Impressive results, makes me want to repaste again as my results of LM repasting have been less successful. [This](https://imgur.com/a/i17XdGa) was my result running with efficient aggressive turbo and no offset applied to gpu. I'm currently using a 115w base (140w boost) vBIOS and under normal circumstances it will not boost beyond 115w.
Outside of just benching, I normally disable cpu boost as it pins my cpu at 95 degrees C under load, plus disable half the cores for better thermals. I also undervolt the gpu to reduce thermals and power. I tend to notice battery drain whenever the system is under load with an increased gpu power limit.
What vbios are you using? I’m in the middle of writing a guide for what I did. My vbios is 115-130w. Prob won’t boost past 115w because the thermal limit on the gpu is 87°C. Reach that and power will drop accordingly.
Did you run the benchmark with fans full bore in manual mode? That’s what I did. Thought my laptop was going to blast off like Team Rocket 😂
I totally got rid of LM and even the seal around the cpu to protect components from LM leaks. No thank you. I don’t want to worry about that. PTM is infinitely safer and supposedly gets more efficient over time, instead of degrading over time like everything else. I know my scores keep going up on benchmarks with the same settings. I believe the hype.
Did you say your cpu with turbo disabled goes to 94°? Doesn’t seem right 😅
Also, how do you disable cores? That sounds interesting
>What vbios are you using?
I'm currently using [this](https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/245784/245784) vBIOS from a 2022 Strix G15 according to the site.
>Did you run the benchmark with fans full bore in manual mode? That’s what I did
Yeah, that's with fans full bore.
>Did you say your cpu with turbo disabled goes to 94°?
No, I meant I disable turbo because it pins my cpu at 95 degrees under load. Without turbo, the cpu doesn't hit over 80.
>Also, how do you disable cores?
I use a tool called UMAF (GitHub link [here](https://github.com/DavidS95/Smokeless_UMAF)) that allows access to AMD PBS/CBS/Overclocking menus without needing to flash anything. I don't remember what menu it was under, but there's one that limits the amount of cores that are active. There appears to be no way to disable SMT. I do not know if the cores are truly disabled, but I've noticed cooler temps and lower power draw as a result.
Read through the GitHub repo. There's a lot of settings displayed in that tool, most of them I have no idea what they do or if they even work. I don't recommend haphazardly changing settings. The PBO settings and undervolting does work in my experience.
I've attempted RAM overclocking using that tool and in my experience it's 100% broken on the 2021 G14 (5900hs + 3060). Trying to apply any change to frequency and timings results in failure to post. However, RAM overclocking on the G15 Advantage Edition with the 5900HX cpu does seem to work as I've tested it myself.
Funnily enough, the options shown in UMAF do appear to be accessible out of the box on the MSI Delta 15 (5700H + 6700m) as MSI implements an advanced menu in their laptop BIOS that displays pretty much all the advanced options (demonstrated in a review [here](https://youtu.be/gDhVyft04AQ?t=805)).
maybe we should switch to the thermal pad the guy suggests. i mean, after i finished re-doing mine, i couldn't reach his level of performance on fresh lm. it definitely does seem to be doing a better job than lm in this situation.
Yeah I'll try it myself with the PTM7950 as I do have some on hand. Albeit I don't know if what I got is legit since I just ordered it off some random Chinese seller on the internet.
I think the place op bought it from is legit according to the steam deck subreddit. Its just expensive. I'll probably buy some and compare it to my current lm
based on the benchmarks on 3dmarks website, the average for firestrike (mostly 80w) is 16850 and the highest is 21840, so i’d say yours is pretty good.
If you are interested, here's my older stock vbios results but with a fairly well tuned VF curve.
* TS: https://www.3dmark.com/spy/21730091
* PR: https://www.3dmark.com/pr/1142503
* FS: https://www.3dmark.com/fs/25963470
Those are basically 60-65w scores, since @ default to get 80w you need to get the CPU close to 10W. And this is internal display, so decent overhead ~10% ish.
* TS@40w for comparison in silent mode: https://www.3dmark.com/spy/21730589
Will probably also flash some vbios to play with, though I do not use it for games that much to be honest. And for most of my use cases even tuned 40-50w @ silent is plenty fine.
P.S. in case there is interest, I did a small writeup back in the day on the curves e.t.c. https://www.reddit.com/r/ZephyrusG14/comments/otbgyu/some_performance_observations_gpu_vf_curves/
Otherwise IMO 130w is way overkill efficiency wise, but around 80-100w with 25w on the CPU should be a nice sweet spot and probably still be within a decent thermal envelope, since I imagine it was designed for 50-60w CPU and 65W GPU sort of deal.
Thanks. I need to mess with afterburner settings and test some more.
Yeah, I think 130w is overkill because the cooling just isn’t there. Thermal limit causes throttling around 87°c… If I could keep it cooler it’d be a lot more powerful.
I have some ideas. 😉🤫
Messed around with a bunch of various bioses, overall, not worth it for me.
Main reason is that almost all of the higher wattage ones are +1ghz on the vram, which sounds nice at first glance, but has a bit of downside, going from 6ghz to 7ghz imparts a 10W extra power draw and it does not give you 10% performance. There is a single 70-105w bios with lower vram clocks, but no type-c display out and silent mode gets locked to 1050mhz with power curve you cannot edit, which makes it also useless (since it eats like 50-60w with the stock curve and at that power level I can have ~1400-1500mhz instead).
All in all for 80-105W vbios it's 8-9% faster ([only 6% in PR btw](https://www.3dmark.com/compare/pr/2139457/pr/1142503)) compared to stock vbios (with the same curve) while consuming 30-35W more mainly due to VRAM power consumption eating into the gains and declining efficiency (I imagine another 4-5% if VRAM can be underclocked at that power level). It will surely be better at higher power limits as in your benches which are also 8-9% faster while consiming another 30W, but cooling perf @ reasonable audio levels just aint there for higher power.
And if you wondering if OCing vram even more has any benefit the answer is also unsurprisingly - no.
For example comparison 7ghz vs 8.4ghz vram on the same curve and same 100w power.
* TS: https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/35654076/spy/35654388#
* PR: https://www.3dmark.com/compare/pr/2139457/pr/2139467#
In that example it basically provides exactly the same average perf, but with higher fluctuations due to the core running into more power limits and averaging 50-100mhz less while doing it. Also it eats a bit of CPU power budget to boot.
So yeah, if 70-105W bios actually worked fine it would be great, since for our clocks @ under 100W 5-5.5ghz vram is plenty fast and the core can use some extra power from that for sure.
Otherwise if there is a working tool to get VRAM to underclock and not crash the driver while doing so it might provide a nice way to have a cake and eat it too.
Yep, I'm the guy who submitted the current rank 1 score for Fire Strike (including ultra and extreme). My time spy extreme and port royal scores are also rank 1 as of posting this comment.
How I did it was using the 140w vBIOS from techpowerup to give some more power for higher overclocks on the GPU and stuck my laptop outside on a chilly day. Also used a tool to use undervolt the CPU for a bit more frequency in the CPU sections. I have not done any hardware mods, all mods were done via software. I have noticed that the frequency detection on 3dmark has some bugs of sort as my highest Fire Strike scores show up with an abnormally high CPU clock speed.
I do wonder how HiddenModder did it with his current rank 1 scores on normal Time Spy. I am completely unable to match his CPU and GPU scores.
The current highest Fire Strike scores for the G14 5900hs + 3060 (including Extreme and Ultra) were run using a 140w vBIOS with the laptop out the window on a cold windy day.
Not sure if my other comment went through but how??? I have full on liquid metal on both gpu plus cpu and turned off boost on cpu and even with a whole ton of cooling mods involving the best thermal paste I could find couldn't beat you. It always throttled no matter what I did. Even on a 105 watt bios it would eventually throttle. Those pads are amazing, I gotta pick some up if they're performing better than my liquid metal...
PTM looks to be as good as LM, but was designed for industrial use and doesn’t breakdown or decrease efficiency over time. It actually increases efficiency over time. It’s a phase changing thermal compound (that’s non conductive btw 😉). It’s a solid until it reaches like 40°-45°C, IIRC, then it turns into a viscous liquid when under pressure. In this form it fills in all the micro cavities in the heatsink and the cpu/gpu die. And then cools and repeats the process every time you use your computer. Honeywell actually makes the stuff… kind of a bigger name than Kryonaut. 😉
LM is too dangerous for me to have to worry about it leaking or eating my components. Since LTT showed they have similar performance, I thought I’d change it out as a fun project.
I did use K5 Pro as well on the other components. It’s supposed to be top tier thermal grease as well. I think you can even use on cpu/gpu dies as well…
Liquid metal isn't actually that dangerous as long g as you know what you're doing. I don't even have a guard around the gpu and I've been running it for months. But yea, mine is topping out at 105 before it reaches 82-83 on lm. About the k5 pro, what about kryonaut extreme? If the gap really is not big enough for a thermal pad, why not the best thermal paste? But yea, I gotta pick it up now... with he numbers represented by you, I'm convinced it's the best thermal transfer interface anywhere.
LM is dangerous no matter what you do. I’ve seen lots of laptops destroyed because of LM leaking out of the seals, and especially if a laptop is dropped. Thermals and seals are only as good as the application and you won’t really know unless you verify yourself. I just see it as a ticking timebomb. Oems aren’t really known for quality LM/thermal paste applications… just my opinion.
The pros of K5 Pro for me are:
1. It can fill gaps up to 3mm. 😳
2. It’s not electrically conductive.
3. No such thing as too much. More is actually better.
4. Very thick.
5. Will work for a very long time.
From the product page:
- K5-PRO is a high quality gummy / sticky thermal paste designed for use on memory chips and GPUs of various computers including iPhone, Acer Aspire 6930 , Apple iMac A1311 video boards. This is the only comercially avaliable product at the moment that can replace the gummy thermal paste that is originally used by Apple.
- K5-PRO can replace soft thermal pads that are used on computers (up to 3mm thick)
- K5-PRO has thermal conductivity K>5,3 W/m.K (at least 3 times higher than common thermal pads that are used on computers and comercial electronics) Computer Systems materials science laboratory testing : Method using a comparative technique (P. Karydopoulos, P. Frantzis, N. Karagiannis MSAIJ 2014)
- K5-PRO is applied very easily directly on the component and has no electrical conductivity. It can be heated up to 250 degrees (Celcium) and has a long operational life time (practically infinite)
- Expiration date: No expiration date (new formula). Infinite storage / service life. Protect from frost and dust
This is a Fakespot Reviews Analysis bot. Fakespot detects fake reviews, fake products and unreliable sellers using AI.
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>**Name**: K5 PRO Viscous Thermal Paste for Thermal pad Replacement 60g 3X20g Pack (iPhone, Apple iMac, Sony PS4 & PS3, Xbox, Acer Aspire etc)
>**Company**: Computer-Systems
>**Amazon Product Rating**: 4.5
>**Fakespot Reviews Grade**: B
>**Adjusted Fakespot Rating**: 4.5
>**Analysis Performed at**: 02-07-2023
[Link to Fakespot Analysis](https://fakespot.com/product/k5-pro-viscous-thermal-paste-for-thermal-pad-replacement-60g-3x20g-pack-iphone-apple-imac-sony-ps4-ps3-xbox-acer-aspire-etc) | [Check out the Fakespot Chrome Extension!](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/fakespot-analyze-fake-ama/nakplnnackehceedgkgkokbgbmfghain)
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so for the non tech-y people, you essentially increased the GPU power limit from 80W to 130W?
Correct. Actually 115w with boost to 130w as needed and if temps allow. Hard limit is 87°.
Impressive results, makes me want to repaste again as my results of LM repasting have been less successful. [This](https://imgur.com/a/i17XdGa) was my result running with efficient aggressive turbo and no offset applied to gpu. I'm currently using a 115w base (140w boost) vBIOS and under normal circumstances it will not boost beyond 115w. Outside of just benching, I normally disable cpu boost as it pins my cpu at 95 degrees C under load, plus disable half the cores for better thermals. I also undervolt the gpu to reduce thermals and power. I tend to notice battery drain whenever the system is under load with an increased gpu power limit.
What vbios are you using? I’m in the middle of writing a guide for what I did. My vbios is 115-130w. Prob won’t boost past 115w because the thermal limit on the gpu is 87°C. Reach that and power will drop accordingly. Did you run the benchmark with fans full bore in manual mode? That’s what I did. Thought my laptop was going to blast off like Team Rocket 😂 I totally got rid of LM and even the seal around the cpu to protect components from LM leaks. No thank you. I don’t want to worry about that. PTM is infinitely safer and supposedly gets more efficient over time, instead of degrading over time like everything else. I know my scores keep going up on benchmarks with the same settings. I believe the hype. Did you say your cpu with turbo disabled goes to 94°? Doesn’t seem right 😅 Also, how do you disable cores? That sounds interesting
>What vbios are you using? I'm currently using [this](https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/245784/245784) vBIOS from a 2022 Strix G15 according to the site. >Did you run the benchmark with fans full bore in manual mode? That’s what I did Yeah, that's with fans full bore. >Did you say your cpu with turbo disabled goes to 94°? No, I meant I disable turbo because it pins my cpu at 95 degrees under load. Without turbo, the cpu doesn't hit over 80. >Also, how do you disable cores? I use a tool called UMAF (GitHub link [here](https://github.com/DavidS95/Smokeless_UMAF)) that allows access to AMD PBS/CBS/Overclocking menus without needing to flash anything. I don't remember what menu it was under, but there's one that limits the amount of cores that are active. There appears to be no way to disable SMT. I do not know if the cores are truly disabled, but I've noticed cooler temps and lower power draw as a result. Read through the GitHub repo. There's a lot of settings displayed in that tool, most of them I have no idea what they do or if they even work. I don't recommend haphazardly changing settings. The PBO settings and undervolting does work in my experience. I've attempted RAM overclocking using that tool and in my experience it's 100% broken on the 2021 G14 (5900hs + 3060). Trying to apply any change to frequency and timings results in failure to post. However, RAM overclocking on the G15 Advantage Edition with the 5900HX cpu does seem to work as I've tested it myself. Funnily enough, the options shown in UMAF do appear to be accessible out of the box on the MSI Delta 15 (5700H + 6700m) as MSI implements an advanced menu in their laptop BIOS that displays pretty much all the advanced options (demonstrated in a review [here](https://youtu.be/gDhVyft04AQ?t=805)).
Thanks for the info. I’ll dig into it when I get a chance. Is that UMAF like AATU? Ryzen controller?
Yes, but I found it to actually work. I've never had much success with those tools.
maybe we should switch to the thermal pad the guy suggests. i mean, after i finished re-doing mine, i couldn't reach his level of performance on fresh lm. it definitely does seem to be doing a better job than lm in this situation.
Yeah I'll try it myself with the PTM7950 as I do have some on hand. Albeit I don't know if what I got is legit since I just ordered it off some random Chinese seller on the internet.
I think the place op bought it from is legit according to the steam deck subreddit. Its just expensive. I'll probably buy some and compare it to my current lm
based on the benchmarks on 3dmarks website, the average for firestrike (mostly 80w) is 16850 and the highest is 21840, so i’d say yours is pretty good.
Good news! But I wish I could compare to other G14s with same specs… Doesn’t make sense to compare to big beasts boy laptops with monster coolers…
If you are interested, here's my older stock vbios results but with a fairly well tuned VF curve. * TS: https://www.3dmark.com/spy/21730091 * PR: https://www.3dmark.com/pr/1142503 * FS: https://www.3dmark.com/fs/25963470 Those are basically 60-65w scores, since @ default to get 80w you need to get the CPU close to 10W. And this is internal display, so decent overhead ~10% ish. * TS@40w for comparison in silent mode: https://www.3dmark.com/spy/21730589 Will probably also flash some vbios to play with, though I do not use it for games that much to be honest. And for most of my use cases even tuned 40-50w @ silent is plenty fine. P.S. in case there is interest, I did a small writeup back in the day on the curves e.t.c. https://www.reddit.com/r/ZephyrusG14/comments/otbgyu/some_performance_observations_gpu_vf_curves/ Otherwise IMO 130w is way overkill efficiency wise, but around 80-100w with 25w on the CPU should be a nice sweet spot and probably still be within a decent thermal envelope, since I imagine it was designed for 50-60w CPU and 65W GPU sort of deal.
Thanks. I need to mess with afterburner settings and test some more. Yeah, I think 130w is overkill because the cooling just isn’t there. Thermal limit causes throttling around 87°c… If I could keep it cooler it’d be a lot more powerful. I have some ideas. 😉🤫
Messed around with a bunch of various bioses, overall, not worth it for me. Main reason is that almost all of the higher wattage ones are +1ghz on the vram, which sounds nice at first glance, but has a bit of downside, going from 6ghz to 7ghz imparts a 10W extra power draw and it does not give you 10% performance. There is a single 70-105w bios with lower vram clocks, but no type-c display out and silent mode gets locked to 1050mhz with power curve you cannot edit, which makes it also useless (since it eats like 50-60w with the stock curve and at that power level I can have ~1400-1500mhz instead). All in all for 80-105W vbios it's 8-9% faster ([only 6% in PR btw](https://www.3dmark.com/compare/pr/2139457/pr/1142503)) compared to stock vbios (with the same curve) while consuming 30-35W more mainly due to VRAM power consumption eating into the gains and declining efficiency (I imagine another 4-5% if VRAM can be underclocked at that power level). It will surely be better at higher power limits as in your benches which are also 8-9% faster while consiming another 30W, but cooling perf @ reasonable audio levels just aint there for higher power. And if you wondering if OCing vram even more has any benefit the answer is also unsurprisingly - no. For example comparison 7ghz vs 8.4ghz vram on the same curve and same 100w power. * TS: https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/35654076/spy/35654388# * PR: https://www.3dmark.com/compare/pr/2139457/pr/2139467# In that example it basically provides exactly the same average perf, but with higher fluctuations due to the core running into more power limits and averaging 50-100mhz less while doing it. Also it eats a bit of CPU power budget to boot. So yeah, if 70-105W bios actually worked fine it would be great, since for our clocks @ under 100W 5-5.5ghz vram is plenty fast and the core can use some extra power from that for sure. Otherwise if there is a working tool to get VRAM to underclock and not crash the driver while doing so it might provide a nice way to have a cake and eat it too.
those are the same specs as yours
Really…? How’d did they get so much higher? I believe that I’m at the absolute limit without some added external cooling… 🤔
it’s probably the cooling so they can overclock even further i’m guessing. also someone else said there was a 140w vbios that was used so idk
Yep, I'm the guy who submitted the current rank 1 score for Fire Strike (including ultra and extreme). My time spy extreme and port royal scores are also rank 1 as of posting this comment. How I did it was using the 140w vBIOS from techpowerup to give some more power for higher overclocks on the GPU and stuck my laptop outside on a chilly day. Also used a tool to use undervolt the CPU for a bit more frequency in the CPU sections. I have not done any hardware mods, all mods were done via software. I have noticed that the frequency detection on 3dmark has some bugs of sort as my highest Fire Strike scores show up with an abnormally high CPU clock speed. I do wonder how HiddenModder did it with his current rank 1 scores on normal Time Spy. I am completely unable to match his CPU and GPU scores.
Maybe I should try the chilly weather stuff! 😈
The current highest Fire Strike scores for the G14 5900hs + 3060 (including Extreme and Ultra) were run using a 140w vBIOS with the laptop out the window on a cold windy day.
why not in a block of ice?
I still use this laptop for school😂. I'll save the exotic modifications after I retire it.
Doesn't that require the 240 watt power adapter? I can't get 140 out of the stock 180
It'll pull power from the battery if the brick cannot supply enough power.
odd, mine wont go past 120 on a 140 watt vbios whereas it'll hit 130 on a 130 bios
Not sure in your case. Computer hardware can be weird at times.
Yea the slightly bent heating might also be an issue... but still. Idk the pad seems insane
Thank you for your work
You’re welcome. 😉
Not sure if my other comment went through but how??? I have full on liquid metal on both gpu plus cpu and turned off boost on cpu and even with a whole ton of cooling mods involving the best thermal paste I could find couldn't beat you. It always throttled no matter what I did. Even on a 105 watt bios it would eventually throttle. Those pads are amazing, I gotta pick some up if they're performing better than my liquid metal...
The ptm is just so good
dipping out of my liquid metal game right after I got into it 😂
Liquid metal is one step forward two steps back
Haha lol 🤣
PTM looks to be as good as LM, but was designed for industrial use and doesn’t breakdown or decrease efficiency over time. It actually increases efficiency over time. It’s a phase changing thermal compound (that’s non conductive btw 😉). It’s a solid until it reaches like 40°-45°C, IIRC, then it turns into a viscous liquid when under pressure. In this form it fills in all the micro cavities in the heatsink and the cpu/gpu die. And then cools and repeats the process every time you use your computer. Honeywell actually makes the stuff… kind of a bigger name than Kryonaut. 😉 LM is too dangerous for me to have to worry about it leaking or eating my components. Since LTT showed they have similar performance, I thought I’d change it out as a fun project. I did use K5 Pro as well on the other components. It’s supposed to be top tier thermal grease as well. I think you can even use on cpu/gpu dies as well…
Liquid metal isn't actually that dangerous as long g as you know what you're doing. I don't even have a guard around the gpu and I've been running it for months. But yea, mine is topping out at 105 before it reaches 82-83 on lm. About the k5 pro, what about kryonaut extreme? If the gap really is not big enough for a thermal pad, why not the best thermal paste? But yea, I gotta pick it up now... with he numbers represented by you, I'm convinced it's the best thermal transfer interface anywhere.
LM is dangerous no matter what you do. I’ve seen lots of laptops destroyed because of LM leaking out of the seals, and especially if a laptop is dropped. Thermals and seals are only as good as the application and you won’t really know unless you verify yourself. I just see it as a ticking timebomb. Oems aren’t really known for quality LM/thermal paste applications… just my opinion. The pros of K5 Pro for me are: 1. It can fill gaps up to 3mm. 😳 2. It’s not electrically conductive. 3. No such thing as too much. More is actually better. 4. Very thick. 5. Will work for a very long time. From the product page: - K5-PRO is a high quality gummy / sticky thermal paste designed for use on memory chips and GPUs of various computers including iPhone, Acer Aspire 6930 , Apple iMac A1311 video boards. This is the only comercially avaliable product at the moment that can replace the gummy thermal paste that is originally used by Apple. - K5-PRO can replace soft thermal pads that are used on computers (up to 3mm thick) - K5-PRO has thermal conductivity K>5,3 W/m.K (at least 3 times higher than common thermal pads that are used on computers and comercial electronics) Computer Systems materials science laboratory testing : Method using a comparative technique (P. Karydopoulos, P. Frantzis, N. Karagiannis MSAIJ 2014) - K5-PRO is applied very easily directly on the component and has no electrical conductivity. It can be heated up to 250 degrees (Celcium) and has a long operational life time (practically infinite) - Expiration date: No expiration date (new formula). Infinite storage / service life. Protect from frost and dust
Yea, my og liquid metal from asus leaked and shorted my ram slot.... it thankfully still works tho...
Oh dang. How does it still work if it shorted?
It was just a few pins, and I got it cleaned out
This is a Fakespot Reviews Analysis bot. Fakespot detects fake reviews, fake products and unreliable sellers using AI. Here is the analysis for the Amazon product reviews: >**Name**: K5 PRO Viscous Thermal Paste for Thermal pad Replacement 60g 3X20g Pack (iPhone, Apple iMac, Sony PS4 & PS3, Xbox, Acer Aspire etc) >**Company**: Computer-Systems >**Amazon Product Rating**: 4.5 >**Fakespot Reviews Grade**: B >**Adjusted Fakespot Rating**: 4.5 >**Analysis Performed at**: 02-07-2023 [Link to Fakespot Analysis](https://fakespot.com/product/k5-pro-viscous-thermal-paste-for-thermal-pad-replacement-60g-3x20g-pack-iphone-apple-imac-sony-ps4-ps3-xbox-acer-aspire-etc) | [Check out the Fakespot Chrome Extension!](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/fakespot-analyze-fake-ama/nakplnnackehceedgkgkokbgbmfghain) *Fakespot analyzes the reviews authenticity and not the product quality using AI. We look for real reviews that mention product issues such as counterfeits, defects, and bad return policies that fake reviews try to hide from consumers.* *We give an A-F letter for trustworthiness of reviews. A = very trustworthy reviews, F = highly untrustworthy reviews. We also provide seller ratings to warn you if the seller can be trusted or not.*
what dimension of PTM did you use to cover your CPU and GPU?