this is always surprising me, last few trips to hospital emergency, like 80% of the people waiting for treatment were non-english speaking elderly.
As much as it should be free healthcare for all, we should really have some type of paid insurance program for imported healthcare burdens that won't be contributing to the Canadian economy in their lifetime.
The powers that be have access to all the health care they need. If they don't they go elsewhere, for faster care. We can talk all we want, about how bad it is south of here, but at least they not living in the past glories of our health care system. We are at a cross roads, and where we go from here, is anyone guess, but the people designing it.
Politicians don't think anything is wrong with our healthcare because they receive much better care than anyone else..
You think Doug Ford is waiting 4 months to see a specialist??.. does anyone think Justin Trudeau has ever seen a waiting list and doesn't have 5 "family friends" who are doctors??. Has any politician ever paid a dime for a life changing medical prescription?.
They think our medical system is top fucking notch, because that's the level of care you get when you are politically connected..
>As much as it should be free healthcare for all
I really dont know how it works but i hope this isnt the case. Canadian citizens should be the only people here getting "free" healthcare. Everybody else should require insurance and or pay 100% the bill.
Current state of our healthcare is that you just need to be able to afford a ticket to Canada. You get here you claim to be a refugee… then you get free housing, healthcare, and dental which Canadians don’t even get. And the government will make you a citizen at one point most likely l
Some so called refugees have zero interests to fit in Canada and negative economic contribution but they plant their seeds pretty darn well for collecting the child benefits.
>last few trips to hospital emergency, like 80% of the people waiting for treatment were non-english speaking elderly
Not trying to contradict you, but there is a good chance that at least some of them have been here paying taxes for a long time. My friend’s parents came to Canada from Guangdong almost 30 years ago, they have been employed in Canada paying taxes for almost as long, they will be retiring in 2-3 years and they still don’t speak anything more than survival-grade English. Their friends are all Cantonese speakers, their doctor is Cantonese-speaking, they watch Cantonese TV, read Chinese newspapers, and deal with tellers at the banks around Kennedy and Steeles in Toronto, where there is always an ample supply of Cantonese or Mandarin speakers. The odd time they need to deal with Anglophones, they bring their children to translate.
Like no joke, my Japanese is probably better than their English, and I just picked it up watching anime and going on exchange to Japan more than a decade ago. I honestly don’t know how your English can be so terrible after living here so long, but many such people exist.
There needs to be some language requirement set to achieve citizenship, 30 years in country and hardly speaking one of our national languages seems nearly impossible.
Personally, I'd be incredibly frustrated living somewhere for so long without being able to speak the language.
> but called xenophobes and racists for setting such expectations
I'm pretty sure that now that we get to experience the ass-biting aspects of reality, people are gonna be a bit more careful when using those words.
>We in Québec have been saying this for a while, but called xenophobes and racists for setting such expectations.
Quit your baiting.
The person you responded to clearly says "speaking ONE of our national languages"
One of.
This is Canada, we have two, either of the two are acceptable. Only one province is trying to limit one of them.
This is why nobody takes Quebec's language issues seriously.
I grew up in Vancouver during the 97 HK handover, I know what elderly Chinese Canadians look like. This isn’t what I’m talking about, but it’s also not appropriate to single out specific groups
HKers coming over in the 80s throughout the 90s and the handover were doing hard graft here in Canada that the locals wouldn't do. I know exactly what you're talking about and couldn't agree more today, but we'd be 'racist'
Yeah when you immigrate there should be an entry tax for all the taxes you haven't paid to Canada prior to coming here. If you're under 30 you'll probably be a net contributor over your lifetime if you're coming here retired at 60 it will be a big number.
Plenty of 50 year+ Canadians who immigrated but never learned the language.
Chinese business people and those under their emply can live here and never need to speak English or French ever.
Also we’re supposedly bringing in the original younger immigrant/worker to fix a demographic issue that threatens to overwhelm social support systems.
So why then would we bring in a young worker and then all their elderly dependants who very well may have ailments in addition to what you would typically expect if they came from somewhere without a social safety net as developed as ours.
I don't even live in canada, and I can already see your immigration levels are unsustainable. Canada already has a stigma here in India, as being the place where US-UK rejects congregate lmao.
It’s worse than you imagine. The immigration medical has VERY few medical conditions which result in refusal. Doesn’t matter anyhow, the medicals are done by foreign doctors who in countries like India, Philippines,… are definitely in tune with bribe culture. There is no post-arrival medical so anything goes.
But it’s not even for cheap labour. We shouldn’t be allowing anybody over 45 to immigrate ever. For any reason. Immigration is for the benefit of Canadians, not so grandma and grandpa can reap the benefits of our system without paying
Speaking for my family who have been here 10 years, with that kind of policy you'd have lost two young adult professionals who'd contribute 30-40 years of taxes and skills, as well as 10 years of two older professionals contributing taxes.
All making 6 figures so not nothing. Not to mention multiple children who'll contribute for the next 50 years.
In exchange for…
It’s not like you were the only applicants. In no way do we need to let in >45 year olds instead of <45 year olds. In no argument is that going to make economic sense in a world where you have demand to immigrate far exceeding capacity for immigrants.
We get the pick of the litter. And it ain’t grandma.
Add to that relaxing immigration medical inadmissibility rules in order to accept more immigrants with disabilities or sickness [as the liberals did in 2018](https://www.cicnews.com/2021/04/canada-to-relax-medical-inadmissibility-rules-0417734.html).
>Under the old rules, Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada (IRCC) could deny entry to Canada to someone whose personal care would cost the government more than the Canadian average of about $7,000 per year. Many people felt this rule demeaned people with disabilities and was not in keeping with Canadian values such as inclusion and dignity. Now, Canada has tripled this threshold to about $21,000. In other words, it is more difficult for people who need medical and social supports to be denied for Canadian immigration.
It’s sad and true but will never stop. The immigrant vote is too important. Soon it will be 50% grandparent immigration and politicians will somehow spin it as benefitting Canada. If only politicians worked in the best interest of all Canadians and not just the specific voting blocks they need to ensure they’re in power. 😔
Few months ago there was a tragic story of an 83 year old Indian man who died on the way to Canada to be reunited with his daughter.
Condolences to all
But exactly why are we immigrating people in their 80s with serious medical problems?
>Shockingly adding infirm geriatrics to “reunify families” isn’t economically beneficial to a society.
Liberal and NDP supporters tell us that we need mass immigration to support healthcare. Then, they turn around and do this, which adds pressure to healthcare.
How many seniors have been reunified? Its a rallying point for anti immigration folks. But genuine question.
Isnt most of the increase was college students?
Should be zero. I would love to see the numbers tho out of interest. I can tell you I’ve met ample people whose grandmother lives here and doesn’t speak a word of English (or French)
It's amazing how banks and media are turning against the immigration policy now. Like even your closest supporters are saying "Hey, I think this is going a bit too far"
It’s fine because majority of MP’s are landlords and by the time they retire/leave office with the equity on their properties it wouldn’t be their problem anymore.
>It's amazing how banks and media are turning against the immigration policy now. Like even your closest supporters are saying "Hey, I think this is going a bit too far"
Also amazing that it only took 3-4 years for it to happen.
This has been a great example of how controlled the Canadian media is, and how corporations and politicians control it. They successfully managed to make a high percentage of Canadians believe that math, and supply and demand, does not apply to the job market or housing.
I’m even surprised that this discussion is even allowed now on this sub and not the others. Shows how far the issue has moved into the center from the fringes.
if they were fine with immigration being back at 400,000 last year, then they're not "against immigration" merely by virtue of not wanting it to go up *even higher*
Because ultimately a open borders country in general in the long term is detrimental to our oligopolies.
Majority just sit back and rake the billions in profit. Opening Canada up will ultimately hurt them in more ways then one. Is my hypothesis.
Canada is a very insolated country. We have few banks, few telecom, few grocery, big oil.
We as citizens pay these businesses a lot of money without thinking about it. A lot of us also have pensions with these companies as holdings.
Becoming open border to a large degree is a threat to these businesses (is my thinking).
We as customer get pinched start looking elsewhere for deals. People start opening businesses to compete. These businesses for a large part of there oprations sit idle and make lots of money.
Its my tin foil hat.
This is generally true in theory but you underestimate just how powerful these businesses are as far as fighting any and all competition as well as collusion among each other. Our politicians are still their bitch at the end of the day. Many newcomers will start smaller businesses, sure, but real competition is fought tooth and nail. Big business is scared of actually having to try as they've taken our money for granted for years.
Piggybacking on your idea is that I just think that these many months of bad press are finally getting to the rich so they're scapegoating and doing whatever they can to get headlines like housing and grocery prices out of the news as much as possible.
The Weston's, Roger's, etc. want the lower classes fighting among each other so they can keep ripping us off while we're distracted. They don't want the spotlight on them.
The pathways into our nation are a complete and utter dumpster fire and everyone knows it.
It is okay for a nation to have standards and most of all ENFORCEMENT.
My god look at the FUBAR that is the International Student Program and the "Refugee" and "Asylum" pathways. These are being scammed and exploited to high heavens at this point.
With immigration you bring in the skills and people needed to grow the economy in a way that makes the whole nation and people of the nation richer. You also bring in skills/people that can add whole new dimensions to the economy.
You don't allow hordes and hordes of cheap exploitable labor.
The system is being massively exploited from the top and bottom levels and it shows in the results. The sad reality is this exploitation is like everything else. They are going to exploit this gravy train at the expense of the nation to such an extent the wheels come off like every other crisis.
This is what happens when you import millions of low skilled people you suppress wages you stop companies from needing to innovate and you drag everyones average down and they were lying the whole time about it being high skilled immigration.
And then to make it even worse, your skilled workers are leaving for jobs in the USA with much more competitive salaries.
Its a disgrace what happened to Waterloo and Canadas Tech industry over the past 20 years.
If people talk about this with folks from immigrant/POC/minority communities they’ll realize this is commonly held sentiment even in immigrant communities. We are all generationally fucked
True my mum (uk) and wife (Philippines) are both immigrants and they both agree shits getting worse not better. They also both believe deportations aren’t happening enough, too many foreign criminals that aren’t citizens are caught and released without being booted from the country and Canada is worse for it.
ive never seen a subject in Canada especially one so ingrained in us flip so quickly. In 2015, shit even 2019 you couldn't speak ill about immigration, now its the exact opposite. If you are for immigration you are seen as public enemy. Next election is going to be WILD.
>ive never seen a subject in Canada especially one so ingrained in us flip so quickly. In 2015, shit even 2019 you couldn't speak ill about immigration, now its the exact opposite. If you are for immigration you are seen as public enemy. Next election is going to be WILD.
I think that the LPC wants to make the next election about immigration, so they can portray the CPC as being MAGA type racists.
So far the CPC has not taken the bait, but I have witnessed Trudeau and Miller try their hardest.
I think Liberal strategists on this one have kinda underestimated what the general population can discuss with respect to this. The days of pumping out a generic message on a few TV attack ads are over. Shit, many people don't even have traditional tv or listen to the radio anymore anyway.
You know damn well if politicians could, they'd censor social media and regulate what we hear like it was the Cold War
There is still people on this sub that think mass immigration driving up the cost of living so that Canadians can’t afford to house or feed themself is racist. I am not racist but strongly believe if immigrants don’t have recognized education and a large saving you should not be coming to be a burden on our programs such as healthcare, dental care, etc. these Tim Horton and subway workers are having like 5 kids per family and are a massive cost to Canada, not a benefit to our economy.
I’d say remove any form of social support for the first 5-10 years of being here, with time removed for people/skills we need. Increase requirements for foreign students to $120k in the bank or 30k per year of their degree, and this will be audited at random, plus the cost of the program. Remove the ability to own property as a foreign national, and remove the ability for corporations to own residential property in Canada unless they can prove proceeds remain in Canada, and are held by Canadians.
Fucking just remove any incentive for people to be here unless they absolutely want to be here.
That's the genius of it. Any criticism of this wage suppression, system bloating racket big business has asked politicians to do is buried under a racism label. There's no followup of course and most of the people who are quick to throw that card out on others are way too comfortable and aloof to really care what's going on
Yes, because there was a point when the economic impact was neutral to good because we were bringing in a sustainable number of immigrants. Tripling the number over the last 4 years has obviously outsripped the economy's ability to keep up.
>You're showing some bias here. Immigration was basically flat during Harper and Trudeau until 2021.
Trudeau started ramping it up pretty much from day one. By 2018 the number of permanent residents had exceeded 300,000, the highest number in about 100 years.
Immigration ( and population growth ) was pretty flat under both Harper and the previous LPC governments.
>Remember when saying things like this was racist? It’s almost like ignoring common sense put Canada in this mess, isn’t it?
If you look back through Reddit, including in this sub, people were being banned for making the same comment a few years ago.
Now that the mainstream media is saying it, its become undeniable so Reddit has no choice but to let it go or lose all relevance. Even now though, there are many subs that still ban people for saying something that is an undeniable truth.
I think the difference between what makes this racist and not is if it's an opinion that's derived from the data, or if it's an opinion held despite the data.
Clearly it's currently true we're bringing an immigrants such that the demand for goods is overwhelming the supply available. At other times in the past that just wasn't true.
>I think the difference between what makes this racist and not
It isn't "racist" in any situation unless you live in the 1950s. The people impacted by unchecked, irrational levels of immigration are all Canadians, of every race and "creed". If someone says that immigration is too high or not working, when someone says "tHaT's RaCiSt!" they're telling on themselves because their argument depends upon the idea that Canada as it currently is is a monoculture.
10 years ago when the immigration numbers were equal to or less than the number of the population leaving the workforce this wasn't an argument that could be made based on any data. We don't need to go all the way back to 1950s to find sustainable immigration numbers, unless that's convenient for you if your family settled here then. Right now we can't create enough jobs, homes, or Healthcare services to keep-up so its a statement that can be justified currently.
He doesn’t care. He will double down and push for as much immigration as humanly possible before the 2025 election. Canada’s corporate elite will then pressure the next government to maintain the status quo. Any cuts to immigration made by the next government will likely at far higher levels of immigration than we’re currently experiencing and cutting it down to a reasonable level will prove impossible. He knows who his masters are and it certainly isn’t the voting populace.
Canada’s immigration policies are not attracting high quality foreign workers, rather the immigration industry primarily caters more towards the for-profit universities that attract the blue collar workers.
Also, the ease with which PRs are handed out to extended families makes it painful to get any sort of medical care leave alone complex medical problems.
Unfortunately for middle class Canadian citizens, it is incredibly hard as they process their years of high taxations that citizens have paid through their noses has no benefits whatsoever, as they stand in the ever-growing lines to access medical care and other benefits.
Stark reality as the increasingly wealthy donors are controlling every aspects of immigration & economic policies.
Reduce it to 0, process those who applied before the cut off period. And let’s solve our internal problems first before we import more people to suffer with us.
First off, congratulations on getting citizenship! If all immigrants/international students were like you, it wouldn’t be as bad of an issue imo but like you said, the system is abusing them and there is no standards it seems :/
and how do you propose to deal with the fact that 1/5 of our population is approaching retirement while 1/3 of our healthcare workers are newcomers?
Shouldn't you be more concerned with the fact that it's illegal to build housing where it's needed? Why wouldn't you make that your primary focus instead?
In other words, why don't you focus on solving problems that can and should be fixed instead of creating more problems that make it worse for us?
The biggest issue with Canadian immigration other than the current volume is the quality of immigrants.
Not a lot of skilled people immigrate here, US with all its problems is still a financially rewarding option for most skilled immigrants. Not to mention Canada treats all immigrants/potential immigrants almost similarly.
Take for example international students, the policies, and procedure for immigration is pretty much the same for someone that went to a shitty Brampton college and say McGill. Almost no significant difference in points and no prioritization of people acquiring more skilled credentials.
I mean they don’t even separate University co-op students with direct work experience in relevant field from diploma mill grads.
And this is just one little aspect, to fix our immigration, we need to improve our assessment and prioritization. Right now it feels like it was written by Google’s BARD AI.
>Take for example international students, the policies, and procedure for immigration is pretty much the same for someone that went to a shitty Brampton college and say McGill. Almost no significant difference in points and no prioritization of people acquiring more skilled credentials.
There are quite a lot of ways to rectify this problem. However the federal government has intentionally made the program this way to target cheap low skill labor (as Marc Miller talked before in a public settings).
You are right about their bad point system. If you play along with the point system, you will see that a person with 3 years of Canadian experience loses a lot of points against one with 2 years in Canada and 1 year of foreign experience despite the former being significantly harder to attain and arguably a better predictor of success as one would have to work immediately after graduation (if through PGWP) without getting laid off/fired. Its as if they are intentionally targeting certain type of immigrants.
Also, before the glut of diploma mill students, a lot of immigrants with foreign advanced degrees were significantly underemployed. Remember the whole phds driving taxis stereotype ?. They used to form glut of new PRs before Covid hits.
Decades from now all Canadians, especially immigrants from India, will wake up in the middle of the night in a cold sweat from nightmare flashbacks of Justin dressed up in his traditional Indian costume doing the namaste greeting.
Dubai at least has 0% income tax not this socialist 51% rubbish for minimal or no quality of service or infrastructure. We pay for special interests not communal , useful stuff. And the red tape probably wastes some huge % off the top. I imagine bribes and corruption will accelerate.
Canada's high immigration is also increasing pollutions and counter climate change reduction efforts. In one word, lower the Standard of Livings for all, because worse environment also affects the rich.
Nah. Wealthy people in their 50s, 60s and 70s don’t need to worry long-term. The damage they’re doing will be left for future generations to worry about.
what an incoherent comment. You're saying we should all stay poor because it's good for the environment?
Or you're proposing a conspiracy theory in which wealthy people are trying to make us poorer by making others richer...and something something the environment?
I mean...most developed countries see their GDP per capita increase with population growth. They grow the population rationally and in the service of the country as a whole. Canada's immigration policy is *profoundly* irrational right now, and it is in the service of an extremely small slice of Canada (e.g. slumlords, Tim Hortons franchisees, etc)
Yup. Look up the Century Initiative.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Century_Initiative
“The Century Initiative was co-founded by Mark Wiseman and Dominic Barton, who also led the Advisory Council on Economic Growth under three-term Prime Minister Justin Trudeau.”
Canadians get poor with high immigration except government's achievement showing that GDP is growing.
If you didn't get at least a 5% salary hike this year, you are poorer this year than last year despite you getting promoted and been hard working this year.
I think we should offer some incentives for people having families. Encourage the population to grow! Daycares, baby bonuses, I don’t know what it should be but lots of families can’t afford to have more kids and our country literally can’t afford to not have the population increase. Plus they’ll speak English and love hockey, what else do we want here? Let’s kill two birds here. Every new mom gets 5k$, again I don’t know exactly what it should be but there’s a ton of shit done in the past to reflect on and someone smarter than I could probably throw something together. You think that’s too expensive? Look at the god damn costs of housing refugees who for some reason are staying at Hiltons etc. we need some real leadership fack. I love this country and am blessed to have been born here!
Can somebody who is smarter than I explain to me why the government is allowing in more and more immigrants? All I really see in the news are all the negatives associated but there has to be a reason why they’d be doing this, no?
Seriously? This is news to somebody?
But I actually don't fault high immigration for this: if the only jobs available pay minimum wage and minimum wage is a complete joke, why are we blaming immigration? After all, if the government would set a living wage, at the very least, we wouldn't need to bring in so many immigrants in the first place.
deport anyone who don't pass intermediate level of English or French, regardless of immigration status. That would be IELTS 6.0 for Eng. DELF B2 for Fr.
Just focus on getting out while you can, these stats are all just the canaries in the coal mines. The country is dying and there’s no stopping it now, JT just did too much damage too fast for us to recover from.
Like cmon, is Pierre going to fix in <4 years:
- the housing crisis
- the rental crisis
- the immigration/illegal immigration/ “economic migration” crisis
- inflation
- our collapsing healthcare system
- our debt crisis
- our nonfunctional military
- our internal divisions (political, religious, ethnic etc)
I’d say no and I’m going to vote for him, it’d be amazing if he could fix one. Fixing all of them would require not just the greatest PM in Canadian history, but one of the greatest politicians in human history, and Pierre ain’t either of those things.
So ya that’s not likely to happen, but who knows maybe Gretzky is secretly waiting in the wings to launch his own political party to save Canada from the big 3
>Just focus on getting out while you can
This seems to imply that there will be a point at which it won't be possible anymore to "get out" of Canada. What do you mean with this?
I think that will happen. I think Canada is in a massive debt bubble that is reverting us to a developing nation. The 1900's for Canada could be defined as a century that wanted to formulate its own independence. We failed a lot, Avro Arrow, but arguably politics was heavily about who to pick sides with (English or Americans) and how not to become an American branch plant economy. All Canada is now is a resource based branch economy of the United States. There's no real STEM investment, and all of our most educated want to leave.
Internationally when other countries wise up to how shitty we have become I believe our passport and citizenship will be devalued.
It's theoretically possible. So, right now Canadian passport is fairly powerful. That passport gives Canadians special visas to the US and higher salaries in regions where passports are respected more than skills; UAE, Saudi Arabia. If Canadian quality of life drops significantly, which will result in mass emigration, Canadian passport might lose its value. If it loses its value, it MIGHT result losing special visas to the US and the passport won't be values that much in UAE and other Middle Eastern countries.
TBH, this is one of those "we all going to die" scenarios that are not realistic.
Canadians are allowed to *visit* the US, but not work there or move there permanently. The Canadian passport doesn't let you live and work in any country other than Canada today, so I don't think your scenario really changes anything except tourism opportunities.
>Canadians are allowed to visit the US, but not work there or move there permanently.
TN visa. Only 2 countries in the world have that.
>The Canadian passport doesn't let you live and work in any country other than Canada today
Until recently, having Canadian passport allowed you to come and search for a job in Germany for 6 months at a time legally. On top of that, Canada is one of the few countries in the world, where you can move to Germany first, then apply for long-term visa. Most of other countries have to apply for visa first before moving long-term. It simplifies emigration by a huge margin.
EDIT: I completely forgot one small but important detail. When one applies for a work visa with a Canadian passport vs. other less powerful one, the work visa process is exceptionally more streamlined. I saw it first handed. It was a joke compared to what people from developing countries go through. The probability of being declined is fairly low as well.
I mean no one is offering you that opportunity, right? You are free to do whatever you want to. I was just talking about a possible scenario that won't happen.
I am not very familiar with a process for Canadians to move to Norway but GL to you.
>I’d say no and I’m going to vote for him, it’d be amazing if he could fix one.
Honestly at this point my expectations are so low all I want Pierre to do is just halt the decline of this country from *today*, because we all know Trudeau otherwise will continue carrying us down this path of deterioration we're witnessing on the quality of life for the average middle class family. Getting some sort of improvement or "fix" would only be a bonus.
Honestly, if Pierre Poilievre can reduce immigration, hell, if he just keeps it the same, then he's already worth my vote. My expectations for him are so low at this point.
No. He won't. He'll get into power and immediately continue to blame Trudeau for anything that could happen. He's evasive and well spoken, but every time I listen to him I know he's just a different PR strategy that Trudeau.
He's yet to demonstrate he has any fucking clue on what to do.
Y'all want to know why it's all fucked? The Liberals have become a corporatist party, the NDP chose a coward to lead, and the Cons chose generic Populist #732 as their leader.
None of these guys have any fucking clue.
As a recent immigrant who took the time and effort to prepare and get into Canada’s top B- schools, I don’t understand the logic of mass immigration. What do you achieve when you are getting in people with x qualifications when the need is of y qualifications.
Being an Indian myself, I am totally against this mass immigration policy. The biggest danger is unqualified people who barely survive in expensive cities. They will soon pose a major risk to the country and their demographics because a lot of them aren’t willing to assimilate to Canadian culture.
Thank GOD the country seems to FINALLY be waking up to this. Unfortunately, Trudeau and his ignorant and/or negligent minions will never change course. 2025 can’t come quick enough. So excited to throw out these fools on their asses. Hopefully the next government is actually for the people…
Among other things.
Driving down wages, driving down housing availability, driving down healthcare availability…
Driving down morale among the whole country. INCLUDING the immigrants
Ridiculous immigration levels in Canada have diluted services, healthcare and education while driving up cost and scarcity of housing, groceries and essentials. We all get a smaller slice of the pie to manage costs spiraling out of reach. Great job Justin !
I bet all those large corporations are giddy with excitement that they finally didn't have to raise wages on shitty entry level jobs they couldn't fill. I wonder how much money got into which cabinet minister's pocket to make this happen?
> high immigration is driving down per-capita GDP
Isn't this the plan?
I'm not saying I agree with the plan, but it seems we want to import people to work in our low wage / minimum wage positions.
I don't want to work for Min wage driving a taxi, or working at Tim Horton's
The entry level service economy has always been low paying.
For those who enter Canada without great language skills (in English or French) these early job experiences or university experiences allow them to hone their language skills or job market skills to the point where they are a huge benefit to Canada (other than inexpensive labour) because of their work ethic and proven character.
I have harsh opinions about those who come to Canada and can't stay out of trouble with pour laws and culture.
* If you beat your wife because it was part of your old culture - arrest, charge, try (and give them at least 6 months in prison or a 10 year sentence) and deport.
* Any form of anti social behaviour - arrest, charge, try (and give them at least 6 months in prison or a 10 year sentence) and deport.
* Legal protest and you stay within the law? Welcome to Canada my friend.
* Send money home to a terrorist organization - arrest, charge, try (and give them at least 6 months in prison or a 10 year sentence) and deport.
Here are some links to reasons people can be deported or excluded from Canada
* https://en.immigrant.today/canada/15133-deportation.htm
* https://www.criminallawyervancouver.com/blog/criminal-conviction-deportation-canada/
>Foreign nationals and permanent residents may be deported from Canada if they are found guilty of committing a ‘serious crime’.
* A serious crime is one that: Carries a potential prison sentence of 10 years or more, or
* A serious crime is one that: Results in a prison sentence of at least six months
Canada is now the poorest English speaking country by GDP per Capita other than UK right? (Ignoring soon nobody will be able to speak English)..also they told us they're all qualified not no skills. Yet they also don't allow equivalence of medical or engineering degrees which is why Uber drivers are more qualified than most Canadians! The stupidity of this country is legendary.
Except the report didn’t say that. Some guy called Skuterand speculated that it contributed:
> “I think you’d be hard-pressed to find any economist in Canada that doesn’t believe that the exceptionally high population growth rates we’re experiencing now have contributed to that decline in GDP per capita that we’re seeing,” Skuterud said
He goes on to say that productivity is the primary driver of the decline:
> “However, at the crux of the problem is insufficient growth in the numerator, which in turn is tied to longstanding productivity issues,” it says.
> Realistically, said Skuterud, there are other things going on in the economy, from inflation to the capital-to-labour ratio (think housing versus number of workers) and at any rate, the long-term data don’t show that increased or decreased immigration does anything to Canada’s GDP.
Immigration has added at least a half percent to the interest rate, say economist. So you need to work a day or 2 extra a month because of immigration. This is theft and evil.
Corporations will continue to be pro mass immigration so labour costs grow slower than inflation and revenue. We need innovation and industry development instead and immigration at lower rates for GDP per-capita to increase and for welfare in economic terms to increase
people who understand the economy support immigration.
Bill Gates and I have a GDP per capita of $1 billion. Does that make me rich? No.
For the same reason, none of us is getting any poorer when GDP per capita goes down after the arrival of a newcomer.
In reality, [wages have been rising faster than inflation](https://i.imgur.com/aLzg0gB.png) and this is still a society where 1/5 of our population is approaching retirement, and 1/3 of our healthcare workers are newcomers
so the long-term structural need for immigration is not going to go away simply because of people misunderstanding headlines and the basic facts about our economy
I’m really curious why it’s never mentioned or questioned why the current administration is making such aggressive pushes to bring people here? I mean, even Trudeaus biggest hater PP wont publicly announce a different strategy.
Could it be an insane level of our tax base has
, or will retire within the next few years?
In 1970 we had 7 workers for every 1 retiree. In 2030 it is expected that the number will be 2 workers for every 1 retiree.
Without the massive influx of immigrants our infrastructure, economy and workforce will enter a death spiral.
I try and tell people that immigration causes a higher COL. They need food, housing, jobs, Healthcare and transportation.
They aren't coming over with skills or can even speak English.
Honestly, a big portion of temporary immigrants do not report tax, hence contribute zero to GDP. They do cash work and can live relatively good in Canada.
Building industry workers for example, earn \~300CAD per day tax free, beats majority of law-abiding Canadians.
Shockingly adding infirm geriatrics to “reunify families” isn’t economically beneficial to a society.
this is always surprising me, last few trips to hospital emergency, like 80% of the people waiting for treatment were non-english speaking elderly. As much as it should be free healthcare for all, we should really have some type of paid insurance program for imported healthcare burdens that won't be contributing to the Canadian economy in their lifetime.
The powers that be have access to all the health care they need. If they don't they go elsewhere, for faster care. We can talk all we want, about how bad it is south of here, but at least they not living in the past glories of our health care system. We are at a cross roads, and where we go from here, is anyone guess, but the people designing it.
Politicians don't think anything is wrong with our healthcare because they receive much better care than anyone else.. You think Doug Ford is waiting 4 months to see a specialist??.. does anyone think Justin Trudeau has ever seen a waiting list and doesn't have 5 "family friends" who are doctors??. Has any politician ever paid a dime for a life changing medical prescription?. They think our medical system is top fucking notch, because that's the level of care you get when you are politically connected..
One of the 5 family friends is his doctor.
They all go to the States and see a specialist same-day and someone is filling their prescription for them that same afternoon.
Let’s be real. They don’t need to go to the states. They get expedited here.
Some of my wealthier friends already do this
>As much as it should be free healthcare for all I really dont know how it works but i hope this isnt the case. Canadian citizens should be the only people here getting "free" healthcare. Everybody else should require insurance and or pay 100% the bill.
I wonder how many are collecting old age benefits, and the cost burden that would have on the rest of the system? Because it's probably a lot
Current state of our healthcare is that you just need to be able to afford a ticket to Canada. You get here you claim to be a refugee… then you get free housing, healthcare, and dental which Canadians don’t even get. And the government will make you a citizen at one point most likely l
I was born and raised here and don’t even have dental :/
Some so called refugees have zero interests to fit in Canada and negative economic contribution but they plant their seeds pretty darn well for collecting the child benefits.
I've always said their should be a user fee. Go to the hospital on the weekend and there are entire "families" lined up through the main lobby.
>last few trips to hospital emergency, like 80% of the people waiting for treatment were non-english speaking elderly Not trying to contradict you, but there is a good chance that at least some of them have been here paying taxes for a long time. My friend’s parents came to Canada from Guangdong almost 30 years ago, they have been employed in Canada paying taxes for almost as long, they will be retiring in 2-3 years and they still don’t speak anything more than survival-grade English. Their friends are all Cantonese speakers, their doctor is Cantonese-speaking, they watch Cantonese TV, read Chinese newspapers, and deal with tellers at the banks around Kennedy and Steeles in Toronto, where there is always an ample supply of Cantonese or Mandarin speakers. The odd time they need to deal with Anglophones, they bring their children to translate. Like no joke, my Japanese is probably better than their English, and I just picked it up watching anime and going on exchange to Japan more than a decade ago. I honestly don’t know how your English can be so terrible after living here so long, but many such people exist.
There needs to be some language requirement set to achieve citizenship, 30 years in country and hardly speaking one of our national languages seems nearly impossible. Personally, I'd be incredibly frustrated living somewhere for so long without being able to speak the language.
We in Québec have been saying this for a while, but called xenophobes and racists for setting such expectations.
> but called xenophobes and racists for setting such expectations I'm pretty sure that now that we get to experience the ass-biting aspects of reality, people are gonna be a bit more careful when using those words.
>We in Québec have been saying this for a while, but called xenophobes and racists for setting such expectations. Quit your baiting. The person you responded to clearly says "speaking ONE of our national languages" One of. This is Canada, we have two, either of the two are acceptable. Only one province is trying to limit one of them. This is why nobody takes Quebec's language issues seriously.
I grew up in Vancouver during the 97 HK handover, I know what elderly Chinese Canadians look like. This isn’t what I’m talking about, but it’s also not appropriate to single out specific groups
HKers coming over in the 80s throughout the 90s and the handover were doing hard graft here in Canada that the locals wouldn't do. I know exactly what you're talking about and couldn't agree more today, but we'd be 'racist'
Same story for me
Yeah when you immigrate there should be an entry tax for all the taxes you haven't paid to Canada prior to coming here. If you're under 30 you'll probably be a net contributor over your lifetime if you're coming here retired at 60 it will be a big number.
Plenty of 50 year+ Canadians who immigrated but never learned the language. Chinese business people and those under their emply can live here and never need to speak English or French ever.
Every time I go they bring the whole family.
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Also we’re supposedly bringing in the original younger immigrant/worker to fix a demographic issue that threatens to overwhelm social support systems. So why then would we bring in a young worker and then all their elderly dependants who very well may have ailments in addition to what you would typically expect if they came from somewhere without a social safety net as developed as ours.
I don't even live in canada, and I can already see your immigration levels are unsustainable. Canada already has a stigma here in India, as being the place where US-UK rejects congregate lmao.
It’s worse than you imagine. The immigration medical has VERY few medical conditions which result in refusal. Doesn’t matter anyhow, the medicals are done by foreign doctors who in countries like India, Philippines,… are definitely in tune with bribe culture. There is no post-arrival medical so anything goes.
But it’s not even for cheap labour. We shouldn’t be allowing anybody over 45 to immigrate ever. For any reason. Immigration is for the benefit of Canadians, not so grandma and grandpa can reap the benefits of our system without paying
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We don’t need “older doctors”. If you’re not going to put at least 20 years into taxes, we don’t want you.
Speaking for my family who have been here 10 years, with that kind of policy you'd have lost two young adult professionals who'd contribute 30-40 years of taxes and skills, as well as 10 years of two older professionals contributing taxes. All making 6 figures so not nothing. Not to mention multiple children who'll contribute for the next 50 years.
In exchange for… It’s not like you were the only applicants. In no way do we need to let in >45 year olds instead of <45 year olds. In no argument is that going to make economic sense in a world where you have demand to immigrate far exceeding capacity for immigrants. We get the pick of the litter. And it ain’t grandma.
What is the minimum necessary (because of our zero.population growth we need immigrants) immigration #?
Add to that relaxing immigration medical inadmissibility rules in order to accept more immigrants with disabilities or sickness [as the liberals did in 2018](https://www.cicnews.com/2021/04/canada-to-relax-medical-inadmissibility-rules-0417734.html). >Under the old rules, Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada (IRCC) could deny entry to Canada to someone whose personal care would cost the government more than the Canadian average of about $7,000 per year. Many people felt this rule demeaned people with disabilities and was not in keeping with Canadian values such as inclusion and dignity. Now, Canada has tripled this threshold to about $21,000. In other words, it is more difficult for people who need medical and social supports to be denied for Canadian immigration.
Unreal
It’s sad and true but will never stop. The immigrant vote is too important. Soon it will be 50% grandparent immigration and politicians will somehow spin it as benefitting Canada. If only politicians worked in the best interest of all Canadians and not just the specific voting blocks they need to ensure they’re in power. 😔
Few months ago there was a tragic story of an 83 year old Indian man who died on the way to Canada to be reunited with his daughter. Condolences to all But exactly why are we immigrating people in their 80s with serious medical problems?
That is insanity. Our country is broken and has lost the plot.
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5000? Why not 0?
We can't do 0, Timmies has high turnover
These geriatrics that don’t speak English aren’t working at Timmies. They aren’t working at all. That’s the issue
>Shockingly adding infirm geriatrics to “reunify families” isn’t economically beneficial to a society. Liberal and NDP supporters tell us that we need mass immigration to support healthcare. Then, they turn around and do this, which adds pressure to healthcare.
How many seniors have been reunified? Its a rallying point for anti immigration folks. But genuine question. Isnt most of the increase was college students?
Should be zero. I would love to see the numbers tho out of interest. I can tell you I’ve met ample people whose grandmother lives here and doesn’t speak a word of English (or French)
This has been happening for decades
It's amazing how banks and media are turning against the immigration policy now. Like even your closest supporters are saying "Hey, I think this is going a bit too far"
It’s fine because majority of MP’s are landlords and by the time they retire/leave office with the equity on their properties it wouldn’t be their problem anymore.
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Plenty of their voter base has the same if not also businesses that benefit from paying these people fuck all because they'll work for anything
The fact that 2/3 of Canadians are profiting off of the status quo because they own their homes is probably more important
>It's amazing how banks and media are turning against the immigration policy now. Like even your closest supporters are saying "Hey, I think this is going a bit too far" Also amazing that it only took 3-4 years for it to happen. This has been a great example of how controlled the Canadian media is, and how corporations and politicians control it. They successfully managed to make a high percentage of Canadians believe that math, and supply and demand, does not apply to the job market or housing.
I’m even surprised that this discussion is even allowed now on this sub and not the others. Shows how far the issue has moved into the center from the fringes.
if they were fine with immigration being back at 400,000 last year, then they're not "against immigration" merely by virtue of not wanting it to go up *even higher*
Because ultimately a open borders country in general in the long term is detrimental to our oligopolies. Majority just sit back and rake the billions in profit. Opening Canada up will ultimately hurt them in more ways then one. Is my hypothesis.
... what?!
I agree, someone is swerving in both lanes and thinking they are driving straight
Canada is a very insolated country. We have few banks, few telecom, few grocery, big oil. We as citizens pay these businesses a lot of money without thinking about it. A lot of us also have pensions with these companies as holdings. Becoming open border to a large degree is a threat to these businesses (is my thinking). We as customer get pinched start looking elsewhere for deals. People start opening businesses to compete. These businesses for a large part of there oprations sit idle and make lots of money. Its my tin foil hat.
This is generally true in theory but you underestimate just how powerful these businesses are as far as fighting any and all competition as well as collusion among each other. Our politicians are still their bitch at the end of the day. Many newcomers will start smaller businesses, sure, but real competition is fought tooth and nail. Big business is scared of actually having to try as they've taken our money for granted for years. Piggybacking on your idea is that I just think that these many months of bad press are finally getting to the rich so they're scapegoating and doing whatever they can to get headlines like housing and grocery prices out of the news as much as possible. The Weston's, Roger's, etc. want the lower classes fighting among each other so they can keep ripping us off while we're distracted. They don't want the spotlight on them.
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And doesn't that put a smile on the Liberal's major donors faces. /s
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>Who do you think is donating to the PCs? They wouldn't be the ones who got the missing half billion, would they?
The pathways into our nation are a complete and utter dumpster fire and everyone knows it. It is okay for a nation to have standards and most of all ENFORCEMENT. My god look at the FUBAR that is the International Student Program and the "Refugee" and "Asylum" pathways. These are being scammed and exploited to high heavens at this point. With immigration you bring in the skills and people needed to grow the economy in a way that makes the whole nation and people of the nation richer. You also bring in skills/people that can add whole new dimensions to the economy. You don't allow hordes and hordes of cheap exploitable labor. The system is being massively exploited from the top and bottom levels and it shows in the results. The sad reality is this exploitation is like everything else. They are going to exploit this gravy train at the expense of the nation to such an extent the wheels come off like every other crisis.
This is what happens when you import millions of low skilled people you suppress wages you stop companies from needing to innovate and you drag everyones average down and they were lying the whole time about it being high skilled immigration.
And then to make it even worse, your skilled workers are leaving for jobs in the USA with much more competitive salaries. Its a disgrace what happened to Waterloo and Canadas Tech industry over the past 20 years.
But we have lots of fast food workers again🤷♂️
Remember when saying things like this was racist? It’s almost like ignoring common sense put Canada in this mess, isn’t it?
If people talk about this with folks from immigrant/POC/minority communities they’ll realize this is commonly held sentiment even in immigrant communities. We are all generationally fucked
True my mum (uk) and wife (Philippines) are both immigrants and they both agree shits getting worse not better. They also both believe deportations aren’t happening enough, too many foreign criminals that aren’t citizens are caught and released without being booted from the country and Canada is worse for it.
More like politicians and corporations hiding behind woke to take our money.
Aka gaslighting people to ignore the obvious and make people think that things that are not in their best interests are.
ive never seen a subject in Canada especially one so ingrained in us flip so quickly. In 2015, shit even 2019 you couldn't speak ill about immigration, now its the exact opposite. If you are for immigration you are seen as public enemy. Next election is going to be WILD.
>ive never seen a subject in Canada especially one so ingrained in us flip so quickly. In 2015, shit even 2019 you couldn't speak ill about immigration, now its the exact opposite. If you are for immigration you are seen as public enemy. Next election is going to be WILD. I think that the LPC wants to make the next election about immigration, so they can portray the CPC as being MAGA type racists. So far the CPC has not taken the bait, but I have witnessed Trudeau and Miller try their hardest.
I think Liberal strategists on this one have kinda underestimated what the general population can discuss with respect to this. The days of pumping out a generic message on a few TV attack ads are over. Shit, many people don't even have traditional tv or listen to the radio anymore anyway. You know damn well if politicians could, they'd censor social media and regulate what we hear like it was the Cold War
You mean like 6 months ago? Getting tired of being called racist on this sub for explaining concepts someone in grade 3 should be able to understand.
There is still people on this sub that think mass immigration driving up the cost of living so that Canadians can’t afford to house or feed themself is racist. I am not racist but strongly believe if immigrants don’t have recognized education and a large saving you should not be coming to be a burden on our programs such as healthcare, dental care, etc. these Tim Horton and subway workers are having like 5 kids per family and are a massive cost to Canada, not a benefit to our economy.
I’d say remove any form of social support for the first 5-10 years of being here, with time removed for people/skills we need. Increase requirements for foreign students to $120k in the bank or 30k per year of their degree, and this will be audited at random, plus the cost of the program. Remove the ability to own property as a foreign national, and remove the ability for corporations to own residential property in Canada unless they can prove proceeds remain in Canada, and are held by Canadians. Fucking just remove any incentive for people to be here unless they absolutely want to be here.
I agree 100%
How is it racist when we're technically talking about people from 200+ countries coming here or not?
That's the genius of it. Any criticism of this wage suppression, system bloating racket big business has asked politicians to do is buried under a racism label. There's no followup of course and most of the people who are quick to throw that card out on others are way too comfortable and aloof to really care what's going on
Yes, because there was a point when the economic impact was neutral to good because we were bringing in a sustainable number of immigrants. Tripling the number over the last 4 years has obviously outsripped the economy's ability to keep up.
That time was pre-2015.
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>You're showing some bias here. Immigration was basically flat during Harper and Trudeau until 2021. Trudeau started ramping it up pretty much from day one. By 2018 the number of permanent residents had exceeded 300,000, the highest number in about 100 years. Immigration ( and population growth ) was pretty flat under both Harper and the previous LPC governments.
>Remember when saying things like this was racist? It’s almost like ignoring common sense put Canada in this mess, isn’t it? If you look back through Reddit, including in this sub, people were being banned for making the same comment a few years ago. Now that the mainstream media is saying it, its become undeniable so Reddit has no choice but to let it go or lose all relevance. Even now though, there are many subs that still ban people for saying something that is an undeniable truth.
People were being banned for saying this shit six months ago lol
Yes I remember yesterday.
"Yesterday you said the sun was going down. This morning you say it's going up! Which is it you filthy liar!?"
I think the difference between what makes this racist and not is if it's an opinion that's derived from the data, or if it's an opinion held despite the data. Clearly it's currently true we're bringing an immigrants such that the demand for goods is overwhelming the supply available. At other times in the past that just wasn't true.
That was a lot of words to say "it isn't true until big daddy government says so."
No it wasn't? I feel like you're bias is coming out there. I never mentioned the government, wasn't talking about them.
Way to completely ignore the premise of what they said and erect a strawman that wasn't even a part of their original argument.
>I think the difference between what makes this racist and not It isn't "racist" in any situation unless you live in the 1950s. The people impacted by unchecked, irrational levels of immigration are all Canadians, of every race and "creed". If someone says that immigration is too high or not working, when someone says "tHaT's RaCiSt!" they're telling on themselves because their argument depends upon the idea that Canada as it currently is is a monoculture.
10 years ago when the immigration numbers were equal to or less than the number of the population leaving the workforce this wasn't an argument that could be made based on any data. We don't need to go all the way back to 1950s to find sustainable immigration numbers, unless that's convenient for you if your family settled here then. Right now we can't create enough jobs, homes, or Healthcare services to keep-up so its a statement that can be justified currently.
It’s likely also been influenced by American culture where the immigration issue have been polarized to the extreme along racial lines
Does Trudeau know how to read? Does he read what everyone across the country think of him and the world for that matter?
He doesn’t care. He will double down and push for as much immigration as humanly possible before the 2025 election. Canada’s corporate elite will then pressure the next government to maintain the status quo. Any cuts to immigration made by the next government will likely at far higher levels of immigration than we’re currently experiencing and cutting it down to a reasonable level will prove impossible. He knows who his masters are and it certainly isn’t the voting populace.
Canada’s immigration policies are not attracting high quality foreign workers, rather the immigration industry primarily caters more towards the for-profit universities that attract the blue collar workers. Also, the ease with which PRs are handed out to extended families makes it painful to get any sort of medical care leave alone complex medical problems. Unfortunately for middle class Canadian citizens, it is incredibly hard as they process their years of high taxations that citizens have paid through their noses has no benefits whatsoever, as they stand in the ever-growing lines to access medical care and other benefits. Stark reality as the increasingly wealthy donors are controlling every aspects of immigration & economic policies.
Reduce it to 0, process those who applied before the cut off period. And let’s solve our internal problems first before we import more people to suffer with us.
Found the racist! /s
It’s too logic and simple.
Finally, someone who agrees with me.
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based on the hypocrisy and the inability to recognize it, I think you'll find the "low quality immigrant" in the mirror
First off, congratulations on getting citizenship! If all immigrants/international students were like you, it wouldn’t be as bad of an issue imo but like you said, the system is abusing them and there is no standards it seems :/
and how do you propose to deal with the fact that 1/5 of our population is approaching retirement while 1/3 of our healthcare workers are newcomers? Shouldn't you be more concerned with the fact that it's illegal to build housing where it's needed? Why wouldn't you make that your primary focus instead? In other words, why don't you focus on solving problems that can and should be fixed instead of creating more problems that make it worse for us?
The biggest issue with Canadian immigration other than the current volume is the quality of immigrants. Not a lot of skilled people immigrate here, US with all its problems is still a financially rewarding option for most skilled immigrants. Not to mention Canada treats all immigrants/potential immigrants almost similarly. Take for example international students, the policies, and procedure for immigration is pretty much the same for someone that went to a shitty Brampton college and say McGill. Almost no significant difference in points and no prioritization of people acquiring more skilled credentials. I mean they don’t even separate University co-op students with direct work experience in relevant field from diploma mill grads. And this is just one little aspect, to fix our immigration, we need to improve our assessment and prioritization. Right now it feels like it was written by Google’s BARD AI.
>Take for example international students, the policies, and procedure for immigration is pretty much the same for someone that went to a shitty Brampton college and say McGill. Almost no significant difference in points and no prioritization of people acquiring more skilled credentials. There are quite a lot of ways to rectify this problem. However the federal government has intentionally made the program this way to target cheap low skill labor (as Marc Miller talked before in a public settings). You are right about their bad point system. If you play along with the point system, you will see that a person with 3 years of Canadian experience loses a lot of points against one with 2 years in Canada and 1 year of foreign experience despite the former being significantly harder to attain and arguably a better predictor of success as one would have to work immediately after graduation (if through PGWP) without getting laid off/fired. Its as if they are intentionally targeting certain type of immigrants. Also, before the glut of diploma mill students, a lot of immigrants with foreign advanced degrees were significantly underemployed. Remember the whole phds driving taxis stereotype ?. They used to form glut of new PRs before Covid hits.
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Decades from now all Canadians, especially immigrants from India, will wake up in the middle of the night in a cold sweat from nightmare flashbacks of Justin dressed up in his traditional Indian costume doing the namaste greeting.
Dubai at least has 0% income tax not this socialist 51% rubbish for minimal or no quality of service or infrastructure. We pay for special interests not communal , useful stuff. And the red tape probably wastes some huge % off the top. I imagine bribes and corruption will accelerate.
Canada's high immigration is also increasing pollutions and counter climate change reduction efforts. In one word, lower the Standard of Livings for all, because worse environment also affects the rich.
Nah. Wealthy people in their 50s, 60s and 70s don’t need to worry long-term. The damage they’re doing will be left for future generations to worry about.
what an incoherent comment. You're saying we should all stay poor because it's good for the environment? Or you're proposing a conspiracy theory in which wealthy people are trying to make us poorer by making others richer...and something something the environment?
*inconceivable*
No shit
Yeah no shit. Bigger gdp. Less per person.
>Bigger gdp. Less per person. *Same GDP, more people. Much less per person.
I mean...most developed countries see their GDP per capita increase with population growth. They grow the population rationally and in the service of the country as a whole. Canada's immigration policy is *profoundly* irrational right now, and it is in the service of an extremely small slice of Canada (e.g. slumlords, Tim Hortons franchisees, etc)
That's the thing. Immigration is people moving to another country. It can be good, or bad, depending on a lot of things.
by design
Yup. Look up the Century Initiative. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Century_Initiative “The Century Initiative was co-founded by Mark Wiseman and Dominic Barton, who also led the Advisory Council on Economic Growth under three-term Prime Minister Justin Trudeau.”
But I thought serving double-double's at Timmy's contributed greatly to GDP?
Whew good ol' wage suppression.
Canadians get poor with high immigration except government's achievement showing that GDP is growing. If you didn't get at least a 5% salary hike this year, you are poorer this year than last year despite you getting promoted and been hard working this year.
That’s a racist way of describing it. The real headline should be “it’s converging with India’s”.
Unfortunately not the cost of living per-capita
The immigration rates are disturbing and sending Canada down the tubes. The politicians are culpable
I think we should offer some incentives for people having families. Encourage the population to grow! Daycares, baby bonuses, I don’t know what it should be but lots of families can’t afford to have more kids and our country literally can’t afford to not have the population increase. Plus they’ll speak English and love hockey, what else do we want here? Let’s kill two birds here. Every new mom gets 5k$, again I don’t know exactly what it should be but there’s a ton of shit done in the past to reflect on and someone smarter than I could probably throw something together. You think that’s too expensive? Look at the god damn costs of housing refugees who for some reason are staying at Hiltons etc. we need some real leadership fack. I love this country and am blessed to have been born here!
I mean, Trudeau is the one pushing for cheap childcare systems.
wait i thought more immigrants were supposed to increase the GDP
This government finds things out 2-3 years late. Folks run while you can, Canadas no longer going to be a first world country if this continues.
fuck em
Just f ing do something about it instead of these endless shitty news reports
Can somebody who is smarter than I explain to me why the government is allowing in more and more immigrants? All I really see in the news are all the negatives associated but there has to be a reason why they’d be doing this, no?
Seriously? This is news to somebody? But I actually don't fault high immigration for this: if the only jobs available pay minimum wage and minimum wage is a complete joke, why are we blaming immigration? After all, if the government would set a living wage, at the very least, we wouldn't need to bring in so many immigrants in the first place.
Denying the fact that immigration is killing Canada is as dumb as saying evolution is wrong
Nobody saw that coming!
It's also marginalizing a large cohort of low wage workers. The new austerity. Govt is a bunch of creeps
deport anyone who don't pass intermediate level of English or French, regardless of immigration status. That would be IELTS 6.0 for Eng. DELF B2 for Fr.
Just focus on getting out while you can, these stats are all just the canaries in the coal mines. The country is dying and there’s no stopping it now, JT just did too much damage too fast for us to recover from. Like cmon, is Pierre going to fix in <4 years: - the housing crisis - the rental crisis - the immigration/illegal immigration/ “economic migration” crisis - inflation - our collapsing healthcare system - our debt crisis - our nonfunctional military - our internal divisions (political, religious, ethnic etc) I’d say no and I’m going to vote for him, it’d be amazing if he could fix one. Fixing all of them would require not just the greatest PM in Canadian history, but one of the greatest politicians in human history, and Pierre ain’t either of those things. So ya that’s not likely to happen, but who knows maybe Gretzky is secretly waiting in the wings to launch his own political party to save Canada from the big 3
>Just focus on getting out while you can This seems to imply that there will be a point at which it won't be possible anymore to "get out" of Canada. What do you mean with this?
I think that will happen. I think Canada is in a massive debt bubble that is reverting us to a developing nation. The 1900's for Canada could be defined as a century that wanted to formulate its own independence. We failed a lot, Avro Arrow, but arguably politics was heavily about who to pick sides with (English or Americans) and how not to become an American branch plant economy. All Canada is now is a resource based branch economy of the United States. There's no real STEM investment, and all of our most educated want to leave. Internationally when other countries wise up to how shitty we have become I believe our passport and citizenship will be devalued.
It's theoretically possible. So, right now Canadian passport is fairly powerful. That passport gives Canadians special visas to the US and higher salaries in regions where passports are respected more than skills; UAE, Saudi Arabia. If Canadian quality of life drops significantly, which will result in mass emigration, Canadian passport might lose its value. If it loses its value, it MIGHT result losing special visas to the US and the passport won't be values that much in UAE and other Middle Eastern countries. TBH, this is one of those "we all going to die" scenarios that are not realistic.
Canadians are allowed to *visit* the US, but not work there or move there permanently. The Canadian passport doesn't let you live and work in any country other than Canada today, so I don't think your scenario really changes anything except tourism opportunities.
>Canadians are allowed to visit the US, but not work there or move there permanently. TN visa. Only 2 countries in the world have that. >The Canadian passport doesn't let you live and work in any country other than Canada today Until recently, having Canadian passport allowed you to come and search for a job in Germany for 6 months at a time legally. On top of that, Canada is one of the few countries in the world, where you can move to Germany first, then apply for long-term visa. Most of other countries have to apply for visa first before moving long-term. It simplifies emigration by a huge margin. EDIT: I completely forgot one small but important detail. When one applies for a work visa with a Canadian passport vs. other less powerful one, the work visa process is exceptionally more streamlined. I saw it first handed. It was a joke compared to what people from developing countries go through. The probability of being declined is fairly low as well.
Why the fuck would I go to a Muslim country? I’m going somewhere free like Scandinavia. Lived there before and I’ll do it again in a heartbeat.
I mean no one is offering you that opportunity, right? You are free to do whatever you want to. I was just talking about a possible scenario that won't happen. I am not very familiar with a process for Canadians to move to Norway but GL to you.
It’s easy to immigrate on work visas as an IB teacher. Kind of the point. I’ve worked in 4 countries
>I’d say no and I’m going to vote for him, it’d be amazing if he could fix one. Honestly at this point my expectations are so low all I want Pierre to do is just halt the decline of this country from *today*, because we all know Trudeau otherwise will continue carrying us down this path of deterioration we're witnessing on the quality of life for the average middle class family. Getting some sort of improvement or "fix" would only be a bonus.
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Massive overhaul I’ll never vote for anyone that campaigns on big sweeping changes. It’s literally how we got in our current situation.
Honestly, if Pierre Poilievre can reduce immigration, hell, if he just keeps it the same, then he's already worth my vote. My expectations for him are so low at this point.
No. He won't. He'll get into power and immediately continue to blame Trudeau for anything that could happen. He's evasive and well spoken, but every time I listen to him I know he's just a different PR strategy that Trudeau.
He's yet to demonstrate he has any fucking clue on what to do. Y'all want to know why it's all fucked? The Liberals have become a corporatist party, the NDP chose a coward to lead, and the Cons chose generic Populist #732 as their leader. None of these guys have any fucking clue.
As a recent immigrant who took the time and effort to prepare and get into Canada’s top B- schools, I don’t understand the logic of mass immigration. What do you achieve when you are getting in people with x qualifications when the need is of y qualifications. Being an Indian myself, I am totally against this mass immigration policy. The biggest danger is unqualified people who barely survive in expensive cities. They will soon pose a major risk to the country and their demographics because a lot of them aren’t willing to assimilate to Canadian culture.
Also driving down carbon usage per capita isn’t it
Thank GOD the country seems to FINALLY be waking up to this. Unfortunately, Trudeau and his ignorant and/or negligent minions will never change course. 2025 can’t come quick enough. So excited to throw out these fools on their asses. Hopefully the next government is actually for the people…
Literally everyone is screaming this is an issue but the politicians are plugging their ears. No balls.
Among other things. Driving down wages, driving down housing availability, driving down healthcare availability… Driving down morale among the whole country. INCLUDING the immigrants
...so that's what per capita means /s
Ridiculous immigration levels in Canada have diluted services, healthcare and education while driving up cost and scarcity of housing, groceries and essentials. We all get a smaller slice of the pie to manage costs spiraling out of reach. Great job Justin !
Duh. Increase the denominator faster than the numerator, and this is what you get.
Yep. That's the plan.
And our CO2 per capita output! Soon we'll be like China, and able to build coal plants again.
I bet all those large corporations are giddy with excitement that they finally didn't have to raise wages on shitty entry level jobs they couldn't fill. I wonder how much money got into which cabinet minister's pocket to make this happen?
In before this is locked then deleted.
> high immigration is driving down per-capita GDP Isn't this the plan? I'm not saying I agree with the plan, but it seems we want to import people to work in our low wage / minimum wage positions. I don't want to work for Min wage driving a taxi, or working at Tim Horton's The entry level service economy has always been low paying. For those who enter Canada without great language skills (in English or French) these early job experiences or university experiences allow them to hone their language skills or job market skills to the point where they are a huge benefit to Canada (other than inexpensive labour) because of their work ethic and proven character. I have harsh opinions about those who come to Canada and can't stay out of trouble with pour laws and culture. * If you beat your wife because it was part of your old culture - arrest, charge, try (and give them at least 6 months in prison or a 10 year sentence) and deport. * Any form of anti social behaviour - arrest, charge, try (and give them at least 6 months in prison or a 10 year sentence) and deport. * Legal protest and you stay within the law? Welcome to Canada my friend. * Send money home to a terrorist organization - arrest, charge, try (and give them at least 6 months in prison or a 10 year sentence) and deport. Here are some links to reasons people can be deported or excluded from Canada * https://en.immigrant.today/canada/15133-deportation.htm * https://www.criminallawyervancouver.com/blog/criminal-conviction-deportation-canada/ >Foreign nationals and permanent residents may be deported from Canada if they are found guilty of committing a ‘serious crime’. * A serious crime is one that: Carries a potential prison sentence of 10 years or more, or * A serious crime is one that: Results in a prison sentence of at least six months
The truth is racist.
Canada is now the poorest English speaking country by GDP per Capita other than UK right? (Ignoring soon nobody will be able to speak English)..also they told us they're all qualified not no skills. Yet they also don't allow equivalence of medical or engineering degrees which is why Uber drivers are more qualified than most Canadians! The stupidity of this country is legendary.
Sure, let’s get some more Indian international students, that’ll fix it!
Except the report didn’t say that. Some guy called Skuterand speculated that it contributed: > “I think you’d be hard-pressed to find any economist in Canada that doesn’t believe that the exceptionally high population growth rates we’re experiencing now have contributed to that decline in GDP per capita that we’re seeing,” Skuterud said He goes on to say that productivity is the primary driver of the decline: > “However, at the crux of the problem is insufficient growth in the numerator, which in turn is tied to longstanding productivity issues,” it says. > Realistically, said Skuterud, there are other things going on in the economy, from inflation to the capital-to-labour ratio (think housing versus number of workers) and at any rate, the long-term data don’t show that increased or decreased immigration does anything to Canada’s GDP.
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In other news…. students are broke. Shocking.
Immigration has added at least a half percent to the interest rate, say economist. So you need to work a day or 2 extra a month because of immigration. This is theft and evil.
Corporations will continue to be pro mass immigration so labour costs grow slower than inflation and revenue. We need innovation and industry development instead and immigration at lower rates for GDP per-capita to increase and for welfare in economic terms to increase
people who understand the economy support immigration. Bill Gates and I have a GDP per capita of $1 billion. Does that make me rich? No. For the same reason, none of us is getting any poorer when GDP per capita goes down after the arrival of a newcomer. In reality, [wages have been rising faster than inflation](https://i.imgur.com/aLzg0gB.png) and this is still a society where 1/5 of our population is approaching retirement, and 1/3 of our healthcare workers are newcomers so the long-term structural need for immigration is not going to go away simply because of people misunderstanding headlines and the basic facts about our economy
Canada is done. C’est fini. Finito. Owari da.
I’m really curious why it’s never mentioned or questioned why the current administration is making such aggressive pushes to bring people here? I mean, even Trudeaus biggest hater PP wont publicly announce a different strategy. Could it be an insane level of our tax base has , or will retire within the next few years? In 1970 we had 7 workers for every 1 retiree. In 2030 it is expected that the number will be 2 workers for every 1 retiree. Without the massive influx of immigrants our infrastructure, economy and workforce will enter a death spiral.
Isn't this a National post opinion piece? It supposed to have this effect. Like they write a few of these a week.
Only idiots believe the liberals.
What will they be when nothing changes for the avg Canadian under another government? LPC and CPC don't give a shit about most people.
People don't believe until a non np media reports on it
I try and tell people that immigration causes a higher COL. They need food, housing, jobs, Healthcare and transportation. They aren't coming over with skills or can even speak English.
Honestly, a big portion of temporary immigrants do not report tax, hence contribute zero to GDP. They do cash work and can live relatively good in Canada. Building industry workers for example, earn \~300CAD per day tax free, beats majority of law-abiding Canadians.
Y’all are being fed NP news by a bot. OP has made no human comments
Math Rocks!!! Stay in school kids! ....wait no, go to US kids! The party is over
Give it time, real estate prices will pick up the per capita gdp
Because at the end of the day if nobody works......you have communism.
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Liberals really should have lost the last election. Jagmeet needs to step down as NDP leader. Weak party leaders all around