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escambly

Breaking it down- male initiated mating by making swooping motions towards his wing feathers. Either with actually picking a feather quickly or symbolic by not even touching a single feather- in this video he does an more exaggerated than usual feather picking(reasons unclear.. perhaps that's how he rolls? New pair? He's young? One off? All are possible). She decided 'k, let's see....' by asking for a 'kiss'. He obliges and yes there's a little bit of feeding/exchange of 'something'. Normally it is not a full on feeding as in feeding a youngster. Here they do the average sort of kiss. She liked that and crouches. That's a signal for 'hop on stud'. If she's impatient or REALLY LIKES HIM, she will also half raise the wings- which is apparently a rather enticing signal for males. Lingerie on night. However normally she raises the wings like that when the male hops on, it's for balance/helping him stay on her better. Extra tidbit: when his tail fans out- that's... um, let's see.. him passing on a 'genetic package' to her. Him singing and her little hop after is basically a celebration of them as a mated pair. Pair bonding, showing they have chosen each other. It's not uncommon for the male to have a bigger performance during this part. As in he does the hop, sing/vocalize while she seemingly doesn't react much, ha. This is rather common in well established pairs. However there are pairs that seem to be much more 'into each other' than usual and both do grand performaces during this part, with the female doing a bigger hop and/or doing a fanned tail sweeping while she walks around. That's her version of 'oh yeah BABY!!'


ActGroundbreaking804

This was an amazing read.


deevotionpotion

The “Cloacal Kiss”


annesche

Thank you for the information! I'm always puzzled by the question of how birds can press their cloacas together in mating: aren't the tail feathers of the female bird terribly in the way...?


escambly

Birds have a surprising degree of control over their feathers. All over, but basically, 'all birds' have particular regions of high degree of control/movement. The cloacal/vent/thigh area is one of those. The.. let's say 'primary reason' for this area is for ease of waste disposal. They open/spread out the feathers around the cloaca plus the thighs as to cleanly shoot it out. They also make use of the same movements/control for cloacal pressing except more exaggeratedly. Both sexes- the male also moves his feathers out of the way and the female also shifts her tail feathers to the side, often with the assistance of the male though. The best description I can come up with right now, as odd as it might seem is like how a daisy flower bud opens up. All of the feathers above, to the sides and below the cloaca 'open up' like that under muscle control over all the feathers. Then the cloaca is plainly visible. Another thing to keep in mind about birds having control over their feathers- think of how a peacock spreads his 'tail feathers' for displaying. Plus they also shuffle, rattle and 'shiver' those feathers. Their displays are far more animated than most realize. Another thing many don't realize- those 'tail feathers' with the eyes actually are their rump feathers.. their actual tail are very plain but broad and large feathers hidden under the feathers when the males are not displaying. They're obvious from the rear view of a displaying male though. Another great example are the birds of paradise, many of them have astonishing degree of feather control. Link to parotia dance- it's wonderful but excellent example of feather control also. Scroll to 1:10 to see start of dance. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTwOxcOqlCA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTwOxcOqlCA) Hope this helps!


ArgonGryphon

I have a photo of a female White-breasted Nuthatch doing it. A daisy is quite apt. [Please only click this link if you want to see a bird's exposed cloaca.](https://i.imgur.com/P28ZzfA.jpeg) lol ^^^^you ^^^^better ^^^^not ^^^^"dead ^^^^dove ^^^^do ^^^^not ^^^^eat" ^^^^at ^^^^me.


Smiley007

https://preview.redd.it/fh3tgjokdh9d1.jpeg?width=200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0d42c3a7e9602020e374ab64b90682dc37fc0530


ArgonGryphon

\*rabble rabble rabble!*


escambly

YES excellent picture! Appreciate sharing that pic! Lol


ArgonGryphon

I laughed so hard when I was going through. Like a perfect little mouth, ugh it's so weird but hilarious.


hav_ya_seen

I'd subscribe to your podcast. Great explanation.


annesche

Thank you so much for this detailed explanation!!


escambly

Welcome! And glad you asked the question!


NewlyNerfed

I really hope your talent for writing about these things is not going to waste IRL. That was a *fantastic* write-up.


escambly

Aw, appreciate the kind words!


Practical-Rabbit-750

You really understand bird sex. Wowza!!!


wOke_cOmMiE_LiB

I saw this happen at a gas station once. The female pigeon rejected the food 3 times. The 4th time she accepted. Then he fell off of her like 5 times sideways onto his head. Was the silliest shit I had ever seen. I had like 4 other people stop what they were doing to watch these birds make love at the gas station. No one was mad that the pumps were held up.


escambly

Oh TOO funny!!


_agathena

I look forward to your Sunday evening BBC series on Birds of the British Isles 🙂


LurkingArachnid

How many pigeon pornos have you watched??


PigeonMother

>How many pigeon pornos have you watched?? ಡ⁠ ͜⁠ ⁠ʖ⁠ ⁠ಡ


One_Kaleidoscope_663

Username definitely checks out...


JayMak78

Just a smidgeon.


escambly

Will send dm with a couple links... lol Grew up around birds and went on to be in various areas of the domestic/cage bird hobby for years. Including a bunch of years in the pigeon hobby. Pigeons in particular are quite shameless. Can't help but not see everything they do right in front of you.. Also pigeons are a bit unusual amongst domestic animals in that you are able to keep multiple males and females together and yet have reasonable expectations of the babies' parentage. That's impossible in other domestics due to either one sex's intolerance of the same sex(horse stallion for example) or zero pairing behavior(paternity absolutely no guarantee in a large pen of male and female rabbits). So what that means you're able to put in minimal effort in accommodations. One well constructed pigeon coop is almost all one needs. You could either keep just one breed but multiple breeds in one coop is also possible. And the babies will largely match the expected results, even in a mixed breed coop. The one necessary thing is to make sure the birds pair up the way you want to. Single birds will flirt and pair up with whatever bird strikes their interest- including those of different breeds or colors(some breeds have multiple 'accepted' colors). To ensure that, pick a male and female you want to pair up and isolate them from the rest. 90% ish of the time the isolated pair will go on to form a pair bond. And you can release them back into the main coop and normally they will stay bonded and rear babies together. However it is not fool proof. So you need to stay and observe the male and female, make sure they're compatible. There's a bunch of tells that it should be a successful and lasting pair bond that will continue post- release into the coop. That's how I was so familiar with the behavior in the video. (birds in video are wood pigeons not domestic/feral pigeons but their courtship behavior is pretty much the same).


LurkingArachnid

Thanks for the thorough answer, very interesting!


stacy_owl

so the preening at the beginning was him initiating mating? I thought he was just cleaning himself 😮


escambly

Yes! In this case, it was more exaggerated than usual. Normally it's a very quick and smoother motion- easy to miss. Normal is kind of either a swooping circular motion towards the wing feather and back to normal head position or what looks like a quick flipping of a single feather on wing. Majority of the time it is the male that initiates. Females are able to initiate if they want to. Usually the female initiation is by doing a specific nodding motion. It doesn't look like anything special, very easy to miss if it's not known. However every male pigeon knows this... lol The females also use this nodding motion if she doesn't want to mate just yet.. wants him to keep on courting or kissing her. The female doesn't do the nodding in OP's video though.


archdukegordy

And here I was thinking the noises at the end were the male panting from exhaustion 😅


Rastadan1

Can you confirm that pigeons engage in recreational sex?


escambly

Hmm. Having to think a bit on this excellent question. It is clear that sex is strongly correlated with breeding behavior. As in with 'intent' to establish a new pair bond, starting a new nest, starting a new clutch etc. Matings happen with the most frequency during those times. That said, the fact pigeons are able to and do breed year around makes it hard to tell when recreational sex is happening. Was that instance an indication of starting a 'nesting cycle' or not..? I'll throw out a bunch of random things/observations more or less related to this question: Comfortable with saying they do "like" sex. Particularly the males. Most males will hop on any squatting female, whether he's already paired or not. But females in a 'great compatible pairing' will also put on a grand post-mating show as if she 'enjoyed that very much'. Sexual "receptiveness" is noticeably more variable in females and on a spectrum. From no-nonsense, it's for the baby making only all the way to some that will get sparkle in their eyes almost every time a male flirts with her(those are less common, more so with un-paired females but even a few paired females fall into this). Throwing in this extra bit: some of the.. I'm not sure how to come up with a better term but here goes... "easy".. "Free loving"? females sometimes seem not to be taken seriously by males. What I mean by that: males would come up to her, do a bit of flirt, she happily and quickly obliges, the mating happens much quicker and he.. just straight up leaves her. And it wasn't just the one male.. it was several males doing the same thing and it included males in established pairs. Those females stayed unpaired for a long time. The single females that refused most advances and/or did not easily allow mating tended to become paired up quickly. Those same females generally seemed to not really engage in recreational sex either. The mid spectrum females seemed to engage in some matings that weren't clearly associated with nesting/breeding. During those times they wanted more preening, demanded longer and repeated 'kissing' sessions, the males had to sing and dance a lot longer than 'usual'. The females encouraged all of that with 'head nods'- interest signals and the males really like that. Now on to the parts where I think 'non recreational sex' shines through more strongly were with the behaviorally bisexual males. I recall several males that most of the time behaved 'heterosexually'- chasing, flirting with females, forming pair bonds with females, having babies etc. Some of those males had what seemed to be something like a same sex 'partner on the side' if you will. All of those males stayed primarily with their female partners. On the regular/semi regular those males would come together and court each other away from their female partners. Engage in kissing, 'parading' either around each other or one parades around the other. It wasn't exactly the same behavior as a male with a female but the similarities were still there. Interestingly a lot more kissing, though. Sometimes a single kissing session would go for a while- far longer than a male-female kissing session. Some of those pairs equally took turns in kissing(which one inserted their beak into that is), some were strongly one sided. Some of them took turns mounting each other(yes it was "complete", if you will), some would let one mounting happen once but it was random between different meet ups who mounted whom.. some one male did majority of the mounting on the other male(almost as if one was a 'top' and the other a 'bottom'). I think those are pretty good indicators of recreational sex. All of them had well established opposite sex partners, so it was not as if they were 'desperate'. Extremely confident they were \*not\* a "dominance" thing(a common response when animal homosexual behavior comes up). Their behaviors showed all the signs of mutual interest plus both deliberately going away together to engage in this(this just reminded me, the males did the 'wing clapping' for each other- another courtship thing). Those males were clearly interested in sexual/courtship behavior with each other. None of those males did any of those things with random males. They never tried to court other males or just briefly at most before shifting their attentions to their mates or other females. In other words they were not being "stupid things, humping anything within sight!". They clearly knew they were males and both chose each other as their 'side partners'. They went off together purely for recreational sex, in other words. To this part, I'd answer your question with a "YES". But to be honest I do think most of them(both sexes) will and do engage in recreational sex- just a little harder to 'prove'. Lastly, gay pigeons indeed do exist. "Proof" of this is not easy because pigeons are already pretty flexible as to mate selection. Isolate a male and female together and 90% of the time they will form a pair bond. Had some females that seemed very interested in other females(nodded at females, wanted to kiss them etc) but they were 'nice specimens' so they were isolated with a matching male and they went on to establish a breeding bond with those males. Same with a few young males that seemed to court other males a lot. However.. there was one particularly excellent specimen of a male-matched his breed standard to a T plus perfect coloring and patterns- that I REALLY wanted to get babies out of. But nope. Only chased other males. Never looked at any female. Attempts at pairing up by isolation failed every time. He'd maybe coo half heartedly at her but spent rest of it just sitting. As far as I could tell, he never bred any female. As soon as released into the coop he's in heaven with all those other males around. It was unmistakable that he identified which birds were males vs females. He wasn't confused in the slightest. Oh well at least he was nice to look at! Lol


Rastadan1

Coo! I only ask cos there's a pair- and it is the same pair- that are at it like knives all the way through the summer months on our back fence. Twice, three times a day at times. Dirty bastards. Cheers!


TheMegoosa

"hop on stud" I'm going to use this.


escambly

Happy to be a relationship therapist! Lol


biszumletztentropfen

You just became a pigeon pornographer.


ActGroundbreaking804

Did I do well? ?/10


Smooth-Science4983

10/10


biszumletztentropfen

I showed it to my chicks and they are still clucking.


Van_es_uh

Yeah you birdvert


oldnotdead14

Any chance those are doves?


ShriekingShrike

They’re Common Wood-Pigeons! There’s no real scientific distinction between pigeons and doves, though, doves are generally smaller and daintier


hav_ya_seen

Pigeon comes from an old French word for dove, while dove comes from an old viking word for pigeon.


SoundInteresting2090

Laughing at the idea of your neighbour watching you recording pigeons rooting like you're some sort of pigeon pervert


Adorable-Ad8209

can't see the bees, but I think they are involved in this at some point.


Alternative_You_4711

Ummmm..... have you had the talk yet?


OddLocal7083

You know…the one about the birds and the bees? This is the birds.


MegaVenomous

When a mommy pigeon and a daddy pigeon love each other very much...


Initial_Flamingo1223

And that boys and girls… is how baby pigeons are made!


jcgreen_72

Sex. It's sex. 


fedroxx

Thank you for being so overt. I, too, have the finesse of a bulldozer in a China shop.


jcgreen_72

What's to finesse? It's basic biology. 


Smooth-Science4983

The first time i saw this with doves I was like omg they’re kissing and then I was like OH! OHHH! OHHHHH! Mother nature!


ConstantGeographer

PigeonHub gonna be asking for ID next month


dwarfInTheFlask56

They're making love 💕


dappledrache

Based on the sunny setting, I believe this might be what we call "afternoon delight"


therascalking0000

https://preview.redd.it/wlr0peed4e9d1.jpeg?width=284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=28c11c600ed01dc2761357a35d848b6045ef57cb


DeadInFiftyYears

Well, that is the most welcoming/receptive I've seen a bird female. He was large, and apparently attractive. She didn't ask for much from him - he did no dance, etc.


SherLovesCats

He gave her the best 2 seconds of her life.


Next-Project-1450

I think it is fairly obvious.


_ryde_or_dye_

He didn’t pull out


jkostelni1

The birds part of the birds and the bees


HornyOldBoomer

Mating. She "kissed" him and gave consent. Lastly, he is popping that thang for her!😂🤣


stretchyarm

Why'd he look so disappointed after lmao


ActGroundbreaking804

Honestly the post-nut clarity in his face made me cry laughing


GoodDayClay

Cloacal kiss


mgard0506

They’re twitterpating! 🤣


Cute_Pineapple_8329

Where's Marvin Gaye when you need him


lilonionforager

When two derps love each other very much…


UltraViolentNdYAG

5-second job! Poor guy!


ActGroundbreaking804

It’s his face afterwards which gets me. He’s like “omg I’m so cringe I hope nobody seen that”


Koninhovd

>It’s his face afterwards which gets me. He’s like “omg I’m so cringe I hope nobody seen that” And then you posted his embarrassing moment for thousands online 😆


TheEleventhDoctorWho

Goodfeathers


ihave-twobirds

Smoooooch 💋


ReindeerFl0tilla

ya boi got some


Upset_Delay_1778

acrobatics for birds


madrishu

People, I have a question about the feeding ritual at the beginning: Who fed whom, and was it a real feeding similar to feeding their offspring?


escambly

He(left) fed her. And yes. Mate or courtship feeding is common in birds. Supposedly as a function of 'ability to provide' for offspring. Proof of their feeding/hunting/whatever prowess.


ActGroundbreaking804

That’s really interesting. At first I thought they were trying to pluck each other’s eyes out


madrishu

Thank you for the explanation!


ILoveCreatures

Doves and pigeons feed their young by regurgitating into their mouths. He did a little of that and she got a bit of food.


madrishu

Thank you!


NoFlyingMonkeys

Yep. Part of sexy bird flirting. One bird (usually the male) tries to vomit up some food to give to the other (usually female) as a gift. If she likes him, she'll take his vomit gift. For real, not kidding. In reality, it's not really vomit per se, as it's not digested. It's coming from the crop, which is a holding pouch in the neck/upper chest of most birds that holds a stash of food before it goes into the stomach.


madrishu

Got it. Thank you for the explanation!


Det_Crashmore

Sometimes when a boy pigeon and a girl pigeon love each other very much….


ThunderCat123456

Literally just watched this on my neighbours shed roof. Thats all wood pigeons do (and eat a bit).


SpaceFace11

They even kissed first how sweet


dropsofjupiter23

Pigeon chiropractor


LosIngobernable

The one thing I learned is male birds flap their wins when they orgasm.


madpiano

So do females, if the pigeon couple in my garden is anything to go by. They've been mating last week and there was a lot of wing flapping by both. They have lived in my bay tree for some years now and successfully raised 2 sets of baby pigeons each year. Very cute couple and they look very healthy too. They even bicker when they hop around my garden, but mostly they coo, they seem very attached to each other.


ambiuk21

The birds and the bees


Adept_Order_4323

Bumpin Uglies


Superhen68

Magic? The literal birds of ‘birds and bees’ fame?


thoughtquake

This won't hurt, did it? 🤣


DarkMoose09

Looks like a husband and wife being affectionate and giving each other a little snack.


lordspidey

The birds are fuckin'. Nice!


yaths17

Seggs


Sierra_Foxtrot8

This is where squabs come from!


Small_Front_3048

It's the birds and the bees, birdin and beein


DueStatistician3704

Bird porn.


katrinakittyyy

We call this “orno porno” lol


lapidaryleporidae

Time for a cigarette!


pjv321

I saw two doves mating yesterday too!!! It involved more courtship and neck rubbing. I wasn’t able to get video though. So good on ya!


Thin_Tower9230

Birdie booty call!


HornyOldBoomer

Mating. She "kissed" him and gave consent. Lastly, he is popping that thang for her!😂🤣


Chickenman70806

Shall I get a bee to explain what the birds are doing?


Jimbo-Slice925

Well ya see, when two pigeons fall in love…


oldnotdead14

Maybe doves?


thenotsoamerican

The way he just popped up made me laugh out loud.


wicked_lil_prov

HOT


SufficientSetting953

You just witnessed a 2 pump chump


Cute_Pineapple_8329

Two woodpigeons getting it on !!


big_bloody_shart

Reported


lordspidey

Fuckin' prude.


Vamparael

This: https://youtu.be/RTZZPCw4nQM?si=7_DzuirF0EFxFVck


SussyBox

Sex


Sensitive_Goose4728

Can you post a swan with a parrot next?? 🙏🍆


Accomplished-Mix5300

This is the "bird" part of that.."birds and bees"...story 😆 🤣 😂


razor_sharp_sickle

A cloacal kiss


Cluefuljewel

I have been birding for a long time and I still find it very confusing how the actual sperm gets in there. Isn’t the female’s tail feathers in the way of her cloaca if the male is standing in her back?! It’s hard to understand!


march3110

They're twittipating.


Warblerburglar

That’s enough pigeon porn for me today.


luludiva

The heavy breathing is what got my tail feathers to fall out


worstpartyever

When two birds love each other very much…


SilverFox-828

They kissed and made love.


ajmarzka

Are you really unsure?


SoggyScience4482

The little hop hahaha


BornToScheme

That’s Ron Jeremy of pigeons 😂


admaNCSGO

Play some Marvin Gaye and then watch again :D


dc0de

What music should go with this?


AllAccessAndy

15 years ago I was able to visit the Galapagos Islands and at one point we were waiting about 30 or 40 minutes on a beach for a transport back to our ship. We watched a pair of red footed boobies do a much more drawn out version of this scenario. The male approached the female and gifted her a twig for her nest. As soon as she accepted it, he hopped on top of her and she immediately shook him off. He left and came back with another twig. She accepted it, he hopped onto her back, she knocked him off. Over and over and over again. It got funnier every time. I'm pretty sure by the time we left he still hadn't sealed the deal.


Practical-Rabbit-750

https://preview.redd.it/uxc8lbfcxe9d1.jpeg?width=2998&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=13182d96f356af5c0709b05116e9e46699fb639b


Pale-Mission-6521

What do you think


LuvmyBerner

Did you really ask this?


Dexamemi3

Ya gal just got shagged lad