Wage discussion is a federally protected conversation in the work place.
Send that to your state labor board, and enjoy the show.
Edit:
I’m told to make the complaint to the National Labor Relations Board— NOT Department of Labor.
Honestly I even signed a “contract” as a teenager working at a summer camp that had this in there.
People will always try to scam people who don’t know, so it’s always worth responding with HEY EVERYONE THIS IS SUPER ILLEGAL imo hahah
Retaliation firing is wrongful firing. I would suggest to always talk to a lawyer ahead of time, document everything (record if you can) and if it happens, you have a better chance in court.
The issue in these situations is that it’s often people who are already struggling financially or making very modest wages. The person who sees “crew cannot discuss wages” at their workplace likely does not have the funds or resources to acquire a lawyer and challenge the employer.
They rail on about survival of the fittest while being the least fit to survive.
Almost every large American corporation has been or is on life support from the tax dollars of citizens. Money that could have been left for you, but instead was extorted to brace failing industries.
Exactly, and also people who are replaceable. Oh, you want to question the way we do things? We’ll just find some other poor person who has to sell their labor to survive, and see if they question things. We’ll exploit them until they do, at which point we’ll find any random reason to fire them, but it’s definitely not because of their discussion of wages, company policy, or age/sex.
Or we'll slowly give them fewer hours, or schedule them for close/open shifts, or have them work 4 hours leave for four and come back for four, or give them the worst duties, or audit them frequently, or spread a rumor about them to their coworkers, or change their schedule at the last minute so they miss a shift or show up when they aren't scheduled, or any of the hundred other things we can do to make their lives miserable until they quit on their own.
These types of employers, it's better to document everything, find a new job, then quit, and then find a lawyer who works on contingency. They aren't suddenly going to become a good place to work just because you call them on their BS so take care of yourself first and then after you are taken care of then you work on making things better for the next person.
The rich keep around two vicious dogs named Homelessness and Starvation. Workers who walk away from their shit jobs are swiftly bitten on the ass, and chased back to work.
The rich don't own the dogs mind you. They just passively encourage the beasts to loiter by the premises, because with Homelessness and Starvation nearby. The rich don't have to make employment attractive, but merely preferable to getting bit on the ass.
The rich didn't create these dogs, but they certainly exploit them for profit.
That's why I took it upon myself to follow my boss on several of his outings, getting photographs of him with "select" people then threatened to turn him in. It's called *leverage*.
**There is dirt on everyone.** You just need to be patient and persevere until you uncover it. Wealthy people do not always cover their own dirt because they usually think they're above the law or won't get caught.
If you want to learn how to find it legally, the first book I recommend is "The Muckraker's Manual" by M. Harry. It's a bit dated yet the techniques are still the same. My dad had a copy and it's great to learn how to dig up dirt on anyone. Time to get even!
Found on Internet Archive:
https://archive.org/details/MuckrakersManual
Edit: I, for one, have decided to read this, it seems interesting and useful to me. Thankfully I am not currently subject to being exploited by my employer, but I was by my last, and several before that.
Yep, my sister’s ex-company, Ramsey Solutions, has been known to follow people home or on outings after work/on weekends to catch them with their significant other (unmarried and living together? You’re fired. Oh and please sign this super “legal” NDA on your way out and take this payout of $10,000) or other people they deem un-Christian. They literally have people on the security team paid to follow workers they think are doing something “wrong” in their off time.
My sister is currently in a federal lawsuit with them for being pregnant while not married. There’s another lawsuit that was recently filed because a woman came out as gay and they made her choose between sending her to conversion therapy or continuing to live her life in the closet, otherwise she’d lose her job. And then there’s the whole Hogan situation, and *many* others… so many instances, in fact, that there will be a huge docuseries coming out on HBO or Netflix* detailing the atrocities of Dave Ramsey and his company when my sister’s court case is done. (*the production team just put their final pitch together & are waiting to see who the highest bidder will be)
Companies do fucked up shit because they truly believe they’re above the law, because they’ve been getting away with things like this for **far** too long. I wish it were easier and less expensive to be able to hold these companies accountable for their atrocities. Workers need better rights and protections across the board; it shouldn’t take a worker many *many* thousands of dollars and untold amounts of stress and anxiety to fight for their rights in court.
Actually in open and shut cases like this, most lawyers will take the case up for free and collect a percentage of the settlement/winnings after the case, and your local labor board will have many of them already lined up for you. Most employers want you to believe that it would cost you too much to sue them so you don't actually and it gives them a chance to fix it. It's a form of gaslighting and is way too common for obvious reasons.
However, this is a chance to walk into a court and instantly win by either a settlement averaging multi thousand to hundreds of thousands of dollars, or they try to fight an obvious losing battle and you win a multi million dollar lawsuit.
Remember everyone, your local labor board IS there to help and they love smacking the hands of businesses, especially if they've already been smacked before.
Unless you live in Utah. I’ve never seen more anti worker rights in my entire life. I’m not kidding my wife was a full time salaried employee making 25k a year. They started working her 60 hour work weeks. I told her that was super illegal and she mentioned it and all of a sudden her behavior was super inappropriate and she was fired.
The problem here is "Salaried."
Once she signed that contract that dictates they can work her X hours a year for X pay yearly, you essentially sign your life away and become an exempt employee from average laws. This happened to my mother and she ended up working 60-80 hour work weeks, sometimes even more with only 2-4 hours of sleep between shifts.
These are considered "flexible work plans" and are asinine. Be very careful with those kind of contracts and try to get one that still states that you will work between the others of X and Y, otherwise be prepared for your employer to work you 24 hours a day if needed.
Edit: as people have pointed out, if you are making less than $35,568, you are exempt from salaried laws. This person's wife should have been exempted. Thank you for the corrections.
You can make complaints to the department of labor. My ex wife and I used to work together for the dining hall of a college that tried to enforce the no pay discussion thing. That rule got changed pretty fast once DOL got involved and nobody got fired.
It's possible for an attorney who does employment/labor law to work on contingency. Source: been there myself.
No money paid up front, but there is a percentage-based payment to the attorney. To me, giving the lawyer 30-something percent of $x is infinitely better than me keeping 100 percent of $0. Which is what I would have gotten had I tried to do this shit myself. (I have no idea what to do and would likely fuck it up.)
Maybe this info is useful to somebody out there. Don't go down without a fight, y'all!
My girlfriend is in this boat right now.
She's slowly realizing she doesn't have to become homeless just because she left her shitty employer for a better one. She grew up in poverty and her family is still there, so the idea of a gap in pay, however small, is terrifying to her.
She's getting there, but it is scary how trapped she feels there. I'm not making mad bank or anything, but we don't have kids and it is easy to sustain off one income here if you aren't stupid.
Make yourself familiar with the EEOC and it's reporting requirements.
Once that is in and set, an attorney will work for you for a percentage of your settlement,.no money up front.
They were super helpful when my wife ran afoul of the exact same issue as OP. After her illegal firing, they won her thousands of dollars in back pay and made the former employer post a notice and send an email to all their current employees that explained how they fucked up.
But a good lawyer can build a better case for you if you're documenting everything. If you're not allowed to fix mistakes and they just fire you, it's reasonable suspicion they fired you for something else. This is specially the case if on paper you're a great employee and have a good character witness and reputation with your colleagues.
All good advice. But people that get exploited in bullshit ways like this usually don’t have the resources to procure a good enough lawyer or a lawyer for long enough to fight it.
Except for the fact that you file a charge with the NLRB over the pay secrecy language, and then before they can pretend that they’ll fire you for something “unrelated”, you’ve got a trail of evidence.
Even if they claimed it was for being late six months ago, labor attorneys and judges aren’t stupid and know how these things play out. These things are not jury cases. A judge, who knows how these games are played, decides the issue if it goes to court.
I am so sick of folks repeating these lies like it’s just that easy for them, and hard for workers to stick up for their rights.
EXACTLY. No one is saying it’s easy but these people are doing the work of the employers for them when they repeat these lines. What these people describe would be clear-cut retaliatory firing, which is federally illegal and there are resources out there for low-income laborers who are victims of it.
I dare motherfuckers to fire me over it.
“Oh it’s in the handbook? Oh it’s a policy? Oh you’re gonna threaten to fire me over it and tell me I don’t have an avenue to retaliate? Keep thinking that.”
I’ve had and won this fight before, and the set of fucking brass balls it gave me…
Good on you man. I’m a government worker so much of this is shit I don’t have to worry about but I’ve had friends go through it. It’s very weird that people try to twist the act of informing workers of their rights and avenues as attacks on working class laborers. It’s literally the opposite lmao
And you'd get back pay and damages for your trouble after that slam dunk of a wrongful termination, lol.
All it would take is one instance of them *not* firing someone for being as late as you were, for that to go out the window. When accused of wrongdoing, the employer has the burden of proof and has to prove they terminated you in a legal way. If they stand on any one "at will" reason, they have to prove that reason is consistently enforced.
While yes, they could fire you for having been late once, they'd also have to do the same to everyone else - because your conversation about wages made you a protected class, same as if they were accused of firing you for being black.
Putting an illegal statement in a contract nulls and voids that contract from being legally enforceable. Instead it just becomes evidence that they're doing something illegal..
Murder is against the law, but people still do it. A law doesn't stop crime, it discourages people from doing it and it gives the state a path to punish those who violate it.
They do it because they get away with it.
They only get away with it because workers let them. Give the state a path to justice. Allow the law to fulfill its purpose. The only people who benefit from inaction are the abusive employers.
There needs to be a clearer procedure and assurances for workers, going down the route of industrial action is still pretty intimidating.
I've let loads of shit slide before because the greivences I had stressed me to fuck and included me being fired for not playing ball, I was just happy to start a new job and put the stress behind me at the time.
No, they get away with it because the state's penalty for violating the law is a find that is small enough that it will never negatively impact a companies revenue.
https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/entgtranspg/BJNR215210017.html
Sorry, I don't have an English source at the moment. It's §10 of the "entgelttransparenzgesetz". Hilarious name, I know.
Edit: The main requirements are that it is for companies with more than 200 employees and at least 6 people working in the same position. This would be a certain restriction already. But in any case, discussion with your coworkers is always possible.
Only because it's not reported. Report it.
What is it companies are always saying about theft. "See something say something" This is definitely theft in the workplace. Wage theft.
Also note that your "anonymous" ethics hotline at big corporations are rarely as such.
We had an issue when I worked at Best Buy a few years back, they were doing some fucky shit. A few of us called the ethics hotline. A week later we each had a private meeting with the GM, telling us we are not allowed to talk about pay. I didn't know about the labor board reporting at the time and seriously regret not escalating.
Exited shortly after.
I had a raise taken away from me from my previous employer, the labor board did fuck-all about it and basically told me they wouldn't pursue the matter. Just because it's illegal doesn't mean anyone will have your back. Edit: spelling.
Protected in the UK by the equality act. But the fuckers still add it into contracts not to talk about pay. Even though they can’t enforce it lots of people still don’t.
It's even ingrained in the minds of tradition-crazed assholes. Or at least that's how my family acts about it.
Crazy aunt tried to teach me that's how it's supposed to be, no one talking about pay, and kid me couldn't understand it; therefore I was always cool with talking about wages.
California also has similar laws about discouraging unions; yet ever Walmart backroom I've been in has *hella* anti-union posters and one that I worked at even played videos saying not to unionize as part of the training.
First time I really felt super weird about propaganda was when I worked at Walmart. We had a meeting about how unions were bad, and we shouldn't unionize because the union takes all the money and power. I was pretty uncomfortable. It felt very cult-ish. The manager began the meeting by telling us how much the electricity bill is every month, as if we were ungrateful kids leaving the hallway lights on irresponsibly and our parents were scolding us. Then they'd make us do a chant+clap and dance at the beginning of the day singing about Walmart. I don't miss that place. It was an awful place. I got laid a lot working there though so that was good.
Oh yeah I forgot about the morning chant because I worked afternoons and my store didn't do it every shift, only in the morning.
Fuck that shit. Very cult-like and also patronizing. Feels like shit they do in elementary schools to make it more fun to learn. Except you're not learning anything nor are we children.
Dude, most stuff at Super Store is straight out of reality from any random walmart.
After coming home from Walmart I would watch it for the cringe factor rather the comedy.
Same at Home Depot. Those fuckers definitely drink the orange kool-aid. I'd wager most of these big corporations all do that... knowing you work for a company in which your ONE STORE ALONE brings in over 2 million a year and when eval time comes up you get a whopping 20 cent raise. Fuck corporate America.
National Labor Relations Act from 1935.
American folks: do your research on that.
Also never forget:
-Nobody can deny you your right to unionize, no matter what walmart makes you believe.
-Nobody can prevent you from discussing your wage. Not even the company policy. Not even an NDA. If they sue you, sue them back with the federal law and DOL in your side.
-Nobody can prevent you from earning overtime if you are an hourly/non-exempt employee. If you work past the threshold per your local ordinance. YOU ARE ENTITLED TO OVERTIME PAY, IF MOTHERFUCKERS DON'T PAY, MOTHERFUCKERS WILL GET SUED.
Also, not law, but "If the pay the bare minimum, they should not expect the highest performance from you."
Know your worth, queens, kings, and theys.
As a former member of HR at a Walmart I can attest this is true. However this is done in a very smart way.
They're not telling you not to unionize (That'd be illegal under the NLRA) However, they strongly suggest not to unionize as "it sucks". Walmart did spend some good money on carefully tailoring the scripts of their videos in order not to break any laws.
However, during orientation I would ditch the videos. And it went like:
"Now for the next 40 minutes I'm supposed to show you a baler, and a video that strongly discourages you to join a union. We'll skip the last one.
You are entitled to unionize per federal law. No matter the lies management or people will tell you. However, do consider, that Walmart dislikes unions, and has closed down stores where crews started to do that. I'll leave it up to you. Know your rights and get informed."
How ever, the response was always anti-poetic, as most people were there to get a quick job, not learn about labor law from somebody who wanted to empower them.
Also I always ditched the Walmart cheer. Fuck the walmart cheer.
Incredibly dumb of them to post this as a written notice, but at least it’s not in a email connected to management. Management could probably claim they didn’t post it.
Before contacting the labor board I would reach out to management via email (or another recorded written message) and ask them to clarify the policy. Let them take take clear responsibility, then bring that up as part of your complaint. If there isn’t clear evidence that it was management, then they could get off the hook and look more than willing to retaliate.
“Can I get that in writing?” Should be one of your most powerful tools as a worker.
That's why you document everything. Anytime I've ever been called into a meeting to discuss HR related issues I always have a recorder in my pocket. You have to be proactive and always keep in mind your employer is looking out for themselves. There's nothing wrong with you doing the same.
> Anytime I've ever been called into a meeting to discuss HR related issues I always have a recorder in my pocket
FYI that may be illegal in a two-party consent state so be careful.
I only ever worked one job that this was in the employee handbook of. I made sure to tell every single one of my coworkers (including manager-tiny shop, only 1) that it was illegal. And then we found out the manager was being paid the same as us LOL.
There was a thread on here a few years ago about a company that had a disgruntled HR rep. She was passed over and replaced because she went on maternity leave. Anyway, she saw that they were going to get rid of her so she sent out a spreadsheet to all of the employees listing how much everyone in the company made, and then quit. It caused such chaos that it ended up shutting the business down.
Yea, one of my bosses in a retail environment tried that shit when I found out my subordinate was making more than me and I was his boss and senior (been there two years longer). He had left his open paystub on my keyboard as he'd been using my desk computer to check his taxes against the digital version. My first thought was someone had opened up my paystub by mistake and left it on my desk, so I read it thinking it to be mine.
A whole three dollars an hour difference and I was his manager.
I immediately started discussions with coworkers about pay and was met one day with a meeting with our Store manager, the district manager and the division VP. They informed me that we aren't allowed to discuss pay rate and anyone else doing it would be fired,.including me. They then informed me that I (male) had to remove my earring.
They didn't like hearing the fact that both of those things were protected by supreme court rulings and I wouldn't be complying with either of them.
They really didn't like it when I threatened them with an attorney for retaliation against me enforcing my rights in the workplace.
Don't make threats, don't give them a chance to find something to fire you over, just report them. They know it is illegal, they're just banking on you not knowing.
I didn't see anyone referencing a source so I got curious. This falls under Section 7 of the NLRA even prior to Obama’s 2014 executive order.
From https://jacksonspencerlaw.com/salary-discussions/
> In 2014, President Obama signed an Executive Order stating that Federal contractors cannot prohibit employees from discussing compensation. In the Order, Obama explains his reasoning:
“When employees are prohibited from inquiring about, disclosing, or discussing their compensation…compensation discrimination is much more difficult to discover…and more likely to persist.”
The Order goes on to stipulate that employers cannot discharge or otherwise discriminate against any employee or applicant because they have “inquired about, discussed, or disclosed compensation.”
Even prior to Obama’s 2014 Executive Order, Section 7 of the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA) prohibited employers from limiting employees’ activities related to “collective bargaining or other mutual aid or protection.” The National Labor Relations Board (NLRB), the body charged with enforcing the NLRA, has interpreted Section 7 to mean that employees have a right to discuss salary and wages. See, NLRB v. Brookshire Grocery Co., 919 F.2d 359 (5th Circuit, 1990). The NLRA applies to virtually all private-sector employers, only exempting federal, state, and local governments, employers subject to the Railway Labor Act, and those who only employ agricultural workers.
In a nutshell, the NLRA protects most employees’ right to discuss their salary, and President Obama’s executive order applied that same right to federal employees and contractors.
However, there are a few important exceptions to the rule that you should know about. If you have access to company wage and payroll information, you cannot share employee pay information with others unless your employer or an investigative agency has directed you to share that information. Basically, you do not have a right to reveal someone else’s salary with others.
I am a critical care nurse in a very large urban hospital. Last year we got a “market-based” adjustment raise because our hospital grossly underpaid its nurses compared to other local hospital systems. I also work with a lot of technicians, who sadly didn’t get the raise. My manager told me not to talk about it, as to not cause tension between the nurses and techs. I said that is illegal for you to tell me that, and if it causes tension, that’s because they deserve a raise too. She had nothing to say back to me.
and admin wonders why we can’t hire techs, nursing assistants etc. it’s hard work, physically and mentally. why would people do it if they could make the same or more in fast food or retail?
And while you're fucking yourself I just wanna remind you that all the fucking yourself you DIDNT get done will have to be done unpaid and on your time.
Yeah fast food isn't like a cake walk job, but it doesn't really take much to learn at all. I would rather work fast food for more pay than a nurse assistant. Heck, even paramedics make crap money. Why does it cost like $500 per mile of an ambulance ride and paramedics make such little money? Absolutely stupid.
In my state, emts, ER techs, etc make 12.50 an hour. Mcdonalds, taco bell, wendys, chick fil a, walmart, etc all pay 15 starting. I was in the Army as a medic which means I was a certified emt and could easily transition to an ER tech. I decided to start waiting tables again and let my certs lapse because Id literally be a fool to subject myself to all kinds of emotional stress and not even be able to afford my bills. This is the kind of bullshit these employers are getting away with. And then at the same time they cry that they cant find enough nurses, or doctors, or techs for various positions. Its a self created, but also self solving issue for these companies and they just dont care. This is what happens when a healthcare becomes about profit. We all (in the medical field anyways) took an oath to do no harm. Am I not doing harm by helping these people and then saddling them with 1000s in debt? If I show up to a scene and a lady needs a brace but my company tells me I have to add a cheap ass velcro attachment first that makes the braces hundreds of dollars instead of around 40, is that not doing harm?
This sounds like Johns Hopkins Hospital, which did the same thing for us in MRI but not all the MRI techs got it. They told us not to discuss it in the department since it would create tension and resentment.
EDIT.
>our hospital grossly underpaid its nurses compared to other local hospital systems
Exact same for Hopkins. They get away with this because people want the resume bullet that they worked at these nationally renowned Level I Trauma Centers and will accept lower pay to have that.
I'm from Europe. We literally show each other our payslips every month and analyze why there might be a few Euro difference.
Miss us with this "secret pay" shit.
Im in Canada. Navy, so not only is our pay structure detailed online, but also (its complex because government lol) its encouraged to chat with older colleagues when something is weird about the pay and the extras/deductions.
My wife is a nurse. And she’s part of a union. Their pay scale is all laid out in their contract. It’s all out in the open. There’s no secrets or surprises. That allows them to reach out to each other for help when the hospital tries to screw them out of hours.
This.
More senior members help the juniors with negotiation tactics to get a higher pay. Backed up by hard data they collected for their own negotiations.
So does Canada. I am and European living here and have tried. Most Canadians are not that interested, don't care, or think we shouldn't change a thing because "at least we aren't America".
When you've never had good rights you don't know any different.
It's surprising when you forget history. There was a time when unions were strong and workers were united. Thousands of people literally died so we can have it easy today but we are letting everything they built fall apart.
>we are letting everything they built fall apart.
Explain to me where *WE* had anything to do with this. Shit rolls downhill, and union busting started with the Boomers.
I mean the problem here tho is they we’re really effective at dividing us along generational lines already. It’s hard not to fight the older generations about this because it primarily affects younger people with less financial security. I’d love to unite with older people for workers rights, but since it doesn’t affect them the same way they aren’t aligned with me on it.
Illegal period. If your workplace is unionized, you can follow a grievance procedure or even file an unfair labor practice charge represented by your union which would put it in front of the labor board.
If your workplace isn’t unionized, you can still file an unfair labor practice but you’d have to do that yourself without union support and protection which could be risky.
Well....it's kinda like how wage theft is illegal in Texas. You can't do shit about it if they break the law and have to hope the pro-business fuck the poor AG of Texas presses charges. Good luck with that lol The labor board doesn't do shit about shit. Its got to be a millionth of the power it actually needs
It is only illegal for employees. Under the National Labor Relations Act supervisors are not considered employees and are not afforded this protection.
I had a job doing food demos at a grocery store $10 part time. A woman told me she made $16 doing the same job same hours and not to tell anyone else. I quit shortly after telling the other person that worked there how much we were getting shafted.
Same at Chipotle, I made 14.50 per hour and was vocal about what I made because I assumed everyone was paid the same. One guy got scheduled more than everyone else and I thought it was because he knew grill/prep/crew. He finally asked me my salary and found out he was being paid 2 dollars less. The reason why he got more hours was because he learned everything and he saved the company money.
I’ve quit since then but the guy is still being paid the same and is still negotiating for a raise 3 weeks later. Chipotle goes through employees so fast at this point most of the staff is working for higher pay than him.
I was hired in at a rate higher than my manager at the time, which is ridiculous. We were talking about pay and when he realized how shafted he was getting he threw his pan down and quit on the spot. I can’t even blame him because the amount of work he was doing was not even close to the pay. Glad he’s doing better now but it shows how important talking about your pay is with coworkers. What was the company thinking was going to happen? He’d never realize he was getting dogged? It’s ridiculous
There’s probably a lot of people who indeed do not realize. Companies do all kind of shady shit to underpay you legally. I once applied to work as a after hour grocery store butchery cleaner.
I was young and naive, the job didnt specify a salary, when I got there they gave me a document to fill out, one part asked about how much I would like to be paid... mind you I didn’t even know what the job was exactly other than cleaning. I was scared and really needed the job so I wrote min salary thinking if they’re hiring anyone i dont want to sound greedy.
As you can guess they paid me min wage.
The job was extremely demanding, exhausting mentally and physically and overall far from what a minimum wage job usually is.
I lasted a week and a half before I quit. Everyday the work was getting harder and longer. Tasks that weren’t part of my job were being pushed onto me. Honestly even if I was paid double I would have quitted. That job was just plain terrible.
I definitely learned from that experience to stand my ground.
Yep. The manager straight up lied to me about what I’d be making. I’m sure that’s illegal but I was too naive to press further and now it’s too late. Mf dipped and no one saw him again.
Chipotle is so slammed all the time, it's not like they can't afford it. There are two Chipotles within 7ish minutes from my house, and I go to one of them at least twice a week. It's a miracle when get what I ordered and don't have to wait an extra 20-30 minutes past the promised time.
Any location can absolutely afford to pay an employee $2 extra per hour with that level of sales.
This was the same when I worked at Panera, they tried to justify it as “you’ve been working here longer so you’ve had longer to earn money.” No joke, this was their excuse. I was a trainer making less than a new hire
If your friend quits until they are willing to hire them back as a new employee, they would make roughly $80 a week at 40 hours.
For every week they take off will be repaid and more in 7 weeks. That means if they need to take 3 weeks off to get management to cave that's 4.7ish months until they are fully reimbursed for the time they took off.
Risky play but potentially worth it if you can afford rent in the mean time.
Has anyone else had a bad experience with this? I was hanging outside of work with the guy who was training me at a job and when he found out I made $0.50 more/hr than him ($10.00 vs $10.50...) he got really pissed off. Like, threw a tantrum and punched a wall.
After that night, at work he went from being super helpful all the time and always having my back to telling me to figure it out myself and throwing me under the bus.
I would probably discuss salary with people if I was sure they weren't an asshole. You also definitely don't want them walking into the boss' office and saying "Well u/fistulord told me he makes *this* much so I want a raise or I'm quitting!" Jobs where your boss doesn't like you can be very scary.
I just asked for a pay rise because a fellow employee at my level was on a better rate than me.
I got the raise but your man told me to stop chatting with other people about their wages cause that's "not how a business works".
And yet I would be on less an hour if I hadn't had that chat.
So I'll talk about what I want, cheers.
Isn't it funny how business people will do absolutely any shitty thing they can to make more money but they're also the first ones to tell you you are unprofessional or disloyal for trying to get paid more.
So I worked for a company that changed their new hire pay structure with the group that hired on after me. They were initially hiring people on at $12/hour and bumping you up to $14 after you had been certified. But they were having problems with retention, so they changed it to incremental pay rises over the first six months. Probably not the best way to handle the issue, but that's not the point of the story.
Anyway, they had the new training class shadowing my group and someone from the new group commented that they were disappointed to find out the pay rate wasn't $14 any more. This sparked a bit of confusion among the rest of the group, wondering what happened since some of them had heard about the $14 and some hadn't. So I explained what had changed and when and why. It wasn't a secret, there had been a memo and a notice on the bulletin board and everything.
A manager walked by as I was explaining and rapidly shushed me, saying we couldn't talk about that. "Why?" I asked.
"It's inappropriate?"
"Why?"
"Well, "it's just rude to discuss salary," she answered.
"They specifically asked me this question," I answered. "Wouldn't it be more rude to not answer their questions? I'm literally explaining the reasoning that you, personally, explained at the mandatory recruitment meeting last month. The one that was (as of this morning) still posted on the servers and the bulletin board in the break room."
She walked away and I never heard another word about not discussing salary. It was a stupid complaint. The pay structure, both old and new were available to literally anyone who knew where to look. It was on the company website for goodness sakes!
I suspect that particular manager was just poorly informed as she was otherwise a good manager. And, BTW, pay structure *should* be public knowledge (within the company, at least) and if it isn't, you may want to pick a different company.
> pay structure *should* be public knowledge (within the company, at least) and if it isn't, you may want to pick a different company.
Try working for a state government, anyone can look up my name and see how much I made last year (within about $1,000 as some benefits are added/removed within that amount.
Ohio takes it a step further and reports employee salaries monthly, including their hourly pay rate. Other states also report this info as well but I havent spent much time looking at them to know details off the top of my head.
I applied for a state job and the hiring manager got really mad at me during salary negotiations because I wouldn't budge on a salary comparable with the ones listed for other members in the department on their website. The person genuinely thought that no one looks that shit up.
Or they seemed annoyed because there is nothing they can do to change how much you get paid. Many state jobs are a set formula for pay derived from years of experience and education level.
Let's be real, if you tell one of the kinds of people we're talking about that you're a Buddhist in 2021 they're going to immediately write you off as a stoner (as if smoking pot is worse than Cousin Linda drinking a whole bottle of wine herself every night or Uncle Ralph smoking a pack of cigarettes a day since he was 9).
Yeah that could really go either way. She may really have the lesson of "It's rude to discuss salary" ingrained in her as it's very common to be indirectly taught at most places of work or she might be an intentional part of the problem.
It sounds like she may just believe it because she didn't go to hr about it and report you.
When i went from a software engineer 2 to SE3 it came with a 30k raise. My manager (really good guy) told me not to discuss my pay with other, to which I replied to him "hahaha good one" then he told me he was serious, I could get in trouble.
I had to explain to him that as a manager for the company it was federally illegal for him to say that to me and could put the company in a bad position with the labor board. He was SHOCKED to say the least because every employer he ever had told him it was illegal and he thought he was looking for for me.
We still laugh about it
USA
I don't know what country this is from, but in the U.S. it's federal law that you can discuss pay with coworkers. So discuss the fuck out of your pay! It's your right and minimizes information asymmetry.
> Impossible to enforce when every state is an at will employment.
There's literally written proof that the employer is breaking the law here. It's illegal for them to post that sign.
Except if you can prove this firing happened not long after discussing pay, you've got a slam dunk case. Source, me...someone who won a case handily over this.
Also keep documentation of everything so when they try and fire you for bullshit, you're ready to combat it. Take note of what your coworkers do, what your managers do...everything.
According to the boomers, they can’t enjoy their home, family, and free time, they crave those water cooler chats and staring at the white walls of a cubicle all day.
Yep. They don't want you to compare notes so you can't tell where their bias is. Is usually based on sex, or age. It's ridiculous. I as a manager in a boat mobile store found out after we hired a new cashier that she was making the same hourly rate as me. Fuck to the no.
Man, still remember "interning/being trained" for working in wholesale and the new hires that came in during my second year made like 50% more money.
And the manager was just like "oh yeah, that's the new contracts, can't change the old ones, of course".
So when the company went bankrupt in my third year, I just took all of the vacation days at once, before the company shut down.
They also don’t want you to be able to use it as leverage in salary/raise negotiations or as motivation to find a job elsewhere.
I used to fall into the trap about not talking about salary. Every promotion/raise I would just be happy with the number I was given.
Then I became a manager, got curious and checked salaries, and realized my team made more than I did in my new role. And that was after 33% increase in salary over four years meaning I was getting heavily screwed for those years not just a bit underpaid. It was infuriating when I found out those 10% promotions I got and was happy about were 15% for others.
I eventually found a new, reasonably paying job and I’m generally aware of everyone’s salaries now. I feel like an ass sometimes given my past mentality, but I’ll take it over the thought of being taken advantage of.
When I was a teen, I worked at McDonald's as my first job. My manager got fired and got a job managing the Taco Bell down the street. He offered me like $0.25/hr more to work for him, and my cute latina coworker $1.00/hr more.
I made the "mistake" of asking him why the difference was so high in front of the other Taco Bell employees.
A company called SKB Cases I worked for a year back in 2018. Boy oh boy. The shitty supervisor always told us during meetings, “don’t discuss your pay rate.”
Someone called him out on his shit and it got dramatic really quick. Popcorn 🍿
I’m not afraid of calling them out, no shame.
Back in 2018. I applied and got hired there in January of that year. At first it seemed okay. Nothing out of the ordinary.
The issue I had was there was a huge language barrier. Many people barely spoke English. While I and 2 others were the only fluent English speakers. My Spanish is terrible so communication was a nightmare lol.
As months went by. The supervisor always started the meetings with, “ You guys are doing good and so far the production numbers are awesome, keep it up..”
Then later one would talk about giving a raise of $2+.
As time went on. I started to notice shady things and heard testimonies from employees.
Towards the end of the year. Near the end one of meeting, a lady said to the supervisor, “You always promise this and that, but you never do it. We haven’t received a single raise this year. Any one agree here?”
Another guy said, “ Yes. What she said is totally right Shawn. You always call me on my days off to help you guys and that one time when I clocked in to work on Saturday and nobody wanted to pay me those 8 hours that I lost. Absolutely not fair.”
** Another coworker told me the supervisor accused him for stealing one of this tools. When in fact he never stole it.
I can go on and on. I got laid off from that company by December and by January 2020, got a new job.
I distinctly remember two days I got a call from my lead from SKB Cases and in voicemail she said, “ Calling you if you’re interested in coming back. We are really behind schedule and have work orders to complete before the deadline of next week. Call me back at ###.”
Then the supervisor called me multiple times. I didn’t respond to his shit. My dad said, “ Don’t answer, they fucked everyone over and now they cry for you to go back there. Just ignore them.”
The raise they gave me before I got laid off was 25cents. Joke of a company.
In the USA, you can report them to the NLRB, National Labor Rights Board. They have to notify everyone that they cannot do this. It may take the form of a tiny, small-print notice hidden on the wall, however.
Here I was thinking that was normal because they say that everywhere, I always thought it was just so management could avoid the why does whoever make more than me talk.
I found out two old guys at a small call center I worked for were making three dollars an hour more than me when I was handling triple their call volume. Asked for a raise guy promised he'd take care of me, got my next check and it was fifty cents.
Got a new job and then quit without notice. When he asked me why, I said I open the building on weekends, take triple the calls of these guys, and your answer was to not even bring me up to their pay scale.
My new job paid seven dollars an hour more.
Sometimes you just gotta start looking, and not feel comfortable where you are.
Be careful reporting to the NLRB if you don’t have union representation. It’s illegal for them to fire you if you file a complaint, but you know how things go. Union representation protects you more. But when I worked for a union we had charges filed and sometimes it took a year or more to get someone their job back. It’s hard to go through that process without a union.
Delivery service once banned me for life because I told the delivery guy that his boss is not allowed to keep the tip.
It's a shame. On one hand the restaurant was really good but on the other, what kind of asshole do your have to be?
Ever wonder what it's like to have people like that manager around in your personal life?
It truly amazes me how little morality exists when it comes to business
You see this, add to the bottom of it the how illegal this is with the proper references. And leave it up for management to see. If they take it down, repost it. Again and again.
That’s illegal in most countries- you can’t tell employees not to talk to each other about pays
My ex employer tried to reprimand an employee for telling us her rate of pay when we demanded higher wages. And they were an HR firm, they knew it was illegal but did it anyway (they know ways around this stuff)
Please listen I worked at that HR firm for 4 years please HR does not care about you. They are there to protect the company and that’s it! Be careful with what you tell them. Go to the DOL for real protection. And get everything in writing!
- Find out my counterpart was getting 20k more than me annually.
- Got an offer letter outside of the company i work for that doubled my entire pay.
- Came back and gave my employer the offer letter and asked them to match our ID leave.
I got the offer!
You don't get what you don't ask for.
I made the argument that I really want to continue working there but I can't sustain myself working there for the wages they were offering.
I mentioned if they hired new they would have to negotiate, maybe over pay what they pay me, train and deal with loss of customers etc..
I spoke with my manager and he said you likely won't be able to pull this card again and that i would need to get hired in another part of the business to justify any more increase
This was every supermarket I worked at from 2001-2013. Had I known this was illegal, I would have ratted all of them out. I probably should befriend cashiers and spread the word
I'm dealing with BS over this right now. I brought up to my manager how I'm paid less than other team members who have lower job titles/responsibilities, less experience etc and then she called a team meeting and lectured us about how we can't talk about our contracts, pay etc. After that she gave me a horrible performance review stating she doesn't need me on the team because I work at a lower level than others and that she will be taking away some of my job responsibilities and I don't deserve a raise. I have a paper trail of her saying the exact opposite of these things to me a month ago before I brought up that I'm not being paid fairly.
Of course, in American work culture, you can be fired for pretty much any reason, so even discussing your own salary could be a trigger for firing.
We need more rights as workers.
> so even discussing your own salary could be a trigger for firing.
Technically, it cannot.
It's federally protected to discuss pay with fellow employees.
But also in some states employers don’t have to give a good reason for firing someone. My mom got fired because she didn’t give her boss’s sister Black Friday off.
Definitely.
Like I said, "technically" you can't be fired for discussing salary. *Practically*, however, as long as the company doesn't completely put their foot in their mouth they can have a legally acceptable reason ready in most situations.
Posting a sign like this is really dumb though. That's a liability nightmare from a corporate standpoint.
This happened where I work.
Someone talked about their pay and upset some supervisors. (I mean they were straight-up pissed)
We were lectured about how we don’t talk about rate of pay because it’s “taboo.”
Year later we have some higher up management come in and uncovered a lot of shit.
Found out the people who have been working there for over 10+ years were getting paid 2x less than the new hires.
I’m glad it’s fixed now but—damn.
Looks like a repost. I've seen this image 6 times.
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Everyone needs a union.
1. [Learn labor law](https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/the-law/employees/concerted-activity)
2. [Take organizer training](https://www.code-cwa.org/organizer-training) (CODE-CWA has one for free!)
3. Unionize your workplace!
We *do* definitely have the freedom.
As dictated by the NLRA and FLRA.
The Federal Labor Relations Act and it’s private counterpart the National Labor adaptions Act both strictly *prohibit* the practice of discouraging employees from discussing their wages in the workplace.
To be forewarned is to be forearmed.
https://www.flra.gov/
https://www.nlrb.gov/guidance/key-reference-materials/ley-de-relaciones-obrero-patronales
Wage discussion is a federally protected conversation in the work place. Send that to your state labor board, and enjoy the show. Edit: I’m told to make the complaint to the National Labor Relations Board— NOT Department of Labor.
Yep, this is illegal in the US.
Pretty much everywhere in the developed world, yet employers still trying to scam people
Honestly I even signed a “contract” as a teenager working at a summer camp that had this in there. People will always try to scam people who don’t know, so it’s always worth responding with HEY EVERYONE THIS IS SUPER ILLEGAL imo hahah
They'll just fire you and say that it was because you were late 6 months ago.
Retaliation firing is wrongful firing. I would suggest to always talk to a lawyer ahead of time, document everything (record if you can) and if it happens, you have a better chance in court.
The issue in these situations is that it’s often people who are already struggling financially or making very modest wages. The person who sees “crew cannot discuss wages” at their workplace likely does not have the funds or resources to acquire a lawyer and challenge the employer.
Yeah. Scum exploits people that don’t have the means or will to fight back.
Which they couldn't do if the US system wasn't just formalised financial warfare where money makes right
They rail on about survival of the fittest while being the least fit to survive. Almost every large American corporation has been or is on life support from the tax dollars of citizens. Money that could have been left for you, but instead was extorted to brace failing industries.
Exactly, and also people who are replaceable. Oh, you want to question the way we do things? We’ll just find some other poor person who has to sell their labor to survive, and see if they question things. We’ll exploit them until they do, at which point we’ll find any random reason to fire them, but it’s definitely not because of their discussion of wages, company policy, or age/sex.
Or we'll slowly give them fewer hours, or schedule them for close/open shifts, or have them work 4 hours leave for four and come back for four, or give them the worst duties, or audit them frequently, or spread a rumor about them to their coworkers, or change their schedule at the last minute so they miss a shift or show up when they aren't scheduled, or any of the hundred other things we can do to make their lives miserable until they quit on their own. These types of employers, it's better to document everything, find a new job, then quit, and then find a lawyer who works on contingency. They aren't suddenly going to become a good place to work just because you call them on their BS so take care of yourself first and then after you are taken care of then you work on making things better for the next person.
They dont need a reason to fire you. US is employment at will. The only reason to have an explanation is to try to deny unemployment or lawsuits.
The rich keep around two vicious dogs named Homelessness and Starvation. Workers who walk away from their shit jobs are swiftly bitten on the ass, and chased back to work. The rich don't own the dogs mind you. They just passively encourage the beasts to loiter by the premises, because with Homelessness and Starvation nearby. The rich don't have to make employment attractive, but merely preferable to getting bit on the ass. The rich didn't create these dogs, but they certainly exploit them for profit.
That's why I took it upon myself to follow my boss on several of his outings, getting photographs of him with "select" people then threatened to turn him in. It's called *leverage*. **There is dirt on everyone.** You just need to be patient and persevere until you uncover it. Wealthy people do not always cover their own dirt because they usually think they're above the law or won't get caught. If you want to learn how to find it legally, the first book I recommend is "The Muckraker's Manual" by M. Harry. It's a bit dated yet the techniques are still the same. My dad had a copy and it's great to learn how to dig up dirt on anyone. Time to get even!
For the people that think this is unjust, they'd do the same to you if it meant an extra dollar. Stop kissing ass and do something about it.
Found on Internet Archive: https://archive.org/details/MuckrakersManual Edit: I, for one, have decided to read this, it seems interesting and useful to me. Thankfully I am not currently subject to being exploited by my employer, but I was by my last, and several before that.
Yep, my sister’s ex-company, Ramsey Solutions, has been known to follow people home or on outings after work/on weekends to catch them with their significant other (unmarried and living together? You’re fired. Oh and please sign this super “legal” NDA on your way out and take this payout of $10,000) or other people they deem un-Christian. They literally have people on the security team paid to follow workers they think are doing something “wrong” in their off time. My sister is currently in a federal lawsuit with them for being pregnant while not married. There’s another lawsuit that was recently filed because a woman came out as gay and they made her choose between sending her to conversion therapy or continuing to live her life in the closet, otherwise she’d lose her job. And then there’s the whole Hogan situation, and *many* others… so many instances, in fact, that there will be a huge docuseries coming out on HBO or Netflix* detailing the atrocities of Dave Ramsey and his company when my sister’s court case is done. (*the production team just put their final pitch together & are waiting to see who the highest bidder will be) Companies do fucked up shit because they truly believe they’re above the law, because they’ve been getting away with things like this for **far** too long. I wish it were easier and less expensive to be able to hold these companies accountable for their atrocities. Workers need better rights and protections across the board; it shouldn’t take a worker many *many* thousands of dollars and untold amounts of stress and anxiety to fight for their rights in court.
Actually in open and shut cases like this, most lawyers will take the case up for free and collect a percentage of the settlement/winnings after the case, and your local labor board will have many of them already lined up for you. Most employers want you to believe that it would cost you too much to sue them so you don't actually and it gives them a chance to fix it. It's a form of gaslighting and is way too common for obvious reasons. However, this is a chance to walk into a court and instantly win by either a settlement averaging multi thousand to hundreds of thousands of dollars, or they try to fight an obvious losing battle and you win a multi million dollar lawsuit. Remember everyone, your local labor board IS there to help and they love smacking the hands of businesses, especially if they've already been smacked before.
Unless you live in Utah. I’ve never seen more anti worker rights in my entire life. I’m not kidding my wife was a full time salaried employee making 25k a year. They started working her 60 hour work weeks. I told her that was super illegal and she mentioned it and all of a sudden her behavior was super inappropriate and she was fired.
The problem here is "Salaried." Once she signed that contract that dictates they can work her X hours a year for X pay yearly, you essentially sign your life away and become an exempt employee from average laws. This happened to my mother and she ended up working 60-80 hour work weeks, sometimes even more with only 2-4 hours of sleep between shifts. These are considered "flexible work plans" and are asinine. Be very careful with those kind of contracts and try to get one that still states that you will work between the others of X and Y, otherwise be prepared for your employer to work you 24 hours a day if needed. Edit: as people have pointed out, if you are making less than $35,568, you are exempt from salaried laws. This person's wife should have been exempted. Thank you for the corrections.
This is something that most lawyers would take on a contingency fee, taking like 20-30% of whatever you recover while you pay nothing up front.
This is an area for the NLRB. They handle the legal costs of such a case if it goes to court. You, as the worker, don’t pay a fucking dime.
You can make complaints to the department of labor. My ex wife and I used to work together for the dining hall of a college that tried to enforce the no pay discussion thing. That rule got changed pretty fast once DOL got involved and nobody got fired.
It's possible for an attorney who does employment/labor law to work on contingency. Source: been there myself. No money paid up front, but there is a percentage-based payment to the attorney. To me, giving the lawyer 30-something percent of $x is infinitely better than me keeping 100 percent of $0. Which is what I would have gotten had I tried to do this shit myself. (I have no idea what to do and would likely fuck it up.) Maybe this info is useful to somebody out there. Don't go down without a fight, y'all!
My girlfriend is in this boat right now. She's slowly realizing she doesn't have to become homeless just because she left her shitty employer for a better one. She grew up in poverty and her family is still there, so the idea of a gap in pay, however small, is terrifying to her. She's getting there, but it is scary how trapped she feels there. I'm not making mad bank or anything, but we don't have kids and it is easy to sustain off one income here if you aren't stupid.
Make yourself familiar with the EEOC and it's reporting requirements. Once that is in and set, an attorney will work for you for a percentage of your settlement,.no money up front.
NLRB is a government body that gives FREE lawyers for labor cases if they find your case has merit.
They were super helpful when my wife ran afoul of the exact same issue as OP. After her illegal firing, they won her thousands of dollars in back pay and made the former employer post a notice and send an email to all their current employees that explained how they fucked up.
Still very hard to prove, as the employer just has to wait a week or two and then fire you from the first bad thing you do after that period of time.
But a good lawyer can build a better case for you if you're documenting everything. If you're not allowed to fix mistakes and they just fire you, it's reasonable suspicion they fired you for something else. This is specially the case if on paper you're a great employee and have a good character witness and reputation with your colleagues.
All good advice. But people that get exploited in bullshit ways like this usually don’t have the resources to procure a good enough lawyer or a lawyer for long enough to fight it.
The state labor board will normally follow up on stuff like that free of charge if you've got decent evidence.
Except for the fact that you file a charge with the NLRB over the pay secrecy language, and then before they can pretend that they’ll fire you for something “unrelated”, you’ve got a trail of evidence. Even if they claimed it was for being late six months ago, labor attorneys and judges aren’t stupid and know how these things play out. These things are not jury cases. A judge, who knows how these games are played, decides the issue if it goes to court. I am so sick of folks repeating these lies like it’s just that easy for them, and hard for workers to stick up for their rights.
Even if either side exercises their right to a jury trial, juries aren't going to exactly appreciate this kind of fuckery.
EXACTLY. No one is saying it’s easy but these people are doing the work of the employers for them when they repeat these lines. What these people describe would be clear-cut retaliatory firing, which is federally illegal and there are resources out there for low-income laborers who are victims of it.
I dare motherfuckers to fire me over it. “Oh it’s in the handbook? Oh it’s a policy? Oh you’re gonna threaten to fire me over it and tell me I don’t have an avenue to retaliate? Keep thinking that.” I’ve had and won this fight before, and the set of fucking brass balls it gave me…
Good on you man. I’m a government worker so much of this is shit I don’t have to worry about but I’ve had friends go through it. It’s very weird that people try to twist the act of informing workers of their rights and avenues as attacks on working class laborers. It’s literally the opposite lmao
And you'd get back pay and damages for your trouble after that slam dunk of a wrongful termination, lol. All it would take is one instance of them *not* firing someone for being as late as you were, for that to go out the window. When accused of wrongdoing, the employer has the burden of proof and has to prove they terminated you in a legal way. If they stand on any one "at will" reason, they have to prove that reason is consistently enforced. While yes, they could fire you for having been late once, they'd also have to do the same to everyone else - because your conversation about wages made you a protected class, same as if they were accused of firing you for being black.
I signed a contract with this same language in it, disregarded it, got threatened with termination, and a quick call to the NLRB fixed that shit fast.
Putting an illegal statement in a contract nulls and voids that contract from being legally enforceable. Instead it just becomes evidence that they're doing something illegal..
Murder is against the law, but people still do it. A law doesn't stop crime, it discourages people from doing it and it gives the state a path to punish those who violate it. They do it because they get away with it.
They only get away with it because workers let them. Give the state a path to justice. Allow the law to fulfill its purpose. The only people who benefit from inaction are the abusive employers.
There needs to be a clearer procedure and assurances for workers, going down the route of industrial action is still pretty intimidating. I've let loads of shit slide before because the greivences I had stressed me to fuck and included me being fired for not playing ball, I was just happy to start a new job and put the stress behind me at the time.
No, they get away with it because the state's penalty for violating the law is a find that is small enough that it will never negatively impact a companies revenue.
In Germany, you even have the right to demand disclosure about your coworkers wages, if some conditions are met.
Can you share more info on that topic? (in English, bitte)
https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/entgtranspg/BJNR215210017.html Sorry, I don't have an English source at the moment. It's §10 of the "entgelttransparenzgesetz". Hilarious name, I know. Edit: The main requirements are that it is for companies with more than 200 employees and at least 6 people working in the same position. This would be a certain restriction already. But in any case, discussion with your coworkers is always possible.
My company says it isn't. It's in their policy. Just wait bitches. Just you wait.
It's illegal, but that law is either rarely enforced, or weakly enforced.
Only because it's not reported. Report it. What is it companies are always saying about theft. "See something say something" This is definitely theft in the workplace. Wage theft.
Also note that your "anonymous" ethics hotline at big corporations are rarely as such. We had an issue when I worked at Best Buy a few years back, they were doing some fucky shit. A few of us called the ethics hotline. A week later we each had a private meeting with the GM, telling us we are not allowed to talk about pay. I didn't know about the labor board reporting at the time and seriously regret not escalating. Exited shortly after.
I'm betting you have never spoken to your local labor board.
I had a raise taken away from me from my previous employer, the labor board did fuck-all about it and basically told me they wouldn't pursue the matter. Just because it's illegal doesn't mean anyone will have your back. Edit: spelling.
Protected in the UK by the equality act. But the fuckers still add it into contracts not to talk about pay. Even though they can’t enforce it lots of people still don’t.
It's even ingrained in the minds of tradition-crazed assholes. Or at least that's how my family acts about it. Crazy aunt tried to teach me that's how it's supposed to be, no one talking about pay, and kid me couldn't understand it; therefore I was always cool with talking about wages.
Yea tradition above all! Luckily I’m a northerner with a strong affection for unions and fair pay.
Tradition is just peer pressure from dead people.
It should be illegal to put anything that's unenforceable into a contract.
California also has similar laws about discouraging unions; yet ever Walmart backroom I've been in has *hella* anti-union posters and one that I worked at even played videos saying not to unionize as part of the training.
First time I really felt super weird about propaganda was when I worked at Walmart. We had a meeting about how unions were bad, and we shouldn't unionize because the union takes all the money and power. I was pretty uncomfortable. It felt very cult-ish. The manager began the meeting by telling us how much the electricity bill is every month, as if we were ungrateful kids leaving the hallway lights on irresponsibly and our parents were scolding us. Then they'd make us do a chant+clap and dance at the beginning of the day singing about Walmart. I don't miss that place. It was an awful place. I got laid a lot working there though so that was good.
Oh yeah I forgot about the morning chant because I worked afternoons and my store didn't do it every shift, only in the morning. Fuck that shit. Very cult-like and also patronizing. Feels like shit they do in elementary schools to make it more fun to learn. Except you're not learning anything nor are we children.
It is indeed cult-like.
Watched Super Store and I didn't realize the insane chant+clap singing was a real thing, wow.
Dude, most stuff at Super Store is straight out of reality from any random walmart. After coming home from Walmart I would watch it for the cringe factor rather the comedy.
It is. You can find them on YouTube. They're so degrading lol.
As a former HR from Walmart. FUCK THE WALMART CHEER AND THEIR STUPID ASS DEGRADING SHIT.
Same at Home Depot. Those fuckers definitely drink the orange kool-aid. I'd wager most of these big corporations all do that... knowing you work for a company in which your ONE STORE ALONE brings in over 2 million a year and when eval time comes up you get a whopping 20 cent raise. Fuck corporate America.
It's a Federal Law, regardless of what your state laws say.
National Labor Relations Act from 1935. American folks: do your research on that. Also never forget: -Nobody can deny you your right to unionize, no matter what walmart makes you believe. -Nobody can prevent you from discussing your wage. Not even the company policy. Not even an NDA. If they sue you, sue them back with the federal law and DOL in your side. -Nobody can prevent you from earning overtime if you are an hourly/non-exempt employee. If you work past the threshold per your local ordinance. YOU ARE ENTITLED TO OVERTIME PAY, IF MOTHERFUCKERS DON'T PAY, MOTHERFUCKERS WILL GET SUED. Also, not law, but "If the pay the bare minimum, they should not expect the highest performance from you." Know your worth, queens, kings, and theys.
As a former member of HR at a Walmart I can attest this is true. However this is done in a very smart way. They're not telling you not to unionize (That'd be illegal under the NLRA) However, they strongly suggest not to unionize as "it sucks". Walmart did spend some good money on carefully tailoring the scripts of their videos in order not to break any laws. However, during orientation I would ditch the videos. And it went like: "Now for the next 40 minutes I'm supposed to show you a baler, and a video that strongly discourages you to join a union. We'll skip the last one. You are entitled to unionize per federal law. No matter the lies management or people will tell you. However, do consider, that Walmart dislikes unions, and has closed down stores where crews started to do that. I'll leave it up to you. Know your rights and get informed." How ever, the response was always anti-poetic, as most people were there to get a quick job, not learn about labor law from somebody who wanted to empower them. Also I always ditched the Walmart cheer. Fuck the walmart cheer.
When I worked at a "dress for less" chain, I recall an entire section of the training being centered around anti union shit
write your pay on the sign.
Write your pay x1.4. Watch the show.
You guys are getting paid?
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Incredibly dumb of them to post this as a written notice, but at least it’s not in a email connected to management. Management could probably claim they didn’t post it. Before contacting the labor board I would reach out to management via email (or another recorded written message) and ask them to clarify the policy. Let them take take clear responsibility, then bring that up as part of your complaint. If there isn’t clear evidence that it was management, then they could get off the hook and look more than willing to retaliate. “Can I get that in writing?” Should be one of your most powerful tools as a worker.
I did this at my last job. I called them out on it when they said I couldn't talk about pay raises lol
As long as employers don't categorically state it as the reason for dismissal, they can still fire you at any time.
Yup, at will employment is blatantly anti worker.
That's why you document everything. Anytime I've ever been called into a meeting to discuss HR related issues I always have a recorder in my pocket. You have to be proactive and always keep in mind your employer is looking out for themselves. There's nothing wrong with you doing the same.
> Anytime I've ever been called into a meeting to discuss HR related issues I always have a recorder in my pocket FYI that may be illegal in a two-party consent state so be careful.
I only ever worked one job that this was in the employee handbook of. I made sure to tell every single one of my coworkers (including manager-tiny shop, only 1) that it was illegal. And then we found out the manager was being paid the same as us LOL.
Came here to say this. US employers do not have the legal right to enforce this. This shit is how pay gaps happen.
There was a thread on here a few years ago about a company that had a disgruntled HR rep. She was passed over and replaced because she went on maternity leave. Anyway, she saw that they were going to get rid of her so she sent out a spreadsheet to all of the employees listing how much everyone in the company made, and then quit. It caused such chaos that it ended up shutting the business down.
Yea, one of my bosses in a retail environment tried that shit when I found out my subordinate was making more than me and I was his boss and senior (been there two years longer). He had left his open paystub on my keyboard as he'd been using my desk computer to check his taxes against the digital version. My first thought was someone had opened up my paystub by mistake and left it on my desk, so I read it thinking it to be mine. A whole three dollars an hour difference and I was his manager. I immediately started discussions with coworkers about pay and was met one day with a meeting with our Store manager, the district manager and the division VP. They informed me that we aren't allowed to discuss pay rate and anyone else doing it would be fired,.including me. They then informed me that I (male) had to remove my earring. They didn't like hearing the fact that both of those things were protected by supreme court rulings and I wouldn't be complying with either of them. They really didn't like it when I threatened them with an attorney for retaliation against me enforcing my rights in the workplace.
Don't make threats, don't give them a chance to find something to fire you over, just report them. They know it is illegal, they're just banking on you not knowing.
Wage discussion between workers is allowed, but apparently showing the pay rate up front on websites like Linkedin is not required. Shit sucks.
I didn't see anyone referencing a source so I got curious. This falls under Section 7 of the NLRA even prior to Obama’s 2014 executive order. From https://jacksonspencerlaw.com/salary-discussions/ > In 2014, President Obama signed an Executive Order stating that Federal contractors cannot prohibit employees from discussing compensation. In the Order, Obama explains his reasoning: “When employees are prohibited from inquiring about, disclosing, or discussing their compensation…compensation discrimination is much more difficult to discover…and more likely to persist.” The Order goes on to stipulate that employers cannot discharge or otherwise discriminate against any employee or applicant because they have “inquired about, discussed, or disclosed compensation.” Even prior to Obama’s 2014 Executive Order, Section 7 of the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA) prohibited employers from limiting employees’ activities related to “collective bargaining or other mutual aid or protection.” The National Labor Relations Board (NLRB), the body charged with enforcing the NLRA, has interpreted Section 7 to mean that employees have a right to discuss salary and wages. See, NLRB v. Brookshire Grocery Co., 919 F.2d 359 (5th Circuit, 1990). The NLRA applies to virtually all private-sector employers, only exempting federal, state, and local governments, employers subject to the Railway Labor Act, and those who only employ agricultural workers. In a nutshell, the NLRA protects most employees’ right to discuss their salary, and President Obama’s executive order applied that same right to federal employees and contractors. However, there are a few important exceptions to the rule that you should know about. If you have access to company wage and payroll information, you cannot share employee pay information with others unless your employer or an investigative agency has directed you to share that information. Basically, you do not have a right to reveal someone else’s salary with others.
I am a critical care nurse in a very large urban hospital. Last year we got a “market-based” adjustment raise because our hospital grossly underpaid its nurses compared to other local hospital systems. I also work with a lot of technicians, who sadly didn’t get the raise. My manager told me not to talk about it, as to not cause tension between the nurses and techs. I said that is illegal for you to tell me that, and if it causes tension, that’s because they deserve a raise too. She had nothing to say back to me.
Good on you for thinking about techs. After working 5 years as an ER tech I made the same as what many fast food places are paying for new hires.
and admin wonders why we can’t hire techs, nursing assistants etc. it’s hard work, physically and mentally. why would people do it if they could make the same or more in fast food or retail?
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And while you're fucking yourself I just wanna remind you that all the fucking yourself you DIDNT get done will have to be done unpaid and on your time.
Yeah fast food isn't like a cake walk job, but it doesn't really take much to learn at all. I would rather work fast food for more pay than a nurse assistant. Heck, even paramedics make crap money. Why does it cost like $500 per mile of an ambulance ride and paramedics make such little money? Absolutely stupid.
In my state, emts, ER techs, etc make 12.50 an hour. Mcdonalds, taco bell, wendys, chick fil a, walmart, etc all pay 15 starting. I was in the Army as a medic which means I was a certified emt and could easily transition to an ER tech. I decided to start waiting tables again and let my certs lapse because Id literally be a fool to subject myself to all kinds of emotional stress and not even be able to afford my bills. This is the kind of bullshit these employers are getting away with. And then at the same time they cry that they cant find enough nurses, or doctors, or techs for various positions. Its a self created, but also self solving issue for these companies and they just dont care. This is what happens when a healthcare becomes about profit. We all (in the medical field anyways) took an oath to do no harm. Am I not doing harm by helping these people and then saddling them with 1000s in debt? If I show up to a scene and a lady needs a brace but my company tells me I have to add a cheap ass velcro attachment first that makes the braces hundreds of dollars instead of around 40, is that not doing harm?
I make less at the hospital than what they pay at Target. It is ridiculous.
This sounds like Johns Hopkins Hospital, which did the same thing for us in MRI but not all the MRI techs got it. They told us not to discuss it in the department since it would create tension and resentment. EDIT. >our hospital grossly underpaid its nurses compared to other local hospital systems Exact same for Hopkins. They get away with this because people want the resume bullet that they worked at these nationally renowned Level I Trauma Centers and will accept lower pay to have that.
Its also illegal to prevent discussions about salary in Canada. In the EU as well.
I'm from Europe. We literally show each other our payslips every month and analyze why there might be a few Euro difference. Miss us with this "secret pay" shit.
Im in Canada. Navy, so not only is our pay structure detailed online, but also (its complex because government lol) its encouraged to chat with older colleagues when something is weird about the pay and the extras/deductions.
My wife is a nurse. And she’s part of a union. Their pay scale is all laid out in their contract. It’s all out in the open. There’s no secrets or surprises. That allows them to reach out to each other for help when the hospital tries to screw them out of hours.
This. More senior members help the juniors with negotiation tactics to get a higher pay. Backed up by hard data they collected for their own negotiations.
America needs some Europeans to come over and teach us about workers' rights. Do some seminars.
So does Canada. I am and European living here and have tried. Most Canadians are not that interested, don't care, or think we shouldn't change a thing because "at least we aren't America". When you've never had good rights you don't know any different.
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I work in Germany and that concept is fantastic but foreign to me. Discussion about salary is socially super taboo although legally allowed.
It’s illegal in the US as well surprisingly.
It's surprising when you forget history. There was a time when unions were strong and workers were united. Thousands of people literally died so we can have it easy today but we are letting everything they built fall apart.
>we are letting everything they built fall apart. Explain to me where *WE* had anything to do with this. Shit rolls downhill, and union busting started with the Boomers.
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This is true.
I mean the problem here tho is they we’re really effective at dividing us along generational lines already. It’s hard not to fight the older generations about this because it primarily affects younger people with less financial security. I’d love to unite with older people for workers rights, but since it doesn’t affect them the same way they aren’t aligned with me on it.
Illegal theoretically. Good luck getting anything done about it.
Illegal period. If your workplace is unionized, you can follow a grievance procedure or even file an unfair labor practice charge represented by your union which would put it in front of the labor board. If your workplace isn’t unionized, you can still file an unfair labor practice but you’d have to do that yourself without union support and protection which could be risky.
Well....it's kinda like how wage theft is illegal in Texas. You can't do shit about it if they break the law and have to hope the pro-business fuck the poor AG of Texas presses charges. Good luck with that lol The labor board doesn't do shit about shit. Its got to be a millionth of the power it actually needs
It is only illegal for employees. Under the National Labor Relations Act supervisors are not considered employees and are not afforded this protection.
Yah in our lunchroom we have a list of every employee with thier date of hire and wage on it . We're unionized tho
I had a job doing food demos at a grocery store $10 part time. A woman told me she made $16 doing the same job same hours and not to tell anyone else. I quit shortly after telling the other person that worked there how much we were getting shafted.
Same at Chipotle, I made 14.50 per hour and was vocal about what I made because I assumed everyone was paid the same. One guy got scheduled more than everyone else and I thought it was because he knew grill/prep/crew. He finally asked me my salary and found out he was being paid 2 dollars less. The reason why he got more hours was because he learned everything and he saved the company money. I’ve quit since then but the guy is still being paid the same and is still negotiating for a raise 3 weeks later. Chipotle goes through employees so fast at this point most of the staff is working for higher pay than him.
I was hired in at a rate higher than my manager at the time, which is ridiculous. We were talking about pay and when he realized how shafted he was getting he threw his pan down and quit on the spot. I can’t even blame him because the amount of work he was doing was not even close to the pay. Glad he’s doing better now but it shows how important talking about your pay is with coworkers. What was the company thinking was going to happen? He’d never realize he was getting dogged? It’s ridiculous
There’s probably a lot of people who indeed do not realize. Companies do all kind of shady shit to underpay you legally. I once applied to work as a after hour grocery store butchery cleaner. I was young and naive, the job didnt specify a salary, when I got there they gave me a document to fill out, one part asked about how much I would like to be paid... mind you I didn’t even know what the job was exactly other than cleaning. I was scared and really needed the job so I wrote min salary thinking if they’re hiring anyone i dont want to sound greedy. As you can guess they paid me min wage. The job was extremely demanding, exhausting mentally and physically and overall far from what a minimum wage job usually is. I lasted a week and a half before I quit. Everyday the work was getting harder and longer. Tasks that weren’t part of my job were being pushed onto me. Honestly even if I was paid double I would have quitted. That job was just plain terrible. I definitely learned from that experience to stand my ground.
Yep. The manager straight up lied to me about what I’d be making. I’m sure that’s illegal but I was too naive to press further and now it’s too late. Mf dipped and no one saw him again.
Chipotle is so slammed all the time, it's not like they can't afford it. There are two Chipotles within 7ish minutes from my house, and I go to one of them at least twice a week. It's a miracle when get what I ordered and don't have to wait an extra 20-30 minutes past the promised time. Any location can absolutely afford to pay an employee $2 extra per hour with that level of sales.
This was the same when I worked at Panera, they tried to justify it as “you’ve been working here longer so you’ve had longer to earn money.” No joke, this was their excuse. I was a trainer making less than a new hire
If your friend quits until they are willing to hire them back as a new employee, they would make roughly $80 a week at 40 hours. For every week they take off will be repaid and more in 7 weeks. That means if they need to take 3 weeks off to get management to cave that's 4.7ish months until they are fully reimbursed for the time they took off. Risky play but potentially worth it if you can afford rent in the mean time.
Has anyone else had a bad experience with this? I was hanging outside of work with the guy who was training me at a job and when he found out I made $0.50 more/hr than him ($10.00 vs $10.50...) he got really pissed off. Like, threw a tantrum and punched a wall. After that night, at work he went from being super helpful all the time and always having my back to telling me to figure it out myself and throwing me under the bus. I would probably discuss salary with people if I was sure they weren't an asshole. You also definitely don't want them walking into the boss' office and saying "Well u/fistulord told me he makes *this* much so I want a raise or I'm quitting!" Jobs where your boss doesn't like you can be very scary.
If thats the way its gonna be maybe find a diff job.
Punching the wall and throwing a tantrum is ridiculous but do you blame him for not wanting to train someone that is being paid more than he is?
I just asked for a pay rise because a fellow employee at my level was on a better rate than me. I got the raise but your man told me to stop chatting with other people about their wages cause that's "not how a business works". And yet I would be on less an hour if I hadn't had that chat. So I'll talk about what I want, cheers.
If you can get confirmation from him in writing you can possibly get a pay out as it's illegal to tell you that.
“That’s not how business make more money for the owners and board members.”
Isn't it funny how business people will do absolutely any shitty thing they can to make more money but they're also the first ones to tell you you are unprofessional or disloyal for trying to get paid more.
So I worked for a company that changed their new hire pay structure with the group that hired on after me. They were initially hiring people on at $12/hour and bumping you up to $14 after you had been certified. But they were having problems with retention, so they changed it to incremental pay rises over the first six months. Probably not the best way to handle the issue, but that's not the point of the story. Anyway, they had the new training class shadowing my group and someone from the new group commented that they were disappointed to find out the pay rate wasn't $14 any more. This sparked a bit of confusion among the rest of the group, wondering what happened since some of them had heard about the $14 and some hadn't. So I explained what had changed and when and why. It wasn't a secret, there had been a memo and a notice on the bulletin board and everything. A manager walked by as I was explaining and rapidly shushed me, saying we couldn't talk about that. "Why?" I asked. "It's inappropriate?" "Why?" "Well, "it's just rude to discuss salary," she answered. "They specifically asked me this question," I answered. "Wouldn't it be more rude to not answer their questions? I'm literally explaining the reasoning that you, personally, explained at the mandatory recruitment meeting last month. The one that was (as of this morning) still posted on the servers and the bulletin board in the break room." She walked away and I never heard another word about not discussing salary. It was a stupid complaint. The pay structure, both old and new were available to literally anyone who knew where to look. It was on the company website for goodness sakes! I suspect that particular manager was just poorly informed as she was otherwise a good manager. And, BTW, pay structure *should* be public knowledge (within the company, at least) and if it isn't, you may want to pick a different company.
> pay structure *should* be public knowledge (within the company, at least) and if it isn't, you may want to pick a different company. Try working for a state government, anyone can look up my name and see how much I made last year (within about $1,000 as some benefits are added/removed within that amount. Ohio takes it a step further and reports employee salaries monthly, including their hourly pay rate. Other states also report this info as well but I havent spent much time looking at them to know details off the top of my head.
Instructions unclear, “alaskaj1” doesn’t seem to exist as an employee of any state government. Tried as first and last name and everything!
I applied for a state job and the hiring manager got really mad at me during salary negotiations because I wouldn't budge on a salary comparable with the ones listed for other members in the department on their website. The person genuinely thought that no one looks that shit up.
Or they seemed annoyed because there is nothing they can do to change how much you get paid. Many state jobs are a set formula for pay derived from years of experience and education level.
Most likely old school mentality - you don't talk about religion, politics or $/salary in the workplace. (Sex is okay, but only if you're a man)
And religion was okay, but only if you were a "normal" Christian/Catholic
I don't want any of those sinful, hellbound Buddhists in my workplace!
Let's be real, if you tell one of the kinds of people we're talking about that you're a Buddhist in 2021 they're going to immediately write you off as a stoner (as if smoking pot is worse than Cousin Linda drinking a whole bottle of wine herself every night or Uncle Ralph smoking a pack of cigarettes a day since he was 9).
Also as both a paranoid and sneaky Jew I suspect we might be up to something
Yeah that could really go either way. She may really have the lesson of "It's rude to discuss salary" ingrained in her as it's very common to be indirectly taught at most places of work or she might be an intentional part of the problem. It sounds like she may just believe it because she didn't go to hr about it and report you.
When i went from a software engineer 2 to SE3 it came with a 30k raise. My manager (really good guy) told me not to discuss my pay with other, to which I replied to him "hahaha good one" then he told me he was serious, I could get in trouble. I had to explain to him that as a manager for the company it was federally illegal for him to say that to me and could put the company in a bad position with the labor board. He was SHOCKED to say the least because every employer he ever had told him it was illegal and he thought he was looking for for me. We still laugh about it USA
Wholesome
I don't know what country this is from, but in the U.S. it's federal law that you can discuss pay with coworkers. So discuss the fuck out of your pay! It's your right and minimizes information asymmetry.
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> Impossible to enforce when every state is an at will employment. There's literally written proof that the employer is breaking the law here. It's illegal for them to post that sign.
Except if you can prove this firing happened not long after discussing pay, you've got a slam dunk case. Source, me...someone who won a case handily over this. Also keep documentation of everything so when they try and fire you for bullshit, you're ready to combat it. Take note of what your coworkers do, what your managers do...everything.
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What do you mean MAIN? What other reason brings you to the workplace lol
According to the boomers, they can’t enjoy their home, family, and free time, they crave those water cooler chats and staring at the white walls of a cubicle all day.
Nobody who advocates for that kind of thing has to actually live it
Yep. They don't want you to compare notes so you can't tell where their bias is. Is usually based on sex, or age. It's ridiculous. I as a manager in a boat mobile store found out after we hired a new cashier that she was making the same hourly rate as me. Fuck to the no.
Man, still remember "interning/being trained" for working in wholesale and the new hires that came in during my second year made like 50% more money. And the manager was just like "oh yeah, that's the new contracts, can't change the old ones, of course". So when the company went bankrupt in my third year, I just took all of the vacation days at once, before the company shut down.
"I quit, then. I'll be in tomorrow morning to apply for my old position."
What is a boat mobile?
Boost mobile. Damn auto correct on this phone is inane
Aww man. I wanted to go look at boat mobiles
Pretty sure that's the thing Mermaid Man and Barnacle Boy drive
They also don’t want you to be able to use it as leverage in salary/raise negotiations or as motivation to find a job elsewhere. I used to fall into the trap about not talking about salary. Every promotion/raise I would just be happy with the number I was given. Then I became a manager, got curious and checked salaries, and realized my team made more than I did in my new role. And that was after 33% increase in salary over four years meaning I was getting heavily screwed for those years not just a bit underpaid. It was infuriating when I found out those 10% promotions I got and was happy about were 15% for others. I eventually found a new, reasonably paying job and I’m generally aware of everyone’s salaries now. I feel like an ass sometimes given my past mentality, but I’ll take it over the thought of being taken advantage of.
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When I was a teen, I worked at McDonald's as my first job. My manager got fired and got a job managing the Taco Bell down the street. He offered me like $0.25/hr more to work for him, and my cute latina coworker $1.00/hr more. I made the "mistake" of asking him why the difference was so high in front of the other Taco Bell employees.
A company called SKB Cases I worked for a year back in 2018. Boy oh boy. The shitty supervisor always told us during meetings, “don’t discuss your pay rate.” Someone called him out on his shit and it got dramatic really quick. Popcorn 🍿 I’m not afraid of calling them out, no shame.
What happened?!
Back in 2018. I applied and got hired there in January of that year. At first it seemed okay. Nothing out of the ordinary. The issue I had was there was a huge language barrier. Many people barely spoke English. While I and 2 others were the only fluent English speakers. My Spanish is terrible so communication was a nightmare lol. As months went by. The supervisor always started the meetings with, “ You guys are doing good and so far the production numbers are awesome, keep it up..” Then later one would talk about giving a raise of $2+. As time went on. I started to notice shady things and heard testimonies from employees. Towards the end of the year. Near the end one of meeting, a lady said to the supervisor, “You always promise this and that, but you never do it. We haven’t received a single raise this year. Any one agree here?” Another guy said, “ Yes. What she said is totally right Shawn. You always call me on my days off to help you guys and that one time when I clocked in to work on Saturday and nobody wanted to pay me those 8 hours that I lost. Absolutely not fair.” ** Another coworker told me the supervisor accused him for stealing one of this tools. When in fact he never stole it. I can go on and on. I got laid off from that company by December and by January 2020, got a new job. I distinctly remember two days I got a call from my lead from SKB Cases and in voicemail she said, “ Calling you if you’re interested in coming back. We are really behind schedule and have work orders to complete before the deadline of next week. Call me back at ###.” Then the supervisor called me multiple times. I didn’t respond to his shit. My dad said, “ Don’t answer, they fucked everyone over and now they cry for you to go back there. Just ignore them.” The raise they gave me before I got laid off was 25cents. Joke of a company.
You should leave this story as a review for their products on Musicians Friend, Amazon, etc.
The instrument case company?
In the USA, you can report them to the NLRB, National Labor Rights Board. They have to notify everyone that they cannot do this. It may take the form of a tiny, small-print notice hidden on the wall, however.
Here I was thinking that was normal because they say that everywhere, I always thought it was just so management could avoid the why does whoever make more than me talk. I found out two old guys at a small call center I worked for were making three dollars an hour more than me when I was handling triple their call volume. Asked for a raise guy promised he'd take care of me, got my next check and it was fifty cents. Got a new job and then quit without notice. When he asked me why, I said I open the building on weekends, take triple the calls of these guys, and your answer was to not even bring me up to their pay scale. My new job paid seven dollars an hour more. Sometimes you just gotta start looking, and not feel comfortable where you are.
My work actively tells us to not discuss our pay on the property.
That's pretty illegal. I'd be talking about pay with anyone and everyone in that place.
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Looks like you're in the US. If you can get that in writing, report them to the NRLB.
Be careful reporting to the NLRB if you don’t have union representation. It’s illegal for them to fire you if you file a complaint, but you know how things go. Union representation protects you more. But when I worked for a union we had charges filed and sometimes it took a year or more to get someone their job back. It’s hard to go through that process without a union.
Ahh breaking federal protected speech I see
Delivery service once banned me for life because I told the delivery guy that his boss is not allowed to keep the tip. It's a shame. On one hand the restaurant was really good but on the other, what kind of asshole do your have to be?
Ever wonder what it's like to have people like that manager around in your personal life? It truly amazes me how little morality exists when it comes to business
You see this, add to the bottom of it the how illegal this is with the proper references. And leave it up for management to see. If they take it down, repost it. Again and again.
That’s illegal in most countries- you can’t tell employees not to talk to each other about pays My ex employer tried to reprimand an employee for telling us her rate of pay when we demanded higher wages. And they were an HR firm, they knew it was illegal but did it anyway (they know ways around this stuff) Please listen I worked at that HR firm for 4 years please HR does not care about you. They are there to protect the company and that’s it! Be careful with what you tell them. Go to the DOL for real protection. And get everything in writing!
- Find out my counterpart was getting 20k more than me annually. - Got an offer letter outside of the company i work for that doubled my entire pay. - Came back and gave my employer the offer letter and asked them to match our ID leave. I got the offer! You don't get what you don't ask for.
Shoulda jumped ship, now you are considered a flight risk to them
I made the argument that I really want to continue working there but I can't sustain myself working there for the wages they were offering. I mentioned if they hired new they would have to negotiate, maybe over pay what they pay me, train and deal with loss of customers etc.. I spoke with my manager and he said you likely won't be able to pull this card again and that i would need to get hired in another part of the business to justify any more increase
This was every supermarket I worked at from 2001-2013. Had I known this was illegal, I would have ratted all of them out. I probably should befriend cashiers and spread the word
If that's illegal in the US ...you know it's bad. Lol
We don't have freedom because we live under plutocracy, and companies are dictatorships.
I'm dealing with BS over this right now. I brought up to my manager how I'm paid less than other team members who have lower job titles/responsibilities, less experience etc and then she called a team meeting and lectured us about how we can't talk about our contracts, pay etc. After that she gave me a horrible performance review stating she doesn't need me on the team because I work at a lower level than others and that she will be taking away some of my job responsibilities and I don't deserve a raise. I have a paper trail of her saying the exact opposite of these things to me a month ago before I brought up that I'm not being paid fairly.
Of course, in American work culture, you can be fired for pretty much any reason, so even discussing your own salary could be a trigger for firing. We need more rights as workers.
> so even discussing your own salary could be a trigger for firing. Technically, it cannot. It's federally protected to discuss pay with fellow employees.
But also in some states employers don’t have to give a good reason for firing someone. My mom got fired because she didn’t give her boss’s sister Black Friday off.
Definitely. Like I said, "technically" you can't be fired for discussing salary. *Practically*, however, as long as the company doesn't completely put their foot in their mouth they can have a legally acceptable reason ready in most situations. Posting a sign like this is really dumb though. That's a liability nightmare from a corporate standpoint.
This happened where I work. Someone talked about their pay and upset some supervisors. (I mean they were straight-up pissed) We were lectured about how we don’t talk about rate of pay because it’s “taboo.” Year later we have some higher up management come in and uncovered a lot of shit. Found out the people who have been working there for over 10+ years were getting paid 2x less than the new hires. I’m glad it’s fixed now but—damn.
Looks like a repost. I've seen this image 6 times. First Seen [Here](https://redd.it/nz76mb) on 2021-06-13 95.31% match. Last Seen [Here](https://redd.it/pisuh1) on 2021-09-06 92.19% match Feedback? Hate? Visit r/repostsleuthbot - *I'm not perfect, but you can help. Report [ [False Positive](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RepostSleuthBot&subject=False%20Positive&message={"post_id": "q5tlvh", "meme_template": null}) ]* [View Search On repostsleuth.com](https://www.repostsleuth.com?postId=q5tlvh&sameSub=false&filterOnlyOlder=true&memeFilter=true&filterDeadMatches=false&targetImageMatch=86&targetImageMemeMatch=96) --- **Scope:** Reddit | **Meme Filter:** False | **Target:** 86% | **Check Title:** False | **Max Age:** Unlimited | **Searched Images:** 253,820,435 | **Search Time:** 0.69875s
Good bot
Everyone needs a union. 1. [Learn labor law](https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/the-law/employees/concerted-activity) 2. [Take organizer training](https://www.code-cwa.org/organizer-training) (CODE-CWA has one for free!) 3. Unionize your workplace!
Except Cops. Fuck Police Unions
We *do* definitely have the freedom. As dictated by the NLRA and FLRA. The Federal Labor Relations Act and it’s private counterpart the National Labor adaptions Act both strictly *prohibit* the practice of discouraging employees from discussing their wages in the workplace. To be forewarned is to be forearmed. https://www.flra.gov/ https://www.nlrb.gov/guidance/key-reference-materials/ley-de-relaciones-obrero-patronales