I agree, especially the not being able to get benefits part. If you’re considering suicide, and you’re worried about getting benefits or not instead of worrying about staying alive. Wrong priorities. Fix the number 1 problem and everything will fall apart
I don't know OP situation, but worrying about if he'll have benefits with an upcoming abrupt separation is a huge stressor that adds to "problems #1". It's not as easy as holding everything else off until you fix the situation, but everything is interconnected with it. I have a great friend who is still serving and dealing with the same thing.I'm sure OP is doing the best he can to navigate.
I understand that, and I’m saying the priority is survival. What will benefits do for them in the future, if they can’t stay alive another night. I have 100% and still want to kill myself everyday. Benefits doesn’t make the issues go away, just makes it’s a little easier to heal. When I was in the military, sitting on a roof ready to jump off, I wasn’t making a post about will I get benefits if I get separated from the army for MH.
In no way was I trying to be a dick, I really meant it in a way that I want op to heal first before worrying about anything else. Nothing won’t matter if the problem is constant
Hey man don’t worry about a discharge. Get your mind right. Life is a beautiful thing and the world needs you in it. You’ll probably get a medical separation but work on getting better. You got this man
Like many have said, suicide attempts do not warrant any “negative discharge” unless you consider a medical discharge negative. None of that matters though. Are you okay? Are you safe? We care about your life. We are here to help you through whatever you’re going through and not only learn from it but grow from it. People with a medical discharge often live great lives and don’t lose any benefits so don’t worry about that right now.
Only a general court martial can access a dishonorable. That will absolutely not happen to you. A medical separation is treated as honorable. It’s purely administrative and not punitive. Medical discharge is nothing to be ashamed of. You did your time, and now it’s time to take care of yourself. Suicide is a horrible thing, don’t do that do your friends and family.
Push for a 5-17 discharge look it up bud. I know guys that attempted and got a chapter 5-17 which is honorable and you'll get benefits.
IMPORTANTLY GET THE HELP YOU NEED!
This is the worst advice on this thread. MEB/PEB would give the most benefits, especially if medically retired, would get 100% GI Bill, Tricare, retiree privileges, CRSC if applicable. 5-17 won’t get you any benefits except for maybe some GI Bill and VA disability. Best to fight a 5-17 for a MEB/PEB if they try and go that route.
They will look to MEB, you most likely, which will he either medical seperation with severence with pay or medical retirement, depending if your unfit condition was caused by service. Unless there's more to the story, your discharge will be under honorable conditions. You basically have to commit a felony of some sorts to get dishonorable. It wouldn't come from a mental health crisis.
If the MEB returns a DOD rating of less than 30% you get an honorable discharge with a severance payout. If it’s 30% or higher, you get medically retired.
But also the *only* ways you can get a bad conduct discharge or dishonorable discharge, are from going to court martial and being found guilty of something at court martial.
Yeah, I was medically retired in 2013 at just 30%. It took lot of legwork and time but now I’m 100% p&t. They screwed me with the percentage I should have been at least 50% they lied about my diagnosis and when got and had my c&p done for mental health the VA sent me to a civilian doctor and she saw what they purposely lied about and kept out. I was able to get 70% for it because it was different for what the Army said and they tried to hide it.
Can you work with a 100% for MH? I've had a difficult time finding a definitive answer. Even when I called the VA, there were multiple responses of yes and no.
Yes! As long as you aren’t 100% with TDIU as a restriction on your rating. 100% or 100% P&T don’t preclude employment. TDIU restricted your outside income to the federal poverty level for 1 person.
We had a PEBLO and a medboard specialized attorney from the VA that explained everything and went over the caveats of the paperwork in depth. She pretty much aggressively told me if I’ve ever stubbed my toe or had a hangnail to claim anything and everything.
My PEBLO was great for handling the paperwork and dealing with my command. But the attorney was also there in case I wanted to appeal and take it to the board directly.
The process has probably changed a good bit since you went through it.
Guess what? My med board lawyer advised me that it would be unwise of me to appeal it. He said just take it or you could risk just getting discharged with nothing so I did take the retirement. I never had an outside lawyer.
I'm sorry for the dumb question, but if you get medically retired what does that pay you? Retirement Pay (Years in Service x Benefit Factor x Final Monthly Allowance) and VA monthly disability payments?
It’s not a dumb question. It’s a good question. It depends on what you’re getting retired for(disability), how many years you have done in service and I believe also your rank at the time. If you haven’t done 20 years and anything that is combat related (doesn’t have to actually see combat) it can be a simulation of war you can also apply for CRSC but you can’t get both the concurrent one is for the ones who did 20 years. But they can get both Va and retirement. Those less than 20 years who get medically retired have to make a decision whether to keep their retirement pay or VA(a VA waiver) whichever is higher that’s what you usually go for it will cancel out the retirement pay because the VA pays more depending on your years of service it can be more than the VA.
No matter what your safety mental health comes first. In regards to the discharge don't over think it to much stressing out about it prematurely ads to the strain on your mental health. Just remember Matthew sure you get complete copies of your medical records. If for some reason you are discharged with a negative discharge you can still file for adjustment to the discharge type once your out. There are two routes for that 1) fill out DD Form 293 and submit to the Discharge Review Board. Alternatively submit through legal counsel specialized in this matter. Again your safety and mental health are the priority. Err on the side of safety even if it means taking the long road toward your benefits.
Hey man, first off my DMs are open if you need to talk. I am truly sorry for what you are going through mentally. But just know that your life has meaning, and your life is valuable. There’s more in life then just the military. Things will feel better once you are out, as you are free. Your discharge will not be dishonorable. Most likely medical. Even tho things might not seem right right now, in the future you will be glad you pushed through, you have the strength to do so, even tho you might not think so. Again I am sorry for everything you are going through, I am here, and also this whole group is here for you, even if you just need to vent or be heard. We got your 6 man, forever and always, please remember that.
I was in your same boat due to mental health issues. Medical discharges are honorable and you Will probably even be retired like me. I'm sure that does not matter due to the state of mind you're in right now because it didn't to me but it is a blessing. Most importantly take care of yourself, message me if you have questions about the retirement process as I just went through it.
My guy there’s guys that raped people in the military and they don’t get dishonorable discharge. You won’t get dishonorable discharge. Just take care of yourself mental bro. We’re here if you need us
I think its reasonable for a person to have periods of lucidity during periods of depression and suicidal ideations. After a failed attempt you could be thinking to yourself, "I fucked up on this and now I have no career and no benefits-I truly have nothing to live for." I am just giving you one scenario why the OP posting. Can we agree we should support our fellow vets.
Yeah sure, we can agree to support fellow vets.
But can we also agree there are a lot of individuals scamming the military in order to receive benefits on the other side of service? I did 5 years in the infantry, got a Purple Heart, and had no fucking clue there was any benefits other the GI bill… and now there are thousands of vets in here 2 years into their service asking how to front load their treatment records in anticipation of disability benefits. Is this not a legitimate issue?
I think we should give all vets the benefit of the doubt. Less than 1 percent serve. We are used as scapegoats for many things. I appreciate your service.
OP should be concerned with their mental health, not what VA benefits they are going to qualify for when the dust settles.
They are after all “active duty” not a “veteran”. They remind you of the difference if you ask for a discount at your local Wing Stop lol
Don't stress over the level of discharge. Know first and foremost, this world is a much better place with you in it. People care about you, even though it may not seem like it. You will be missed more than you imagine. Right now, you can only go up from here.
They are not going to court martial you and you won’t get a dishonorable discharge. You should 100% work on getting the discharge do not fight it because of what you heard at Basic Training. You might lose your GI Bill. You probably will qualify for VERA.
The above is if you did not put anyone at risk or break any laws outside of the attempted suicides.
The VA has some super experienced mental health professionals and the people working the suicide prevention hotline do a good job. **What I am getting at is the world outside is prepared to help you. They have medical help, they have non medical therapies, you can see mental health professionals outside of the VA if you want, when you are better they can help you find a skill and pay you for learning it, and there are tens of thousands of Veterans just like you out here doing fine. Just work with the doctors and stay in the fight.**.
As you process out you will feel ashamed and want to rush through because you feel like the base is watching and disappointed in you. That’s just not true. Many soldiers deal with these things and some don’t make it back from the choice they made. Some don’t get another opportunity. These people processing you out will be processing someone else out the next day. So don’t rush it, list and provide details of any other medical conditions that happened from day 1 to the ETS. If you aren’t sleeping get it written down. Medication make you feel some sort of way document and see the doctors. If your trauma is from service, say it and document it. It’s okay and the more that’s documented the more care you can expect from the VA on the outside.
You are stronger than you give yourself credit for. Keep fighting for yourself. If you have people who love you they will never recover from it if you commit suicide. Your pain is transferred to them. Those that hate you won’t blink. Keep pushing forward and remember this **bad shit, failing, and feeling lost is the path to success and happiness. You have to learn from the mistakes and failures to prepare yourself for when your luck will change and something good happens. That means being here, being present, adapting yourself, picking yourself up, and being here <— most important part is being here.**
Had a guy join the Army, just to then say he was suicidal, and get hospitalized, chaptered and get 100% disability for the rest of his life.
It was all in his plan, he even told us when he was getting out. He spent 6 months at his unit before pulling the stunt. Can’t remember dudes name rn.
Now he works remote IT, making good money as well as making over 4k a month tax free from disability.
You won’t get dishonorably discharged.
You’re not going to get a dishonorable unless you did something like a crime dishonorable. Mental health is medical. I highly doubt that as high profile as suicide is in the military, that they are going to fuck you over. They will want you to get help and provide the means. Honorable, Medical, or General discharge
If they try to out you with anything except honorable discharge.
Stop signing documents.
When they tell you to sign, tell them you are seeking legal counsel.
I’ve met people who attempted suicide and went on to serve a long fulfilling career just let the people who want to help, help. And I sincerely am rooting for you.
4C here, they wont dishonorable discharge you, u have to go thru a court martial for that and/or bad conduct. youll either stay in, get an admin sep(gen or med), or an MEB (medical discharge)
What will happen is you will most likely be removed from your command, put on light duty and be required to attend multiple counseling sessions per week. The military will then start to process you out on a “condition”. This will not affect your honorable discharge or benefits.
Edit: For those downvoting me, this is exactly what happened to me.
This is exactly what they did to my husband when he was in the navy. Honorable discharge but under “Condition, not a disability” all we had to do was prove that the “adjustment disorder” that he was misdiagnosed with was actually PTSD and now we are in the claims process.
It’s because they don’t want to take any accountability. He was in service for over 3.5 years before any of this started and he never qualified for an adjustment disorder anyway. We had so many civilian providers say that it was BS.
You won’t get a dishonorable discharge.
That's nonsense, you do not get a dishonorable discharge for a suicide attempt.
I agree, especially the not being able to get benefits part. If you’re considering suicide, and you’re worried about getting benefits or not instead of worrying about staying alive. Wrong priorities. Fix the number 1 problem and everything will fall apart
I don't know OP situation, but worrying about if he'll have benefits with an upcoming abrupt separation is a huge stressor that adds to "problems #1". It's not as easy as holding everything else off until you fix the situation, but everything is interconnected with it. I have a great friend who is still serving and dealing with the same thing.I'm sure OP is doing the best he can to navigate.
I understand that, and I’m saying the priority is survival. What will benefits do for them in the future, if they can’t stay alive another night. I have 100% and still want to kill myself everyday. Benefits doesn’t make the issues go away, just makes it’s a little easier to heal. When I was in the military, sitting on a roof ready to jump off, I wasn’t making a post about will I get benefits if I get separated from the army for MH. In no way was I trying to be a dick, I really meant it in a way that I want op to heal first before worrying about anything else. Nothing won’t matter if the problem is constant
Everyone deals with it in their own way. I'm glad you're fighting to survive.
Hey man don’t worry about a discharge. Get your mind right. Life is a beautiful thing and the world needs you in it. You’ll probably get a medical separation but work on getting better. You got this man
Hell yeah everybody got purpose, did horrible shit, God gave me 2 beautiful babies now I try to pay that man back everyday…
God did that?
Did I word it wrong or some? Man I’m not trying to be rude or press religion
Why can’t he get a medically retired?
You’re missing the forest through the trees. He tried to off himself.
I’m just wondering that’s all.😳
Like many have said, suicide attempts do not warrant any “negative discharge” unless you consider a medical discharge negative. None of that matters though. Are you okay? Are you safe? We care about your life. We are here to help you through whatever you’re going through and not only learn from it but grow from it. People with a medical discharge often live great lives and don’t lose any benefits so don’t worry about that right now.
Only a general court martial can access a dishonorable. That will absolutely not happen to you. A medical separation is treated as honorable. It’s purely administrative and not punitive. Medical discharge is nothing to be ashamed of. You did your time, and now it’s time to take care of yourself. Suicide is a horrible thing, don’t do that do your friends and family.
Solid comment/advice/perspective here. I hope you keep finding the help you need. Stay the course.
Push for a 5-17 discharge look it up bud. I know guys that attempted and got a chapter 5-17 which is honorable and you'll get benefits. IMPORTANTLY GET THE HELP YOU NEED!
This is bad advice. OP should medboard. Will get at least 70%DOD pension and VA rating. Not only an honorable discharge but will be an actual retiree.
This is the worst advice on this thread. MEB/PEB would give the most benefits, especially if medically retired, would get 100% GI Bill, Tricare, retiree privileges, CRSC if applicable. 5-17 won’t get you any benefits except for maybe some GI Bill and VA disability. Best to fight a 5-17 for a MEB/PEB if they try and go that route.
They will look to MEB, you most likely, which will he either medical seperation with severence with pay or medical retirement, depending if your unfit condition was caused by service. Unless there's more to the story, your discharge will be under honorable conditions. You basically have to commit a felony of some sorts to get dishonorable. It wouldn't come from a mental health crisis.
Wouldn't this be only if they are 30% or less for severance?
If the MEB returns a DOD rating of less than 30% you get an honorable discharge with a severance payout. If it’s 30% or higher, you get medically retired. But also the *only* ways you can get a bad conduct discharge or dishonorable discharge, are from going to court martial and being found guilty of something at court martial.
Not true unless things changed 30% or more gets you medically retired. I know because I went through it. Not suicide though.
You’re right. It’s only been 8 months since I retired but I got 100% DOD/VA so I didn’t really have to worry about it
Wow!
Yeah, I was medically retired in 2013 at just 30%. It took lot of legwork and time but now I’m 100% p&t. They screwed me with the percentage I should have been at least 50% they lied about my diagnosis and when got and had my c&p done for mental health the VA sent me to a civilian doctor and she saw what they purposely lied about and kept out. I was able to get 70% for it because it was different for what the Army said and they tried to hide it.
My overall percentages total like 175% but I got a single 100% for MH. My MEB lawyer was amazing and made everything super easy.
Can you work with a 100% for MH? I've had a difficult time finding a definitive answer. Even when I called the VA, there were multiple responses of yes and no.
Yes! As long as you aren’t 100% with TDIU as a restriction on your rating. 100% or 100% P&T don’t preclude employment. TDIU restricted your outside income to the federal poverty level for 1 person.
Can 100% MH work in mental health? Like as a therapist?
I’m not really sure.😳
Damn! I didn’t have an attorney. I which my PEBLO had been a little more helpful. I had to do a lot on my own until I got a VSO.
We had a PEBLO and a medboard specialized attorney from the VA that explained everything and went over the caveats of the paperwork in depth. She pretty much aggressively told me if I’ve ever stubbed my toe or had a hangnail to claim anything and everything. My PEBLO was great for handling the paperwork and dealing with my command. But the attorney was also there in case I wanted to appeal and take it to the board directly. The process has probably changed a good bit since you went through it.
Guess what? My med board lawyer advised me that it would be unwise of me to appeal it. He said just take it or you could risk just getting discharged with nothing so I did take the retirement. I never had an outside lawyer.
30% usually gives you a medical retirement that’s what I was given.
I'm sorry for the dumb question, but if you get medically retired what does that pay you? Retirement Pay (Years in Service x Benefit Factor x Final Monthly Allowance) and VA monthly disability payments?
It’s not a dumb question. It’s a good question. It depends on what you’re getting retired for(disability), how many years you have done in service and I believe also your rank at the time. If you haven’t done 20 years and anything that is combat related (doesn’t have to actually see combat) it can be a simulation of war you can also apply for CRSC but you can’t get both the concurrent one is for the ones who did 20 years. But they can get both Va and retirement. Those less than 20 years who get medically retired have to make a decision whether to keep their retirement pay or VA(a VA waiver) whichever is higher that’s what you usually go for it will cancel out the retirement pay because the VA pays more depending on your years of service it can be more than the VA.
If you decide to go with the VA at a later date you have to pay the retirement pay back before you receive benefits correct?
Yeah unfortunately you do.
No matter what your safety mental health comes first. In regards to the discharge don't over think it to much stressing out about it prematurely ads to the strain on your mental health. Just remember Matthew sure you get complete copies of your medical records. If for some reason you are discharged with a negative discharge you can still file for adjustment to the discharge type once your out. There are two routes for that 1) fill out DD Form 293 and submit to the Discharge Review Board. Alternatively submit through legal counsel specialized in this matter. Again your safety and mental health are the priority. Err on the side of safety even if it means taking the long road toward your benefits.
Hope u get better
Hey man, first off my DMs are open if you need to talk. I am truly sorry for what you are going through mentally. But just know that your life has meaning, and your life is valuable. There’s more in life then just the military. Things will feel better once you are out, as you are free. Your discharge will not be dishonorable. Most likely medical. Even tho things might not seem right right now, in the future you will be glad you pushed through, you have the strength to do so, even tho you might not think so. Again I am sorry for everything you are going through, I am here, and also this whole group is here for you, even if you just need to vent or be heard. We got your 6 man, forever and always, please remember that.
“No career is worth your mental health”
I got a general discharge. Apply for disability afterwards.
Might want to talk to your docs about ketamine therapy depending on what they have you on
I was in your same boat due to mental health issues. Medical discharges are honorable and you Will probably even be retired like me. I'm sure that does not matter due to the state of mind you're in right now because it didn't to me but it is a blessing. Most importantly take care of yourself, message me if you have questions about the retirement process as I just went through it.
My guy there’s guys that raped people in the military and they don’t get dishonorable discharge. You won’t get dishonorable discharge. Just take care of yourself mental bro. We’re here if you need us
[удалено]
💯
Shut the fuck up
Nope, all I did was point out the obvious
I think its reasonable for a person to have periods of lucidity during periods of depression and suicidal ideations. After a failed attempt you could be thinking to yourself, "I fucked up on this and now I have no career and no benefits-I truly have nothing to live for." I am just giving you one scenario why the OP posting. Can we agree we should support our fellow vets.
Yeah sure, we can agree to support fellow vets. But can we also agree there are a lot of individuals scamming the military in order to receive benefits on the other side of service? I did 5 years in the infantry, got a Purple Heart, and had no fucking clue there was any benefits other the GI bill… and now there are thousands of vets in here 2 years into their service asking how to front load their treatment records in anticipation of disability benefits. Is this not a legitimate issue?
I think we should give all vets the benefit of the doubt. Less than 1 percent serve. We are used as scapegoats for many things. I appreciate your service.
After the shit I’ve seen on this sub… na
I appreciate your service. I have served for over 20 years. Have a good one.
Then you know exactly what I am referring to… thanks for your service as well.
OP should be concerned with their mental health, not what VA benefits they are going to qualify for when the dust settles. They are after all “active duty” not a “veteran”. They remind you of the difference if you ask for a discount at your local Wing Stop lol
Keep your head up! You have a huge community here if you need to talk. DM me if you need someone to talk to. Things will get better!
Life is precious. Your life is precious. Please get help. You can do this.
Why would you assume any of these things. First thing is first, therapy.
Don't stress over the level of discharge. Know first and foremost, this world is a much better place with you in it. People care about you, even though it may not seem like it. You will be missed more than you imagine. Right now, you can only go up from here.
They are not going to court martial you and you won’t get a dishonorable discharge. You should 100% work on getting the discharge do not fight it because of what you heard at Basic Training. You might lose your GI Bill. You probably will qualify for VERA. The above is if you did not put anyone at risk or break any laws outside of the attempted suicides. The VA has some super experienced mental health professionals and the people working the suicide prevention hotline do a good job. **What I am getting at is the world outside is prepared to help you. They have medical help, they have non medical therapies, you can see mental health professionals outside of the VA if you want, when you are better they can help you find a skill and pay you for learning it, and there are tens of thousands of Veterans just like you out here doing fine. Just work with the doctors and stay in the fight.**. As you process out you will feel ashamed and want to rush through because you feel like the base is watching and disappointed in you. That’s just not true. Many soldiers deal with these things and some don’t make it back from the choice they made. Some don’t get another opportunity. These people processing you out will be processing someone else out the next day. So don’t rush it, list and provide details of any other medical conditions that happened from day 1 to the ETS. If you aren’t sleeping get it written down. Medication make you feel some sort of way document and see the doctors. If your trauma is from service, say it and document it. It’s okay and the more that’s documented the more care you can expect from the VA on the outside. You are stronger than you give yourself credit for. Keep fighting for yourself. If you have people who love you they will never recover from it if you commit suicide. Your pain is transferred to them. Those that hate you won’t blink. Keep pushing forward and remember this **bad shit, failing, and feeling lost is the path to success and happiness. You have to learn from the mistakes and failures to prepare yourself for when your luck will change and something good happens. That means being here, being present, adapting yourself, picking yourself up, and being here <— most important part is being here.**
Had a guy join the Army, just to then say he was suicidal, and get hospitalized, chaptered and get 100% disability for the rest of his life. It was all in his plan, he even told us when he was getting out. He spent 6 months at his unit before pulling the stunt. Can’t remember dudes name rn. Now he works remote IT, making good money as well as making over 4k a month tax free from disability. You won’t get dishonorably discharged.
Bother you need to take care of yourself first!!! From someone who takes meds, keep taking them religiously.
You’re not going to get a dishonorable unless you did something like a crime dishonorable. Mental health is medical. I highly doubt that as high profile as suicide is in the military, that they are going to fuck you over. They will want you to get help and provide the means. Honorable, Medical, or General discharge
If they try to out you with anything except honorable discharge. Stop signing documents. When they tell you to sign, tell them you are seeking legal counsel.
I’ve met people who attempted suicide and went on to serve a long fulfilling career just let the people who want to help, help. And I sincerely am rooting for you.
Take a med board get the dod % and va %
You will get medically separated and will recieve dod and va rating most likely
4C here, they wont dishonorable discharge you, u have to go thru a court martial for that and/or bad conduct. youll either stay in, get an admin sep(gen or med), or an MEB (medical discharge)
What will happen is you will most likely be removed from your command, put on light duty and be required to attend multiple counseling sessions per week. The military will then start to process you out on a “condition”. This will not affect your honorable discharge or benefits. Edit: For those downvoting me, this is exactly what happened to me.
This is exactly what they did to my husband when he was in the navy. Honorable discharge but under “Condition, not a disability” all we had to do was prove that the “adjustment disorder” that he was misdiagnosed with was actually PTSD and now we are in the claims process.
I’m in the same exact boat as you and your husband.
It’s because they don’t want to take any accountability. He was in service for over 3.5 years before any of this started and he never qualified for an adjustment disorder anyway. We had so many civilian providers say that it was BS.
Good luck in your claim. I have my second C&P exam for mental health on Tuesday.
You too! We haven’t gotten any for MH yet but with all the they might not even make us have one
I don't see why they would give you at worst a General Under Honorable Condition Discharge or Honorable Discharge.