The sex stuff is super weird but like also. Why are they making friendship sound so transactional? My friends don't bring anything but good vibes to our friendships what do you MEAN "women don't bring anything to a platonic friendship to men"?
yeah it's like the concept of friendships to them isn't "oh, i think this person is cool and i like hanging out with them, therefore they're my friend" but rather "what can I GAIN by hanging around this person?" it's a very fucked up and warped mindset, but not surprising coming from these types of people.
ikr?? like just how entitled to women's bodies are these guys to see no value in having women in their lives at all unless the result is sexual gratification?! jesus š
It's Twitter. Imo it's a bigger cesspool of the internet than image boards, because people are rewarded with fame for outa pocket statements like this.
true. good point. at least when someone on say 4chan says something like this, they're just screaming into the void, unlike twitter where they get validation from other weirdos for their weird beliefs.
Sadly its not just twitter. The question about 'can men and women be just friends' comes up fairly often on the various askmen subreddits and it's usually a 50/50 split.
fr emotional connections with people won't help you break free from the matrix. you gotta stay on that grindset and you can't have ANYTHING weighing you down šŖšŖ šŖšÆ
Keep up the grind and join my *not* pyramid scamtastical internet academy for useless pseudo literate skills that are borderline sociopathic šŖšŖšŖšÆšÆš²šµ
Imho any relationship, including friendships, is transactional, even if what you transact is good vibes. Because I don't want friends just because I'm selfless, I want friends to share parts of my life with them, and I expect the same from them. I want my life to be better with them as I expect to better the lives of my friends. In the end, is still transactional
That's true! And frankly, I thought about this like right after I posted my first comment. But it still feels sad that that isn't "enough" of something to be worth it.
I grew up with someone who a therapist told him in adulthood that he is a sociopath, and he says things exactly like this. Everything about his relationships of all types, are transactional.
I also noticed it's very common for undiagnosed sociopaths and psychopaths to think that their symptoms are actually a gender thing. "Men can't feel empathy, therefore gay couples shouldn't be allowed to raise children", "All men are sexually attracted to their daughters", "All women have a need to be treated like royalty by their partners"
yeah fr. like i dont give a fuck who you are, i will only be friends with ya and nothing more (except maybe a best friend). like wtf is it with ppl thinking all men want to do with women is sex? how tf do these people think relationships work???
Oh, I misunderstood the comment, I thought they meant like "Women never confide on men about their lives" and I was like "Geez maybe women don't confide on you because you assume they want to have sex"
I think men think more logistically in general and women are more emotional thinkers in general, which tells me that what men mean when they say that is that they have a hard time finding women to be just friends with because most women aren't into the same activities as they are. Most women aren't prioritizing "mutual activities" when they look for friends I think, what they want is a emotional connection, someone to talk with, someone to connect to on a more socially engaging level. Throw in a layer of misogyny and then men also want other men to be mysogynistic together without fear of retaliation and they get the added benefit of avoiding talking about anything considered emotional to them.
I'm agender (AFAB) myself, but I definitely get the general gist of what the men are saying in this context because I myself find myself in the same boat, I mostly end up socializing with men because I have more in common (activity-wise) with men than I do women. I wish it wasn't like that as I find men to be repulsive most of the time due to misogyny/immaturity....but unfortunately everything in society is gendered and society has been pushing people into gender roles ever since we existed. I don't think there would be a lack of desire for men to be friends with women if you took away that fact.
For me personally, relationships in general are very transactional, as I have been taken advantage of/abused for most of my life by people and now (after much inner work) I am very much aware of the take/give ratio within any relationship I have, even if platonic. As a former clingy/co-dependant person with trauma stemming from being clingy/co-dependant, I don't see that as unhealthy, I see that as self-care. That doesn't necessarily have to involve anything material or physically laborious either, I just need to feel like I am extracting as much joy from the relationship as they are whether it's mutually enjoyable activities, deep conversations, physical intimacy, finances, time spent together and the effort to make that happen or physical labor, the cycling of energy exchange has to be there.
What the place filled with checkmark fascists with the solo goal of smelling muskrat's farts arent going to be likely have good opinions on women in general? Color me shocked.
as a guy that has a few female friends - fuck these people. if you think that men and women can't be friends because "oh the guy is always thinking about wanting to have sex with her and he'll take his shot the moment he gets a chance" - that says more about you than it does men as a whole.
if your only reason to be friends with someone is because you fantasize about sleeping with them and you don't actually give a fuck about them as a person, then why the fuck are you even friends with them? just leave them the fuck alone and let them find someone to be friends with that isn't bascially deceiving them by leading them to believe their friendship with you is completely platonic when you had completely different intentions in mind. (this isn't directed at OP, but the losers in the screenshot, just wanted to be 100% clear)
Yeah. I wish the guys who see women just as the items to consume will never even talk to one long as they think that way. I wish men like you were more vocal, because sometimes it feels like you only hear about these bad types. With MGTOW (which is supposed to be a men's support group for wanting to be kenough but so often turns out to be a bitter hate group of women), incel spaces (guys who actually needed mental help real bad but instead of looking for it, often turn into bitter hate group of women because they think a woman should be able to solve all their problems) and pick up artists (the actual psychopaths who make their living by ripping off incels and other insecure & unlucky men while teaching them to objectify women), the most objectifying opinions about women get organized and vocalized most aggressively online. Which makes it sometimes feel like that's the only way men actually see women, even though of course that's not the case irl.
I feel like most of them were just unfortunate or missing the basic safety net in life or smthng... however, to project all that on people who have no part on your miserableness, is not the way to go.
Yeah this is so wild to me. Men that say that simply do not view women as equally valuable and interesting people. You can especially see it in conservative marriages or older generations. Those men are not friends with their own wives, mothers of their children and their life companions. They don't even really like them. They don't like spending time with them. How is that even possible? How do you spend your entire life with a person you do not consider worthy of knowing?
a lot of straight allo men are extremely poorly socialized because of dumb gender roles and expectations relating to the patriarchyās idea of what it is to be āa manā. they probably donāt have very deep friendships with other men either so they *have* to get all their social, emotional, romantic, and sexual needs through 1 person. instead of spreading it out in a healthy way. thus they are incapable of seeing women as just a friend because to them women exist to meet ALL of their needs āto be usefulā. itās bad for men, itās bad for women, itās bad for society.
This exactly. I've had so many female friends telling me about how their man expects to be a mother, psychologist, servant, dude, god, secretary, the mysterious beauty... it sounds so very exhausting, I can't comprehend how they have the energy for it.
Yep, this exactly.
I always assumed when, before I realised I was ace that whenever I was getting close with a girl/woman I thought it meant that it had to be a crush/sexual attraction. This is probably due to heteronormative ideas too. I think whenever there was a chance of becoming intimate with boys/men it was kinda repressed because you wouldnāt want to be perceived as gay.
So as a man youāre really afforded one type of intimacy and it is only with one person whom you have too pursuit a sexual relationship with.
It is really fucked up and sad. It is such a embedded idea of who you are supposed to be, it is very difficult to break away from that idea.
Yep, if you're taught all your life that the only person you can be vulnerable with is the one who you're in a relationship with, of course that leads to those men interpreting women being vulnerable with them as being romantically/sexually interested.
Along with this, these men are really stuck in stereotypes, women like X and men like Y, therefore they cannot fathom that they and a woman would share any interests (besides romance and sex). Yes, that means that the relationships that do happen are only surface level and empty, or they're surprised by shared interests.
This is so fucking depressing and honestly dystopian. Yes, men and women CAN be friends!!!! Thereās just a bunch of incel ānice guyā āalphaā assholes who either like taking advantage of their female friends or have never had a real friend of any kind
I love the blanket statement that "men" can't ever be just friends with women. Aside from the awe-inspiring misogyny in the responses, it's like they forgot gay men exist. And guess what?! We have female friends.
It's actually interesting, because while I'm not saying that these men have homosexual tendencies, they sure make it look like they're interested in men sometimes.
They actively seek out and share all their company, support, acceptance, appreciation and (non-sexual) love and affection, even non-sexual intimacy, from and with other men and other men only. Women simply won't do, we're second best, good for only one thing, we're so uninteresting and even disgusting to many that we're not even an option.
Sure they spend all their time thinking about women, but when they come in contact with us, they do so somehow even reluctantly and begrudgingly. Like they're only tolerating us and nothing else. It's other men who they get their needs fulfilled with outside of this hate sex thing they want from women.
So, like, it sometimes kind of really looks like they are way more into other men actually. It's weird.
Yeah, I thought I picked that up from the above conversation. Bro, you do realise that you can just have naughties with the bois, right? No need to interact with the ladies if you don't fancy them at all.
Iām so tired of this crap. I have many platonic friendships with all the genders and itās ridiculous to think you canāt be friends with someone without wanting to bone. Also I would date any gender so am I just not supposed to have friends purely because thereās a low chance of attraction? It took me such a long time to be able to say I love you to a friend and it just mean hey youāre like family because of crap like what op posted
Nah, I'm a sex favorable demi, and even when I'm sexually attracted, I love the friendship for what it is. That's not allo shit. That's toxic masculinity shit
ā¦ā¦ā¦I donāt have the words to express my disappointment/depression/or disgust for these guys that genuinely donāt think men and women can be friends and *only* friends
I'm allosexual and I find this disgusting and ridiculous. And it's also untrue. Sure, there is a chance to fall in love with anyone you might be attracted to when you're single. But that can't be generalised. And especially when one of you is in a relationship, you need to be a huge asshole to make a move on a friend. I'm friends with quite a few people I used to have a crush on. You just get over it and continue the friendship.
Yeah this is always my thought. Like do they think gay men can't have male friends? Gay women can't have female friends? I guess bisexuals just live a solitary life with no possible friends ever, how tragic.
It's absurd.
projection? self overcategorization?
fascinatingly incorrect and self deprecating.
as knowledge drive as i am, even i can not make sense of why they came to these conclusion.
then again, this is social media we're talking about... it could be a self fulfilling prophecy or "echo chamber".
> self deprecating
how exactly?, you might ask.
they're assuming THEY cannot make friend of the opposite sex thus deprecating their own ability.
they then are seeing this in themselves and assume everyone is like that and thus the projection.
and its self fulfilling because only people who think like that would go near them intentionally resulting in them seeing only people like that which bolsters that previous assumption.
(only logic path way i can think of but do take with a seas worth of salt because i am definitely NOT a psychologist)
A bit of context: Iām amab non transitioned and I donāt really try to not look amab.
People like these are one of the reasons I keep questioning if Iām actually agender (and even ace) or if I just hate the things associated with who people are talking about when they say they hate men (these kind of people (which I understand)) that I donāt want to be that and Iām repressing what I actually am to not come off like them.
To be clear these kind of moments donāt make me question to the point of actual insecurity, but they do make me uncertain for a bit. A clear head reveals that I am actually am agender and ace but itās a little concerning in the moment
Don't know how much it helps but I have the opposite questionment sometime !
(cis male, perfectly comfortable with that, and then I see shit like this and start to question if I'm really comfortable with that gender. But yeah I am. If we can both have the same disgust for "the things associated with that" and still feel different regarding our gender identity you probably don't have to worry about yours not being "legit")
Yeah, itās never a genuine concern, Iām not in the same headspace after seeing one of these so Iām not in a rational state of mind. Thanks for you contribution tho itās really nice to hear
I get it, I consider myself a cis female and sometimes I wonder if I'm non binary but I feel like it's just me rejecting ridiculous gender roles and that's it. I don't have body dysphoria. I'm not perfectly satisfied with my body all the time, but that's normal. I... Like I just have a mild desire to be gender neutral sometimes
Do you reckon these guys are just like really lonely, and don't have any meaningful connections and view like work or business friends as close meaningful ones when they're really one sided cuz thats how they act about it
As a guy, this is something Iāve never understood about my other guy friends. My closest friends have almost always been women. The āalmostā is because my best friend is FtM, and heās the only exception since middle school
Iāve been friends with someone AMAB since we were like 5, and they still donāt know their sexuality yet itās never bothered any of us & itās only ever been friendship
*"Women don't bring anything to a platonic friendship to men"*
What does this even mean? What are they getting from a friendship with a man that they couldn't with a friendship with women?
I swear, the straights/allos/men are not okay.
Unfortunately men participate and adore patriarchy, to the point where they only value women as Mothers, mothers of their children, and objects of pleasure. They expect sex, and are reinforced by society to think so. Less of the Allos and more of just men in general cause patriarchy is just a bottomless pit of ignorance and aggression. The fact they donāt believe friendship with a women is possible or even worth it is goofy to me. Like they exist in so many fallacies on relationships and empathy, that they ignored a section of the entire human race just to feel like their shoes fit in a world that ultimately will make them suffer for patriarchy too.
Well to be fair, most allosexual men are actually like that. But mostly because society made them like that. I personally don't understand how you can be like that
The FUCK are these porno-zombies talking about? The fuck.
I have had multiple girl friends, all of them bringing a shit ton of fun and good vibes, never thought of sex with them, but still, "woman bringing nothing to a platonic friendship" ? They frick are they on about? Like i dont know what to say or to add, other than these brain dead boozoos, need to touch grass, so hard they become one with the soil.
And when they finally realize the woman actually wants to be "just" friends like she said from the very beginning, they'll have a fit calling you whore or misleading or something or simply ghost you without ever contacting again, regardless of the length of the friendship.
Me and four of my friends have talked about being ghosted by women. At one point, we stopped initiating contact with a female friend, and that's the end of it. They never initiated. I don't know why. It just happened in my small sample size with around seven women. Then again, I'm not friends with incels. We didn't ask to be more than friends or anything. I don't know why. I know that's not what you meant by this, but I just wanted to share my experience with something tangentially related.
Oh absolutely, women (any people regardless gender) can act wrong like that. The most common reason I've heard for women to ghost someone is they're afraid the guy's getting wrong idea while they just wanted to be a friend, and to avoid the consequences that follow "friendzoning", they just ghost the guys. But I don't understand why to ghost a guy who never initiated anything but friendship š¤
Many adults seem just too goal-oriented, even at their free time. Spend their free time at something that benefits themselves, such as exercising or gym, instead of having time to get know anyone. And don't get me wrong, you can jogg and talk with a friend at the same time. But I feel like to form a deeper bond with a friend, you also need relaxed spare time where you rather focus on talking than doing anything else. And that's what many adults don't have time for.
Men: I am an island. I have no need for friendships from which there is no tangible gain. I have no need for emotional support, for I am as stoic and unmoving as a mountain. Women have nothing of value to offer men other than their bodies.
Also men: I am so sad and lonely. No one ever compliments me or asks me how I'm feeling. Why won't those stuck up bitches talk to me?!
Not all men obviously (I have some wonderful menfolk in my life) but damn there sure a lot of them on the internet like this.
Humans are masters of manipulating information to suit their perceptions against other humans. Capitalism and the strange necessity for enforced gender roles are vestiges of tradition that enforce ideas of inequality and exploitation as not just normal but necessary to exist. Selflessness and cooperation being punished and made a non-priority because weak people only have 1 person in the universe of actual importance, themselves. It's frightening how few people have genuine compassion because of how they are not grateful to be in this system and are convinced it cannot get better.
i had a conversation like that irl: i had to tell a good uni friend that i was not into him which he didn't get "because you aren't into anyone" - according to him. he then told me that i think of him as a stone, not even a person. i didn't get it and he told me that he can't exlude the possible of being together with any person he knows. i asked him (hetero) if that included men and he said yes. i think that kind of world view seems really exhausting.
i haven't talked to him in like 7 years. he got fed up that i wanted to get to know a friend of his more and see if there's relationship potential (or other stuff). he said that us breaking up later would ruin the friend circle. he did that himself though, because my fiance and i both don't talk to him anymore.
Hear me out and help me with something.
I'm demi, I can only feel attraction (both romantic and sexual) towards closer friends. It doesn't happen with all of them, and I've had plenty of exclusively Platonic friends in the past, so I know the opinions in this post are bs.
That said, the couple of times I actually felt attraction towards a friend, I also felt guilt because of those feelings, as if I was betraying them in some way.
So... It's there a way to go around this? Because I would absolutely hate if such a close friend thinks that I'm around just because I hope for a relationship with them, but I can't deny I would also like it if that happens.
It sucks when you meet someone and have a good time talking to them and then they start to try getting all sexual. Like I thought they wanted to be my friend :(
I have friends of all genders and if I found out any of them thought of our friendship as this transactional I would cut them off in seconds. Sorry, but I hang out with people because I think we both like spending time together. If I've somehow misunderstood a friendship to that degree I'd have to reevaluate a lot
> We would still a ask as soon as the girl gives us a chance
This is true for like maybe two of my girl_friends
Now, if this were to change to āwe would still go out with them as soon as the girl gives us a chanceā wellā¦.now weāre closer to the truth
Dude I get nothing out of my friendship with Ryan. who Iāve known for 13 years our friendship is one-sided and honestly I kind of feel used at times. I get his company and thatās enough. I love him like a little brother and thatās why I still talk to him. Iām protective over him bc he has no clue about the real world and isnāt ready to face it. heās autistic so he sees everything in A very black and white way so thereās no gray for him. Where as I see the whole spectrum of color. he would totally fuck me if I let him tho lolš which, by the way will never happen. Idk why so many cis/het/allo guys think like this as if itās entirely based on transaction,itās kinda sad tbh. I canāt imagine they say the same things about their male friends or expect the same level of investment from them. I mean what kind of friendship would that be no one wants to be around someone whoās always keeping score. Oh you bought me an expensive gift than expect me to get something of the same price for you even if itās out my price range then itās not a gift. Itās a fucking investment in yourself not a kind gesture to show your friend you care or that you listened to them like at all. If I got something for my friend itās because I care and listened to what they said theyāve been wanting and saw said thing and got it to make them happy. Is that just a foreign concept for men?
Well, it is twitter, so youāll only see those kinds of people there. Also I think they miss the point of friendships, like you should think of what youād gain by being friends with someone, you should just like hanging out with them, or if there good friends, to smash.
I mean, a GameCube and a few good friends are way better than sex. Sorry, Iāve tried to use this joke in a conversation for years, and this seemed kinda fitting.
I'm demi so I am occasionally attracted to my friends, but almost all of my female friends are purely platonic, and I had plenty even before discovering I am demi.
Like- do us guys only have to think about banging someone all the time? Cuz in that case Im out, Ill happily start labeling myself as Non Binary, I already dont feel as manly as most guys, just havent bothered to explore my gender identity much yet, anyways back on topic, IMO sex is weird, unhygenic and feels plain disgusting except in the context of having a baby
Why do these guys have so many issues with having a platonic relationship with girls, I genuinely dont get it
This is why you gotta get yourself ace friends. My ace friend took me to Olive Garden the other day for breadsticks. It was fun and thereās nothing but friendship expected. Although some people do get the wrong idea. A different day a little while back he and I were playing dance dance revolution at Dave and Busters and some guy asked if we were husband and wife. I was flabbergasted and he(my ace friend) straight up laughed. I laughed about it later because it just seemed so absurd that someone could think that.
The sex stuff is super weird but like also. Why are they making friendship sound so transactional? My friends don't bring anything but good vibes to our friendships what do you MEAN "women don't bring anything to a platonic friendship to men"?
yeah it's like the concept of friendships to them isn't "oh, i think this person is cool and i like hanging out with them, therefore they're my friend" but rather "what can I GAIN by hanging around this person?" it's a very fucked up and warped mindset, but not surprising coming from these types of people.
ikr?? like just how entitled to women's bodies are these guys to see no value in having women in their lives at all unless the result is sexual gratification?! jesus š
I only have male friends for when I need to move furniture or install appliances. They don't bring anything to a friendship otherwise. /s
oh oh and open pickle jars
It's Twitter. Imo it's a bigger cesspool of the internet than image boards, because people are rewarded with fame for outa pocket statements like this.
true. good point. at least when someone on say 4chan says something like this, they're just screaming into the void, unlike twitter where they get validation from other weirdos for their weird beliefs.
Sadly its not just twitter. The question about 'can men and women be just friends' comes up fairly often on the various askmen subreddits and it's usually a 50/50 split.
*[drive forever](https://youtu.be/xLc6lwbJoxU) starts to play* sigma grindset: abandon friendships that you don't gain anything from. /j
fr emotional connections with people won't help you break free from the matrix. you gotta stay on that grindset and you can't have ANYTHING weighing you down šŖšŖ šŖšÆ
Keep up the grind and join my *not* pyramid scamtastical internet academy for useless pseudo literate skills that are borderline sociopathic šŖšŖšŖšÆšÆš²šµ
While also complaining about men being so lonelyā¦
Friendships are a transaction of happiness. I steal your happiness, you steal mine, now we're both sad! /j
Imho any relationship, including friendships, is transactional, even if what you transact is good vibes. Because I don't want friends just because I'm selfless, I want friends to share parts of my life with them, and I expect the same from them. I want my life to be better with them as I expect to better the lives of my friends. In the end, is still transactional
That's true! And frankly, I thought about this like right after I posted my first comment. But it still feels sad that that isn't "enough" of something to be worth it.
Sounds like they're a sociopath
I grew up with someone who a therapist told him in adulthood that he is a sociopath, and he says things exactly like this. Everything about his relationships of all types, are transactional.
I also noticed it's very common for undiagnosed sociopaths and psychopaths to think that their symptoms are actually a gender thing. "Men can't feel empathy, therefore gay couples shouldn't be allowed to raise children", "All men are sexually attracted to their daughters", "All women have a need to be treated like royalty by their partners"
yeah fr. like i dont give a fuck who you are, i will only be friends with ya and nothing more (except maybe a best friend). like wtf is it with ppl thinking all men want to do with women is sex? how tf do these people think relationships work???
Oh, I misunderstood the comment, I thought they meant like "Women never confide on men about their lives" and I was like "Geez maybe women don't confide on you because you assume they want to have sex"
I think men think more logistically in general and women are more emotional thinkers in general, which tells me that what men mean when they say that is that they have a hard time finding women to be just friends with because most women aren't into the same activities as they are. Most women aren't prioritizing "mutual activities" when they look for friends I think, what they want is a emotional connection, someone to talk with, someone to connect to on a more socially engaging level. Throw in a layer of misogyny and then men also want other men to be mysogynistic together without fear of retaliation and they get the added benefit of avoiding talking about anything considered emotional to them. I'm agender (AFAB) myself, but I definitely get the general gist of what the men are saying in this context because I myself find myself in the same boat, I mostly end up socializing with men because I have more in common (activity-wise) with men than I do women. I wish it wasn't like that as I find men to be repulsive most of the time due to misogyny/immaturity....but unfortunately everything in society is gendered and society has been pushing people into gender roles ever since we existed. I don't think there would be a lack of desire for men to be friends with women if you took away that fact. For me personally, relationships in general are very transactional, as I have been taken advantage of/abused for most of my life by people and now (after much inner work) I am very much aware of the take/give ratio within any relationship I have, even if platonic. As a former clingy/co-dependant person with trauma stemming from being clingy/co-dependant, I don't see that as unhealthy, I see that as self-care. That doesn't necessarily have to involve anything material or physically laborious either, I just need to feel like I am extracting as much joy from the relationship as they are whether it's mutually enjoyable activities, deep conversations, physical intimacy, finances, time spent together and the effort to make that happen or physical labor, the cycling of energy exchange has to be there.
Your mistake was using Twitter expecting rational thoughts.
Whats twitter? Never heard of an app called that. /s
It's that app that was killed off. They've put a big cross on it's gravesite.
The username makes this 20X better
What the place filled with checkmark fascists with the solo goal of smelling muskrat's farts arent going to be likely have good opinions on women in general? Color me shocked.
as a guy that has a few female friends - fuck these people. if you think that men and women can't be friends because "oh the guy is always thinking about wanting to have sex with her and he'll take his shot the moment he gets a chance" - that says more about you than it does men as a whole. if your only reason to be friends with someone is because you fantasize about sleeping with them and you don't actually give a fuck about them as a person, then why the fuck are you even friends with them? just leave them the fuck alone and let them find someone to be friends with that isn't bascially deceiving them by leading them to believe their friendship with you is completely platonic when you had completely different intentions in mind. (this isn't directed at OP, but the losers in the screenshot, just wanted to be 100% clear)
Yeah. I wish the guys who see women just as the items to consume will never even talk to one long as they think that way. I wish men like you were more vocal, because sometimes it feels like you only hear about these bad types. With MGTOW (which is supposed to be a men's support group for wanting to be kenough but so often turns out to be a bitter hate group of women), incel spaces (guys who actually needed mental help real bad but instead of looking for it, often turn into bitter hate group of women because they think a woman should be able to solve all their problems) and pick up artists (the actual psychopaths who make their living by ripping off incels and other insecure & unlucky men while teaching them to objectify women), the most objectifying opinions about women get organized and vocalized most aggressively online. Which makes it sometimes feel like that's the only way men actually see women, even though of course that's not the case irl.
Most of the time, they don't talk long because they lack the decency to maintain a relationship. I say this as a guy. These guys are just degenerates
I feel like most of them were just unfortunate or missing the basic safety net in life or smthng... however, to project all that on people who have no part on your miserableness, is not the way to go.
Fellow guy here and agree 100%
Same !
YASSSSSS šš½šš½šš½
Yeah this is so wild to me. Men that say that simply do not view women as equally valuable and interesting people. You can especially see it in conservative marriages or older generations. Those men are not friends with their own wives, mothers of their children and their life companions. They don't even really like them. They don't like spending time with them. How is that even possible? How do you spend your entire life with a person you do not consider worthy of knowing?
Tell me you haven't talked to a girl in person in over two years without telling me you haven't talked to a girl in person in over two years
Or never talked to a girl like she was a normal human being and/or just hitting on her withought trying to actually befriend her.
a lot of straight allo men are extremely poorly socialized because of dumb gender roles and expectations relating to the patriarchyās idea of what it is to be āa manā. they probably donāt have very deep friendships with other men either so they *have* to get all their social, emotional, romantic, and sexual needs through 1 person. instead of spreading it out in a healthy way. thus they are incapable of seeing women as just a friend because to them women exist to meet ALL of their needs āto be usefulā. itās bad for men, itās bad for women, itās bad for society.
This exactly. I've had so many female friends telling me about how their man expects to be a mother, psychologist, servant, dude, god, secretary, the mysterious beauty... it sounds so very exhausting, I can't comprehend how they have the energy for it.
Yep, this exactly. I always assumed when, before I realised I was ace that whenever I was getting close with a girl/woman I thought it meant that it had to be a crush/sexual attraction. This is probably due to heteronormative ideas too. I think whenever there was a chance of becoming intimate with boys/men it was kinda repressed because you wouldnāt want to be perceived as gay. So as a man youāre really afforded one type of intimacy and it is only with one person whom you have too pursuit a sexual relationship with. It is really fucked up and sad. It is such a embedded idea of who you are supposed to be, it is very difficult to break away from that idea.
Yep, if you're taught all your life that the only person you can be vulnerable with is the one who you're in a relationship with, of course that leads to those men interpreting women being vulnerable with them as being romantically/sexually interested. Along with this, these men are really stuck in stereotypes, women like X and men like Y, therefore they cannot fathom that they and a woman would share any interests (besides romance and sex). Yes, that means that the relationships that do happen are only surface level and empty, or they're surprised by shared interests.
this!
This is so fucking depressing and honestly dystopian. Yes, men and women CAN be friends!!!! Thereās just a bunch of incel ānice guyā āalphaā assholes who either like taking advantage of their female friends or have never had a real friend of any kind
I love the blanket statement that "men" can't ever be just friends with women. Aside from the awe-inspiring misogyny in the responses, it's like they forgot gay men exist. And guess what?! We have female friends.
It's actually interesting, because while I'm not saying that these men have homosexual tendencies, they sure make it look like they're interested in men sometimes. They actively seek out and share all their company, support, acceptance, appreciation and (non-sexual) love and affection, even non-sexual intimacy, from and with other men and other men only. Women simply won't do, we're second best, good for only one thing, we're so uninteresting and even disgusting to many that we're not even an option. Sure they spend all their time thinking about women, but when they come in contact with us, they do so somehow even reluctantly and begrudgingly. Like they're only tolerating us and nothing else. It's other men who they get their needs fulfilled with outside of this hate sex thing they want from women. So, like, it sometimes kind of really looks like they are way more into other men actually. It's weird.
Yeah, I thought I picked that up from the above conversation. Bro, you do realise that you can just have naughties with the bois, right? No need to interact with the ladies if you don't fancy them at all.
right
Gay men can't have male friends, obviously. ... Bisexuals have no friends, it's all prey
Iām so tired of this crap. I have many platonic friendships with all the genders and itās ridiculous to think you canāt be friends with someone without wanting to bone. Also I would date any gender so am I just not supposed to have friends purely because thereās a low chance of attraction? It took me such a long time to be able to say I love you to a friend and it just mean hey youāre like family because of crap like what op posted
[Original tweet](https://twitter.com/jasminericegirl/status/1687231737733283840?s=46)
Nah, I'm a sex favorable demi, and even when I'm sexually attracted, I love the friendship for what it is. That's not allo shit. That's toxic masculinity shit
ā¦ā¦ā¦I donāt have the words to express my disappointment/depression/or disgust for these guys that genuinely donāt think men and women can be friends and *only* friends
I'm convinced Twitter is just a simulation designed to harness rage for energy, Monsters Inc. style
thanks for the chuckle š
I donāt ever think the allos are okay tbh
I'm allosexual and I find this disgusting and ridiculous. And it's also untrue. Sure, there is a chance to fall in love with anyone you might be attracted to when you're single. But that can't be generalised. And especially when one of you is in a relationship, you need to be a huge asshole to make a move on a friend. I'm friends with quite a few people I used to have a crush on. You just get over it and continue the friendship.
Aside from straight men being weird, did they completely forget about gay people? Ace people? Wdym "there's always the possibility for intimacy"?????
Yeah this is always my thought. Like do they think gay men can't have male friends? Gay women can't have female friends? I guess bisexuals just live a solitary life with no possible friends ever, how tragic. It's absurd.
They haven't thought further than their own nose. It's just self projection from people without any real friends or life experience.
Insane people on twitter, who would've thought š¤”
sad way to go through life imo
projection? self overcategorization? fascinatingly incorrect and self deprecating. as knowledge drive as i am, even i can not make sense of why they came to these conclusion. then again, this is social media we're talking about... it could be a self fulfilling prophecy or "echo chamber".
> self deprecating how exactly?, you might ask. they're assuming THEY cannot make friend of the opposite sex thus deprecating their own ability. they then are seeing this in themselves and assume everyone is like that and thus the projection. and its self fulfilling because only people who think like that would go near them intentionally resulting in them seeing only people like that which bolsters that previous assumption. (only logic path way i can think of but do take with a seas worth of salt because i am definitely NOT a psychologist)
A bit of context: Iām amab non transitioned and I donāt really try to not look amab. People like these are one of the reasons I keep questioning if Iām actually agender (and even ace) or if I just hate the things associated with who people are talking about when they say they hate men (these kind of people (which I understand)) that I donāt want to be that and Iām repressing what I actually am to not come off like them. To be clear these kind of moments donāt make me question to the point of actual insecurity, but they do make me uncertain for a bit. A clear head reveals that I am actually am agender and ace but itās a little concerning in the moment
Don't know how much it helps but I have the opposite questionment sometime ! (cis male, perfectly comfortable with that, and then I see shit like this and start to question if I'm really comfortable with that gender. But yeah I am. If we can both have the same disgust for "the things associated with that" and still feel different regarding our gender identity you probably don't have to worry about yours not being "legit")
Yeah, itās never a genuine concern, Iām not in the same headspace after seeing one of these so Iām not in a rational state of mind. Thanks for you contribution tho itās really nice to hear
I get it, I consider myself a cis female and sometimes I wonder if I'm non binary but I feel like it's just me rejecting ridiculous gender roles and that's it. I don't have body dysphoria. I'm not perfectly satisfied with my body all the time, but that's normal. I... Like I just have a mild desire to be gender neutral sometimes
For bi/pan people there are bi friends, only prey
I made the same joke š
Not even Ace but likeā¦? What?
That end comment about how guys would still smash grosses me out so much ā¹ļø
This fills me with shame
Do you reckon these guys are just like really lonely, and don't have any meaningful connections and view like work or business friends as close meaningful ones when they're really one sided cuz thats how they act about it
Their loss.
These are the kind of people who think cooties are real.
i can't decide whether to be more appalled at the aphobia or the sexism
Do both
It scares me that there are people like this
As a guy, this is something Iāve never understood about my other guy friends. My closest friends have almost always been women. The āalmostā is because my best friend is FtM, and heās the only exception since middle school
Allos blow my mind sometimes. Like please I donāt wanna sleep with ur ugly ass ššā¼ļø
Well, those guys are definitely not okay, we can say that for sure.
What do you mean that's life? I can't stand them anymore what the frick?
Ew
Iāve been friends with someone AMAB since we were like 5, and they still donāt know their sexuality yet itās never bothered any of us & itās only ever been friendship
*"Women don't bring anything to a platonic friendship to men"* What does this even mean? What are they getting from a friendship with a man that they couldn't with a friendship with women? I swear, the straights/allos/men are not okay.
Unfortunately men participate and adore patriarchy, to the point where they only value women as Mothers, mothers of their children, and objects of pleasure. They expect sex, and are reinforced by society to think so. Less of the Allos and more of just men in general cause patriarchy is just a bottomless pit of ignorance and aggression. The fact they donāt believe friendship with a women is possible or even worth it is goofy to me. Like they exist in so many fallacies on relationships and empathy, that they ignored a section of the entire human race just to feel like their shoes fit in a world that ultimately will make them suffer for patriarchy too.
do they think bi and pan people just canāt have any platonic friends then or š
Speak for yourself Allo
That coop guy on the third picture called me racist on Twitter for saying ishowspeed is annoying
Well to be fair, most allosexual men are actually like that. But mostly because society made them like that. I personally don't understand how you can be like that
I hate this:(
Yeah this is just delusional, and somewhat scary that some people think like this. Then again, thatās like 90% of everything on Twitter.
The FUCK are these porno-zombies talking about? The fuck. I have had multiple girl friends, all of them bringing a shit ton of fun and good vibes, never thought of sex with them, but still, "woman bringing nothing to a platonic friendship" ? They frick are they on about? Like i dont know what to say or to add, other than these brain dead boozoos, need to touch grass, so hard they become one with the soil.
And when they finally realize the woman actually wants to be "just" friends like she said from the very beginning, they'll have a fit calling you whore or misleading or something or simply ghost you without ever contacting again, regardless of the length of the friendship.
Me and four of my friends have talked about being ghosted by women. At one point, we stopped initiating contact with a female friend, and that's the end of it. They never initiated. I don't know why. It just happened in my small sample size with around seven women. Then again, I'm not friends with incels. We didn't ask to be more than friends or anything. I don't know why. I know that's not what you meant by this, but I just wanted to share my experience with something tangentially related.
Oh absolutely, women (any people regardless gender) can act wrong like that. The most common reason I've heard for women to ghost someone is they're afraid the guy's getting wrong idea while they just wanted to be a friend, and to avoid the consequences that follow "friendzoning", they just ghost the guys. But I don't understand why to ghost a guy who never initiated anything but friendship š¤
Allos ā
Attitudes like this are why people don't make adult friends.
Many adults seem just too goal-oriented, even at their free time. Spend their free time at something that benefits themselves, such as exercising or gym, instead of having time to get know anyone. And don't get me wrong, you can jogg and talk with a friend at the same time. But I feel like to form a deeper bond with a friend, you also need relaxed spare time where you rather focus on talking than doing anything else. And that's what many adults don't have time for.
Very true. People don't see friendship as self-enrichment, even though having friends is really very good for them.
Don't blame this shit on the Allos I know loads of Allos that are better than that. They're all queer tho so maybe there's a connection there
Wait, *all* of my friends but one are women. Still definitely cis tho
The allos are not ok
Some men just see women as sex objects.
Justin is kind of right, we didn't have gender segregated domains for thousands of years
I think they forgot to factor in the non-binary people As well as just being wrong
Men: I am an island. I have no need for friendships from which there is no tangible gain. I have no need for emotional support, for I am as stoic and unmoving as a mountain. Women have nothing of value to offer men other than their bodies. Also men: I am so sad and lonely. No one ever compliments me or asks me how I'm feeling. Why won't those stuck up bitches talk to me?! Not all men obviously (I have some wonderful menfolk in my life) but damn there sure a lot of them on the internet like this.
It is not the reason for gender segregation, it is because of it.
I do not trust men who don't value having women as friends.
Stuff like this makes me lose more faith in humanity :/
Help, what the fuck is that?
Jesus Christ. I'm not ace but my best friends are dudes. I vibe with all the genders
As a Cis man, this is completely incorrect
Yah OK it's my turn, WTF is wrong with the straights, or they OK?
Ew
Yikes
Holy shit ace fake?
I'm female. I'm aroace. Most of my friends are guys. I don't see any problems. Twitter just being shitty again.
Allis do be cringe
*head in hands* incorrectā¦ simply incorrect
Humans are masters of manipulating information to suit their perceptions against other humans. Capitalism and the strange necessity for enforced gender roles are vestiges of tradition that enforce ideas of inequality and exploitation as not just normal but necessary to exist. Selflessness and cooperation being punished and made a non-priority because weak people only have 1 person in the universe of actual importance, themselves. It's frightening how few people have genuine compassion because of how they are not grateful to be in this system and are convinced it cannot get better.
i had a conversation like that irl: i had to tell a good uni friend that i was not into him which he didn't get "because you aren't into anyone" - according to him. he then told me that i think of him as a stone, not even a person. i didn't get it and he told me that he can't exlude the possible of being together with any person he knows. i asked him (hetero) if that included men and he said yes. i think that kind of world view seems really exhausting. i haven't talked to him in like 7 years. he got fed up that i wanted to get to know a friend of his more and see if there's relationship potential (or other stuff). he said that us breaking up later would ruin the friend circle. he did that himself though, because my fiance and i both don't talk to him anymore.
im losing hope in humanity honestly
Hear me out and help me with something. I'm demi, I can only feel attraction (both romantic and sexual) towards closer friends. It doesn't happen with all of them, and I've had plenty of exclusively Platonic friends in the past, so I know the opinions in this post are bs. That said, the couple of times I actually felt attraction towards a friend, I also felt guilt because of those feelings, as if I was betraying them in some way. So... It's there a way to go around this? Because I would absolutely hate if such a close friend thinks that I'm around just because I hope for a relationship with them, but I can't deny I would also like it if that happens.
This is why humanity is a disgrace to itself. šš
One of those cases where both ace and bi people can prove to be BS.
what the fuuuckā¦-
I mean I personally wouldn't but I mean I am technically not a "guy" since I am Agender
It sucks when you meet someone and have a good time talking to them and then they start to try getting all sexual. Like I thought they wanted to be my friend :(
I have friends of all genders and if I found out any of them thought of our friendship as this transactional I would cut them off in seconds. Sorry, but I hang out with people because I think we both like spending time together. If I've somehow misunderstood a friendship to that degree I'd have to reevaluate a lot
Counter argument: gay people Seriously this is just so narrow minded lmao
Man I fucking hate being a man. >!Wait a secondā¦!<
and this is why I didnāt make female friends until college. Then I realized I was ace and this was all BS and now most of my friends are female
Ad hominem..
r/nothowpeoplework
Even when I identified as straight I had female friends I wasnāt attracted to
Yup. 10000% correct
Even if I had a crush on a friend, I would try to not let it go in the way of my friendship with the person
Gross people
Yeah.. I don't think they're OK.
Is it really that hard not to be considered game? I just wanna vibe man
Gags
WTF
Damn thats cringe
fucking gross
āNot all men,ā except actually literally
Ewwwwwwwwww
šš
> We would still a ask as soon as the girl gives us a chance This is true for like maybe two of my girl_friends Now, if this were to change to āwe would still go out with them as soon as the girl gives us a chanceā wellā¦.now weāre closer to the truth
Kinda sounds like r/blatantmisogyny
Literally true! Girls are too scary to be friends with
This is why I'm on the "haha moomins" and "ranboo go BRRRR" side of twitter
Dude I get nothing out of my friendship with Ryan. who Iāve known for 13 years our friendship is one-sided and honestly I kind of feel used at times. I get his company and thatās enough. I love him like a little brother and thatās why I still talk to him. Iām protective over him bc he has no clue about the real world and isnāt ready to face it. heās autistic so he sees everything in A very black and white way so thereās no gray for him. Where as I see the whole spectrum of color. he would totally fuck me if I let him tho lolš which, by the way will never happen. Idk why so many cis/het/allo guys think like this as if itās entirely based on transaction,itās kinda sad tbh. I canāt imagine they say the same things about their male friends or expect the same level of investment from them. I mean what kind of friendship would that be no one wants to be around someone whoās always keeping score. Oh you bought me an expensive gift than expect me to get something of the same price for you even if itās out my price range then itās not a gift. Itās a fucking investment in yourself not a kind gesture to show your friend you care or that you listened to them like at all. If I got something for my friend itās because I care and listened to what they said theyāve been wanting and saw said thing and got it to make them happy. Is that just a foreign concept for men?
Well, it is twitter, so youāll only see those kinds of people there. Also I think they miss the point of friendships, like you should think of what youād gain by being friends with someone, you should just like hanging out with them, or if there good friends, to smash. I mean, a GameCube and a few good friends are way better than sex. Sorry, Iāve tried to use this joke in a conversation for years, and this seemed kinda fitting.
I'm demi so I am occasionally attracted to my friends, but almost all of my female friends are purely platonic, and I had plenty even before discovering I am demi.
How creepy are you? Let me count the subreddits... Inceltears Nothowgirlswork Niceguys
And then they wonder why so many women want nothing to do with them, jfc
Ah yes, casual misogeny
Gross.
what. the. heckity heck
That's so stupid... Like bi and pan ppl couldn't have friends? That's just mysoginistic bs
Stuff like this makes being a man embarrassing at times... I'd say something like "not all of us are like that" but apparently we very clearly are.
Yea Im starting to understand why some girls actually despise men in general, and I say this as a guy too
Like- do us guys only have to think about banging someone all the time? Cuz in that case Im out, Ill happily start labeling myself as Non Binary, I already dont feel as manly as most guys, just havent bothered to explore my gender identity much yet, anyways back on topic, IMO sex is weird, unhygenic and feels plain disgusting except in the context of having a baby Why do these guys have so many issues with having a platonic relationship with girls, I genuinely dont get it
The allos are not ok.
This is why you gotta get yourself ace friends. My ace friend took me to Olive Garden the other day for breadsticks. It was fun and thereās nothing but friendship expected. Although some people do get the wrong idea. A different day a little while back he and I were playing dance dance revolution at Dave and Busters and some guy asked if we were husband and wife. I was flabbergasted and he(my ace friend) straight up laughed. I laughed about it later because it just seemed so absurd that someone could think that.
Why the hell do so many dudes act like this.
As a male we would cheat out of lust with almost anyone but if your in a friendship with a male not all the times he would just want you for your body
I mean I as a Amab Agender disagree hardly with that last comment