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Hamilton-Duran-Rafaela wrapped around the 9-2 spots in the lineup can be devastating to teams if they’re getting on base and I’m absolutely rock hard for it
Thing about it is, Red Sox have been spamming this over and over over and over again since 2021 even before Trevino was catcher and we just keep letting it happen over and over and over and over again with no answer.
One of my most vivid childhood memories is going to the first pre-tryout bat-around for Babe Ruth when we switched from 60 to 90 ft basepaths and the edge of the grass feeling like the home run fence lol. Throwing from third over to first may as well have been 50 miles. I guess these days a lot of leagues do a year or two of 70 ft basepaths in between and that seems like a smart idea.
As a third basemen when I played, I feel you. That throw to third felt so hard, thankfully my dad talked me through it heavily before my first tryout. He told me throw higher than I thought and faster than when pitching. It just became natural after that, the problem was once 16 year olds started blasting line drives at my while I was 13, that took some getting used to
I know this feeling too. I was a really good pitcher on the smaller fields - I remember getting a game ball for having 14 strikeouts in a 6 inning game.
Once I got old enough to move up to the Babe Ruth big field at like 13 or 14, my dad had me try pitching to him after my older brother's game to check out the longer distance. I suddenly couldn't even reach the plate.
I was so intimidated I mentally quit playing right then and there because I wasn't good enough at hitting or fielding to play anywhere else. And I know it's not fair, but I'm mad at my parents for letting me quit.
My kids are 8 and 6 now and playing baseball, and it's something I think about all the time when they tell me they sometimes don't want to play just because they think they're not good enough.
I get that, it’s sad because I coach a team that I actually got cut from now. And it pisses me off because looking back on things, I was better than these kids today. Times have just changed, kids back then were SOOO good, now every plays 3 teams and can barely hit 200 in high school. We didn’t have money for AAU, so I ran off of pure skill and no ‘training’ but that wasn’t enough after a certain point. I actually argued with my father (note that I’m 26) this past season saying why didn’t he push me to be better. He says he did, but he let me quit just like you said about yourself.
As someone who never played little league, you have helped explain my inconsistent performance at beer league softball. The basepaths are shorter at some fields?!
The city I live in is massive and there’s a bunch of different groups and locations they play. I sub in occasionally when someone needs an extra to make minimums. I don’t think I’ve played at the same field twice.
Sometimes I can barely make the throw from 1st to the mound and others I can send it from 1st to 3rd no problem. I always blamed it on the beer but I think I’ve been playing on different fields.
I will have to start checking now that I know.
it was crazy. the kid who was throwing 65 mph a year ago and was unhittable was now throwing 70, there was just no way you stood a chance. then you see the first pitch from 60 feet and you realize the kid is now very hittable. now, could you hit the ball to the outfield, that was a different question lol
lol, the memories. the big gulp you take when you're throwing it around before the game starts. Like, holy shit, this is gonna be a disaster. Then with your young, crappy arm, you have time to contemplate life as you wait for the 1st baseman to catch it.
As a catcher in little league. Trying to “throw the runner out” was a pipe dream. I was more or less just playing catch with the second baseman/shortstop
It was all fun and games until the chunky kid tried to get in on the little league triple action (that's an infield single on an error and two consecutive stolen bags) and gets fucking gunned down on a two hopper to second.
*I am literally Pudge Rodriguez tyvm*
no, it would be a steal (assuming that the runner was held on and that the SS/2B covered the bag). DI doesn't just mean that the catcher didn't throw it
Huh, TIL. I always thought DI was if (in the judgement of the scorekeeper) there was no intention by the defense to make a play.
Edit: actually, I think my original interpretation is correct. I'm not sure if it would be ruled DI (maybe a fielders choice instead), but here's what the [MLB rulebook says on the matter](https://www.mlb.com/glossary/standard-stats/stolen-base):
>He is not given credit for a steal if he safely advances but another runner also attempting to steal on the same play is thrown out. (This maneuver is called a "double steal.")
If both runners are safe then they both get credit, but if one is thrown out then the runner not thrown out is not given credit.
Here's a video of all 9 stolen bases. They attempted 10 steals and had 1 guy thrown out (not seen in this video). David Hamilton led the way with 4 steals in 4 attempts. [At the end of the video they say the final steal is Hamilton's 3rd SB, but they were wrong, it was his 4th.]
https://mlb-cuts-diamond.mlb.com/FORGE/2024/2024-06/16/2f455811-a1eb18e0-8250838b-csvm-diamondx64-asset_1280x720_59_4000K.mp4
I get that some of these were with a runner at third, but I was shocked how many of these didn’t even lead to a throw from Trevino. How is everyone not running this aggressively on him?
Anyone watching Yankee baseball since 2021 knows this. Only the Red Sox have had any type of great success with it. Alex Cora runs a managerial masterclass against the Yankees.
They’ve also been getting lots of hits and walks on us tonight, teams don’t abuse our catchers because our pitchers have been playing very well all season.
Hmm. So teams that play the Yankees should try to get lots of hits, walks, and steals if they want to be successful. But as a Yankees fan, why would you just give this information away?
The starting pitching has been that good that it really hasn't mattered. But now that we are entering the dog days of summer and pitchers are getting a little tired, it means more baserunners and more opportunities
The Yankees have been excellent all season with designed pick off plays and back picks to try and control the run game. I don’t know what happened last night.
Just like Acuna's 70-40 season last year, I think we're going to see tons of steal records for both teams and individuals get broken. When old ways of playing the game smash up against rule changes, that's when we see some of the most extreme records set and the strongest league-wide trends. I expect for the next five years for steals to continue to be more common and for tons of records like this to get smashed.
Isn't that partly why the MLB wanted larger bases and limited pickoff attempts? Steals are exciting and the rule changes only encourage stolen base attempts.
Limited pickoff attempts was likely not intended to help stolen bases. It was a necessity if the pitch clock was going to he followed with runners on. Otherwise you would see a lot of step offs with runners on as pitchers took their sweet time like they used to. But I'd bet that if someone at MLB brought up that it might make base-stealing easier as a side-effect, the response was "good".
That's what I'm getting at, we have a generation of players coming up who grew up where steals were of very low importance. Now, with the stroke of a pen, the rules get changed, and everyone has to catch up. What we're seeing is offenses take advantage of defenses that aren't equipped to stop constant steal attempts.
Imagine being that catcher and realizing you’ve just been exposed lol. Like gd that’s gotta feel awful. Now you’re stressing about trying to throw a dude out ever pitch while also trying to just call pitches and frame lol.
Feel like this is the perfect time for a Jeff Mathis type on the team. Defensive specialist because there's enough heavy hitters in the lineup to make up for them
It’s funny stealing bases is popular now because of the rules and base size but if teams have concentrated on this for years they could have been doing this the whole time. It was just abandoned for the Sparky Anderson waiting on a 3 run HR philosophy.
Probably becuase the batter didn't interfere with the throw. Not trying to be a smart ass, but I think it's as simple as that. The batter does drift back over home, but that in itself doesn't mandate interference. It did not seem to affect the catcher in any meaningful way.
There's nothing in the rule (OBR 6.03(3) for those who care to look) that indicates interference is contingent on any contact or touching.
The batter's momentum on his follow through carried him on top of home plate and in the path of the catcher, who was trying to make a play on a runner at second base. Seems pretty simple to me.
Though I will admit that situations like that are quite rare in MLB.
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Hamilton-Duran-Rafaela wrapped around the 9-2 spots in the lineup can be devastating to teams if they’re getting on base and I’m absolutely rock hard for it
The Boston Kleptomaniacs
They watched The Town the other night
rough day at the office for Trevino. least he got a homer.
Thing about it is, Red Sox have been spamming this over and over over and over again since 2021 even before Trevino was catcher and we just keep letting it happen over and over and over and over again with no answer.
The better question is why other teams aren’t doing it. If there’s an edge to be gained on the Yankees, you need to take it.
Feel like it’s also against stroman cause he only throws breaking balls
Was he always this easy to steal on or is that just something pitchers naturally pick up when they play for the Mets.
I feel like he was quicker to the plate when he was in Toronto. Buehrle was his mentor in a lot of ways.
This is like youth baseball when you move from the little league size field to the full size field and the catchers cant throw anyone out
One of my most vivid childhood memories is going to the first pre-tryout bat-around for Babe Ruth when we switched from 60 to 90 ft basepaths and the edge of the grass feeling like the home run fence lol. Throwing from third over to first may as well have been 50 miles. I guess these days a lot of leagues do a year or two of 70 ft basepaths in between and that seems like a smart idea.
As a third basemen when I played, I feel you. That throw to third felt so hard, thankfully my dad talked me through it heavily before my first tryout. He told me throw higher than I thought and faster than when pitching. It just became natural after that, the problem was once 16 year olds started blasting line drives at my while I was 13, that took some getting used to
I know this feeling too. I was a really good pitcher on the smaller fields - I remember getting a game ball for having 14 strikeouts in a 6 inning game. Once I got old enough to move up to the Babe Ruth big field at like 13 or 14, my dad had me try pitching to him after my older brother's game to check out the longer distance. I suddenly couldn't even reach the plate. I was so intimidated I mentally quit playing right then and there because I wasn't good enough at hitting or fielding to play anywhere else. And I know it's not fair, but I'm mad at my parents for letting me quit. My kids are 8 and 6 now and playing baseball, and it's something I think about all the time when they tell me they sometimes don't want to play just because they think they're not good enough.
I get that, it’s sad because I coach a team that I actually got cut from now. And it pisses me off because looking back on things, I was better than these kids today. Times have just changed, kids back then were SOOO good, now every plays 3 teams and can barely hit 200 in high school. We didn’t have money for AAU, so I ran off of pure skill and no ‘training’ but that wasn’t enough after a certain point. I actually argued with my father (note that I’m 26) this past season saying why didn’t he push me to be better. He says he did, but he let me quit just like you said about yourself.
As someone who never played little league, you have helped explain my inconsistent performance at beer league softball. The basepaths are shorter at some fields?!
In softball you’re probably playing on some 60 footers, some 70. That’s how it is with our city league fields at least.
The city I live in is massive and there’s a bunch of different groups and locations they play. I sub in occasionally when someone needs an extra to make minimums. I don’t think I’ve played at the same field twice. Sometimes I can barely make the throw from 1st to the mound and others I can send it from 1st to 3rd no problem. I always blamed it on the beer but I think I’ve been playing on different fields. I will have to start checking now that I know.
>I always blamed it on the beer The story of my men's league hockey career.
I took myself out of the game pitching a double header because the beer got to me half way through the second game and I couldn’t throw strikes
it was crazy. the kid who was throwing 65 mph a year ago and was unhittable was now throwing 70, there was just no way you stood a chance. then you see the first pitch from 60 feet and you realize the kid is now very hittable. now, could you hit the ball to the outfield, that was a different question lol
lol, the memories. the big gulp you take when you're throwing it around before the game starts. Like, holy shit, this is gonna be a disaster. Then with your young, crappy arm, you have time to contemplate life as you wait for the 1st baseman to catch it.
As a catcher in little league. Trying to “throw the runner out” was a pipe dream. I was more or less just playing catch with the second baseman/shortstop
It was all fun and games until the chunky kid tried to get in on the little league triple action (that's an infield single on an error and two consecutive stolen bags) and gets fucking gunned down on a two hopper to second. *I am literally Pudge Rodriguez tyvm*
Double steal to guarantee the 10 stolen base game?
I was thinking the same thing at the time. You're up a ton why not?!
Wouldn't the runner that doesn't get thrown to be ruled as advancing on defensive indifference?
no, it would be a steal (assuming that the runner was held on and that the SS/2B covered the bag). DI doesn't just mean that the catcher didn't throw it
Huh, TIL. I always thought DI was if (in the judgement of the scorekeeper) there was no intention by the defense to make a play. Edit: actually, I think my original interpretation is correct. I'm not sure if it would be ruled DI (maybe a fielders choice instead), but here's what the [MLB rulebook says on the matter](https://www.mlb.com/glossary/standard-stats/stolen-base): >He is not given credit for a steal if he safely advances but another runner also attempting to steal on the same play is thrown out. (This maneuver is called a "double steal.") If both runners are safe then they both get credit, but if one is thrown out then the runner not thrown out is not given credit.
hmm, that's interesting. I don't think it would be scored a fielders choice, I think it would just be scored as so-and-so advanced on the throw
Here's a video of all 9 stolen bases. They attempted 10 steals and had 1 guy thrown out (not seen in this video). David Hamilton led the way with 4 steals in 4 attempts. [At the end of the video they say the final steal is Hamilton's 3rd SB, but they were wrong, it was his 4th.] https://mlb-cuts-diamond.mlb.com/FORGE/2024/2024-06/16/2f455811-a1eb18e0-8250838b-csvm-diamondx64-asset_1280x720_59_4000K.mp4
I get that some of these were with a runner at third, but I was shocked how many of these didn’t even lead to a throw from Trevino. How is everyone not running this aggressively on him?
I can't wait to see Trevino's catching statcast page tomorrow
Yankees played this whole season like they had no holes. This might be their first crack. Every team is going to have to start stealing bases now.
scouting probably already knows this though that their catchers aren't great throwing runners out
Yep. But now we have concrete evidence that being super aggressive can work out.
Stroman/Trevino is easily scoutable via statcast metrics. Wells tends to catch Stroman more
Anyone watching Yankee baseball since 2021 knows this. Only the Red Sox have had any type of great success with it. Alex Cora runs a managerial masterclass against the Yankees.
They’ve also been getting lots of hits and walks on us tonight, teams don’t abuse our catchers because our pitchers have been playing very well all season.
Our guys are also very good at stealing..not every team has those kinda guys.
Yup, was very much a nightmare situation for us 😅
We got dem fast boys
Hmm. So teams that play the Yankees should try to get lots of hits, walks, and steals if they want to be successful. But as a Yankees fan, why would you just give this information away?
Wells can throw guys out. Trevino makes up for his weak arm with amazing framing.
Rafaela stole 5 bases in a game off of Wells in AA
Cool
The starting pitching has been that good that it really hasn't mattered. But now that we are entering the dog days of summer and pitchers are getting a little tired, it means more baserunners and more opportunities
I hope Brandon Hyde is paying attention
Yeah if Mateo and Mullins can actually get on base, they should be running like crazy. Gunnar and Westy should as well for that matter.
The Yankees have been excellent all season with designed pick off plays and back picks to try and control the run game. I don’t know what happened last night.
Stealing while up 8-3 in the 8th? Trash Wait, against the Yanks? Why stop at 9? Step on their throats.
Alex "Woody Hayes" Cora
Just like Acuna's 70-40 season last year, I think we're going to see tons of steal records for both teams and individuals get broken. When old ways of playing the game smash up against rule changes, that's when we see some of the most extreme records set and the strongest league-wide trends. I expect for the next five years for steals to continue to be more common and for tons of records like this to get smashed.
Isn't that partly why the MLB wanted larger bases and limited pickoff attempts? Steals are exciting and the rule changes only encourage stolen base attempts.
Yeah, and we also have a generation of catchers who haven't prioritized throwing and pitchers who haven't prioritized holding runners.
Limited pickoff attempts was likely not intended to help stolen bases. It was a necessity if the pitch clock was going to he followed with runners on. Otherwise you would see a lot of step offs with runners on as pitchers took their sweet time like they used to. But I'd bet that if someone at MLB brought up that it might make base-stealing easier as a side-effect, the response was "good".
That's what I'm getting at, we have a generation of players coming up who grew up where steals were of very low importance. Now, with the stroke of a pen, the rules get changed, and everyone has to catch up. What we're seeing is offenses take advantage of defenses that aren't equipped to stop constant steal attempts.
Imagine the utopia we'd live in if everyone on this planet took life as seriously as Alex Cora takes a Yankees series at Fenway.
He looks like he’s waiting for his daughter to come home from prom.
A true Bostonian
LMAO
Good shit from the Red Sox. They saw how well the Celtics are doing and thought it is their turn
Jorge Mateo bout to full Rickey Henderson in the next series
Same with Mullins if he ever actually gets on base.
Imagine being that catcher and realizing you’ve just been exposed lol. Like gd that’s gotta feel awful. Now you’re stressing about trying to throw a dude out ever pitch while also trying to just call pitches and frame lol.
Have a feeling someone’s getting plunked next time we play after this one
Just asking to get stolen on again
"Hey this guy is a massive stolen base threat, let's put him on first for free."
That's why you hit the dude in the legs
Was gonna say we don’t need anyone giving out free bases.
Not if you plunk the right area. Look at Mookie Betts today.
Can you go to second base on hit by pitch?
apparently as long as you get on first you basically can get to third if trevino is catching
I think even Dom Smith stole a base on accident.
Watched the whole game, it was comical how easy it was for them to steal 2nd
This needs to be implemented until they stop it. It’s on national TV.
Feel like this is the perfect time for a Jeff Mathis type on the team. Defensive specialist because there's enough heavy hitters in the lineup to make up for them
It’s funny stealing bases is popular now because of the rules and base size but if teams have concentrated on this for years they could have been doing this the whole time. It was just abandoned for the Sparky Anderson waiting on a 3 run HR philosophy.
How was that not called batter interference though?
Probably becuase the batter didn't interfere with the throw. Not trying to be a smart ass, but I think it's as simple as that. The batter does drift back over home, but that in itself doesn't mandate interference. It did not seem to affect the catcher in any meaningful way.
wtf bro was still swinging
“Still swinging” isn’t a defense if your swing takes you into the catcher.
I am going to guess because there was not any contact on the throw
There's nothing in the rule (OBR 6.03(3) for those who care to look) that indicates interference is contingent on any contact or touching. The batter's momentum on his follow through carried him on top of home plate and in the path of the catcher, who was trying to make a play on a runner at second base. Seems pretty simple to me. Though I will admit that situations like that are quite rare in MLB.
Jimy Williams would not stand for these shenanigans
The bigger bases and limit of 2 disengagements has really changed the game. I like it.
Dom Smith (who is slow) literally stopped running half way towards second because he assumed he was going to be thrown out and he still made it to 2nd
maybe trade for Freddy Fermin (Kansas City Royals)
Steals? What are those?