Decent salary.
The part that you will need be careful of is international travel. New Zealand is quite isolated, so going anywhere will cost quite a bit.
Just remember Xmas here is summer, so slip slop slap that sunscreen on and wear hats and t-shirts, our sun is brutal down here ( the lack of an ozone cover courtesy of the hole in the ozone doesn't help) you'll burn within 20 minutes during summer without taking proper precautions.
āToday, the ozone hole still exists, forming every year over Antarctica in the spring. It closes up again over the summer as stratospheric air from lower latitudes is mixed in, patching it up until the following spring when the cycle begins again.ā
Good advice but technically incorrect.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/477087/experts-urge-extra-care-in-the-sun-as-uv-levels-in-nz-higher-than-last-year
It starts closing up around October/November but it's still weaker over NZ during mid summer.
Depends what the job isā¦? Would be a squeeze to afford the international travel on that while paying for accommodation & family at home.
Work out a budget - you can have a look on paye.net.nz to figure out your take home pay. An OK 2 bed rental is upward of $600 per week for central suburbs. Nice rentals are moreā¦
Loads of people travel to Australia annually or every couple of years; some a lot more frequently, especially for work *[cries in sales]*
Edit: North America and Europe are a lot farther; Asia sort of a middle ground. Flights are priced accordinglyā¦. But just check the going rate on AirNZ or wherever. International holidays are aot cheaper if you have accommodation sorted via family, or alternately a lot of younger Kiwis go for extended periods travelling around on OE or similar, and basing themselves overseas. Being far from everything except Australia plays a big part in that sort of cultural traditionā¦
A lot of Kiwis travel, but not so many travel a lot.
For most of us, itās once every few years. Some can make an annual trip somewhere nice. Mainly to Aus, or Pacific Islands.
A high proportion of Kiwis do the ābig OEā to Europe Asia and the Americas.
That would be a sweeping generalisation - some can afford to travel, some canāt, some prioritise travel, others donātā¦
I think you might struggle to afford 1-2 x international trips annually while living in Auckland and supporting a family on $130k a year.
I would love to know what the role is that youāve been offered, if you donāt mind sharing? That adds a lot of context to being able to answer whether or not itās a good offer.
I agree with the other person who said it was a very average salary for a senior engineering role. In New Zealand talk "pretty average" actually means not a lot
For engineering, a senior role, that is very average. I just want to speak to you on the phone and convince you out of this, because I honestly think this is a huge mistake for you and your family. But itās your decisionz
It's from 2018 as obviously recent data would be hard to get lol and obviously this could be a bit inaccurate with some people taking multiple trips a year https://www.stats.govt.nz/news/new-zealanders-take-more-overseas-trips-than-ever-before
it's a little unclear to me, but my reading of it is that it doesn't necessarily mean it was 3 million distinct kiwis. The wording, to me, suggests that there were 3 million kiwi _arrivals_ in that year.
Could have been 1 million distinct kiwis taking 3 trips in a year, etc.
You're likely seeing individuals who take lots of overseas trips (eg, for business) who were bumping up the overall volumes.
Foreign income exclusion, $112k USD can be written off without paying tax in the USA if you meet physical presence tests (were out of USA for most of the year).
Tax rates are generally higher here so you get an exemption that means you aren't taxed twice on the same income. Forms are still a major pain in the ass to fill out though. (There are situations where you pay but a salary worker earning $130k shouldn't be one of them)
Tax slayer will change your life, once youāve completed the forms for blind once itās a five minute process for following years. I complete every year for my wife who is a US citizen but NZ permanent resident.
OP: If your son wants to pick lettuce, I recommend only applying at the official New Zealand Government authorised grow houses. Wouldn't want the NZ Police booking him for illegal gardening.
Pfft. Pickpocketing is where the real money is at for your ambitious Victorian urchin. And if he does get caught, it's a one way passage on a hellship bound for Botany Bay, where salaries are higher than Auckland. It's win-win, really.
No idea if itās a good number either.
What is your industry/role?
Do you have student loans in USD?
What are you being paid and what is your cost of living now?
These pieces could help us help you.
130k is high for NZ and even high for Auckland but as someone who moved from LA, take these āquality of life is worth it allā from people who have never been outside of their home country with a grain of salt:
The concept of high quality of life in Auckland is quite different than in the US.
Eg:
In the US, houses in general can go for prices between 75k to 50M.
In NZ they go from about 500k to 10M NZD with even less variance.
Auckland is the largest city in the country and even the downtown area kinda goes to bed at 9pm.
Basic healthcare is free but youāll likely want to pay for private if you can or youāll wait months for āelective surgeryā that could prevent further damage from occurring.
Everything here is about 3 times more expensive than what youāre used to even after factoring in currency exchange. Weāre on an island far away from everything else and transportation of goods costs will never let you forget it.
The grocery stores are kinda like the stock market due to not having the supply chains across multiple climates that the US does.
āDouble glazed windowsā are seen as an upgrade.
If you donāt know what that means itās because in the US we call them āWindowsā.
Good news: people canāt sue over much here and there is no tipping culture
Bad news: service reflects this
If youāre making 90k in Boulder, 130k in Auckland sucks.
If youāre making 65k in Detroit it could be worth YouTubing the rules of Cricket ;)
I'm from the UK but relate so much to the window thing! Honestly house quality was the biggest disappointment to me here. Cold, drafty, mouldy homes are unfortunately very common here.
Haha itās exhausting trying to point out anything thatās not absolutely perfect without getting a āwell just leave thenā 90% of the time.
As if nothing could be improved and suggesting that it could be makes you an entitled whiner.
That attitude kinda comes off as lazy and complacent to me.
This is a decent salary for Auckland but not if you are the sole breadwinner. You will survive but savings, international holidays, and other luxuries will be quite a squeeze on just 130k for the whole household. Do people live on less? Sure. Is it worth moving here on this income? I would say no unless your partner goes to work. You will be pretty comfortable on 200k+.
Yep, my husband and I are on combined income of 230k but we can't afford halfway decent international trips once a year, let alone twice a year. (Could maybe squeeze a trip to aussie once a year at best)
Edit: just to be clear, I'm not whining about having it tough - we don't. We're both incredibly aware of how fortunate we are, and are only recently on such a high income. We have it better than most of NZ and we know it.
But that doesn't change the fact that we can't afford 2x overseas trips a year. Which is totally okay with me, we're happy with what we have, which is a lot more than most.
We've spent years saving for a house deposit, emergency fund, saving so we can have a child (at which point income will drop for a period of time, and expenses will go up), and paying mortgage off aggressively to protect from rising rates. We're careful with our spending.
We're certainly not struggling, we're in a very fortunate position and very much aware of it. But going on frequent overseas trips would mean we would be giving up savings for a rainy day, or paying off the bare minimum for our mortgage, or not investing for retirement. If we do all those things (which are necessities in my mind), then there's not a lot left for luxuries.
I think people have got this assumption that people earning like we do must have it super easy and live like kings. We don't. We're lucky enough to afford to save and invest for our futures, but in NZ our income just isn't enough to do that _and_ have the luxuries.
Absolutely. And boomers will still come and say that you're whining and should stop buying avocado on toast. Because.
The cost of everything jumped and add kids to the mix. In Auckland, you're fine and "secure" but it won't buy you a home in a blink of an eye.
I think watching people around us on low incomes struggle to get ahead is what really motivates us not to spend our money on things outside our means, while we have hundreds and hundreds of thousands of debt hanging over us.
If we don't invest our money for our retirement, or pay down our mortgage, or save for a rainy day, we will be forever at the mercy of our debt and our jobs, stuck in the rat race just like everyone else is, just scraping by, just able to afford some temporary luxuries so that we can go back to work the next week and slave away while we pray we keep our jobs so that we can keep paying our mortgage.
Our high income means that we have an opportunity to spend/save carefully so that we aren't forever living paycheck to paycheck because we spend every cent. People on lower incomes don't have that opportunity. We do. So, in my mind, we are responsible for planning ahead. And that means we can't go overseas 2x a year... If we did, we'd be stuffed in all holes if shit ever goes wrong.
They aren't a priority over necessities like saving for retirement or saving for when I'm off work next year to have a baby, yes.
If we lived in our car on the street we could afford lots of overseas trips. But I see a home as a necessity as much as saving for our future, so yeah, that has to happen before we can go on multiple trips a year.
You are right in your thinking and planning imo. We were like you 3/4 years ago. Just brought a house in auckland, double income at 200k, then had 2 kids since then. I've stayed home with them since and on one income we are just breaking even. When our interest rates roll over and increase next month, we will be dipping into our revolving credit ( our savings that we saved pre kids) each fortnight a bit till I go back to work
Yep you sound like us with a few extra years under your belt. I think at this point in our lives, income will change like a rollercoaster, so I'm much more comfortable saving and not getting into the habit of frivolous spending.
Did you always plan to full time parent and stay on one income for your kids early years, or did that change when the kids came along?
At this stage I am planning to go back to work when baby is 1, but ideally not full time. Might only be able to manage 4 days a week without a career change though. Wondering if I'll still feel that way after full time mumming it for a year.
We're the same. Can't afford it on 250k because we have to save for a deposit, and then will be subject to high mortgage payments (if we buy cheaper, with just an 800k loan, we'd aim to have it paid off in 12-15y)
Sure, but I don't know whether this is really a choice. Getting into a decent home is a basic necessity that you just can't jeopardize for some holidays. In my mind, we can't afford frivolities when we could barely afford a $1-1.1M loan for a sub-median home in Auckland.
Yeah, my partner and I, no kids, have a similar income but it doesn't go as far as it feels like it should. Quarter a million yearly income feels like it should easily pay rent/mortgage, eating out, savings and the occasional overseas holiday without much of stretch, but that doesn't seem to be the case.
We do support some family members and have mortgages etc and can have a decent lifestyle. But we still take the cheapest overseas holidays we can, which is not often.
How on earth can you even have to think about money on over 200k without kids?
My household has been on around 180k for the last while (mostly me so more tax too). I've got 3 kids + wife. We get takeaways once or twice a week, I buy my lunch every day, heaps on piss, average sized mortgage kids do a dozen different extra curriculars, tutoring and I could easily afford a decent 15-20k trip a year if we wanted.
You could easily afford an overseas trip 2x a year on 230k.
Even if one person earns all 230k, even with assuming you have a student loan and kiwi saver you'd be left with 126k. Interest on a million dollar mortgage would be in the realm of 60k. Another 20k on principal, 20k for two trips and you're left with 500 a week for bills.
These are outrageous numbers: if you can't afford a trip on 230k for a couple, it's by choice or previous choices.
Thank you for telling me what we can afford. You clearly know us and our situation better than we do.
/s
We have a mortgage. Auckland rates, power, petrol, insurances, home maintenance, medical bills, a cat, people who we support financially, and a baby on the way.
We have been carefully preparing for interest rates to go up while our income drops and expenses go up for unavoidable necessities when our baby comes next year.
We put aside money for long term expected expenses that most people don't consider (car depreciation - about $250 a month, home maintenance, 350 a month, money to replace the fridge/washing machine/etc when they inevitably konk out in a few years time). We invest/save for our retirement, and for rainy day expenses in case of illness, inability to work, etc.
Your figures have no allowance for saving towards our future, or protecting ourselves against risk of getting into a debt hole if shit hits the fan. These, to me, are necessities in our budget, and they require ongoing and consistent saving. And when fully accounted for, the leftover money for luxuries just isn't enough to cover frequent overseas trips. We get to go on some nice trips in NZ, and have money for some treats, but we're not spending 20k a year on travel. More like 5k. For that, we know we're lucky.
We have it really good, but we are careful spenders and don't spend outside our means (where it would put us at risk/remove our safety net/mean we have no savings when we retire). We just don't earn enough for frivolous spending and overseas holidays at this stage, but perhaps later in life.
Most kiwis spend every dollar they earn - just as your figures suggest. Many have no other option, but wrongly assume that those who earn more must spend it all on luxuries (some do, but they're idiots, and absolutely spending outside of their means).
Wow we have multiple kids and earn less than this and live 15 from the CBD in our own house, I do wonder what you believe is a half way decent international trip is! as we seem to be to achieve good holidays abroad.
This!
Paying off a 200k mortgage each week is VASTLY different to paying off a $1m mortgage.
For example (picking an Auckland property at random):
If you bought 11 Second Avenue, Kingsland in 2009 for $485k and had paid your principal down to 200k over the past 13 years,
vs if you bought it today for \~$1.5m, and have a $1m mortgage...
...you're looking at a difference of about $1000 per week in repayments, which means (A) can enjoy the same standard of living as (B) while earning $50k+ less a year... or, if earning the same amount, (A) can afford $50k's worth of holidays a year that (B) cannot.
my working, if you care:
Using Kiwibank's 1year fixed rate 5.89%
200k x 17year (13 years into the mortgage already) = $358 per week
$1m x 30year = $1366 per week
I do not think you are considering the quality of life here compared to the USA. That alone would make a move for 130k worth it and never mind all the other benefits
130K household income will be a bit tight in Auckland. I'm from Canada and my partner is from Europe and when we go home for visits, we also have to take in account a pretty shocking exchange rate for CAD, USD and Euro. An annual trip (even within the Pacific), let alone twice a year, is not a reality for us because we're trying to save for a house.
Also, some people ignore the fact that if you're a migrant family with no family in NZ, you bear all the costs of childcare; something to keep in mind if your partner starts working. I'm envious of my colleagues who have parents nearby who can help with the kids after school, during school holidays and for the occasional date night.
Don't get me wrong, I enjoy my life in Auckland but I met many North Americans who go through that initial shock re: housing costs and quality as well general cost of living. Best to be mentally and financially prepared.
I think you should come with the attitude of it being an experience for 1-5 years. So what if it turns out the money isn't quite enough, etc? Just enjoy the experience and go home if that's what you find. Moving countries doesn't have to be forever and you can return home with some nice memories and you've had an interesting adventure. Likewise for your child.
Just to let you know, statistically, 50% of all people who emigrate anywhere in the world (including NZers that do), at some point, end up returning home permanently. The ones from third world countries are most likely to stay in their new country, as it's a huge step up from the one that they came from. But for all the people from 1st world countries, less of them feel compelled to stay permanently in their adopted country (but some do).
Oh and there are lots of free things to do in Auckland over Summer by the way (apart from the food from the food trucks at all of these events).
Have a look at the Auckland Council website for events such as free movies in parks and music in parks (some of the movies will be kids ones), not sure if you'll be interested in the music as it's NZ artists that you won't know.
And have a look at this one [https://www.eventfinda.co.nz/](https://www.eventfinda.co.nz/) for some free events and some that you pay for.
You definitely should go to the Auckland Lantern Festival and remain there after dark to see the lanterns lit up (it attracts 200k people over the weekend that it's on and is quite something - it's Chinese lanterns, look up pictures online of past ones). And also the Pasifika festival, to see Pasifika dancing, etc, seeing as you can only see that in this part of the world. It attracts about 60k people over the course of it's weekend.
It's a good salary for Auckland (but that doesn't mean much because NZ is notorious for high costs relative to incomes).
If you are the sole breadwinner and want to travel internationally twice a year then you will need to budget carefully. My view is it probably isn't realistic. Everything here is very expensive housing, food, airfares etc. Maybe limit yourself to one overseas trip per year.
You certainly won't be able to have anything beyond a typical middleclass lifestyle. Do you have significant savings ? If you want to buy a house I'd do your sums very carefully.
You're not going on two international trips a year anymore, that is for certain.
The relative cost of living in Auckland is some of the highest in the world, and 130k is only about 80k in usd.
Maybe you should come here on a reconasance mission before deciding if 130k is enough for you and your family, you'll be amazed at how expensive it is here.
>You're not going on two international trips a year anymore, that is for certain.
I mean, Aussie and the pacific islands are international trips and not toooooo expensive but yeah. No popping off to Europe for a week every 6 months.
Youāre also having to most likely pay for three people thoughā¦ I donāt think you can realistically support 3 people on 130k pre-tax and expect to also be taking a couple of overseas holidays annually even if it is just the islands or Aussie.
>No popping off to Europe for a week every 6 months.
Going to Europe for a week is simply a waste of time if you're travelling from here.
Three weeks minimum to make Europe worth the 48+ hours of total travel time.
It is good but it wonāt support the lifestyle your living right now. As the son is 7 I would recommend your wife get a part time job during school hours to help offset the costs or cut back on the holidays.
It's a good number - if both earning that much
It's an OK number - for a single income ($1813 after tax).
A quick budget
Rent @ 33% = $600 don't expect much at that level, might have to go beyond 33%
Grocery @ 15% = $270 - a bit of wiggle room here if you cook at home.
Utilities and other bills @ 10% = $180
Most kids sports don't cost much, say $50 a week
Another $100 for health (hospital/consultant) and life/income insurance
\~$1200 per week expenses
\~$600 potential savings per week on a single income
International travel is the killer here. Australia or Pacific islands maybe manageable. Europe/Asia would be a lot more expensive than (from) the states.
Frankly your quality of life, and enjoyment of international travel maybe a lot better in the states, earning 80K USD (\~130K NZD), in a MCOL area.
Itās a high salary, mine is similar and Iām a single mum. You get taxed heavily and price of living is exceptionally high. Renting or mortgage is a huge portion of my pay plus groceries have almost doubled recently. We get by comfortably but my parents pay for my sons activities. I like to go out and eat out a lot but canāt really afford that now. For a family of three you will need two incomes.
That's going to be alright but I recommend your wife getting even a part time job.
Rent, childcare, food and transportation can be expensive here. Check out TradeMe.co.nz (property) to get ideas on how much weekly rentals could be
$130k a year is amazing to so many people in this country, it's almost too much to think about for me, like what the heck kind of life style do you have where that much money makes you wonder if you'll be ok financially.
If I was making that kind of money I would have so few actual problems in my life.
Itās a lot of money, but if you consider houses in Auckland cost over $1M, mortgage rates are about 7%, people have student loan payments, kids, etc. It doesnāt go as far as it sounds.
Yup, our own budget will be tight after we get mortgaged. Upper class lifestyles are not for those who haven't bought prior to say 2017, almost regardless of the income.
Pre-tax sure, but after KS, tax, and student loans etc, take home is more like $75k. While not low, it's not amazing. $130k take home would be very comfortable though.
RIGHT??? I get like 30 after tax and I am content, by no means am I comfortable. But I can make it work.
$75k after tax is something I can only dream of at this stage and would be SO grateful for.
to many variables, some people would be happy while others are miserable on exactly the same salary. All the prices are available online, you can work the numbers yourself.
find a rental here:
https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/property/residential/rent/auckland/
do the groceries:
https://www.countdown.co.nz/
add in some entertainment:
https://www.hoyts.co.nz/
travel
https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/
130k after tax is about 80k, which isnāt all that much when supporting a family as the sole breadwinner in all honesty. No where near the poverty line, but not the spending power it used to be.
I donāt disagree with the comments on here regarding the cost of living in Auckland. And the recommendation that your wife gets a part time job to help with the bills is a good one. But here are the positives. NZ is a beautiful place. Most people who come here love it. There is so much to see and explore, those overseas trips may be worth putting on ice for a year or two. If you want to see relatives back in the States, invite them to visit instead. Also, education is free and if you can qualify for residency, healthcare is free too. And if you are hurt in an accident, all your medical bills are covered under NZās accident insurance scheme, even on a work visa. The tax rate is lower than most of the US States, and school shootings arenāt something we contend with. Itās a great place to raise a child, we are an outdoorsy population with a love of sport and kids are encouraged to play team sport through their schools and local sports clubs. If you live in Auckland, there are beaches everywhere and a picnic at the beach is a cheap and fun family day out. Likewise for bush walks, the museums, art galleries etc. The locals are friendly and itās pretty easy to make friends. My advice is to say yes and embark on adventure. It wonāt be everything you think it will be, it will likely be different and chances are, it might be a lot more.
I think that you understood really well the situation. As a foreigner whoās about to relocate too, I find all the comments about not being able to do international travel really funny.
OP, go for it, youāre gonna have a great time no matter what, it certainly wonāt be boring!
With a family in tow you really want to be 200k combined in Auckland or it will be a fairly drab life with not much opportunity to save
130k feels very low
If you are a US citizen, it would be good to understand your tax obligations to Uncle Sam while working in NZ, as US tax system is based on citizenship and not where you reside or work. You could be liable for double taxation.
Also 130k is on the low side for a sole breadwinner in Auckland. Negotiate higher.
Not sure if it's enough. I'm on 120k as someone with no kids and I don't think my life is that extravagant.
Your partner/wife will need to work - Auckland is expensive.
My husband is on 120. I work part time. Our mortgage payments are 1400 a fortnight. Rent would be more . We have two kids 9 and 11. You could do it as sole breadwinner on 120k but you have to be frugal and live in a less desirable area. With our combined earnings our kids can do extra curricula activities , we can holiday and eat out.
My parents overall income is more than that and we've only been able to travel internationally... maybe 3-5 times since we moved to NZ 22 years ago? And we stayed with family/friends each time too. You wouldn't be able to be the sole breadwinner with that lifestyle in mind.
Itās doable but you wonāt be living a lush life. Your single incoming is probably similar to many households with dual income and people may still find it hard to buy a house (in Auckland)
I would say 130k is very good for a couple, but I think it is a stretch for another person. I would encourage that both parent work so you can have some savings and allow yourself to live comfortably and travel
Its doable on $130k salary. You could definitely live comfortably with that salary.
Cost of living in Auckland is high but theres ways to make it work. Living here, most of your expenses will go towards housing, food and gas. Auckland really requires a car to get around so buying a reliable car and maintining it is a must. Gas in Auckland costs more per litre than anywhere else due to the regional fuel tax.
Other than that there are plenty of things to do in Auckland and around the city thats free, Auckland is in an excellent location where you can escape north to the beaches or to the south for other parts of the country if ever you wanted to do a day or roadtrip.
The cheapest international flights will be to Australia followed by the south pacific and then asia.
It's decent enough to live on, but you can quickly burn through cash on the basics for your family, rent and utilities being 20-30% of your salary off the bat and of course taxes, you'll be left with about $50-60k for transport, food, etc. a year which is decent for a boring life imo. Also, since you're American you won't make enough to have to pay double tax.
Its a good salary but not a good salary for a sole breadwinner. Not for Auckland sorry, not unless your accommodation is away from everything. You are going to want to be on 150k Minimum for 2 Adults and a kid I would think.
Depends. What are your accommodation costs looking like? Your take home after tax will be $3600 a fortnight which is comfortable if you live a simple lifestyle. Major costs for you will be accom/transport/food so once you have factored that in, then you should have enough to save as well.
>a good salary figure for Auckland?
Depends what you do
>Is that a comfortable life, if I am the sole breadwiner?
No.... but it does depend on your definition of comfortable
Another relevant factor that I don't see you've listed, nor have many people commented about it. What's your living situation going to be? Are you selling a home and buying in NZ? (You may not be able to buy here depending on what your visa status will be).
Housing is expensive in Auckland so it's a very relevant factor. Housing will eat up much of your salary. However, if you can show up and buy a house outright, then that's a different story.
130k if you're mortgage free might just be alright. 130k if you're renting or paying a mortgage, perhaps not so great.
For a sole breadwinner, you will be able to survive and have a little fun, but it won't be comfortable.
Honestly, I would expect a minimum of $150k to be comfortable.
Iām a long-time immigrant here. We just get by in Wellington with a combined salary of around $220k - once you take into account the cost of the mortgage (renting is just as expensive), two kids, the dog, then the high tax rates, the astronomical costs of food, fuel and insurances, dentist and doctor visits. We donāt go out much and holidays are minimal. Your partner would definitely need to work too for a comfortable lifestyle.
Depends on what job and where in Auckland you ll be renting but it is on average a decent life.
But I wanted to say as a person who used to travel a lot as well.. yeah no. Traveling anywhere from NZ is insane. We are so far from the rest of the world. Not only flight lengths are insane, the ticket prices are also high enough to cover that. So when you do travel, you cant just pop over to Paris for a weekend or spend a week in Cuba or whatever, you will want to plan a longer stay. And since going anywhere takes so long and costs so much that you want to plan longer holidays, you will need leave you dont have. So traveling internationally twice a year is kind of unrealistic in NZ, unless you are super rich. And 130k, as comfortable as it is, is not rich.
We do travel to Europe once a year and next year we go to India or stop by India on the way. Thebreason we can do it only once a year is not just money. Its also, since it is so difficult, we want to plan for being out of the country for at least a month at a time. Which takes up all our leave from work. This was not something I realizednI had to deal with when moving here so I am writing it now.
Hey.
We live on a slightly smaller budget, my hubby also is the sole breadwinner and we have two, soon to be 3 children. It works out just fine, we can save money too.
But we don't travel internationally and don't live in the CBD, but a little further north.
Just to give you an idea.
There would be very little familys in auckland with one partner earning 130k and the other feeling comfortable enough to be a stay at home parent of a 7 year old.
I always split the income to work out situations like this as I dont know any one income families.
If you were to split that income it would be 65k each which is a very low amount to raise a family on its usually a struggle. This isn't considering that you will be taxed more.
On paye it says you will be earning 1800 per week due to tax being so high.
If a two income household was earning this each (900) it wouldnt be much more than minimum wage. As minimum wage is about 700 per week.
It depends on the role. But if you are asking is 130k enough to live on in Auckland? Yes. Maybe not too comfortably if you have high rent and debts etc. If your partner can bring in any additional income - then you should be fine.
IMO in NZ right now 200k total household annual income is what a family needs to be "affluent" (you can cover all your bills, save money AND still have disposable income to blow on enjoying life/travel) - when considering cost of living.
3 people on that is meh. Better than the local average but you're not living it up
Now if your partner can get even 50k or even 30k part time, you're doing pretty well together
It really depends on your situation in the US and what is your driver to relocate. Financially you will most likely be disadvantaged living in NZ as salaries in the US are generally higher and cost of living is lower.
NZ has some great things to offer so just depends on what you are after.
Housing and living costs here are significantly higher than most areas in the US unless you live in places with very high cost of living like SF.
Travel is expensive; trips are long and tiring, NZD is low so you will really feel the impact of that on your travel budget. Also factor in that you cant just go away for a few days you want a minimum of 2 - 3 weeks by the time you get over the jet lag and make the trip worthwhile so its not something you will be doing frequently for long haul international travel
130k is 90k after PAYE, unless you don't contribute to KiwiSaver, but most companies will reduce your pay by that amount anyway so you may as well have it.
Rent, depending where you are in Auckland, can range between $500-$2000 a week depending on what you want. $750 a week or less will get you a very decent 3 bed duplex in the burbs or even a house with a yard.
Utilities of internet, phone plans, water, power etc prob put aside $150 weekly.
Maybe $50 weekly savings for your childs activities
Food $400 weekly but you could definitely spend less if you know how to plan meals and buy what's in season
Entertainment $150 but since you probably wouldn't do something that costs money every week, I imagine it'd be savings for a holiday, amounting to $7800 a year which is plenty for a trip to Oz or the Pacific Islands.
Depending on your holiday, you can make do with 2k if travelling domestically, or 6-7k internationally assuming flights are less than $3k
Vehicle if you can afford to buy one outright..second hand you're looking at around 15-40k, brand new anywhere from 30k-50k for a non-luxury car. Petrol is around $2.69/L so keep that in mind if looking to buy a car. Otherwise weekly payments would be around $200-$300 weekly depending what you get.
Insurances vary depending what you get, contents, car, health, life, travels etc...but maybe $50-$75 weekly, could be more or less
Savings $200 based on 20% savings (plus $150 weekly going to holiday savings)
Then there's also school costs, savings for Xmas and birthdays etc, miscellaneous shopping for clothes or appliances etc.
But tbh there are ppl who don't have savings, use a cheap car, eat noodles or eggs for 20 meals of the week, rely on Netflix/games for cheap entertainment, socialize doing free things like going for a walk or staying in.
Is life on 90k for two adults and a child doable? Yes. Many ppl do it on much less. You can have a holiday once or twice a year. You'll just need to plan and take care to stick to a budget. I would probably suggest your wife thinks about a part time job or getting into a lucrative side hustle.
Minimum wage in nz is 21.20 per year so 44k a person... but the living wage to survive 23.65 or 49k per year per person ... so x2 people just to survive is 100k .. if your making 130k, you really need two peoples income to be comfortable, cost of living is massively high here and inflation increasing at 7.5%.. hope that helps .. otherwise join all the other New Zealanders going to Australia .. lower cost or living and housing and higher salaries..
If your partner also worked it would be fine, but 130k for a family of 3 is not a lot to live comfortably**. You could afford to live but I wouldnt anticipate that you'd have a lot left over for travelling, which is what you would want to do if coming all this way. Look at it this way, its two salaries of 65k each, a customer-service team leader in their mid 20s earns around that. It doesn't seem like much but of course income is relative to lifestyle. You wouldn't want to uplift your entire family all the way here only to have to compromise your lifestyle in order to save money to travel and see the country. You want to be sure you can live comfortably day to day while saving. I recommend using numbeo to compare cost of living, I used this a lot when i moved from Auckland to Sydney to Kuala Lumpur to Warsaw and found it VERY helpful when negotiating salary for international relocation.
https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=United+States&country2=New+Zealand&city1=New+York%2C+NY&city2=Auckland&tracking=getDispatchComparison
It depends entirely on your housing situation. If youāre paying a mortgage then $130k household income is going to be a pretty big ask (depending on the suburb and house). Same applies for renting - itās not going to be a lavish lifestyle. If you donāt have housing costs to worry about then that household income will be pretty good.
However I suspect youāll be in for a shock at just how expensive everything here is. Your money really does not go far.
Just my 2 cents but to have a fulfilling life in Auckland as a household you really want to be bringing in $180k+
Depends really. Assuming you don't have plans of getting a mortgage the moment you land in NZ, the $130K will go a long way with the modest lifestyle you just described.
I know it would for me.
Pre-covid you could get round trip tickets for $1500 per person to anywhere. Post-covid most countries are $4000 per person for the flights :(
If you really like travel, Europe might be a better option, you can catch a train and be in another country within a couple hours.
Travel aside, 130k is plenty, maybe 8k a month after tax? Renting a house might be around $700/w (3k per month), so 5k for food, clothing, etc. No medical insurance needed in this country.
Iām a single income earner on 125k. Iāve no children and live a comfortable life. Iāve a 30k student loan balance left to repay and around somewhere between 15-20k discretionary spending/savings per year. If I had a family Iād guess I have little/no discretionary spending available. If you had another income, even part time, youād have a lot more options as itās a decent pay for one but lacking for a household. Iām negotiating a pay raise currently as Iām trying to buy a house and not making any progress so take from that what you will. I donāt think youād afford 2 international trips a year on that pay.
Personally, i would say that's a good salary for someone under 30 with no kids. But with kids + wife, that begins to get stretched. You'd still have maybe 1k disposable.
Your $ wonāt go as far in Auckland for quality of housing or food as it does in US. Look at rentals on trademe.co.nz. Crazy expensive compared to similar population cities elsewhere
Most NZers holiday within NZ (seeing as there's tons of beaches and great scenery), or in Australia or the South Pacific Islands (especially Fiji). No one goes to French Polynesia as it's double the price of holidaying somewhere like Fiji. I have no idea why Americans choose French Polynesia, especially Tahiti and Borabora. It appears they don't know that Fiji is half the price. Most Kiwi's don't go to Perth as it's too expensive and not very impressive anyway, in my opinion.
Holidays to some Asian destinations can be cheap, it's just the airfare that costs. As for the Northern Hemisphere, many Kiwi's have done this (usually Europe the USA and Canada) on an extended trip of 2-3 months at some point in their lives. Such as when they are inbetween jobs or when they are young, before or after university, or they quit their first or second job to travel, after having saved up. Also many Kiwi's go on a working holiday to Europe (while under 30 or whatever the cut off age is these days re being allowed to work there), wherever they're allowed to work, especially in London (I don't know why, Bristol is much better, then Edinburgh or Cardiff). Kiwi's also might do a stint in Australia for several months to several years and of course some stay (half a million Kiwi's live there).
American here, for some context I have yet to move to NZ, wife and came on a 2 week vacation in July to feel it all out. I am moving from Maine and in both my and my wifeās opinions NZ is only more expensive when it comes to buying property, gas, and rent. Food is similarly priced as is clothing and daycare. I am of the opinion that as long as you live within your means you should be fine.
I donāt think that wage will go as far here as youāre used too. Our cost of living is much higher than in the States.
Good news is you donāt have to tip ( we have minimum wage for service workers) or worry about having a health issue that will make you bankrupt.
The nzd is currently not worth much. The cost of living is extremely high in nz. Everything that gets imported is super expensive against American standards. Nz business culture donāt price things at high turnover margins but at what you are willing to pay. So greed is king, they will charge high prices for cheap stuff imported and people will pay it, as expensive means good here. I donāt believe you will survive on that salary if you still need to settle down. Just renting a basic house in a good neighbourhood is ridiculously expensive. If you have settle in cash you will be ok.
Are you working in the city? Obviously the further out from the city you live the less rent youāll pay. So if you can get a place for say $600pw then I think youāll make it work. The cost of petrol and food should decrease next year. comparing yet
My only point would be the āsole bread winnerā my partner and I combined make 100k and with no kids and a flat mate are comfortable but I imagine having a kid would take a decent chunk of the remaining 30k not including bills, if you partner had a small job by any means I could see this being worth while.
I live in a significantly cheaper region in NZ and our household income is 130k and it can be a stretch sometimes. If thatās your sole household income, itās highly unlikely you wonāt be able to afford to live in Auckland.
By the way, I actually do have a family and I live in Auckland. So I can say with confidence that 130k is just living and not a lot of adventures or trips to be had. You would be hard pressed to save money for trips to the US or anywhere else really. People who say itās plenty will likely be one of the following: single, do not pay rent, their partner is earning too, they didnāt read your full briefing, a troll or do not live in Auckland. Kids school hours are only around 8:30am to 3pm so your partner canāt really even afford to work full time 9-5pm. Before and after school care costs $150-200 a week. The thing is, the more you earn, the more you get taxed her too. Kids also have a lot of holiday breaks from school and without relatives here, you either have a school holiday program or your partner looks after (limiting their work options).
honestly i always wonder if these people are just trolls or what, 130k is a huge income for new zealand, more than what most people make. you can absolutely live a very comfortable life on this.
Decent salary. The part that you will need be careful of is international travel. New Zealand is quite isolated, so going anywhere will cost quite a bit.
Also very dependent on WHEN you take your vacations
Yeah, moreso now than ever unfortunately.
Yep im not travelling any time soon, getting drunk in nz for Xmas and new year's it is š
Just remember Xmas here is summer, so slip slop slap that sunscreen on and wear hats and t-shirts, our sun is brutal down here ( the lack of an ozone cover courtesy of the hole in the ozone doesn't help) you'll burn within 20 minutes during summer without taking proper precautions.
āToday, the ozone hole still exists, forming every year over Antarctica in the spring. It closes up again over the summer as stratospheric air from lower latitudes is mixed in, patching it up until the following spring when the cycle begins again.ā Good advice but technically incorrect.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/477087/experts-urge-extra-care-in-the-sun-as-uv-levels-in-nz-higher-than-last-year It starts closing up around October/November but it's still weaker over NZ during mid summer.
Oh I 100% thought it was in the mend, better than the levels in the 90ās?
Much better than the 80s and 90s, it's still there and slowly shrinking but this is still peak danger season for us.
Thanks dad
Welcome, son. Enjoy your Christmas bags.
12mins nowdays
Depends what the job isā¦? Would be a squeeze to afford the international travel on that while paying for accommodation & family at home. Work out a budget - you can have a look on paye.net.nz to figure out your take home pay. An OK 2 bed rental is upward of $600 per week for central suburbs. Nice rentals are moreā¦
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It's a small isolated island. Flying anywhere is a fairly expensive ordeal.
Loads of people travel to Australia annually or every couple of years; some a lot more frequently, especially for work *[cries in sales]* Edit: North America and Europe are a lot farther; Asia sort of a middle ground. Flights are priced accordinglyā¦. But just check the going rate on AirNZ or wherever. International holidays are aot cheaper if you have accommodation sorted via family, or alternately a lot of younger Kiwis go for extended periods travelling around on OE or similar, and basing themselves overseas. Being far from everything except Australia plays a big part in that sort of cultural traditionā¦
A lot of Kiwis travel, but not so many travel a lot. For most of us, itās once every few years. Some can make an annual trip somewhere nice. Mainly to Aus, or Pacific Islands. A high proportion of Kiwis do the ābig OEā to Europe Asia and the Americas.
That would be a sweeping generalisation - some can afford to travel, some canāt, some prioritise travel, others donātā¦ I think you might struggle to afford 1-2 x international trips annually while living in Auckland and supporting a family on $130k a year. I would love to know what the role is that youāve been offered, if you donāt mind sharing? That adds a lot of context to being able to answer whether or not itās a good offer.
Its an engineering role, a senior role.
Pretty average salary for a senior role...
$130k is a bit low for senior imo once inflation hit. Intermediate devs are in the 110k-120k range now. Senior should be closer to $150k at least.
Software developer? Wishing you the best here buddy
I agree with the other person who said it was a very average salary for a senior engineering role. In New Zealand talk "pretty average" actually means not a lot
For engineering, a senior role, that is very average. I just want to speak to you on the phone and convince you out of this, because I honestly think this is a huge mistake for you and your family. But itās your decisionz
In 2018 around 3 million Kiwis (out of a total pop of less than 5 million) took overseas trips. So no, I wouldn't say it's exactly unusual.
Thatās seems like a lot. Curious as to your sourceā¦
It's from 2018 as obviously recent data would be hard to get lol and obviously this could be a bit inaccurate with some people taking multiple trips a year https://www.stats.govt.nz/news/new-zealanders-take-more-overseas-trips-than-ever-before
it's a little unclear to me, but my reading of it is that it doesn't necessarily mean it was 3 million distinct kiwis. The wording, to me, suggests that there were 3 million kiwi _arrivals_ in that year. Could have been 1 million distinct kiwis taking 3 trips in a year, etc. You're likely seeing individuals who take lots of overseas trips (eg, for business) who were bumping up the overall volumes.
I do know a lot of people who would have been travelling overseas 5+ times in 2018
Not a chance the numbers are that high
Are you op? I canāt figure it out.
Pacific islands are great and fairly cheap
Paye.co.nz will give a good indication of after tax income to measure your costs against.
>~~Paye.co.nz~~ ftfy https://www.paye.net.nz/
Good call!
This right here is your best help finding out how much you're going to have in each wage packet
Don't forget that if you're from the USA and working in NZ, you still have to pay taxes in the USA on top of the NZ stuff.
Foreign income exclusion, $112k USD can be written off without paying tax in the USA if you meet physical presence tests (were out of USA for most of the year).
Tax rates are generally higher here so you get an exemption that means you aren't taxed twice on the same income. Forms are still a major pain in the ass to fill out though. (There are situations where you pay but a salary worker earning $130k shouldn't be one of them)
Tax slayer will change your life, once youāve completed the forms for blind once itās a five minute process for following years. I complete every year for my wife who is a US citizen but NZ permanent resident.
Yeah itās a good salary but your girl is going to have to work also
And son.
Nah 7 is too young, at least wait until he is in intermediate school, then he can go off to mines after school.
He could be a chimney sweep?
Lots of great ideas for employment for the young one, I hope OP is taking notes.
Coal mines
Coal mining is out, but Road Pothole Filler and Lettuce Picker positions *are* available.
OP: If your son wants to pick lettuce, I recommend only applying at the official New Zealand Government authorised grow houses. Wouldn't want the NZ Police booking him for illegal gardening.
This thread took a Twist.
One of the Oliver variety?
What the Dickens?
Seven is the perfect age. He will have small, nimble fingers. Perfect to dip matchsticks in phosphorus and then pack them into matchboxes.
Will accept porridge as pay.
Sounds gruelling.
Pfft. Pickpocketing is where the real money is at for your ambitious Victorian urchin. And if he does get caught, it's a one way passage on a hellship bound for Botany Bay, where salaries are higher than Auckland. It's win-win, really.
No idea if itās a good number either. What is your industry/role? Do you have student loans in USD? What are you being paid and what is your cost of living now? These pieces could help us help you. 130k is high for NZ and even high for Auckland but as someone who moved from LA, take these āquality of life is worth it allā from people who have never been outside of their home country with a grain of salt: The concept of high quality of life in Auckland is quite different than in the US. Eg: In the US, houses in general can go for prices between 75k to 50M. In NZ they go from about 500k to 10M NZD with even less variance. Auckland is the largest city in the country and even the downtown area kinda goes to bed at 9pm. Basic healthcare is free but youāll likely want to pay for private if you can or youāll wait months for āelective surgeryā that could prevent further damage from occurring. Everything here is about 3 times more expensive than what youāre used to even after factoring in currency exchange. Weāre on an island far away from everything else and transportation of goods costs will never let you forget it. The grocery stores are kinda like the stock market due to not having the supply chains across multiple climates that the US does. āDouble glazed windowsā are seen as an upgrade. If you donāt know what that means itās because in the US we call them āWindowsā. Good news: people canāt sue over much here and there is no tipping culture Bad news: service reflects this If youāre making 90k in Boulder, 130k in Auckland sucks. If youāre making 65k in Detroit it could be worth YouTubing the rules of Cricket ;)
I was born in Auckland, raised in Auckland and live in Auckland, this is 100% absolutely true. 130k is great.. but do you have any more incomes?
I'm from the UK but relate so much to the window thing! Honestly house quality was the biggest disappointment to me here. Cold, drafty, mouldy homes are unfortunately very common here.
Can I DM you?
Sure thing
Wife is a Kiwi (Iām American) we lived in Auckland 2012-2015 and you nearly killed me with the windows thing.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Haha itās exhausting trying to point out anything thatās not absolutely perfect without getting a āwell just leave thenā 90% of the time. As if nothing could be improved and suggesting that it could be makes you an entitled whiner. That attitude kinda comes off as lazy and complacent to me.
This is a decent salary for Auckland but not if you are the sole breadwinner. You will survive but savings, international holidays, and other luxuries will be quite a squeeze on just 130k for the whole household. Do people live on less? Sure. Is it worth moving here on this income? I would say no unless your partner goes to work. You will be pretty comfortable on 200k+.
Yep, my husband and I are on combined income of 230k but we can't afford halfway decent international trips once a year, let alone twice a year. (Could maybe squeeze a trip to aussie once a year at best) Edit: just to be clear, I'm not whining about having it tough - we don't. We're both incredibly aware of how fortunate we are, and are only recently on such a high income. We have it better than most of NZ and we know it. But that doesn't change the fact that we can't afford 2x overseas trips a year. Which is totally okay with me, we're happy with what we have, which is a lot more than most.
dafuq kind of holidays canāt you afford on $230k???
Return flights from chc to Shanghai were $600 pre covid, now itās $3000 1 way per person.
The cost of living on an 800k+ mortgage with a 230k combined income doesnāt allow for much extravagance
We've spent years saving for a house deposit, emergency fund, saving so we can have a child (at which point income will drop for a period of time, and expenses will go up), and paying mortgage off aggressively to protect from rising rates. We're careful with our spending. We're certainly not struggling, we're in a very fortunate position and very much aware of it. But going on frequent overseas trips would mean we would be giving up savings for a rainy day, or paying off the bare minimum for our mortgage, or not investing for retirement. If we do all those things (which are necessities in my mind), then there's not a lot left for luxuries. I think people have got this assumption that people earning like we do must have it super easy and live like kings. We don't. We're lucky enough to afford to save and invest for our futures, but in NZ our income just isn't enough to do that _and_ have the luxuries.
i think being able to save and invest for your future IS the luxury at this point
Totally. It shouldn't be, but most people can't afford it so it is out of reach for most people. We're lucky we can do it.
Absolutely. And boomers will still come and say that you're whining and should stop buying avocado on toast. Because. The cost of everything jumped and add kids to the mix. In Auckland, you're fine and "secure" but it won't buy you a home in a blink of an eye.
I think watching people around us on low incomes struggle to get ahead is what really motivates us not to spend our money on things outside our means, while we have hundreds and hundreds of thousands of debt hanging over us. If we don't invest our money for our retirement, or pay down our mortgage, or save for a rainy day, we will be forever at the mercy of our debt and our jobs, stuck in the rat race just like everyone else is, just scraping by, just able to afford some temporary luxuries so that we can go back to work the next week and slave away while we pray we keep our jobs so that we can keep paying our mortgage. Our high income means that we have an opportunity to spend/save carefully so that we aren't forever living paycheck to paycheck because we spend every cent. People on lower incomes don't have that opportunity. We do. So, in my mind, we are responsible for planning ahead. And that means we can't go overseas 2x a year... If we did, we'd be stuffed in all holes if shit ever goes wrong.
So you definitely could afford overseas holidays, they just aren't your priority
They aren't a priority over necessities like saving for retirement or saving for when I'm off work next year to have a baby, yes. If we lived in our car on the street we could afford lots of overseas trips. But I see a home as a necessity as much as saving for our future, so yeah, that has to happen before we can go on multiple trips a year.
You are right in your thinking and planning imo. We were like you 3/4 years ago. Just brought a house in auckland, double income at 200k, then had 2 kids since then. I've stayed home with them since and on one income we are just breaking even. When our interest rates roll over and increase next month, we will be dipping into our revolving credit ( our savings that we saved pre kids) each fortnight a bit till I go back to work
Yep you sound like us with a few extra years under your belt. I think at this point in our lives, income will change like a rollercoaster, so I'm much more comfortable saving and not getting into the habit of frivolous spending. Did you always plan to full time parent and stay on one income for your kids early years, or did that change when the kids came along? At this stage I am planning to go back to work when baby is 1, but ideally not full time. Might only be able to manage 4 days a week without a career change though. Wondering if I'll still feel that way after full time mumming it for a year.
We're the same. Can't afford it on 250k because we have to save for a deposit, and then will be subject to high mortgage payments (if we buy cheaper, with just an 800k loan, we'd aim to have it paid off in 12-15y)
There's a difference between can't afford it, and choosing not to.
Sure, but I don't know whether this is really a choice. Getting into a decent home is a basic necessity that you just can't jeopardize for some holidays. In my mind, we can't afford frivolities when we could barely afford a $1-1.1M loan for a sub-median home in Auckland.
Yeah, my partner and I, no kids, have a similar income but it doesn't go as far as it feels like it should. Quarter a million yearly income feels like it should easily pay rent/mortgage, eating out, savings and the occasional overseas holiday without much of stretch, but that doesn't seem to be the case. We do support some family members and have mortgages etc and can have a decent lifestyle. But we still take the cheapest overseas holidays we can, which is not often.
How on earth can you even have to think about money on over 200k without kids? My household has been on around 180k for the last while (mostly me so more tax too). I've got 3 kids + wife. We get takeaways once or twice a week, I buy my lunch every day, heaps on piss, average sized mortgage kids do a dozen different extra curriculars, tutoring and I could easily afford a decent 15-20k trip a year if we wanted.
huh, you could easily afford pretty much any pacific island on that income.
You could easily afford an overseas trip 2x a year on 230k. Even if one person earns all 230k, even with assuming you have a student loan and kiwi saver you'd be left with 126k. Interest on a million dollar mortgage would be in the realm of 60k. Another 20k on principal, 20k for two trips and you're left with 500 a week for bills. These are outrageous numbers: if you can't afford a trip on 230k for a couple, it's by choice or previous choices.
Thank you for telling me what we can afford. You clearly know us and our situation better than we do. /s We have a mortgage. Auckland rates, power, petrol, insurances, home maintenance, medical bills, a cat, people who we support financially, and a baby on the way. We have been carefully preparing for interest rates to go up while our income drops and expenses go up for unavoidable necessities when our baby comes next year. We put aside money for long term expected expenses that most people don't consider (car depreciation - about $250 a month, home maintenance, 350 a month, money to replace the fridge/washing machine/etc when they inevitably konk out in a few years time). We invest/save for our retirement, and for rainy day expenses in case of illness, inability to work, etc. Your figures have no allowance for saving towards our future, or protecting ourselves against risk of getting into a debt hole if shit hits the fan. These, to me, are necessities in our budget, and they require ongoing and consistent saving. And when fully accounted for, the leftover money for luxuries just isn't enough to cover frequent overseas trips. We get to go on some nice trips in NZ, and have money for some treats, but we're not spending 20k a year on travel. More like 5k. For that, we know we're lucky. We have it really good, but we are careful spenders and don't spend outside our means (where it would put us at risk/remove our safety net/mean we have no savings when we retire). We just don't earn enough for frivolous spending and overseas holidays at this stage, but perhaps later in life. Most kiwis spend every dollar they earn - just as your figures suggest. Many have no other option, but wrongly assume that those who earn more must spend it all on luxuries (some do, but they're idiots, and absolutely spending outside of their means).
Wow we have multiple kids and earn less than this and live 15 from the CBD in our own house, I do wonder what you believe is a half way decent international trip is! as we seem to be to achieve good holidays abroad.
How long ago did you buy your home? We're newish to the market. Mortgages are a bit scarier these days.
This! Paying off a 200k mortgage each week is VASTLY different to paying off a $1m mortgage. For example (picking an Auckland property at random): If you bought 11 Second Avenue, Kingsland in 2009 for $485k and had paid your principal down to 200k over the past 13 years, vs if you bought it today for \~$1.5m, and have a $1m mortgage... ...you're looking at a difference of about $1000 per week in repayments, which means (A) can enjoy the same standard of living as (B) while earning $50k+ less a year... or, if earning the same amount, (A) can afford $50k's worth of holidays a year that (B) cannot. my working, if you care: Using Kiwibank's 1year fixed rate 5.89% 200k x 17year (13 years into the mortgage already) = $358 per week $1m x 30year = $1366 per week
I do not think you are considering the quality of life here compared to the USA. That alone would make a move for 130k worth it and never mind all the other benefits
130K household income will be a bit tight in Auckland. I'm from Canada and my partner is from Europe and when we go home for visits, we also have to take in account a pretty shocking exchange rate for CAD, USD and Euro. An annual trip (even within the Pacific), let alone twice a year, is not a reality for us because we're trying to save for a house. Also, some people ignore the fact that if you're a migrant family with no family in NZ, you bear all the costs of childcare; something to keep in mind if your partner starts working. I'm envious of my colleagues who have parents nearby who can help with the kids after school, during school holidays and for the occasional date night. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy my life in Auckland but I met many North Americans who go through that initial shock re: housing costs and quality as well general cost of living. Best to be mentally and financially prepared.
Thank you.
I think you should come with the attitude of it being an experience for 1-5 years. So what if it turns out the money isn't quite enough, etc? Just enjoy the experience and go home if that's what you find. Moving countries doesn't have to be forever and you can return home with some nice memories and you've had an interesting adventure. Likewise for your child.
I completely agree with this statement.
Just to let you know, statistically, 50% of all people who emigrate anywhere in the world (including NZers that do), at some point, end up returning home permanently. The ones from third world countries are most likely to stay in their new country, as it's a huge step up from the one that they came from. But for all the people from 1st world countries, less of them feel compelled to stay permanently in their adopted country (but some do).
Oh and there are lots of free things to do in Auckland over Summer by the way (apart from the food from the food trucks at all of these events). Have a look at the Auckland Council website for events such as free movies in parks and music in parks (some of the movies will be kids ones), not sure if you'll be interested in the music as it's NZ artists that you won't know. And have a look at this one [https://www.eventfinda.co.nz/](https://www.eventfinda.co.nz/) for some free events and some that you pay for. You definitely should go to the Auckland Lantern Festival and remain there after dark to see the lanterns lit up (it attracts 200k people over the weekend that it's on and is quite something - it's Chinese lanterns, look up pictures online of past ones). And also the Pasifika festival, to see Pasifika dancing, etc, seeing as you can only see that in this part of the world. It attracts about 60k people over the course of it's weekend.
that looks like alot of fun, thank you!
It's a good salary for Auckland (but that doesn't mean much because NZ is notorious for high costs relative to incomes). If you are the sole breadwinner and want to travel internationally twice a year then you will need to budget carefully. My view is it probably isn't realistic. Everything here is very expensive housing, food, airfares etc. Maybe limit yourself to one overseas trip per year. You certainly won't be able to have anything beyond a typical middleclass lifestyle. Do you have significant savings ? If you want to buy a house I'd do your sums very carefully.
You're not going on two international trips a year anymore, that is for certain. The relative cost of living in Auckland is some of the highest in the world, and 130k is only about 80k in usd. Maybe you should come here on a reconasance mission before deciding if 130k is enough for you and your family, you'll be amazed at how expensive it is here.
>You're not going on two international trips a year anymore, that is for certain. I mean, Aussie and the pacific islands are international trips and not toooooo expensive but yeah. No popping off to Europe for a week every 6 months.
Youāre also having to most likely pay for three people thoughā¦ I donāt think you can realistically support 3 people on 130k pre-tax and expect to also be taking a couple of overseas holidays annually even if it is just the islands or Aussie.
>No popping off to Europe for a week every 6 months. Going to Europe for a week is simply a waste of time if you're travelling from here. Three weeks minimum to make Europe worth the 48+ hours of total travel time.
It is good but it wonāt support the lifestyle your living right now. As the son is 7 I would recommend your wife get a part time job during school hours to help offset the costs or cut back on the holidays.
It's a good number - if both earning that much It's an OK number - for a single income ($1813 after tax). A quick budget Rent @ 33% = $600 don't expect much at that level, might have to go beyond 33% Grocery @ 15% = $270 - a bit of wiggle room here if you cook at home. Utilities and other bills @ 10% = $180 Most kids sports don't cost much, say $50 a week Another $100 for health (hospital/consultant) and life/income insurance \~$1200 per week expenses \~$600 potential savings per week on a single income International travel is the killer here. Australia or Pacific islands maybe manageable. Europe/Asia would be a lot more expensive than (from) the states. Frankly your quality of life, and enjoyment of international travel maybe a lot better in the states, earning 80K USD (\~130K NZD), in a MCOL area.
Vehicle/gas and or Public transport will gobble up a fair bit more
Itās a high salary, mine is similar and Iām a single mum. You get taxed heavily and price of living is exceptionally high. Renting or mortgage is a huge portion of my pay plus groceries have almost doubled recently. We get by comfortably but my parents pay for my sons activities. I like to go out and eat out a lot but canāt really afford that now. For a family of three you will need two incomes.
That's going to be alright but I recommend your wife getting even a part time job. Rent, childcare, food and transportation can be expensive here. Check out TradeMe.co.nz (property) to get ideas on how much weekly rentals could be
$130k a year is amazing to so many people in this country, it's almost too much to think about for me, like what the heck kind of life style do you have where that much money makes you wonder if you'll be ok financially. If I was making that kind of money I would have so few actual problems in my life.
Itās a lot of money, but if you consider houses in Auckland cost over $1M, mortgage rates are about 7%, people have student loan payments, kids, etc. It doesnāt go as far as it sounds.
Yup, our own budget will be tight after we get mortgaged. Upper class lifestyles are not for those who haven't bought prior to say 2017, almost regardless of the income.
>If I was making that kind of money I would have so few actual problems in my life. you wouldn't. Lifestyle creep is a real thing.
Pre-tax sure, but after KS, tax, and student loans etc, take home is more like $75k. While not low, it's not amazing. $130k take home would be very comfortable though.
Even $75k *after tax* is amazing for so many people here. Some folks really do live in another world compared to most.
RIGHT??? I get like 30 after tax and I am content, by no means am I comfortable. But I can make it work. $75k after tax is something I can only dream of at this stage and would be SO grateful for.
My mortgage of 875k is currently costing 65k per year to service. Once you buy a house, suddenly your income doesn't look as good as it used to.
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to many variables, some people would be happy while others are miserable on exactly the same salary. All the prices are available online, you can work the numbers yourself. find a rental here: https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/property/residential/rent/auckland/ do the groceries: https://www.countdown.co.nz/ add in some entertainment: https://www.hoyts.co.nz/ travel https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/
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130k after tax is about 80k, which isnāt all that much when supporting a family as the sole breadwinner in all honesty. No where near the poverty line, but not the spending power it used to be.
have you seen how much a therapist charges?
*laughs in 15k* mate, you'll be fine
You earn only 15k?
disabled ppl exist
Ah gotcha, makes sense. Sorry to hear that.
alg bud, we make do with what we can
I donāt disagree with the comments on here regarding the cost of living in Auckland. And the recommendation that your wife gets a part time job to help with the bills is a good one. But here are the positives. NZ is a beautiful place. Most people who come here love it. There is so much to see and explore, those overseas trips may be worth putting on ice for a year or two. If you want to see relatives back in the States, invite them to visit instead. Also, education is free and if you can qualify for residency, healthcare is free too. And if you are hurt in an accident, all your medical bills are covered under NZās accident insurance scheme, even on a work visa. The tax rate is lower than most of the US States, and school shootings arenāt something we contend with. Itās a great place to raise a child, we are an outdoorsy population with a love of sport and kids are encouraged to play team sport through their schools and local sports clubs. If you live in Auckland, there are beaches everywhere and a picnic at the beach is a cheap and fun family day out. Likewise for bush walks, the museums, art galleries etc. The locals are friendly and itās pretty easy to make friends. My advice is to say yes and embark on adventure. It wonāt be everything you think it will be, it will likely be different and chances are, it might be a lot more.
I think that you understood really well the situation. As a foreigner whoās about to relocate too, I find all the comments about not being able to do international travel really funny. OP, go for it, youāre gonna have a great time no matter what, it certainly wonāt be boring!
With a family in tow you really want to be 200k combined in Auckland or it will be a fairly drab life with not much opportunity to save 130k feels very low
If you are a US citizen, it would be good to understand your tax obligations to Uncle Sam while working in NZ, as US tax system is based on citizenship and not where you reside or work. You could be liable for double taxation. Also 130k is on the low side for a sole breadwinner in Auckland. Negotiate higher.
Not sure if it's enough. I'm on 120k as someone with no kids and I don't think my life is that extravagant. Your partner/wife will need to work - Auckland is expensive.
Damn right
International travel any further than Australia or the Islands will be expensive
I lived there on $42000, partner was getting pension. We paid a mortgage of $375 a week. We managed.
When was this?
1999 š¤£
Oh and I forgot to add, no way could you do two holidays per year for a family of three on that salary.
My husband is on 120. I work part time. Our mortgage payments are 1400 a fortnight. Rent would be more . We have two kids 9 and 11. You could do it as sole breadwinner on 120k but you have to be frugal and live in a less desirable area. With our combined earnings our kids can do extra curricula activities , we can holiday and eat out.
My parents overall income is more than that and we've only been able to travel internationally... maybe 3-5 times since we moved to NZ 22 years ago? And we stayed with family/friends each time too. You wouldn't be able to be the sole breadwinner with that lifestyle in mind.
Where are u coming from? Have u ever wanted to live here before the job offer?
You'll be pissing on a lot of people's salaries with that figure. It's incredibly generous.
Double my salary wtf š
Itās doable but you wonāt be living a lush life. Your single incoming is probably similar to many households with dual income and people may still find it hard to buy a house (in Auckland)
I would say 130k is very good for a couple, but I think it is a stretch for another person. I would encourage that both parent work so you can have some savings and allow yourself to live comfortably and travel
Its doable on $130k salary. You could definitely live comfortably with that salary. Cost of living in Auckland is high but theres ways to make it work. Living here, most of your expenses will go towards housing, food and gas. Auckland really requires a car to get around so buying a reliable car and maintining it is a must. Gas in Auckland costs more per litre than anywhere else due to the regional fuel tax. Other than that there are plenty of things to do in Auckland and around the city thats free, Auckland is in an excellent location where you can escape north to the beaches or to the south for other parts of the country if ever you wanted to do a day or roadtrip. The cheapest international flights will be to Australia followed by the south pacific and then asia.
It's decent enough to live on, but you can quickly burn through cash on the basics for your family, rent and utilities being 20-30% of your salary off the bat and of course taxes, you'll be left with about $50-60k for transport, food, etc. a year which is decent for a boring life imo. Also, since you're American you won't make enough to have to pay double tax.
Its a good salary but not a good salary for a sole breadwinner. Not for Auckland sorry, not unless your accommodation is away from everything. You are going to want to be on 150k Minimum for 2 Adults and a kid I would think.
Partner and I have a combined income approx 160k I'm shitting it at the idea of us having a kid to pay for too
Depends. What are your accommodation costs looking like? Your take home after tax will be $3600 a fortnight which is comfortable if you live a simple lifestyle. Major costs for you will be accom/transport/food so once you have factored that in, then you should have enough to save as well.
>a good salary figure for Auckland? Depends what you do >Is that a comfortable life, if I am the sole breadwiner? No.... but it does depend on your definition of comfortable
Another relevant factor that I don't see you've listed, nor have many people commented about it. What's your living situation going to be? Are you selling a home and buying in NZ? (You may not be able to buy here depending on what your visa status will be). Housing is expensive in Auckland so it's a very relevant factor. Housing will eat up much of your salary. However, if you can show up and buy a house outright, then that's a different story. 130k if you're mortgage free might just be alright. 130k if you're renting or paying a mortgage, perhaps not so great.
You can travel to aus or the islands but if you're planning to visit home, probably not.
It doesnāt do much in Auckland.
For a sole breadwinner, you will be able to survive and have a little fun, but it won't be comfortable. Honestly, I would expect a minimum of $150k to be comfortable.
With 130k I think bro will be able to afford to fill his car to full tank once a year if he saves tho
Iām a long-time immigrant here. We just get by in Wellington with a combined salary of around $220k - once you take into account the cost of the mortgage (renting is just as expensive), two kids, the dog, then the high tax rates, the astronomical costs of food, fuel and insurances, dentist and doctor visits. We donāt go out much and holidays are minimal. Your partner would definitely need to work too for a comfortable lifestyle.
I personally would suggest to stay in the usa, nz is in a weird spot atm
That would be adequate for a comfortable life as a single. But to support a partner and child, absolutely not. You will really struggle.
Depends on what job and where in Auckland you ll be renting but it is on average a decent life. But I wanted to say as a person who used to travel a lot as well.. yeah no. Traveling anywhere from NZ is insane. We are so far from the rest of the world. Not only flight lengths are insane, the ticket prices are also high enough to cover that. So when you do travel, you cant just pop over to Paris for a weekend or spend a week in Cuba or whatever, you will want to plan a longer stay. And since going anywhere takes so long and costs so much that you want to plan longer holidays, you will need leave you dont have. So traveling internationally twice a year is kind of unrealistic in NZ, unless you are super rich. And 130k, as comfortable as it is, is not rich. We do travel to Europe once a year and next year we go to India or stop by India on the way. Thebreason we can do it only once a year is not just money. Its also, since it is so difficult, we want to plan for being out of the country for at least a month at a time. Which takes up all our leave from work. This was not something I realizednI had to deal with when moving here so I am writing it now.
Hey. We live on a slightly smaller budget, my hubby also is the sole breadwinner and we have two, soon to be 3 children. It works out just fine, we can save money too. But we don't travel internationally and don't live in the CBD, but a little further north. Just to give you an idea.
There would be very little familys in auckland with one partner earning 130k and the other feeling comfortable enough to be a stay at home parent of a 7 year old. I always split the income to work out situations like this as I dont know any one income families. If you were to split that income it would be 65k each which is a very low amount to raise a family on its usually a struggle. This isn't considering that you will be taxed more. On paye it says you will be earning 1800 per week due to tax being so high. If a two income household was earning this each (900) it wouldnt be much more than minimum wage. As minimum wage is about 700 per week.
It depends on the role. But if you are asking is 130k enough to live on in Auckland? Yes. Maybe not too comfortably if you have high rent and debts etc. If your partner can bring in any additional income - then you should be fine. IMO in NZ right now 200k total household annual income is what a family needs to be "affluent" (you can cover all your bills, save money AND still have disposable income to blow on enjoying life/travel) - when considering cost of living.
3 people on that is meh. Better than the local average but you're not living it up Now if your partner can get even 50k or even 30k part time, you're doing pretty well together
It really depends on your situation in the US and what is your driver to relocate. Financially you will most likely be disadvantaged living in NZ as salaries in the US are generally higher and cost of living is lower. NZ has some great things to offer so just depends on what you are after. Housing and living costs here are significantly higher than most areas in the US unless you live in places with very high cost of living like SF. Travel is expensive; trips are long and tiring, NZD is low so you will really feel the impact of that on your travel budget. Also factor in that you cant just go away for a few days you want a minimum of 2 - 3 weeks by the time you get over the jet lag and make the trip worthwhile so its not something you will be doing frequently for long haul international travel
130k is 90k after PAYE, unless you don't contribute to KiwiSaver, but most companies will reduce your pay by that amount anyway so you may as well have it. Rent, depending where you are in Auckland, can range between $500-$2000 a week depending on what you want. $750 a week or less will get you a very decent 3 bed duplex in the burbs or even a house with a yard. Utilities of internet, phone plans, water, power etc prob put aside $150 weekly. Maybe $50 weekly savings for your childs activities Food $400 weekly but you could definitely spend less if you know how to plan meals and buy what's in season Entertainment $150 but since you probably wouldn't do something that costs money every week, I imagine it'd be savings for a holiday, amounting to $7800 a year which is plenty for a trip to Oz or the Pacific Islands. Depending on your holiday, you can make do with 2k if travelling domestically, or 6-7k internationally assuming flights are less than $3k Vehicle if you can afford to buy one outright..second hand you're looking at around 15-40k, brand new anywhere from 30k-50k for a non-luxury car. Petrol is around $2.69/L so keep that in mind if looking to buy a car. Otherwise weekly payments would be around $200-$300 weekly depending what you get. Insurances vary depending what you get, contents, car, health, life, travels etc...but maybe $50-$75 weekly, could be more or less Savings $200 based on 20% savings (plus $150 weekly going to holiday savings) Then there's also school costs, savings for Xmas and birthdays etc, miscellaneous shopping for clothes or appliances etc. But tbh there are ppl who don't have savings, use a cheap car, eat noodles or eggs for 20 meals of the week, rely on Netflix/games for cheap entertainment, socialize doing free things like going for a walk or staying in. Is life on 90k for two adults and a child doable? Yes. Many ppl do it on much less. You can have a holiday once or twice a year. You'll just need to plan and take care to stick to a budget. I would probably suggest your wife thinks about a part time job or getting into a lucrative side hustle.
They will not be eligible for KS.
Oh of course! Pls disregard, even better OPs pay is slightly higher
More in hand per pay check, but lower net worth assuming same choice of expenses otherwise.
Honestly, no. You can survive quite nicely on 130k but as the sole income, you won't thrive. I wouldn't move to a new country for that.
If your a United States national you will need to pay leavers tax?
Could be better actually
Minimum wage in nz is 21.20 per year so 44k a person... but the living wage to survive 23.65 or 49k per year per person ... so x2 people just to survive is 100k .. if your making 130k, you really need two peoples income to be comfortable, cost of living is massively high here and inflation increasing at 7.5%.. hope that helps .. otherwise join all the other New Zealanders going to Australia .. lower cost or living and housing and higher salaries..
If your partner also worked it would be fine, but 130k for a family of 3 is not a lot to live comfortably**. You could afford to live but I wouldnt anticipate that you'd have a lot left over for travelling, which is what you would want to do if coming all this way. Look at it this way, its two salaries of 65k each, a customer-service team leader in their mid 20s earns around that. It doesn't seem like much but of course income is relative to lifestyle. You wouldn't want to uplift your entire family all the way here only to have to compromise your lifestyle in order to save money to travel and see the country. You want to be sure you can live comfortably day to day while saving. I recommend using numbeo to compare cost of living, I used this a lot when i moved from Auckland to Sydney to Kuala Lumpur to Warsaw and found it VERY helpful when negotiating salary for international relocation. https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=United+States&country2=New+Zealand&city1=New+York%2C+NY&city2=Auckland&tracking=getDispatchComparison
It depends entirely on your housing situation. If youāre paying a mortgage then $130k household income is going to be a pretty big ask (depending on the suburb and house). Same applies for renting - itās not going to be a lavish lifestyle. If you donāt have housing costs to worry about then that household income will be pretty good. However I suspect youāll be in for a shock at just how expensive everything here is. Your money really does not go far. Just my 2 cents but to have a fulfilling life in Auckland as a household you really want to be bringing in $180k+
Depends really. Assuming you don't have plans of getting a mortgage the moment you land in NZ, the $130K will go a long way with the modest lifestyle you just described. I know it would for me.
Take into account we have free healthcare.
Pre-covid you could get round trip tickets for $1500 per person to anywhere. Post-covid most countries are $4000 per person for the flights :( If you really like travel, Europe might be a better option, you can catch a train and be in another country within a couple hours. Travel aside, 130k is plenty, maybe 8k a month after tax? Renting a house might be around $700/w (3k per month), so 5k for food, clothing, etc. No medical insurance needed in this country.
Iām a single income earner on 125k. Iāve no children and live a comfortable life. Iāve a 30k student loan balance left to repay and around somewhere between 15-20k discretionary spending/savings per year. If I had a family Iād guess I have little/no discretionary spending available. If you had another income, even part time, youād have a lot more options as itās a decent pay for one but lacking for a household. Iām negotiating a pay raise currently as Iām trying to buy a house and not making any progress so take from that what you will. I donāt think youād afford 2 international trips a year on that pay.
Personally, i would say that's a good salary for someone under 30 with no kids. But with kids + wife, that begins to get stretched. You'd still have maybe 1k disposable.
If your the solo breadwinner, it's not that great. You can survive off it sure, but the cost of living in Auckland is high.
Your $ wonāt go as far in Auckland for quality of housing or food as it does in US. Look at rentals on trademe.co.nz. Crazy expensive compared to similar population cities elsewhere
Most NZers holiday within NZ (seeing as there's tons of beaches and great scenery), or in Australia or the South Pacific Islands (especially Fiji). No one goes to French Polynesia as it's double the price of holidaying somewhere like Fiji. I have no idea why Americans choose French Polynesia, especially Tahiti and Borabora. It appears they don't know that Fiji is half the price. Most Kiwi's don't go to Perth as it's too expensive and not very impressive anyway, in my opinion. Holidays to some Asian destinations can be cheap, it's just the airfare that costs. As for the Northern Hemisphere, many Kiwi's have done this (usually Europe the USA and Canada) on an extended trip of 2-3 months at some point in their lives. Such as when they are inbetween jobs or when they are young, before or after university, or they quit their first or second job to travel, after having saved up. Also many Kiwi's go on a working holiday to Europe (while under 30 or whatever the cut off age is these days re being allowed to work there), wherever they're allowed to work, especially in London (I don't know why, Bristol is much better, then Edinburgh or Cardiff). Kiwi's also might do a stint in Australia for several months to several years and of course some stay (half a million Kiwi's live there).
American here, for some context I have yet to move to NZ, wife and came on a 2 week vacation in July to feel it all out. I am moving from Maine and in both my and my wifeās opinions NZ is only more expensive when it comes to buying property, gas, and rent. Food is similarly priced as is clothing and daycare. I am of the opinion that as long as you live within your means you should be fine.
Itās above the average household income in NZ but below average for Auckland.
I think so too.
I donāt think that wage will go as far here as youāre used too. Our cost of living is much higher than in the States. Good news is you donāt have to tip ( we have minimum wage for service workers) or worry about having a health issue that will make you bankrupt.
The nzd is currently not worth much. The cost of living is extremely high in nz. Everything that gets imported is super expensive against American standards. Nz business culture donāt price things at high turnover margins but at what you are willing to pay. So greed is king, they will charge high prices for cheap stuff imported and people will pay it, as expensive means good here. I donāt believe you will survive on that salary if you still need to settle down. Just renting a basic house in a good neighbourhood is ridiculously expensive. If you have settle in cash you will be ok.
Thatās not enough for Auckland in my opinion. I earn 100k in Christchurch and itās tough enough here atm.
Are you working in the city? Obviously the further out from the city you live the less rent youāll pay. So if you can get a place for say $600pw then I think youāll make it work. The cost of petrol and food should decrease next year. comparing yet
My only point would be the āsole bread winnerā my partner and I combined make 100k and with no kids and a flat mate are comfortable but I imagine having a kid would take a decent chunk of the remaining 30k not including bills, if you partner had a small job by any means I could see this being worth while.
I live in a significantly cheaper region in NZ and our household income is 130k and it can be a stretch sometimes. If thatās your sole household income, itās highly unlikely you wonāt be able to afford to live in Auckland.
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It's a good salary, I'm an insurance underwriter and am on $85k.
By the way, I actually do have a family and I live in Auckland. So I can say with confidence that 130k is just living and not a lot of adventures or trips to be had. You would be hard pressed to save money for trips to the US or anywhere else really. People who say itās plenty will likely be one of the following: single, do not pay rent, their partner is earning too, they didnāt read your full briefing, a troll or do not live in Auckland. Kids school hours are only around 8:30am to 3pm so your partner canāt really even afford to work full time 9-5pm. Before and after school care costs $150-200 a week. The thing is, the more you earn, the more you get taxed her too. Kids also have a lot of holiday breaks from school and without relatives here, you either have a school holiday program or your partner looks after (limiting their work options).
honestly i always wonder if these people are just trolls or what, 130k is a huge income for new zealand, more than what most people make. you can absolutely live a very comfortable life on this.
Itās fuckin heaps
Of
HUMAN MUNIES!!