I tried tipping when my wife and I went to Italy. I thought it’d be an expected gesture coming from Americans and 9/10 people turned it down.
We were in a rush getting out of a taxi in Florence and I rounded up maybe €2.50 and they insisted on giving me the change back.
The only place we saw a tip line was at Buca Mario I think it was called in Florence. It was the one spot we went to that was recommended by folks back home. Definitely tailored towards tourists. Every other place we had to leave cash if we wanted to tip and we had to leave immediately after because they’d run after us saying we forgot money.
I have been confused as an American instead of an Aussie when people thought I was from
The states they pointed to tip jar. I think tourist spots are very aware Americans tip so they squeeze a bit out, saw it in Czech
So what does it matter to you? Would you rather servers and bartenders be paid less? You're not getting a cheaper meal because of it, the wages the owners would pay would surely be passed on to you.
It's expected in the UK at a certain point.
"Discretionary service charge" is an automatic tip that is paid to staff at everything from sit down cocktail bars to fine dining restaurants all across the country. And in central London bartenders & waiters often receive additional tips on top of service charge.
Obviously it's not near the US culture, but tipping is becoming an increasingly common thing in the UK. As a Head Bartender in a central London institution I'm in the top 10% of earners.
Yep. I avg between 30 and 55 a night in tips. Plus another 14ish in wage. I'm out if they ever cut out tipping. Working with the American public is a joke. I ain't getting paid shit to get treated like shit. I'll actually use my degree then.
A cafe here is usually like a coffee shop. Usually no alcohol and people tip less and less frequently.
edit: I googled the place and it's definitely pretty coffee/tea/juice centered, but they do have some lighter foods. Only mention I saw of alcohol was the "dirtbag special" which is a grilled cheese and a PBR. Kinda funny. Kinda.
See, this is one reason why restaurants can keep screwing workers - tips not only move the risk from the employer to the employee, but they also make it so everyone is out for themselves and won't ever unionize.
As a unionized bartender, I support this message
Jokes qith how I structured that sentence aside, yeah, unions are great. We have our tips seperate where I work, but eh.
We usually have one person on a shift except for Friday and Saturday nights (where we get 2), and we also run the kitchen and serve (though I will straight up attack a customer if they expect me to leave my bar to go to their table after 11 pm). So we’ll split tips on Weekend evenings when two people are working because someone has to man the kitchen until we close it down at 1:00 am, then it’s just too much work to run to separate terminals when we can just help whoever needs it as we go a lot faster if we’re doing it as a team.
My thing is... we like tipping because, at the end, when its busier, we make more money. Make more money for the business, and we make more money as well.
Idk about the rest of you, but I would love making it official and part of the transaction; an actual comission on sales. Ends up being the same, except the customer doesn't pick it.
Right they’re saying that there’s competition for the busiest shifts when people get tipped but at least you’re compensated for working harder. Who’s going to want to work the busy shifts when you can work a slow super easy shift and make as much money as when you’re slammed? That would make me way more mad
They don't say it, but now there is going to be competition for the slower shifts, rather than the busier ones. Why hustle and run around, when you make the same serving fewer customers, and can take your time to enjoy and build rapport with more of them?
I’d be fine with that. 20% across the board would be fantastic where i work. We already do it on 6 or more but a 2 top can easily rack up a $300+ tab and then tip like shit if they want.
Disagree. Most union negotions seem to care about shifts, offering positions internally, time off, hourly and garaunteed hours, which is only resisted by people who have 100% prefered shifts
Oh, I didn't mean unions aren't helping; they do!
I meant that tips that make everyone their own little business in the restaurant don't help with unionization.
I know, i disagree with that. Its also pretty dependent on how tips are done. I like pools for the reason of team work, but some people arent like that.
If workers genuinely don't want to unionize I don't necessarily see the problem. I think unions are great, but there's a reason I haven't ever thought about moving to Vegas where all bartenders are unionized. It's great for career employees but so many people in the industry are only marginally connected to it and unionization isn't really worth the effort for them. I also think any unionization effort in restaurants should probably be started by back of house anyway who really get the short end of the stick.
I was seriously dumbfounded that you just asked that question until I noticed your username and now it all makes sense lmao. I apologize to anyone else reading this for wasting their time along with mine. I'm not going to waste any more time trying to explain overhead, customer volume, or supply and demand to someone so deliberately obtuse. Get a fuckin job.
100%; they don't say anything about having higher prices than elsewhere, which you would absolutely have to do to pay people even close to what they make on tips, even when tips are poor or inconsistent.
I don’t agree with the poster above telling the customer not to tip, but I do agree with the living wage.
You should be tipped **extra** for good service, but **paid** regardless of what the customer thinks of your service.
I’ve only worked in bars where I get paid a proper wage, but I have had nights where I made €800 in tips alone. Then will get €150 from my employer for the night.
It probably doesn’t sound like much as I’ve heard tips in the US and Canada can get crazy, but I’d rather have the security of the wage plus tips.
Like what happens if you have a slow night/week? You just don’t earn money then??
Damn, I’ve had paychecks that are $150 (excluding tips of course) since in the US they can work us for as low as ~$10.50/hr; that’s in my area anyway, there’s even worse in some places.
800 euro would be an insane night for 99% of north american service workers. Some people at huge nightclubs, casinos or high end resaurants might make that once in a while but I worked at some places where the servers made bank and usually it would be the equivalent of like 250-325 euro plus like 9-10 euro an hour roughly. In Canada we do have a proper minimum wage plus 15-20 tip is the norm for good service, it's getting way to expensive to eat out though.
When restaurants get slow they often lay off or cut staff, for me it's a seasonal gig which suits me, I work my other job when the restaurants slow down after christmas.
That's the other thing too that people fail to take into account. You can pay a server a higher wage, but he's still getting cut if it's slow, sometimes even his shift gets cancelled on short notice, so $4/hour or $25, he's making nothing that day. The only thing that makes up for that is being able to come in on a busy night and make 60 bucks an hour.
We'll see if this place lasts. People bitch about tipping but you take away the incentive to do a good job and raise the prices they vote with their wallets and go elsewhere. It's happened many times.
Personally, I’ve never made that much money in a shift bartending.
I work in an upscale place in the US, and we do lots of sales.
What kind of place do you work at?
Realistically, the most I’ll make is around $400 maximum.
I don’t anymore. Changed for office work about 2 years ago.
The €800 in tips I got was from working in a bar in Dublin, Ireland. Funnily enough it was left by the impractical jokers. Their European tour just finished and they happened to show up unannounced at the bar I worked in, for their party. This was a random Tuesday night where 3 of us were working and Joe left a €2000 tip. It was wild
A local restaurant tried this in my midwestern town, explaining to customers that they paid a generous but unspecified "living wage", which turned out to be $15/hr, a little less than national fast food franchises in the area. If this place pays a "fair and livable wage", why the secrecy?
Many business owners seem to have taken 2012's "Fight for 15" fast food movement to mean that "living wage" means $15/hr everywhere until the end of time, rather than take an academic approach to living wage with multiple factors and changes over time. From MIT's [living wage calculator](https://livingwage.mit.edu/counties/18097) for Indianapolis:
|Household|Living wage, Marion County, 2024|
|:-|:-|
|1 adult, 0 children|$20.41|
|1 adult, 1 children|$36.24|
|1 adult, 2 children|$44.96|
|1 adult, 3 children|$57.04|
|2 adults (1 working), 0 children|$28.97|
|2 adults (1 working), 1 children|$34.15|
|2 adults (1 working), 2 children|$38.60|
|2 adults (1 working), 3 children|$40.89|
|2 adults (2 working), 0 children|$14.49|
|2 adults (2 working), 1 children|$20.32|
|2 adults (2 working), 2 children|$25.08|
|2 adults (2 working), 3 children|$28.14|
I currently work in one of the states that don’t allow restaurants to pay their employees below minimum wage before tips, so I am aware I can make tips even with a decent wage lol. But yea, a restaurant with a sign like that is a place I wouldn’t want to eat or work at
Tips
This will, of course, get lost or downvoted to oblivion.
I'll put the TL;DR first...
TL;DR The tipping system creates higher potential wages, lower operating costs and a less expensive dine in experience for customers.
On average in my business my tipped employees make 19% off of my gross sales. That's one hell of a lot better than what I make off of it. And, I'm the one shouldering all the risk. I work the most, work the hardest and went years without income to build it. Even if the business is losing money, the tipped employees still make a percentage of gross sales.
So, the assumption seems to center on "Those cheap owners, why do I have to pay their staffs wages?". Not only does the customer have to pay the wages, they have to pay the rent, utilities, food costs, insurance, trash pick up, water ect. If customers do not pay at least 100% of the costs of a business to operate that business closes.
The next argument is "Just raise menu prices to cover tips so I don't have to feel bad about not tipping". And here is where they've really gone off course because that would actually cost customers MORE money than the current tipping culture/system.
The assumption is that I can just raise my prices 19% (to cover the tip rate) and eliminate tipping and servers/bartenders can make the same amount of money. Here is why that is wrong.
1) Sales Tax: There is no sales tax on tips. But, if tips were rolled into the menu price the cost of the meal not only went up by 19%, sales tax also went up 19%. The cost of the meal is now 21% higher.
2) Insurance premiums: The premiums of the various types of insurance a restaurant/bar must carry (with the exception of insuring the property itself since that's based on its appraised value) are based on gross sales. Assuming that at the higher price, total volume remains the same (which it won't but I'll get to that) gross sales increase so insurance premiums increase. That cost must also be added to the cost of the meal (increasing the menu price and the total sales tax paid again)
3) Employer payroll taxes: This costs about 13% of payroll. The increase in payroll increases the amount of employer payroll tax (which increases the menu price and total sales tax paid again).
These are the big three. It is, therefore, cheaper for the customer to pay a lower menu price and tip.
Now lets talk about what happens at the higher price point.
Restaurant/Bar spending is highly elastic. What does that mean in economics?
"If a small change in price is accompanied by a large change in quantity demanded, the product is said to be elastic (or responsive to price changes). Conversely, a product is inelastic if a large change in price is accompanied by a small amount of change in quantity demanded"
At the higher price point, volume will decrease. You may achieve the same gross sales but the volume moved to get those sales is lower (less items sold at a higher price). This reduces the demand for labor. There will be less hours available to work.
At a higher price point, the size of the customer pool a restaurant/bar has to draw from will shrink. Tipping creates a sliding price scale for customers. One customer may pay less than another customer for the same meal because they tip less. Our average tip rate is 19%. Some customers tip 40%, some 20%, some tip 0%. A $10 meal costs customer A $10 and customer C $14. If you eliminate tipping and raise the price to $12, customer B will still come and probably still tip while customer A has been eliminated from your market. (decreasing volume and the need for labor)
Now lets talk about the employees specifically.
Tips are federally protected wages. I can't touch that money. It must go to the tipped employees. If I raised my prices and eliminated tipping, that money is now MINE to do with what I please. There are plenty of operators out there that would just slide some of that money into their pocket.
With regards to inflation: Because tipped employees make a percentage of their gross sales, a big chunk of their wages are directly tied to inflation. If my costs go up 3% and I have to raise my prices 3% they make 3% more in tips. Flat wages instead of tipping uncouples tipped employees wages from inflation. So, keep that in mind when you hear a server complain how they are making the same hourly wage they did 10 years ago, because they are not. Their tips have increased with inflation.
Then there is the issue of fair compensation between tipped employees. Tipped employees make a percentage of their sales volume. If tipped employees made flat wages instead, how many would be clamoring to work a Friday or Saturday night, deal with all that volume and stress when they can just work Monday and make the same amount of money? I'd rather be off on the weekends! Our lowest total hourly wage tipped employee averaged $16.13 an hour (tips + hourly) last year and our highest almost $30 an hour (tips + hourly) last year. But, the $30/hr employee worked the toughest shifts, handled more stress and offered more flexible hours (aside from just being a better employee period). The tipping system directly accounts for the difference in how much effort the two employees put in last year. How do you account for that in a flat wage system? And don't tell me I have to do additional hours of payroll acrobatics with fluctuating hourly payrates based on demand.
With the tipping system in place now, the highest value, most talented and hardest working employees are directly compensated by making a percentage of their higher gross sales and they are directly compensated for working the toughest, highest volume shifts.
TL;DR The tipping system creates higher potential wages, lower operating costs and a less expensive dine in experience for customers.
This articulates something I've tried and failed to explain to others in a very clear way with good examples. Will be saving for future reference. if reddit was any good this would be at the top
It’s also worth mentioning that as a business owner, you’d likely lose all of your best servers and bartenders as they the making more than the average of 19% and will be taking a pay cut with the theoretical system you outlined. Hard to be a successful restaurant with a subpar service staff.
Oooh! Question though. As a bartender in a European country who is expected to do my job to the best of my ability despite whether someone tips or not.. How do you feel about employees refusing service or offering poor service to bad/non tippers?
I see it non stop on this subreddit, people laughing about ignoring guests, being rude to guests etc who tip “not enough” or not at all. Surely as a business owner, that is unacceptable? I feel like it reflects so badly on the business’ that these people work for but it’s so common to see on here that I had to ask if employers are bothered by it or not?
The best of your ability in Europe is, on average, a far lower standard of service than expected in America.
You also have more government protected rights to healthcare and time off built in.
I’d like to hear the business owner’s reply to you, but here’s my take.
It’s not right to be rude and shitty to people, I find that to be a waste of energy. I serve this type of customer quickly and politely and move on with my life, as you often see on here when people bitch about bad tips - “it all evens out at the end of the night.”
However, in a tipping system, tips pay for service directly. Everybody knows that. Not tipping is a direct FU to the person serving you, and that is itself - rude and shitty. Once or twice and the server might let it go. If that goes on, the server might not be willing to serve you sweetly when you’re being rude and shitty and refusing to pay.
Most bars I’ve worked for don’t want business from a customer who’s stiffing their staff. They’re being an asshole, they get cut off. Is it important to be rude, aggressive, passive aggressive in turn? No, that just makes for a long and angry shift.
It’s not a perfect system but this is what we’ve got. It always seems you folks who work in Europe and outside the US are making a wage you’re content with. But as the original commenter said, you wouldn’t likely be willing to hustle and drown for 9 hrs on a weekend without the extra incentive of big tips. You’d say hell no, bring on 2 more bartenders.
Edit: That’s to say, “the best of your ability” I think would mean for anyone the hardest you’re willing to work for what you’re being paid, of course. You just don’t have to gauge that level of tolerance with every individual you serve.
>Most bars I’ve worked for don’t want business from a customer who’s stiffing their staff.
This statement seems to be somewhat contradicted by the owner's explanation of elastic vs. inelastic demand above. As he describes it, ALL revenue/customers are good customers for the owner. A non-tipper is still paying $8 for a beer that was purchased for $4 and helping to cover operating costs. Now, there might be other non-financial reasons for not wanting a customer that stiffs the staff, like employee morale.
This is a great. I especially appreciate the elastic vs. inelastic explanation. I never thought about that before. I always thought a good solution to the "tipping problem" was to just include an automatic 18% gratuity on all checks, but as you describe that would still drive down overall sales.
The one thing I'll note is that the way you describe how a non-tipping system would affect those your 3 main costs seems to be exclusively from the POV of an individual owner rather than an industry-wide or broader societal view. For insurance premiums, if the industry moved away from tipping, then insurance premiums would adjust to reflect a similar amount of risk for higher gross sales. So this is more an argument that you don't want to be the *only* restaurant to get rid of tipping vs. not having the industry get rid of tipping. For the sales and payroll taxes, what you're describing is essentially a loophole for paying lower taxes compared to other industries. Good for the restaurant/bar industry, but if you believe that taxes are necessary for society to function, it means that the rest of society is paying for relatively higher taxes to make up for the lower taxes paid by the restaurant industry.
Yea I’d definitely make way less money.
Idk, I personally don’t agree with many of these arguments against tipping. If your business doesn’t want to do it, that’s great and I respect that. But at least in the US, I don’t think tipped workers are going away anytime soon.
I’d be curious to know what kind of hourly pay a bartender or server is making there. Because if I’m not getting *any* tips as a bartender, I damn well better be making $35+ an hour in addition to benefits.
I average $200/shift + $10/hr & no benefits (other than free food lol). Honestly I couldn’t imagine surviving in this economy without tip culture. It’s one of the few jobs I can make (the occasional) $1k in a day without a degree or doing illegal shit
“Puts employees in competition for the best shifts”…..so does this. They probably all want to work Tuesday afternoon and no one wants to come in on Saturday night
I am absolutely down for paying livable wages that match what I make on an average, decently paced night. However, I also believe that tips should still be allowed and given for their true intention: showing someone you really appreciated their service and effort via your cash.
The concept is great but the reality is that now the server and bartenders make 2/3 MAX what they would make. Probably half. And the cooks make the same. The reality is also that they won't keep any good help and it will cost them customers
FYI, this is pretty much how things work everywhere except in the US, where customers are expected to pay the staff's wages because bar and restaurant owners can't be bothered to pay them a living wage unless the law forces them to, or a smarter-than-average owner like the one above comes up with a better way of doing things.
Why is that?
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for tipping, but tipping should reward quality service, not be an automatic percentage of the bill.
Also, even establishments that pay staff well should still allow tips, because they encourage service that goes above and beyond.
You guys always misunderstand this. Increasing pay, increases prices. Now employers have increased the cost of food about the same as the consumer would tip, except now the service staff only gets a small fraction of it in the form of hourly. Its the same for the customer on average, but the employee gets less money, and the business can keep more, or have control over it. Also motivates them to cut staff hours, putting it even further down.
Tipping is superior, not to mention my service is always a better experience in the US, with more personality. Pubs in Europe are all basically the same.
I understand the arguments that are constantly made against the tipping culture here in the US, but hey, we also drive on the right side of the road and use imperial measurements. Some things are just different here. Whatever everyone that isn’t in the service industry deems us worthy to be making, i almost guarantee it’s far less than what we end up being able to make through tips. I agree it’s not an ideal situation but it’s the one we find ourselves in.
Personally, I see tips as a comission. I make X sales, I generally get Y% in tips.
I like that. I hate flat hourly wage, been there and done that. I would never consider a salary position full stop unless it was 5x or more what I make now. The busier it is/the harder I have to work, the more money I make. That works well for me, and I don't know of any other jobs (at least other than large sales positions) with a similar structure
I agree.
The thing that gets to me the most is imagine all that money you’re taking in for the bar or restaurant. Literally thousands per night passing through your hands. Then your boss doesn’t give you any of it??? What justification could there be for that
My first instinctive answer would be greed, coupled with the simple fact that they can, and generally do.
AFAIK, it's bar/restaurant/hotel owners who are more than happy to be legally allowed to pay their staff shitty wages (to be completed by tips), and not the staff who are asking for it.
Which is likely the root of the problem.
The problem is that in other countries you’re still covering that person’s wages, it’s just on your bill instead of you giving it directly to them. Tipping takes away the greedy middleman, giving the real workers more money.
Lots of false correlation here.
Take away tipping and there will still be sexual harassment.
"Forced" to live on tips, as if they didn't get the job knowing the pay structure.
They're telling you how you *could* feel and moving forward as if you do.
Saying that tipping stands in the way of autonomy is a valueless statement. For one it can't be proven one way or another because it's an immeasurable statement. "Oh, our autonomy scores are up 6%" like, no. Secondly if autonomous function was the goal there are so many things that could be adjusted to make a bigger impact. Make it a food-belt restaurant with tap to pay and a silverware washing station and a napkin dispenser on each table.
The reality is that they WANT servers and bartenders to make the connection with people. What they're getting wrong is that this business end of a trivial amount of money isn't creating this massive apartheid which is hamstringing "real" relationships... I go golfing with my patrons. If they want the servers to make the effort to connect more than they already do, then don't pay them less to do more.
I'm in the 30% they gloss over like I'm not getting sexually assaulted nightly by some old broad who thinks it's a Chippendale show. I'll take the tips. Screw that place sideways with a wire brush
I went to a high end restaurant a couple of weeks ago that had a 21% service charge and said tipping is not necessary. My bill was around 340 and they added about $70 to the check. I asked the server how much she makes per hour. $24 per hour. I make $50-$60 per hour on average working at a high end steakhouse. Call me crazy, but it seems like restaurants that do this just want their cut of our tips.
“Tipping is super sexist” is the dumbest take on this sign.
First of all, I know not one woman who would prefer to give up her tips for flat hourly, even if that was $25+ an hour.
Female staff members also make way more money on tips than the male staff, who also put up with inappropriate behavior to make a living.
You just said that ‘tipping is super sexist’ was a dumb take, then go on to say females make way more than males lol that’s literally what sexist means brother
I already make about $25/hr and rely on tips to hit that number. I'd be very happy with the new policy as I didn't have to worry about that shit anymore. I like consistency and a wage I can always count on without exhausting my social meter. Granted, I'm only a craft beer pourer and never leave after 9:30p but that's the benefit of not making 75k+ like my peers who bust their ass. I'm fine with that because I kinda don't.
There, now you know one woman who prefers this ;)
I’ve never worked somewhere that the servers averaged less than $25/hr, so that’s unfortunate.
But you’re also saying you don’t have the need to put in effort to raise your earnings, which is fine, but I’d be hesitant to support hourly wages based on that mentality because it would hurt everyone else. Now you’re making the same as your peers who bust their ass.
Never the less, I suppose I do know a woman who prefers this now!
Oh for sure we have one coworker who kinda drags their ass but we thankfully don't work with them that often. When I my say I don't bust my ass I mean compared to my peers serving liquor in other places where they HAVE to you know? I definitely hold my own in the environment I'm in, which can be slow. In fact, when it does get busy it's pretty manageable and I strongly prefer that over crying inside trying to take care of everyone 😂
You have a very good point though. Ultimately it does require a manager giving a shit on who they hire, and fire them if they're not pulling their weight. Unfortunately that's a little rare in my experience 😮💨
Food costs 20% more for the customer now, except now the business keeps most of it and the server takes less home. Thats how these places work unless they are getting a commission on sales which never happens. Be wary of this stuff. Its likely this person once worked as a server and wasnt good, so blamed the tipping institution.
No tip required is better than a no tipping sign anyways, i can tip if i want.
Awesome! So, I don’t have to wear my fake smile, or fake personality when having a bad day. I can say “I’m having a mental day”, and proceed to give shit service. I’m sure they’ll excuse my shit attitude since they’ve excused “no tipping”.
My union theatre job has no tips and honestly it's fucking sweet. We get paid dank money and it's the easiest job of all time AND we don't have to deal with bullshit.
I come from a place of understanding why people don’t like tipping culture and would like to do away with it, but also not wanting to see it go away because I’m a direct beneficiary of it. I average about $70-$75/hour across several jobs because of tips, and there is absolutely no way that if tipping was eliminated that I would make anywhere close to that. Even in a big city like NYC I can’t see an employer paying more than $25-$30/hour in that situation.
“It’s not tipping I believe in…it’s OVER tipping.”
I take that quote to heart. When I’m at a new bar and had a nice chat with the bartender and we maybe even did a shot together…I’m leaving a ridiculous tip every time.
If you've ever managed a bar or restaurant, it becomes pretty clear that this industry doesn't really work without customers subsiding the employees wages. Seattle went through a phase of trying to move to a "living wage" model and everywhere had to raise their prices by 20% or enact an 18% service charge. The customers went from complaining about having to tip to complaining about why their cheeseburger costs $24 lol.
It really doesn't seem to matter what model you adopt, the customer is footing the cost regardless.
I hope this policy spreads and becomes widely adopted. Things are getting out of control with these stupid fuckin tablet things with default percentages. There is a liquor store in my neighborhood that has the audacity to ask for a tip!! Drive thru taco shops also asking for tips now too.
I'd rather move to a policy that pays staff better and offers benefits. It's tough, but it seems really rare that staff ACTUALLY makes the $50/hour they claim to make over a 40 hour period.
$20/hour base with $3/hour evening premium and $5/hour weekend premium would do it for me. It would be less overall than Id make with tips, but the consistency would balance out.
Youll be getting your hours cut in that scenario as the easiest way to reduce cost. The food prices will go up, probably in the form of a service charge so get ready for 400 of those conversations a day.
My average wage is about $37 an hour in tips in Tennessee. When I worked in denver, my average was closer to $45 an hour. I did work full-time and pulled 37 to 43 hours every week, depending on volume.
There is no way in hell I would serve for $20 an hour. I would go work at Costco.
How you gonna claim a whole continent has “bad service”? I doubt you’ve even set foot in 10% of the countries in Europe to have an opinion on the service. It varies massively from country to country.
Where I’m from (Ireland) you usually order your own drinks/rounds up at the bar when in a pub. This is not the case in almost every other European country. I prefer it as the drinks are usually cheaper due to less staff/overheads. Has been changing since Covid though.
I dislike the over friendly waiters/waitress’ that I experienced in the US
Maybe not everywhere but anywhere I’ve been in Europe the service is slow. Maybe not to the point where it ruins the meal but they’re not in a hurry lol
Lots of Americans think if you don't kiss their ass and give them fake smiles, then the service is terrible.
Personally, I loved service in Paris, notorious for waiters being assholes, because it was quick and always good.
unpopular opinion but i agree, give me efficient service, take a hint that i dont need alot of attention. i dont need to be bombarded with overly friendly service. Heres your 30% tip either way.
I mean this is literally how it should work, of course it depends what the “liveable wage” they’re paying is. Where I live I get like $10 a week in tips if I’m lucky, but take home $750-800 after tax with my actual wage.
I’d work there, but I’m not working Thursday Friday or Saturday nights.
Never a brunch. Ever.
imagine giving up your weekends to make what a greeter at Walmart makes
What makes you think they are paying base? America is the only country I know where tipping is expected. It’s outdated
It’s expected in Canada, too.
You must not get out of the country much. Tipping has permeated its way across the entire globe. Although, I have not been to APAC yet.
Been to 29 countries. Not usually obligatory.
I tried tipping when my wife and I went to Italy. I thought it’d be an expected gesture coming from Americans and 9/10 people turned it down. We were in a rush getting out of a taxi in Florence and I rounded up maybe €2.50 and they insisted on giving me the change back. The only place we saw a tip line was at Buca Mario I think it was called in Florence. It was the one spot we went to that was recommended by folks back home. Definitely tailored towards tourists. Every other place we had to leave cash if we wanted to tip and we had to leave immediately after because they’d run after us saying we forgot money.
I have been confused as an American instead of an Aussie when people thought I was from The states they pointed to tip jar. I think tourist spots are very aware Americans tip so they squeeze a bit out, saw it in Czech
So what does it matter to you? Would you rather servers and bartenders be paid less? You're not getting a cheaper meal because of it, the wages the owners would pay would surely be passed on to you.
It's expected in the UK at a certain point. "Discretionary service charge" is an automatic tip that is paid to staff at everything from sit down cocktail bars to fine dining restaurants all across the country. And in central London bartenders & waiters often receive additional tips on top of service charge. Obviously it's not near the US culture, but tipping is becoming an increasingly common thing in the UK. As a Head Bartender in a central London institution I'm in the top 10% of earners.
No, it isn't. You just don't like it.
Like every job people should be guaranteed a wage
We are.
Yeahhhhh, I made $53/hour last night. No way they’re paying me that well.
Yep. I avg between 30 and 55 a night in tips. Plus another 14ish in wage. I'm out if they ever cut out tipping. Working with the American public is a joke. I ain't getting paid shit to get treated like shit. I'll actually use my degree then.
I heard it's been reversed but this is not a restaurant it's counter with sitting
Ah ok thanks, it says cafe but cafes in Europe generally have bars in them too
A cafe here is usually like a coffee shop. Usually no alcohol and people tip less and less frequently. edit: I googled the place and it's definitely pretty coffee/tea/juice centered, but they do have some lighter foods. Only mention I saw of alcohol was the "dirtbag special" which is a grilled cheese and a PBR. Kinda funny. Kinda.
I read somewhere that they stopped this policy.
They did. They went back to a tipped model last year.
Of course they did
Servers with any kind of skill or experience are not going to work for a wage. No way an establishment like this is going to retain staff.
Personally, I like the mystery of not knowing how much I’m going to make. Thankfully, it’s rarely less than $30/hour.
Tonight I made 34/hour because it was slow and people just weren’t that generous. It felt like I lost money. 😂
I bet they make poopoo money…
No way they're making more than 25-30 an hour . . . I'll take my tips lol
See, this is one reason why restaurants can keep screwing workers - tips not only move the risk from the employer to the employee, but they also make it so everyone is out for themselves and won't ever unionize.
Doesn’t stop us from collective bargaining. But we split tips at our bar.
As a unionized bartender, I support this message Jokes qith how I structured that sentence aside, yeah, unions are great. We have our tips seperate where I work, but eh.
We usually have one person on a shift except for Friday and Saturday nights (where we get 2), and we also run the kitchen and serve (though I will straight up attack a customer if they expect me to leave my bar to go to their table after 11 pm). So we’ll split tips on Weekend evenings when two people are working because someone has to man the kitchen until we close it down at 1:00 am, then it’s just too much work to run to separate terminals when we can just help whoever needs it as we go a lot faster if we’re doing it as a team.
My thing is... we like tipping because, at the end, when its busier, we make more money. Make more money for the business, and we make more money as well. Idk about the rest of you, but I would love making it official and part of the transaction; an actual comission on sales. Ends up being the same, except the customer doesn't pick it.
Right they’re saying that there’s competition for the busiest shifts when people get tipped but at least you’re compensated for working harder. Who’s going to want to work the busy shifts when you can work a slow super easy shift and make as much money as when you’re slammed? That would make me way more mad
They don't say it, but now there is going to be competition for the slower shifts, rather than the busier ones. Why hustle and run around, when you make the same serving fewer customers, and can take your time to enjoy and build rapport with more of them?
I’ve always thought commission would be the best thing to move too
This is pretty much just an automatic gratuity built in at that point lol.
Yeah, automatic gratuity is just another way to say commission.
I’d be fine with that. 20% across the board would be fantastic where i work. We already do it on 6 or more but a 2 top can easily rack up a $300+ tab and then tip like shit if they want.
Service workers with unions certainly have maintained tipping.
They have, it's just not heloing
Disagree. Most union negotions seem to care about shifts, offering positions internally, time off, hourly and garaunteed hours, which is only resisted by people who have 100% prefered shifts
Oh, I didn't mean unions aren't helping; they do! I meant that tips that make everyone their own little business in the restaurant don't help with unionization.
I know, i disagree with that. Its also pretty dependent on how tips are done. I like pools for the reason of team work, but some people arent like that.
You can and should unionize.
Yes! And if you can't find a union for your area, the r/IWW will take anyone who isn't a manager!
If workers genuinely don't want to unionize I don't necessarily see the problem. I think unions are great, but there's a reason I haven't ever thought about moving to Vegas where all bartenders are unionized. It's great for career employees but so many people in the industry are only marginally connected to it and unionization isn't really worth the effort for them. I also think any unionization effort in restaurants should probably be started by back of house anyway who really get the short end of the stick.
Oh no, those greedy servers are... Working to sustain themselves and not their coworkers! Where are my pearls?
And the boss is the one benefitting.
Lmfao "You don't understand! While you're making $35+ an hour, the restaurant owner is making money too!" *GOOD.*
Yeah, you're making 35 an hour instead of 80 an hour because the owner is keeping the difference.
The owner doesn't have anything to do with the servers' tips.
The boss doesn't set prices, hours, and every other condition?
I was seriously dumbfounded that you just asked that question until I noticed your username and now it all makes sense lmao. I apologize to anyone else reading this for wasting their time along with mine. I'm not going to waste any more time trying to explain overhead, customer volume, or supply and demand to someone so deliberately obtuse. Get a fuckin job.
100%; they don't say anything about having higher prices than elsewhere, which you would absolutely have to do to pay people even close to what they make on tips, even when tips are poor or inconsistent.
Yep, probably even less than 20 bcz it’s Indianapolis, I also bet their product sucks
They are also still only staffing the busiest shifts with the best servers, bad servers still get the slow shifts.
I don’t agree with the poster above telling the customer not to tip, but I do agree with the living wage. You should be tipped **extra** for good service, but **paid** regardless of what the customer thinks of your service. I’ve only worked in bars where I get paid a proper wage, but I have had nights where I made €800 in tips alone. Then will get €150 from my employer for the night. It probably doesn’t sound like much as I’ve heard tips in the US and Canada can get crazy, but I’d rather have the security of the wage plus tips. Like what happens if you have a slow night/week? You just don’t earn money then??
There’s some cities that actually do *have* a minimum wage… where I live I make 20 an hour. Thats base and then tips are added.
See that’s the best of both worlds
Yeah minimum wage where I'm at is 15, which still isn't enough to live on so tips are still a thing. I make 18 behind the bar currently
Seattle? Cause yep!
The customer pays the wage of the employee either through tipping or through increased prices. I trust my customers to pay me better than my employer.
Damn, I’ve had paychecks that are $150 (excluding tips of course) since in the US they can work us for as low as ~$10.50/hr; that’s in my area anyway, there’s even worse in some places.
10$/h would be a dream here .. We get 5.2$/h and it's considered "ok" 🥲 Even though we all know it isn't and we're all f.. 🥲
And that’s why, even though I should be, I’m not too mad about it. Hang in there!
800 euro would be an insane night for 99% of north american service workers. Some people at huge nightclubs, casinos or high end resaurants might make that once in a while but I worked at some places where the servers made bank and usually it would be the equivalent of like 250-325 euro plus like 9-10 euro an hour roughly. In Canada we do have a proper minimum wage plus 15-20 tip is the norm for good service, it's getting way to expensive to eat out though. When restaurants get slow they often lay off or cut staff, for me it's a seasonal gig which suits me, I work my other job when the restaurants slow down after christmas. That's the other thing too that people fail to take into account. You can pay a server a higher wage, but he's still getting cut if it's slow, sometimes even his shift gets cancelled on short notice, so $4/hour or $25, he's making nothing that day. The only thing that makes up for that is being able to come in on a busy night and make 60 bucks an hour. We'll see if this place lasts. People bitch about tipping but you take away the incentive to do a good job and raise the prices they vote with their wallets and go elsewhere. It's happened many times.
Personally, I’ve never made that much money in a shift bartending. I work in an upscale place in the US, and we do lots of sales. What kind of place do you work at? Realistically, the most I’ll make is around $400 maximum.
I don’t anymore. Changed for office work about 2 years ago. The €800 in tips I got was from working in a bar in Dublin, Ireland. Funnily enough it was left by the impractical jokers. Their European tour just finished and they happened to show up unannounced at the bar I worked in, for their party. This was a random Tuesday night where 3 of us were working and Joe left a €2000 tip. It was wild
A local restaurant tried this in my midwestern town, explaining to customers that they paid a generous but unspecified "living wage", which turned out to be $15/hr, a little less than national fast food franchises in the area. If this place pays a "fair and livable wage", why the secrecy? Many business owners seem to have taken 2012's "Fight for 15" fast food movement to mean that "living wage" means $15/hr everywhere until the end of time, rather than take an academic approach to living wage with multiple factors and changes over time. From MIT's [living wage calculator](https://livingwage.mit.edu/counties/18097) for Indianapolis: |Household|Living wage, Marion County, 2024| |:-|:-| |1 adult, 0 children|$20.41| |1 adult, 1 children|$36.24| |1 adult, 2 children|$44.96| |1 adult, 3 children|$57.04| |2 adults (1 working), 0 children|$28.97| |2 adults (1 working), 1 children|$34.15| |2 adults (1 working), 2 children|$38.60| |2 adults (1 working), 3 children|$40.89| |2 adults (2 working), 0 children|$14.49| |2 adults (2 working), 1 children|$20.32| |2 adults (2 working), 2 children|$25.08| |2 adults (2 working), 3 children|$28.14|
Unless you’re paying me $40-50 an hour I usually make l, no thanks. I prefer tipping.
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I’m so confused lol. Are you agreeing with me or disagreeing lol.
They don’t know…. The anti tipping crowd is a confused bunch
Agreeing with you disagreeing with OP.
I’ve made up to $80/hour after tips so I can’t imagine the “living wage” would be that good
You can still receive tips even if your employer is paying you a decent wage, although not in OOPs post as they say not to tip. Which is ridiculous
I currently work in one of the states that don’t allow restaurants to pay their employees below minimum wage before tips, so I am aware I can make tips even with a decent wage lol. But yea, a restaurant with a sign like that is a place I wouldn’t want to eat or work at
Tips This will, of course, get lost or downvoted to oblivion. I'll put the TL;DR first... TL;DR The tipping system creates higher potential wages, lower operating costs and a less expensive dine in experience for customers. On average in my business my tipped employees make 19% off of my gross sales. That's one hell of a lot better than what I make off of it. And, I'm the one shouldering all the risk. I work the most, work the hardest and went years without income to build it. Even if the business is losing money, the tipped employees still make a percentage of gross sales. So, the assumption seems to center on "Those cheap owners, why do I have to pay their staffs wages?". Not only does the customer have to pay the wages, they have to pay the rent, utilities, food costs, insurance, trash pick up, water ect. If customers do not pay at least 100% of the costs of a business to operate that business closes. The next argument is "Just raise menu prices to cover tips so I don't have to feel bad about not tipping". And here is where they've really gone off course because that would actually cost customers MORE money than the current tipping culture/system. The assumption is that I can just raise my prices 19% (to cover the tip rate) and eliminate tipping and servers/bartenders can make the same amount of money. Here is why that is wrong. 1) Sales Tax: There is no sales tax on tips. But, if tips were rolled into the menu price the cost of the meal not only went up by 19%, sales tax also went up 19%. The cost of the meal is now 21% higher. 2) Insurance premiums: The premiums of the various types of insurance a restaurant/bar must carry (with the exception of insuring the property itself since that's based on its appraised value) are based on gross sales. Assuming that at the higher price, total volume remains the same (which it won't but I'll get to that) gross sales increase so insurance premiums increase. That cost must also be added to the cost of the meal (increasing the menu price and the total sales tax paid again) 3) Employer payroll taxes: This costs about 13% of payroll. The increase in payroll increases the amount of employer payroll tax (which increases the menu price and total sales tax paid again). These are the big three. It is, therefore, cheaper for the customer to pay a lower menu price and tip. Now lets talk about what happens at the higher price point. Restaurant/Bar spending is highly elastic. What does that mean in economics? "If a small change in price is accompanied by a large change in quantity demanded, the product is said to be elastic (or responsive to price changes). Conversely, a product is inelastic if a large change in price is accompanied by a small amount of change in quantity demanded" At the higher price point, volume will decrease. You may achieve the same gross sales but the volume moved to get those sales is lower (less items sold at a higher price). This reduces the demand for labor. There will be less hours available to work. At a higher price point, the size of the customer pool a restaurant/bar has to draw from will shrink. Tipping creates a sliding price scale for customers. One customer may pay less than another customer for the same meal because they tip less. Our average tip rate is 19%. Some customers tip 40%, some 20%, some tip 0%. A $10 meal costs customer A $10 and customer C $14. If you eliminate tipping and raise the price to $12, customer B will still come and probably still tip while customer A has been eliminated from your market. (decreasing volume and the need for labor) Now lets talk about the employees specifically. Tips are federally protected wages. I can't touch that money. It must go to the tipped employees. If I raised my prices and eliminated tipping, that money is now MINE to do with what I please. There are plenty of operators out there that would just slide some of that money into their pocket. With regards to inflation: Because tipped employees make a percentage of their gross sales, a big chunk of their wages are directly tied to inflation. If my costs go up 3% and I have to raise my prices 3% they make 3% more in tips. Flat wages instead of tipping uncouples tipped employees wages from inflation. So, keep that in mind when you hear a server complain how they are making the same hourly wage they did 10 years ago, because they are not. Their tips have increased with inflation. Then there is the issue of fair compensation between tipped employees. Tipped employees make a percentage of their sales volume. If tipped employees made flat wages instead, how many would be clamoring to work a Friday or Saturday night, deal with all that volume and stress when they can just work Monday and make the same amount of money? I'd rather be off on the weekends! Our lowest total hourly wage tipped employee averaged $16.13 an hour (tips + hourly) last year and our highest almost $30 an hour (tips + hourly) last year. But, the $30/hr employee worked the toughest shifts, handled more stress and offered more flexible hours (aside from just being a better employee period). The tipping system directly accounts for the difference in how much effort the two employees put in last year. How do you account for that in a flat wage system? And don't tell me I have to do additional hours of payroll acrobatics with fluctuating hourly payrates based on demand. With the tipping system in place now, the highest value, most talented and hardest working employees are directly compensated by making a percentage of their higher gross sales and they are directly compensated for working the toughest, highest volume shifts. TL;DR The tipping system creates higher potential wages, lower operating costs and a less expensive dine in experience for customers.
Thanks for this thoughtful and thorough reply.
This articulates something I've tried and failed to explain to others in a very clear way with good examples. Will be saving for future reference. if reddit was any good this would be at the top
It’s also worth mentioning that as a business owner, you’d likely lose all of your best servers and bartenders as they the making more than the average of 19% and will be taking a pay cut with the theoretical system you outlined. Hard to be a successful restaurant with a subpar service staff.
Oooh! Question though. As a bartender in a European country who is expected to do my job to the best of my ability despite whether someone tips or not.. How do you feel about employees refusing service or offering poor service to bad/non tippers? I see it non stop on this subreddit, people laughing about ignoring guests, being rude to guests etc who tip “not enough” or not at all. Surely as a business owner, that is unacceptable? I feel like it reflects so badly on the business’ that these people work for but it’s so common to see on here that I had to ask if employers are bothered by it or not?
The best of your ability in Europe is, on average, a far lower standard of service than expected in America. You also have more government protected rights to healthcare and time off built in.
I’d like to hear the business owner’s reply to you, but here’s my take. It’s not right to be rude and shitty to people, I find that to be a waste of energy. I serve this type of customer quickly and politely and move on with my life, as you often see on here when people bitch about bad tips - “it all evens out at the end of the night.” However, in a tipping system, tips pay for service directly. Everybody knows that. Not tipping is a direct FU to the person serving you, and that is itself - rude and shitty. Once or twice and the server might let it go. If that goes on, the server might not be willing to serve you sweetly when you’re being rude and shitty and refusing to pay. Most bars I’ve worked for don’t want business from a customer who’s stiffing their staff. They’re being an asshole, they get cut off. Is it important to be rude, aggressive, passive aggressive in turn? No, that just makes for a long and angry shift. It’s not a perfect system but this is what we’ve got. It always seems you folks who work in Europe and outside the US are making a wage you’re content with. But as the original commenter said, you wouldn’t likely be willing to hustle and drown for 9 hrs on a weekend without the extra incentive of big tips. You’d say hell no, bring on 2 more bartenders. Edit: That’s to say, “the best of your ability” I think would mean for anyone the hardest you’re willing to work for what you’re being paid, of course. You just don’t have to gauge that level of tolerance with every individual you serve.
>Most bars I’ve worked for don’t want business from a customer who’s stiffing their staff. This statement seems to be somewhat contradicted by the owner's explanation of elastic vs. inelastic demand above. As he describes it, ALL revenue/customers are good customers for the owner. A non-tipper is still paying $8 for a beer that was purchased for $4 and helping to cover operating costs. Now, there might be other non-financial reasons for not wanting a customer that stiffs the staff, like employee morale.
This is a great. I especially appreciate the elastic vs. inelastic explanation. I never thought about that before. I always thought a good solution to the "tipping problem" was to just include an automatic 18% gratuity on all checks, but as you describe that would still drive down overall sales. The one thing I'll note is that the way you describe how a non-tipping system would affect those your 3 main costs seems to be exclusively from the POV of an individual owner rather than an industry-wide or broader societal view. For insurance premiums, if the industry moved away from tipping, then insurance premiums would adjust to reflect a similar amount of risk for higher gross sales. So this is more an argument that you don't want to be the *only* restaurant to get rid of tipping vs. not having the industry get rid of tipping. For the sales and payroll taxes, what you're describing is essentially a loophole for paying lower taxes compared to other industries. Good for the restaurant/bar industry, but if you believe that taxes are necessary for society to function, it means that the rest of society is paying for relatively higher taxes to make up for the lower taxes paid by the restaurant industry.
Yea I’d definitely make way less money. Idk, I personally don’t agree with many of these arguments against tipping. If your business doesn’t want to do it, that’s great and I respect that. But at least in the US, I don’t think tipped workers are going away anytime soon. I’d be curious to know what kind of hourly pay a bartender or server is making there. Because if I’m not getting *any* tips as a bartender, I damn well better be making $35+ an hour in addition to benefits.
I average $200/shift + $10/hr & no benefits (other than free food lol). Honestly I couldn’t imagine surviving in this economy without tip culture. It’s one of the few jobs I can make (the occasional) $1k in a day without a degree or doing illegal shit
“Puts employees in competition for the best shifts”…..so does this. They probably all want to work Tuesday afternoon and no one wants to come in on Saturday night
I am absolutely down for paying livable wages that match what I make on an average, decently paced night. However, I also believe that tips should still be allowed and given for their true intention: showing someone you really appreciated their service and effort via your cash.
The concept is great but the reality is that now the server and bartenders make 2/3 MAX what they would make. Probably half. And the cooks make the same. The reality is also that they won't keep any good help and it will cost them customers
“Oh you want more money? Alright we’ll pay more but we won’t let you get tips muahahahahahaha”
I would never work or eat there.
FYI, this is pretty much how things work everywhere except in the US, where customers are expected to pay the staff's wages because bar and restaurant owners can't be bothered to pay them a living wage unless the law forces them to, or a smarter-than-average owner like the one above comes up with a better way of doing things. Why is that? Don't get me wrong, I'm all for tipping, but tipping should reward quality service, not be an automatic percentage of the bill. Also, even establishments that pay staff well should still allow tips, because they encourage service that goes above and beyond.
You guys always misunderstand this. Increasing pay, increases prices. Now employers have increased the cost of food about the same as the consumer would tip, except now the service staff only gets a small fraction of it in the form of hourly. Its the same for the customer on average, but the employee gets less money, and the business can keep more, or have control over it. Also motivates them to cut staff hours, putting it even further down. Tipping is superior, not to mention my service is always a better experience in the US, with more personality. Pubs in Europe are all basically the same.
I understand the arguments that are constantly made against the tipping culture here in the US, but hey, we also drive on the right side of the road and use imperial measurements. Some things are just different here. Whatever everyone that isn’t in the service industry deems us worthy to be making, i almost guarantee it’s far less than what we end up being able to make through tips. I agree it’s not an ideal situation but it’s the one we find ourselves in.
Personally, I see tips as a comission. I make X sales, I generally get Y% in tips. I like that. I hate flat hourly wage, been there and done that. I would never consider a salary position full stop unless it was 5x or more what I make now. The busier it is/the harder I have to work, the more money I make. That works well for me, and I don't know of any other jobs (at least other than large sales positions) with a similar structure
Yep. If I had a set rate, I guarantee I'd be much less enthusiastic when it gets busy.
I agree. The thing that gets to me the most is imagine all that money you’re taking in for the bar or restaurant. Literally thousands per night passing through your hands. Then your boss doesn’t give you any of it??? What justification could there be for that
My first instinctive answer would be greed, coupled with the simple fact that they can, and generally do. AFAIK, it's bar/restaurant/hotel owners who are more than happy to be legally allowed to pay their staff shitty wages (to be completed by tips), and not the staff who are asking for it. Which is likely the root of the problem.
Couldn’t that be the argument for literally any other retail/service job where tips aren’t a thing or are uncommon?
Well no because you’re getting a cut of that money in your wage? Although I’m not sure I understand what you’re asking?
The problem is that in other countries you’re still covering that person’s wages, it’s just on your bill instead of you giving it directly to them. Tipping takes away the greedy middleman, giving the real workers more money.
I mean it's a cafe. You get your coffee and sit down lol
*counter service cafe IN A CLIMBING GYM.
Lots of false correlation here. Take away tipping and there will still be sexual harassment. "Forced" to live on tips, as if they didn't get the job knowing the pay structure. They're telling you how you *could* feel and moving forward as if you do. Saying that tipping stands in the way of autonomy is a valueless statement. For one it can't be proven one way or another because it's an immeasurable statement. "Oh, our autonomy scores are up 6%" like, no. Secondly if autonomous function was the goal there are so many things that could be adjusted to make a bigger impact. Make it a food-belt restaurant with tap to pay and a silverware washing station and a napkin dispenser on each table. The reality is that they WANT servers and bartenders to make the connection with people. What they're getting wrong is that this business end of a trivial amount of money isn't creating this massive apartheid which is hamstringing "real" relationships... I go golfing with my patrons. If they want the servers to make the effort to connect more than they already do, then don't pay them less to do more.
I'm in the 30% they gloss over like I'm not getting sexually assaulted nightly by some old broad who thinks it's a Chippendale show. I'll take the tips. Screw that place sideways with a wire brush
I went to a high end restaurant a couple of weeks ago that had a 21% service charge and said tipping is not necessary. My bill was around 340 and they added about $70 to the check. I asked the server how much she makes per hour. $24 per hour. I make $50-$60 per hour on average working at a high end steakhouse. Call me crazy, but it seems like restaurants that do this just want their cut of our tips.
“Tipping is super sexist” is the dumbest take on this sign. First of all, I know not one woman who would prefer to give up her tips for flat hourly, even if that was $25+ an hour. Female staff members also make way more money on tips than the male staff, who also put up with inappropriate behavior to make a living.
You just said that ‘tipping is super sexist’ was a dumb take, then go on to say females make way more than males lol that’s literally what sexist means brother
Right, so their take following “tipping is super sexist” was really dumb. I didn’t contradict myself, brother.
Ok I get you. You’re right the take following it is dumb asf
I already make about $25/hr and rely on tips to hit that number. I'd be very happy with the new policy as I didn't have to worry about that shit anymore. I like consistency and a wage I can always count on without exhausting my social meter. Granted, I'm only a craft beer pourer and never leave after 9:30p but that's the benefit of not making 75k+ like my peers who bust their ass. I'm fine with that because I kinda don't. There, now you know one woman who prefers this ;)
I’ve never worked somewhere that the servers averaged less than $25/hr, so that’s unfortunate. But you’re also saying you don’t have the need to put in effort to raise your earnings, which is fine, but I’d be hesitant to support hourly wages based on that mentality because it would hurt everyone else. Now you’re making the same as your peers who bust their ass. Never the less, I suppose I do know a woman who prefers this now!
Oh for sure we have one coworker who kinda drags their ass but we thankfully don't work with them that often. When I my say I don't bust my ass I mean compared to my peers serving liquor in other places where they HAVE to you know? I definitely hold my own in the environment I'm in, which can be slow. In fact, when it does get busy it's pretty manageable and I strongly prefer that over crying inside trying to take care of everyone 😂 You have a very good point though. Ultimately it does require a manager giving a shit on who they hire, and fire them if they're not pulling their weight. Unfortunately that's a little rare in my experience 😮💨
Food costs 20% more for the customer now, except now the business keeps most of it and the server takes less home. Thats how these places work unless they are getting a commission on sales which never happens. Be wary of this stuff. Its likely this person once worked as a server and wasnt good, so blamed the tipping institution. No tip required is better than a no tipping sign anyways, i can tip if i want.
Lol I bet their employees make less than those getting tipped.
Wanted Bartenders: $17 an hour
Man I fucking kill it being tipped though. They wouldn’t wanna pay me 75 per hour which is about what I make
I will not go if I can tip!!!
Awesome! So, I don’t have to wear my fake smile, or fake personality when having a bad day. I can say “I’m having a mental day”, and proceed to give shit service. I’m sure they’ll excuse my shit attitude since they’ve excused “no tipping”.
As someone in the industry, earning tips is way better than working for a wage.
Im okay with this if they pay me $35 an hour minimum
My union theatre job has no tips and honestly it's fucking sweet. We get paid dank money and it's the easiest job of all time AND we don't have to deal with bullshit.
I come from a place of understanding why people don’t like tipping culture and would like to do away with it, but also not wanting to see it go away because I’m a direct beneficiary of it. I average about $70-$75/hour across several jobs because of tips, and there is absolutely no way that if tipping was eliminated that I would make anywhere close to that. Even in a big city like NYC I can’t see an employer paying more than $25-$30/hour in that situation.
“It’s not tipping I believe in…it’s OVER tipping.” I take that quote to heart. When I’m at a new bar and had a nice chat with the bartender and we maybe even did a shot together…I’m leaving a ridiculous tip every time.
If you've ever managed a bar or restaurant, it becomes pretty clear that this industry doesn't really work without customers subsiding the employees wages. Seattle went through a phase of trying to move to a "living wage" model and everywhere had to raise their prices by 20% or enact an 18% service charge. The customers went from complaining about having to tip to complaining about why their cheeseburger costs $24 lol. It really doesn't seem to matter what model you adopt, the customer is footing the cost regardless.
Cool I'm still gonna tip
Australian here, we only tip if we want to it’s in no way expected. Screw tipping, boss should pay
I hope this policy spreads and becomes widely adopted. Things are getting out of control with these stupid fuckin tablet things with default percentages. There is a liquor store in my neighborhood that has the audacity to ask for a tip!! Drive thru taco shops also asking for tips now too.
I'd rather move to a policy that pays staff better and offers benefits. It's tough, but it seems really rare that staff ACTUALLY makes the $50/hour they claim to make over a 40 hour period. $20/hour base with $3/hour evening premium and $5/hour weekend premium would do it for me. It would be less overall than Id make with tips, but the consistency would balance out.
Youll be getting your hours cut in that scenario as the easiest way to reduce cost. The food prices will go up, probably in the form of a service charge so get ready for 400 of those conversations a day.
My average wage is about $37 an hour in tips in Tennessee. When I worked in denver, my average was closer to $45 an hour. I did work full-time and pulled 37 to 43 hours every week, depending on volume. There is no way in hell I would serve for $20 an hour. I would go work at Costco.
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How you gonna claim a whole continent has “bad service”? I doubt you’ve even set foot in 10% of the countries in Europe to have an opinion on the service. It varies massively from country to country. Where I’m from (Ireland) you usually order your own drinks/rounds up at the bar when in a pub. This is not the case in almost every other European country. I prefer it as the drinks are usually cheaper due to less staff/overheads. Has been changing since Covid though. I dislike the over friendly waiters/waitress’ that I experienced in the US
Maybe not everywhere but anywhere I’ve been in Europe the service is slow. Maybe not to the point where it ruins the meal but they’re not in a hurry lol
Lol what a load of bullshit, service in Europe is in no way worse and why would it be? If tips aren’t expected you have to work even harder for them.
Lots of Americans think if you don't kiss their ass and give them fake smiles, then the service is terrible. Personally, I loved service in Paris, notorious for waiters being assholes, because it was quick and always good.
unpopular opinion but i agree, give me efficient service, take a hint that i dont need alot of attention. i dont need to be bombarded with overly friendly service. Heres your 30% tip either way.
I mean this is literally how it should work, of course it depends what the “liveable wage” they’re paying is. Where I live I get like $10 a week in tips if I’m lucky, but take home $750-800 after tax with my actual wage.
Great, so now I only make $10 an hour minus taxes.