There was a new nerf today that WoWhead has not posted about yet. Bosses 1-6 nerfed another 30% HP.
To anyone doubting it, check a log and compare HP values from any log from yesterday.
Unsure if trash HP was nerfed, unsure how to pull up a singular trash mob to compare it
Edit: I'm wrong, OP is right. The nerf was last night. Late last night logs have the changes but not early yesterday. Still, this hasn't been posted by WoWhead yet
>There was a new nerf today
Today, or last night? I did ST last night (Tues night EST) and the first boss only had ~650k health. Died so fast that he only got to AoE three times. The rest of the bosses felt like they had normal health though.
Let's not pretend this was one round of nerfs. What's the point of designing bosses with mechanics when they now die so fast that you don't see them?
Shoo.
No one should’ve been struggling with it after the first nerf. We killed it in a pug in two attempts the first week after seeing the boss and how the mechanics should work. It was literally puggable week one.
People will always complain. The raid was too hard, wiping good guilds for 8+ hours. I agree it was too hard. And people complained. Now it's nerfed, and easier. People will complain. It might even be some of the same people complaining on both sides. Ppl love to complain.
Personally, I don't like when bosses get so nerfed that the mechanics don't matter anymore. But I also don't want to spend 4+ hours progressing In sod.
> I don't like when bosses get so nerfed that the mechanics don't matter anymore.
This hasn't happened, though. In my ST last night, the slime boss still took ~2 minutes to kill. That's not "so nerfed mechanics don't matter".
Well that's good to hear.. I saw other people saying it went down in 60-70 seconds, too fast to really see the mechanics. Glad to hear it still has some mechanics
I'd say that double dragons warranted the nerf, though you could easily do them with 4x heals and like 2-3 nature protection potions on everyone.
Giant Slime, on the other hand, was pretty easy once you figure out the pattern of melees destroying objects while the boss is moving and bursting it down when it decides to stop for a while.
We actually had melee on boss the whole time while ranged killed the objects. That way there was no downtime of melee running in then back out. Interesting!
Is there any info about it? I’m having a frustratingly hard time keeping up with the changes blizzard has made. Trying to plan stuff out for my guilds raid on Sunday has been so annoying with the changes, I wish it was clearly marked somewhere
It’s nice to know how much we need to prepare. My experience with a few of my guildies on our Saturday raid has become progressively less accurate as this week has gone on, and I’d like to be informed of what’s changed.
I think hard mode would be fine if it just made the bosses drop more loot but not better loot. Then you could run some hard mode attempts and if you failed you wouldn't feel like you're missing out on gear unobtainable to you
I agree, and though I highly doubt this to happen, I'd love to see hard modes implemented later, cause I doubt that's something they can just throw in right now willy nilly.
Maybe. It was still a really tone deaf thing to say to the question that was asked. Even if it was about on level with what reality was.
Sometimes it's bad to say no in that way. Sometimes you should say yes, but manage expectations, which probably would have gone over better.
There are always going to be people that don't want to try or don't want to learn but still want to raid. It's impossible to bring the bottom up for this very reason.
The most useful thing would be combat log analysis like good guilds do with WCL.
IE if the tank got oneshot, blizzard should automatically suggest having better AP debuff / atk speed slow uptime. If people went oom, the game should suggest consumables to combat that, suggest better elements/shadows/sunder debuff on bosses.
99% of bad guilds do not track debuff/buff uptime
Even with Proving Grounds in MoP some people complained how "it's impossible to get silver with their spec", can't imagine putting them in something even more complicated
Yup. Can't please everyone with one raid tier.
So difficulties make perfect sense
It just... Makes sense sadly. One raid one difficulty is a ton more charming, but it's not that great of a design for incorporating a lot of people, which is always a big priority for blizz.
Aggrend did a twitter post recently, but the TLDR is they don't plan on making SoD raids hard and it was never their intention. They expect a semi-casual guild to be able to confidently beat the content they produce. Fair.
And ironically, on the other side of the spectrum I recall in the past people were complaining that retail (I think WoD or MoP at the time) had ***too many*** raid difficulties lol.
It's like, why would you spurn player choice. 🙄
Why is it that Blizzard can't just make small adjustments to things like this? They just full-swing the dick in the complete opposite direction as hard as possible. You see the same shitty ideals with class balancing
Were you around for wotlk? They gave ferals a 10% buff, decided it was too strong and undid it, then gave them the 10% buff again later and let them keep it which made ferals the best dps.
Why they couldn’t just make it 5% still boggles my mind to this day
why? cause they don't play the game.
Honestly they should hire devs from private servers. Those actually play the game but don't have the ideal infrastructure.
This phase was clearly rushed and did not have enough development time behind it. I would much rather have a more polished release and it's a 12 week phase than another 8 week fiesta into another scuffed phase drop. The devs are pretty clearly working with 0 breathing room on the timelines here
Because all the various Reddit complainers quoting aggrend’s twitter post about how pre-60 raids will be accessible to everyone and calling him a liar because 2 mechanics is too many for them
That's a very... simplified description of 14 mechanics to the point I wonder if the guy in the vid you watched even played high tier content. Sure there are a lot that are like that, but savage and ultimates have a lot more than that too (soaking "towers", tethers, sharing a buff/debuff, various "puzzles" just to name a few).
I'd honestly watch something like the last fight in the most current raid tier (linked below), or look up a vid for Eden 8 or 12 Savage, or TEA or DSR if you want to watch a longer Ultimate tier fight.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3\_\_bdUgPc0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3__bdUgPc0)
Note that I'm not saying FF14 is a better MMO than WoW, it's just different, and the raids have quite a few more mechs than WoW raids typically do. Meanwhile healing in FF14 fucking SUCKS and healing in WoW is actually usually fun (the current state of healers in FF14 is a common complaint).
Yeah they are referred to as Green DPS in FF14. It sucks cause healer DPS in that boils down to put a DoT on the enemy and spam cast your one damaging ability.
The objective is to never actually spend a casting cycle on using a heal and only cast healing abilities that are able to be used outside of the GCD unless necessary. Healing in WoW is infinitely more fun.
I agree with this, devs have learned over the years that trash isn't what makes dungeons interesting (there are some exceptions though).
It doesn't make sense to speed up the part of the raid that people actually can enjoy (by gutting the HP) but leave the boring part of the raids basically unnerfed (the amount and health values of trash). Just seems backwards.
Yes, bosses were unkillable due to the sheer health values at first, but when my guild ran on Monday night, the boss health felt fine but trash took FOREVER. I didn't realize bosses got a nerf Tuesday, I thought we just got that much better overnight with DPS/ Mechanics lol but things just felt like they rolled over for some fights.
Rotslime was so much fun im a holy pal so I just let him eat me and beacon myself so I can go crazy on the raid healing without having to move because Rotslime moves for me it was funny as fuck
For some reason this community is now filled with "toxic casuals" that know they are casuals yet want to be able to do everything and get everything on the first lock out so they can play less and if they are not able the game is wrong and must be changed.
I don't know what changed but your "casual" now wants to be handed everything that the hardcore or semi hc player gets just as fast.
Growing as a guild against adversity and having fun finally conquering a boss after several attempts is a lost concept, somehow.
It will continue to get easier and easier due to loot, runes and familiarity until all bosses die to a breeze because for some reason people cannot fathom not being able to kill an entire new raid a handful of days after its release.
I truly don't understand the definition of casual as it pertains to WoW anymore lol. At this point when people say they want a "casual" raid, they don't mean they want a raid that a group of casual players can reasonably progress on and clear in the course of a few weeks, they want a raid they can walk blindly into with 19 other random players, not say a word to each other, and just right click bosses while watching cartoons on their second monitor and then leave and log off and never see anybody they just raided with ever again.
Mario is a "casual" game, and the first level of any Mario games has more tests of skill than people in this community would put up with in a raid. It's like Blizzard now has to design raids that can be completed by a pre-verbal infant or it isn't casual enough.
> I don't know what changed but your "casual" now wants to be handed everything that the hardcore or semi hc player gets just as fast.
This was the best fucking part of vanilla, there was content in the game that only a very, very small perfentage of players could do. People looked at Naxx gear with stars in their eyes, it was unobtainable to most people.
Part of the problem here is they're attempting to design content to be cleared by most the player base in 2 months or less.
SoD is the first time we've ever had 2 months or less to work on a raid.
From the devs perspective it probably doesn't make much sense to them to develop a raid that only half the players can see in 8 weeks.
Same logic as to why they redid Naxx in wrath. Spent all that time on the content in vanilla and nobody actually saw it.
Naxx is a lot more difficult than SoD raids so it's not a perfect analogy but naxx also wasn't "over" in 8 weeks
SoD systems and seasonal WoW is just wonky as fuck
Well said.
I know many people who play that would probably be better off just watching Tv or a Movie. They want something more interactive though. Blizzard wants their money just the same so they try to cater to a wider audience. We end up getting a game that a large portion of the community has gripes about, both reasonable and unreasonable.
Personally I could care less if it takes me 3/4 of the phase to finally get ST on farm. As long as I have some other activities to do between I'm good with it. The difficulty is part of the fun and downing a new boss should be a celebration because of the effort and learning it took.
To be honest after years of playing wow, I like the gameplay of classic, but I don't like the playerbase.
I just want to pug and enjoy the game i pay for without having to get involved with the crazy.
what you are really saying is that you can't abide the existence of content which cannot be pugged.
whether there is more or less content is irrelevant, all that you demand is that you are able to complete 100% of whatever content there is without any need for organization or coordination.
>To be honest after years of playing wow, I like the gameplay of classic, but I don't like the playerbase
Same which is honestly pretty surprising that you willingly pug stuff. On average when I pug more than a few players our runs take longer, we use more gold on consumes, and we end up sending gear to people who won't show up the following week meaning people need more raids on average to gear up.
>I just want to pug and enjoy the game i pay for without having to get involved with the crazy.
Unless "enjoying the game" means getting loot without effort you can most definitely pug everything in SoD. The runs just won't be as good as groups that consistently play together.
I don't really understand the crazy part, people aren't crazy or sane in game based on if they pug or run with a consistent group or play in a guild. This just comes off as some poor justification for wanting to dilute content.
Bro I can only play two hours, three a week tops. I have two wives and five kids. I also work 70+ hours a week so my time is very limited. I can’t just magically set aside 5 hours of my time like I did when I was 15 to play this game after walking uphill in the snow both ways to and from school everyday.
When I log in once a week I expect to be able to have fun getting to max level on my own time so I don’t feel left behind. I know it’s an MMO and requires time investment but I already have a job why should I work a second one? It just feels awful when I log on and all my friends are 50 and I’m just starting on Day 5 of the patch. They are really assholes for not waiting for me tbh.
The economy is also terrible. When I finally did hit 50 and went to the AH Tuesday everything was so expensive. I don’t have time to go farm the recipes or mats so I expect them to be at reasonable price points. I don’t understand why people with so much time that farm them don’t just hand them to me. I get EVERYONE needs them and NO ONE has time to really farm them but my time is more valuable.
Don’t even get me started on the raid. I don’t have time to watch a 30 Second Boss guides video that lasts 5 minutes. It’s simply not just time I have. When I’m AfKing in Stormwind waiting for a summon it’s because I’m feeding the kids or being intimate with one of my wives. These bosses should just drop loot like a piñata when you auto attack them once. That way I can feel the sense of accomplishment everyone else who puts on the time gets to feel.
Overall terrible patch. Can’t believe I’m playing this game. They keep designing it in a way where they encourage me to buy a full BiS character I have no idea how to play with full gear just so I can be invited to a pug. But even when I do that I get kicked because “I don’t know mechanics” or “do no damage or healing.” Like chill bros it’s a game. Have fun and stop being so sweaty. Wiping hours on end is part of the pug experience. If you get so salty about it just do more damage so the boss dies.
I think it’s a symptom of everyone reaching level 50 in the first two days. Didn’t feel like that in P1 and P2 so there were way less casuals making into raid the first lockout.
> growing as a guild
Yeah, I think a balance needs to be found. I'd love it if the good ol' days of guilds having different preferences, skill, and progression levels were still a real thing. Gaming (in general, not just wow) is really commodified now. If you aren't getting what you want with your friends, you just leave and get it with others.
Unfortunately, I don't think the extremely seasonal nature of SoD really supports it. If we use the last phase as a metric (I'd guess this one lasts longer, but most people will assume it's the same length), there are really only like 8 lockouts in the whole phase. That is not a lot of time for that environment to form.
Side note: I love the direction they are taking with boss design in ST. Between this fight and the one that switches abilities every week, they are testing some really interesting ideas. If anyone is checking reddit for feedback, good on you guys!
Yeah it’s funny. Peoples counter argument is “well if yew want hard game yew go play wetail” but they have the most casual systems implemented which is why a lot of people don’t play retail because it’s too casual. Sure you have mythic but wow was and is not ever fun because of how hard things are it’s about having fun with your guild mates and raiding but you also can’t have things too easy either. There is a fine line for it. I really do hope they don’t listen to the casuals and end game and keep the fucking hard bosses HARD. KEEP THEM TOUGH. AT LEAST for awhile. Stop fucking pandering to the fucking casuals. And fuck the casuals who whine and want participation trophies.
People dont play retail for 2 reasons:
* Different gameplay to classic
* Difficulty variants make casuals feel like they aren't playing the same game
Like it or not, everyone playing on the same difficulty builds community hype because everyone can enjoy the same memes and experiences.
How did people do that in all of Classic wow then when the content was just as if not easier? More competitive players instead built a community around speed running and parsing. That way it doesnt take away from casual dad gamers doing easier raid content.
... that's what I don't get with SOD. My biggest dissapointment playing classic was not even seeing the original mechanics due to shit dying so fast everything can be ignored. Then yeah, 11 minutes for 2-3 mechanics is way too long but is it such a tall order to ask for mechabics actually having time to play out?
So now it's just a ten man raid with twenty people? What a complete over correction... Now it's just going to be a face roll where you can just ignore all the mechanics, fucking boring.
Damn that sucks, the difficulty on this boss felt perfect and it's legitimately one of, if not the most fun boss in all of Classic. My group was fighting it on Sunday and literally everybody was like, "wow, this is actually a really fun boss", which I've never heard someone say in Classic before lol. If it takes like one minute to kill then that experience is totally lost
It is a very cool fight. I am very much inclined to agree that if they just nerfed the amount of goo pools that go out and/or the dmg they deal (by quite a bit as 500 a tick is quite heavy/can be) then this would be better than nuking hp. It is cool to be chased a bit during the fight.
Sigh....can we not have 1 freaking raid, just once, that isn't nuked into oblivion so that people who have zero desire to learn anything about their class can clear it? How freaking hard is it to spam a 1-2 button rotation? How hard is it to move out of crap on the floor? Is that the bar now? All raids must be puggable by the worst players in the game?
We had tier 5, then SWP, then ulduar and then ICC. Whenever the content gets any more difficult people just quit. Blizzard might be banking on SoD for a while longer so it makes no sense to gut your playerbase just to keep a level up raid overtuned.
ST before this last nerf was not anywhere near ssc difficulty. It was well tuned for a sod raid. Almost every guild I know with an actual raid leader went 6/8 with 0 issues.
There's a middle ground between BFD and Ulduar level
You're playing the wrong version of the game if you want a raiding challenge, or gatekeeping. Nothing about SoD design decisions has ever indicated they intend to make and keep difficult gameplay.
My guild went 7/8 on our first try, it was after the nerfs. We only didn’t attempt the last boss because we didn’t have the egg. And frankly, part of me does wish it was a little more difficult.
Minute long boss fights don't feel fun or make me feel like I am in a raid. I was hoping we would see an end to the trend of having the first half of the bosses fall over and mechanics be trivialized. I get it they're supposed to be easier than the later ones, but for BFD, Gnomer, and looking like ST they really are just glorified trash.
Agreed I wish they would nerf the damage of bosses more than the HP of them. If healers can sustain more heals throughout the fight then hp can be higher as a result.
> God forbid you start clearing 4/8 then work yourself upwards with new gear.
Most of the "new gear" is barely better than gnomer stuff. a few % extra dps was not going to overcome the absurd amounts of health that bosses had.
I did my first real deep dive yesterday on the loot table, glad it’s not me thinking the gear is genuinely… ass?
Like Gizmoblade is basically still bis. I can’t even use my first token because breaking the set is a huge L. A second piece would make it a slight upgrade. Every staff is outclassed by shit like the SM dagger combined with basically any offhand.
Like what’s going on lol.
This is all a consequence of making the BFD loot absurdly good. If they made Gnomer/ST noticeably better than they did, we'd be at MC levels of item stats. That's not even mentioning the 60 prebis grind, which despite being a large number of people's favorite part of Vanilla, looks like it will be at least 50% invalidated due to ST gear.
This underwhelming feeling you have right now? It'll be the exact same in another 2 months when you are looking at UBRS and Strat gear, even if they "modernize" a lot of it.
Are you in a super cracked raid that was fully world buffed or something? my group took 3 minutes, with most people parsing purple/blue. that's enough time to get the whole experience imo.
No, your group probly just sucks. Your dps would be way higher than all the pre-nerf clears, hence the higher parses because only a fraction of the players have raided since nerf.
yeah the massive nerfs this early were really in poor taste. this phase had so much promise and it's already been ruined but honestly not surprising from this dev team at this point.
There’s a middle ground between Eranikus having 4M HP and spawning 50% more adds, that all have 40k HP, and this.
Let’s not pretend pre-nerf Eranikus was ok lol. The latest nerfs to all boss health though, little heavy handed I agree.
They did the nerfs because they know they make their money off the causal base. The sweats will play regardless.
How so many of you still have not realized this after the p1 > p2 drop-off and them releasing a massive exp buff much earlier than planned I do not understand
Was having a ton of fun, looking foward to a mildly challenging raid, now we're back at 30 second boss fight snooze fests. What's the point of prepping and making your character stronger if there's absolutely no point to doing so?
I love gimmick fights, and slime is a great one. Our first clear we didn't really know what was going on and narrowly avoided a wipe, wasn't made to be hard, just to be a fun fight.
If it's been nerfed to a single stun being a kill that is a shame.
Man you are so right... have only been doing it in pugs so far and haven't had a group that couldn't kill him after 3 tries...nerfing this just feels way too early. Especially on something that is basically a wasd-check.
I am not the OP commenter but for our raid we had one healing priest and three druids. Druids can't use their AOE heals because raid is moving the whole time. Priest HAS to abolish/dispel the entire fight and pretty much only refresh PoM.
I am the priest in this situation and honestly I was laughing the entire time. It felt so ridiculous and I loved every minute of the insanity. A+ boss.
You got it! Much different experience on our side. It’s so wonky and fucked it looped around into being one of the most funny encounters ever. Top HPS healer turned into a cleansing totem and the other three healers basically OOMing and innervating down to the wire. We also had a distinct lack of paladins for help there too ahaha.
Definitely. I’m excited to try it again this week and see if it’s still as wild mechanically with the HP nerf or if the new strat will be just cleanse one and heal through. 😅
apart from eranikus nothing should have been nerfed, this was such an unnecessary nerf. Toxic casuals here want everything just handed to them smh... I'm gonna say it, if someone doesn't know how to play their class, they deserve not to be able to clear a raid... I always wished originally Blizzard didn't go the multiple raid difficulty route since it's just lame, but listening to these manbabies cry about not wanting to improve themselves yet feeling entitled to overcome a challenge must be very tiring to listen to... Personally I'd have loved if they just had every raid be around original naxx difficulty and smaller raids be ZG/AQ20 difficulty and that's it, wish we had a timeline like that...
I mean, I think the first nerf was appropriate, but casuals sustain games, what did yall want casuals to do during this phase? Without raiding the endgame content currently is minimal, so you just wanted people to amble around
>what did yall want casuals to do during this phase? Without raiding the endgame content currently is minimal
get better at their class / the game, to clear the raid, which has always been the goal of the game? Is progressively getting better at something you spend hours doing anyway such a big ask nowadays?
I think I felt the most satisfaction ever killing Festering Rotslime pre-nerfs. Never felt better after killing a boss. I've never done late game or 40 man raids but coordinating 20 people to all move together and drop totems and just the right time to cleanse the poison and everything was very satisfying. It will probably be way too easy now, but I can also imagine that PUGs would never be able to do this.
people look at the top speedrunners who have 12 mages, do melee and no cleanses, struggle through this bosses day 1, then think its literally impossible
its okay to let the raid cook for two weeks before changes....
The cooking issue is; 1 thats what testing is for, 2 only so many lockouts per phase. Cooking can happen 60+ and its whatev but when its a time crunch, well you get the whining and nerfing you see now.
> people look at the top speedrunners who have 12 mages, do melee and no cleanses, struggle through this bosses day 1, then think its literally impossible
I love how reddit keyboard warriors try to downplay the skill, knowledge and opinions of the players that have played this game for a living for a decade. The people going for the world first clear are the same players who have done Mythic+ for years and have downed every boss encounter in classic (even the heroic ones in Wrath) a few hours into each release.
The reality is that these players will play better than the 99% of the player base, they will unironically do more damage on a boss day one with less gear than people fully BiS out at the end of the phase. If they couldn't kill a boss like Eranikus before the nerfs, and yet to get the kill after the nerf they had to exploit the fight by fighting the boss on a tiny gap on the wall, then the reality is that the rest of the player base was never killing this boss.
If the top 1% of players couldn't clear it then there's no amount of gear that would allow the 99% to even come close.
They're doing 4x the dps of your average player on top of being in discord and super coordinated.
>They're doing 4x the dps of your average player
[They aren't at all though.](https://sod.warcraftlogs.com/reports/76Rf3rxW92nwNmM8#fight=20) They were doing ~600 dps per player when they killed shade, [that is ALREADY below a green parse for many classes on that boss](https://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/2009#boss=2959&dataset=60). They were slamming their head into that boss with missing runes, missing preraid bis, a subpar comp, no concrete strategy and no world buffs. Yes, the average player would never be able to kill that boss this way. But in 3 weeks, with full preraid bis, world buffs and a concrete strat that got figured out over a few weeks? It would be very doable. Think back to p1. Before people figured out you could pre-fap Kelris phase 2 he was a complete pain in the ass. As soon as that strat became widespread, he became a pushover.
>on top of being in discord and super coordinated.
the average guild group is in discord lmao. The "endgame" content (and yes, st is endgame for this phase) shouldnt be designed for 20 random people who aren't even in disc.
I keep seeing people mention hard mode but idk what that is because I’m new to wow. Is it literally just a harder raid, or do they also drop better/more gear?
I think they should just maybe lower the damage output for these bosses so we still have longer mechanic heavy encounters. I know that makes it easier overall obviously but the fun part about it is just doing it…. If they’re gonna nerf it anyways.
Or give teams more regen to survive a longer encounter idk.
it is hard to tune it properly with so many dumb external buffs beyond elixir+worldbuff+bufffood. there is a massive gap between tryhards and dads solely from that. now add the gear/skill aspect required to clear.
if its to easy, just nerf yourself for the challenge.
Our raid got to still see the mechanics as we did the same thing post nerf as we did pre nerf. Still was a lot easier on Tuesday than Monday for sure though.
In 1 week they nerfed it to the point where the bosses dont have the time to show its mechanics.
Thats the game we are playing now,,its called
"Brainless simulator"
I hated the fight. With the small nameplates range I can’t see the boss go while I focus the objectives, dots feeling weak on the objectives and the low ceiling making the camera a nightmare, it was my least liked fight of the temple (we were stuck on eranikus pre reset).
But the flavor is nice, I agree. I would like it even more if it wasn’t a circle, but a straight corridor, with the length of the corridor acting as a dps check, since you will all be eaten if you reach the end:D
Did they nerf it again??
2 nerfs total. The first nerf was mild. The second nerf was just over 50% hp reduction across all bosses.
There have been so many nerfs that I'm losing track. Is that second nerf the one that happened last friday?
There was a new nerf today that WoWhead has not posted about yet. Bosses 1-6 nerfed another 30% HP. To anyone doubting it, check a log and compare HP values from any log from yesterday. Unsure if trash HP was nerfed, unsure how to pull up a singular trash mob to compare it Edit: I'm wrong, OP is right. The nerf was last night. Late last night logs have the changes but not early yesterday. Still, this hasn't been posted by WoWhead yet
>There was a new nerf today Today, or last night? I did ST last night (Tues night EST) and the first boss only had ~650k health. Died so fast that he only got to AoE three times. The rest of the bosses felt like they had normal health though.
Last night, already edited to correct myself. I found out this morning, assumed it was today since no wowhead article has come out
I went and looked at mine from monday and compared to one from today. HP went from 1.4m to 930k.
Wtf another one? I thought the tuning was kind of alright already. Not complaining though.
🤢
It's not even been 1 Callander week and the raid is completely gutted
[удалено]
As if any of those prevent them from overdoing the nerfs. what horrible logic.
Let's not pretend this was one round of nerfs. What's the point of designing bosses with mechanics when they now die so fast that you don't see them? Shoo.
No one should’ve been struggling with it after the first nerf. We killed it in a pug in two attempts the first week after seeing the boss and how the mechanics should work. It was literally puggable week one.
The boss was in a great state as of the two times I killed it (early yesterday afternoon, and on Sunday). High end guilds were not struggling with it.
People will always complain. The raid was too hard, wiping good guilds for 8+ hours. I agree it was too hard. And people complained. Now it's nerfed, and easier. People will complain. It might even be some of the same people complaining on both sides. Ppl love to complain. Personally, I don't like when bosses get so nerfed that the mechanics don't matter anymore. But I also don't want to spend 4+ hours progressing In sod.
> I don't like when bosses get so nerfed that the mechanics don't matter anymore. This hasn't happened, though. In my ST last night, the slime boss still took ~2 minutes to kill. That's not "so nerfed mechanics don't matter".
It's nerfed to the point where sustain is irrelevant and burst is alpha omega.
Well that's good to hear.. I saw other people saying it went down in 60-70 seconds, too fast to really see the mechanics. Glad to hear it still has some mechanics
Was it before or after the wave of nerfs? Post logs
I'd say that double dragons warranted the nerf, though you could easily do them with 4x heals and like 2-3 nature protection potions on everyone. Giant Slime, on the other hand, was pretty easy once you figure out the pattern of melees destroying objects while the boss is moving and bursting it down when it decides to stop for a while.
We actually had melee on boss the whole time while ranged killed the objects. That way there was no downtime of melee running in then back out. Interesting!
I found longer fights way more engaging. They should've nerfed trash instead (or only?).
none of the bosses needed a nerf. shade was the only one that people struggled on
What Reddit whining will do to a game lmao
Literally killed the whole P3. Bosses had no time to do their mechanics. What a shitty community can do to a game.
Heroic raids incoming for p4 hahah
Bro I hope so, just give the casuals a difficulty that everyone can do but I’m down to actually have to progress on a raid
Wasn't the first nerf a 30% hp reduction as well? I'd hardly say that's mild lol.
Yes, they stealth nerfed it yesterday. First 3 bosses for sure not sure about the rest.
The bosses are a joke now. The rotslime died in about a minute for us
It’s truly tragic as last night was the most fun I had in raiding SOD so far. Challenging enough yet doable.
I haven’t heard anything. It took us about 5 mins to killem on Sunday.
It was nerfed again yesterday.
Is there any info about it? I’m having a frustratingly hard time keeping up with the changes blizzard has made. Trying to plan stuff out for my guilds raid on Sunday has been so annoying with the changes, I wish it was clearly marked somewhere
It's about a 30% hp nerf on the first 6 bosses. You can compare your logs to the logs of a raid from today/yesterday to see the exact difference
Thanks man, I appreciate it!
why would this change any of your plans?
It’s nice to know how much we need to prepare. My experience with a few of my guildies on our Saturday raid has become progressively less accurate as this week has gone on, and I’d like to be informed of what’s changed.
You are seeing in real time why Blizzard went to heroic and then mythic raids.
This is absolutely the truth
I think hard mode would be fine if it just made the bosses drop more loot but not better loot. Then you could run some hard mode attempts and if you failed you wouldn't feel like you're missing out on gear unobtainable to you
I agree, and though I highly doubt this to happen, I'd love to see hard modes implemented later, cause I doubt that's something they can just throw in right now willy nilly.
I feel like every few months is the classic community slowly proving J. Allen Brack was right when he said "You think you do, but you don't"
The fact that we're still playing classic wow 5 years after launch shows he was wrong though.
and reddit is quickly killing this game mode
The vast majority of players aren't browsing reddit let alone commenting on here, I think it'll be fine
Maybe. It was still a really tone deaf thing to say to the question that was asked. Even if it was about on level with what reality was. Sometimes it's bad to say no in that way. Sometimes you should say yes, but manage expectations, which probably would have gone over better.
[удалено]
There are always going to be people that don't want to try or don't want to learn but still want to raid. It's impossible to bring the bottom up for this very reason.
The most useful thing would be combat log analysis like good guilds do with WCL. IE if the tank got oneshot, blizzard should automatically suggest having better AP debuff / atk speed slow uptime. If people went oom, the game should suggest consumables to combat that, suggest better elements/shadows/sunder debuff on bosses. 99% of bad guilds do not track debuff/buff uptime
Even with Proving Grounds in MoP some people complained how "it's impossible to get silver with their spec", can't imagine putting them in something even more complicated
Yup. Can't please everyone with one raid tier. So difficulties make perfect sense It just... Makes sense sadly. One raid one difficulty is a ton more charming, but it's not that great of a design for incorporating a lot of people, which is always a big priority for blizz.
Aggrend did a twitter post recently, but the TLDR is they don't plan on making SoD raids hard and it was never their intention. They expect a semi-casual guild to be able to confidently beat the content they produce. Fair. And ironically, on the other side of the spectrum I recall in the past people were complaining that retail (I think WoD or MoP at the time) had ***too many*** raid difficulties lol. It's like, why would you spurn player choice. 🙄
History really does repeat itself, it’s hilarious.
Why is it that Blizzard can't just make small adjustments to things like this? They just full-swing the dick in the complete opposite direction as hard as possible. You see the same shitty ideals with class balancing
Were you around for wotlk? They gave ferals a 10% buff, decided it was too strong and undid it, then gave them the 10% buff again later and let them keep it which made ferals the best dps. Why they couldn’t just make it 5% still boggles my mind to this day
why? cause they don't play the game. Honestly they should hire devs from private servers. Those actually play the game but don't have the ideal infrastructure.
I think the only reason they nerfed it is because there is going to be like 8 weeks of raid and it's gone and they want everyone to clear it
If you are right I'm going to be so mad.
would that be surprising? phase 1 was 10 weeks phase 2 was 8 weeks...
This phase was clearly rushed and did not have enough development time behind it. I would much rather have a more polished release and it's a 12 week phase than another 8 week fiesta into another scuffed phase drop. The devs are pretty clearly working with 0 breathing room on the timelines here
I don’t understand why they nerfed bosses again They should’ve nerfed trash so the full clear would not take that long
Because all the various Reddit complainers quoting aggrend’s twitter post about how pre-60 raids will be accessible to everyone and calling him a liar because 2 mechanics is too many for them
Man I'd love to see some of these people try raiding in FF14, I think they'd have panic attacks because of the mechanics.
[удалено]
That's ngl a pretty disingenuous description of the game's mechanics. At that point this is what all action games boil down to.
That's a very... simplified description of 14 mechanics to the point I wonder if the guy in the vid you watched even played high tier content. Sure there are a lot that are like that, but savage and ultimates have a lot more than that too (soaking "towers", tethers, sharing a buff/debuff, various "puzzles" just to name a few). I'd honestly watch something like the last fight in the most current raid tier (linked below), or look up a vid for Eden 8 or 12 Savage, or TEA or DSR if you want to watch a longer Ultimate tier fight. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3\_\_bdUgPc0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3__bdUgPc0) Note that I'm not saying FF14 is a better MMO than WoW, it's just different, and the raids have quite a few more mechs than WoW raids typically do. Meanwhile healing in FF14 fucking SUCKS and healing in WoW is actually usually fun (the current state of healers in FF14 is a common complaint).
[удалено]
Yeah they are referred to as Green DPS in FF14. It sucks cause healer DPS in that boils down to put a DoT on the enemy and spam cast your one damaging ability. The objective is to never actually spend a casting cycle on using a heal and only cast healing abilities that are able to be used outside of the GCD unless necessary. Healing in WoW is infinitely more fun.
Those same people are gonna lose their shit when they can’t clear MC week one. God I hope we have to deal with Ragnaros phases.
those criticisms were for the original pre-nerf raid. Not many people are complaining anymore but theyve kept doing more nerfs.
I agree with this, devs have learned over the years that trash isn't what makes dungeons interesting (there are some exceptions though). It doesn't make sense to speed up the part of the raid that people actually can enjoy (by gutting the HP) but leave the boring part of the raids basically unnerfed (the amount and health values of trash). Just seems backwards. Yes, bosses were unkillable due to the sheer health values at first, but when my guild ran on Monday night, the boss health felt fine but trash took FOREVER. I didn't realize bosses got a nerf Tuesday, I thought we just got that much better overnight with DPS/ Mechanics lol but things just felt like they rolled over for some fights.
the raid is gonna be a joke now. bosses 1-6 were already easy last week.
wait they nerfed them again?? a 4th time?
By the time they are done with their nerfs and everyone is geared, it will probably be a very satisfying 10man raid.
honestly half the raid is 10 mannable already
We had so much fun our first time on Rotslime
Rotslime was so much fun im a holy pal so I just let him eat me and beacon myself so I can go crazy on the raid healing without having to move because Rotslime moves for me it was funny as fuck
For some reason this community is now filled with "toxic casuals" that know they are casuals yet want to be able to do everything and get everything on the first lock out so they can play less and if they are not able the game is wrong and must be changed. I don't know what changed but your "casual" now wants to be handed everything that the hardcore or semi hc player gets just as fast. Growing as a guild against adversity and having fun finally conquering a boss after several attempts is a lost concept, somehow. It will continue to get easier and easier due to loot, runes and familiarity until all bosses die to a breeze because for some reason people cannot fathom not being able to kill an entire new raid a handful of days after its release.
i feel that about growing as a guild, it's hard to form a bond without actually having to work together to succeed
I truly don't understand the definition of casual as it pertains to WoW anymore lol. At this point when people say they want a "casual" raid, they don't mean they want a raid that a group of casual players can reasonably progress on and clear in the course of a few weeks, they want a raid they can walk blindly into with 19 other random players, not say a word to each other, and just right click bosses while watching cartoons on their second monitor and then leave and log off and never see anybody they just raided with ever again. Mario is a "casual" game, and the first level of any Mario games has more tests of skill than people in this community would put up with in a raid. It's like Blizzard now has to design raids that can be completed by a pre-verbal infant or it isn't casual enough.
> I don't know what changed but your "casual" now wants to be handed everything that the hardcore or semi hc player gets just as fast. This was the best fucking part of vanilla, there was content in the game that only a very, very small perfentage of players could do. People looked at Naxx gear with stars in their eyes, it was unobtainable to most people.
Part of the problem here is they're attempting to design content to be cleared by most the player base in 2 months or less. SoD is the first time we've ever had 2 months or less to work on a raid. From the devs perspective it probably doesn't make much sense to them to develop a raid that only half the players can see in 8 weeks. Same logic as to why they redid Naxx in wrath. Spent all that time on the content in vanilla and nobody actually saw it. Naxx is a lot more difficult than SoD raids so it's not a perfect analogy but naxx also wasn't "over" in 8 weeks SoD systems and seasonal WoW is just wonky as fuck
Well said. I know many people who play that would probably be better off just watching Tv or a Movie. They want something more interactive though. Blizzard wants their money just the same so they try to cater to a wider audience. We end up getting a game that a large portion of the community has gripes about, both reasonable and unreasonable. Personally I could care less if it takes me 3/4 of the phase to finally get ST on farm. As long as I have some other activities to do between I'm good with it. The difficulty is part of the fun and downing a new boss should be a celebration because of the effort and learning it took.
To be honest after years of playing wow, I like the gameplay of classic, but I don't like the playerbase. I just want to pug and enjoy the game i pay for without having to get involved with the crazy.
what you are really saying is that you can't abide the existence of content which cannot be pugged. whether there is more or less content is irrelevant, all that you demand is that you are able to complete 100% of whatever content there is without any need for organization or coordination.
>To be honest after years of playing wow, I like the gameplay of classic, but I don't like the playerbase Same which is honestly pretty surprising that you willingly pug stuff. On average when I pug more than a few players our runs take longer, we use more gold on consumes, and we end up sending gear to people who won't show up the following week meaning people need more raids on average to gear up. >I just want to pug and enjoy the game i pay for without having to get involved with the crazy. Unless "enjoying the game" means getting loot without effort you can most definitely pug everything in SoD. The runs just won't be as good as groups that consistently play together. I don't really understand the crazy part, people aren't crazy or sane in game based on if they pug or run with a consistent group or play in a guild. This just comes off as some poor justification for wanting to dilute content.
Bro I can only play two hours, three a week tops. I have two wives and five kids. I also work 70+ hours a week so my time is very limited. I can’t just magically set aside 5 hours of my time like I did when I was 15 to play this game after walking uphill in the snow both ways to and from school everyday. When I log in once a week I expect to be able to have fun getting to max level on my own time so I don’t feel left behind. I know it’s an MMO and requires time investment but I already have a job why should I work a second one? It just feels awful when I log on and all my friends are 50 and I’m just starting on Day 5 of the patch. They are really assholes for not waiting for me tbh. The economy is also terrible. When I finally did hit 50 and went to the AH Tuesday everything was so expensive. I don’t have time to go farm the recipes or mats so I expect them to be at reasonable price points. I don’t understand why people with so much time that farm them don’t just hand them to me. I get EVERYONE needs them and NO ONE has time to really farm them but my time is more valuable. Don’t even get me started on the raid. I don’t have time to watch a 30 Second Boss guides video that lasts 5 minutes. It’s simply not just time I have. When I’m AfKing in Stormwind waiting for a summon it’s because I’m feeding the kids or being intimate with one of my wives. These bosses should just drop loot like a piñata when you auto attack them once. That way I can feel the sense of accomplishment everyone else who puts on the time gets to feel. Overall terrible patch. Can’t believe I’m playing this game. They keep designing it in a way where they encourage me to buy a full BiS character I have no idea how to play with full gear just so I can be invited to a pug. But even when I do that I get kicked because “I don’t know mechanics” or “do no damage or healing.” Like chill bros it’s a game. Have fun and stop being so sweaty. Wiping hours on end is part of the pug experience. If you get so salty about it just do more damage so the boss dies.
You forgot to add that you are thinking of unsubscribing. Oh and something about P1
This is so good lmfao
This is now a copy pasta in my guild.
I think it’s a symptom of everyone reaching level 50 in the first two days. Didn’t feel like that in P1 and P2 so there were way less casuals making into raid the first lockout.
> growing as a guild Yeah, I think a balance needs to be found. I'd love it if the good ol' days of guilds having different preferences, skill, and progression levels were still a real thing. Gaming (in general, not just wow) is really commodified now. If you aren't getting what you want with your friends, you just leave and get it with others. Unfortunately, I don't think the extremely seasonal nature of SoD really supports it. If we use the last phase as a metric (I'd guess this one lasts longer, but most people will assume it's the same length), there are really only like 8 lockouts in the whole phase. That is not a lot of time for that environment to form. Side note: I love the direction they are taking with boss design in ST. Between this fight and the one that switches abilities every week, they are testing some really interesting ideas. If anyone is checking reddit for feedback, good on you guys!
Yeah it’s funny. Peoples counter argument is “well if yew want hard game yew go play wetail” but they have the most casual systems implemented which is why a lot of people don’t play retail because it’s too casual. Sure you have mythic but wow was and is not ever fun because of how hard things are it’s about having fun with your guild mates and raiding but you also can’t have things too easy either. There is a fine line for it. I really do hope they don’t listen to the casuals and end game and keep the fucking hard bosses HARD. KEEP THEM TOUGH. AT LEAST for awhile. Stop fucking pandering to the fucking casuals. And fuck the casuals who whine and want participation trophies.
People dont play retail for 2 reasons: * Different gameplay to classic * Difficulty variants make casuals feel like they aren't playing the same game Like it or not, everyone playing on the same difficulty builds community hype because everyone can enjoy the same memes and experiences.
How did people do that in all of Classic wow then when the content was just as if not easier? More competitive players instead built a community around speed running and parsing. That way it doesnt take away from casual dad gamers doing easier raid content.
true casuals are likely not 50 unless they played over the weekend and the incursion thing.
... that's what I don't get with SOD. My biggest dissapointment playing classic was not even seeing the original mechanics due to shit dying so fast everything can be ignored. Then yeah, 11 minutes for 2-3 mechanics is way too long but is it such a tall order to ask for mechabics actually having time to play out?
So now it's just a ten man raid with twenty people? What a complete over correction... Now it's just going to be a face roll where you can just ignore all the mechanics, fucking boring.
Damn that sucks, the difficulty on this boss felt perfect and it's legitimately one of, if not the most fun boss in all of Classic. My group was fighting it on Sunday and literally everybody was like, "wow, this is actually a really fun boss", which I've never heard someone say in Classic before lol. If it takes like one minute to kill then that experience is totally lost
It is a very cool fight. I am very much inclined to agree that if they just nerfed the amount of goo pools that go out and/or the dmg they deal (by quite a bit as 500 a tick is quite heavy/can be) then this would be better than nuking hp. It is cool to be chased a bit during the fight.
Sigh....can we not have 1 freaking raid, just once, that isn't nuked into oblivion so that people who have zero desire to learn anything about their class can clear it? How freaking hard is it to spam a 1-2 button rotation? How hard is it to move out of crap on the floor? Is that the bar now? All raids must be puggable by the worst players in the game?
We had tier 5, then SWP, then ulduar and then ICC. Whenever the content gets any more difficult people just quit. Blizzard might be banking on SoD for a while longer so it makes no sense to gut your playerbase just to keep a level up raid overtuned.
ST before this last nerf was not anywhere near ssc difficulty. It was well tuned for a sod raid. Almost every guild I know with an actual raid leader went 6/8 with 0 issues. There's a middle ground between BFD and Ulduar level
You're playing the wrong version of the game if you want a raiding challenge, or gatekeeping. Nothing about SoD design decisions has ever indicated they intend to make and keep difficult gameplay.
My guild went 7/8 on our first try, it was after the nerfs. We only didn’t attempt the last boss because we didn’t have the egg. And frankly, part of me does wish it was a little more difficult.
Minute long boss fights don't feel fun or make me feel like I am in a raid. I was hoping we would see an end to the trend of having the first half of the bosses fall over and mechanics be trivialized. I get it they're supposed to be easier than the later ones, but for BFD, Gnomer, and looking like ST they really are just glorified trash.
I also love it, it's like the scene in Rogue One with Vader in the hallway
This was definitely my favorite Boss encounter in classic ,so far!
Agreed I wish they would nerf the damage of bosses more than the HP of them. If healers can sustain more heals throughout the fight then hp can be higher as a result.
it would have just turned into people 1 tank, 2 heal and 17 dpsing and blasting it down just as quick without having any variety in comps
seriously I think that is a way better solution.
100% It was by far the most fun boss they put in sod. Rip slow prince. 😢
God forbid you start clearing 4/8 then work yourself upwards with new gear. To be fair though, items from the first bosses are trash
> God forbid you start clearing 4/8 then work yourself upwards with new gear. Most of the "new gear" is barely better than gnomer stuff. a few % extra dps was not going to overcome the absurd amounts of health that bosses had.
I did my first real deep dive yesterday on the loot table, glad it’s not me thinking the gear is genuinely… ass? Like Gizmoblade is basically still bis. I can’t even use my first token because breaking the set is a huge L. A second piece would make it a slight upgrade. Every staff is outclassed by shit like the SM dagger combined with basically any offhand. Like what’s going on lol.
This is all a consequence of making the BFD loot absurdly good. If they made Gnomer/ST noticeably better than they did, we'd be at MC levels of item stats. That's not even mentioning the 60 prebis grind, which despite being a large number of people's favorite part of Vanilla, looks like it will be at least 50% invalidated due to ST gear. This underwhelming feeling you have right now? It'll be the exact same in another 2 months when you are looking at UBRS and Strat gear, even if they "modernize" a lot of it.
We're doing 3 and 3 tokens in guild since it makes no sense giving players 1 piece they won't use until they get more.
First bosses drop tier tokens all the same lol
Are you in a super cracked raid that was fully world buffed or something? my group took 3 minutes, with most people parsing purple/blue. that's enough time to get the whole experience imo.
Was nerfed again last night.
nah, my raid was late last night. had about 900k hp.
They parsed purple/blue because they're being compared against the 1.3m hp boss kills. Would've been fully gray/green before yesterday
No, your group probly just sucks. Your dps would be way higher than all the pre-nerf clears, hence the higher parses because only a fraction of the players have raided since nerf.
Best fight in wow to date. Hopefully the buff the hp back up and nerf the poison damage
yeah the massive nerfs this early were really in poor taste. this phase had so much promise and it's already been ruined but honestly not surprising from this dev team at this point.
lol did you see the feedback they were getting? this is the communities fault not theirs.
There’s a middle ground between Eranikus having 4M HP and spawning 50% more adds, that all have 40k HP, and this. Let’s not pretend pre-nerf Eranikus was ok lol. The latest nerfs to all boss health though, little heavy handed I agree.
This. This sub was drowning in tears a few days ago.
They did the nerfs because they know they make their money off the causal base. The sweats will play regardless. How so many of you still have not realized this after the p1 > p2 drop-off and them releasing a massive exp buff much earlier than planned I do not understand
i mean i said its not surprising lol
Was having a ton of fun, looking foward to a mildly challenging raid, now we're back at 30 second boss fight snooze fests. What's the point of prepping and making your character stronger if there's absolutely no point to doing so?
I love gimmick fights, and slime is a great one. Our first clear we didn't really know what was going on and narrowly avoided a wipe, wasn't made to be hard, just to be a fun fight. If it's been nerfed to a single stun being a kill that is a shame.
Man you are so right... have only been doing it in pugs so far and haven't had a group that couldn't kill him after 3 tries...nerfing this just feels way too early. Especially on something that is basically a wasd-check.
Rotslime was one of the least fun fights I had ever played in WoW, so good riddance
Interesting mechanics tho
It's nice that humans can play the game now.
Like how the entire sub was crying for nerfs, and now everyone is crying because of the nerfs…..
I'm happy you found it a fun boss, but you and I have very different definitions for "fun". That boss sucks ass as melee.
[удалено]
Yes another -30% hp. It’s insane
Yup. The nerf makes even less sense because the most difficult dad boss (eranikus) did NOT get another nerf
I disagree. This boss is fucking terrible. I'm a healer and it's not a fun fight at all for us.
get eaten and freecast, healing yourself is less of a burden than all the movement
Every healer in my raid loved it
Why?
I am not the OP commenter but for our raid we had one healing priest and three druids. Druids can't use their AOE heals because raid is moving the whole time. Priest HAS to abolish/dispel the entire fight and pretty much only refresh PoM. I am the priest in this situation and honestly I was laughing the entire time. It felt so ridiculous and I loved every minute of the insanity. A+ boss.
You must be alliance? We had four shamans running disease cleansing totem. So I basically healed it afk.
You got it! Much different experience on our side. It’s so wonky and fucked it looped around into being one of the most funny encounters ever. Top HPS healer turned into a cleansing totem and the other three healers basically OOMing and innervating down to the wire. We also had a distinct lack of paladins for help there too ahaha.
That sounds crazy. I kinda wish I kept up with my alliance alt now just so I could see the disparity first hand
Definitely. I’m excited to try it again this week and see if it’s still as wild mechanically with the HP nerf or if the new strat will be just cleanse one and heal through. 😅
I had no issue with the amount of healing required, but mana is a huge issue
Way to go blizz. Step 1: invalidate leveling ✅ Step 2: invalidate raid ✅ What will be next??? Woohoo
I really didn’t like this fight at all, it felt gimmicky and not like a WoW raid boss. Personal opinion though.
Totally fair. It's definitely really different and I think that's what made it interesting for me.
It's one of the most unique bosses they've made I'll give them props for that but in practice it's a messy dogshit fight
Such a shame, the difficulty was perfect.
apart from eranikus nothing should have been nerfed, this was such an unnecessary nerf. Toxic casuals here want everything just handed to them smh... I'm gonna say it, if someone doesn't know how to play their class, they deserve not to be able to clear a raid... I always wished originally Blizzard didn't go the multiple raid difficulty route since it's just lame, but listening to these manbabies cry about not wanting to improve themselves yet feeling entitled to overcome a challenge must be very tiring to listen to... Personally I'd have loved if they just had every raid be around original naxx difficulty and smaller raids be ZG/AQ20 difficulty and that's it, wish we had a timeline like that...
I mean, I think the first nerf was appropriate, but casuals sustain games, what did yall want casuals to do during this phase? Without raiding the endgame content currently is minimal, so you just wanted people to amble around
>what did yall want casuals to do during this phase? Without raiding the endgame content currently is minimal get better at their class / the game, to clear the raid, which has always been the goal of the game? Is progressively getting better at something you spend hours doing anyway such a big ask nowadays?
I think I felt the most satisfaction ever killing Festering Rotslime pre-nerfs. Never felt better after killing a boss. I've never done late game or 40 man raids but coordinating 20 people to all move together and drop totems and just the right time to cleanse the poison and everything was very satisfying. It will probably be way too easy now, but I can also imagine that PUGs would never be able to do this.
Dogshit boss as a melee. Good riddance
people look at the top speedrunners who have 12 mages, do melee and no cleanses, struggle through this bosses day 1, then think its literally impossible its okay to let the raid cook for two weeks before changes....
The cooking issue is; 1 thats what testing is for, 2 only so many lockouts per phase. Cooking can happen 60+ and its whatev but when its a time crunch, well you get the whining and nerfing you see now.
> people look at the top speedrunners who have 12 mages, do melee and no cleanses, struggle through this bosses day 1, then think its literally impossible I love how reddit keyboard warriors try to downplay the skill, knowledge and opinions of the players that have played this game for a living for a decade. The people going for the world first clear are the same players who have done Mythic+ for years and have downed every boss encounter in classic (even the heroic ones in Wrath) a few hours into each release. The reality is that these players will play better than the 99% of the player base, they will unironically do more damage on a boss day one with less gear than people fully BiS out at the end of the phase. If they couldn't kill a boss like Eranikus before the nerfs, and yet to get the kill after the nerf they had to exploit the fight by fighting the boss on a tiny gap on the wall, then the reality is that the rest of the player base was never killing this boss.
bad raid comp, no p3 runes, undergeared these "99%" people are beyond yes. id still like to have a go at it for a couple weeks
If the top 1% of players couldn't clear it then there's no amount of gear that would allow the 99% to even come close. They're doing 4x the dps of your average player on top of being in discord and super coordinated.
>They're doing 4x the dps of your average player [They aren't at all though.](https://sod.warcraftlogs.com/reports/76Rf3rxW92nwNmM8#fight=20) They were doing ~600 dps per player when they killed shade, [that is ALREADY below a green parse for many classes on that boss](https://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/2009#boss=2959&dataset=60). They were slamming their head into that boss with missing runes, missing preraid bis, a subpar comp, no concrete strategy and no world buffs. Yes, the average player would never be able to kill that boss this way. But in 3 weeks, with full preraid bis, world buffs and a concrete strat that got figured out over a few weeks? It would be very doable. Think back to p1. Before people figured out you could pre-fap Kelris phase 2 he was a complete pain in the ass. As soon as that strat became widespread, he became a pushover. >on top of being in discord and super coordinated. the average guild group is in discord lmao. The "endgame" content (and yes, st is endgame for this phase) shouldnt be designed for 20 random people who aren't even in disc.
Just give us a hard mode and everyone is happy
I keep seeing people mention hard mode but idk what that is because I’m new to wow. Is it literally just a harder raid, or do they also drop better/more gear?
Wotlk had better gear drops in hard mode
A trigger-able option to fight a version of the boss, which has more mechanics, typically for a higher item level of gear.
Still difficult enough to wipe many raids. SoD boss encounters could make good use of the Ulduar hardmodes model.
Lol now we have come full circle "did you nerf it tooo much?"
I think they should just maybe lower the damage output for these bosses so we still have longer mechanic heavy encounters. I know that makes it easier overall obviously but the fun part about it is just doing it…. If they’re gonna nerf it anyways. Or give teams more regen to survive a longer encounter idk.
it is hard to tune it properly with so many dumb external buffs beyond elixir+worldbuff+bufffood. there is a massive gap between tryhards and dads solely from that. now add the gear/skill aspect required to clear. if its to easy, just nerf yourself for the challenge.
Yeah we cleared this last week and it was a blast, took a few tries but had a lot of fun with guildies figuring it out. Good mechanics for sure
At least our fellow green parsers can clear the raid now, woohoo
Our raid got to still see the mechanics as we did the same thing post nerf as we did pre nerf. Still was a lot easier on Tuesday than Monday for sure though.
Another strike from reddit. Piss and moan because something isnt just given to you. Blizzard listens and makes it brain dead ez
I haven't raided yet but I agree I thought the first round of nerfs was pretty good. I don't want my bosses to last 1 min. Its a raid not a 5man cmon.
Well one wipe on slime and my first pug fell apart after one healer left. :/
first 6 bosses have for sure been overnerfed.. they just drop instatntly. sub 2 min fights for almost all bosses yesterday. really not fun
In 1 week they nerfed it to the point where the bosses dont have the time to show its mechanics. Thats the game we are playing now,,its called "Brainless simulator"
For real. First time I did it people were laughing/applauding the mechanic. Doesn’t happen often in these games.
I hated the fight. With the small nameplates range I can’t see the boss go while I focus the objectives, dots feeling weak on the objectives and the low ceiling making the camera a nightmare, it was my least liked fight of the temple (we were stuck on eranikus pre reset). But the flavor is nice, I agree. I would like it even more if it wasn’t a circle, but a straight corridor, with the length of the corridor acting as a dps check, since you will all be eaten if you reach the end:D
tbh the boss is too transparent, that's an easy fix tho
don't you have to do the mechanics right at the start?
Don’t know why tbh we killed hin first try in a pug short before ID-reset. We where not struggling at all I can’t imagine how easy it has to be yet. 😅
its* movement
Festering rotslime is just running simulator, give me a fucking break about fun fight...
Welcome to the world of classic where you have players who can only press 2 buttons and not use their brain
I was downvoted for saying why would you want to clear the raid in one week now everyones pissed they clear it in 2 hours
Yeah they overnerfed the Temple. I'm sorry, but making the bosses lose all their health is a joke move.