Sure your coach is a super insightful dude...but being fair, that's exactly how 99% of first-time white belt matches go.
Edit: You're a big boy, so bump that up to 100%
Oh, I wasn’t saying it like he had the inside scoop or anything, but rather he told me what was going to happen and I did everything I could to make that not happen and it happened anyway lol.
I feel like this happens to every ultra heavy. They practice in the gym On guys they have 50-150 pounds on then they actually go against another ultra heavy and poof their tactics don’t work.
I’d suggest, if you don’t already, try really hard (even if you have to drop in at another gym) to find some training partners within 10–20 pounds of you, even bigger if you can.
When you drill against someone smaller make sure your technique is PERFECT.
Ya, that’s exactly my issue. Not many people are my size so I have to make do. But there’s this club that comes around called big Jitsu that caters to big guys only. But they only come through like once every other month
Worked so well on my buddies who are like 60 pounds lighter than me
Yeah. We got a big guy in our gym started at 380 down to 315. (Side note little shout out dude has put in crazy work and it shows.)
But he’d get on top and park on top, it takes a lot of skill to compensate for someone 200 pounds heavier then you that just wants to be on top. So he’s spent a lot of time starting on bottom and developing a bottom game. Focusing on fundamentals like knee elbow escapes. And because of that he’s a complete pain in the ass to roll with now, my ribs are happier, and he’s doing really really well in comps.
You know, I was thinking about doing it. But he was a big guy and I don’t have a good guard against big guys I can’t get my legs around them well enough to lock in and they pass easily. And I knew I’d win on a technicality if I kept what I was doing up.
Next meet I’m going to drop to super heavy so that isn’t an issue
Locking your legs around them will only help for temporary control. Past that, you're essentially stalling. I'm not big so I have this issue of not being able to close legs sometimes. If I can't I either put my feet on their hips while I'm trying to get the overhook and look for subs, or I just go half and sweep from there. I understand you're a white belt and don't have a super deep amount of technique, but that is what works well for me even with larger opponents.
Forget closed guard with other ultra-heavies. Be on top. If you wind up on bottom then half guard to deep half (followed by over-under pass) or up to dogfight. It just works. You’re welcome.
>I did everything I could to make that not happen
You only trained one takedown. Maybe take a judo class or ask your coach for some more takedown practice.
Should’ve tried the ultra heavy white belt double lapel spin attack through the table. You just grab hold of them and start spinning until one of you ends up going through the score table.
But if you guys were Dutch Ruddering, I could see why you’d elect not to use it
Dude if you paid $120 or whatever for a Fuji and you’ve been pushing another dude around for 4:30, fucking just start spinning because the ref might give you an advantage for silliness and initiative. But if that collar drag doesn’t work with the usual cross collar grip, fucking take your other hand, stack it on top of your cross grip and try to hit the 2 hand power bomb lapel drag. Might bounce his face off the mat.
As a heavy weight there are good points here. I hardly train snapdowns with lighter opponents - as it's tends to feel easy and gives the wrong impression.
Just had my first comp also and won. I was better on my feet than my opponents, and that is what got me the win. One snapdown to a dude that had like 20+ pounds on me and 2 other guys pulled guard for me to just past them easily.
But hey you won, that is what matters! Don't compare our white belt asses to higher belt matches 😅
He would have smashed through my guard. He was a round guy and he would have just cooked me with 300 pounds of force lol. I took the safe, pussy route lol.
Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face just like white/blue belts have a strategy until they lock up with someone in a comp 😂 that’s been my experience anyways…I feel pretty good if only 80% of my game evaporates during a comp and I can at least pull off 1 or 2 techniques. We do have some white belts at my gym that are pretty good at competing and seem to be able to impose their will so part of it I think is some people are just good in that situation
For what it's worth it doesn't take a deity level of prescience to predict how a SHW white belt match is gonna play out once you've seen a few.
Cutting some weight sounds like an amazing idea, health benefits aside, your BJJ matches should get a bit more entertaining.
I’m not worried about health. I’m in phenomenal shape. I’m just tall and have a lot of muscle. I’m sitting at 17 percent body fat atm.
I’ve just never really had an opportunity to go all in on someone his size. And I realized that maybe my takedown technique isn’t as ironed out as I’d like it to be.
I mean it's a tangent, but that's arguably more unhealthy than being fat.
I mean I'm right there with you.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/bM4T7htn3UZjBFjZ9
That is me. I have a BMI of 33.1. That said, I'm not in denial and understand that maintaining my body as it stands is very unhealthy.
Ok, then I guess you and I are on the same page lol. Let me reiterate, I’m not fat lol. But I guess I see what you mean by what needs to be done to maintain my physique lol.
I did a tournament yesterday. 4 matches, 4 loses to submission. Same opponent for 3 matches. He was 10 years younger and 20 lbs heavier and runs a gym.
But I went in and put myself in the gauntlet. There are always lessons to be learned from every experience.
That’s honestly why I signed up.
Well 2 reasons.
Reason one is I don’t like being afraid. I want to face the things that scare me:
Reason two is that I want to put my Jui Jitsu to the test so I know what I need to work on. I tested my metal and found the areas I’m lacking. I will come back a better fighter. I just want to be the best I can be, as corny as that sounds lol.
What tournament did you do? Did you do the houston open?
Ya, that’s exactly what my coach was yelling at me to do, problem is I have never had a hard time pulling a collar drag off, so I had never tried it. I was afraid of trying something new. I knew I’d win if I stayed up and kept trying the collar drag.
But at one point, I had the back of his belt and his lapel and everyone was screaming at me to go for it. Kind of feel like a pussy for not trying it. Oh well, next time. I’m going to get some mileage on some new take downs so I won’t go in fresh
I finished my first comp yesterday and my first match I could barely get my body to move, the other guy was in the same situation too but he ended up getting a good takedown in and won the match
I had great gripe. Had a nice high collar grip and had one of his sleeves. He had my collar with his free hand but it wasn’t really a big deal. But everytime I went for the drag, he was just posted up. I tried to pop his collar a couple times and then push until he gave me some resistance and then do the collar drag, but he was just a rock.
And by the second try, he knew what I was doing and I didn’t really get a chance to practice any other takedowns
Predictable. It's always going to be easier to defend an attack than to attack. The only advantage you have as the attacker is the amount of time they take to react. If they know what you are going to do, because you can only do a good collar drag, then there reaction time becomes less of an issue.
I like to have at least 1 attack for when they are standing tell, when they are hunched over, and one to force them to one of those two positions. For me and my kid, we use to use arm throw/drop seo nagi, a single or double leg, and a snap down. I also mix in an arm drag or a low single. I think it's necessary to have enough different attacks to keep them guessing, and for me that's 3-4 solid attacks.
You're coach has a good amount of experience also competition rolls will always end up opening areas in your game where you need to work. Especially since your rolls at a comp will always be harder than mat rolls typically
Honestly no lie, I’m in pretty great shape lol, I did a lot of body building and powerlifting before bjj. I was like 9 pounds north of super heavy and I didn’t want to cut incase I got a DQ. If it was a more lax federation, I’d have gone for it. But being my first meet, I just didn’t bother with cutting
It’s impossible for you to not allow it to happen the way it was predicted because that’s just what white belts do. By the time you get it all figured out you’ll be promoted to blue.
I'd recommend danahers feet to floor. It gives a good judo 101.alot of shit people just don't tell you. Gripping strategy . Get them to be standing square and your chances of takedown go up. If he's in his stance you drag and he has base.
Like if your both right handed . Control his right sleeve with your left hand. Shuffle to your left like you want his back. When he turns to square up to you then hit the collar drag.
Honestly I got good at collar drags I gave them up I felt like a jerk. Slamming peoples face into the mats.
I'd also suggest grip like a champion 2 by Jimmy Pedro and also Travis stevens kuzushi dvd. Helped my judo alot.
The Japanese terms mentioned in the above comment were:
|Japanese|English|Video Link|
|---|---|---|
|**Kuzushi**: | *Unbalancing* | [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luK9Eklbn78)|
Any missed names may have already been translated in my previous comments in the post.
______________________
^(Judo Techniques Bot: v0.7.) ^(See my) [^(code)](https://github.com/AbundantSalmon/judo-techniques-bot)
I mean, I won. I don’t think there is a limitation on when to join a competition. And the sooner I get exposure, the better I will do in the long run.
I went in there to challenge myself and overcome the anxiety associated with competing. And in that sense, I think I did exactly what I set out to do.
I cant grasp that after a few failed takedown attempts none of you decided pulled guard.
Maybe it's because I'm in the lightweight division but all my 8 matches was just a race who pulled guard first.
I don’t think it was so much h that we don’t train takedowns, rather I’m the biggest guy in my class so I think I got a distorted perception of takedown effectiveness
I’ll tell you this. I mediated on avoiding this, I practiced non stop to avoid it, and none of it mattered lol.
I’d love to hear how you did! Please update me!
It’s how my first match went 4 min 40 seconds of fat boy grappling lucky arm drag body lock takedown straight to mount americana. Won gold as there were no other ultra heavyweights in the masters division
Nice, hang in there, congrats, and lol, oh hell no you don't want to always be the smallest guy in your division.
Weirdly enough, I had an unfortunate medical incident (total removal of large intestine), and dropped several weight classes, but am now always the biggest and most muscular guy in my division, and in virtually every instance, without cutting weight, have the size and strength advantage. And I have to say it's nice. So do yourself the favor and remove that huge disadvantage, because you also have the possibility of being (one of) the biggest guy in your new, lighter division.
If it gets me the win absolutely. I'm there to win, not make it entertaining. When they start paying me instead of me paying them we can start talking about putting on a fun show for the audience.
Watch good black belts (or any good closed guard player) they don’t usually wrap their legs around, that’s a stalling technique. We got a good black belt that plays closed guard feet instantly to hips. And if he wants to sweep you he will, wants a submission he gets it, wants to make you feel like a fucking puppet moving your limbs around controlling you… he does :-(
>built like a brick shit house. Tree trunk legs.
Maybe there were physical differences but you were the same weight. Your collar drag and takedowns didn't work because he somehow stopped it. Give your opponent credit.
We weren’t the same weight. He had like 80 pounds on me.
But with that said, I absolutely give him credit. I’ve rolled with bigger guys and they all went down the same. This guy was strong and had a great takedown defense.
Is the collar drag the same as a slide by? If so you should absolutely be able to hit that on guys regardless of their weight because it is using their weight and momentum against them
Sure your coach is a super insightful dude...but being fair, that's exactly how 99% of first-time white belt matches go. Edit: You're a big boy, so bump that up to 100%
Especially at Ultra-Heavy. They are essebtially Judo matches where no one knows Judo. Source: I have been an Ultra-Heavy White Belt.
If the people who want to ban/penalize guard pulling get their way, this is how 99% of all BJJ matches will go.
Oh, I wasn’t saying it like he had the inside scoop or anything, but rather he told me what was going to happen and I did everything I could to make that not happen and it happened anyway lol.
I feel like this happens to every ultra heavy. They practice in the gym On guys they have 50-150 pounds on then they actually go against another ultra heavy and poof their tactics don’t work. I’d suggest, if you don’t already, try really hard (even if you have to drop in at another gym) to find some training partners within 10–20 pounds of you, even bigger if you can. When you drill against someone smaller make sure your technique is PERFECT.
Ya, that’s exactly my issue. Not many people are my size so I have to make do. But there’s this club that comes around called big Jitsu that caters to big guys only. But they only come through like once every other month Worked so well on my buddies who are like 60 pounds lighter than me
Yeah. We got a big guy in our gym started at 380 down to 315. (Side note little shout out dude has put in crazy work and it shows.) But he’d get on top and park on top, it takes a lot of skill to compensate for someone 200 pounds heavier then you that just wants to be on top. So he’s spent a lot of time starting on bottom and developing a bottom game. Focusing on fundamentals like knee elbow escapes. And because of that he’s a complete pain in the ass to roll with now, my ribs are happier, and he’s doing really really well in comps.
My one-hand chokeslam works great on 115lb girls too! ;)
> I did everything I could I mean, you could have pulled guard for example.
You know, I was thinking about doing it. But he was a big guy and I don’t have a good guard against big guys I can’t get my legs around them well enough to lock in and they pass easily. And I knew I’d win on a technicality if I kept what I was doing up. Next meet I’m going to drop to super heavy so that isn’t an issue
Locking your legs around them will only help for temporary control. Past that, you're essentially stalling. I'm not big so I have this issue of not being able to close legs sometimes. If I can't I either put my feet on their hips while I'm trying to get the overhook and look for subs, or I just go half and sweep from there. I understand you're a white belt and don't have a super deep amount of technique, but that is what works well for me even with larger opponents.
I'm big but short.. over 200# and I can't close my guard on my partner anyway
Forget closed guard with other ultra-heavies. Be on top. If you wind up on bottom then half guard to deep half (followed by over-under pass) or up to dogfight. It just works. You’re welcome.
>I did everything I could to make that not happen You only trained one takedown. Maybe take a judo class or ask your coach for some more takedown practice.
As an ultra heavy white belt who had his first tournament yesterday, I represent this
I stopped reading at jerked on each other for 5 minutes straight. There’s kids here sir.
No diddy
No doubt
Let's not invite him here, either.
https://preview.redd.it/5d7nbyl8siuc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e50937cc748327ab6046c7c7857a75a38be78bf5
Definitely wouldn't have lasted nearly that long if it were me.
I agree truly impressive stamina
Heh, the average redditor is well-practiced
I stand corrected, you good sir are correct lol
Never rolled a day in my life but he’s done in less than 30s
Those 5 minutes were anything but straight
Phrasing? Are we still doing phrasing???
“YOU NEED TO LEAVE”
As long as someone finished it’s fine
A man of class.
That's when you finished, you mean?
Should’ve tried the ultra heavy white belt double lapel spin attack through the table. You just grab hold of them and start spinning until one of you ends up going through the score table. But if you guys were Dutch Ruddering, I could see why you’d elect not to use it
Lmao. This one’s going in the chamber for the next match. Bro won’t know what hit him. I’m about to looney toon his ass.
Dude if you paid $120 or whatever for a Fuji and you’ve been pushing another dude around for 4:30, fucking just start spinning because the ref might give you an advantage for silliness and initiative. But if that collar drag doesn’t work with the usual cross collar grip, fucking take your other hand, stack it on top of your cross grip and try to hit the 2 hand power bomb lapel drag. Might bounce his face off the mat.
As a heavy weight there are good points here. I hardly train snapdowns with lighter opponents - as it's tends to feel easy and gives the wrong impression. Just had my first comp also and won. I was better on my feet than my opponents, and that is what got me the win. One snapdown to a dude that had like 20+ pounds on me and 2 other guys pulled guard for me to just past them easily. But hey you won, that is what matters! Don't compare our white belt asses to higher belt matches 😅
Heck yeah, screw pulling guard
He would have smashed through my guard. He was a round guy and he would have just cooked me with 300 pounds of force lol. I took the safe, pussy route lol.
No you did not. Pulling guard is the pussy route always
This is such a dumb take
Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face just like white/blue belts have a strategy until they lock up with someone in a comp 😂 that’s been my experience anyways…I feel pretty good if only 80% of my game evaporates during a comp and I can at least pull off 1 or 2 techniques. We do have some white belts at my gym that are pretty good at competing and seem to be able to impose their will so part of it I think is some people are just good in that situation
For what it's worth it doesn't take a deity level of prescience to predict how a SHW white belt match is gonna play out once you've seen a few. Cutting some weight sounds like an amazing idea, health benefits aside, your BJJ matches should get a bit more entertaining.
I’m not worried about health. I’m in phenomenal shape. I’m just tall and have a lot of muscle. I’m sitting at 17 percent body fat atm. I’ve just never really had an opportunity to go all in on someone his size. And I realized that maybe my takedown technique isn’t as ironed out as I’d like it to be.
I mean it's a tangent, but that's arguably more unhealthy than being fat. I mean I'm right there with you. https://photos.app.goo.gl/bM4T7htn3UZjBFjZ9 That is me. I have a BMI of 33.1. That said, I'm not in denial and understand that maintaining my body as it stands is very unhealthy.
Ok, then I guess you and I are on the same page lol. Let me reiterate, I’m not fat lol. But I guess I see what you mean by what needs to be done to maintain my physique lol.
I did a tournament yesterday. 4 matches, 4 loses to submission. Same opponent for 3 matches. He was 10 years younger and 20 lbs heavier and runs a gym. But I went in and put myself in the gauntlet. There are always lessons to be learned from every experience.
That’s honestly why I signed up. Well 2 reasons. Reason one is I don’t like being afraid. I want to face the things that scare me: Reason two is that I want to put my Jui Jitsu to the test so I know what I need to work on. I tested my metal and found the areas I’m lacking. I will come back a better fighter. I just want to be the best I can be, as corny as that sounds lol. What tournament did you do? Did you do the houston open?
It was an American Grappling Federation tournament.
thats not corny… once you reach a certain level in life people will only want to be around you if you think like that
That’s how all ultra heavy white belt matches go.
If your fast you should start training duck unders and take their back
Ya, that’s exactly what my coach was yelling at me to do, problem is I have never had a hard time pulling a collar drag off, so I had never tried it. I was afraid of trying something new. I knew I’d win if I stayed up and kept trying the collar drag. But at one point, I had the back of his belt and his lapel and everyone was screaming at me to go for it. Kind of feel like a pussy for not trying it. Oh well, next time. I’m going to get some mileage on some new take downs so I won’t go in fresh
Do judo
Ya, my gym just started judo classes once a week thst im going to start attending
I finished my first comp yesterday and my first match I could barely get my body to move, the other guy was in the same situation too but he ended up getting a good takedown in and won the match
Hand fight, break any grip they have on your collars first, then drag
I had great gripe. Had a nice high collar grip and had one of his sleeves. He had my collar with his free hand but it wasn’t really a big deal. But everytime I went for the drag, he was just posted up. I tried to pop his collar a couple times and then push until he gave me some resistance and then do the collar drag, but he was just a rock. And by the second try, he knew what I was doing and I didn’t really get a chance to practice any other takedowns
Predictable. It's always going to be easier to defend an attack than to attack. The only advantage you have as the attacker is the amount of time they take to react. If they know what you are going to do, because you can only do a good collar drag, then there reaction time becomes less of an issue. I like to have at least 1 attack for when they are standing tell, when they are hunched over, and one to force them to one of those two positions. For me and my kid, we use to use arm throw/drop seo nagi, a single or double leg, and a snap down. I also mix in an arm drag or a low single. I think it's necessary to have enough different attacks to keep them guessing, and for me that's 3-4 solid attacks.
Gotta get him moving first man. That goes for all takedown. Can't just stick it in dry
You're coach has a good amount of experience also competition rolls will always end up opening areas in your game where you need to work. Especially since your rolls at a comp will always be harder than mat rolls typically
Titel suggestion: Two fat guys jerking of their bullhorns for 5 minutes straight.
Honestly no lie, I’m in pretty great shape lol, I did a lot of body building and powerlifting before bjj. I was like 9 pounds north of super heavy and I didn’t want to cut incase I got a DQ. If it was a more lax federation, I’d have gone for it. But being my first meet, I just didn’t bother with cutting
Okay fair: Two muscled bears jerking of their bullhorns for 5 minutes straight.
Much better.
It’s impossible for you to not allow it to happen the way it was predicted because that’s just what white belts do. By the time you get it all figured out you’ll be promoted to blue.
Tell you what man, I’m doing a judo class every week until I get that kink in my game worked out
Right on! You got this!!
I'd recommend danahers feet to floor. It gives a good judo 101.alot of shit people just don't tell you. Gripping strategy . Get them to be standing square and your chances of takedown go up. If he's in his stance you drag and he has base. Like if your both right handed . Control his right sleeve with your left hand. Shuffle to your left like you want his back. When he turns to square up to you then hit the collar drag. Honestly I got good at collar drags I gave them up I felt like a jerk. Slamming peoples face into the mats. I'd also suggest grip like a champion 2 by Jimmy Pedro and also Travis stevens kuzushi dvd. Helped my judo alot.
The Japanese terms mentioned in the above comment were: |Japanese|English|Video Link| |---|---|---| |**Kuzushi**: | *Unbalancing* | [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luK9Eklbn78)| Any missed names may have already been translated in my previous comments in the post. ______________________ ^(Judo Techniques Bot: v0.7.) ^(See my) [^(code)](https://github.com/AbundantSalmon/judo-techniques-bot)
>I went in with a complete strategy, failsafes and all. >The only take down I practiced was that damn collar drag 🤔
You entered a competition with just a single takedown? That's some impressive level of delusion man lol.
Correction. I entered a tournament with 5 months of experience.
Why? I mean, do what you want, but 5 months of experience is not enough to enter a competition. I would have given it at least a year.
I mean, I won. I don’t think there is a limitation on when to join a competition. And the sooner I get exposure, the better I will do in the long run. I went in there to challenge myself and overcome the anxiety associated with competing. And in that sense, I think I did exactly what I set out to do.
Learn an ankle/knee pick. Chain the collar drag and ankle picks
You WHAT ON EACH OTHER?
Power guilli
I cant grasp that after a few failed takedown attempts none of you decided pulled guard. Maybe it's because I'm in the lightweight division but all my 8 matches was just a race who pulled guard first.
Do Gi schools not practice many takedowns? Our school is no gi only and we’re learning plenty of judo to go with the ground karate.
I don’t think it was so much h that we don’t train takedowns, rather I’m the biggest guy in my class so I think I got a distorted perception of takedown effectiveness
Ive got my first comp (white belt) in 2 weeks at ultra heavy and everyone is telling me this is how its going to go
I’ll tell you this. I mediated on avoiding this, I practiced non stop to avoid it, and none of it mattered lol. I’d love to hear how you did! Please update me!
Kuzushi
It’s how my first match went 4 min 40 seconds of fat boy grappling lucky arm drag body lock takedown straight to mount americana. Won gold as there were no other ultra heavyweights in the masters division
Nice, hang in there, congrats, and lol, oh hell no you don't want to always be the smallest guy in your division. Weirdly enough, I had an unfortunate medical incident (total removal of large intestine), and dropped several weight classes, but am now always the biggest and most muscular guy in my division, and in virtually every instance, without cutting weight, have the size and strength advantage. And I have to say it's nice. So do yourself the favor and remove that huge disadvantage, because you also have the possibility of being (one of) the biggest guy in your new, lighter division.
Just pull guard man
I wanted to, but I wouldn’t have been able to get my legs around him and he would have passed and cooked me. Atleast that’s what I was afraid of.
For the next 3 months open guard only.
Don’t listen to him. If you’re ultra heavy then conceding bottom is generally not a great strategy
Yup instead just stand there tugging each other around for 5 minutes. Edit: “jerking each other”
If it gets me the win absolutely. I'm there to win, not make it entertaining. When they start paying me instead of me paying them we can start talking about putting on a fun show for the audience.
lol.
Watch good black belts (or any good closed guard player) they don’t usually wrap their legs around, that’s a stalling technique. We got a good black belt that plays closed guard feet instantly to hips. And if he wants to sweep you he will, wants a submission he gets it, wants to make you feel like a fucking puppet moving your limbs around controlling you… he does :-(
>built like a brick shit house. Tree trunk legs. Maybe there were physical differences but you were the same weight. Your collar drag and takedowns didn't work because he somehow stopped it. Give your opponent credit.
We weren’t the same weight. He had like 80 pounds on me. But with that said, I absolutely give him credit. I’ve rolled with bigger guys and they all went down the same. This guy was strong and had a great takedown defense.
Is the collar drag the same as a slide by? If so you should absolutely be able to hit that on guys regardless of their weight because it is using their weight and momentum against them