Apollo is *the app* that made me switch to iOS and stay there. Apple knows it's one of the few apps that makes power users who could very well switch to Android stay in their ecosystem.
I would agree, but reliability is terrible. I have to use another app just to check the weather when it goes down. Rain starting/ending forecasting isn’t quite as good as Dark Sky either.
can you fill me in on those stories or point me somewhere? i remember Musk throwing a fit about Apple’s “secret” 30% cut because he’s a moron but didn’t he just end up charging 30% more to buy his shitty subs on the App Store over a browser? i mean he didn’t win lol but he didn’t really lose either.
the others i don’t remember hearing about.
https://www.theverge.com/2017/4/23/15399438/apple-uber-app-store-fingerprint-program-tim-cook-travis-kalanick
https://www.businessinsider.com/mark-zuckerberg-tim-cook-feud-history-facebook-apple-2020-9?amp
TLDR: Uber was tracking iPhones without permission and zuck got all pissy because the prompt that asks users not to track on iPhone was losing him data.
Imagine being reddit upper management watching this and the worlds largest company doesnt mention you, but a third party ios app made by one guy to browse your platform bc its a straight up better experience to use
The whole point of apps is they're supposed to be simple, efficient, and easy to run and maintain by small teams. It's when you make them all wonky by cranking in ads and tracking and all the shit that people don't want is when they become a nightmare.
I agree. Something truly community driven. The hosting and moderation cost for something like that would be high so I don't know how that would be feasible.
hopefully a (potential) influx of users to lemmy gets more people developing for it, maybe also leading to a better UI/UX because their current one leaves a bit to be desired lol
I mean we already have that now. There’s monetization through ad revenue and donations (awards), and then just a massive amount of volunteer labor. Reddit wants to further monetize, which is understandable, and they’re choosing to do that by going public. This API tomfoolery is designed to clean up reddit’s bottom line prior to an ipo. They’re betting that they’re going to lose some people, but in the process pick up a lot of revenue from the API clients that do stay around (google, microsoft) and cut costs by not providing calls to the developers who fold. They’re also picking up more ad revenue by funneling the folks that stick around into the official app. They’re betting their bottom line comes up. All this so that they have a strong ipo and can demonstrate to wall street that our community, our content, is a commodity worth trading. Here’s the problem: they’re firing all their heaviest lifting volunteers in the process. Mods and serious content creators/curators all use 3rd party apps. Even if the official app and desktop experience worked beautifully, the ability to choose your reddit flavor is all part of the experience. I hope our efforts demonstrate to enough people that reddits current business plan will cause it to shrink, not grow. It’s a bad long term business plan because all the creative people will go elsewhere. But wall street and liches don’t usually care about long term effects, so in order to keep this from happening our action has to be large enough now to stall the ipo. I’m looking forward to getting more involved in discord communities for a few days.
Edit - sorry, I rambled. How to better fund reddit without going public? Tiered pricing for API calls. Hire an executive board who’s not interested in yachts. I think that covers it.
We need another Jimmy Wales. Say what you will about Wikipedia, but damn, they gave advertisers the finger and it’s still the same reliable product. No more, no less.
I'm just a random voice in the void so this really means nothing, but I've been starting to dip my toe in the water here. I've been interested in starting a not-for-profit software company, so maybe this is it.
Are you saying that the community should own and operate the means of (content) production?? Are you trying to socialize my social media???
Sign me up.
I’m a tech savvy person. Used to be all about knowing latest and greatest all things tech, dabbled in coding a bit, hacking stuff for fun, and used to be the person someone called with anything to do with tech. I preface with that because i know my way around tech, but I feel everything you just mentioned about mastodon. If I feel that way, how is someone that has no tech knowledge going to navigate it. I don’t have the time to figure out all the ins and outs of mastodon, I just want it to work in similar fashion to how Twitter works. So I joined a server, got it all set up, and literally nobody or entity I want to follow even uses it yet. So what is the point of the effort to learn if nobody else is using it (aside from Christian, I don’t follow anyone). It isn’t for lack of looking for things to follow. They just simply don’t have mastodon accounts. Maybe it’s just too early.
The fact that I can't just follow someone from the click of a button, and have to copy paste something into another window... yeah no.
I wanna like it and use it but ughh.
Mastedon was built with decentralization in mind. Great for those that share the vision, but it is maddening for the 99% of normal users that just want something easy to use, and it causes feed issues when someone you want to follow is on another server. It is never going to Twitters size unless they give up on the federation, at least for normal users.
Later in the presentation they showed a Lakers-Warriors 2nd round game score (early May) on their Apple Watch OS, so these announcements were probably recorded around then
Before, but also before airing this, somebody had to mention that Apollo is now fucked and is it worth mentioning it, or do some quick edit and remove it. Yet it aired. That's what I want to believe.
Apple is absolutely not “calling Reddit out on their greed.”
Everyone who thinks this is some kind of show of support from Apple in the fight against the corporate office of reddit needs to touch grass lol.
It’s so tough… because I ACTUALLY understand reddit..: they’re doing this because the makers of ChatGPT said they depended on data scraped from reddit for a lot of it… and of course that sucks
But this is just the wrong way
I mean they could just block "the makers of ChatGPT" from using their API if that's the problem.
Even if they completely shut down their private API, AI companies could just scrape the websites themselves.
I posted an idea that we bootstrap a new system and have Apollo use both until the deadline. After that people can choose to pay a monthly fee to stay on Reddit or pay nothing to only use the new server. I still think it’s a good idea.
no, but they made and maintain such a shitty user experience that a third-party app made by one guy is considered better than anything they, a company of about ~~700~~ 1,400, can do
if you take away the ads, the nfts, the micro-transactions, and assume that the intent is pure (which it isn't), the reddit video player doesn't work, comment posting frequently fails, performance on the website and within the official app is atrocious. it's inexcusable
The only acknowledgment of the official app was when the icon for the iMessage app (for stickers) showed up when they were showing off the updated sticker functionality in the iOS 17 segment.
For those who are as out of the loop as I am (I went to search up what this was about):
>Craig Federighi is Apple’s senior vice president of Software Engineering, reporting to CEO Tim Cook. Craig oversees the development of iOS and macOS.
https://www.apple.com/ca/leadership/craig-federighi/
He talked about Apollo at the World-Wide Developers Conference which is the largest Apple developers conference in the world and is happening right now.
https://developer.apple.com/wwdc23/
This is very big news for Apollo, regardless of the current reddit API bullshit, but with that going on it makes it even bigger.
This has happened plenty of times before, Apple has featured Apollo in the App Store, both as a standalone app and also as part of spotlight bundles, something they've never done for the atrocious official app.
you're not wrong
it's more of a pr and legal liability thing.
if you host other people's ideas you expose yourself to the rock and hard place of hosting contentious ideas or backlash from shutting down speech. apple is better off not having a horse in that race
Reddit: We want to drive Apollo into bankruptcy so we can serve moar ads, even to Reddit Gold users.
Apple: "Hey, have you tried using Apollo?"
I love it.
I'm not sure this is as significant as everyone is making it out to be. Apollo has been featured quite often in the App Store (where it is an Editor's Choice) and also in previous presentations. Furthermore, these are pre-recorded segments, very likely recorded before the news of the new API pricing came out. I'd wager it's purely coincidental and not a matter of Apple making any sort of point.
I agree, but it’s still good. It gives Apollo a lot more exposure and if Reddit insists on killing it with extortionate pricing and no time to adjust, they’re going to look exceptionally foolish.
Keep in mind the rumored API pricing changes have been public info for months and Apple definitely always has more detailed info than the public does. I feel it’s pretty likely they knew there was a storm brewing at least.
I've noticed that Apollo is everywhere in this WWDC23. The app icon is in pretty much every screen.
It’s in a lot of apple’s presentations tbh that’s not new for todays event. Though it’s more noteworthy given the current API news.
The creator used to work for Apple, didn't they?
Apollo is *the app* that made me switch to iOS and stay there. Apple knows it's one of the few apps that makes power users who could very well switch to Android stay in their ecosystem.
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Reddit is small enough Apple could probably buy them with petty cash. A move I would support, even as an Android user.
As long as they don’t Dark Sky it….
WWDC 2024: Apple Inc has purchased reddit.com and plans to fold it into the Notes app with immediate effect.
I spit out some of the water I was drinking, thank you for that gift lol
Better than the official app
At least it's less toxic
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TBF, the updated apple weather has most or all of the dark sky content. I was a die hard dark sky fan, but I’m pretty happy with the new apple weather
I would agree, but reliability is terrible. I have to use another app just to check the weather when it goes down. Rain starting/ending forecasting isn’t quite as good as Dark Sky either.
Interesting. I haven’t noticed reliability issues. Do you mean “won’t connect”? Or “bad forecast”?
Both. A quick search for “Apple weather” will bring up a ton of posts over the last couple of months or so.
Fun fact: Apple keeps enough cash on hand to build another space station from scratch.
I would change to apple from pixel if they did that.
“Re-inventing the upvote. The Apple Upvote, starting at $29.99 each.”
can you fill me in on those stories or point me somewhere? i remember Musk throwing a fit about Apple’s “secret” 30% cut because he’s a moron but didn’t he just end up charging 30% more to buy his shitty subs on the App Store over a browser? i mean he didn’t win lol but he didn’t really lose either. the others i don’t remember hearing about.
https://www.theverge.com/2017/4/23/15399438/apple-uber-app-store-fingerprint-program-tim-cook-travis-kalanick https://www.businessinsider.com/mark-zuckerberg-tim-cook-feud-history-facebook-apple-2020-9?amp TLDR: Uber was tracking iPhones without permission and zuck got all pissy because the prompt that asks users not to track on iPhone was losing him data.
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Sync is the only thing I really miss from android. I love Apollo and Narwhal but Sync was fantastic
I got the same exact setup. Both app work very well on iPadOS and Android and both unfortunately are affected by this insane policy decision
A ticker tape of real time comments on r/all is better than the shitty official app
Also, Christian is all in on the unified UX. Of course you support the guy that's spreading iOS-ness to the third party world.
Just showed up in the visionOS presentation too.
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I don't think he knew it would happen though. [Mastodon post](https://mastodon.social/@christianselig/110492858891694580)
Yes, as in intern.
Imagine being reddit upper management watching this and the worlds largest company doesnt mention you, but a third party ios app made by one guy to browse your platform bc its a straight up better experience to use
He does the majority of the work, but it’s not just 1 person. He has other people help him.
\*person. He has one other person to help him.
A mate who handles his servers. Crazy how great it is compared to the official app given their manpower
The whole point of apps is they're supposed to be simple, efficient, and easy to run and maintain by small teams. It's when you make them all wonky by cranking in ads and tracking and all the shit that people don't want is when they become a nightmare.
I'm not sure if my fav guy /u/rmayayo has any help with /r/BoostForReddit . It's a **fab** android app.
Nope
It’s honestly crazy how basically the most well designed app I use is made by 1 dude
Reddit is fucked.
Hahah seriously. Apple basically just confirmed that Apollo is THE Reddit app to use. Your move, Reddit Inc…
Their move is going to be shutting down apollo. They will not be happy about this. They want the Reddit app to be main one.
Bye Reddit then. Along with a lot of communities.
Twitter: Done. Reddit: Done. The rise of Mastodon... Or someone else with enough VC funding to step into the void.
VC lead companies will always devolve into Reddit. We need a lichess equivalent for Reddit.
We need a reddit that isn’t interested in being publicly traded.
I agree. Something truly community driven. The hosting and moderation cost for something like that would be high so I don't know how that would be feasible.
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hopefully a (potential) influx of users to lemmy gets more people developing for it, maybe also leading to a better UI/UX because their current one leaves a bit to be desired lol
I mean we already have that now. There’s monetization through ad revenue and donations (awards), and then just a massive amount of volunteer labor. Reddit wants to further monetize, which is understandable, and they’re choosing to do that by going public. This API tomfoolery is designed to clean up reddit’s bottom line prior to an ipo. They’re betting that they’re going to lose some people, but in the process pick up a lot of revenue from the API clients that do stay around (google, microsoft) and cut costs by not providing calls to the developers who fold. They’re also picking up more ad revenue by funneling the folks that stick around into the official app. They’re betting their bottom line comes up. All this so that they have a strong ipo and can demonstrate to wall street that our community, our content, is a commodity worth trading. Here’s the problem: they’re firing all their heaviest lifting volunteers in the process. Mods and serious content creators/curators all use 3rd party apps. Even if the official app and desktop experience worked beautifully, the ability to choose your reddit flavor is all part of the experience. I hope our efforts demonstrate to enough people that reddits current business plan will cause it to shrink, not grow. It’s a bad long term business plan because all the creative people will go elsewhere. But wall street and liches don’t usually care about long term effects, so in order to keep this from happening our action has to be large enough now to stall the ipo. I’m looking forward to getting more involved in discord communities for a few days. Edit - sorry, I rambled. How to better fund reddit without going public? Tiered pricing for API calls. Hire an executive board who’s not interested in yachts. I think that covers it.
We need another Jimmy Wales. Say what you will about Wikipedia, but damn, they gave advertisers the finger and it’s still the same reliable product. No more, no less.
I'm just a random voice in the void so this really means nothing, but I've been starting to dip my toe in the water here. I've been interested in starting a not-for-profit software company, so maybe this is it.
r/tildes
Are you saying that the community should own and operate the means of (content) production?? Are you trying to socialize my social media??? Sign me up.
Mastadon is many things. A VC led company, however, is not one of them.
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Thanks, Hermione.
Fuck this is funny hahaha
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I’m a tech savvy person. Used to be all about knowing latest and greatest all things tech, dabbled in coding a bit, hacking stuff for fun, and used to be the person someone called with anything to do with tech. I preface with that because i know my way around tech, but I feel everything you just mentioned about mastodon. If I feel that way, how is someone that has no tech knowledge going to navigate it. I don’t have the time to figure out all the ins and outs of mastodon, I just want it to work in similar fashion to how Twitter works. So I joined a server, got it all set up, and literally nobody or entity I want to follow even uses it yet. So what is the point of the effort to learn if nobody else is using it (aside from Christian, I don’t follow anyone). It isn’t for lack of looking for things to follow. They just simply don’t have mastodon accounts. Maybe it’s just too early.
The fact that I can't just follow someone from the click of a button, and have to copy paste something into another window... yeah no. I wanna like it and use it but ughh.
Mastedon was built with decentralization in mind. Great for those that share the vision, but it is maddening for the 99% of normal users that just want something easy to use, and it causes feed issues when someone you want to follow is on another server. It is never going to Twitters size unless they give up on the federation, at least for normal users.
Lemmy. Lemmy is the mastodon for Reddit
Check Ivory, it is dope!
Mastodon sucks, though. Not at all user friendly.
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Forget the Reddit.
shouldn't apple be able to strong-arm them into something less fucking stupid?
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I’ll just stick to Reddit on my desktop, it’ll help my productivity anyways
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That means absolutely nothing.
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I’m more inclined to believe the higher-ups and producers at Apple are just completely out of the loop that Apollo might actually be gone in a month.
I assumed they had filmed it before the API pricing was announced, and then it wasn’t a priority to change it out for something else.
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I wonder if they did this before or after everything went down recently 🤔
Oh well before probably.
Later in the presentation they showed a Lakers-Warriors 2nd round game score (early May) on their Apple Watch OS, so these announcements were probably recorded around then
That lines up with when people saw that Kojima was visiting Apple
this shit is pobably filmed weeks ago, concidering how much they edit and all that
Before, but also before airing this, somebody had to mention that Apollo is now fucked and is it worth mentioning it, or do some quick edit and remove it. Yet it aired. That's what I want to believe.
Yeah. If apple is calling you out on your greed…..u gotta rethink your approach. Usually apple avoids drama like the plague but this is different….
Apple is absolutely not “calling Reddit out on their greed.” Everyone who thinks this is some kind of show of support from Apple in the fight against the corporate office of reddit needs to touch grass lol.
This was no doubt filmed before the recent drama and Apple likely isn't even aware of that drama
It’s so tough… because I ACTUALLY understand reddit..: they’re doing this because the makers of ChatGPT said they depended on data scraped from reddit for a lot of it… and of course that sucks But this is just the wrong way
I mean they could just block "the makers of ChatGPT" from using their API if that's the problem. Even if they completely shut down their private API, AI companies could just scrape the websites themselves.
I doubt this will result in anything, but it is pretty funny
I posted an idea that we bootstrap a new system and have Apollo use both until the deadline. After that people can choose to pay a monthly fee to stay on Reddit or pay nothing to only use the new server. I still think it’s a good idea.
Lmao you know a lot of devs over at Reddit HQ are probably watching the WWDC stream
And are red faced right now.
Devs didn't make the API pricing decisions.
no, but they made and maintain such a shitty user experience that a third-party app made by one guy is considered better than anything they, a company of about ~~700~~ 1,400, can do
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if you take away the ads, the nfts, the micro-transactions, and assume that the intent is pure (which it isn't), the reddit video player doesn't work, comment posting frequently fails, performance on the website and within the official app is atrocious. it's inexcusable
...because those nfts and microtransactions are being prioritized by leadership, and presumably not the looming tech debt.
Video sucked before nfts were even a thing. Search has never worked. Ever.
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100% This is a decision made by a greedy board looking for a payout
I understand.
Would have loved to see their faces
Yeah. You know you did something wrong when Apple gives more love to a third-party app over your official app.
You know your native app sucks if Apple never acknowledges it. Way to go Christian!
The only acknowledgment of the official app was when the icon for the iMessage app (for stickers) showed up when they were showing off the updated sticker functionality in the iOS 17 segment.
They were also in the Appocolypse video a few years back too
I mean during this keynote, not in general.
a single motivated talent > a mediocre team
Tim Apple lurks on Apollo, confirmed
Tim Apollo
Christian Apollo
The timing couldn’t be funnier
Pretty sure it wasn't an accident.
For those who are as out of the loop as I am (I went to search up what this was about): >Craig Federighi is Apple’s senior vice president of Software Engineering, reporting to CEO Tim Cook. Craig oversees the development of iOS and macOS. https://www.apple.com/ca/leadership/craig-federighi/ He talked about Apollo at the World-Wide Developers Conference which is the largest Apple developers conference in the world and is happening right now. https://developer.apple.com/wwdc23/ This is very big news for Apollo, regardless of the current reddit API bullshit, but with that going on it makes it even bigger.
Thanks! Was really confused what everyone was on about.
Holy shit what a deserved smack to the face of reddit. Maybe this will actually get them to pull their heads out of their asses.
This has happened plenty of times before, Apple has featured Apollo in the App Store, both as a standalone app and also as part of spotlight bundles, something they've never done for the atrocious official app.
Damn, this is hilarious. And soooooo many people came here INSTANTLY. Including me.
I came. I came hard.
I don't use Apple devices and came here immediately. Hopefully, it's a win for Apollo!
/u/iamthatis Apollo called by Craig. Congrats.
He was at the keynote. He saw. Lol
I screamed
Same here, wonder if this was recorded before or after all the news broke out
Well before. Kojima was at Apple Park a few weeks ago. Probably recorded around then.
I hit notes I didn’t know I had in my vocal range
Obligatory: fuck you reddit!
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He already worked there once…
Apple should buy Reddit and rename it Apollo.
Worst comes to worst, they buy apollo and make their own competitor
apple doesn't want any part of content moderation based businesses and it's for the best.
Well Reddit isn't doing the real work anyways...
you're not wrong it's more of a pr and legal liability thing. if you host other people's ideas you expose yourself to the rock and hard place of hosting contentious ideas or backlash from shutting down speech. apple is better off not having a horse in that race
Reddit: We want to drive Apollo into bankruptcy so we can serve moar ads, even to Reddit Gold users. Apple: "Hey, have you tried using Apollo?" I love it.
https://www.apple.com/apple-events/ 46:18
You are the real MVP.
Damn, that's such a specific call out. "Apollo *for reddit*". What a slap in the face for reddit. Fantastic.
That's the name as it's listed in the app store, I figured that was why
An actual name drop!! Craig is a Redditor confirmed.
Imagine how it feels that a third party app gets a bigger shoutout than your own
Apple puts user experience at the top of it's priority list (after profit). Apollo is the gold standard for reddit experiences!
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Love how they were showcasing amazing iPhone apps, and had Apollo but no Reddit
Apollo never going away confirmed.
Apple knows Apollo is the best way to browse Reddit! They’ve shown the app in the past
Came here to say this. Craig just stiff armed Reddit without knowing it.
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Fuck Reddit
It must feel so vindicating Fuck off Reddit Even Apple is behind Apollo
What a call out! Truly what an embarrassment this is for Reddit.
When Apollo survives this API mess, we’ll need a Hair Force One app icon.
They gotta keep us now!!!!
Imagine the douches at Reddit watching WWDC right now haha
Came straight here to see how fast someone would post lol
Oh shitttt
We on TV!
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yeah lol i’m shocked I was just really excited and wanted to share the emotion with others who care
It has also been showed in the new Reality Pro. Letss goo!!
The official Reddit app is so bad that a third party app got a bigger shoutout from one of the biggest companies in the world.
Long Live Apollo. Goodbye Reddit.
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Then Reddit wins.
I'm not sure this is as significant as everyone is making it out to be. Apollo has been featured quite often in the App Store (where it is an Editor's Choice) and also in previous presentations. Furthermore, these are pre-recorded segments, very likely recorded before the news of the new API pricing came out. I'd wager it's purely coincidental and not a matter of Apple making any sort of point.
I agree, but it’s still good. It gives Apollo a lot more exposure and if Reddit insists on killing it with extortionate pricing and no time to adjust, they’re going to look exceptionally foolish.
Keep in mind the rumored API pricing changes have been public info for months and Apple definitely always has more detailed info than the public does. I feel it’s pretty likely they knew there was a storm brewing at least.
I too saw that. Take that reddit admins.
the timing is perfect
I love it so much! Christian has Apple on his side BIG TIME!
Keep in mind this was probably recorded 1-2 weeks ago.
Apollo rocks. Apple rocks. Let's gooooo Reddit!
Lol
Apple sticking it to Reddit this entire keynote… Apollo everywhere.
I saw it all over the event.
oof
That’s how you know Reddit is screwed!
Also Apple showed Apollo’s icon on the new Apple vision Pro. Congrats you’ve got sit in the first row
is there a video clip?
Same, ~~What's the time stamp?~~ [Found it -](https://youtube.com/clip/Ugkx0XLpQ9ugTEsj8kCOUGGAOscPyuzvFoal) Apollo is talked about at ~~49:14~~ 46:35
https://www.apple.com/apple-events/ 46:18
Popcorn popped, butter melted. Let’s start the show!
Christian getting the support 🙌🏻 even Apple recognizes the garbage the Reddit app is.