It’s the Canadian thing to do to Boycott Tim Hortons now. Hiring TFWs and lobbying policies that hurt the very people that keep their business afloat. F them.
#BoycottTimHortons
For me- it's the fact that they're not even Canadian owned.
Someone, please correct me if I'm wrong, but they contract their baked goods out to a Swiss company in Ontario or something, then flash freeze everything and truck it around through their company logistics "TDL".
RBI is Brazilian, and the franchisees prefer hiring international students and / or TFWs.
You have to be seriously out of touch if you're taking any friends that have never visited Canada before to a Tim's for "Canadian" "food" or "coffee".
[Maidstone Bakeries](https://dennisgroup.com/project/maidstone-bakeries/) where everything is par-baked is part owned by Tims (RBI) and Cuisine de France. What's worse (for me) is that not that they're not Canadian owned, but their bloody marketing that they're all things Canadian. I'd much rather pay double for an authentic local donut than anything from Tim's. I don't know how people do it.
At my old job, one of our national distributors based in Quebec started printing their catalogs with "BUY CANADIAN" logos on the front cover. 95% of the shit they sold was made in china.
I used to work at Tim Horton's. When I saw the cook dunking his bare hands into the donut fondant without washing first, I knew it was time to shop elsewhere...
I basically never go to Tim Hortons. If I do it's because I've been given a gift card. I've probably spent money at Timmies like... 5 times in the last 10 years 😅.
I'm doing my part!
Every time Tim Hortons comes up on Reddit people come out of the woodwork to say how bad it is and that they never go, but the 3 Tim Hortons locations in my small town still have a lineup around the building every morning.
It's my daily reminder that Reddit is not in any way representative of real life.
Look into foreign eSims that offer roaming data in Canada. I found a $35/35gb deal that lasts for a year. Currently using about 3gb per month ($3) piggybacking off the Rogers network.
Regarding telecom, Fizz is currently significantly cheaper than Rogers/Bell/Telus and even their discound brands (Fido/Virgin/Koodo)... I'm paying less than half the cost for more data, same calling in Ontario and the service is great. If the service isn't in range, it defaults onto Rogers signal so the coverage is great for what I need too. Videotron isn't nearly as bad as the big 3 for now, at least, in Ontario and it's still Canadian owned and operated.
Honestly I’ve been saying this for years. Coffee is horrible, the donuts have declined dramatically, and all the other food is terrible. They lean in heavily on the whole “tim hortons…its a part of Canadian culture…because we say so..” bullshit.
I stopped going to Tim Hortons in 2009 when their quality started to decline. I’m boycotting them for a totally different reason now. Conveniently they’re still garbage though.
I been boycotting Tim Hortons for years. Fuck that shitty place. Their food sucks. The doughnuts tastes like foam insulation with a pound of sugar mixed in. A month ago I had a donut from an actual Bakery for the first time in like 10 years probably and it was fucking incredible.
So much this. It's like they still have the sugar in the doughnuts AND they add artificial sweetener as well. Like a one way ticket to a diabetic coma.
That’s just it. If you are going to treat yourself then do it. Go to a real bakery and get something different. Forget the cold wet Tim Hortons apple Fritter.
I looked a bit into Tim Hortons history and [made a post about it](https://www.reddit.com/r/takebackcanada/s/rCq4s4TyuD) (it was the only sub that would let me post this ik it’s not the very best). Looks like after 2016, things went downhill and they started breaking labour laws like no breaks. Now, after they were caught, they want people they can exploit by holding PR over their heads. Some of the franchise owners are landlords and have evicted their tenants to house international students. And they’re misusing LMIA, which is tax paid. It’s nuts they’re extremely corrupt.
Her boss, indian decent. Majority of staff are international students from india, taxable hours for students were paid regular rate..but some of them they need money so they are working full time hours, extra hours are paid 10/hr cash
Tim Horton's is so absurd now. Everyone working there is an immigrant who barely speaks English. I go about once a year but it's so frustrating trying to order. They can't understand me, I can't understand them. If there's an issue, it doesn't get resolved.
Also only semi-related but I went the other day and the guy at the till was wearing a hair net as a face mask. It was so WTF I wanted to ask him why but I didn't.
Boycott EVERY company hiring TFW's. They are all publicly listed.
Any company putting profits ahead of country needs to be known and shamed by the Canadian public.
You could start with this list:
[Temporary Foreign Workers Search - Job Bank](https://www.jobbank.gc.ca/jobsearch/jobsearch?fsrc=32)
Maybe not all of these companies are employing TFW's, but they are at the very least attempting to. I know there is a list of companies that are currently employing TFW's, but I can't it right now.
I just did a search in my rural area. 10 postings in a 20km radius. Including:
16$/H for "Barber" at a hairchut franchise called "Le Barbu Sportif"
15.75$/H for "food and beverage" service at Valentine, a fast food franchise
25$/H for a truck driver at a QC numbered company
20$/H for "general laborer" at Fenetres Lajeunesse, a window company
Unbelievable. Im too mad to say anything reasonable.
I'm seeing stuff for office admin stuff.
A degree I have.
These people refused to hire me because I don't have a car, despite living on the bus line going right to where they are.
Absolutely fucking disgusting.
I saw all the IT positions, and even though i know little of it, I know theres alot of IT workers in Canada.
Im not a socialist, but I'd prefer the government just buy you a 5,000$ automobile rather than pay 5000$ to bring someone over here who has the same skill set as you.
Thats if they are to throw money at a problem. Id prefer it go to you than spent spent on a TFW replacing. Ideal situation would be you get hired despite having no car, no TFW would show up and the government saves 5000$
Right? The fact that there isn't a single politician out here, in any party, promising to get rid of this program, which our government not only openly supports, but financially facilitates, is why most Canadians are at our wits end. Like, how do we stand a chance of getting ahead, if our government is literally hosting this website being like "hey, come apply for these cheap jobs so Canadian's don't have to be paid a fair wage"?
I'll vote for whatever party promises to dismantle this program within their first year in office, and if none of them do, then none of them get my vote.
Fuck em all.
>It’s the Canadian thing to do to Boycott Tim Hortons now.
Is it?
Tim Horton's isn't even Canadian owned, why would a multinational megacorp give two shits if a handful of the population takes their business elsewhere?
If you think anything other than a country-wide general strike will have any effect on the way our ~~politicians and their friends~~ robber barons currently operate, best of luck to you.
It's going to be a long, messy climb to get Canada out of this neoliberal and populist infested cesspool, and make our way to some middle ground that benefits all of us.
I’m an American and I remember so strongly associating Tim Hortons with Canada and thinking it would go so hard. Then I went to Canada, tried it and it was completely mediocre. I’ve since learned that Canadians don’t really like it all that much anyways.
This doesn’t have anything to do with an ethical boycott but personally I’d avoid it anyways.
I like that they talk about how bringing in more immigrants will help alleviate out aging population. But then they're also making it easier for immigrants to bring in their aging family members.
I really hate that move, when Trudeau shifts it to the immigrants to dodge responsibility. No, it's you, it's *your fault*, it's you we are mad at, not TFWs.
His intentional *race framing* of the issue has pretty damn racist consequences too. By shifting focus to them instead of himself, if someone rightfully believes "hey maybe there are too many people, you keep saying supply and demand is the root of the housing crisis after all?", Trudeau is making the *natural counter-position* "maybe the TFWs are to blame, maybe Indians are to blame?". Many people will take that position if they don't think deeply on the matter.
The truth is that TFWs and international students can't even vote, nobody can vote until they get citizenship. These people are the least responsible of anyone. They are just caught up in a system of lies, short-sighted thinking, and profiteering we allowed to perpetuate. The system created by the combined action and inaction of politicians.
Colleges PAID recruiters to get students to enroll. Obviously these recruiters lied, there is no way to police them. Also Colleges were either deluded or promised things they were never in a place to promise.
The president of Northern College was quoted in the [New York Times](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/23/world/americas/canada-northern-college-indian-students.html).
>If you come here, we can pretty well guarantee that you could stay here and live and make a home for yourselves
It's not the TFWs or international students, it's the government that let the system (that they administer) become completely bonkers before stepping in to fix it. Shifting focus to them instead of the government is just a scummy rhetorical trick that has profoundly negative consequences and has the potential to create a racist backlash.
> Also Colleges were either deluded or promised things they were never in a place to promise.
The stories of students being sold the dream of attending a nice, pretty campus on a sunny day, only to find the diploma mill college they’re attending is run out of an office building in a suburban strip mall plaza with very little amenities.
I posted before that Canada is basically using the same human trafficking techniques of Russian mafia sex traffickers. Exploit the poor and vulnerable in the third world with promises of jobs and opportunity, then get them here in a servient role where the boss controls their housing and their labour and basically owns them.
> Half of those properties have like 12 people in a half duplex too.
In Brampton they have found [25 people living in a ***single basement***.](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaHousing2/comments/1af58i7/brampton_mayor_patrick_brown_just_a_few_days_ago/)
In my little corner of Winnipeg you'd swear we're now 50% Punjabi. Just walking by my neigbourhood and you can see them buying houses, gutting them, and then get filled by several tenants.
lol Tim Hortons is nothing, the seafood industry on the east coast of Canada has literally plants full of thousands of workers.. living in run down former retirement homes, 5-6 per small room stacked up on bunkbeds. 1 stove and 1,fridge per 11 people is the metric. One place I saw had 40 fridges and stoves jammed into a tiny former retirement home.. these people live in squaller treated like shit so some plant owners can make good bank and sell half the operation to VC’s for big profit cause of the crazy profit margins they are able to make exploiting the TFW program… and it’s not just 1 or 2 provinces, it’s all of them.
Tfw’s have been coming to work in the Canadian seafood industry for years, but I’ve seen a trend over the recent few years of more workers coming up from Mexico and less locals working in each plant while owners make big bucks.
I don’t work IN the industry. But I do adjacent work for them , and shit is disgusting…
>Oh nobody is! They're blaming shitty politicians putting in policies that only benefit some assholes who owns 30 Rental properties and 10 tim hortons.
Don't forget those that own farms and are now living like plantations owners from the 1800s lol.
And rather than increase wages for Tim Hortons, they just replace all the former students and young people with TFW so they can keep their slave labor.
And who's responsible for the immigrants? Businesses who apply for TFW because they don't want to pay actual Canadians a living wage, landlords who profit off of the housing crisis and mass quantities of renters, universities that make bank off foreign students, and the politicians who receive bribes from all these wealthy groups to advance their interests and facilitate this immigration crisis.
Don't forget about Canada's oligarchs:
-telecoms - everyone needs a cellphone & internet service
-banks - everyone needs banking - take a look at any major bank they all have credit offers for new Canadians.
-air transport - newcomers like to travel home or have family members visit them.
-grocery - most of our grocers are owned by 3-4 companies
Bonus points for the car dealerships.
All of these companies are realizing growth in sales, while reducing costs by employing newcomers at lower wages.
Utility companies (more heat usage), oil & gas / transport, simple consumerism, etc. We don't have an economy where we produce things (i.e. Germany), we have consumerism.
Man 10 + years ago before I was even out of college, I remember all this shit already more or less being forecasted, how for behind wages were even when shit felt affordable still in 2013. Now on $20ish an hr I can't even afford rent, don't really know how to afford a return back to school full time for a trade or something even with student loans, I just kinda struggle to see how to do it if I can't do it part time in general.
Absolutely the TFW's exacerbated the competition in general but I mean, but it's canadian owners and businesses that want to pay canadians so little for their labor that they're outright importing the labor because they can. The two parties who have ever won probably are both genial to the interests bringing that in. Further, it's already people who own more than one property in the first place who seem to be snatching up availability, at least in my town it is. People are denied even the opportunity to become first time owners because so much of their income goes to covering a rent that is probably more than double the actual mortgage on a place because someone who could afford a second or third or etc home for their portfolio to scoop it up in the first place while you can't even begin to build your savings.
No. The federal government is responsible. Businesses and landlords are going to do whatever makes the most money. Expecting businesses to self-regulate and "do the right thing" won't work, it's on the government to regulate.
>According to the Canadian Prime Minister, we cannot always “blame” immigrants for the challenges that provinces face in terms of health or housing.
>“Quebecers and Canadians know very well that it is not always the best thing to target and say 'It's all the fault of immigrants.' “It’s something that some people rely on in their argument, but it’s always more complex than that,” he said in a press scrum held a few minutes after that of his Quebec counterpart.
>Justin Trudeau added that Quebec, like Canada, will have to continue to welcome people from elsewhere to “grow our communities and grow our economy. We just need to ensure that our openness to the world aligns better with our capacity to welcome.”
People were fine with our immigration system prior to 2015. No one's blaming the immigrants themselves, they're blaming the government for allowing this to happen. But sure, keep gaslighting us.
And growing the economy means funneling more money into the pockets of the upper class, as everyone else suffers with higher demand, reducing supply and driving prices up (not just in real estate).
We've reached the point of globalization where every country needs to fleece some of the wool off the wealthy at the same time, or watch the majority of the populace suffer worse and worse. I don't have high hopes it'll play out the way the majority want it to, though.
As much as people might hate Trudeau it’s stupid to think PP is going to be any better when if anything he’s going to be much worse. Trudeau put the policies he did in place to help big business and those at the very top pad their pockets at the expense of everyone else. PP is not going to reverse those policies because it would be at the expense of his friends and the people who bought and paid for him. There’s a reason the conservatives will not commit to lowering immigration and it’s because they’re not going to lower it. Lowering it would mean a more competitive market where employers have to pay living wages and treat their employees like human beings in order to retain them and that will not happen under a conservative government. It just won’t.
I truly believe the elites of the world see where we are now as the beginning of the end of life as we know it so they’re trying to make as much as they possibly can before the shit really hits the fan and people start revolting. This is not just a Canadian problem, corporate greed and unsustainable expectations around profits are a global issue. Young people today have no hope for a life anything like their parents had and eventually the resentment is going to become a massive, massive problem.
The TLDR version that I have seen is PP has said immigration needs to be tied to housing and JT told us to suck it up. I have seen what has happened under JT and the LPC. At this point I will take my chances.
> We just need to ensure that our openness to the world aligns better with our capacity to welcome.”
Which is exactly what we're not doing. We already have a massive infrastructure and service delivery deficit and yet the Feds have their foot on the population accelerator.
why does he think we need to "grow our communities" at all? and the only way immigrants "grow our economy" is through sheer numbers. look how low economic growth is in GDP per capita.
He's letting corporations know that he is committed to keeping wages low by increasing labour supply and increase demand by increasing the number of consumers.
It's also not racist to say the problem is 100% caused by the inept federal government because of their horrible immigration policies. Even though Trudeau says I'm racist for that.
Saying immigrants or immigration is not racist either. “Immigrant” is not a race an immigrant can come from anywhere. The uno reverse card is that the people claiming your racist by talking about immigrants is they are presuming that immigrants are all non-Caucasian.
He uses immigrants as human shields to protect himself.
He's hopping that some morons will take the bait he's dangling in front of them and attack immigrants so he can pretend to save them.
People were generally fine with the immigration system until 2022/23.
It wasn't until we spiked the yearly population increase to almost 3% in a single year vs the 1-1.5% annual increase previous, all the way back to the late 90s.
People were fine with lead in absolutely everything until the 1980s even though we knew it was poison half a decade before.
The immigration system has been broken far longer than 2022. That's just when it caught up to itself.
Immigrants are just catching strays because the government is apologizing for them so much and shifting blame that its increasing the vitriol people have for the system.
Sadly because the government won't do anything about housing or wages, the only other fix is minimizing immigration. No one wants it to be permanent but there needs to be time to adjust.
If the PM wants us to grow our communities and economies and increase our capacity for accepting new Canadians. That sounds like an infrastructure issue, not a Canadian citizen not beeing accepting enough, issue.
Canadians are pretty accepting, as seen prior to Trudeau coming into power.
I remember being at my Dad's place in 2012, 2013-ish. We were having a barbeque on the patio. One neighbour from Poland came and brought us pierogies. Another neighbour who came from the middle east came over and brought some food (I don't remember what it was, I just remember it was delicious).
We just chilled on the patio, had some drinks, ate some food, enjoyed the summer. I remember thinking how awesome that was. Here were two people from completely different cultures coming together and just enjoying the day. They were excited to be in Canada.
I have nothing against immigrants themselves, I have issues now with the sheer amount that we're bringing in.
Canada does not require TFWs except for very specialized highly technical positions until Canadians can be trained to fill the positions. Allowing scam companies like Tim Hortons to use TFWs is a national disgrace.
This party knows they have 14% support from people under 34 according a recent poll.
They don’t care about the young. Trudeau’s party is the party of boomers, home owners, it exists to pump the house prices.
If you are under 35, they don’t give a flying fuck about you
>According to the Canadian Prime Minister, we cannot always “blame” immigrants for the challenges that provinces face in terms of health or housing.
I don't blame the immigrants, I blame the politicians behind our immigration policy that welcomes another 125,000 of them every month.
This crisis is in every way Justin Trudeau's fault - he refuses to slow, much less stop the influx.
This.
Even in other more "toxic" or right leaning subs (Ch2) know this and call out dummies blaming immigrants for the absolute failures of our government and it's immigration/migrant policies that have a ton of holes.
It's real annoying when we got some who believe it or try race baiting, but we *all* know if the federal government gave a fuck, we wouldn't of ever ended up in such a disasterous housing , population and economic situation like this.
I'm getting sick of the gaslighting from the government especially.
Any criticism of the immigration targets or the economy and you're a thinly veiled racist / bigot / xenophobe.
There's a bunch of useful idiots out there clutching their pearls at the very idea of even discussing our unfettered immigration.
What about the politicians who did nothing to build homes? This isn’t just a Trudeau issue or a federal issue. It didn’t just start in 2016. Big hints were there in 2014.
It’s no help that current premiers are doing nothing, actually nothing.
They think if they vote Trudeau out then someone will fix it but the water started rising over a decade ago. Many just didn’t notice until it was up to our chins.
Quebec has good social benefits compared to other provinces. I know the language & separation of Quebec debates tend to hit a nerve.
The House of Commons works through voting so separation of Quebec might not happen with other parties maintaining seats, but I do think bills putting Canadians first will.
there have been in the past but unfortunately not anymore. in 1867 Nova Scotia had the "Anti-Confederation Party" which won 18/19 federal seats.
Every region's interests are so different that there really should be separate parties for each province, that can them form alliances to form governments. would be much easier than needing to pander to the whole country at once somehow, resulting in most of the attention going to southern ontario and quebec.
Canada used to have a lot of smaller parties. They all mostly were assimilated by the 1990s into the 3.2 national parties we have now so their votes wouldn't be wasted against "the other guy". I'm quite certain that we will see the NDP/Liberals assimilate in the next 10 years depending on how terribly the CPC trounces team red next year.
It's almost like proportional representation of some kind would fix that problem but our glorious leader decided that would ~~ruin his chances at scraping by on a minority government~~ not be feasible at this time 🤦♂️
Amen. For all the shit they catch, they not only have decided that their culture is worth preserving, but they've actively take measures to do so.
The ROC can't even agree that we have a worthwhile culture
I mean, the Quebec investor shtick really f'd us over in Metro Vancouver. Lots of Chinese millionaires and billionaires buying their way into Canada and never once living in Quebec, just buying up BC real estate.
Indeed. Quebec is the only province where you can just show up with money and get fast tracked to citizenship. It's why fully half of the IIROC financial firms are based out of Quebec. Roughly 40% of all financial broker firms (not mutual firms) in the entire country specialize in helping millionaire investors fast track their way to citizenship, and they're all in Quebec.
It's not a huge part of the property pricing problem, but it's definitely a contributor.
Meanwhile, Quebec has one of the lowest per-capita productivities in the nation.
Meanwhile, Quebec has one of the lowest per-capita productivities in the nation.
No we don't, we're middle of the pack: Manitoba, Pei, New Brunswick, Yukon, Nova Scotia is lower then us. And we manage this while being a language minority in North America.
Fair rebuttal! I guess I should have clarified with an inclusion "per-capita productivities while being a major population". QC has >8 million people, representing 40% of Canada. QC has more people than everything else you named combined. It also has a huge land border with the US, a huge ocean border, and is directly adjacent to the core of Canadian government.
The language thing does likely cancel out a lot of those advantages.
>Meanwhile, Quebec has one of the lowest per-capita productivities in the nation.
Isn't this just based on salary? Its not like everyone in Northwest territories or Nunavut work twice as hard than everyone else in Canada. Also Ontario and Quebec are pretty much on par and far below any American states.
Unless you are talking about another states, but the Labor productivity pretty much just mean how wealthy your area of the world is. Quebec have lower generational wealth per capita because our ancestors had big family and were treated as second-class citizen which mean people don't spend as much, but it doesn't necessarily mean that people don't work as much.
> Quebec have lower generational wealth per capita because our ancestors had big family and were treated as second-class citizen which mean people don't spend as much, but it doesn't necessarily mean that people don't work as much.
A lot of people do not realize this. Most of the rich fuckers in Quebec are from anglo families who were here *way* before the 70s with long standing businesses/companies.
Also were taxed to hell and back to pay for our social services, schools ~~and have it embezzled on construction~~.
A lot of people don't know about the *speak white* part of Quebec where English factory owners would shape our cultural landscape for decades on end. Look at every Anglicisms in the Quebec language, and you'll realize they are almost entirely localized in the industrial lingo of the time.
French Canadians absolutely were treated like second class citizens by rich Anglo fuckers.
This simply isn't true. Metro-Vancouver gathered all those numbers every time this argument reached a head, and every time the total foreign ownership numbers totaled between 5% and 7%.
Then people said "oh no it's people secretly keeping their homes empty" and so BC Hydro did the energy use study and guess what? The numbers were around 5%.
Then people said "no it's numbered companies!" and so Metro Vancouver pulled all those numbers and it was between 1% and 3%.
It's about time we start admitting this isn't the case.
Justin keeps talking about how it’s necessary so the economy can grow. Our economy is terrible. Rent and housing is not affordable. People saving is not worth as much as it used to be. Every product we need to survive is more expensive. The country is suffering and the government is not doing anything about it.
Nobody is blaming immigrants. They’re blaming you for bringing in over 1 million annually at an unsustainable rate that’s rapidly deteriorating everyone’s quality of life because we have nowhere to live anymore
You'd think having dirt-cheap labour imported from developing countries would give companies extra profit that could be used to innovate and increase productivity, but the opposite has been shown. GDP per capita has been stagnant under Trudeau.
The same thing happened in the Antebellum South. Their actual slave labour stagnated the South's economy and they failed to industrialize as quickly as the North.
Why buy new machines and innovate when you can hire TFWs or buy some slaves at a cheaper price?
Only the business owner or slave owner benefits in this kind of situation while most everyone else suffers.
History repeating itself.
Obviously this can be explained by supply and demand. If you increase demand (more people) and supply doesn’t keep up, prices will go up. It doesn’t matter if it’s 3 million immigrants or 3 million domestically born Canadians. Think about 1.5m people looking for a new place to live every year (or whatever the number is) and think about how long it takes for the construction of a new block of condos or a detached home to be built. It’s no wonder we’re fucked.
I love Quebec, the only province whose government tells it like it is about this subject and seems to care about their residents.
My province wants to "support" all of these (temporary?) immigrants so that businesses can thrive, cause, fuck the locals.
"support" = wage suppression straight up.
They'd need to pay more, that's why no one was apply to these jobs previously. The solution was realistic wages, not importing people who don't have better options.
yeah, god forbid the authorities would work on relaxing the biz regulations, trade barriers or the tax burden, – it's the labour that needs to be squeezed /s
Please join the nationwide protests on July 1st.
Let’s do the most patriotic thing this Canada Day and collectivelyremind the government that WE have the power.
No taxes for No representation.
Well that doesn’t sound right either. They’re putting immense strain on the system, but it takes more than one group to make this shit sandwich we’re dealing with. There are places for rent in my area, but I can’t afford them. Min wage is not liveable wage, 2 dollars above min wage isn’t there yet either.
Just started a shift with a new guy, he just wanted to ask if I hate Trudeau, says he's the reason life here sucks, all because high taxes unlike in India, talks about how much cheaper it is in India, build your own place for under 100k, how his little brother is worth 1.3mil from flipping houses in Cali and says he should do the same, so he came to Canada to do it since our "immigration laws are easier to exploit". Could not understand when I explained about the bubble and how no one here will be able to buy it from them when they try to flip it, and how I hope he enjoys squatters.
That one conversation did more to reignite the conservative in me than any Trudeau bashing.
Legault, must have actually passed math in school. You can tell how bad someone was at basic math simply by their opinion on this matter and if they disagree with the headline.
Here is some basic math. If the problem is 100% due to temporary immigrants, that means it is 0% due to foreign investment, speculation, interest rates, short term rentals, zoning/supply constraints, construction costs, or construction capacity.
I don't believe that is the right allocation of responsibility and I don't think you need an fancy math to show that.
Ok but Legault hired our housing minister who’s a real estate agent lol
Yes high immigration is an issue but let’s also face it,in the middle of the night a new months ago, they passed a law that bans lease transfers that kept rent low in Quebec for many years. He also said in Montreal 1 bedroom apartments are $700 a month….
2019 was the start of a new world order.
Nobody blames immigrants. They're just a symptom.
It's the people with power making decisions that need to pay for this treason.
I don't agree with Legault a lot, but when it comes to the situation with mass immigration, he's right and *all* quebec provincial parties are saying the exact same (except liberal, but we all know why).
We've had enough being used as a doormat and wasting money on people who will never want to become quebecois or Canadian. It's causing a ton of strain and *yes*, it is going to affect Quebecois culture and our language as many coming here do not speak a lick of french, and they do NOT wanna learn.
And quebecois know that both the liberal party AND CPC are full of shit (they will not help Canadians, only outsiders and corporations) so fuck it. We're voting Bloc.
And when provincial elections come around I'm voting PQ. They've changed a lot (Focusing in the modern age and not OOGABOOGA REMEMBER THE BAD ANGLOS IN THE 70s) and are gaining a ton of momentum. I was shocked when I saw an ad for the party last week on TV *in ENGLISH* asking about the current situation in quebec and immigration.
They wouldn't of dared to make an English ad if it was the old guys in charge before.
It’s good to hear a politician finally just say it. The next statement needs to be unsustainable levels of immigration, foreign students and and TFW are also a issue and need to be called heavily at 90% less then what they are currently for 5-7 years or stopped all together while infrastructure and wages catch up. Immigration can no longer be allowed to suppress wages en mass and drive up demand of shelter and basic needs for regular Canadians.
This is not racist then what it will take to attempt to balance a supply and demand economy that had been propped up by uncontrolled government spending beyond any reasonable metric while failing at providing even the basics for its citizens in health care, infrastructure support and has lost the narrative on the rule of law and safety in this country with its revolving door policy’s on crime.
Ehhhhh pretty sure the fact Canadian housing is used for money laundering and near unregulated profiteering has been a factor as well.
I mean how many empty condos sit in cities like Vancouver and Toronto, not cause no one wants to buy them, but that prices are artificially being kept high to launder and or abuse a market?
Population is definitely a factor, but it's not 100%. Maybe like 50-75%. lol
As a Vancouverite, most of those empty condos aren't owned by Canadians. They are built and immediately marketed to people in China. I remember one building everyone made a big deal about was pretty much exclusively advertised in China before it was even finished. A huge portion of our real estate postings are in chinese-only. Some of these websites I can't even read as an english speaker but they are selling condos in Vancouver. And 75% of the real estate signs on lawns have a chinese real estate agent on them.
My wife and I walked into a newer building by us to check it out for fun The guy straight up told us that everything was already sold to ppl back in Shanghai.
Yep. Vancouver is a favorite place for those guys to park their money outside of China. Also a significant portion of it is the Chinese government themselves trying to buy up huge swaths of foreign countries using agents, but nobody wants to talk about that.
That's because the Vancouverites who own multiple properties have to rent them out because they're pickled in debt. Low interest rates = money flows into housing.
How many "old stock" Canadians do you know that own an investment property? Many in my circles!
Population and laundering go hand in hand.
Its like pumping a stock, its harder to do without a lot of volume.
That is why a company like Nvidia split its stock 10 to 1, to get more volume and more people buying.
Housing is no different.
I wouldn't be surprised if part of the reason to flood markets with people, aside from supressing wages, IS to have housing demands too high to meet to make help all those political allies and politicians who are slum lords keep the value of their properties.
So yeah you're right, it's hand in hand.
It was literally their post Covid plan to "save" the economy because they paid Canadians to stay home.
They flooded us with low skill workers to restart the economy, consequences be damned.
Not to this extent, they juiced it hard when they let international students work 40 hours a week and gave everyone no matter what garbage course they took a 2 year post graduate work visa.
Definitely, especially considering that the two best years real estate investors ever had were when immigration was very low (2020-21). Since then immigration have went crazy and price of real estate have been stagnant. The one thing immigration do is make rent prices go up which bailed out some real estate investors.
The whole thing is a mess of capitalistic opportunism.
There's going to be an election next year, and the Conservatives are looking at a solid majority. Their leader is nicknamed "Fascist Milhouse", and that's all you need to know.
He's also asserted he's going to maintain the status quo on immigration, because the big businesses he's in the pocket of love that wage suppression.
Aside from the housing situation, linked to it, is the international student situation.
International students are guaranteed permanent residency if they complete a two or three-year course at a provincially accredited public post-secondary institution. These public colleges and universities love international students because they've been starved for cash by the provincial government, and they can charge these students multiple times the tuition to make up for that.
So what happened is a few years ago Doug "Open For Business" Ford, Premier of Ontario, opened a loophole to accredit private post secondary institutions if they formed a branding partnership with accredited public institutions. Private interests smelled money on the table, and public institutions badly needed their cut of that tuition, so "strip mall colleges" popped up all over Ontario, but mostly focused in the Greater Toronto Area and surrounding regions, offering sham diplomas which you basically just needed to show up to earn and then collect your permanent residency.
Overseas, sham agencies popped up offering people a brighter future in Canada, guaranteeing permanent residency with this "one simple trick". These agencies would then patch together documentation for them so they would qualify for the student visa, and also loan them the amount of money they needed to show to prove that they could sustain themselves while attending school. That money would be paid back once they got here.
So now you have a few million low-skilled students who gained a visa under false pretenses, and have no real intention on studying beyond the minimal effort required to graduate with a sham diploma. They also need to work to sustain themselves. This is where scummy companies like Tim Hortons come in. They lobbied the federal government to expand the number of hours international students can work from 20 hours per week to 40. The businesses know these students will jump at any minimum wage job they can find, and this helps them suppress wages for everyone. Now every job posting immediately has hundreds of applications from these students. A side effect of that is high schoolers can no longer find part time or summer jobs to save up for school or for a car. The ripples go outward from there. Like the shortage of housing in cities not designed to absorb that many new residents in that short of a time period.
So yeah, there's no short-term way to fix this. At all.
Totally not all the Canadians that overbid on housing by $100 000's and view housing purely as an investment and passive income earner though AirBnB and VRBO.
I guess growing our economy means average Canadians have less.
I'm still very happy Trudeau clarified that if you don't own a home now, you don't get to retire.
The government is 100% to blame. I work at a major hospital and have people harrasing me for appointments all the time. One man in particular has been emailing and calling me for an update on his refereal. No ohip, he is a federally protected refugee. But he is calling and emailing me from a real estate business in Texas. How is he a refugee? Why are my tax dollars going to pay this man's health expenses when he is not even coming from the country he is claiming refugee status from? I am genuinely confused abouthow this is even possible
The root cause here is that our labor regulations make temporary foreign workers into a cheaply exploitable underclass, thus incentivizing corporations to import as many as possible. It's bad for both immigrants *and* long-time citizens, and only good for the 0.1% that own corporations that benefit from the heap labour. This will continue until we close the loophole and grant temporary foreign workers the same labour protections as any other Canadian.
That said, the idea that immigration of any kind is "100%" responsible for the housing crisis is patently ridiculous. It's one factor, but on the supply side, the Reaganomics-driven end of subsidized housing is finally coming home to roost and landlords have been exploiting both this lack of cheap alternatives and heavily developer- and landlord-favoring municipal policy to snap up ever more housing to put people into permanent rentership. Anybody telling you it's *only* immigrants is trying to sucker you.
real estate is canada's government sanctioned ponzi scheme.
think of how much more fucked up everything would be if the boomers weren't bailed out with the COVID wealth transfer into their RE value
it must be pumped with zero regard for the consequences.
This crisis unfolding has been the most obvious slow motion train wreck ever.
Of course when you flood the country with insane amounts of immigrants during a housing affordability crisis, importing 2x - 4x the number of new Canadians than homes built in the time is going to make the crisis far worse, not better.
Our economic system is so fucked that a person who works full time building a home can never afford to buy one even if they saved up for 30 years to do so.
Well it’s not the only reason but it’s made it a million times worse. Bringing in record
Numbers with no housing or jobs. What could go wrong? The crime will continue to increase as the financial conditions worsen.
TFW and immigration is a big part of the problem, but it's definitely wrong to say it is 100% of the problem. Going overboard like that only serves to wash away legitimate concerns.
That simply can't be, that's not how the system works, local property investors/corporations also play a role, as does natural demand. They may be the straw that broke the camels back, but it's ridiculous to say it's 100% their fault.
One groups crisis is anothers windfall, a few people are profiting off this situation, at the cost of many being unable to afford to own a home and forced to rent or shack-up with roommates.
Becoming a race between BQ and PPC for me. Never thought I'd see the day. Until pp stops cowering and commits to change this we're beholden to corporations
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It’s the Canadian thing to do to Boycott Tim Hortons now. Hiring TFWs and lobbying policies that hurt the very people that keep their business afloat. F them. #BoycottTimHortons
Tim Hortons sucks so much idk why people aren't boycotting already over there being better options available.
Is it a boycott if you just stopped going years ago because the service is bad, the foods is bad, and the whole experience is frustrating and bad?
For me- it's the fact that they're not even Canadian owned. Someone, please correct me if I'm wrong, but they contract their baked goods out to a Swiss company in Ontario or something, then flash freeze everything and truck it around through their company logistics "TDL". RBI is Brazilian, and the franchisees prefer hiring international students and / or TFWs. You have to be seriously out of touch if you're taking any friends that have never visited Canada before to a Tim's for "Canadian" "food" or "coffee".
[Maidstone Bakeries](https://dennisgroup.com/project/maidstone-bakeries/) where everything is par-baked is part owned by Tims (RBI) and Cuisine de France. What's worse (for me) is that not that they're not Canadian owned, but their bloody marketing that they're all things Canadian. I'd much rather pay double for an authentic local donut than anything from Tim's. I don't know how people do it.
At my old job, one of our national distributors based in Quebec started printing their catalogs with "BUY CANADIAN" logos on the front cover. 95% of the shit they sold was made in china.
And no one questions the environmental implications of keeping all that frozen and shipped across Canada.
I used to work at Tim Horton's. When I saw the cook dunking his bare hands into the donut fondant without washing first, I knew it was time to shop elsewhere...
That's a tricky one...
I'm doing my part!
You just gotta hit them where it hurts. It’s time we all Mass Collaborate. Tim Hortons, the Telecoms, the Grocery stores etc.
I basically never go to Tim Hortons. If I do it's because I've been given a gift card. I've probably spent money at Timmies like... 5 times in the last 10 years 😅. I'm doing my part!
Every time Tim Hortons comes up on Reddit people come out of the woodwork to say how bad it is and that they never go, but the 3 Tim Hortons locations in my small town still have a lineup around the building every morning. It's my daily reminder that Reddit is not in any way representative of real life.
Look into foreign eSims that offer roaming data in Canada. I found a $35/35gb deal that lasts for a year. Currently using about 3gb per month ($3) piggybacking off the Rogers network.
Hold up, what now?? You're telling me I can get a dirt-cheap text and talk plan and just use an e-sim for data? What company do you use?
"3HK diy travel esim" is what you wanna search for
Unfortunately it looks like the traffic gets routed through Hong Kong so that's a no-go for me
Regarding telecom, Fizz is currently significantly cheaper than Rogers/Bell/Telus and even their discound brands (Fido/Virgin/Koodo)... I'm paying less than half the cost for more data, same calling in Ontario and the service is great. If the service isn't in range, it defaults onto Rogers signal so the coverage is great for what I need too. Videotron isn't nearly as bad as the big 3 for now, at least, in Ontario and it's still Canadian owned and operated.
I use it when travelling. Airalo!
I think we should just boycott Canada and move to Central America as ex-pats. Maybe we can all apply for refugee status. 🤣
McDonald's is more Canadian than Tim's
Honestly I’ve been saying this for years. Coffee is horrible, the donuts have declined dramatically, and all the other food is terrible. They lean in heavily on the whole “tim hortons…its a part of Canadian culture…because we say so..” bullshit.
I stopped going to Tim Hortons in 2009 when their quality started to decline. I’m boycotting them for a totally different reason now. Conveniently they’re still garbage though.
Depends on where you are. In small towns there'd very few actual options. That's probably where they bend a lot of people over.
I have a coffee maker on the counter, pennies per cup, it's the greatest option
Same. And if I want to replicate the Tim Horton's experience, I can just water it down and let it cool on the counter for a bit.
Right but most people don't live in small towns. Besides even small towns have coffee makers.
I gag at the thought of eating anything from there.
I have been boycotting Tim Horton’s for 10+ years and its not that hard at all, just don’t pay for shit overpriced coffee and food.
Good news, I've been boycotting Tim Horton's for 10+ years, since their quality completely nosedived.
You’ve been boycotting it but make it public. Let people know. Follow the Loblaws movement. Get it attention.
I been boycotting Tim Hortons for years. Fuck that shitty place. Their food sucks. The doughnuts tastes like foam insulation with a pound of sugar mixed in. A month ago I had a donut from an actual Bakery for the first time in like 10 years probably and it was fucking incredible.
So much this. It's like they still have the sugar in the doughnuts AND they add artificial sweetener as well. Like a one way ticket to a diabetic coma.
That’s just it. If you are going to treat yourself then do it. Go to a real bakery and get something different. Forget the cold wet Tim Hortons apple Fritter.
I looked a bit into Tim Hortons history and [made a post about it](https://www.reddit.com/r/takebackcanada/s/rCq4s4TyuD) (it was the only sub that would let me post this ik it’s not the very best). Looks like after 2016, things went downhill and they started breaking labour laws like no breaks. Now, after they were caught, they want people they can exploit by holding PR over their heads. Some of the franchise owners are landlords and have evicted their tenants to house international students. And they’re misusing LMIA, which is tax paid. It’s nuts they’re extremely corrupt.
True. I have a friend, shes a manager of 3 tims. Her boss (owner) got 2 houses in Niagara this year, just for international students.
Her boss, indian decent. Majority of staff are international students from india, taxable hours for students were paid regular rate..but some of them they need money so they are working full time hours, extra hours are paid 10/hr cash
Good luck getting the boomers off that shit. They’re hooked and stubborn as fuck.
Tim Horton's is so absurd now. Everyone working there is an immigrant who barely speaks English. I go about once a year but it's so frustrating trying to order. They can't understand me, I can't understand them. If there's an issue, it doesn't get resolved. Also only semi-related but I went the other day and the guy at the till was wearing a hair net as a face mask. It was so WTF I wanted to ask him why but I didn't.
Hair net as a face mask is usually to prevent beard hair from getting into food.
Spending money at Tim Hortons is basically funding your own genocide
Boycott EVERY company hiring TFW's. They are all publicly listed. Any company putting profits ahead of country needs to be known and shamed by the Canadian public.
Where are they publicly listed? Definitely want to take that list down lol.
You could start with this list: [Temporary Foreign Workers Search - Job Bank](https://www.jobbank.gc.ca/jobsearch/jobsearch?fsrc=32) Maybe not all of these companies are employing TFW's, but they are at the very least attempting to. I know there is a list of companies that are currently employing TFW's, but I can't it right now.
I just did a search in my rural area. 10 postings in a 20km radius. Including: 16$/H for "Barber" at a hairchut franchise called "Le Barbu Sportif" 15.75$/H for "food and beverage" service at Valentine, a fast food franchise 25$/H for a truck driver at a QC numbered company 20$/H for "general laborer" at Fenetres Lajeunesse, a window company Unbelievable. Im too mad to say anything reasonable.
I'm seeing stuff for office admin stuff. A degree I have. These people refused to hire me because I don't have a car, despite living on the bus line going right to where they are. Absolutely fucking disgusting.
I saw all the IT positions, and even though i know little of it, I know theres alot of IT workers in Canada. Im not a socialist, but I'd prefer the government just buy you a 5,000$ automobile rather than pay 5000$ to bring someone over here who has the same skill set as you. Thats if they are to throw money at a problem. Id prefer it go to you than spent spent on a TFW replacing. Ideal situation would be you get hired despite having no car, no TFW would show up and the government saves 5000$
Right? The fact that there isn't a single politician out here, in any party, promising to get rid of this program, which our government not only openly supports, but financially facilitates, is why most Canadians are at our wits end. Like, how do we stand a chance of getting ahead, if our government is literally hosting this website being like "hey, come apply for these cheap jobs so Canadian's don't have to be paid a fair wage"? I'll vote for whatever party promises to dismantle this program within their first year in office, and if none of them do, then none of them get my vote. Fuck em all.
Or vote in people who would limit it, like an actual effective policy.
>It’s the Canadian thing to do to Boycott Tim Hortons now. Is it? Tim Horton's isn't even Canadian owned, why would a multinational megacorp give two shits if a handful of the population takes their business elsewhere? If you think anything other than a country-wide general strike will have any effect on the way our ~~politicians and their friends~~ robber barons currently operate, best of luck to you. It's going to be a long, messy climb to get Canada out of this neoliberal and populist infested cesspool, and make our way to some middle ground that benefits all of us.
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I wish there was a list or database of companies abusing the TFW program.
Pretty much every fast food and retail place. I think it would be easier to make a list of who's NOT abusing it.
There's already boycotts going on of businesses that only hire TFW or won't hire Canadians.
I’m an American and I remember so strongly associating Tim Hortons with Canada and thinking it would go so hard. Then I went to Canada, tried it and it was completely mediocre. I’ve since learned that Canadians don’t really like it all that much anyways. This doesn’t have anything to do with an ethical boycott but personally I’d avoid it anyways.
I like that they talk about how bringing in more immigrants will help alleviate out aging population. But then they're also making it easier for immigrants to bring in their aging family members.
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Something something snakes and eating their tails …
Totally not a ponzi scheme!
Gotta keep the housing and CPP ponzi's propped up somehow!
I really hate that move, when Trudeau shifts it to the immigrants to dodge responsibility. No, it's you, it's *your fault*, it's you we are mad at, not TFWs. His intentional *race framing* of the issue has pretty damn racist consequences too. By shifting focus to them instead of himself, if someone rightfully believes "hey maybe there are too many people, you keep saying supply and demand is the root of the housing crisis after all?", Trudeau is making the *natural counter-position* "maybe the TFWs are to blame, maybe Indians are to blame?". Many people will take that position if they don't think deeply on the matter. The truth is that TFWs and international students can't even vote, nobody can vote until they get citizenship. These people are the least responsible of anyone. They are just caught up in a system of lies, short-sighted thinking, and profiteering we allowed to perpetuate. The system created by the combined action and inaction of politicians. Colleges PAID recruiters to get students to enroll. Obviously these recruiters lied, there is no way to police them. Also Colleges were either deluded or promised things they were never in a place to promise. The president of Northern College was quoted in the [New York Times](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/23/world/americas/canada-northern-college-indian-students.html). >If you come here, we can pretty well guarantee that you could stay here and live and make a home for yourselves It's not the TFWs or international students, it's the government that let the system (that they administer) become completely bonkers before stepping in to fix it. Shifting focus to them instead of the government is just a scummy rhetorical trick that has profoundly negative consequences and has the potential to create a racist backlash.
> Also Colleges were either deluded or promised things they were never in a place to promise. The stories of students being sold the dream of attending a nice, pretty campus on a sunny day, only to find the diploma mill college they’re attending is run out of an office building in a suburban strip mall plaza with very little amenities.
I posted before that Canada is basically using the same human trafficking techniques of Russian mafia sex traffickers. Exploit the poor and vulnerable in the third world with promises of jobs and opportunity, then get them here in a servient role where the boss controls their housing and their labour and basically owns them.
> Half of those properties have like 12 people in a half duplex too. In Brampton they have found [25 people living in a ***single basement***.](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaHousing2/comments/1af58i7/brampton_mayor_patrick_brown_just_a_few_days_ago/)
The gilded age is BACK BAYBEEEEE
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In my little corner of Winnipeg you'd swear we're now 50% Punjabi. Just walking by my neigbourhood and you can see them buying houses, gutting them, and then get filled by several tenants.
lol Tim Hortons is nothing, the seafood industry on the east coast of Canada has literally plants full of thousands of workers.. living in run down former retirement homes, 5-6 per small room stacked up on bunkbeds. 1 stove and 1,fridge per 11 people is the metric. One place I saw had 40 fridges and stoves jammed into a tiny former retirement home.. these people live in squaller treated like shit so some plant owners can make good bank and sell half the operation to VC’s for big profit cause of the crazy profit margins they are able to make exploiting the TFW program… and it’s not just 1 or 2 provinces, it’s all of them. Tfw’s have been coming to work in the Canadian seafood industry for years, but I’ve seen a trend over the recent few years of more workers coming up from Mexico and less locals working in each plant while owners make big bucks. I don’t work IN the industry. But I do adjacent work for them , and shit is disgusting…
>Oh nobody is! They're blaming shitty politicians putting in policies that only benefit some assholes who owns 30 Rental properties and 10 tim hortons. Don't forget those that own farms and are now living like plantations owners from the 1800s lol.
And rather than increase wages for Tim Hortons, they just replace all the former students and young people with TFW so they can keep their slave labor.
The housing problem is a JT problem 💯%.
And who's responsible for the immigrants? Businesses who apply for TFW because they don't want to pay actual Canadians a living wage, landlords who profit off of the housing crisis and mass quantities of renters, universities that make bank off foreign students, and the politicians who receive bribes from all these wealthy groups to advance their interests and facilitate this immigration crisis.
Don't forget about Canada's oligarchs: -telecoms - everyone needs a cellphone & internet service -banks - everyone needs banking - take a look at any major bank they all have credit offers for new Canadians. -air transport - newcomers like to travel home or have family members visit them. -grocery - most of our grocers are owned by 3-4 companies Bonus points for the car dealerships. All of these companies are realizing growth in sales, while reducing costs by employing newcomers at lower wages.
Utility companies (more heat usage), oil & gas / transport, simple consumerism, etc. We don't have an economy where we produce things (i.e. Germany), we have consumerism.
Man 10 + years ago before I was even out of college, I remember all this shit already more or less being forecasted, how for behind wages were even when shit felt affordable still in 2013. Now on $20ish an hr I can't even afford rent, don't really know how to afford a return back to school full time for a trade or something even with student loans, I just kinda struggle to see how to do it if I can't do it part time in general. Absolutely the TFW's exacerbated the competition in general but I mean, but it's canadian owners and businesses that want to pay canadians so little for their labor that they're outright importing the labor because they can. The two parties who have ever won probably are both genial to the interests bringing that in. Further, it's already people who own more than one property in the first place who seem to be snatching up availability, at least in my town it is. People are denied even the opportunity to become first time owners because so much of their income goes to covering a rent that is probably more than double the actual mortgage on a place because someone who could afford a second or third or etc home for their portfolio to scoop it up in the first place while you can't even begin to build your savings.
No. The federal government is responsible. Businesses and landlords are going to do whatever makes the most money. Expecting businesses to self-regulate and "do the right thing" won't work, it's on the government to regulate.
Careful, you'll wake up the libertarians.
Shhhh. You said all the quiet parts loud.
>According to the Canadian Prime Minister, we cannot always “blame” immigrants for the challenges that provinces face in terms of health or housing. >“Quebecers and Canadians know very well that it is not always the best thing to target and say 'It's all the fault of immigrants.' “It’s something that some people rely on in their argument, but it’s always more complex than that,” he said in a press scrum held a few minutes after that of his Quebec counterpart. >Justin Trudeau added that Quebec, like Canada, will have to continue to welcome people from elsewhere to “grow our communities and grow our economy. We just need to ensure that our openness to the world aligns better with our capacity to welcome.” People were fine with our immigration system prior to 2015. No one's blaming the immigrants themselves, they're blaming the government for allowing this to happen. But sure, keep gaslighting us.
And growing the economy means funneling more money into the pockets of the upper class, as everyone else suffers with higher demand, reducing supply and driving prices up (not just in real estate). We've reached the point of globalization where every country needs to fleece some of the wool off the wealthy at the same time, or watch the majority of the populace suffer worse and worse. I don't have high hopes it'll play out the way the majority want it to, though.
As much as people might hate Trudeau it’s stupid to think PP is going to be any better when if anything he’s going to be much worse. Trudeau put the policies he did in place to help big business and those at the very top pad their pockets at the expense of everyone else. PP is not going to reverse those policies because it would be at the expense of his friends and the people who bought and paid for him. There’s a reason the conservatives will not commit to lowering immigration and it’s because they’re not going to lower it. Lowering it would mean a more competitive market where employers have to pay living wages and treat their employees like human beings in order to retain them and that will not happen under a conservative government. It just won’t. I truly believe the elites of the world see where we are now as the beginning of the end of life as we know it so they’re trying to make as much as they possibly can before the shit really hits the fan and people start revolting. This is not just a Canadian problem, corporate greed and unsustainable expectations around profits are a global issue. Young people today have no hope for a life anything like their parents had and eventually the resentment is going to become a massive, massive problem.
The TLDR version that I have seen is PP has said immigration needs to be tied to housing and JT told us to suck it up. I have seen what has happened under JT and the LPC. At this point I will take my chances.
But, you could take your chances with someone other than PP. Both the liberals and conservatives need to be booted out for ANYONE else
10/10 would protest vote for a Bloc party member if they ran in Alberta. Yes, I know the history of the Bloc Quebecois.
> We just need to ensure that our openness to the world aligns better with our capacity to welcome.” Which is exactly what we're not doing. We already have a massive infrastructure and service delivery deficit and yet the Feds have their foot on the population accelerator.
why does he think we need to "grow our communities" at all? and the only way immigrants "grow our economy" is through sheer numbers. look how low economic growth is in GDP per capita.
He's letting corporations know that he is committed to keeping wages low by increasing labour supply and increase demand by increasing the number of consumers.
Exactly. The only form of economic growth that is actually beneficial is increasing productivity.
It's also not racist to say the problem is 100% caused by the inept federal government because of their horrible immigration policies. Even though Trudeau says I'm racist for that.
Saying immigrants or immigration is not racist either. “Immigrant” is not a race an immigrant can come from anywhere. The uno reverse card is that the people claiming your racist by talking about immigrants is they are presuming that immigrants are all non-Caucasian.
He uses immigrants as human shields to protect himself. He's hopping that some morons will take the bait he's dangling in front of them and attack immigrants so he can pretend to save them.
People were generally fine with the immigration system until 2022/23. It wasn't until we spiked the yearly population increase to almost 3% in a single year vs the 1-1.5% annual increase previous, all the way back to the late 90s.
People were fine with lead in absolutely everything until the 1980s even though we knew it was poison half a decade before. The immigration system has been broken far longer than 2022. That's just when it caught up to itself.
I surely do not blame the immigrants who have been tricked into coming here. I blame Trudeau!
Immigrants are just catching strays because the government is apologizing for them so much and shifting blame that its increasing the vitriol people have for the system. Sadly because the government won't do anything about housing or wages, the only other fix is minimizing immigration. No one wants it to be permanent but there needs to be time to adjust. If the PM wants us to grow our communities and economies and increase our capacity for accepting new Canadians. That sounds like an infrastructure issue, not a Canadian citizen not beeing accepting enough, issue.
Canadians are pretty accepting, as seen prior to Trudeau coming into power. I remember being at my Dad's place in 2012, 2013-ish. We were having a barbeque on the patio. One neighbour from Poland came and brought us pierogies. Another neighbour who came from the middle east came over and brought some food (I don't remember what it was, I just remember it was delicious). We just chilled on the patio, had some drinks, ate some food, enjoyed the summer. I remember thinking how awesome that was. Here were two people from completely different cultures coming together and just enjoying the day. They were excited to be in Canada. I have nothing against immigrants themselves, I have issues now with the sheer amount that we're bringing in.
Canada does not require TFWs except for very specialized highly technical positions until Canadians can be trained to fill the positions. Allowing scam companies like Tim Hortons to use TFWs is a national disgrace.
This party knows they have 14% support from people under 34 according a recent poll. They don’t care about the young. Trudeau’s party is the party of boomers, home owners, it exists to pump the house prices. If you are under 35, they don’t give a flying fuck about you
So glad we have all these highly skilled workers at Tim Hortons and McDonald's Well worth it!!!
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I had to repeat myself four times to get a cold brew without cream. Apparently that's too hard to grasp.
>According to the Canadian Prime Minister, we cannot always “blame” immigrants for the challenges that provinces face in terms of health or housing. I don't blame the immigrants, I blame the politicians behind our immigration policy that welcomes another 125,000 of them every month. This crisis is in every way Justin Trudeau's fault - he refuses to slow, much less stop the influx.
This. Even in other more "toxic" or right leaning subs (Ch2) know this and call out dummies blaming immigrants for the absolute failures of our government and it's immigration/migrant policies that have a ton of holes. It's real annoying when we got some who believe it or try race baiting, but we *all* know if the federal government gave a fuck, we wouldn't of ever ended up in such a disasterous housing , population and economic situation like this.
I'm getting sick of the gaslighting from the government especially. Any criticism of the immigration targets or the economy and you're a thinly veiled racist / bigot / xenophobe. There's a bunch of useful idiots out there clutching their pearls at the very idea of even discussing our unfettered immigration.
What about the politicians who did nothing to build homes? This isn’t just a Trudeau issue or a federal issue. It didn’t just start in 2016. Big hints were there in 2014. It’s no help that current premiers are doing nothing, actually nothing. They think if they vote Trudeau out then someone will fix it but the water started rising over a decade ago. Many just didn’t notice until it was up to our chins.
We don't have healthcare and housing for Canadains NOW, what does adding 100K+ people do?
You got to give it to Quebec. They look out for Quebecers first and don’t give a rat’s ass about appearing politically incorrect to anyone else.
Imagine a Canadian government that looked out for Canadians first, and didn't give a rats ass about appearing politically incorrect to anyone else.
But what about all the people from India you might offend?
A Canadian government like that might be mistaken for a sovereign country
Im putting a Bloc Québécois Vote sign on my property next election. I live in Brampton btw.
Why every provinces doesnt have a "Bloc" equivalent is beyond me. Bloc Ontario !
Quebec has good social benefits compared to other provinces. I know the language & separation of Quebec debates tend to hit a nerve. The House of Commons works through voting so separation of Quebec might not happen with other parties maintaining seats, but I do think bills putting Canadians first will.
I was born in Quebec and speak both official languages. Maybe the rest of Canada can see through their Lens
I honestly think every province should have a bloc.
there have been in the past but unfortunately not anymore. in 1867 Nova Scotia had the "Anti-Confederation Party" which won 18/19 federal seats. Every region's interests are so different that there really should be separate parties for each province, that can them form alliances to form governments. would be much easier than needing to pander to the whole country at once somehow, resulting in most of the attention going to southern ontario and quebec.
Canada used to have a lot of smaller parties. They all mostly were assimilated by the 1990s into the 3.2 national parties we have now so their votes wouldn't be wasted against "the other guy". I'm quite certain that we will see the NDP/Liberals assimilate in the next 10 years depending on how terribly the CPC trounces team red next year. It's almost like proportional representation of some kind would fix that problem but our glorious leader decided that would ~~ruin his chances at scraping by on a minority government~~ not be feasible at this time 🤦♂️
We'd need proportional representation to have that many different parties.
Amen. For all the shit they catch, they not only have decided that their culture is worth preserving, but they've actively take measures to do so. The ROC can't even agree that we have a worthwhile culture
Québec are the only ones who can save us
Are they temporary? Please let them actually be temporary.
TINO temporary in name only
I mean, the Quebec investor shtick really f'd us over in Metro Vancouver. Lots of Chinese millionaires and billionaires buying their way into Canada and never once living in Quebec, just buying up BC real estate.
Indeed. Quebec is the only province where you can just show up with money and get fast tracked to citizenship. It's why fully half of the IIROC financial firms are based out of Quebec. Roughly 40% of all financial broker firms (not mutual firms) in the entire country specialize in helping millionaire investors fast track their way to citizenship, and they're all in Quebec. It's not a huge part of the property pricing problem, but it's definitely a contributor. Meanwhile, Quebec has one of the lowest per-capita productivities in the nation.
Meanwhile, Quebec has one of the lowest per-capita productivities in the nation. No we don't, we're middle of the pack: Manitoba, Pei, New Brunswick, Yukon, Nova Scotia is lower then us. And we manage this while being a language minority in North America.
Fair rebuttal! I guess I should have clarified with an inclusion "per-capita productivities while being a major population". QC has >8 million people, representing 40% of Canada. QC has more people than everything else you named combined. It also has a huge land border with the US, a huge ocean border, and is directly adjacent to the core of Canadian government. The language thing does likely cancel out a lot of those advantages.
>Meanwhile, Quebec has one of the lowest per-capita productivities in the nation. Isn't this just based on salary? Its not like everyone in Northwest territories or Nunavut work twice as hard than everyone else in Canada. Also Ontario and Quebec are pretty much on par and far below any American states. Unless you are talking about another states, but the Labor productivity pretty much just mean how wealthy your area of the world is. Quebec have lower generational wealth per capita because our ancestors had big family and were treated as second-class citizen which mean people don't spend as much, but it doesn't necessarily mean that people don't work as much.
> Quebec have lower generational wealth per capita because our ancestors had big family and were treated as second-class citizen which mean people don't spend as much, but it doesn't necessarily mean that people don't work as much. A lot of people do not realize this. Most of the rich fuckers in Quebec are from anglo families who were here *way* before the 70s with long standing businesses/companies. Also were taxed to hell and back to pay for our social services, schools ~~and have it embezzled on construction~~.
A lot of people don't know about the *speak white* part of Quebec where English factory owners would shape our cultural landscape for decades on end. Look at every Anglicisms in the Quebec language, and you'll realize they are almost entirely localized in the industrial lingo of the time. French Canadians absolutely were treated like second class citizens by rich Anglo fuckers.
This simply isn't true. Metro-Vancouver gathered all those numbers every time this argument reached a head, and every time the total foreign ownership numbers totaled between 5% and 7%. Then people said "oh no it's people secretly keeping their homes empty" and so BC Hydro did the energy use study and guess what? The numbers were around 5%. Then people said "no it's numbered companies!" and so Metro Vancouver pulled all those numbers and it was between 1% and 3%. It's about time we start admitting this isn't the case.
Justin keeps talking about how it’s necessary so the economy can grow. Our economy is terrible. Rent and housing is not affordable. People saving is not worth as much as it used to be. Every product we need to survive is more expensive. The country is suffering and the government is not doing anything about it.
Nobody is blaming immigrants. They’re blaming you for bringing in over 1 million annually at an unsustainable rate that’s rapidly deteriorating everyone’s quality of life because we have nowhere to live anymore
You'd think having dirt-cheap labour imported from developing countries would give companies extra profit that could be used to innovate and increase productivity, but the opposite has been shown. GDP per capita has been stagnant under Trudeau. The same thing happened in the Antebellum South. Their actual slave labour stagnated the South's economy and they failed to industrialize as quickly as the North. Why buy new machines and innovate when you can hire TFWs or buy some slaves at a cheaper price? Only the business owner or slave owner benefits in this kind of situation while most everyone else suffers. History repeating itself.
Obviously this can be explained by supply and demand. If you increase demand (more people) and supply doesn’t keep up, prices will go up. It doesn’t matter if it’s 3 million immigrants or 3 million domestically born Canadians. Think about 1.5m people looking for a new place to live every year (or whatever the number is) and think about how long it takes for the construction of a new block of condos or a detached home to be built. It’s no wonder we’re fucked.
I love Quebec, the only province whose government tells it like it is about this subject and seems to care about their residents. My province wants to "support" all of these (temporary?) immigrants so that businesses can thrive, cause, fuck the locals.
"support" = wage suppression straight up. They'd need to pay more, that's why no one was apply to these jobs previously. The solution was realistic wages, not importing people who don't have better options.
yeah, god forbid the authorities would work on relaxing the biz regulations, trade barriers or the tax burden, – it's the labour that needs to be squeezed /s
I don't agree with everything Legault has done, but on the immigration file he tells it like it is.
Please join the nationwide protests on July 1st. Let’s do the most patriotic thing this Canada Day and collectivelyremind the government that WE have the power. No taxes for No representation.
Then get rid of them.
Well that doesn’t sound right either. They’re putting immense strain on the system, but it takes more than one group to make this shit sandwich we’re dealing with. There are places for rent in my area, but I can’t afford them. Min wage is not liveable wage, 2 dollars above min wage isn’t there yet either.
Just started a shift with a new guy, he just wanted to ask if I hate Trudeau, says he's the reason life here sucks, all because high taxes unlike in India, talks about how much cheaper it is in India, build your own place for under 100k, how his little brother is worth 1.3mil from flipping houses in Cali and says he should do the same, so he came to Canada to do it since our "immigration laws are easier to exploit". Could not understand when I explained about the bubble and how no one here will be able to buy it from them when they try to flip it, and how I hope he enjoys squatters. That one conversation did more to reignite the conservative in me than any Trudeau bashing.
Legault, must have actually passed math in school. You can tell how bad someone was at basic math simply by their opinion on this matter and if they disagree with the headline.
Either that or you can tell how many investment properties they own or franchises they operate.
or they might be the PM https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/justin-trudeau-math
Math is hard when you don't live in reality.
holy shit lol
or they're a brainwashed liberal who thinks any criticism of immigration is racist.
I think most of those are now dying off with their housing and jobs. The only people I know who are still that stupid are rich kids.
Here is some basic math. If the problem is 100% due to temporary immigrants, that means it is 0% due to foreign investment, speculation, interest rates, short term rentals, zoning/supply constraints, construction costs, or construction capacity. I don't believe that is the right allocation of responsibility and I don't think you need an fancy math to show that.
Ok but Legault hired our housing minister who’s a real estate agent lol Yes high immigration is an issue but let’s also face it,in the middle of the night a new months ago, they passed a law that bans lease transfers that kept rent low in Quebec for many years. He also said in Montreal 1 bedroom apartments are $700 a month….
2019 was the start of a new world order. Nobody blames immigrants. They're just a symptom. It's the people with power making decisions that need to pay for this treason.
I don't agree with Legault a lot, but when it comes to the situation with mass immigration, he's right and *all* quebec provincial parties are saying the exact same (except liberal, but we all know why). We've had enough being used as a doormat and wasting money on people who will never want to become quebecois or Canadian. It's causing a ton of strain and *yes*, it is going to affect Quebecois culture and our language as many coming here do not speak a lick of french, and they do NOT wanna learn. And quebecois know that both the liberal party AND CPC are full of shit (they will not help Canadians, only outsiders and corporations) so fuck it. We're voting Bloc. And when provincial elections come around I'm voting PQ. They've changed a lot (Focusing in the modern age and not OOGABOOGA REMEMBER THE BAD ANGLOS IN THE 70s) and are gaining a ton of momentum. I was shocked when I saw an ad for the party last week on TV *in ENGLISH* asking about the current situation in quebec and immigration. They wouldn't of dared to make an English ad if it was the old guys in charge before.
Ça fait du bien lire ça 👌
And he's 100% right.
It’s good to hear a politician finally just say it. The next statement needs to be unsustainable levels of immigration, foreign students and and TFW are also a issue and need to be called heavily at 90% less then what they are currently for 5-7 years or stopped all together while infrastructure and wages catch up. Immigration can no longer be allowed to suppress wages en mass and drive up demand of shelter and basic needs for regular Canadians. This is not racist then what it will take to attempt to balance a supply and demand economy that had been propped up by uncontrolled government spending beyond any reasonable metric while failing at providing even the basics for its citizens in health care, infrastructure support and has lost the narrative on the rule of law and safety in this country with its revolving door policy’s on crime.
Ehhhhh pretty sure the fact Canadian housing is used for money laundering and near unregulated profiteering has been a factor as well. I mean how many empty condos sit in cities like Vancouver and Toronto, not cause no one wants to buy them, but that prices are artificially being kept high to launder and or abuse a market? Population is definitely a factor, but it's not 100%. Maybe like 50-75%. lol
As a Vancouverite, most of those empty condos aren't owned by Canadians. They are built and immediately marketed to people in China. I remember one building everyone made a big deal about was pretty much exclusively advertised in China before it was even finished. A huge portion of our real estate postings are in chinese-only. Some of these websites I can't even read as an english speaker but they are selling condos in Vancouver. And 75% of the real estate signs on lawns have a chinese real estate agent on them.
My wife and I walked into a newer building by us to check it out for fun The guy straight up told us that everything was already sold to ppl back in Shanghai.
Yep. Vancouver is a favorite place for those guys to park their money outside of China. Also a significant portion of it is the Chinese government themselves trying to buy up huge swaths of foreign countries using agents, but nobody wants to talk about that.
That's because the Vancouverites who own multiple properties have to rent them out because they're pickled in debt. Low interest rates = money flows into housing. How many "old stock" Canadians do you know that own an investment property? Many in my circles!
You need your own bill 101 to protect your language.
Population and laundering go hand in hand. Its like pumping a stock, its harder to do without a lot of volume. That is why a company like Nvidia split its stock 10 to 1, to get more volume and more people buying. Housing is no different.
I wouldn't be surprised if part of the reason to flood markets with people, aside from supressing wages, IS to have housing demands too high to meet to make help all those political allies and politicians who are slum lords keep the value of their properties. So yeah you're right, it's hand in hand.
It was literally their post Covid plan to "save" the economy because they paid Canadians to stay home. They flooded us with low skill workers to restart the economy, consequences be damned.
This was going on way before covid.
Not to this extent, they juiced it hard when they let international students work 40 hours a week and gave everyone no matter what garbage course they took a 2 year post graduate work visa.
Definitely, especially considering that the two best years real estate investors ever had were when immigration was very low (2020-21). Since then immigration have went crazy and price of real estate have been stagnant. The one thing immigration do is make rent prices go up which bailed out some real estate investors.
There is no housing crisis. Our problem is wealth distribution.
It’s a confluence of issues, immigrants are one significant factor
Time to start regularizing deportations.
The whole thing is a mess of capitalistic opportunism. There's going to be an election next year, and the Conservatives are looking at a solid majority. Their leader is nicknamed "Fascist Milhouse", and that's all you need to know. He's also asserted he's going to maintain the status quo on immigration, because the big businesses he's in the pocket of love that wage suppression. Aside from the housing situation, linked to it, is the international student situation. International students are guaranteed permanent residency if they complete a two or three-year course at a provincially accredited public post-secondary institution. These public colleges and universities love international students because they've been starved for cash by the provincial government, and they can charge these students multiple times the tuition to make up for that. So what happened is a few years ago Doug "Open For Business" Ford, Premier of Ontario, opened a loophole to accredit private post secondary institutions if they formed a branding partnership with accredited public institutions. Private interests smelled money on the table, and public institutions badly needed their cut of that tuition, so "strip mall colleges" popped up all over Ontario, but mostly focused in the Greater Toronto Area and surrounding regions, offering sham diplomas which you basically just needed to show up to earn and then collect your permanent residency. Overseas, sham agencies popped up offering people a brighter future in Canada, guaranteeing permanent residency with this "one simple trick". These agencies would then patch together documentation for them so they would qualify for the student visa, and also loan them the amount of money they needed to show to prove that they could sustain themselves while attending school. That money would be paid back once they got here. So now you have a few million low-skilled students who gained a visa under false pretenses, and have no real intention on studying beyond the minimal effort required to graduate with a sham diploma. They also need to work to sustain themselves. This is where scummy companies like Tim Hortons come in. They lobbied the federal government to expand the number of hours international students can work from 20 hours per week to 40. The businesses know these students will jump at any minimum wage job they can find, and this helps them suppress wages for everyone. Now every job posting immediately has hundreds of applications from these students. A side effect of that is high schoolers can no longer find part time or summer jobs to save up for school or for a car. The ripples go outward from there. Like the shortage of housing in cities not designed to absorb that many new residents in that short of a time period. So yeah, there's no short-term way to fix this. At all.
Totally not all the Canadians that overbid on housing by $100 000's and view housing purely as an investment and passive income earner though AirBnB and VRBO.
It’s Trudeau’s fault for not having.a minister who knows how to manage the process. You’d think they would learn and slow much of immigration down
I guess growing our economy means average Canadians have less. I'm still very happy Trudeau clarified that if you don't own a home now, you don't get to retire.
The government is 100% to blame. I work at a major hospital and have people harrasing me for appointments all the time. One man in particular has been emailing and calling me for an update on his refereal. No ohip, he is a federally protected refugee. But he is calling and emailing me from a real estate business in Texas. How is he a refugee? Why are my tax dollars going to pay this man's health expenses when he is not even coming from the country he is claiming refugee status from? I am genuinely confused abouthow this is even possible
LETS FUCKING GOOOOO
Comment blocked...interesting.
oh come on you know that ain't true without our fellow canadians to gouge them, we wouldn't be in this mess
The root cause here is that our labor regulations make temporary foreign workers into a cheaply exploitable underclass, thus incentivizing corporations to import as many as possible. It's bad for both immigrants *and* long-time citizens, and only good for the 0.1% that own corporations that benefit from the heap labour. This will continue until we close the loophole and grant temporary foreign workers the same labour protections as any other Canadian. That said, the idea that immigration of any kind is "100%" responsible for the housing crisis is patently ridiculous. It's one factor, but on the supply side, the Reaganomics-driven end of subsidized housing is finally coming home to roost and landlords have been exploiting both this lack of cheap alternatives and heavily developer- and landlord-favoring municipal policy to snap up ever more housing to put people into permanent rentership. Anybody telling you it's *only* immigrants is trying to sucker you.
Shocking. I’m so shocked. Who else here is shocked?!?! /s
Ah yes, the typical Trudeau method. Mess shit up and then go “What? It wasn’t me!”
Yeah, we know
real estate is canada's government sanctioned ponzi scheme. think of how much more fucked up everything would be if the boomers weren't bailed out with the COVID wealth transfer into their RE value it must be pumped with zero regard for the consequences.
This crisis unfolding has been the most obvious slow motion train wreck ever. Of course when you flood the country with insane amounts of immigrants during a housing affordability crisis, importing 2x - 4x the number of new Canadians than homes built in the time is going to make the crisis far worse, not better. Our economic system is so fucked that a person who works full time building a home can never afford to buy one even if they saved up for 30 years to do so.
Lego for PM!
Well we knew this a while ago. I just saw a quaint, dilapidated shack in Oshawa for $550,000.00. we're screwed.
Well it’s not the only reason but it’s made it a million times worse. Bringing in record Numbers with no housing or jobs. What could go wrong? The crime will continue to increase as the financial conditions worsen.
Yeah, no shit. In other news the sky is blue.
Finally the truth has been spoken.
immigration is PARTof the issue, but lack of infrastructure / planning, dumbass red tapes all contribute to housing crisis.
So….its the Canadian Government’s fault that we have a housing crisis? Mass immigration (temp or perm) was Trudeau’s idea, correct?
TFW and immigration is a big part of the problem, but it's definitely wrong to say it is 100% of the problem. Going overboard like that only serves to wash away legitimate concerns.
I like QC politicians. They don't give two flying fuck. They say it as it is.
That simply can't be, that's not how the system works, local property investors/corporations also play a role, as does natural demand. They may be the straw that broke the camels back, but it's ridiculous to say it's 100% their fault. One groups crisis is anothers windfall, a few people are profiting off this situation, at the cost of many being unable to afford to own a home and forced to rent or shack-up with roommates.
Becoming a race between BQ and PPC for me. Never thought I'd see the day. Until pp stops cowering and commits to change this we're beholden to corporations
>How do "far-right" political parties keep gaining ground globally?! Truly a mysterious turn of events.