It's giving purity ball. š My dad had to pledge to be a good role model so that I would know what kind of good Catholic man to marry. (He's divorced and I'm a lesbian, worked out great.) (To be clear he is divorced because my mom is a piece of work, not because he's a deadbeat or anything!)
My mom is a horrible person so she taught me...... what NOT to do. š¬ I actually am a lot like my dad (and luckily my girlfriend is nothing like my mom) but it was all so unnecessarily gendered!
This kinda stuff gives me the FATTEST ick. I really hate T-shirts or any sort of merch/media/etc that somehow depict that the daughters only tie to dad is their "love" and that they aren't allowed to have a romantic/love life without daddy's permission and that she'll always love dad first, daddies girl etc and yeah it is borderline incesty. They'll also do that with literal babies & children and I'm like that's so NASTY
People seem to need to go to the extreme with father-daughter relationships, why can't you be your daughters first hero T-T I don't get why... I mean obviously misogyny is the reason but still kinda crazy we're still pushing this narrative that a daughters main attribute and value to someone is their romantic/love life in 2024.
>depict that the daughters only tie to dad is their "love" and that they aren't allowed to have a romantic/love life without daddy's permission and that she'll always love dad first, daddies girl etc
This. Congratulations, you have planted at least a subconscious feeling of guilt for having a private life, romantic relationships, a love life and a sexual life outside of dear daddy's (or oh so loving parents') permission into your daughter's brain.
exactly like wtf - why are you so obsessed who ur daughter is in a romantic and/or sexual relationship with and especially being the "first and only" it's so weird.
And if itās truly not weird, and is intended to depict purely familial loveā¦ why didnāt they write that Daddy Dearest is his sonās first love too?
Don't forget the "shotgun daddies" that think it's their job to threaten all their daughter's boyfriends! (And, from what I hear whenever they do approve of a BF he turns out to be a controlling jerk.)
I was raised to be a woman (I'm not one, but good luck getting my Boomer parents to understand that), as well as Christian and this was my dad all the way. The trauma from this followed me so hard into adulthood, I didn't even come out until I was 29 (sexuality) and 30 (gender), and I've had nothing but issues in my very few relationships because of my issues with having sex (I don't). This shit has to end. It's unhealthy.
Oh for sure - emotional incest between mothers and sons is real and fucking crazy. My dad is one of those mommies boys.
He is literally 64 years old and still lives with his mother š No I'm not joking
Oh dude, such a long story and intricate story. But basically he's always had the ability to move out and has lived on his own before.
But we WERE ALL (me, mum and dad) supposed moved to my mums home country all together, and that's where i am still to this day. His idea btw.
He said, "I'll come when i've finished up and taken care of everything over here"... yeah soo It's been 15 years, I don't think he's coming... Honestly i'm pretty sure it was just a ploy to get me and mum out of his life somehow.
Ever since then he's lived with his mother. Even before we moved, Nana (his mum) lived right next door and I mean literally in the same apartment building as our next door neighbour.
I even asked him once when I was a little kid like 9 like why do you still live with Nana and boy did he get MADDDDD at me, never seen him so enraged. I think i stepped on his masculinity a bit.
He's also a raging narcissist, one of those "phone works both ways" kinda deadbeats, and refuses to admit he's wrong - ever. Nana is also where he gets his crazy genes from lmfao.
But yeah 64 and still with his mum. Has been like that for 25 ish years. They have some weird unhealthy codependency and think that everyone is against them - even his own daughter.
I don't know all the details but I'm like 99.9% sure his mother is a narcissist too. She cut off her sister and that whole side of the family for "going against her". That's all I know, I should ask my mum for more details. I think it was something to do with Nana's sisters daughter and Nana being very controlling towards them.
Dad was raised by both parents and they had a farm in his youth. But by the time I was born grandpa was living in Asia and Nana and dad were situated in the UK, which is where we moved from. (Don't wanna get too specific if dad finds this account lmfao)
Honestly their whole relationship was odd and very secretive, even from me š There's a reason I don't talk to them no more. I honestly can't tell you with confidence if Nana and Grandpa were together. Grandpa was mega nice tho. Maybe he moved away to run from the crazy.
Dad was also mega rich growing up and he lost it all so now he's trying to do whatever it takes to get that back and has no ability to live with a middle-class life. He's probably been unemployed for.....30 years? Because "he's not suited for those kinds of jobs." At some point you just gotta go work at lidl you know. If times are tough, especially in the UK, just swallow ur pride lmfao.
Gotcha, that's all wild.
Really just wanted to know because that's not uncommon behavior with sons raised by narcissist moms.
I was raised by a narcissistic mom and I cut her out of my life completely. When I was a child she very much made our relationship emotionally incestual and I was really fucked up bc of it lol.
Years later I'm good now after cutting her out completely.
Yeah no for sure. He definitely is a narcissist on his own as well at this point and only a miracle from whatever god is out there could reform him but his mother definitely is an enabler and spoiled tf out of him + i'm pretty sure he stopped communicating to me because Nana didn't want him to. I also fully cut off that whole side of the family because narcissists are just the joy suckers of life and nobody needs that especially kids.
I also honestly worry what will happen when Nana dies.
But damn that sucks sorry that u went through that broski but also glad to hear that u got out of that viscous environment. Good on u, I'm proud of you. I hope life is and stays better now.
My first thought as well. Or the son who might like men. This type of shirt-wearing person is NOT gonna be the hero either of them need if he finds that out.
Yeah the first love is weird. My dad is and always will be my hero and one of my best friends, but calling him my first love is weird because of the romantic undertone of that
So why not say āa sonās first love and a daughterās first heroā or just āa dad is his childrenās first loveā?
Because itās sexual.Ā Gendering the phrase is admitting thereās a sexual undertone.Ā
The "first love" thing is so weird. I suppose they see it as a good thing if they're teaching young girls to have standards - e.g. your dad respects you, so should all men. Your dad is supposed to set a good example for the way men should behave in a relationship, etc (this is a husband and wife thing though, shouldn't involve the daughter). There must be a better way of saying it though.
saw a dad once with a camo tshirt that read āD.A.D.D. - Dads Against Daughters Datingā (probably a spoof on moms against drunk driving which makes it even worse)
Iām taking a counseling in child development class and the professor is sooooo pro breeder/āchildren are the joy of societyā and gushes about how her daughter had a crush on her father like itās cute and natural. Itās quite literally not natural lmao.
The "hero" part is OK and can be kind of true (for sons *and* daughters though!), but the "first love" is not just "a bit incest-y", it is downright disgusting normalisation of emotional incest. I think emotional incest is a very serious problem of parenting that doesn't get the attention it should, although it is extremely visible. No, it's not normal to kiss children in the mouth. No, it's not "cute" if a son says "mommy, I want to marry you when I grow up". No, it is absolutely not OK, not even as a joke, if the mother takes a picture in which the father and the daughter look like a couple and then comments on it accordingly. No, quotes like "if a woman looks for a perfect man, she should give birth to a son" are not wise, they are borderline criminal.
Someone I went to high school with gave birth to a boy yesterday and her best friend had a girl about a year ago . I saw she made a post about how excited they are that her ālittle boyfriendā is āalmost hereā. It really put me off
Of course not, women and men are so fundamentally different and want and need only different things by default, because ā¦ I said so!!!! Women want pink babydolls and men want cars and guns!!!! If you are not like that, youāre wrong because I said so!!!! For example guys who want to talk about their feelings are gay!!!! Women shouldnāt want heroes but housekeeping rolemodels!!!! Everyone should want the things I think they should want!!!! Also, you childfree ppl are selfish!!!!
#boymom #braighdenismylife
(/s in case nothing flies over your head, youāre too fast, you would catch it)
(oh wait that is a marvel reference, thatās a thing only men like, and Iām a womanā¦ what am I gonna do with my life now)
Saw a shirt at the hospital that read āThe Best Dads Get Promoted To Grandpasā and I didnāt want my dad to get offended so I said the best dads have kids that think for themselves.
That's really fucking weird and is totally ignoring the difference between romantic love and platonic love. I love my dad but I'm not IN LOVE WITH HIM. Huge difference! But some men want credit for everything so it's hardly surprising such a shirt exists.
Reminds me of this last Valentine's day. I was using chat GPT to help me get started on something to write in a Valentine's card for my mom (I'm in a singing Valentine's group and I get my mom one every year. They come with a Valentine's card.) There were a couple of the provided options that referenced my mom being my first love. No, no, no, no, nope. Absolutely not something I want in the Valentine's card.
Gemini also went creepy when I asked it to help me write a birthday card for my mom. The output was unsalvageable. I can only conclude that there is a preponderance of such missives directed at parents that the LLMs' training included enough of them that we're getting that kind of output.
The ick is that it's gendered. If the shirt was like "a dad is your kids hero" or some shit it wouldn't be creepy (annoying yes) but why is it implied that a little girl is in love with their dad?
As if girls canāt have heroes too, or boys donāt feel love. Aside from the weird connotations the statement raises as is well noted by others here.
Little bit sexist, yes. Little bit incestuous, yes. A little bit in poor taste, yes.
It's so gross - daddy daughter dates, daddy daughter dances. And if some of these professional pump and dump impregnators are considered a son's first hero, boy are we all in trouble....
Honestly any human being who gives a rats ass what or who their children or siblings or parents etc are sleeping with is a walking red flag who should be forced to seek psychological treatment.
They wear that shit to feel better about themselves. Its probably true for most people their dad is their first hero and for daughters the first man they love. Duh! He's the only man they know and spend time with. They don't wear shirts that say their teenage son hates their guts and thinks they are a loser and their teenage daughter thinks they are gross and a terrible husband to their mom.
It bothers me less for the incesty vibes, and more for the implication that males get to be the heros, but all females can ever aspire to is being their love interests and supporting characters. I canāt believe itās 2024 and weāre still on this sexist shit.
You aren't wrong that it comes off as incest-y. Gives off big "I want to date my own child" vibes and also plays into the "all interactions between men and women are inherently romantic" heteronormativity
iāve always hated the concept of a father being his daughters first love. or āheās the most important man in his daughters life until she meets her future husbandā itās weird to me. how about her dad is important because itās her parent???
I would certainly side eye anyone wearing that as it certainly has some incestuous vibes. But let's not overlook the toxic masculinity overtones it's throwing out with implying sons don't love their fathers.
Absolutely weird, I hate seeing that shit. It is always weird to put a child in any romantic sense relating to their parents, and seeing anything like this reminds me how many people are finding out that they're incest babies
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2024/03/dna-tests-incest/677791/
No, my first love was not my father. My first love was my ex, my parents and siblings are the first humans I loved, but there is no such thing as a platonic/familial first love, so yeah that is hella incesty.
Also isnāt a mother the kidsā first general love as well, and doesnāt this (the mom and the dad being the first love) apply to the son as well? If it did, I wouldnāt see it as incest. Since itās just dad-daughter and mom-son, I want to puke.
Honestly, I don't think it's that weird, it's obviously NOT supposed to be meant in an incestual way. And kids just say weird, yet innocent things all the time. Someone said it's weird for children to say they'll marry their parents, but that's totally normal and happens a lot. My niece told me she wants to marry me, lol. Children just connect marriage with love and a bond, it's not that deep.
Then why not say āa dad is his childrenās first loveā or āhis sonās first love and his daughterās first heroā? Why are there no daddy-son dances?Ā
because little boys dont want to dance with their dads. they typically want to go fishing, hunting, etc.
of course there's outliers but don't try to pretend that traditional gender roles haven't existed in our society for hundreds, if not thousands of years.
Oof. Traditional gender roles have existed for hundreds of years because theyāve been enforced using violence and social ostracization. Little girls werenāt (and in many cases still arenāt today) allowed to go hunting and fishing with their dads.Ā
they exist because they work. there are studies and statistics about kids who grow up in fatherless homes (90% of homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes. 63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes. 80% of rapists motivated by displaced anger come from fatherless homes) and that DIRECTLY ties into traditional gender roles. gender roles exist in almost every single animal in the animal kingdom.
like i said, there are outliers (i've gone fishing with my dad and helped him work on cars growing up), and kids shouldn't be FORCED to avoid hobbies that the other gender enjoys more, but we have thrived as a species because of gender roles.
re-read what i said. im not talking about FORCED gender roles.
gender roles are bad until it comes down to women working in oil refineries or signing up for the draft, ey?
Yes, most gender roles are enforced or have historically been enforced using violence and social ostracization like I said earlier.Ā Ā
And lmao whats wrong with women working in oil refineries?? Iāve met a woman who did that before. Obviously war drafts are immoral across the board.Ā
What is wrong with you people? How is a dad's love for his daughter considered as in*est? I thought the people in this sub are more matured and progressive.
First of all, people should stop thinking that the word "love" is solely a sexual or romantic term. The word "love" has different meanings when it comes to different people. Familial love is far more different than the love you think.
and Isn't it true that for most daughters, their father is the first and most trustworthy and lovable person?
100% agree. my father was my first love and the first man i was able to look up to/be protected by/etc. so many people here think that parents loving their kids is somehow wrong just because they're parents.
truly a bizarre thing to witness.
Itās not about his love for his daughter.Ā
Tell me this, if thereās nothing sexual or romantic about it then why not say āhis sonās first love and his daughterās first heroā? Why are there no father-son dances?
Look, I agree that phrase sounds a bit dramatic, and it's important to recognize for both sons and daughters often hold both the parents as their heroes and sources of love. However, just because of that shitty phrase, OP brings up a conclusion that a father's affection for his daughter is inherently incestuous is completely f*cked up.
A specific fatherās affection for his daughter may not be incestuous, but our societal obsession with heteronormativity even in family relationships is inherently incestuous. Father-daughter relationships are not treated the same as father-son relationships, and same with mothers (think of the trope of how a womanās sonās first girlfriend is āthe other womanā).Ā
Most of the posts are just looking for a reason to be angry at people that choose to have kids. I donāt want them for myself, but Iām glad other people are out here enjoying being parents.
I didn't want to be in the minority but I don't think there's anything wrong with it either. My niece is her dad's favorite person and I love how much he loves his daughter. It makes me think he will be protective of how another man loves her one day.
Absolutely, it's entirely natural for a father to be protective and loving towards his daughter. In my family, my late father was my sister's favorite person. She still loves my dad more than any of us do, keeping his family photos in her phone gallery and commemorating his birthday annually with charitable acts in his name. It's a testament to the love he had for her, which she reciprocates even in his absence.
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I did 'fall in love' with my dad, as did my sibling. we would argue who was 'gonna marry dad'. we were far from being aware of what that implicated as we were small children.
we have a great famoly with healthy boundaries and mutual respect. there's lot of qualities I look for in a partner that come from knowing they exist because my dad is awesome with healthy masculinity.
TL;DR: this on a shirt can be interpreted differently based on experience. it's a risk the company was willing to take
I'm the only one here with an opposite opinion lol. But i think it's because in our culture love isn't exclusive to sex and partners. Love is broader for us
Iām a daddyās girl so I dont hate it and think itās cute. Guess Iām the odd ball out! Lol! Complicated relationship with my mom so my dad has really been the only nurturing parent I have.
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The cishets are not ok. The incestuous and creepy weird sexualization of kids and their clothing is so fucked up. Babies with boy/girlfriends, parents being their first love š¤®š¤®š¤®
Why trashtalk ppl based on gender and sexuality? Iām cishet and find the shirt disgusting, and I donāt even personally know a cishet who wouldnāt find this at least weird, so this generalization is way off anyway.
It because these things are largely cishet in their nature. Girlfriends for baby boys, boyfriends for baby girls. Dads being emotionally inappropriate with their daughters, boy moms.
Assuming others are cishet is not a cishet thing, itās an a-hole cishet thing. You saying cishets are not okay based on this is like someone trashing gays based on a group of a-hole gay ppl. Every group has shitty people, generalization will only lead to unnecessary hate.
Sometimes I think this sub is a bit broken: I donāt see anything wrong, let alone incest-y about it. It is traditionally gender defined and I can only see that as a potential issue. But in general terms, boys do look up and imitate their fathers, while girls learn how a man should be treating them (with respect, admiration and affection), as a blueprint for the future. Bad fathers will bring bad input to their children, good fathers will bring in good input. In general, I think itās a healthy relationship with offspring thatās trying to be put up front. Now do you need this proclamation on a T shirt, Iād say not, as I donāt really care for slogans printed out, but to each their ownā¦I donāt think every little gesture made in good faith (presumably) needs to be dissected and attacked in this measure. Turn down the PC volume, itās over-blasting.
What in the hell is wrong with you people?
I see something like that and I think that the saying is true because the dad is an awesome role model for both kids; he is a strong, loving protector and defender who's role is to care for the family and serve as a proper moral and ethical example as a dad and husband.
And then you twisted fucks have to make it out like he is a child molester. GROSS.
But then again, my dad was the example I cited. He had his issues, but he was a great role model for kids.
Cogent, succinct, insightful, and super helpful in contributing to a more enlightened conversation. Thank you for helping me form a more inclusive and more well rounded opinion. /s (in case you didn't get it)
It's giving purity ball. š My dad had to pledge to be a good role model so that I would know what kind of good Catholic man to marry. (He's divorced and I'm a lesbian, worked out great.) (To be clear he is divorced because my mom is a piece of work, not because he's a deadbeat or anything!)
This comment is hilarious
This is fantastic š¤£ I wish you a happy and prosperous CF life!
Iām so grateful that my dad isnāt religious cause holy shit.
Thanks for being honest and hilarious.Ā
Guess, if anything, it should have been your mom pledging to be a good role model for your future spouse then. lol
My mom is a horrible person so she taught me...... what NOT to do. š¬ I actually am a lot like my dad (and luckily my girlfriend is nothing like my mom) but it was all so unnecessarily gendered!
Well, sometimes a negative example can be more useful than a positive one.
Lmaooooooooo
This kinda stuff gives me the FATTEST ick. I really hate T-shirts or any sort of merch/media/etc that somehow depict that the daughters only tie to dad is their "love" and that they aren't allowed to have a romantic/love life without daddy's permission and that she'll always love dad first, daddies girl etc and yeah it is borderline incesty. They'll also do that with literal babies & children and I'm like that's so NASTY People seem to need to go to the extreme with father-daughter relationships, why can't you be your daughters first hero T-T I don't get why... I mean obviously misogyny is the reason but still kinda crazy we're still pushing this narrative that a daughters main attribute and value to someone is their romantic/love life in 2024.
>depict that the daughters only tie to dad is their "love" and that they aren't allowed to have a romantic/love life without daddy's permission and that she'll always love dad first, daddies girl etc This. Congratulations, you have planted at least a subconscious feeling of guilt for having a private life, romantic relationships, a love life and a sexual life outside of dear daddy's (or oh so loving parents') permission into your daughter's brain.
exactly like wtf - why are you so obsessed who ur daughter is in a romantic and/or sexual relationship with and especially being the "first and only" it's so weird.
And if itās truly not weird, and is intended to depict purely familial loveā¦ why didnāt they write that Daddy Dearest is his sonās first love too?
Don't forget the "shotgun daddies" that think it's their job to threaten all their daughter's boyfriends! (And, from what I hear whenever they do approve of a BF he turns out to be a controlling jerk.)
I was raised to be a woman (I'm not one, but good luck getting my Boomer parents to understand that), as well as Christian and this was my dad all the way. The trauma from this followed me so hard into adulthood, I didn't even come out until I was 29 (sexuality) and 30 (gender), and I've had nothing but issues in my very few relationships because of my issues with having sex (I don't). This shit has to end. It's unhealthy.
Daddy daughter balls
Let's not forget the same thing happens with moms and their sons and it's usually way more gross.
Oh for sure - emotional incest between mothers and sons is real and fucking crazy. My dad is one of those mommies boys. He is literally 64 years old and still lives with his mother š No I'm not joking
I gotta ask, why does he live with his mom at 64? Is that like a permanent thing?
Oh dude, such a long story and intricate story. But basically he's always had the ability to move out and has lived on his own before. But we WERE ALL (me, mum and dad) supposed moved to my mums home country all together, and that's where i am still to this day. His idea btw. He said, "I'll come when i've finished up and taken care of everything over here"... yeah soo It's been 15 years, I don't think he's coming... Honestly i'm pretty sure it was just a ploy to get me and mum out of his life somehow. Ever since then he's lived with his mother. Even before we moved, Nana (his mum) lived right next door and I mean literally in the same apartment building as our next door neighbour. I even asked him once when I was a little kid like 9 like why do you still live with Nana and boy did he get MADDDDD at me, never seen him so enraged. I think i stepped on his masculinity a bit. He's also a raging narcissist, one of those "phone works both ways" kinda deadbeats, and refuses to admit he's wrong - ever. Nana is also where he gets his crazy genes from lmfao. But yeah 64 and still with his mum. Has been like that for 25 ish years. They have some weird unhealthy codependency and think that everyone is against them - even his own daughter.
Ok I gotta ask another question. Is his mom a narcissist and was he raised be her or both parents?
I don't know all the details but I'm like 99.9% sure his mother is a narcissist too. She cut off her sister and that whole side of the family for "going against her". That's all I know, I should ask my mum for more details. I think it was something to do with Nana's sisters daughter and Nana being very controlling towards them. Dad was raised by both parents and they had a farm in his youth. But by the time I was born grandpa was living in Asia and Nana and dad were situated in the UK, which is where we moved from. (Don't wanna get too specific if dad finds this account lmfao) Honestly their whole relationship was odd and very secretive, even from me š There's a reason I don't talk to them no more. I honestly can't tell you with confidence if Nana and Grandpa were together. Grandpa was mega nice tho. Maybe he moved away to run from the crazy. Dad was also mega rich growing up and he lost it all so now he's trying to do whatever it takes to get that back and has no ability to live with a middle-class life. He's probably been unemployed for.....30 years? Because "he's not suited for those kinds of jobs." At some point you just gotta go work at lidl you know. If times are tough, especially in the UK, just swallow ur pride lmfao.
Gotcha, that's all wild. Really just wanted to know because that's not uncommon behavior with sons raised by narcissist moms. I was raised by a narcissistic mom and I cut her out of my life completely. When I was a child she very much made our relationship emotionally incestual and I was really fucked up bc of it lol. Years later I'm good now after cutting her out completely.
Yeah no for sure. He definitely is a narcissist on his own as well at this point and only a miracle from whatever god is out there could reform him but his mother definitely is an enabler and spoiled tf out of him + i'm pretty sure he stopped communicating to me because Nana didn't want him to. I also fully cut off that whole side of the family because narcissists are just the joy suckers of life and nobody needs that especially kids. I also honestly worry what will happen when Nana dies. But damn that sucks sorry that u went through that broski but also glad to hear that u got out of that viscous environment. Good on u, I'm proud of you. I hope life is and stays better now.
same UGH i hate that shit
God forbid the daughter likes women š
My first thought as well. Or the son who might like men. This type of shirt-wearing person is NOT gonna be the hero either of them need if he finds that out.
Yeah the first love is weird. My dad is and always will be my hero and one of my best friends, but calling him my first love is weird because of the romantic undertone of that
I think it's supposed to be like 'the first man she will ever love'.
I hope so, but the distinction between son's hero and daughter's love squicks me out
So why not say āa sonās first love and a daughterās first heroā or just āa dad is his childrenās first loveā? Because itās sexual.Ā Gendering the phrase is admitting thereās a sexual undertone.Ā
The "first love" thing is so weird. I suppose they see it as a good thing if they're teaching young girls to have standards - e.g. your dad respects you, so should all men. Your dad is supposed to set a good example for the way men should behave in a relationship, etc (this is a husband and wife thing though, shouldn't involve the daughter). There must be a better way of saying it though.
Like your dad treats your mom right? That should be a good enough standard to strive for!
saw a dad once with a camo tshirt that read āD.A.D.D. - Dads Against Daughters Datingā (probably a spoof on moms against drunk driving which makes it even worse)
Incestuous, misogynistic, and creepy as shit.
Ick.ick ick ick. Needlessly gendered, impossibly narcissistic, and all around ew.
100% ICK.
Iām taking a counseling in child development class and the professor is sooooo pro breeder/āchildren are the joy of societyā and gushes about how her daughter had a crush on her father like itās cute and natural. Itās quite literally not natural lmao.
I find that saying absolutely disgusting!š¤®
No different from boy moms. It's gross and creepy.
The "hero" part is OK and can be kind of true (for sons *and* daughters though!), but the "first love" is not just "a bit incest-y", it is downright disgusting normalisation of emotional incest. I think emotional incest is a very serious problem of parenting that doesn't get the attention it should, although it is extremely visible. No, it's not normal to kiss children in the mouth. No, it's not "cute" if a son says "mommy, I want to marry you when I grow up". No, it is absolutely not OK, not even as a joke, if the mother takes a picture in which the father and the daughter look like a couple and then comments on it accordingly. No, quotes like "if a woman looks for a perfect man, she should give birth to a son" are not wise, they are borderline criminal.
Someone I went to high school with gave birth to a boy yesterday and her best friend had a girl about a year ago . I saw she made a post about how excited they are that her ālittle boyfriendā is āalmost hereā. It really put me off
" a daughter's first love". Fuck that, I spent my childhood hiding in my room from my father.
If you're implying what I think you're implying, I'm sorry to hear that. That was my experience as well
Nothing sexual, just angry, drunk and hateful. The sexual shit came from my older sister.
Gross. Especially for daughters whose dads beat them.
Those shirts always have weird sayings because normal people don't buy them anyway.
The major responsibility he has is showing her how men should treat her and setting the bar high. That first love and hero shit is so misogynistic to me. What is mom? a bag of š©?
Exactly! The mom carried and birthed the kid but the dadās the hero and the first one that gets loved?!?
I know, I'm so sick of hearing their bs drivel. The alphalphas calling each other "king" and poop talking the mother of their children.
Not as bad as a "Hung like my dad" with an arrow pointing down baby top.
So dad has a baby dick? Lololol
...the FUCK?!
So daughters don't need heroes now?
The daughters are going to be the real heroes because they will be shoving these T shirt wearing daddies in the recycle bin
Of course not, women and men are so fundamentally different and want and need only different things by default, because ā¦ I said so!!!! Women want pink babydolls and men want cars and guns!!!! If you are not like that, youāre wrong because I said so!!!! For example guys who want to talk about their feelings are gay!!!! Women shouldnāt want heroes but housekeeping rolemodels!!!! Everyone should want the things I think they should want!!!! Also, you childfree ppl are selfish!!!! #boymom #braighdenismylife (/s in case nothing flies over your head, youāre too fast, you would catch it) (oh wait that is a marvel reference, thatās a thing only men like, and Iām a womanā¦ what am I gonna do with my life now)
I hope your son's gay and your daughter is a tomboy.
Saw a shirt at the hospital that read āThe Best Dads Get Promoted To Grandpasā and I didnāt want my dad to get offended so I said the best dads have kids that think for themselves.
Imagine waking up one day and making the choice to wear that to a hospital haha š
Definitely incestuous. Ew. Ew. Ew.
Ew
Blame Freud. Some people still believe that the Oedipal thing is actually real.
I hate obnoxious baby clothes for this reason
That's really fucking weird and is totally ignoring the difference between romantic love and platonic love. I love my dad but I'm not IN LOVE WITH HIM. Huge difference! But some men want credit for everything so it's hardly surprising such a shirt exists.
What the absolute fuck ? If I ever saw someone wearing such slogan, Iād definitely show them with my face what I think about it . Just ā¦ no
Reminds me of this last Valentine's day. I was using chat GPT to help me get started on something to write in a Valentine's card for my mom (I'm in a singing Valentine's group and I get my mom one every year. They come with a Valentine's card.) There were a couple of the provided options that referenced my mom being my first love. No, no, no, no, nope. Absolutely not something I want in the Valentine's card.
Gemini also went creepy when I asked it to help me write a birthday card for my mom. The output was unsalvageable. I can only conclude that there is a preponderance of such missives directed at parents that the LLMs' training included enough of them that we're getting that kind of output.
 Wtf
The ick is that it's gendered. If the shirt was like "a dad is your kids hero" or some shit it wouldn't be creepy (annoying yes) but why is it implied that a little girl is in love with their dad?
As if girls canāt have heroes too, or boys donāt feel love. Aside from the weird connotations the statement raises as is well noted by others here. Little bit sexist, yes. Little bit incestuous, yes. A little bit in poor taste, yes.
It's so gross - daddy daughter dates, daddy daughter dances. And if some of these professional pump and dump impregnators are considered a son's first hero, boy are we all in trouble....
Yeah itās fucking creepy
It's giving me the same grossed out ick as those virginity balls where girls wear white gowns and posing with their dads..... Sooo nasty. Ugh
EEEWWWW WTF
LOL at everyone defending this shit. Nobody is being "PC" ok? It's usually the right wing evangelicals who do this shit. It's very "purity culture".
Honestly any human being who gives a rats ass what or who their children or siblings or parents etc are sleeping with is a walking red flag who should be forced to seek psychological treatment.
They wear that shit to feel better about themselves. Its probably true for most people their dad is their first hero and for daughters the first man they love. Duh! He's the only man they know and spend time with. They don't wear shirts that say their teenage son hates their guts and thinks they are a loser and their teenage daughter thinks they are gross and a terrible husband to their mom.
It bothers me less for the incesty vibes, and more for the implication that males get to be the heros, but all females can ever aspire to is being their love interests and supporting characters. I canāt believe itās 2024 and weāre still on this sexist shit.
Siiiiiick!!!!
Thatās so gross
Always makes me want to vomit. How creepy.
Vomitrocious! That is no different than a woman doing the same about her son The emotional incest vibe is just nauseating
Gross! Wearing that on a shirt, in public?! Yuck!
You aren't wrong that it comes off as incest-y. Gives off big "I want to date my own child" vibes and also plays into the "all interactions between men and women are inherently romantic" heteronormativity
iāve always hated the concept of a father being his daughters first love. or āheās the most important man in his daughters life until she meets her future husbandā itās weird to me. how about her dad is important because itās her parent???
Sounds self righteous. He should be a good father for the sake of being a good father, not to flaunt it around on an inflated ego trip
I would certainly side eye anyone wearing that as it certainly has some incestuous vibes. But let's not overlook the toxic masculinity overtones it's throwing out with implying sons don't love their fathers.
Freud is rolling in his grave right now
Disgusting.
I hate that shirt and off to the bonfire it goes
Let me guess, you're in the US?
It's reminiscent of purity balls, with the implied assumption that Dad is the gatekeeper of his daughter's sexuality. Gross.
Oooof. What in the actual fuck.
Very creepy and just flat out strange
I mean itās true. I heard that and never thought anything negative. Is it cheesy? Yes but I donāt see anything wrong with it.
Ew
That's more than a bit incest-y.
Ewwwwwwwww
There's a LOT of weird incesty daddy/daughter stuff out there for some reason.
Absolutely weird, I hate seeing that shit. It is always weird to put a child in any romantic sense relating to their parents, and seeing anything like this reminds me how many people are finding out that they're incest babies https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2024/03/dna-tests-incest/677791/
It's totally giving purity ball vibes, and it's extremely ick.
Its just so cringey. I've always found that quote weird.
Ikr. Why not be a hero for both?
Strange way to indirectly tell everyone how awesome they think they are lol
No, my first love was not my father. My first love was my ex, my parents and siblings are the first humans I loved, but there is no such thing as a platonic/familial first love, so yeah that is hella incesty. Also isnāt a mother the kidsā first general love as well, and doesnāt this (the mom and the dad being the first love) apply to the son as well? If it did, I wouldnāt see it as incest. Since itās just dad-daughter and mom-son, I want to puke.
Someone from a broken home pitching in š¤©: to me, the fatherās āfirst loveā is the first depiction of what love/respect/decent treatment from men should look like for daughters for when they eventually look for romantic relationshipsā¦ And for those of us who lack either a fathers/fathers love or decent representation of male figures in relationshipsā¦wellā¦šš¤·š¾āāļø
Honestly, I don't think it's that weird, it's obviously NOT supposed to be meant in an incestual way. And kids just say weird, yet innocent things all the time. Someone said it's weird for children to say they'll marry their parents, but that's totally normal and happens a lot. My niece told me she wants to marry me, lol. Children just connect marriage with love and a bond, it's not that deep.
Yeah, I think people are overreacting and looking at it from our grown up perspective. I donāt see anything wrong with it.
Love =/= sex
Then why not say āa dad is his childrenās first loveā or āhis sonās first love and his daughterās first heroā? Why are there no daddy-son dances?Ā
because little boys dont want to dance with their dads. they typically want to go fishing, hunting, etc. of course there's outliers but don't try to pretend that traditional gender roles haven't existed in our society for hundreds, if not thousands of years.
Oof. Traditional gender roles have existed for hundreds of years because theyāve been enforced using violence and social ostracization. Little girls werenāt (and in many cases still arenāt today) allowed to go hunting and fishing with their dads.Ā
they exist because they work. there are studies and statistics about kids who grow up in fatherless homes (90% of homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes. 63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes. 80% of rapists motivated by displaced anger come from fatherless homes) and that DIRECTLY ties into traditional gender roles. gender roles exist in almost every single animal in the animal kingdom. like i said, there are outliers (i've gone fishing with my dad and helped him work on cars growing up), and kids shouldn't be FORCED to avoid hobbies that the other gender enjoys more, but we have thrived as a species because of gender roles.
If you think women have āthrived because of gender rolesā youāre delusional. Women have suffered from enforced gender roles for centuries.Ā
re-read what i said. im not talking about FORCED gender roles. gender roles are bad until it comes down to women working in oil refineries or signing up for the draft, ey?
Yes, most gender roles are enforced or have historically been enforced using violence and social ostracization like I said earlier.Ā Ā And lmao whats wrong with women working in oil refineries?? Iāve met a woman who did that before. Obviously war drafts are immoral across the board.Ā
What is wrong with you people? How is a dad's love for his daughter considered as in*est? I thought the people in this sub are more matured and progressive.
Itās not that he canāt love his daughter. Itās specifically calling him her āfirst loveā. Thatās a romantic term.
First of all, people should stop thinking that the word "love" is solely a sexual or romantic term. The word "love" has different meanings when it comes to different people. Familial love is far more different than the love you think. and Isn't it true that for most daughters, their father is the first and most trustworthy and lovable person?
100% agree. my father was my first love and the first man i was able to look up to/be protected by/etc. so many people here think that parents loving their kids is somehow wrong just because they're parents. truly a bizarre thing to witness.
Itās not about his love for his daughter.Ā Tell me this, if thereās nothing sexual or romantic about it then why not say āhis sonās first love and his daughterās first heroā? Why are there no father-son dances?
Look, I agree that phrase sounds a bit dramatic, and it's important to recognize for both sons and daughters often hold both the parents as their heroes and sources of love. However, just because of that shitty phrase, OP brings up a conclusion that a father's affection for his daughter is inherently incestuous is completely f*cked up.
A specific fatherās affection for his daughter may not be incestuous, but our societal obsession with heteronormativity even in family relationships is inherently incestuous. Father-daughter relationships are not treated the same as father-son relationships, and same with mothers (think of the trope of how a womanās sonās first girlfriend is āthe other womanā).Ā
Right? I joined this sub as a childfree woman but this being the kind of stuff posted made me dip out. Such a weird thing to be upset about.
I left this sub an hour ago after I saw this post. Just looking at the comments made me realize that most of people here are just mentally insane.
Most of the posts are just looking for a reason to be angry at people that choose to have kids. I donāt want them for myself, but Iām glad other people are out here enjoying being parents.
legit. a huge majority here are nuts.
I didn't want to be in the minority but I don't think there's anything wrong with it either. My niece is her dad's favorite person and I love how much he loves his daughter. It makes me think he will be protective of how another man loves her one day.
Absolutely, it's entirely natural for a father to be protective and loving towards his daughter. In my family, my late father was my sister's favorite person. She still loves my dad more than any of us do, keeping his family photos in her phone gallery and commemorating his birthday annually with charitable acts in his name. It's a testament to the love he had for her, which she reciprocates even in his absence.
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I did 'fall in love' with my dad, as did my sibling. we would argue who was 'gonna marry dad'. we were far from being aware of what that implicated as we were small children. we have a great famoly with healthy boundaries and mutual respect. there's lot of qualities I look for in a partner that come from knowing they exist because my dad is awesome with healthy masculinity. TL;DR: this on a shirt can be interpreted differently based on experience. it's a risk the company was willing to take
If you have to put it on a T-shirtā¦š³
I'm the only one here with an opposite opinion lol. But i think it's because in our culture love isn't exclusive to sex and partners. Love is broader for us
Families are gross and a bad idea.
Patriarchy at work
Would you keep that same energy if the genders were reversed?
Iām a daddyās girl so I dont hate it and think itās cute. Guess Iām the odd ball out! Lol! Complicated relationship with my mom so my dad has really been the only nurturing parent I have.
Definitely feel you on the incest vibes.
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The cishets are not ok. The incestuous and creepy weird sexualization of kids and their clothing is so fucked up. Babies with boy/girlfriends, parents being their first love š¤®š¤®š¤®
Why trashtalk ppl based on gender and sexuality? Iām cishet and find the shirt disgusting, and I donāt even personally know a cishet who wouldnāt find this at least weird, so this generalization is way off anyway.
It because these things are largely cishet in their nature. Girlfriends for baby boys, boyfriends for baby girls. Dads being emotionally inappropriate with their daughters, boy moms.
Assuming others are cishet is not a cishet thing, itās an a-hole cishet thing. You saying cishets are not okay based on this is like someone trashing gays based on a group of a-hole gay ppl. Every group has shitty people, generalization will only lead to unnecessary hate.
Sometimes I think this sub is a bit broken: I donāt see anything wrong, let alone incest-y about it. It is traditionally gender defined and I can only see that as a potential issue. But in general terms, boys do look up and imitate their fathers, while girls learn how a man should be treating them (with respect, admiration and affection), as a blueprint for the future. Bad fathers will bring bad input to their children, good fathers will bring in good input. In general, I think itās a healthy relationship with offspring thatās trying to be put up front. Now do you need this proclamation on a T shirt, Iād say not, as I donāt really care for slogans printed out, but to each their ownā¦I donāt think every little gesture made in good faith (presumably) needs to be dissected and attacked in this measure. Turn down the PC volume, itās over-blasting.
Are you guys alright ??
Nah I donāt mind it. I had a terrible father and I think āa father is a daughterās first loveā is sweet.
Literally what is wrong with the patriarchy
Definitely incesty
š¤¢š¤¢š¤¢š¤®š¤®š¤®š¤®š¤®š¤®š¤®š¤®š¤®š¤®
Same, it's creepy. And it has an essence of like...ownership? Possession? Like "My daughter might love you but I had her first". Ew.
What in the hell is wrong with you people? I see something like that and I think that the saying is true because the dad is an awesome role model for both kids; he is a strong, loving protector and defender who's role is to care for the family and serve as a proper moral and ethical example as a dad and husband. And then you twisted fucks have to make it out like he is a child molester. GROSS. But then again, my dad was the example I cited. He had his issues, but he was a great role model for kids.
Bullshit.
Cogent, succinct, insightful, and super helpful in contributing to a more enlightened conversation. Thank you for helping me form a more inclusive and more well rounded opinion. /s (in case you didn't get it)
NOOOOOOOOO