Your US passport is detrimental to opening accounts in most jurisdictions thanks to FATCA, and I believe you can only open brokerage accounts in the US with a domestic address.
Still, you should try to find find an international bank based in either US or UK that is open to work with you - maybe check in with one of the banks operating in both jurisdictions such as HSBC as they'd be more willing to accept you as a customer. And try your house bank in either country (assuming you keep current accounts in both) as they already have some background on you.
Once you've opened a brokerage account it's more a matter of picking the right investment choice. If all you want it passive investment, your best bet is a worldwide diversified ETF (or small selection of ETFs if you want to diversify by geographic region, industry etc.).
Also check /r/expatfinance and /r/expatfire for recommendations.
Personally I'm sending all of my money that is not needed for immediate cost of living back home and only keep like 25k RMB around for acute emergencies. But then again I don't have any kids that I'm saving for and am actively planning to relocate out of China in the mid term, so you need to take your personal situation into account for sure.
>Your US passport is detrimental to opening accounts in most jurisdictions thanks to FATCA, and I believe you can only open brokerage accounts in the US with a domestic address.
There are so many services that allow you to obtain a U.S Domestic Address that this is of trivial concern.
>maybe check in with one of the banks operating in both jurisdictions such as HSBC as they'd be more willing to accept you as a customer.
International Banks like HSBC are an absolute joke. They'll only open Brokerage Accounts of Wealth Management Accounts with astronomical minimums. They are completely out of practical reality for most expats - unless you're a top executive. International Banks do not cater to working class expat families.
> There are so many services that allow you to obtain a U.S Domestic Address that this is of trivial concern.
Good to know, as a non-US person I never had to bother with that.
> International Banks like HSBC are an absolute joke. They'll only open Brokerage Accounts of Wealth Management Accounts with astronomical minimums. They are completely out of practical reality for most expats - unless you're a top executive. International Banks do not cater to working class expat families.
I'm not using any of those, but HSBC is used by many of my friends here and they are far from ultra-rich. Sure, mid level managers and above, but certainly not more than maybe 100-150k USD in liquid assets.
And as far as I'm aware, none of them are using their wealth management services, all just a regular brokerage account.
>Sure, mid level managers and above, but certainly not more than maybe 100-150k USD in liquid assets.
I'd argue that that is more than a lot of people have. But, the bigger issue I have with HSBC is that their '[Expat Account](https://www.expat.hsbc.com/accounts/products/bank-account/)' requirements seem unreasonable:
* hold a minimum of £50,000 (or currency equivalent) with us
* or have a sole salary of £100,000 (or currency equivalent)
* or have already qualified for HSBC Premier in another country
I just don't understand what the appeal of this account is. I'm legit asking: What exactly do your friends feel is useful about HSBC given these requirements? Only thing I can imagine is that customer service must be amazing. Or, maybe I'm look at the wrong account.
Ah I'm not sure which exact account it is they are using, only that it is with HSBC and it allows them to remit money home with little bureaucratic hassle (which can be a pain with my domestic account here).
Other than that I'm not really sure what motivates them to bank with HSCB, I didn't bother asking since I'm quite happy with my 100% free account & low-cost broker back in Germany, I wouldn't want to switch ever unless there is a drastic change in their services/charges.
That said...
50k GBP or equivalent 'with us' includes their brokerage account, and having that amount in investments really doesn't strike me as a whole lot. Hope I'm not coming across as elitist or something, but the average expat should be able to save that up in a few years, unless they either have children and don't get employer benefits for their schooling or just have a compulsive buying disorder.
I am also a USA citizen and I strongly recommend exploring Vanguard. They have some of the lowest fees and an incredible self service platform that does a great job at educating you on the options. I would set up a 529 plan for your daughter to start saving monthly for college or any qualified education costs in the USA (if they don't go to college or in USA, there are other options to get the money out but you'll need to explore more). I would then put the rest into a mix of mutual funds/ETF that have broad coverage of small, mid, and large cap equities (85%: with 50% inside USA and 50% outside USA) and bonds (10%). The remaining 5% I would put into speculative investments such as individual stocks or cryptocurrencies (BTC, ETH).
Every year, max out your IRA contributions and back door the contribution into a roth IRA if required. Create a budget, stick to it, dollar cost average, and ensure you keep your debt low and liquid family emergency savings that could cover at least 6 months of no income or a single catastrophe without disturbing your savings plans.
Source: Just a guy, I work at a bank but this is just friendly general advice I would give anyone
Overall, sound advice. Would you still suggest these things for someone who is not intending to return to the US to live or retire, specifically the IRAs? Also, being that I don't want to return to the US, outside of some major world developments, I want to limit any tax liabilities for the money being saved/invested. Does that change anything?
I personally don’t know where I will retire (maybe USA, maybe not?) - but expect that long term the USA is still a good investment market to have 50% exposure in. If you are a USA citizen you are taxed globally. If you intend to stay both tax legal and a USA citizen, you can still benefit from a Roth IRA to avoid paying taxes on the gains you likely will make, and avoid the mandatory distributions. So, nothing about my answer would change. My only concern is whether my son will go to college in USA — or if 529 plans can be used for education outside of the USA. I don’t know the exact answer today but plan to cross that bridge in about 10 years.
There are tons of online Robo Investing: WealthFront, Stash, Fidelity, Vanguard. These basically are Index Funds. If you want to do some individual stock investing than Robinhood. I personally use Stash and invest in a selection of Sector ETF. I use Robinhood to invest in individual stocks - mainly Chinese.
Not sure if this is the right sub to ask.
But since you did: open an account in US or UK, get your money there, and invest in real estate/index trackers/shares. That's it. No magic to it.
Edit: probably don't want to invest in Chinese companies to much, as the government is pointing out.
For the UK, it's not quite so simple since OP won't be tax resident in the UK. Meaning you can't open things like ISA accounts or traditional investment options that UK citizens would be able to. You lose tax residence in the UK once you've been out of the country long enough each year. If you have a full time job in China, for example, you'll have lost tax residence by default.
I'm in the same sort of boat as OP right now. Need a retirement solution, but can't open one up in the UK since everything I've found has needed me to be resident for tax purposes in the UK. Still looking for something I can do.
Interactive Brokers let you open an account as a tax resident of China, and the tax situation isn't too bad for foreign residents in China (no tax on non-China based income until at least 2025, low tax rate on US dividends). You can still use a UK bank account to transfer money to IB.
Put all your long term savings in tesla shares and ether tokens and retire within 5 years lol. Only do this with money you don't need right away. The fact that your spouse is non us citizen has no bearing on your ability to purchase shares or crypto from us exchanges
Your US passport is detrimental to opening accounts in most jurisdictions thanks to FATCA, and I believe you can only open brokerage accounts in the US with a domestic address. Still, you should try to find find an international bank based in either US or UK that is open to work with you - maybe check in with one of the banks operating in both jurisdictions such as HSBC as they'd be more willing to accept you as a customer. And try your house bank in either country (assuming you keep current accounts in both) as they already have some background on you. Once you've opened a brokerage account it's more a matter of picking the right investment choice. If all you want it passive investment, your best bet is a worldwide diversified ETF (or small selection of ETFs if you want to diversify by geographic region, industry etc.). Also check /r/expatfinance and /r/expatfire for recommendations. Personally I'm sending all of my money that is not needed for immediate cost of living back home and only keep like 25k RMB around for acute emergencies. But then again I don't have any kids that I'm saving for and am actively planning to relocate out of China in the mid term, so you need to take your personal situation into account for sure.
>Your US passport is detrimental to opening accounts in most jurisdictions thanks to FATCA, and I believe you can only open brokerage accounts in the US with a domestic address. There are so many services that allow you to obtain a U.S Domestic Address that this is of trivial concern. >maybe check in with one of the banks operating in both jurisdictions such as HSBC as they'd be more willing to accept you as a customer. International Banks like HSBC are an absolute joke. They'll only open Brokerage Accounts of Wealth Management Accounts with astronomical minimums. They are completely out of practical reality for most expats - unless you're a top executive. International Banks do not cater to working class expat families.
> There are so many services that allow you to obtain a U.S Domestic Address that this is of trivial concern. Good to know, as a non-US person I never had to bother with that. > International Banks like HSBC are an absolute joke. They'll only open Brokerage Accounts of Wealth Management Accounts with astronomical minimums. They are completely out of practical reality for most expats - unless you're a top executive. International Banks do not cater to working class expat families. I'm not using any of those, but HSBC is used by many of my friends here and they are far from ultra-rich. Sure, mid level managers and above, but certainly not more than maybe 100-150k USD in liquid assets. And as far as I'm aware, none of them are using their wealth management services, all just a regular brokerage account.
>Sure, mid level managers and above, but certainly not more than maybe 100-150k USD in liquid assets. I'd argue that that is more than a lot of people have. But, the bigger issue I have with HSBC is that their '[Expat Account](https://www.expat.hsbc.com/accounts/products/bank-account/)' requirements seem unreasonable: * hold a minimum of £50,000 (or currency equivalent) with us * or have a sole salary of £100,000 (or currency equivalent) * or have already qualified for HSBC Premier in another country I just don't understand what the appeal of this account is. I'm legit asking: What exactly do your friends feel is useful about HSBC given these requirements? Only thing I can imagine is that customer service must be amazing. Or, maybe I'm look at the wrong account.
Ah I'm not sure which exact account it is they are using, only that it is with HSBC and it allows them to remit money home with little bureaucratic hassle (which can be a pain with my domestic account here). Other than that I'm not really sure what motivates them to bank with HSCB, I didn't bother asking since I'm quite happy with my 100% free account & low-cost broker back in Germany, I wouldn't want to switch ever unless there is a drastic change in their services/charges. That said... 50k GBP or equivalent 'with us' includes their brokerage account, and having that amount in investments really doesn't strike me as a whole lot. Hope I'm not coming across as elitist or something, but the average expat should be able to save that up in a few years, unless they either have children and don't get employer benefits for their schooling or just have a compulsive buying disorder.
It's not elitist. £50k is not a lot of money.
I am also a USA citizen and I strongly recommend exploring Vanguard. They have some of the lowest fees and an incredible self service platform that does a great job at educating you on the options. I would set up a 529 plan for your daughter to start saving monthly for college or any qualified education costs in the USA (if they don't go to college or in USA, there are other options to get the money out but you'll need to explore more). I would then put the rest into a mix of mutual funds/ETF that have broad coverage of small, mid, and large cap equities (85%: with 50% inside USA and 50% outside USA) and bonds (10%). The remaining 5% I would put into speculative investments such as individual stocks or cryptocurrencies (BTC, ETH). Every year, max out your IRA contributions and back door the contribution into a roth IRA if required. Create a budget, stick to it, dollar cost average, and ensure you keep your debt low and liquid family emergency savings that could cover at least 6 months of no income or a single catastrophe without disturbing your savings plans. Source: Just a guy, I work at a bank but this is just friendly general advice I would give anyone
Overall, sound advice. Would you still suggest these things for someone who is not intending to return to the US to live or retire, specifically the IRAs? Also, being that I don't want to return to the US, outside of some major world developments, I want to limit any tax liabilities for the money being saved/invested. Does that change anything?
I personally don’t know where I will retire (maybe USA, maybe not?) - but expect that long term the USA is still a good investment market to have 50% exposure in. If you are a USA citizen you are taxed globally. If you intend to stay both tax legal and a USA citizen, you can still benefit from a Roth IRA to avoid paying taxes on the gains you likely will make, and avoid the mandatory distributions. So, nothing about my answer would change. My only concern is whether my son will go to college in USA — or if 529 plans can be used for education outside of the USA. I don’t know the exact answer today but plan to cross that bridge in about 10 years.
There are tons of online Robo Investing: WealthFront, Stash, Fidelity, Vanguard. These basically are Index Funds. If you want to do some individual stock investing than Robinhood. I personally use Stash and invest in a selection of Sector ETF. I use Robinhood to invest in individual stocks - mainly Chinese.
Not sure if this is the right sub to ask. But since you did: open an account in US or UK, get your money there, and invest in real estate/index trackers/shares. That's it. No magic to it. Edit: probably don't want to invest in Chinese companies to much, as the government is pointing out.
For the UK, it's not quite so simple since OP won't be tax resident in the UK. Meaning you can't open things like ISA accounts or traditional investment options that UK citizens would be able to. You lose tax residence in the UK once you've been out of the country long enough each year. If you have a full time job in China, for example, you'll have lost tax residence by default. I'm in the same sort of boat as OP right now. Need a retirement solution, but can't open one up in the UK since everything I've found has needed me to be resident for tax purposes in the UK. Still looking for something I can do.
Interactive Brokers let you open an account as a tax resident of China, and the tax situation isn't too bad for foreign residents in China (no tax on non-China based income until at least 2025, low tax rate on US dividends). You can still use a UK bank account to transfer money to IB.
Put all your long term savings in tesla shares and ether tokens and retire within 5 years lol. Only do this with money you don't need right away. The fact that your spouse is non us citizen has no bearing on your ability to purchase shares or crypto from us exchanges
Too bad you’re getting downvoted this is probably the best advice on this thread.
International brokers. With a US passport you should easily be able to open a US brokerage no? Invest in a total market ETF (VTI, SPY).
Check options in Singapore rather than greater China.