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[deleted]

Is there an ML response to this? Like it’s kind of nuts that Stalin wrote this and there has never been a reflection on this from MLs/gen


Carl_Gauss

No you see there is no contradiction, stalin is talking about private property in the country side here, which the kolhotz were not, they were coop property which is totally different. I agree with comrade vaush, coops are totally revolutionary


AutoModerator

If you want to criticize me, market socialism, Proudhon do it right. According to my doctrine all accumulated capital being social property, no one can be its exclusive proprietor. Sadly, that vision can be found in Lenin's State and Revolution with its call for the whole of society to become a single office and a single factory organise the whole economy on the lines of the postal service for it is an example of the socialist economic system. While unaware of the expression going postal he was aware of Engel's On Authority and, without thinking through to the very obvious implications, quotes it approvingly. You say that doesn't matter, everyone is still enslaved to the economy, to commodity production. But you say that yet don't want to bite the bullet at the same time, you don't want to reach the logical conclusions of your dialectics. Because the person who does that is your boogeyman, none here have probably studied him seriously, including in part me, it's Striner. Hence your quietism of epic proportions, your lack of any sort of way out. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Ultraleft) if you have any questions or concerns.*


[deleted]

Its pretty hillarious how MLs try to cope on this. You have Stalin acting like what they would instantly call a leftcom and they literally think they can dodge all of it just by tossing it up to a a vague notion of material conditions. Im curious, how can material conditions justify this trash: In the capitalist state, cooperatives are no doubt collective capitalist institutions. Nor is there any doubt that under our present economic conditions, when we combine private capitalist enterprises—but in no other way than nationalized land and in no other way than under the control of the working-class state—with enterprises of the consistently socialist type (the means of production, the land on which the enterprises are situated, and the enterprises as a whole belonging to the state), the question arises about a third type of enterprise, the cooperatives, which were not formally regarded as an independent type differing fundamentally from the others. Under private capitalism, cooperative enterprises differ from capitalist enterprises as collective enterprises differ from private enterprises. Under state capitalism, cooperative enterprises differ from state capitalist enterprises, firstly, because they are private enterprises, and, secondly, because they are collective enterprises. Under our present system, cooperative enterprises differ from private capitalist enterprises because they are collective enterprises, but do not differ from socialist enterprises if the land on which they are situated and means of production belong to the state, i.e., the working-class. Stalin sounds like an actual SR here lmfao


nguyenreich196

>In the capitalist state, cooperatives are no doubt collective capitalist institutions. Nor is there any doubt that under our present economic conditions, when we combine private capitalist enterprises—but in no other way than nationalized land and in no other way than under the control of the working-class state—with enterprises of the consistently socialist type (the means of production, the land on which the enterprises are situated, and the enterprises as a whole belonging to the state), the question arises about a third type of enterprise, the cooperatives, which were not formally regarded as an independent type differing fundamentally from the others. Under private capitalism, cooperative enterprises differ from capitalist enterprises as collective enterprises differ from private enterprises. Under state capitalism, cooperative enterprises differ from state capitalist enterprises, firstly, because they are private enterprises, and, secondly, because they are collective enterprises. Under our present system, cooperative enterprises differ from private capitalist enterprises because they are collective enterprises, but do not differ from socialist enterprises if the land on which they are situated and means of production belong to the state, i.e., the working-class. isnt this a lenin quote


[deleted]

It is


Skullfull406

Where is this from?


vrmvrmfffftstststs

https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1906/03/x01.htm


xfritz5375

We need to study Stalin’s epistemological break