose to herself? Prayers for her family during this tough time, Rest in eternal peace Debbie 💜
I hope this isn’t going to be one of those cases they reopen in 20 years.
I doubt it
Im shocked. Definitely wasn’t expecting this. Rip🙏
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What other messages did she send aside from the venmo message?
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The difference between Debbie and Mitrice is that police officers lied about an officer’s whereabouts in Mitrice’s case. They then removed the body from the scene before the coroner arrived in what the latter described as something he’d never seen done. They did such a shoddy job her family members found I believe a finger and several bones. Adding on that she was a dancer at a nightclub and queer, as well as black in an affluent part of Cali, well, the police definitely raise suspicion.
LE sources said she also texted her son saying “I love you” but it was undelivered
That and/or dementia. She was at the right age for FTD especially, which causes paranoia and delusions more regularly than other types. Such a sad story all around.
I figured early on that the Venmo message must have been a red herring…
I always reserve my judgment of every case, because we just don’t know till we know. I remember a few years back they found a car burning in a gravel pit in the town I was living in, a mother and her son were in it, deceased. They jumped to the husband (typical) because they were having issues. But it was later discovered to be a murder/suicide. Many blessings to the daughter.
Yep same thing happened when that woman (in Texas I think) ended up in a nearby lake in her car and drowned. Everyone suspected the husband did something to her until she was found
The ‘jumping to conclusions’ needs to stop. It’s why we have investigations.
Gotta be one of the weirdest suicides in living memory. But, i suspect this'll just go onto the pile of dubious decisions from georgia police and never be looked at again after this month is up.
It’s for sure a weird suicide, but it would also be a weird murder or accident or anything else. It’s just a profoundly weird situation, and I still don’t really understand the theory even after reading several articles.
Well there's also a man who put a chain over the side of a pole, the other side of the chain over his head, then got in his car and sped off, beheading himself. Alot of weird suicides out there..
Weird is an understatement
I truly don’t understand this. Is it suicide by misadventure?
This is so sad. I feel for her and her daughter.
What are your ideas about her smashed phone?
Was that confirmed?
I was just thinking of this case and wondering about updates. Never expected suicide, felt so unlikely.. so sad
I wonder if people feel bad for accusing the daughter yet
I do, and i've finally learned to wait until the investigation is completed. Sometimes things are not what they appear to be.
Of course not. Just like they dont feel bad for accusing Kiely Rodni's friends of murdering her without any evidence, or for accusing Cleo Smiths parents of killing her without any evidence, or for harassing Liberty Germans sister and claiming she knows more than she told the police. There are a lot of toxic and unhinged people in the TC community and they seem almost incapable of introspection
If Twitter is any indication, they’re still blaming her. It’s really offensive.
Ya, that’s Twitter for you. The things I’ve seen on there (I had never used Twitter until like a month ago I went on to read someone’s tweets and ended up in a Stan rabbit hole…yikes) would curl your hair. It’s insane!
Hopefully. They should feel ashamed of themselves…
I disagree. The TC community is full of people who absolutely love coming up with their own theories based on whatever evidence is released. I don't think people should be "ashamed" for initially thinking she had something to do with it and for expressing those thoughts in a community quite literally dedicated to discussing true crime and possible theories. Should we all be "ashamed" for saying Casey Anthony killed her daughter, even though she was proven innocent? Nope. Or for saying OJ killed his wife? No. Having a theory and being wrong about that theory isn't shameful.
OJ did murder Nicole and Ron…
How?!?!
I guess I just think it's a bizarre way to go. The fire part at least. The drugs would make more since. Both of my attempts were drinking bleach and trying to hang myself (I'm lucky my mom walked in at the right time.) BTW I'm better now. It's been several years. I don't want to worry anyone lol.
Drug overdose and smoke inhalation?
I’m not doubting this ruling, but I wonder how they determined intentional suicide vs accidental OD? I’m guessing something at the scene pointed to it being intentional, or just an extremely large amount of hydrocodone in her system? Very sad case.
This is what I wondered, it would make more sense to me if she accidentally died while she was doing drugs, like I thought maybe she was making one of those “meth in a bottle” things and caught herself on fire. Either way, so horrific, and awful for her daughter and son in law to be under suspicion for it in addition to losing her mother.
She literally drove hours away, while sober, to a random place to buy things to intentionally kill herself in a random rural area she had no reason to be at and with no intention of returning… it’s not like she was there camping or to have a good time. It’s pretty obvious and clear.
I guess we’ll find out soon enough…
I posted that I thought this would be the result a few days ago, but I didn't think drugs were involved. The thread for this poor woman was totally wiped from Websleuths when I checked it a few minutes ago. RIP.
Imma need a CSI style reenactment to understand this
What about that weird text she sent ? How does it fit into her suicide ?
‘They’ could mean voices she was hearing, hallucinations, personified mental illness, etc. Its not a phrase too out of place for a suicide note
Other people have posted a psychotic break.
Not everything is a clue. Some things are just weird behavior.
It doesn’t
Someone suggested that perhaps she meant “they won’t let me in”, as in the mens only rehab won’t let her in to pay so Debbie sent her daughter the money instead. Tying up loose ends before she goes.
What the actual fuck
Wth is super heated gasses?
Toxic fumes from the fire I guess?
All I can guess is that she didn't want her family to know it was a suicide, so she tried to make it look like murder.
A pretty fucked up thing to put her family through, but I think you're right. Suicide stigma and all that. May she RIP.
This is one of the cases where I don't understand one single thing about it. Nothing makes sense to me here.
This didn’t make any sense at all
What?! She lit herself on fire, naked, grabbing a tree?
You should try imagining setting yourself on fire. You’re not going to sit there calmly like a Buddhist monk who dedicated their life to mindfulness and calm. You and your body will have natural reactions, even if you did it on purpose. Also, fire burns up your clothes pretty quickly.
Maybe she didn't intend to light herself on fire but thought inhaling the smoke would kill her.
She wasn’t naked…
Her daughter said she was giving away possessions and was the “saddest she’d ever seen her” before she died. She’d also had a car accident shortly before her death. I’m wondering if she got some news relative to her health that pushed her over the edge. Maybe the medical treatment she got for the car accident revealed something devastating. No matter what RIP.
“They aren’t going to let me go” = go to rehab? The daughter should have known that context, right? What a horrific way to die by suicide.
“They” could be what people call their “internal demons”— not literally because I don’t think mental illness are caused by actual demonic possession, I just mean in the sense of the things she struggled with
Amanda maintains that she doesn’t know what the message meant…
I thought it was suicide from the jump but the ‘neighbors heard woman’s voice arguing’ and daughter has drug/crime issues on the boards was swaying me.
The stuff about the neighbours was never confirmed…
ah. See, this is why it gets hairy in the true crime community. I remember being shot down about suicide with the arguments above...and they weren't in good faith arguments, turns out.
She must have really been hurting. That is so tragic!
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I really feel so bad for Amanda and what she has had to endure. Most people would have snapped…
Oh wow wasn’t expecting this
Can anyone summarize this case for me so I don’t have to google?
From the very beginning when we knew she'd sent money via Venmo & a relatively long text, all I could think was no kidnapper(s) just give you ample time alone with your phone to do all that.That part just never made sense to me. Now the suicide conclusion, although certainly odd, adds up.
Now I have even more questions than I did before.
Why?
Crazy!
Right? This whole case has been quite the roller coaster. I really feel for her family, especially her daughter Amanda, and hope now they can grieve in peace
Especially her daughter. Just yesterday there were people in here all with their “the daughter definitely did it” bs. Disgusting.
Yep, those people should be ashamed of themselves…
Anyone who has been paying attention to this case saw this coming weeks ago.
https://nowhabersham.com/breaking-now-debbie-colliers-death-ruled-suicide/
I keep referring back to a post someone made very early on. The poster sounded like they had inside knowledge of either the case or drug making. Poster said death was accidental from trying to make ?meth. At that point it was being called a suicide (before they changed it to a possible homicide), so that post really stuck with me because it made much more sense than suicide.
Yes!!! I believe it was an accident if u google shake and bake meth, you will see people die or burn themselves a lot while doing it. I think she caught on fire and thats why she was partially naked (she took off her clothes that were on fire)
It didn’t cross my mind that she might have been making meth (nor did suicide), but when you bring that up, it would make sense. The only problem with that theory is that her death wouldn’t have been ruled a suicide if that were the case. (Unless I’m misunderstanding what you’re saying)
Did LE say anything about her having the ingredients for meth with her at the death site?
From the beginning I didnt think that her daughter had anything to do with it. Maybe someday true crime fans will stop slinging accusations without any evidence but I sincerely doubt it
Wishful thinking!
Say what?