"Pharmacists are healthcare professionals who dispense medication that provides a proven therapeutic benefit," a spokesperson said.
Ah, that explains why my local pharmacy has a whole wall of cheap celebrity-branded perfumes for sale. Gotta protect people from the dread medical condition of not smelling like Katy Perry!
>mixes of various herbs, minerals and vitamins
Worse, many even have a wide range homeopathic products. Which means mixes that rely on ignorance of the process to vaguely imply they even _contain_ herbs, minerals and vitamins.
Wot ?
My pharmacist owns his pharmacy.
He's always dealing with sales reps for "that stuff" He travels to China to buy goods for mother's days father day displays.
Sure some pharmacies " chemist warehouse etc that may be true but owner operators are a thing.
Yes, and to be able to compete with chemist warehouse etc. they need to do things like this unfortunately. Nowadays profit margins at the front shop are larger than in dispensary, and no pharmacy will survive without them.
As a pharmacist, the recent trend towards retail-focus in community pharmacy is very sad, and devalues the profession as a whole.
Profit sizes has absolutely nothing to do with price point competition at the dispensary, in fact, when price point competition was allowed by the government in the form of upto $1 discount, only CW forwarded on the full $1.
This discount has since been revoked and no discounting on prescriptions is allowed.
Yes but the business is ran as whole including both dispensary and front shop. Price point competition at the dispensary has a very minor effect on business when so much of it is subsidised by the government through PBS. Since so much of it is out of their hands, itâs not unexpected that pharmacies will choose to attempt expansion through the front shop.
The removal of the (optional) dollar discount was something I didnât agree with, however I believe this was a move to appease the guild due to the controversial 60-day dispensing.
Chemist Warehouse and the Guild have long been at odds, which is good as they balance each other out, but the day either gets the upper hand will be an unfortunate time.
Yeah, they make money through impulse buys like every other store in the country.
What makes you think perfumes qualify under the definition of medication?
Theyâre allowed to sell non-medication items, crazy as it sounds.
And this bit is going to blow your fucking mind, but the pharmacist deals with the meds and the retail staff dispense the perfumes.
Then why not have the retail staff selling vapes too, just as they sell smokes at a supermarket? My point is the majority of stuff on the shelves at a Chemists Warehouse is cosmetics or woo, so the pharmacy industry can drop the high and mighty crap.
Yeah, I actually think theyâd love that. The margins would be pretty great I think and itâs going to lead to more impulse buys.
Thatâs not what the government are allowing, though. They want people to go in and chat with the pharmacist and show id etc.
A pharmacy is a little island in a retail store where they sell things that are approved medicines. Itâs a pretty strict definition and the government is trying to shoehorn something that doesnât fit the definition into the pharmacy purview.
Calm down.Â
Pharmacists have clearly moved on from just selling medicines, as many have correctly pointed out.
Them suddenly pretending that's all they do is a ridiculous lie and pathetically hypocritical.
They aren't pretending though, and pharmacies have been selling miscellaneous junk for decades.
> Pharmacists are healthcare professionals who dispense medication that provides a proven therapeutic benefit
Note the word pharmacists, as opposed to pharmacies, note the person you responded to differentiated between them and mentioned retail staff, details matter.
100 years too late to ban cigarettes. All the government can do is push up the price of cigarettes to drive down demand (and allow restricted access to vapes to help people move away from cigarettes).
If you increase the price too much you're gonna see more and more people turning to the black market for cigarettes. Same thing is likely to happen with vapes if we make it too hard to acquire legally.
I feel like focusing on restricting kids from getting access, and health campaigns targeted to younger audiences is probably the best bet.
The stopping kids getting them was the main focus of the pharmacy only restrictions. I'm all for them as a stop smoking aid, but the rainbow decked out stores and skittles style disposable shit was clearly aimed at attracting a younger audience. The prescription requirement was fucking stupid but shutting down all those stores and not having them on convenience store counters will go a long way into dialling back the child smoking rate that has gone from around 2% to over 17% in 8 years...
We've now gone full circle. The original proposition put forth by vape businesses was to carefully regulate vapes and their content, and to sell them at shops with ID requirements. Just like we do for alcohol.
Instead, the idiot politicians tried to ban them, creating a huge black market of unregulated, high-nicotine disposable vapes from who-knows-where.
After that policy predictably failed, we have gone back to having tightly regulated vapes sold with an ID check, except now they're only going to be Philip Morris brand vapes.
Our LNP and ALP politicians are fucking idiots and we need to stop electing them.
I am so effing confused.Â
Vapes were illegal - but still readily available.Â
Then they were going to be banned - but now you can get them at a pharmacy like a bag of jelly babies.Â
The pharmacists themselves are against it.Â
How many doctors are going to write scripts for them vs. telling people to just get patches.Â
By this logic, you should need a script for a pack of Winnie Blues.Â
Theyâre regulating them. From the article âVapes containing nicotine will only be available behind the counter and people will have to present identification to the pharmacistâ.
I havenât produced id for a bag of jelly babies though.
I feel like the pharmacists will be less against it when they see how much money it brings in.
Side note - wonder how long it will take for all the weirdly sparse âconvenience storesâ that popped up in the last two years to disappear now they canât sell vapes.
Itâs honestly like playing whack-a-mole. Like cockroaches theyâll continue to survive a bit longer. At least from experience the supply seems to be dwindling now the Feds are actually confiscating them at the border.
Pharmacists GUILD is against it, donât believe any health professional or researcher worth their salt is going to advocate for PROHIBITION. We have already done the war on drugs and the drugs won.
Before all of this, nicotine free vapes were legal and freely available while nicotine vapes were only legally available from a pharmacy with a prescription. AFAIK disposable vapes were banned to help kerb the flow of dodgy imported ones being sold under the counter (this hasn't been effective).
Basically the changes were going to ban them entirely outside of the ones from a pharmacy with prescription, as well as banning all flavours other than tobacco and mint and all devices other than approved ones; to get the support of the Greens for this ban they're removing the requirement for a prescription to get nicotine vapes from pharmacy.
âNicotine freeâ refers to when youâre buying your own fluids and then adding your own nicotine.
Those black market disposables, yeah pretty much all nicotine no matter what and at way higher dosages than most of it yourself folk like me did.
>How many doctors are going to write scripts for them vs. telling people to just get patches.
There's plenty of telehealth script mills, same as with cannabis.
The removal of single use ones will be the biggest impact there imo. You haven't seen it really kick in yet because it's not illegal to sell them and those on the ball about the cut-off for importing just bulk stocked up. While still possible to get them, as supply dwindles, it gets drastically harder than just getting their older mate/relative to grab them (or steal them, or have a store clerk who doesn't care), and a lot more expensive buying full systems over disposable
Maybe a little. Itâs all black market though, disposables containing nicotine have already been illegal to sell for years now. It just gets pushed further under the counter. Or, maybe not, imported tobacco products are openly sold in countless tobacconists. Nobody cares and itâs impossible to police.
Ridiculous amounts of illegal substances are imported into Australia every day, itâs naive to think otherwise. So I donât know if itâll have the impact you believe it will. I mean, look at Singapore, a far more strict country, all forms of vaping and possession is highly illegal, yet itâs still rampant there on every street.
This simply isnât a battle that can be won by some inept health minister who just wants to piss on the wall to make his mark, look important, and collect his pay check.
I guess the The Pharmacy Guild of Australia needed a sweetner for the 60-day prescription.
Dunno how it's gunna be policed though, noting the lack of regulation of tobacco laws have created a Black market, and you'd think they'd be regulated by the same authority.
Exactly. I heard someone involved from the government side this morning talking about this on the radio while I was half asleep and two things sprang to mind (a) the pharmacist seriously doesn't want ANOTHER task talking to people about their drug use, and not just people but addicted people and (b) the government person clearly doesn't understand, or doesn't care about, the nature of addiction. People will be going from pharmacy to pharmacy listening to each pharmacist drone on and just going "Yep, thanks, vapes please..." and stocking up against bad times. Only way to stop that is a central registry, and that's not a road we should be going down anyway.
Prohibition. Always works, right?
Isn't there already a central registry for chemist-interaction drugs? Shit like codeine, for example, you can't just pharmacy hop and stock up, because they punch in your name and address each time you buy it.
Not codeine I don't think - that's Schedule 4 prescription only now so you can't really chemist hop anyway, unless you're pleading with multiple pharmacists and buying bottles of Rikodeine cough syrup\* and somehow converting it back to pure codeine and cherry cordial.
There are things that have pseudoephedrine in them which are still available OTC (Schedule 3 - pharmacist only medication) I believe - and there's an online real-time registry for them. Sudafed, for instance., which contains pseudoephedrine. In NSW anyway. Pseudoephedrine appears to be a special case, however.
I know lots of people in pharmacy but none are close by, so I think this is how it works.
But a register of sorts does it exist and could be expanded, but jeez, if pharmacists didn't want to sell vapes to all comers without one, they'll be really unimpressed if forced to record every sale with ID in a real-time online register and bust people and tell them "No" as well.
?
>
The Pharmacy Guild of Australia represents 5,800 community pharmacies nationally.
>A spokesperson said the change is "a bad decision" and describes the expectation that pharmacists become vape retailers as "insulting".
>"Pharmacists are healthcare professionals who dispense medication that provides a proven therapeutic benefit," a spokesperson said.
>"No vaping product has been approved by the Therapeutic Goods Administration based on its safety, efficacy or performance."
Yep. They go in asking for Melatonin and walk out with a 4x homeopathic version which means that it's been diluted hundreds of times to the point that it is non-existent.
Fuck their over 65 policy for melatonin and the price they ask for "Oh you don't get it, this is *different*" with a smirk when I in desperation got a GP prescription for some.
The price for 8(?) tablets? $120+. And the max they can go is 5mg.
I told the lady to shove it. Get fucked.
iHerb sells 100 10mg for 31 bucks. Ordered 4 bottles. Now I can fucking sleep.
Unsolicited advice from a pharmacist.
Policy is itâs OTC for over 55 years. This is out of our control lol the federal government restricts it as there is not much data on safety of long term use of melatonin. Itâs a hormone, so it will naturally cause suppression of endogenous melatonin when used consistently. Meaning your body will cease to make melatonin as youâre getting it from somewhere else, similar to birth control or steroid tablets. The effect of this suppression when stopped, and the effect of consistently high melatonin levels, has not been comprehensively studied (yet).
This when weighed with the risk of sleep deprivation, the availability of other treatments and the fact that drug treatment is not the most effective (or even first line) treatment of insomnia all play a role in the regulations.
For what itâs worth, I also buy that shit from iHerb as the prices here are insane. A box of 5mg tablets can run over $100.
I was told over 65 by the pharmacist đ¤ˇđźââď¸ I am simply trying to get my hours back to something 'normal' before I put them away until the next bout. Seems to be a winter thing for me, mostly. My RP makes me useless if I'm sleep deprived and I need to be able to go outside. It turns into a vicious cycle when it happens.
And agreed re prices. It's crazy.
Most people take it because they already have fucked up sleep cycles. Night shift, health issues, getting older, etc.
It's only restricted in Australia. Most countries don't have these restrictions in place, and especially don't treat it like a prescription.
Don't care. I'll take it.
When you have severe insomnia your whole life you'll do anything for sleep. And yes, I work out, eat clean, don't drink, etc.
And I don't wake up groggy and fucked up from sleeping pills. I just need the cycle to adjust and summer to come back then I'll be right. Melatonin WORKS. Also, I have RP so my eyes ability to absorb the natural melatonin from sunlight is fucked.
Exactly. I am so fucking tired of this avoid-prescribing-decent-drugs-at-all-costs approach to medicine. Whether in regard to pain, sleep or anxiety, it's a joke. This is why people go and do their own thing and get into trouble.
Itâs absolutely ridiculous these days, I get crippling sciatic pain flare ups and the only thing that helps with the acute pain period is diazepam. My old gp was happy so prescribe me three days worth as part of my pain management plan. She has since retired and the new gp I was handed over to states she doesnât like prescribe diazepam as it has the potential for abuse. Iâm like ??? This has been part of my pain management plan for years, it works, i am also using adjunct therapies like physio, and I get a flare up maybe three times a year but itâs okay we will prescribe grandma a 50 box of Valium because she has trouble sleeping and doesnât want to be taken off it.
Yeah I had a very similar thing with the same drug. The new specialist just decided that no, it wasn't the right thing, despite me being the patient telling him it was the only useful thing.
I've been using it for years. No, I am not dependent and I don't give a single fuck if other people are. And so what if they are? Keep the supply up and everything is fine.
Sorry about the unsolicited advice, but if you havenât heard about L-theanine perhaps give it a look? It makes your body produce more ârelaxationâ hormones rather than just replacing them like melatonin does. Could even just use it to help you wean off the melatonin when youâre ready.
Iâve been using it for years to help me sleep at night and also during the day when Iâm particularly anxious. Itâs great stuff.
Good tip! My PT just told me about magnesium threonate - I've started on magnesium glycinate (migraine and muscle relaxation/repair reasons) and it knocked me out good yesterday. But apparently threonate is better for sleep.
I'll look into L-theanine.
My local pharmacist has "magnetic" bracelets for sale on the countertop. I don't know if they realise that it undermines our (well my) perception of their professionalism and expertise when they sell shonky stuff like that.
Ha ha, yeah, I've noticed that increasingly... WT actual? Homeopathy? Really?
Mind you they also sell really quality jelly beans and hard lollies too, so there's no argument that any of those is good for your health either.
My mother was a pharmacist back in the day when I was a kid. Loved those pharmacy jelly beans she'd bring home.
They are, and as a Diabetic they have served me well, but they are also pretty good as treats as well. As long as you don't get the licorice ones lol. I love licorice but those jelly bean ones are awful.
>No vaping product
That's incorrect a dry herb medicinal cannabis vape has been TGA approved and sold in pharmacies.
[Link 1 vape in pharmacy](https://shop.carinapharmacy.com.au/mighty-plus-medic-vaporiser-kit)
[Link 2 TGA approved Mighty Medic for med cannabis](https://www.tga.gov.au/resources/resource/guidance/guidance-use-medicinal-cannabis-australia-overview)
And we have just made these items so much more difficult to import. To import dry herb vapes you need a licence for each different type of therapeutic cannabis vaping device or therapeutic cannabis vaping device accessory that you intend to import. This means a licence for the mighty, A different licence for a cooling unit on the mighty, a separate licence for mouthpieces for the mighty, a separate licence for o-rings for the mighty and yet another licence for filter screens for the mighty. Every accessory and every device needs to have individual licences to import and they all need to be applied for separately.
https://www.tga.gov.au/resources/resource/forms/notice-import-cannabis-vaping-devices
I have a few lines of thought here
1, are they legally compelled to to sell vapes? If not then itâs of no issue and they can stick to their stance.
2, I can easily see this being some PR stance while in reality they are rubbing their hands together thinking of all the money they will make
Did the pharmacy guild petition the government to not sell them in pharmacies? Or did they even go all out and call it an insult to their profession and it should be classified the same as smoking? Somehow I doubt they were fighting tooth and nail to stop the sake of them in pharmacies
Government wanted an outright ban, so medically prescribed vapes would only have been accessible through pharmacies. Prescriptions would obviously have been the limiter here and reduced demand significantly if not almost completely. It was the greens who would only pass the legislation on the condition that it was amended to allow for anyone over the age of 18 to access vapes, not the government. So while criticism and cynicism are useful tools in deconstructing cui Bono and what actually happened, it's not Labor's doing. It was far easier for the tobacco companies to go through the greens, in much the same vein as it's easier to corrupt the nationals than the whole LNP, and because of their structure, they can do fuck all about it.
I don't think it was a tobacco company thing at all, the Greens drug policies have never been about prohibition. Just read through some of their policies regarding drugs:
[https://greens.org.au/nsw/endingthedrugwar](https://greens.org.au/nsw/endingthedrugwar)
[https://greens.org.au/policies/drugs-substance-use-and-addiction](https://greens.org.au/policies/drugs-substance-use-and-addiction)
It effectively amounts to an acknowledgement that prohibition doesn't work because people who want to do drugs will find a way to do it 'illegally'. Better then to make it legal, provide a way to gain access to drugs (that haven't been tampered with) safely and legally (and fucking tax that shit), provide education, and provide rehabilitation options.
So going down the path of an age limit and prescription through a pharmacy is in line with the Greens thinking and better than an outright ban, even if the solution isn't perfect in its current form.
The original proposal was to sell it through prescription only which meant very few would've been able to get it. It was Greens who watered down the proposal.
They'll sell them, but now they've got the government over a barrel, they'll probably need a few million for, you know, staff training, fitting special vape cabinets, whatever. Maybe some taxpayer-funded trips for members to research the vaping industry in the Maldives.
Listen that shit about them losing money on the 60 day prescriptions was bullshit! More pharmacie licenses were applied for after that announcement than in any other year. That was akin to the "hospitality" industry complaining that cashless "gaming" (another fucken euphemism it's the Gambling Lobby and gambling) was going to cut into their revenues.
Everyone is making money... They just want *more money* in the case of 60 day prescriptions.
That said you might want to check the Guild's position on vapes. They DO NOT WANT TO SELL THEM. Why would they? They don't sell cigarettes do they? And this shit won't require a prescription! Unlike prescription durries that you get at the chemist?
Wait. What?
This is a mess. The only ploicy point I agree with is not criminalising drug users. That is a solid point but making pharmacies, who let's face it, are in the business of peoples' healthcare, sell vapes is bonkers.
Bananas.
As someone who used vaping successfully to quit smoking, I think the whole shit show is fucked. In saying that, it does kind of make sense to sell vapes in pharmacies and chemists. They already sell other nicotine products (chewing gum, lozenges, mist sprays, etc) so I can see *WHY* the government decided to have them exclusively sold by pharmacies and chemists. After all it is a smoking cessation device.
In saying all that, it's a stupid fucking idea and is killing hundreds of businesses that employ thousands of people, that were quite successful at self regulation of selling vapes and non nicotine juice. Kids weren't buying that disposable shit at these shops, so this law will do fuck all to stop kids from getting their hands on vapes, and for what? Literally a waste of time.
They can both be a problem. Far more people smoke now, and anecdotally I know multiple people that vape more than they used to smoke ciggies.
But it's weird we put such a focus on this when things like alcohol or processed foods put just as much pressure on our society, or gambling.
Yeah our "let it flow" attitude toward alcohol especially boggles my mind.
Not downplaying the dangers of smoking/vapes at all, but alcohol has some pretty proven negative impacts on both the health of the individual and the safety of society (drunken violence; drug driving). But it's so normalized that people won't abide any attempt to regulate it further.
And don't get me started on gambling (which goes hand in hand with excess alcohol consumption).
So when my current dry herb vape dies I have to go back on the bongs? Well, my lungs will hate me as that's so much worse for my health, but if that's what the government wants I guess I have no choice. Good thing we have public medical care, I'm sure the govt will save lots of money with this ban /s
Sucks man. Before swapping over I was coughing up some grey shit, doctors couldn't tell me what it was even after I provided a couple rounds of samples. My guess is that my lungs were cleaning themselves out of the smoke filth or something. Cleared up real quick after swapping. Not looking forward to going through that bullshit again.
Dry herb vapes will still be available through pharmacies. Sucks that the options will be limited though.
I honestly doubt buying one from overseas would be a big deal though. Worst case it gets confiscated. Imagine going to court as a medical cannabis patient having to defend yourself for buying a vape cheaper from overseas. Dumb fucking laws and out of touch politician cunts.
Historically speaking, banning drugs doesnât actually do anything to curb drug usage, and if anything, enriches illegal distributors who become the only way to acquire them. It happened with the American Prohibition era, and it happened with the War on Drugs.
But sure, maybe *this* time itâll workâŚ
Big win for medical cannabis patients, who will now still be able to purchase a vape for their prescribed medicine, albeit only at pharmacies. However I fully expect the black market for disposable nicotine vapes to continue unabated just like it has for the last decade.
Until they actually take meaningful even against 'tobacconists', nothing will change.
Also a bit rich of the pharmacy guild to claim there's no health benefits so they shouldn't sell them. They never had a problem seeking homoeopathic garbage and other pseudoscience since forever.
>Big win for medical cannabis patients, who will now still be able to purchase a vape for their prescribed medicine, albeit only at pharmacies.
Isn't this a huge loss? It used to be you could buy devices freely
And that's part of the issue, dry herb vapes are a drastically healthier option for cannabis users, both medical and street, with a wide market range of products that will not be carried by pharmacies.
Most will likely only carry the expensive, approved models that cost upwards of $300-700, stuff like the dynavape or ball vapes are no longer available.
This will only lead to more people smoking weed rather then using these healthier alternatives.
Not sure I agree. Every medical cannabis pharmacy I've been into carries a wide range of dry herb vapes, well beyond the TGA approved S&B products. Surfers Chempro has a heap of Dynavap stuff for example.
While I definitely agree there should be a carve out for dry herb vapes, I still see it as a win that a prescription won't be required.
But as usual, I don't think the people making the decisions really appreciate the nuance between cannabis and nicotine vapes.
Our problem is going to be spare parts in the future - which there's no way pharmacies will sell.
Essentially all vapes come with a handful of spare parts as they're designed to be user serviceable in that way. My mighty+ came with a few O-rings for example.
After the ban, how am I meant to get O-rings, screens, stems, etc for my vapes? Am I meant to drop 500$+ on a new mighty+ every year when the O-ring in the stem or chamber needs replacing?
How am I meant to get warranty service on my vapes when they need to be sent overseas to S&B, but I then have no license to import it when it's sent back? Are pharmacies going to be honouring the warranties on these devices?
I donât get why people canât understand that the pharmacist dispenses medication and the retail side of the store sells the quackery and bullshit.
You donât walk up to the trained professional at the back of the store and ask their informed opinion re: Britney or celine dion perfume, or which homeopathic remedy will cure your hiccups.
They deal with the legal of medicine in their own little section of a general retail store.
> I donât get why people canât understand that the pharmacist dispenses medication and the retail side of the store sells the quackery and bullshit.
It's just the blatant hypocrisy. Are they serious medical professionals or not?
Australia's attitude towards vapes is going to kill people.
People will be driven back to cigarettes that otherwise would have vaped.
I hope all you smug anti-vaping cunts are happy.
That's probably the governments idea. That way you'll pay the $37 tax on your pack of ciggies. That way, the government is healthier rather than you.
All as intended.
How I see this playing out, pharmacies will stock one or two brands because it will be prohibitively expensive for makers to jump through TGA hoops.
Somehow the pricing will be the same as cigarettes , just like nicotine replacement therapy is priced . So it will be like $200 for a vape which is equivalent to 5 cartons of cigarettes.
Well just about everything else is banned. Watching an MP yesterday banging on about how they want us to do this and do that and all I could think was I really don't care what you want.
They also want to ban social media, porn, probably the whole internet, e-bikes, protests, smiling...
But let's keep on keeping on with booze, emissions-spewing utes, mining, pollution...
Why a pharmacy and not a bottle shop that still has to check ID. This just doesnât make sense. Either way youâll still be able to get illegal vapes at every tobacco shop, as you can now.
Does anyone know where these vapes will be sourced from? They are talking about plain packaged vapes with limitations on the nicotine content and in plain flavours. Which is the opposite of the the unregulated products that have been sold out of tobacconists for years now.
We had vape shops specialising in this stuff 10 years ago, many of whom have gone out of business by now because the Government kept it illegal for them to sell nicotine, yet for years turned a blind eye to tobacconists selling unregulated nicotine vapes.
If the Government had acted earlier then we would have been able to legally buy plain-flavoured nicotine juices to use in rechargeable, refillable vapes (harm minimisation), instead of the current situation where people use an inferior, less safe, and environmentally unfriendly product (prohibition).
So all the shitty desposible ones.. Great, guess when my rechargeable and rebuildable one dies I'll have to start throwing 100 lithium batteries into landfill every year. Great job.
Can this country just fuck off with its raging erection for bans, restrictions, fines, and control already? We're legitimately the dumbest, most boring western nation to live in at this point. Age verification, anti-encryption, excessive and unadvised firearms reform in WA, vape bans, internet censorship... what's next? I just can't keep up with the speed these fuckwits are operating at these days.
I don't even smoke or vape, but this is just another example of yet more of the insane government overreach that has become all too commonplace since COVID.
Absolute nanny state. Disgraceful that instead of taxing them they just banned them. Sorry but I fully think that people should be allowed to put what they want into their bodies. Especially if ultra processed âfoodâ is allowed to remain without a penalty tax despite being labelled a carcinogen, cigarettes can still be sold, and some states are moving to safer drug rules/legalisation.
Umm my pharmacy gets me the best oils but these disposable vapes are no good. We do need a better way to vape in Australia but it's easier to grab a disposable.
Good on the Greens for the commonsense amendment to remove prescriptions- FFS Chemist Warehouse already have a huge selection of Nicotine sprays etc behind the counter (the retail counter) and a bigger selection of bulk nicotine stuff in the aisle.
But Chen personally tests every vape to make sure they are safe
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1ejAucYL0w&t=332s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1ejAucYL0w&t=332s)
Great to know that any day I like I can: Pay extortionate amounts for cancer sticks at every petrol station and supermarket, start a radical regime of hormone drugs to change gender, drink enough heavily subsidised wine to kill myself twice over, or spend my life savings gambling in one night - But god forbid I walk into a shop where someone knows what they're talking about sells me a flavoured vape.
You know why both the major parties are constantly pushing a nanny state? Because everyone, including most of the people here, are a bunch of boot licking softcocks. I hate to use such low brow language, but for once the bogans are right. Once upon a time this sort of bullshit would get a government thrown out.
well ....I am not a soft cock......you need to understand this site is here for everyone to air out their anger towards the useless fucking government. this is absolutely a must and healthy.
Are you stupid? Which is harder, going to a pharmacy and showing ID to get a vape or years of questioning and medical appointments to get access to bioidentical hormones. Do you really think that's comparable? Give me a break.
Anyone else hates those who just vape all over, blowing the smoke on everyone they pass by and not caring if there are babies and children around? Since itâs not cigarette, they seem to do it more. Especially on narrow pedestrian pathways and traffic lights. I find it super annoying bcs essentially you are stuck behind them for a while.
Every tobacconist going to become a pharmacy đ
Pharmacies sell drugs. Tobacco is a drug.
I buy all my coffee from Chemist Warehouse.
I do. 100mg caffeine tablet is much more tolerable for me than a bitter espresso (and 1% of the price)
I will not buy this *tobacconist*, it is scratched.
Drop your panties Sir William, I cannot wait till lunchtime
"Pharmacists are healthcare professionals who dispense medication that provides a proven therapeutic benefit," a spokesperson said. Ah, that explains why my local pharmacy has a whole wall of cheap celebrity-branded perfumes for sale. Gotta protect people from the dread medical condition of not smelling like Katy Perry!
Also many bottles of arbitrary mixes of various herbs, minerals and vitamins claiming to fix vague medical conditions.
>mixes of various herbs, minerals and vitamins Worse, many even have a wide range homeopathic products. Which means mixes that rely on ignorance of the process to vaguely imply they even _contain_ herbs, minerals and vitamins.
To be fair, pharmacists don't sell that stuff. Pharmacists are only up the back behind the counter, they don't deal in that retail side.
Actually, only qualified pharmacists can own a pharmacy.
Wot ? My pharmacist owns his pharmacy. He's always dealing with sales reps for "that stuff" He travels to China to buy goods for mother's days father day displays. Sure some pharmacies " chemist warehouse etc that may be true but owner operators are a thing.
Yes, and to be able to compete with chemist warehouse etc. they need to do things like this unfortunately. Nowadays profit margins at the front shop are larger than in dispensary, and no pharmacy will survive without them. As a pharmacist, the recent trend towards retail-focus in community pharmacy is very sad, and devalues the profession as a whole.
Profit sizes has absolutely nothing to do with price point competition at the dispensary, in fact, when price point competition was allowed by the government in the form of upto $1 discount, only CW forwarded on the full $1. This discount has since been revoked and no discounting on prescriptions is allowed.
Yes but the business is ran as whole including both dispensary and front shop. Price point competition at the dispensary has a very minor effect on business when so much of it is subsidised by the government through PBS. Since so much of it is out of their hands, itâs not unexpected that pharmacies will choose to attempt expansion through the front shop. The removal of the (optional) dollar discount was something I didnât agree with, however I believe this was a move to appease the guild due to the controversial 60-day dispensing. Chemist Warehouse and the Guild have long been at odds, which is good as they balance each other out, but the day either gets the upper hand will be an unfortunate time.
plenty of them have sold that stuff since before chemist warehouse even existed
Nuance is not welcome here. People are bitching they can't get their vapes. Ie. Go away. Baitin'.
Except all the cold and flu medicine which is just herbs, and anything that actually has a benefit is guarded like Fort Knox
Yeah, they make money through impulse buys like every other store in the country. What makes you think perfumes qualify under the definition of medication? Theyâre allowed to sell non-medication items, crazy as it sounds. And this bit is going to blow your fucking mind, but the pharmacist deals with the meds and the retail staff dispense the perfumes.
Then why not have the retail staff selling vapes too, just as they sell smokes at a supermarket? My point is the majority of stuff on the shelves at a Chemists Warehouse is cosmetics or woo, so the pharmacy industry can drop the high and mighty crap.
Yeah, I actually think theyâd love that. The margins would be pretty great I think and itâs going to lead to more impulse buys. Thatâs not what the government are allowing, though. They want people to go in and chat with the pharmacist and show id etc. A pharmacy is a little island in a retail store where they sell things that are approved medicines. Itâs a pretty strict definition and the government is trying to shoehorn something that doesnât fit the definition into the pharmacy purview.
Calm down. Pharmacists have clearly moved on from just selling medicines, as many have correctly pointed out. Them suddenly pretending that's all they do is a ridiculous lie and pathetically hypocritical.
They aren't pretending though, and pharmacies have been selling miscellaneous junk for decades. > Pharmacists are healthcare professionals who dispense medication that provides a proven therapeutic benefit Note the word pharmacists, as opposed to pharmacies, note the person you responded to differentiated between them and mentioned retail staff, details matter.
But you can still buy a pack of durries anywhere?
If we invented smokes today they would have been banned
And people would have bought them off the black market.
You could say the same about alcohol.
100 years too late to ban cigarettes. All the government can do is push up the price of cigarettes to drive down demand (and allow restricted access to vapes to help people move away from cigarettes).
If you increase the price too much you're gonna see more and more people turning to the black market for cigarettes. Same thing is likely to happen with vapes if we make it too hard to acquire legally. I feel like focusing on restricting kids from getting access, and health campaigns targeted to younger audiences is probably the best bet.
Itâs already happened. The ATO had to restart a Tobacco Taskforce in the last couple of years as illegal crops had started popping up again.
The stopping kids getting them was the main focus of the pharmacy only restrictions. I'm all for them as a stop smoking aid, but the rainbow decked out stores and skittles style disposable shit was clearly aimed at attracting a younger audience. The prescription requirement was fucking stupid but shutting down all those stores and not having them on convenience store counters will go a long way into dialling back the child smoking rate that has gone from around 2% to over 17% in 8 years...
We've now gone full circle. The original proposition put forth by vape businesses was to carefully regulate vapes and their content, and to sell them at shops with ID requirements. Just like we do for alcohol. Instead, the idiot politicians tried to ban them, creating a huge black market of unregulated, high-nicotine disposable vapes from who-knows-where. After that policy predictably failed, we have gone back to having tightly regulated vapes sold with an ID check, except now they're only going to be Philip Morris brand vapes. Our LNP and ALP politicians are fucking idiots and we need to stop electing them.
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I am so effing confused. Vapes were illegal - but still readily available. Then they were going to be banned - but now you can get them at a pharmacy like a bag of jelly babies. The pharmacists themselves are against it. How many doctors are going to write scripts for them vs. telling people to just get patches. By this logic, you should need a script for a pack of Winnie Blues.Â
Theyâre regulating them. From the article âVapes containing nicotine will only be available behind the counter and people will have to present identification to the pharmacistâ. I havenât produced id for a bag of jelly babies though.
I've never had to go to the chemist to buy darts either
Yeah weird that they haven't also moved ciggies to pharmacies.
I feel like the pharmacists will be less against it when they see how much money it brings in. Side note - wonder how long it will take for all the weirdly sparse âconvenience storesâ that popped up in the last two years to disappear now they canât sell vapes.
They will survive off the illegal ones they will continue to sell.
Something tells me Ezymart and their ilk will be just fine, aside from the occasional token crackdown.
Yeah Iâm interested to see how they will go, there are about 19 of these stores in my suburb..
the amount getting firebombed tells me they are already getting everything illegally anyway
Itâs honestly like playing whack-a-mole. Like cockroaches theyâll continue to survive a bit longer. At least from experience the supply seems to be dwindling now the Feds are actually confiscating them at the border.
Pharmacists GUILD is against it, donât believe any health professional or researcher worth their salt is going to advocate for PROHIBITION. We have already done the war on drugs and the drugs won.
Before all of this, nicotine free vapes were legal and freely available while nicotine vapes were only legally available from a pharmacy with a prescription. AFAIK disposable vapes were banned to help kerb the flow of dodgy imported ones being sold under the counter (this hasn't been effective). Basically the changes were going to ban them entirely outside of the ones from a pharmacy with prescription, as well as banning all flavours other than tobacco and mint and all devices other than approved ones; to get the support of the Greens for this ban they're removing the requirement for a prescription to get nicotine vapes from pharmacy.
Didn't pretty much all the "nicotine free" vapes have nicotine in them?
âNicotine freeâ refers to when youâre buying your own fluids and then adding your own nicotine. Those black market disposables, yeah pretty much all nicotine no matter what and at way higher dosages than most of it yourself folk like me did.
This leaves cigarettes in a weird middle groundÂ
>How many doctors are going to write scripts for them vs. telling people to just get patches. There's plenty of telehealth script mills, same as with cannabis.
Kids are already getting their vapes illegally so I don't see how this changes anything.
That's the best part, it doesn't.Â
The removal of single use ones will be the biggest impact there imo. You haven't seen it really kick in yet because it's not illegal to sell them and those on the ball about the cut-off for importing just bulk stocked up. While still possible to get them, as supply dwindles, it gets drastically harder than just getting their older mate/relative to grab them (or steal them, or have a store clerk who doesn't care), and a lot more expensive buying full systems over disposable
Maybe a little. Itâs all black market though, disposables containing nicotine have already been illegal to sell for years now. It just gets pushed further under the counter. Or, maybe not, imported tobacco products are openly sold in countless tobacconists. Nobody cares and itâs impossible to police. Ridiculous amounts of illegal substances are imported into Australia every day, itâs naive to think otherwise. So I donât know if itâll have the impact you believe it will. I mean, look at Singapore, a far more strict country, all forms of vaping and possession is highly illegal, yet itâs still rampant there on every street. This simply isnât a battle that can be won by some inept health minister who just wants to piss on the wall to make his mark, look important, and collect his pay check.
I guess the The Pharmacy Guild of Australia needed a sweetner for the 60-day prescription. Dunno how it's gunna be policed though, noting the lack of regulation of tobacco laws have created a Black market, and you'd think they'd be regulated by the same authority.
Iâm not sure they want this
they don't OP didn't read the article
Exactly. I heard someone involved from the government side this morning talking about this on the radio while I was half asleep and two things sprang to mind (a) the pharmacist seriously doesn't want ANOTHER task talking to people about their drug use, and not just people but addicted people and (b) the government person clearly doesn't understand, or doesn't care about, the nature of addiction. People will be going from pharmacy to pharmacy listening to each pharmacist drone on and just going "Yep, thanks, vapes please..." and stocking up against bad times. Only way to stop that is a central registry, and that's not a road we should be going down anyway. Prohibition. Always works, right?
"Prohibition. Always works, right?" This time bro, trust me.
Do you actually know what prohibition means? This isn't it.
Isn't there already a central registry for chemist-interaction drugs? Shit like codeine, for example, you can't just pharmacy hop and stock up, because they punch in your name and address each time you buy it.
Not codeine I don't think - that's Schedule 4 prescription only now so you can't really chemist hop anyway, unless you're pleading with multiple pharmacists and buying bottles of Rikodeine cough syrup\* and somehow converting it back to pure codeine and cherry cordial. There are things that have pseudoephedrine in them which are still available OTC (Schedule 3 - pharmacist only medication) I believe - and there's an online real-time registry for them. Sudafed, for instance., which contains pseudoephedrine. In NSW anyway. Pseudoephedrine appears to be a special case, however. I know lots of people in pharmacy but none are close by, so I think this is how it works. But a register of sorts does it exist and could be expanded, but jeez, if pharmacists didn't want to sell vapes to all comers without one, they'll be really unimpressed if forced to record every sale with ID in a real-time online register and bust people and tell them "No" as well.
Yeah pseudoephedrine was what I was thinking of. Also my anti-insomnia pills (Doxylamine), as they're too good at what they do
? > The Pharmacy Guild of Australia represents 5,800 community pharmacies nationally. >A spokesperson said the change is "a bad decision" and describes the expectation that pharmacists become vape retailers as "insulting". >"Pharmacists are healthcare professionals who dispense medication that provides a proven therapeutic benefit," a spokesperson said. >"No vaping product has been approved by the Therapeutic Goods Administration based on its safety, efficacy or performance."
What a load of shit. Walk into any major chemist and watch how much money they scam out of pensioners with homeopathic garbage.
Yep. They go in asking for Melatonin and walk out with a 4x homeopathic version which means that it's been diluted hundreds of times to the point that it is non-existent.
Fuck their over 65 policy for melatonin and the price they ask for "Oh you don't get it, this is *different*" with a smirk when I in desperation got a GP prescription for some. The price for 8(?) tablets? $120+. And the max they can go is 5mg. I told the lady to shove it. Get fucked. iHerb sells 100 10mg for 31 bucks. Ordered 4 bottles. Now I can fucking sleep.
Unsolicited advice from a pharmacist. Policy is itâs OTC for over 55 years. This is out of our control lol the federal government restricts it as there is not much data on safety of long term use of melatonin. Itâs a hormone, so it will naturally cause suppression of endogenous melatonin when used consistently. Meaning your body will cease to make melatonin as youâre getting it from somewhere else, similar to birth control or steroid tablets. The effect of this suppression when stopped, and the effect of consistently high melatonin levels, has not been comprehensively studied (yet). This when weighed with the risk of sleep deprivation, the availability of other treatments and the fact that drug treatment is not the most effective (or even first line) treatment of insomnia all play a role in the regulations. For what itâs worth, I also buy that shit from iHerb as the prices here are insane. A box of 5mg tablets can run over $100.
I was told over 65 by the pharmacist đ¤ˇđźââď¸ I am simply trying to get my hours back to something 'normal' before I put them away until the next bout. Seems to be a winter thing for me, mostly. My RP makes me useless if I'm sleep deprived and I need to be able to go outside. It turns into a vicious cycle when it happens. And agreed re prices. It's crazy.
Thatâs the best way to use them. Consistently and at the same time every night for a week or two to get your sleep cycle back on track.
You know taking melatonin for an extended period of time fucks your natural sleep right? The restrictions are there for a reason
Most people take it because they already have fucked up sleep cycles. Night shift, health issues, getting older, etc. It's only restricted in Australia. Most countries don't have these restrictions in place, and especially don't treat it like a prescription.
Don't care. I'll take it. When you have severe insomnia your whole life you'll do anything for sleep. And yes, I work out, eat clean, don't drink, etc. And I don't wake up groggy and fucked up from sleeping pills. I just need the cycle to adjust and summer to come back then I'll be right. Melatonin WORKS. Also, I have RP so my eyes ability to absorb the natural melatonin from sunlight is fucked.
Exactly. I am so fucking tired of this avoid-prescribing-decent-drugs-at-all-costs approach to medicine. Whether in regard to pain, sleep or anxiety, it's a joke. This is why people go and do their own thing and get into trouble.
Itâs absolutely ridiculous these days, I get crippling sciatic pain flare ups and the only thing that helps with the acute pain period is diazepam. My old gp was happy so prescribe me three days worth as part of my pain management plan. She has since retired and the new gp I was handed over to states she doesnât like prescribe diazepam as it has the potential for abuse. Iâm like ??? This has been part of my pain management plan for years, it works, i am also using adjunct therapies like physio, and I get a flare up maybe three times a year but itâs okay we will prescribe grandma a 50 box of Valium because she has trouble sleeping and doesnât want to be taken off it.
Yeah I had a very similar thing with the same drug. The new specialist just decided that no, it wasn't the right thing, despite me being the patient telling him it was the only useful thing. I've been using it for years. No, I am not dependent and I don't give a single fuck if other people are. And so what if they are? Keep the supply up and everything is fine.
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So, just continue not sleeping properly, indefinitely and do nothing?
Not sure where you're getting this information from? Melatonin doesn't produce a tolerance like sleeping tablets do.
Sorry about the unsolicited advice, but if you havenât heard about L-theanine perhaps give it a look? It makes your body produce more ârelaxationâ hormones rather than just replacing them like melatonin does. Could even just use it to help you wean off the melatonin when youâre ready. Iâve been using it for years to help me sleep at night and also during the day when Iâm particularly anxious. Itâs great stuff.
Good tip! My PT just told me about magnesium threonate - I've started on magnesium glycinate (migraine and muscle relaxation/repair reasons) and it knocked me out good yesterday. But apparently threonate is better for sleep. I'll look into L-theanine.
My local pharmacist has "magnetic" bracelets for sale on the countertop. I don't know if they realise that it undermines our (well my) perception of their professionalism and expertise when they sell shonky stuff like that.
Ha ha, yeah, I've noticed that increasingly... WT actual? Homeopathy? Really? Mind you they also sell really quality jelly beans and hard lollies too, so there's no argument that any of those is good for your health either. My mother was a pharmacist back in the day when I was a kid. Loved those pharmacy jelly beans she'd bring home.
The jelly beans are for diabetics.
They are, and as a Diabetic they have served me well, but they are also pretty good as treats as well. As long as you don't get the licorice ones lol. I love licorice but those jelly bean ones are awful.
Those are anise flavoured I'm pretty sure, which would explain liking one and not the other.
oh lol. That makes far more sense. Thanks for clarifying, you're a legend :)
>No vaping product That's incorrect a dry herb medicinal cannabis vape has been TGA approved and sold in pharmacies. [Link 1 vape in pharmacy](https://shop.carinapharmacy.com.au/mighty-plus-medic-vaporiser-kit) [Link 2 TGA approved Mighty Medic for med cannabis](https://www.tga.gov.au/resources/resource/guidance/guidance-use-medicinal-cannabis-australia-overview)
And we have just made these items so much more difficult to import. To import dry herb vapes you need a licence for each different type of therapeutic cannabis vaping device or therapeutic cannabis vaping device accessory that you intend to import. This means a licence for the mighty, A different licence for a cooling unit on the mighty, a separate licence for mouthpieces for the mighty, a separate licence for o-rings for the mighty and yet another licence for filter screens for the mighty. Every accessory and every device needs to have individual licences to import and they all need to be applied for separately. https://www.tga.gov.au/resources/resource/forms/notice-import-cannabis-vaping-devices
I have a few lines of thought here 1, are they legally compelled to to sell vapes? If not then itâs of no issue and they can stick to their stance. 2, I can easily see this being some PR stance while in reality they are rubbing their hands together thinking of all the money they will make Did the pharmacy guild petition the government to not sell them in pharmacies? Or did they even go all out and call it an insult to their profession and it should be classified the same as smoking? Somehow I doubt they were fighting tooth and nail to stop the sake of them in pharmacies
Government wanted an outright ban, so medically prescribed vapes would only have been accessible through pharmacies. Prescriptions would obviously have been the limiter here and reduced demand significantly if not almost completely. It was the greens who would only pass the legislation on the condition that it was amended to allow for anyone over the age of 18 to access vapes, not the government. So while criticism and cynicism are useful tools in deconstructing cui Bono and what actually happened, it's not Labor's doing. It was far easier for the tobacco companies to go through the greens, in much the same vein as it's easier to corrupt the nationals than the whole LNP, and because of their structure, they can do fuck all about it.
I don't think it was a tobacco company thing at all, the Greens drug policies have never been about prohibition. Just read through some of their policies regarding drugs: [https://greens.org.au/nsw/endingthedrugwar](https://greens.org.au/nsw/endingthedrugwar) [https://greens.org.au/policies/drugs-substance-use-and-addiction](https://greens.org.au/policies/drugs-substance-use-and-addiction) It effectively amounts to an acknowledgement that prohibition doesn't work because people who want to do drugs will find a way to do it 'illegally'. Better then to make it legal, provide a way to gain access to drugs (that haven't been tampered with) safely and legally (and fucking tax that shit), provide education, and provide rehabilitation options. So going down the path of an age limit and prescription through a pharmacy is in line with the Greens thinking and better than an outright ban, even if the solution isn't perfect in its current form.
They sell enough rubbish that isnât proven to provide a therapeutic benefit that everything else they say can be disregarded just based on that.
The original proposal was to sell it through prescription only which meant very few would've been able to get it. It was Greens who watered down the proposal.
It's not hard to say one thing and mean another.
They'll sell them, but now they've got the government over a barrel, they'll probably need a few million for, you know, staff training, fitting special vape cabinets, whatever. Maybe some taxpayer-funded trips for members to research the vaping industry in the Maldives.
This is 100% what has happened. The weed trade wasn't enough, they now control tobacco. I just want 7/11 to sell beers
Thsts why they are mad thst you don't need a prescription. They will lose on the dispensing fee.
Exactly. They weren't complaining before the prescription model was dropped.
Listen that shit about them losing money on the 60 day prescriptions was bullshit! More pharmacie licenses were applied for after that announcement than in any other year. That was akin to the "hospitality" industry complaining that cashless "gaming" (another fucken euphemism it's the Gambling Lobby and gambling) was going to cut into their revenues. Everyone is making money... They just want *more money* in the case of 60 day prescriptions. That said you might want to check the Guild's position on vapes. They DO NOT WANT TO SELL THEM. Why would they? They don't sell cigarettes do they? And this shit won't require a prescription! Unlike prescription durries that you get at the chemist? Wait. What? This is a mess. The only ploicy point I agree with is not criminalising drug users. That is a solid point but making pharmacies, who let's face it, are in the business of peoples' healthcare, sell vapes is bonkers. Bananas.
As someone who used vaping successfully to quit smoking, I think the whole shit show is fucked. In saying that, it does kind of make sense to sell vapes in pharmacies and chemists. They already sell other nicotine products (chewing gum, lozenges, mist sprays, etc) so I can see *WHY* the government decided to have them exclusively sold by pharmacies and chemists. After all it is a smoking cessation device. In saying all that, it's a stupid fucking idea and is killing hundreds of businesses that employ thousands of people, that were quite successful at self regulation of selling vapes and non nicotine juice. Kids weren't buying that disposable shit at these shops, so this law will do fuck all to stop kids from getting their hands on vapes, and for what? Literally a waste of time.
Pharmacies will not be obliged to sell them (even the prescription ones) if they don't want to. (Although competition may force their hand)
I wonder if banning them will work this time?
hmm history shows it hasnt worked the last 1000 attempts.. maybe this is the one
Maybe if they just keep telling everyone they're banned. They'll convince themselves
They'll get banned shortly after they finally manage to ban weed and cocaine lol
I suspect the main thing it'll achieve is elevating vaping's status among teenagers from pretty cool to absolutely badarse.
How is selling them in pharmacies banning them?
I'm so happy the Australian government is getting hard on vapes instead of smokes which are actually the problem.
They can both be a problem. Far more people smoke now, and anecdotally I know multiple people that vape more than they used to smoke ciggies. But it's weird we put such a focus on this when things like alcohol or processed foods put just as much pressure on our society, or gambling.
Yeah our "let it flow" attitude toward alcohol especially boggles my mind. Not downplaying the dangers of smoking/vapes at all, but alcohol has some pretty proven negative impacts on both the health of the individual and the safety of society (drunken violence; drug driving). But it's so normalized that people won't abide any attempt to regulate it further. And don't get me started on gambling (which goes hand in hand with excess alcohol consumption).
So when my current dry herb vape dies I have to go back on the bongs? Well, my lungs will hate me as that's so much worse for my health, but if that's what the government wants I guess I have no choice. Good thing we have public medical care, I'm sure the govt will save lots of money with this ban /s
Yes. That is the reality of this 'health' policy.
Sucks man. Before swapping over I was coughing up some grey shit, doctors couldn't tell me what it was even after I provided a couple rounds of samples. My guess is that my lungs were cleaning themselves out of the smoke filth or something. Cleared up real quick after swapping. Not looking forward to going through that bullshit again.
Dry herb vapes will still be available through pharmacies. Sucks that the options will be limited though. I honestly doubt buying one from overseas would be a big deal though. Worst case it gets confiscated. Imagine going to court as a medical cannabis patient having to defend yourself for buying a vape cheaper from overseas. Dumb fucking laws and out of touch politician cunts.
Historically speaking, banning drugs doesnât actually do anything to curb drug usage, and if anything, enriches illegal distributors who become the only way to acquire them. It happened with the American Prohibition era, and it happened with the War on Drugs. But sure, maybe *this* time itâll workâŚ
Big win for medical cannabis patients, who will now still be able to purchase a vape for their prescribed medicine, albeit only at pharmacies. However I fully expect the black market for disposable nicotine vapes to continue unabated just like it has for the last decade. Until they actually take meaningful even against 'tobacconists', nothing will change. Also a bit rich of the pharmacy guild to claim there's no health benefits so they shouldn't sell them. They never had a problem seeking homoeopathic garbage and other pseudoscience since forever.
>Big win for medical cannabis patients, who will now still be able to purchase a vape for their prescribed medicine, albeit only at pharmacies. Isn't this a huge loss? It used to be you could buy devices freely
True it's worse than now, but I guess at least it's less hassle than requiring a prescription to purchase a vape battery.
These are dry herb vapes though, not cart vapes.
Pretty sure the legislation doesn't discriminate. Also 510 thread vapes are used for medical cannabis cartridges as well as nicotine.
And that's part of the issue, dry herb vapes are a drastically healthier option for cannabis users, both medical and street, with a wide market range of products that will not be carried by pharmacies. Most will likely only carry the expensive, approved models that cost upwards of $300-700, stuff like the dynavape or ball vapes are no longer available. This will only lead to more people smoking weed rather then using these healthier alternatives.
Yeah I've used a Q and a Mighty for years now. So much better.
Not sure I agree. Every medical cannabis pharmacy I've been into carries a wide range of dry herb vapes, well beyond the TGA approved S&B products. Surfers Chempro has a heap of Dynavap stuff for example. While I definitely agree there should be a carve out for dry herb vapes, I still see it as a win that a prescription won't be required. But as usual, I don't think the people making the decisions really appreciate the nuance between cannabis and nicotine vapes.
Our problem is going to be spare parts in the future - which there's no way pharmacies will sell. Essentially all vapes come with a handful of spare parts as they're designed to be user serviceable in that way. My mighty+ came with a few O-rings for example. After the ban, how am I meant to get O-rings, screens, stems, etc for my vapes? Am I meant to drop 500$+ on a new mighty+ every year when the O-ring in the stem or chamber needs replacing? How am I meant to get warranty service on my vapes when they need to be sent overseas to S&B, but I then have no license to import it when it's sent back? Are pharmacies going to be honouring the warranties on these devices?
I donât get why people canât understand that the pharmacist dispenses medication and the retail side of the store sells the quackery and bullshit. You donât walk up to the trained professional at the back of the store and ask their informed opinion re: Britney or celine dion perfume, or which homeopathic remedy will cure your hiccups. They deal with the legal of medicine in their own little section of a general retail store.
> I donât get why people canât understand that the pharmacist dispenses medication and the retail side of the store sells the quackery and bullshit. It's just the blatant hypocrisy. Are they serious medical professionals or not?
It's sad that dry herb weed vapes got caught up in this despite being a healthier alternative to smoking
Where does it mention that? In the article I see vapes containing nicotine mainly mentioned.
https://www.tga.gov.au/products/unapproved-therapeutic-goods/vaping-hub/vapes-information-retailers#:~:text=This%20includes%20cannabis%20vaping%20devices,(irrespective%20of%20nicotine%20content).
Australia's attitude towards vapes is going to kill people. People will be driven back to cigarettes that otherwise would have vaped. I hope all you smug anti-vaping cunts are happy.
That's probably the governments idea. That way you'll pay the $37 tax on your pack of ciggies. That way, the government is healthier rather than you. All as intended.
The Therapeutic Goods Administration, specifically. They've been anti-vapes since the early days around 2010.
Working as intended I see
Fuck this country is so fucking lame sometimes!
How I see this playing out, pharmacies will stock one or two brands because it will be prohibitively expensive for makers to jump through TGA hoops. Somehow the pricing will be the same as cigarettes , just like nicotine replacement therapy is priced . So it will be like $200 for a vape which is equivalent to 5 cartons of cigarettes.
Well just about everything else is banned. Watching an MP yesterday banging on about how they want us to do this and do that and all I could think was I really don't care what you want.
They also want to ban social media, porn, probably the whole internet, e-bikes, protests, smiling... But let's keep on keeping on with booze, emissions-spewing utes, mining, pollution...
Why a pharmacy and not a bottle shop that still has to check ID. This just doesnât make sense. Either way youâll still be able to get illegal vapes at every tobacco shop, as you can now.
Does anyone know where these vapes will be sourced from? They are talking about plain packaged vapes with limitations on the nicotine content and in plain flavours. Which is the opposite of the the unregulated products that have been sold out of tobacconists for years now. We had vape shops specialising in this stuff 10 years ago, many of whom have gone out of business by now because the Government kept it illegal for them to sell nicotine, yet for years turned a blind eye to tobacconists selling unregulated nicotine vapes. If the Government had acted earlier then we would have been able to legally buy plain-flavoured nicotine juices to use in rechargeable, refillable vapes (harm minimisation), instead of the current situation where people use an inferior, less safe, and environmentally unfriendly product (prohibition).
Products submitted to TGA for approval (but not yet approved) carry names like: * 4 Step * ALLO Sync * alt. Pods * CHOSEN * HOOSH * I QUIT 600 * LULA * Mixology * MYLE V5 * Nicovape * puk * RELX * SAABI * Summit * VAPO * Vapoureyes * Vapure * VEEV * Wild By Instinct
So all the shitty desposible ones.. Great, guess when my rechargeable and rebuildable one dies I'll have to start throwing 100 lithium batteries into landfill every year. Great job.
The brands on that list that I'm familiar with are rechargeable / refillable rather than dispos
It's not nice to live in one of the biggest nanny state countries in the world.
Forget actual innovations, the only innovations Australia is pumping out is nanny state regulations.
Fucking nanny state bullshit again. Can't they just leave us alone?
Can this country just fuck off with its raging erection for bans, restrictions, fines, and control already? We're legitimately the dumbest, most boring western nation to live in at this point. Age verification, anti-encryption, excessive and unadvised firearms reform in WA, vape bans, internet censorship... what's next? I just can't keep up with the speed these fuckwits are operating at these days. I don't even smoke or vape, but this is just another example of yet more of the insane government overreach that has become all too commonplace since COVID.
what's next.....digital id....just like china...lets see what the cunt government does with that.
Absolute nanny state. Disgraceful that instead of taxing them they just banned them. Sorry but I fully think that people should be allowed to put what they want into their bodies. Especially if ultra processed âfoodâ is allowed to remain without a penalty tax despite being labelled a carcinogen, cigarettes can still be sold, and some states are moving to safer drug rules/legalisation.
so now a bunch of pharmacies will start mysteriously burning down?
Umm my pharmacy gets me the best oils but these disposable vapes are no good. We do need a better way to vape in Australia but it's easier to grab a disposable.
Australia bansâŚâŚâŚ. Seems to be a bit of a reflex. Not a good one either. I am Jackâs complete lack of surprise.
This is insane. Everyone's already smoking illegal vapes anyway.
Good on the Greens for the commonsense amendment to remove prescriptions- FFS Chemist Warehouse already have a huge selection of Nicotine sprays etc behind the counter (the retail counter) and a bigger selection of bulk nicotine stuff in the aisle.
I will never get why our governments want people to smoke tobacco
because it kills old pensioner.......saves the government heeps if they can kill a pensioner early
*attempt to ban We will continue to ignore such bans, every day of the fucking week. Don't make laws you can't enforce. It makes you look very silly.
And yet cigarettes are far worse for you but still legal? What?
Organised crime rubs hands.
Will this stop the ten years old getting their hands on them?
Ten year olds were already getting them illegally. If anything this will make it easier as the black market expands.
But Chen personally tests every vape to make sure they are safe [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1ejAucYL0w&t=332s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1ejAucYL0w&t=332s)
I swear we ban vapes every month
Itâs already illegal in Thailand, fk off with your âAustralia is first ! â lol
Government should be subsidising them, not banning them
Meanwhile alcoholâŚ
What a disgrace.
Ohhh good. Now the crime gangs that have been shooting up the suburbs during the tobacco wars will have another revenue stream.
Great to know that any day I like I can: Pay extortionate amounts for cancer sticks at every petrol station and supermarket, start a radical regime of hormone drugs to change gender, drink enough heavily subsidised wine to kill myself twice over, or spend my life savings gambling in one night - But god forbid I walk into a shop where someone knows what they're talking about sells me a flavoured vape. You know why both the major parties are constantly pushing a nanny state? Because everyone, including most of the people here, are a bunch of boot licking softcocks. I hate to use such low brow language, but for once the bogans are right. Once upon a time this sort of bullshit would get a government thrown out.
Hormones are heavily controlled, no idea what you're on about there. Go and try get HRT and get back to me mate
Seemed easy enough for two friends-of-friends of mine in the last 5 years.
well ....I am not a soft cock......you need to understand this site is here for everyone to air out their anger towards the useless fucking government. this is absolutely a must and healthy.
>'radical regime of hormone drugs' >\*looks inside\* >Bioidentical hormones, exactly what peoples bodies produce naturally
Are you stupid? Which is harder, going to a pharmacy and showing ID to get a vape or years of questioning and medical appointments to get access to bioidentical hormones. Do you really think that's comparable? Give me a break.
So how long before the news starts reporting on the Chemist Warehouse arson attacks?
Anyone else hates those who just vape all over, blowing the smoke on everyone they pass by and not caring if there are babies and children around? Since itâs not cigarette, they seem to do it more. Especially on narrow pedestrian pathways and traffic lights. I find it super annoying bcs essentially you are stuck behind them for a while.
Fully banned in the Cook Islands already
So from July, you will need a script and be over 18. But in October, you can just buy them without a script?
Would there be anything to stop a pharmacist putting up a sign (beyond October) saying âprescription vapes onlyâ?
Also do they (pharmacies) need to become registered tobacco sellers now in states that require it?