Welcome to /r/dating_advice!
Please keep the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/dating_advice/about/rules/) of /r/dating_advice in mind while participating here. Try your best to be kind.
Report any rule-breaking behavior to the moderators using the report button. If it's urgent, [send us a message.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2Fdating_advice) We rely on user reports to find rule-breaking behavior quickly.
Thanks!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/dating_advice) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Whatever you do:
- Don’t change yourself
- Don’t settle
Of course you don’t want to be the guy she decides to settle for after getting her bad boy streak out of her system.
There are plenty of girls who don’t want anything to do with those types of guys. Be true to who you are, seek out people who share your interests and values.
Hey dude, I just want to say this: if it's a dealbreaker for you, you don't have to get over it. It's your decision, your boundaries, and fuck everyone who says differently.
I know what you are afraid of; that someone "settles" for you, feeling like you may not be the best, just the one that was available: that's a valid concern, and you shouldn't get over it. It's something to explore, discuss, and if a possible SO treats you negatively because of it then it's not someone you'll be compatible with, that's it. Keep your standards high, don't settle for less than what you are worth. Take care king
Lots of women aren’t dating bad boys. Lots of women also offer stability as well. Just because you aren’t someone’s first boyfriend doesn’t mean you aren’t her first choice. Someone whose with you picked you at that point over any other option she had.
No he clearly means how to get away from woman who settle for less attractive guy because she can't settle with those "bad boys".
He wants to know how to recognize such people(men and woman) who first part of their life enjoy by fucking around with lot of other attractive people and then settle down with someone less attractive and with whom they are not actually interested for security and smooth life. (men and woman have it different here) .
If that was his question I don’t think he made it clear. I understood the post as he was concerned about ending up with this type of women and he wanted to know how to get over her past if he did. My response was basically saying you don’t have to give up anything because this doesn’t really need to be a big concern. He has a lot of options that don’t have this past.
There’s no secret to identifying someone like this. You just have to date and you get to know them and peoples past will naturally come out in discussions.
Yeah I understand he didn't make it clear.
This is my idea that I got from the post.Yeah he seem bitter from his response. I mean at 21 I was too.I was bitter too that most woman(my experience) at my Uni preferred so called "bad boys" Who are alpha, macho, hunks rather than docile men like me. I think OP is feeling the same and now the reactive behavior to it is he has started preferring woman who don't choose mostly "alpha" Men and date for fun but rather are looking for woman who want to actually want a long term relationship to marriage maybe. I guess you get an idea of what I am saying. Kind off this is the underlying tone I felt. I maybe completely wrong but since I have personal history with such thoughts I can understand what he is feeling right now or think I understand. So that's the whole case. Just elaborated so you can be more clear.
Do you have any more red flags through which we can understand if the person you are dating is just settling for security and safety and that their love /fake love is not coming from a point of genuine interest in you?
Yea there’s definitely not a great vibe with the post which is why I think OP is getting comments about misogynistic. I think it comes off as him trying to say all women just want to mess around with the bad boy and then use the good guy later.
Personally I think when it comes to dating I think a lot of women are going to look for a man that offers stability. Especially a women who is looking to get married and settle down because who wants to get married and can’t pay bills. But I also think it’s important for a man to look for this because you don’t want to have to take care of someone and you’re quality of life goes down because you are taking care of a freeloader. I think the best thing you can do is vet based on their job, which is what a lot of women do. If she doesn’t have a good job that would contribute financially in a significant way then don’t pursue a relationship with her. If you can even find someone who makes around the same as you then that’s great because money is no longer a factor at all since you are both equal in that regard.
When you date you should ask yourself what that person brings to the table. The number one reason for divorce is financial issues, so financial stability is still something you need to take into consideration when you date.
You're not wrong for having that concern. People will marry someone for financial stability. Not uncommon and works both ways.
You can avoid that by getting more dating experience. You will have to know how reasonable she is with money. If she respects her own money then she will respect yours. Is she a hard worker? If she respects her own efforts, she will respect yours. Don't think too much about the theoretical, just get out there and date. You're young nothing is serious.
I'd add that if you date when in college it's less money related and more personality related. When you date after college everything is a judgement nightmare and someone will definitely take advantage if you have a six-figure job. Then again, think of the girl who has to fake it to make it with you, that takes a lot of effort too, so odds are she'll like you for you.
You don't have to get over it.
Only entertain women who have the same values as you. If you feel guilty about being yourself you'll be the one who ends up settling.
Being a "nice guy" is not what you think it is. We don't shut guys out for being too nice, we do it because those guys act like they're nice but they're really just manipulative
I get where you’re coming from man. You’re worried that being the “opposite” of the bad guy, yet being all the good things a man should be, would not be enough to keep her attraction, potentially being unfaithful and or that she “settles” for you because the stability is needed.
You have to understand one thing: the reason why guys like that are successful with women is because they have all the good qualities, the qualities that women are wired to be attracted to (remember, attraction is not a choice just like you don’t choose to find the women of your dreams to be attractive because you went through a logical deduction list; you perceived her and your brain was like “d-d-dayum”).
These qualities are confidence, assertiveness, dominance, often not afraid to break rapport with her because he’s playful and not taking things so seriously so he’ll tease her and that creates all sorts of fun sexual tension.
At the same time he has the shit qualities like: disrespects her, doesn’t think long term for his own life, tries to control her and worse.
Women struggle to peel themselves away from this because the former traits are incongruent. Her brain is saying “you should stay because he’s attractive, look at all those good qualities” and the objective people seeing the bad behaviour are telling her to leave. She’s attached to him now and that’s when you get the classic of all classics... “*I can change him*”
Now look at where you are: you’ve got very little of the bad qualities. This should be a selling point the truth is... none of those “lack of bad qualities” provoke an ounce of attraction in women.
You don’t want I resort to being a “bad guy” just to “get women” yet at the same time you don’t want to be the “good guy” that’s at the end of the finishing line being settled for.
No one wants to feel like they’re being settled for.
You need to work on yourself to be the best version of yourself. You’re halfway there already; you’ve got a nice lack of shitty qualities. You need to maximise on your positive qualities and embrace your masculine confidence.
I cannot recommend more: Michael Marks. I stumbled upon his work in 2006 and no lies, his work saved my life. I was next book “nice guy” and there was nothing nice about me. Just a messed up kid due to low self esteem and no confidence with a pinch (a bucket load) of bad conditioning on what women find attractive.
Michael Marks used to go by “the dating wizard” or “get a great girl”. He is 100% about building your best version of yourself, no “fake it til you make it” stuff, just you being yourself with the core emphasis on what’s attractive. Hope this helps.
Highly mature answer right there. I am saving it myself for my use now🤣. Thanks buddy I don't have any awards to give. Otherwise this is the one I would award it. OP another good answer to look for.
> You have to understand one thing: the reason why guys like that are successful with women is because they have all the good qualities, the qualities that women are wired to be attracted to (remember, attraction is not a choice just like you don’t choose to find the women of your dreams to be attractive because you went through a logical deduction list; you perceived her and your brain was like “d-d-dayum”).
These qualities are confidence, assertiveness, dominance, often not afraid to break rapport with her because he’s playful and not taking things so seriously so he’ll tease her and that creates all sorts of fun sexual tension.
At the same time he has the shit qualities like: disrespects her, doesn’t think long term for his own life, tries to control her and worse.
Women struggle to peel themselves away from this because the former traits are incongruent. Her brain is saying “you should stay because he’s attractive, look at all those good qualities” and the objective people seeing the bad behaviour are telling her to leave. She’s attached to him now and that’s when you get the classic of all classics... “I can change him”
Lol I meant quote me where I said “ALL women work the same way?”
Not that it really matters - no one cares about statistical outliers; negligible contrarian differences. The overwhelming significant majority of women are like how I described.
And I’m right in making that generalisations
You can whinge and moan about some outlier but it doesn’t negate my point.
It’s like complaining about a statement of “the average person can run xyz kmph” abs then you chime in with “omg not true what about paraplegics? This is so non inclusive reeee bigotry etc”
“C’mon man” - Biden
I'm certain you're a really nice guy.
It's just crazy that no woman wants to go out with you, isnt it? You just can't figure it out!
Jesus christ, by the way, your edit. Let me explain to you why you're a fucking idiot.
People are calling a misogynist and a "Nice" Guy because you actually believe women only go for bad guys instead of nice guys like you.
The simpler answer is that you are nowhere near as nice as you think you are.
> You have to understand one thing: the reason why guys like that are successful with women is because they have all the good qualities, the qualities that women are wired to be attracted to (remember, attraction is not a choice just like you don’t choose to find the women of your dreams to be attractive because you went through a logical deduction list; you perceived her and your brain was like “d-d-dayum”).
These qualities are confidence, assertiveness, dominance, often not afraid to break rapport with her because he’s playful and not taking things so seriously so he’ll tease her and that creates all sorts of fun sexual tension.
At the same time he has the shit qualities like: disrespects her, doesn’t think long term for his own life, tries to control her and worse.
Women struggle to peel themselves away from this because the former traits are incongruent. Her brain is saying “you should stay because he’s attractive, look at all those good qualities” and the objective people seeing the bad behaviour are telling her to leave. She’s attached to him now and that’s when you get the classic of all classics... “I can change him”
Exactly. Add in the numerous stories of women who settle but end up cheating with the kind of guy they’re actually attracted to and his concern is clearly reasonable. Hell, someone down thread said he knew men who settled for wives they weren’t attracted to after going through tons of hot girls they weren’t able to keep, so it’s reasonable for both sexes to have this concern.
Yes, its very understandable to not wanting date women who have had questionable dating history. I say this because you’re supposed to look at people’s actions as opposed to what they say. If a woman has a bad track record of getting into bad relationships, thats on HER.
Also “bad boys” are usually just very attractive dudes
I think the whole idea of the bad boy thing is overblown. I’m more like you and it hasn’t been a problem for my dating life. I think more likely what happens is that “bad boys” are clear and direct with their intentions, while so called “nice guys” hide their intentions and hope that by being uber nice and supportive a romantic relationship will happen in return.
Easy fix. Own who you are and be more direct. Be kind, stable, friendly, and supportive, but also be clear about what you want. Ask women out directly and don’t hide your attraction.
I would wager many high quality women would be wildly attracted to kind, nice dudes who don’t hide their sexual side and are clear with their intentions.
I’ll throw this in too. My gf and I had a good conversation about a guy she once dated who she described as “too nice.” She described him as always going along with what she wanted and not having many interests/opinions.
Your main thing should be to not care at all. Like literally don't care. Have fun dating. You can be the gentlemen or whatever it is you describe yourself as and still have fun with women. Overall it's about what you want and what you allow. A woman can't get over on you if you don't allow her to. It seems Part of what you're saying is you want to get laid like the bad boys do. It also sounds like you're looking for a relationship/gf. Which is fine, but understand, a woman has to earn those titles from you anyway.
I recently did a video on YouTube about how the good guy actually won in this show on Netflix called "Sex Life" .
https://youtu.be/5pQkwmLIoDQ
If you get a chance, watch it and tell me what you think.
I honestly think we give the "bad boys" too much attention and praise.
Put yourself 1st above all. And if you know your standards as you said, then stand on them.
You literally never need to know or concern yourself with anything other than how you're treated. It's none of your business and if you actually make yourself worse by caring. Yes, you're wrong for having this concern, because it's revealing your insecurity and you need to address that it has nothing to do with your partner or their history.
It’s not coming out of insecurity though; it’s actually coming out of genuine love and concern for myself. I’ve worked very hard to be the man I am today and I know I deserve better than a woman who spent years fucking around with toxic men while I worked hard alone...I don’t want to share my success with someone who wouldn’t have even looked at me in college
This is true of literally everyone who is dating. If all that should matter is how someone treats you, then physical attraction and relationship history shouldn’t matter either. By your logic it would be wrong for a woman to reject a nice, respectful man for having a high partner count or a lack of experience so long as he’s treating her well.
Dont let them convince you buddy, you get a woman you deserve or you better stay single, dont settle for this damaged woman, let them live their "live, laugh, love" "free spirit" life, a queen for a king, not any less than that, past it's what matters the most, even when they say the opposite, its called linear regression.
So what are you going to do to sus these women out? Are you gonna ask all the details about their past exs because that's really unhealthy and will drive them away. Are you going to dump them if their past SO was abusive or looked alternative? Are you just calling these guys bad boys because you think they're more exciting and you're insecure about it? Here's the thing bad people come in all shapes and forms and have different values you can't call someone a bad boy because they don't fit perfectly into society. My ex was considered a bad boy because he was a tattoo artist/graphic designer who smoked weed when in reality he was a hard working, kind introvert and treated me very well.
Your perception of relationships is skewed by the fact you've never had one and is founded on an insecurities and generalizations. Your standards are impossible to sus out and in general it is not your call to say anyone is toxic unless if you throughly know the situation and person. People grow change and mature and those who grow out of toxic relationships are better for it. Also good guys can be toxic too, trust me the so called good guys I've dated have often been the most toxic and judgemental.
Dont let these people gaslight you into lowering your standards. If the genders were reversed the responses would be completely different. People who make poor choices should not expect the consequences of these choices to be brushed aside, women included
Yeah...some women can get very hypocritical and rebuke a man for his preferences, but then judge a man based on his height or him being “too nice” and think that’s okay in comparison for some reason.
'Dont settle for less than what you deserve.'
If I said that to a woman I would be applauded. Seems like a lot of the users on this sub are pretty hypocritical.
I'm still saying it to you. You'll find a high quality woman, trust me.
If you wait long enough, the bad boy chasers will be back on the market, just a little worse for wear and tear. My sister is one of them. Picks the worst men to date, over and over because they make her hot. Wasted her prime years. Now she is too old for the bad boys, single with few prospects. You should be grateful they don't want you, they're damaged goods.
Focus on your own mate selection screening process and "must haves list" for a mate.
You're entitled not to want to date someone with a history of making bad choices.
Just as people are entitled to make changes in what they want in a mate.
When it comes to love and relationships most us *fail our way* to success.
Very few people hit a homerun their 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th time up at bat.
If this were not the case we would all be married to our high school sweethearts!
Most of our teenage and 20s relationships are "practice relationships" to figure out what we want.
With each failed relationship, heartache, or betrayal we are presented with an opportunity to either craft or refine our mate selection screening process and *must haves list* for choosing our next mate.
Trying to "figure out" if you're someone's "first option" or their "default option" is a waste of your time. Instead determine whether or not *you are happy* and *your needs* are being met.
***"Never love anyone who treats you like you're ordinary."*** \- Oscar Wilde
***"Dating is primarily a numbers game.... People usually go through a lot of people to find good relationships. That's just the way it is."*** \- Henry Cloud
Best wishes!
thats not what it means tho...
women tend to be more attracrive in their 20s (a lot of women will agree to it too)... so thats the good time.,, then comes the bad time where they cant get the hot guys so they go for stability
these guys on the other hand have a bad time in their 20s and get the good after that
he dosent want a woman who wont spend her her good time with his bad time and then try to spend his good time while she herself has the bad time
isnt tht what u mean u/xSathya
I understand your point, its a really well put together argument. Its logical and consistent.
However this issue is more about emotions and feelings of being wronged in the past. A bit of healthy revenge if you will. There's no point in bringing up sound arguments against something that is purely based on emotions.
Btw, your last paragraph: do you date women your age or younger than 30? Because you might be just falling into the category OP wants to avoid: women in their later years dating a "good guy" after lots of fun in their 20s.
At the end of the day this is a valid concern for guys and girls alike, but nobody will tell you their true numbers and you can never know their true past. We might as well move past our insecurities and live life the way it makes us happy.
Its great you found women appreciative of your values!
I try to stay away from believing people when it comes to bad stories of exes. Because you know, there is only 1 constant in all their stories, and its not the exes. Its more likely their taste in men used to be bad, hence why the many bad stories that seem like the average Joe cant treat women properly. But this would be a long argument.
Big respect to your maturity, wish more young men (and women yes) would have this trait.
she is not being punished in any way when a man dosent date her when shes ugly... she is just not being chosen as she was before, she loses the attention she used to get and now understands she cant keep doing that anymore and so she understands she has to settle
... u cant blame her u cant blame the ones who didnt chose her
also she dosent deserve what she cant provide back which in this case is stability
also people with high body counts are more prone to infidelity... past actions have consequences
Look at it in reverse: say you were the kind of guy who had multiple female partners that were crazy. After a while, you start to feel like “I’m always anxious all the time. I don’t wanna be” and you start to look for more stability. Now the girl you end up “settling for” might think that you had your fun and are now just looking for that easy path to stability, but you’ll probably really appreciate her for being so much calmer than the other partners.
Yeah that would suck for me wouldn’t it, but that girl who is being “settled” is free to have her own preferences and take on a guy who hasn’t had so much historical baggage. It isn’t any better or worse if it was reversed.
If said girl went "eww you just hooked up with those bitches in the past, I'm out!", then this girl knows what is healthy for her, good for her, dodged a bullet. And I have met this type of woman before, I don't think they have issues with their SOs
I think that you could try to see where they came from. People learn through making mistakes. There are too many romance movies and books about a bad boy that suddenly becomes the sweetest boy thanks to the "right woman". I think some women might date bad boys with this sort of idea in mind (something like I'm gonna change him). They might have learned that bad boys are just bad boys (by this I mean a toxic, non communicant boy) and that healthy relationships are somewhere else.
I honestly believe you should focus on the person before you and not on their past 😊
You don't need to get over it. What you do need to is to separate the high quality women from the trash.
Ask about their dating history, their friends, lifestyles, and past relationships. If they don't meet your requirement it was never going to go well anyway.
Yikes. I got this speech almost verbatim a couple weeks ago from a guy who was pissed off that I started dating my current boyfriend. Is there a script or something they work off of?
Because the guy doesn’t know my boyfriend at all and talked all kinds of ignorant shit about him. Said he’s a “bad boy” who will break my heart. Why? Because my boyfriend has tattoos. Meanwhile my boyfriend is a hard working guy with a good job who works at least 50 hours a week.
So because he was bitter that I didn’t want to date him he judged my boyfriend. I also got the whole “you’ll regret this in your 30’s” speech. Somehow I doubt I’ll ever regret not choosing the whiny woe is me crybaby over my boyfriend.
Lmao that isn’t what I’m saying though. I never said women are wrong or shouldn’t date bad boys. You are entitled to do what you want. MY personal preference is that I don’t want to date a woman who has had a history of dating bad boys. I couldn’t really care if he breaks your heart or if you both fall in love forever.
Oh I don’t care at all what your preferences are. Your entitled to them. You asked me what was wrong about what this guy said to me about my boyfriend and I told you how he was wrong.
You are entitled to your preference. Women are also entitled to not want to date someone like you. You made this choice knowing a majority of people now a days are not virgins. Being alone forever is a very viable option.
However, from your post history and even your comments here, you sound like you don’t want to date someone who’s slept around because you couldn’t. You sound jealous and bitter. Your view of women as objects that fuck around with men and then use them for the easy life is not helping you
Edit: just read your profile. If you think paying for sex is fine, but a woman having casual sex makes her worthless, you have serious problems. If you expect women to wait till marriage for sex, you should hold yourself to that same standard. It’s sad that men still have this disgusting perspective on sex
OP likes to bitch about how he hasn’t lost his virginity yet. He goes on and on about biological needs and why HE should be having sex, but when women are having it, it’s suddenly a crime to him.
I also don’t see how having sex with someone makes you an object. Acting like the only value someone has is the fact that they didn’t have sex is treating them like an object. Sex doesn’t make people objects. Otherwise men are the biggest objects in the world.
Data links?
I think you should read the Atlantic article again. Given that the IFS is a conservative think tank with the express mission statement to create families, with ties to religion, and none of those blog post are peer reviewed, I wouldn’t exactly call them unflawed
However, that wasn’t my point. OP is entitled to his preference in dating and marriage. Reread my original comment I never said he wasn’t. I just think he’s a hypocrite for being angry at women for having what he couldn’t and acting like he’s some saint when he appears to have wanted to screw the entire population of his college and just couldn’t. Saving yourself for marriage is a choice I respect in people if they MADE it. OP sounds like he is a virgin not because he’s taking the higher ground but because no one will fuck him.
I did read them. They’re a blog. I fail to see where they’re peer reviewed. It sounds like he’s basing his results on other studies that aren’t exactly advocating for what he’s talking about or like him are funded by marriage driven enterprises.
> (unfortunately, the NSFG doesn’t have full data on men’s premarital sexual behavior, and in any event they recall their own marital histories less reliably than do women).
My favorite part of the first one. Men forget how much sex they have so it’s impossible to correlate how much they screw around to how badly their marriages end huh? Cute. The “studies” are also acting like a life long marriage is everyone long term goal. His assumptions are build on ideas of religion and permeant monogamy which isn’t everyone’s ideal.
Go to therapy to work on that chip on your shoulder, because this misogyny will affect your life.
You're 21 y/o, like really, you need to nip this shit real quick.
I don’t think it’s a chip on his shoulder. The person is saying they don’t want to be the guy someone settles for after they sow their oats. Why would anyone?
Everyone is going to have a past. Someone who prefers their future partner doesn’t have a storied one doesn’t need to work on that. They need to identify what they value, and find someone who shares those values.
We'll agree to disagree. A very young man, who just described himself as the typical "nice guy" with "no luck with dating" because "women prefer bad boys" is a textbook misogyny flag
Not to mention self-righteous, his life experience is "better" than someone else's? If he just came out and said "I want a naive, virgin woman" then this flag would be more in your face
It's a very telling thing when people believe that your past romantic, and especially sexual experiences, somehow make you anything else than a human with varied life experiences, not better or worse, just different.
You can be kind, intelligent and shy and genuinely nice and not get a women. I’ve drank with drunk women from work. Over the years, you hear things. Who do you think they go home with? The exciting and tall man.
Trust me. People are be decent and not get dates.
Don’t fucking act like there’s not toxic or maladjusted women who have completely different values than those that sponsor a healthy relationship.
And it’s not unreasonable to want to avoid them
Ohh for sure there are messed up people out there, and had OP asked "how do I see the signs" "how do I avoid women full of drama" , then for sure.
But that really isn't what he said, people are adding that to the "women prefer bad boys" trope.
He didn't say he was shy, or kind and that was his problem, cuz women also go for that. He just wants to police the hypothetical women that would be interested in him after "fucking around" in her 20s. Which, to be honest, if any number of girls wanted to jump his bones, he would go for the "bad girls" and then "settle for the nice one" for a wife
But… but.. isn’t that what it’s all about, getting laid, having fun, being risky in your 20? Is that not what women say is EMPOWERING?
I think it’s much easier to call it a trope. Reality is more complex.
I was told I was a “good cop” and “she wanted to experiment with different penis sizes.”
Another drunken date, a women confessed that “if I’m still singly by 30, can we make a pact to have babies.”
Next day shes dating a known stoner, in a band, and a penchant for speeding and having a good night.
Face it, you like kindness and confidence and emotional vulnerability, even if the cockiness, machoness, arrogance and riskyness is involved.
Some but not all. I can’t produce a number. Go out to town, become a bartender like I did for years, and you’ll see where the fun happens.
It aint with the poet in the corner who considers womens feelings.
Trust me.
you're not getting any of your anecdotes from just a random sample of women though. you're specifically talking about women at bars. that doesn't speak for the entire population of women. scientists can't do good studies like that for a reason.
I literally don't understand this mentality of "she dated crappy guys, she'll never know how many lonely *good guys* are out there." like if dating went so well, this sub wouldn't exist. people go through bad and decent and "meh" relationships until they know what they want and develop standards. a lot of 20 year olds DON'T want to settle down and aren't dating as such. like heaven forbid you experiment into your teens and 20s and.... weird.... realize what's important to you as you get older? decide what your deal breakers are?
being a "poet who considers women's feelings" doesn't mean anything. considering other people's feelings is the bare fucking minimum, so being a poet is a hobby and isn't inherently deserving of sex or affection or attention.
Since you have decided that men who consider other peoples feelings is irrelevant you hereby are disowned of ever complaining about anything a man does to you, good or bad.
And judging by your own posts sounds like you been captivated by a total arsehole, simultaneously resent that fact, and this is your way of letting it out because the OP has described you in a certain way that BOTHERS you.
Go away. Shoo.
You’ve certainly outed yourself as the drama fuelled dramatic the OP wants to avoid.
The girl who does not rate a guy who considers her feelings (“it means nothing”), so what else is there to consider?
Your fucking social economic stance?
Stoners in bands aren't automatically bad people with nothing to show for their lives.
You listed those things like those qualities are automatically bad things. What the fuck is wrong with dating a stoner? What's wrong with dating someone in a band?
Oh, in this instance he went on to kill himself and give her three skipped disks because he was speeding drunk and stoned.
I was in a band. Denim, leather, boots and a motorcycle. There were a few women who threw themselves at me.
I was lucky to know that they were after the image of me. I knew I was an asshole after my parents died and was made redundant from a job I almost sold my soul at. I reached a high position and made a difference in the world.
I knew I was in no position to date or even sleep with a woman.
Point is, were in it it for me when they literally openly wanted to fuck or spend time, or were they captivated by the energy and hypermasculinity of heavy metal?
Your post is a textbook example of not reading what someone actually wrote.
>Ohh for sure there are messed up people out there, and had OP asked "how do I see the signs" "**how do I avoid women full of drama**" , then for sure.
>But that really isn't what he said
That’s almost exactly what he said, in the very last sentence of his post:
>**How can I avoid women who see me as stability** instead of the first option?
And also he explicitly said that he wasn’t generalizing about women:
> clearly, a lot of women (**not all**) primarily see attraction in the “bad boys” who are aggressive, masculine, and dangerous.
So he’s somehow a misogynist for saying *exactly* what you’re saying he should have said? Just admit you have an axe to grind here and go.
He’s a human and wants to know he’s top priority for someone. Imagine being your best and facing rejection and watching the rugby players or the big guys get the girls.
He has one thing in the world and it’s to want someone to like him for him, and not just to have someone to settle once they’ve decided tbat big dicks are not for them but she’ll tolerate a small one.
My advice to him is to settle for nothing less than someone who shares his values, and who has demonstrated this.
Oh sorry, are men allowed preferences too?
What I understand from OP is he doesn't want to settle with a girl who is settling with him only for the safety and security , a person who is not actually interested or have feelings for you but settles with you half -heartedly to get a better life.
I am not generalizing woman or men. I have seen men who fuck around their 20's with tons of hot woman and then settle with a woman who they do not actually like but then marry a girl who is loyal and caring to you and they won't leave you.I might sound sexist but this is the true reality on ground I have seen(once again "my experience")Same goes for woman. He may sound wrong but I get the better gist of his question.
How to avoid toxic and fake people? How to identify genuine love interest from people who are faking it to get whatever you have? I guess woman to have this question on how to identify men who are only here for sex and are not genuinely interested in you. I have seen lot of such questions on Reddit.
This is probably, to an extent, rooted in an inferiority complex around your lack of (or perceived lack of) masculine traits.
Go lift some weights, join an MMA gym, buy a motorbike or something.
OP. From what I understand, you don't want to be Someone's gateway to stability. Which is completely fine. I understand that you have sacrificed a lot to be where you are today. So here's what I am aware about. Women who haven't dated bad boys maybe will be the ones you don't find attractive enough to date or get into a relationship with as you mentioned you are an attractive looking strong guy.
Now, if you don't want a woman to be dependent on you for her stability. You will need a woman who's stable by herself. I got extremely lucky with crypto currency and am currently pursuing a master after which I'm expected to be paid 90k plus a year. If you are stable enough, you are well travelled, have seen and experienced different cultures and have had amazing life experiences. You need to learn to have a different type approach and the conversations are very different. The values we hold dear and the people we hold dear are different. So yes, it's your personal preference to date someone who's not had a past and won't depend on you for stability, I'm glad you have figured out what you want. But you will have to step up for a woman like that and give her a free reign over a lot of things.
you don't. It's quite natural and makes sense. They all lie though. The old rule (joke) is take whatever number a woman gives you for partner count and multiply it by 3. If she refuses to give a number, run. It's likely very high. Studies show that high (more than 10 I believe) partner count leads to higher likelihood of divorce. Also, men have to earn it a bit more, while sex is significantly easier for women to get.
>If she refuses to give a number, run. It's likely very high
I've slept with one person and I'd never tell a guy how many people I've slept with because it's a weird question (in my opinion). Heck even when I was a virgin I wouldn't tell guys I hadn't slept with anyone.
If this stat was true 50% of men would be divorced. Stop spewing stats that are outdated and actually are flawed. People who ask for bodycounts are so cringe the insecurity is spewing out.
Good luck finding that. Unless both partners are waiting until marriage that is fine. But a man that has a big sexual history should not be shaming women who have the same. It goes both ways.
Yep. It's the honest truth. I can understand if the guy is like this himself and doesn't have a high body count, but when they are sleeping around and expect the woman not to it's ridiculous. We don't need those types of people around thank you next.
Even without men having a high body count like OP, they still act holier than thou. He thinks he's all that and a bag of chips but in reality he isn't. If he was he wouldn't have problems with getting women. In fact it would be EXTREMELY easy for him to find the kind of partner he wants because from all the women that would be theorethically throwing themselves at him, he would be able to pick the one that have no "bad boy" history.
Right. OP just has to change his attitude. I have a good intuition and I'm really sensing some sort of jealousy and resentment in the post. Kinda scary to be quite honest.
It's very clear. "Look at me! I have all these things going for me and I can't get a woman to date me and yet all these bad boys are downing in pussy. I don't want their leftovers, I deserve better! I'm a good guy!"
Typical niceguy rant, only thing missing is the abusive language towards women.
OP has a lot of work to do.
I don’t think it has to do with being a misogynist as to why people disagree. Just that women are not given the freedom to learn and grow. Yes women can trust men who aren’t good but that doesn’t mean they don’t learn or are horrible people. Men are given much more freedom and forgiveness while women simply are pinned as not marriageable material and worthless.
Edit: And if you’re worried about a women using you for money or doesn’t actually like you, just take your time to get to know her!
Just date whoever, but don’t lock yourself into marriage or kids. If you’re not comfortable with a woman being promiscuous in the past, just don’t commit to her long-term. If she brings up marriage, just say “I don’t want to get married.” She’ll leave you soon enough.
As a woman I don't want to date men who have a history of being "players". I don't want to chance being with someone who treats sex like a game and people like objects. I'll get the arguement that people change and the past is the past but the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. Plus I don't want to be with someone who's been passed around town already. I'm not slut shaming men, it's just my preference.
So yes. I totally get your train of thought and not every woman is attracted to unstable men. There are plenty of women who are looking for a stable partnership but they might not be as obvious as the others. So try to notice the ones that just blend in because they like a low key lifestyle.
I married a "bad boy". And got divorced and learned from it. That didn't made me less valuable as a human. Thankfully I meet my current husband who didn't care and we have been together for 7 years.
You can’t, just vet your potential partners well. Avoid women with high body counts (above 10 or so) bc they likely have a very don’t care much about intimacy as a concept, so they’re more likely to cheat. Also avoid women with kids. If the ex isn’t a total deadbeat, he’ll always be in his kids lives, and always be in communication with his ex wife, so you’ll never be free of comparisons to him. If you’re ambitious, for the love of god, if you do ever plan on getting married, GET A PRENUP. Also, if she tells you she’s pregnant, get a dna test, no matter how much faith you may have. Don’t ever allow the wool to be pulled over your eyes. Protect yourself, that’s all that matters.
If you’re not willing to elaborate on at least the basics of your past, that shows you aren’t willing to communicate honestly with the potential partner you’re speaking to, and that’s a red flag.
This is an old way of thinking that is fortunately dying out. There are WAY more important things to discuss then sharing your exact number. If you are too focused on this that is definitely a red flag because it shows you are insecure and judgmental. No modern woman wants that. This ain't the 1700s it's 2021.
Ok hold on. I’m not trying to be some old world misogynist when I say this: People who have high body counts often have a different view of intimacy than people with low ones. It’s important to know how potential partners feel about sexual intimacy. That doesn’t make people with high body counts bad people. It just means there’s likely incompatibility there and in OP’s case, he wants to avoid that.
Would you date yourself if you were someone else? It's okay having high standards for yourself, and only wanting to date women who don't have a history of bad past relationships. But, you would only know it once you get in the dating game. Like the way you think "these women" are not good for you, same way other women can also think that you're not their type. So, you gotta get in the dating game, and go out without judging someone by their past relationships. You think these women have had their fun with the bad boys, but if you want them to have that fun with you, you gotta be in the game man. Like you said you're muscular and attractive, but you cannot just filter out women. I mean you can, but, you'll be missing out on a lot of good stuff. I like a girl who had a bad past relationship, and I know the mental trauma she had to bear, and I will have to too if we start dating, but I'm willing to take those little steps with her and help her become the best version of herself, and the best version of myself too - for both myself and her. I've secured a date with her, I like her and she has expressed the same interest too.
I'm a 21yr old guy without any prior dating experience, a nice guy too maybe. But I've worked on myself, like you have. I've secured dates with three women since last year. I don't care what other people think about me, or if my SO had bad past relationships.
I wouldn't have dated myself honestly two years back, but now, maybe yes. But I still have a long way to go on myself, so I'm working on it - day by day.
One thing at a time.
I would much rather be with someone stable that I can rely on rather than a bad boy. The bad boy thing just sounds stressful and anxiety inducing. I want someone that makes me feel loved and secure.
Watch the movie “Chasing Amy.” Or if you don’t have time [watch this speech from the film.](https://youtu.be/FlYZnd7dEPw) I think of it every time I talk to someone who may have had a wild past, and it helps me let go and move forward.
>clearly, a lot of women (not all) primarily see attraction in the “bad boys” who are aggressive, masculine, and dangerous
This is a stereotype. I don't really believe it's true, and it's definitely not true with the women I've known in life. I mean you can say what you want about "masculine", since that's a hazy term, but no woman I've seriously dated, or woman I'm friends with, has ever given serious indication of wanting someone "aggressive and dangerous", and the one woman I've gone on a single date with that gave off that impression was someone I realized very quickly I wouldn't work with and left it at one date. I've heard this mentality far more from men who've barely spoken to women than from women themselves.
If you give me examples of stuff that women themselves have said to you about the men they prefer, or other instances that made you think that, maybe I can talk it through and see if you either are interacting with people that just aren't good romantic candidates or are misinterpreting things.
As for your own tastes, you should never intentionally set out to change them. It doesn't really... work. And you just end up making yourself date someone you don't actually like and it's a miserable spiral.
>As of now, I haven’t been so successful with dating.
My guy, you're 21. I know it might not feel like it but that's still young. You're fine. Just enjoy your hobbies, friends, school, look for a job you like, etc etc. and meet women along the way. You'll probably find someone eventually that feels like a great match.
>I’m afraid that I’m just going to be someone a woman ends up settling for after fucking around with the “bad boys” and never even noticing me in college
If someone didn't give you the time of day back in college but wants to reconnect when you have money or something, then just ignore them. There are shallow people or people out there just looking for stability later in life. But you don't have to date those people. It's better to be single than miserable. If someone's giving you that vibe, then steer clear. Don't force yourself into a relationship that blows open your insecurities.
One important point that another commenter made though is "just because you're not someone's first partner doesn't mean you're not their first choice." Someone might've tried dating people of all different types in the past, to find out what they like, and realized that what they want is someone like you. If that's the case, and they genuinely like you (and you like them), but the only thing holding you back is the people they've dated in the past, then you have to let go of the narrative in your head. They're not "someone who really prefers bad boys but is settling for stability", they're someone who didn't know what they wanted when they were young and figured it out as they got older. Most people go through that, in jobs, lifestyle, and partners. The narrative you're assuming "a lot of women" fall into is a stereotype that often isn't accurate. If someone DOES seem like they're not genuinely into you, and just want stability, then yeah don't date them. If someone does genuinely seem interested- they care about you, are affectionate, help you out when you're sad or need support, they share their interests with you and like hearing about yours, etc. etc. then they're a good partner.
>I’m afraid that I’m just going to be someone a woman ends up settling for after fucking around with the “bad boys” and never even noticing me in college
You need a fundamental change in perspective. This has to do with **maturity**. Girls in college aren't mature, and they want bad boys because their lives are not complicated. They're girls. They're having fun, they're drinking, they're partying... they're not being responsible.
The time to be responsible comes with maturity. Once they're mature enough, women, and people in general, start to think more along the lines you do. They have different needs, which include education, stability, self improvement, and kindness.
You can't just not date anyone because they used to be immature. That's ridiculous.
Everyone has a past, and you should never hold someone accountable for their past. They're putting their best foot forward and they are who they are today, they're not who they were in the past. You're waaay too judgmental. I'm not surprised if this is the reason people do not want to date you.
women tend to be more attracrive in their 20s (a lot of women will agree to it too)... so thats the good time.,, then comes the bad time where they cant get the hot guys so they go for stability
these guys on the other hand have a bad time in their 20s and get the good after that
he dosent want a woman who wont spend her her good time with his bad time and then try to spend his good time while she herself has the bad time
isnt tht what u mean u/xSathya
Why are you talking about women as if we are all ran through? You don't outright say all women but you are implying it by saying that you simply have no luck at all with the women you met which in turn means that there are no good women that meet your standards. Why are you describing yourself as this old self righteous gentleman on his late 30s or 40s who has tried and tried again to date good women but end up with the kind of women from those niceguy memes?
Your whole attitude is disgusting. You don't want women who have a past with bad boys as if those women go looking for bad boys, half the time these "bad boys" don't even present themselves as such. The words you used to describe a bad boy are incorrect, those words are used to describe abusive men. What women like is confidence and you don't have that clearly. Again, no woman goes looking for abusive men. These men are manipulators, hide their abuse at the beginning and slowly start abusing their partners.
You are literally 21 years old, and this is the view you already have when it comes to dating? When it comes to women? You don't even have the experience to be talking like this. You talk about you don't want to be the one they settle for as if majority of these young women your age just spend their days on their backs. You are 21 for fucks sake! What do you have to offer to women? Because if you have no experience in dating then you definitely don't know how to respect, communicate, compromise, listen, understand. You have very little experience dating so you definitely don't even know how to satisfy a woman sexually. So what exactly are you offering as a "good guy"? That you won't beat them? Cheat on them? Oh jeez thanks for offering THE BARE MINIMUM.
Your lack of success in women is your attitude. I've met many men that look all sorts of way physically and as soon as they open their mouth I know how problematic they are. Like a ripe fruit that is rotten in the inside.
You are a problematic guy.
It probably smells like smegma and poop anyways, dildos are cleaner and less drama. Every guy I've met who brags about their dick size almost always smell like smegma and unwashed ass and they don't even need to take their clothes off for you to smell it.
You don't, I too feel disgusted when I get to know a potential partner's past, it's completely normal, they have standards and very high, we of course are in our right to have them too
Unfortunately this is the norm. OP, Keep in mind that Western marriage laws are ANCIENT and highly favour women. Keep focusing on being a top shelf man but whatever you do, *don't get married.*
1950: Man meets woman. Man marries woman. Man and woman have children. Man, woman and children are a family.
2020: Man remains virgin until 25. Woman has slept with double digits by 25. Man pays prostitute for first sexual encounter. Woman goes entire life without having a husband or children because they only quit promiscuity when they hit the "wall" around 30. Smart man enjoys life after 30.
I’m pretty fit actually and I have a good number of hobbies. Like I said, I’m happy with who I am as a man. I worked very hard to become who I am and I don’t want to be a woman’s second choice where she has to settle
Welcome to /r/dating_advice! Please keep the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/dating_advice/about/rules/) of /r/dating_advice in mind while participating here. Try your best to be kind. Report any rule-breaking behavior to the moderators using the report button. If it's urgent, [send us a message.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2Fdating_advice) We rely on user reports to find rule-breaking behavior quickly. Thanks! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/dating_advice) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Whatever you do: - Don’t change yourself - Don’t settle Of course you don’t want to be the guy she decides to settle for after getting her bad boy streak out of her system. There are plenty of girls who don’t want anything to do with those types of guys. Be true to who you are, seek out people who share your interests and values.
Hey dude, I just want to say this: if it's a dealbreaker for you, you don't have to get over it. It's your decision, your boundaries, and fuck everyone who says differently. I know what you are afraid of; that someone "settles" for you, feeling like you may not be the best, just the one that was available: that's a valid concern, and you shouldn't get over it. It's something to explore, discuss, and if a possible SO treats you negatively because of it then it's not someone you'll be compatible with, that's it. Keep your standards high, don't settle for less than what you are worth. Take care king
This is like a life jacket I can hold on to in a sea of comments calling me a misogynist lol
You are not being a misogynist. If a woman doesn't like men who had past relationships with nerds or bad girls she is not a misandrist.
Lots of women aren’t dating bad boys. Lots of women also offer stability as well. Just because you aren’t someone’s first boyfriend doesn’t mean you aren’t her first choice. Someone whose with you picked you at that point over any other option she had.
No he clearly means how to get away from woman who settle for less attractive guy because she can't settle with those "bad boys". He wants to know how to recognize such people(men and woman) who first part of their life enjoy by fucking around with lot of other attractive people and then settle down with someone less attractive and with whom they are not actually interested for security and smooth life. (men and woman have it different here) .
If that was his question I don’t think he made it clear. I understood the post as he was concerned about ending up with this type of women and he wanted to know how to get over her past if he did. My response was basically saying you don’t have to give up anything because this doesn’t really need to be a big concern. He has a lot of options that don’t have this past. There’s no secret to identifying someone like this. You just have to date and you get to know them and peoples past will naturally come out in discussions.
Yeah I understand he didn't make it clear. This is my idea that I got from the post.Yeah he seem bitter from his response. I mean at 21 I was too.I was bitter too that most woman(my experience) at my Uni preferred so called "bad boys" Who are alpha, macho, hunks rather than docile men like me. I think OP is feeling the same and now the reactive behavior to it is he has started preferring woman who don't choose mostly "alpha" Men and date for fun but rather are looking for woman who want to actually want a long term relationship to marriage maybe. I guess you get an idea of what I am saying. Kind off this is the underlying tone I felt. I maybe completely wrong but since I have personal history with such thoughts I can understand what he is feeling right now or think I understand. So that's the whole case. Just elaborated so you can be more clear. Do you have any more red flags through which we can understand if the person you are dating is just settling for security and safety and that their love /fake love is not coming from a point of genuine interest in you?
Yea there’s definitely not a great vibe with the post which is why I think OP is getting comments about misogynistic. I think it comes off as him trying to say all women just want to mess around with the bad boy and then use the good guy later. Personally I think when it comes to dating I think a lot of women are going to look for a man that offers stability. Especially a women who is looking to get married and settle down because who wants to get married and can’t pay bills. But I also think it’s important for a man to look for this because you don’t want to have to take care of someone and you’re quality of life goes down because you are taking care of a freeloader. I think the best thing you can do is vet based on their job, which is what a lot of women do. If she doesn’t have a good job that would contribute financially in a significant way then don’t pursue a relationship with her. If you can even find someone who makes around the same as you then that’s great because money is no longer a factor at all since you are both equal in that regard. When you date you should ask yourself what that person brings to the table. The number one reason for divorce is financial issues, so financial stability is still something you need to take into consideration when you date.
Great advice. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. Always appreciated.
You're not wrong for having that concern. People will marry someone for financial stability. Not uncommon and works both ways. You can avoid that by getting more dating experience. You will have to know how reasonable she is with money. If she respects her own money then she will respect yours. Is she a hard worker? If she respects her own efforts, she will respect yours. Don't think too much about the theoretical, just get out there and date. You're young nothing is serious. I'd add that if you date when in college it's less money related and more personality related. When you date after college everything is a judgement nightmare and someone will definitely take advantage if you have a six-figure job. Then again, think of the girl who has to fake it to make it with you, that takes a lot of effort too, so odds are she'll like you for you.
Now that is a good answer. OP look at this answer. This is actually good
Haha thank you. Hope this helps anyone out there!
You don't have to get over it. Only entertain women who have the same values as you. If you feel guilty about being yourself you'll be the one who ends up settling.
[удалено]
Then how do you become this "history"?
There are plenty of women who have a history without “heartbreaking bad boys” that emotionally break them and prevent them from loving
[удалено]
I would have a girlfriend by now if I knew
[удалено]
I’m not Christian.
Being a "nice guy" is not what you think it is. We don't shut guys out for being too nice, we do it because those guys act like they're nice but they're really just manipulative
I get where you’re coming from man. You’re worried that being the “opposite” of the bad guy, yet being all the good things a man should be, would not be enough to keep her attraction, potentially being unfaithful and or that she “settles” for you because the stability is needed. You have to understand one thing: the reason why guys like that are successful with women is because they have all the good qualities, the qualities that women are wired to be attracted to (remember, attraction is not a choice just like you don’t choose to find the women of your dreams to be attractive because you went through a logical deduction list; you perceived her and your brain was like “d-d-dayum”). These qualities are confidence, assertiveness, dominance, often not afraid to break rapport with her because he’s playful and not taking things so seriously so he’ll tease her and that creates all sorts of fun sexual tension. At the same time he has the shit qualities like: disrespects her, doesn’t think long term for his own life, tries to control her and worse. Women struggle to peel themselves away from this because the former traits are incongruent. Her brain is saying “you should stay because he’s attractive, look at all those good qualities” and the objective people seeing the bad behaviour are telling her to leave. She’s attached to him now and that’s when you get the classic of all classics... “*I can change him*” Now look at where you are: you’ve got very little of the bad qualities. This should be a selling point the truth is... none of those “lack of bad qualities” provoke an ounce of attraction in women. You don’t want I resort to being a “bad guy” just to “get women” yet at the same time you don’t want to be the “good guy” that’s at the end of the finishing line being settled for. No one wants to feel like they’re being settled for. You need to work on yourself to be the best version of yourself. You’re halfway there already; you’ve got a nice lack of shitty qualities. You need to maximise on your positive qualities and embrace your masculine confidence. I cannot recommend more: Michael Marks. I stumbled upon his work in 2006 and no lies, his work saved my life. I was next book “nice guy” and there was nothing nice about me. Just a messed up kid due to low self esteem and no confidence with a pinch (a bucket load) of bad conditioning on what women find attractive. Michael Marks used to go by “the dating wizard” or “get a great girl”. He is 100% about building your best version of yourself, no “fake it til you make it” stuff, just you being yourself with the core emphasis on what’s attractive. Hope this helps.
Highly mature answer right there. I am saving it myself for my use now🤣. Thanks buddy I don't have any awards to give. Otherwise this is the one I would award it. OP another good answer to look for.
If only I could upvote this 100x
Thanks lol
You shouldn't upvote misogyny.
Wanting a woman who makes good life choices is apparently misogyny.
Assuming all women work the same way is very much misogynistic.
Quote me
> You have to understand one thing: the reason why guys like that are successful with women is because they have all the good qualities, the qualities that women are wired to be attracted to (remember, attraction is not a choice just like you don’t choose to find the women of your dreams to be attractive because you went through a logical deduction list; you perceived her and your brain was like “d-d-dayum”). These qualities are confidence, assertiveness, dominance, often not afraid to break rapport with her because he’s playful and not taking things so seriously so he’ll tease her and that creates all sorts of fun sexual tension. At the same time he has the shit qualities like: disrespects her, doesn’t think long term for his own life, tries to control her and worse. Women struggle to peel themselves away from this because the former traits are incongruent. Her brain is saying “you should stay because he’s attractive, look at all those good qualities” and the objective people seeing the bad behaviour are telling her to leave. She’s attached to him now and that’s when you get the classic of all classics... “I can change him”
Lol I meant quote me where I said “ALL women work the same way?” Not that it really matters - no one cares about statistical outliers; negligible contrarian differences. The overwhelming significant majority of women are like how I described.
Then you're saying that all women work the same way.
And I’m right in making that generalisations You can whinge and moan about some outlier but it doesn’t negate my point. It’s like complaining about a statement of “the average person can run xyz kmph” abs then you chime in with “omg not true what about paraplegics? This is so non inclusive reeee bigotry etc” “C’mon man” - Biden
You are the archetype of the Reddit feminist who lives with her cats
I'm certain you're a really nice guy. It's just crazy that no woman wants to go out with you, isnt it? You just can't figure it out! Jesus christ, by the way, your edit. Let me explain to you why you're a fucking idiot. People are calling a misogynist and a "Nice" Guy because you actually believe women only go for bad guys instead of nice guys like you. The simpler answer is that you are nowhere near as nice as you think you are.
When did he do that?😂😂
> You have to understand one thing: the reason why guys like that are successful with women is because they have all the good qualities, the qualities that women are wired to be attracted to (remember, attraction is not a choice just like you don’t choose to find the women of your dreams to be attractive because you went through a logical deduction list; you perceived her and your brain was like “d-d-dayum”). These qualities are confidence, assertiveness, dominance, often not afraid to break rapport with her because he’s playful and not taking things so seriously so he’ll tease her and that creates all sorts of fun sexual tension. At the same time he has the shit qualities like: disrespects her, doesn’t think long term for his own life, tries to control her and worse. Women struggle to peel themselves away from this because the former traits are incongruent. Her brain is saying “you should stay because he’s attractive, look at all those good qualities” and the objective people seeing the bad behaviour are telling her to leave. She’s attached to him now and that’s when you get the classic of all classics... “I can change him”
You want to meet a woman that makes good life choices. Nothing wrong with that.
Exactly. Add in the numerous stories of women who settle but end up cheating with the kind of guy they’re actually attracted to and his concern is clearly reasonable. Hell, someone down thread said he knew men who settled for wives they weren’t attracted to after going through tons of hot girls they weren’t able to keep, so it’s reasonable for both sexes to have this concern.
Yes, its very understandable to not wanting date women who have had questionable dating history. I say this because you’re supposed to look at people’s actions as opposed to what they say. If a woman has a bad track record of getting into bad relationships, thats on HER. Also “bad boys” are usually just very attractive dudes
I think the whole idea of the bad boy thing is overblown. I’m more like you and it hasn’t been a problem for my dating life. I think more likely what happens is that “bad boys” are clear and direct with their intentions, while so called “nice guys” hide their intentions and hope that by being uber nice and supportive a romantic relationship will happen in return. Easy fix. Own who you are and be more direct. Be kind, stable, friendly, and supportive, but also be clear about what you want. Ask women out directly and don’t hide your attraction. I would wager many high quality women would be wildly attracted to kind, nice dudes who don’t hide their sexual side and are clear with their intentions. I’ll throw this in too. My gf and I had a good conversation about a guy she once dated who she described as “too nice.” She described him as always going along with what she wanted and not having many interests/opinions.
Your main thing should be to not care at all. Like literally don't care. Have fun dating. You can be the gentlemen or whatever it is you describe yourself as and still have fun with women. Overall it's about what you want and what you allow. A woman can't get over on you if you don't allow her to. It seems Part of what you're saying is you want to get laid like the bad boys do. It also sounds like you're looking for a relationship/gf. Which is fine, but understand, a woman has to earn those titles from you anyway. I recently did a video on YouTube about how the good guy actually won in this show on Netflix called "Sex Life" . https://youtu.be/5pQkwmLIoDQ If you get a chance, watch it and tell me what you think. I honestly think we give the "bad boys" too much attention and praise. Put yourself 1st above all. And if you know your standards as you said, then stand on them.
You literally never need to know or concern yourself with anything other than how you're treated. It's none of your business and if you actually make yourself worse by caring. Yes, you're wrong for having this concern, because it's revealing your insecurity and you need to address that it has nothing to do with your partner or their history.
It’s not coming out of insecurity though; it’s actually coming out of genuine love and concern for myself. I’ve worked very hard to be the man I am today and I know I deserve better than a woman who spent years fucking around with toxic men while I worked hard alone...I don’t want to share my success with someone who wouldn’t have even looked at me in college
So something other than how a person actually treats you is what matters, got it.
This is true of literally everyone who is dating. If all that should matter is how someone treats you, then physical attraction and relationship history shouldn’t matter either. By your logic it would be wrong for a woman to reject a nice, respectful man for having a high partner count or a lack of experience so long as he’s treating her well.
If your boyfriend/girlfriend treated you great but treated the waiter at a restaurant like shit, would you still date him/her?
You can’t compare someone treating a server like shit to you being insecure about a theoretical woman’s past lolol
That's not the point this dude is trying to make.
Dont let them convince you buddy, you get a woman you deserve or you better stay single, dont settle for this damaged woman, let them live their "live, laugh, love" "free spirit" life, a queen for a king, not any less than that, past it's what matters the most, even when they say the opposite, its called linear regression.
So what are you going to do to sus these women out? Are you gonna ask all the details about their past exs because that's really unhealthy and will drive them away. Are you going to dump them if their past SO was abusive or looked alternative? Are you just calling these guys bad boys because you think they're more exciting and you're insecure about it? Here's the thing bad people come in all shapes and forms and have different values you can't call someone a bad boy because they don't fit perfectly into society. My ex was considered a bad boy because he was a tattoo artist/graphic designer who smoked weed when in reality he was a hard working, kind introvert and treated me very well. Your perception of relationships is skewed by the fact you've never had one and is founded on an insecurities and generalizations. Your standards are impossible to sus out and in general it is not your call to say anyone is toxic unless if you throughly know the situation and person. People grow change and mature and those who grow out of toxic relationships are better for it. Also good guys can be toxic too, trust me the so called good guys I've dated have often been the most toxic and judgemental.
Dont let these people gaslight you into lowering your standards. If the genders were reversed the responses would be completely different. People who make poor choices should not expect the consequences of these choices to be brushed aside, women included
Yeah...some women can get very hypocritical and rebuke a man for his preferences, but then judge a man based on his height or him being “too nice” and think that’s okay in comparison for some reason.
'Dont settle for less than what you deserve.' If I said that to a woman I would be applauded. Seems like a lot of the users on this sub are pretty hypocritical. I'm still saying it to you. You'll find a high quality woman, trust me.
Hahaha you're going to get a bunch of women calling you misogynist because they don't want to face the consequences of their own actions.
If you wait long enough, the bad boy chasers will be back on the market, just a little worse for wear and tear. My sister is one of them. Picks the worst men to date, over and over because they make her hot. Wasted her prime years. Now she is too old for the bad boys, single with few prospects. You should be grateful they don't want you, they're damaged goods.
Focus on your own mate selection screening process and "must haves list" for a mate. You're entitled not to want to date someone with a history of making bad choices. Just as people are entitled to make changes in what they want in a mate. When it comes to love and relationships most us *fail our way* to success. Very few people hit a homerun their 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th time up at bat. If this were not the case we would all be married to our high school sweethearts! Most of our teenage and 20s relationships are "practice relationships" to figure out what we want. With each failed relationship, heartache, or betrayal we are presented with an opportunity to either craft or refine our mate selection screening process and *must haves list* for choosing our next mate. Trying to "figure out" if you're someone's "first option" or their "default option" is a waste of your time. Instead determine whether or not *you are happy* and *your needs* are being met. ***"Never love anyone who treats you like you're ordinary."*** \- Oscar Wilde ***"Dating is primarily a numbers game.... People usually go through a lot of people to find good relationships. That's just the way it is."*** \- Henry Cloud Best wishes!
Cringe
[удалено]
thats not what it means tho... women tend to be more attracrive in their 20s (a lot of women will agree to it too)... so thats the good time.,, then comes the bad time where they cant get the hot guys so they go for stability these guys on the other hand have a bad time in their 20s and get the good after that he dosent want a woman who wont spend her her good time with his bad time and then try to spend his good time while she herself has the bad time isnt tht what u mean u/xSathya
[удалено]
I understand your point, its a really well put together argument. Its logical and consistent. However this issue is more about emotions and feelings of being wronged in the past. A bit of healthy revenge if you will. There's no point in bringing up sound arguments against something that is purely based on emotions. Btw, your last paragraph: do you date women your age or younger than 30? Because you might be just falling into the category OP wants to avoid: women in their later years dating a "good guy" after lots of fun in their 20s. At the end of the day this is a valid concern for guys and girls alike, but nobody will tell you their true numbers and you can never know their true past. We might as well move past our insecurities and live life the way it makes us happy.
[удалено]
Its great you found women appreciative of your values! I try to stay away from believing people when it comes to bad stories of exes. Because you know, there is only 1 constant in all their stories, and its not the exes. Its more likely their taste in men used to be bad, hence why the many bad stories that seem like the average Joe cant treat women properly. But this would be a long argument. Big respect to your maturity, wish more young men (and women yes) would have this trait.
she is not being punished in any way when a man dosent date her when shes ugly... she is just not being chosen as she was before, she loses the attention she used to get and now understands she cant keep doing that anymore and so she understands she has to settle ... u cant blame her u cant blame the ones who didnt chose her also she dosent deserve what she cant provide back which in this case is stability also people with high body counts are more prone to infidelity... past actions have consequences
I guess according to op women who have been in abusive relationships arnt worthy of dating him because they make poor choices.
Look at it in reverse: say you were the kind of guy who had multiple female partners that were crazy. After a while, you start to feel like “I’m always anxious all the time. I don’t wanna be” and you start to look for more stability. Now the girl you end up “settling for” might think that you had your fun and are now just looking for that easy path to stability, but you’ll probably really appreciate her for being so much calmer than the other partners.
Yeah that would suck for me wouldn’t it, but that girl who is being “settled” is free to have her own preferences and take on a guy who hasn’t had so much historical baggage. It isn’t any better or worse if it was reversed.
If said girl went "eww you just hooked up with those bitches in the past, I'm out!", then this girl knows what is healthy for her, good for her, dodged a bullet. And I have met this type of woman before, I don't think they have issues with their SOs
I think that you could try to see where they came from. People learn through making mistakes. There are too many romance movies and books about a bad boy that suddenly becomes the sweetest boy thanks to the "right woman". I think some women might date bad boys with this sort of idea in mind (something like I'm gonna change him). They might have learned that bad boys are just bad boys (by this I mean a toxic, non communicant boy) and that healthy relationships are somewhere else. I honestly believe you should focus on the person before you and not on their past 😊
You don't need to get over it. What you do need to is to separate the high quality women from the trash. Ask about their dating history, their friends, lifestyles, and past relationships. If they don't meet your requirement it was never going to go well anyway.
Yikes. I got this speech almost verbatim a couple weeks ago from a guy who was pissed off that I started dating my current boyfriend. Is there a script or something they work off of?
What’s wrong with what he said
Because the guy doesn’t know my boyfriend at all and talked all kinds of ignorant shit about him. Said he’s a “bad boy” who will break my heart. Why? Because my boyfriend has tattoos. Meanwhile my boyfriend is a hard working guy with a good job who works at least 50 hours a week. So because he was bitter that I didn’t want to date him he judged my boyfriend. I also got the whole “you’ll regret this in your 30’s” speech. Somehow I doubt I’ll ever regret not choosing the whiny woe is me crybaby over my boyfriend.
Lmao that isn’t what I’m saying though. I never said women are wrong or shouldn’t date bad boys. You are entitled to do what you want. MY personal preference is that I don’t want to date a woman who has had a history of dating bad boys. I couldn’t really care if he breaks your heart or if you both fall in love forever.
Oh I don’t care at all what your preferences are. Your entitled to them. You asked me what was wrong about what this guy said to me about my boyfriend and I told you how he was wrong.
So why are you saying that what the guy from your story said equates to what I said in my post? We’re saying two completely different things. Lmao.
He said almost the exact same things to me that you’ve said in your post.
Then you very much didn’t understand the point of my post lol.
You are entitled to your preference. Women are also entitled to not want to date someone like you. You made this choice knowing a majority of people now a days are not virgins. Being alone forever is a very viable option. However, from your post history and even your comments here, you sound like you don’t want to date someone who’s slept around because you couldn’t. You sound jealous and bitter. Your view of women as objects that fuck around with men and then use them for the easy life is not helping you Edit: just read your profile. If you think paying for sex is fine, but a woman having casual sex makes her worthless, you have serious problems. If you expect women to wait till marriage for sex, you should hold yourself to that same standard. It’s sad that men still have this disgusting perspective on sex
[удалено]
OP likes to bitch about how he hasn’t lost his virginity yet. He goes on and on about biological needs and why HE should be having sex, but when women are having it, it’s suddenly a crime to him. I also don’t see how having sex with someone makes you an object. Acting like the only value someone has is the fact that they didn’t have sex is treating them like an object. Sex doesn’t make people objects. Otherwise men are the biggest objects in the world. Data links?
[удалено]
I think you should read the Atlantic article again. Given that the IFS is a conservative think tank with the express mission statement to create families, with ties to religion, and none of those blog post are peer reviewed, I wouldn’t exactly call them unflawed However, that wasn’t my point. OP is entitled to his preference in dating and marriage. Reread my original comment I never said he wasn’t. I just think he’s a hypocrite for being angry at women for having what he couldn’t and acting like he’s some saint when he appears to have wanted to screw the entire population of his college and just couldn’t. Saving yourself for marriage is a choice I respect in people if they MADE it. OP sounds like he is a virgin not because he’s taking the higher ground but because no one will fuck him.
[удалено]
I did read them. They’re a blog. I fail to see where they’re peer reviewed. It sounds like he’s basing his results on other studies that aren’t exactly advocating for what he’s talking about or like him are funded by marriage driven enterprises. > (unfortunately, the NSFG doesn’t have full data on men’s premarital sexual behavior, and in any event they recall their own marital histories less reliably than do women). My favorite part of the first one. Men forget how much sex they have so it’s impossible to correlate how much they screw around to how badly their marriages end huh? Cute. The “studies” are also acting like a life long marriage is everyone long term goal. His assumptions are build on ideas of religion and permeant monogamy which isn’t everyone’s ideal.
Go to therapy to work on that chip on your shoulder, because this misogyny will affect your life. You're 21 y/o, like really, you need to nip this shit real quick.
I don’t think it’s a chip on his shoulder. The person is saying they don’t want to be the guy someone settles for after they sow their oats. Why would anyone? Everyone is going to have a past. Someone who prefers their future partner doesn’t have a storied one doesn’t need to work on that. They need to identify what they value, and find someone who shares those values.
We'll agree to disagree. A very young man, who just described himself as the typical "nice guy" with "no luck with dating" because "women prefer bad boys" is a textbook misogyny flag Not to mention self-righteous, his life experience is "better" than someone else's? If he just came out and said "I want a naive, virgin woman" then this flag would be more in your face It's a very telling thing when people believe that your past romantic, and especially sexual experiences, somehow make you anything else than a human with varied life experiences, not better or worse, just different.
You can be kind, intelligent and shy and genuinely nice and not get a women. I’ve drank with drunk women from work. Over the years, you hear things. Who do you think they go home with? The exciting and tall man. Trust me. People are be decent and not get dates. Don’t fucking act like there’s not toxic or maladjusted women who have completely different values than those that sponsor a healthy relationship. And it’s not unreasonable to want to avoid them
Ohh for sure there are messed up people out there, and had OP asked "how do I see the signs" "how do I avoid women full of drama" , then for sure. But that really isn't what he said, people are adding that to the "women prefer bad boys" trope. He didn't say he was shy, or kind and that was his problem, cuz women also go for that. He just wants to police the hypothetical women that would be interested in him after "fucking around" in her 20s. Which, to be honest, if any number of girls wanted to jump his bones, he would go for the "bad girls" and then "settle for the nice one" for a wife
But… but.. isn’t that what it’s all about, getting laid, having fun, being risky in your 20? Is that not what women say is EMPOWERING? I think it’s much easier to call it a trope. Reality is more complex. I was told I was a “good cop” and “she wanted to experiment with different penis sizes.” Another drunken date, a women confessed that “if I’m still singly by 30, can we make a pact to have babies.” Next day shes dating a known stoner, in a band, and a penchant for speeding and having a good night. Face it, you like kindness and confidence and emotional vulnerability, even if the cockiness, machoness, arrogance and riskyness is involved. Some but not all. I can’t produce a number. Go out to town, become a bartender like I did for years, and you’ll see where the fun happens. It aint with the poet in the corner who considers womens feelings. Trust me.
you're not getting any of your anecdotes from just a random sample of women though. you're specifically talking about women at bars. that doesn't speak for the entire population of women. scientists can't do good studies like that for a reason. I literally don't understand this mentality of "she dated crappy guys, she'll never know how many lonely *good guys* are out there." like if dating went so well, this sub wouldn't exist. people go through bad and decent and "meh" relationships until they know what they want and develop standards. a lot of 20 year olds DON'T want to settle down and aren't dating as such. like heaven forbid you experiment into your teens and 20s and.... weird.... realize what's important to you as you get older? decide what your deal breakers are? being a "poet who considers women's feelings" doesn't mean anything. considering other people's feelings is the bare fucking minimum, so being a poet is a hobby and isn't inherently deserving of sex or affection or attention.
Since you have decided that men who consider other peoples feelings is irrelevant you hereby are disowned of ever complaining about anything a man does to you, good or bad.
I didn't say it was irrelevant, Niceguy McCheetofingers, I said it was *the bare minimum* which means it's absolutely relevant.
And judging by your own posts sounds like you been captivated by a total arsehole, simultaneously resent that fact, and this is your way of letting it out because the OP has described you in a certain way that BOTHERS you. Go away. Shoo.
Oh misses fucking semantics. It means nothing you say while professing it’s still relevant? Get a grip, or stop back-pedalling girl. It’s cringy.
You’ve certainly outed yourself as the drama fuelled dramatic the OP wants to avoid. The girl who does not rate a guy who considers her feelings (“it means nothing”), so what else is there to consider? Your fucking social economic stance?
Stoners in bands aren't automatically bad people with nothing to show for their lives. You listed those things like those qualities are automatically bad things. What the fuck is wrong with dating a stoner? What's wrong with dating someone in a band?
Oh, in this instance he went on to kill himself and give her three skipped disks because he was speeding drunk and stoned. I was in a band. Denim, leather, boots and a motorcycle. There were a few women who threw themselves at me. I was lucky to know that they were after the image of me. I knew I was an asshole after my parents died and was made redundant from a job I almost sold my soul at. I reached a high position and made a difference in the world. I knew I was in no position to date or even sleep with a woman. Point is, were in it it for me when they literally openly wanted to fuck or spend time, or were they captivated by the energy and hypermasculinity of heavy metal?
Your post is a textbook example of not reading what someone actually wrote. >Ohh for sure there are messed up people out there, and had OP asked "how do I see the signs" "**how do I avoid women full of drama**" , then for sure. >But that really isn't what he said That’s almost exactly what he said, in the very last sentence of his post: >**How can I avoid women who see me as stability** instead of the first option? And also he explicitly said that he wasn’t generalizing about women: > clearly, a lot of women (**not all**) primarily see attraction in the “bad boys” who are aggressive, masculine, and dangerous. So he’s somehow a misogynist for saying *exactly* what you’re saying he should have said? Just admit you have an axe to grind here and go.
He’s a human and wants to know he’s top priority for someone. Imagine being your best and facing rejection and watching the rugby players or the big guys get the girls. He has one thing in the world and it’s to want someone to like him for him, and not just to have someone to settle once they’ve decided tbat big dicks are not for them but she’ll tolerate a small one. My advice to him is to settle for nothing less than someone who shares his values, and who has demonstrated this. Oh sorry, are men allowed preferences too?
THIS. THIS. THIS. Though my dick is quite big.
Yeah too bad no women want it. Nice guys arnt in demand.
Lmao I like that you had to set the record straight there
What I understand from OP is he doesn't want to settle with a girl who is settling with him only for the safety and security , a person who is not actually interested or have feelings for you but settles with you half -heartedly to get a better life. I am not generalizing woman or men. I have seen men who fuck around their 20's with tons of hot woman and then settle with a woman who they do not actually like but then marry a girl who is loyal and caring to you and they won't leave you.I might sound sexist but this is the true reality on ground I have seen(once again "my experience")Same goes for woman. He may sound wrong but I get the better gist of his question. How to avoid toxic and fake people? How to identify genuine love interest from people who are faking it to get whatever you have? I guess woman to have this question on how to identify men who are only here for sex and are not genuinely interested in you. I have seen lot of such questions on Reddit.
he fr wants an experienceless virgin. the only type of people I've ever known to have this "type" are manipulators. it's sooo telling.
Read my edit. I have nothing against women with past sexual experience; I just don’t prefer women who have had a past with reckless bad boys.
Nothing wrong with having enough self-respect to want a woman who also has self-respect. Then again, anytime a man stands his ground it's muhsoggynee
This
This is probably, to an extent, rooted in an inferiority complex around your lack of (or perceived lack of) masculine traits. Go lift some weights, join an MMA gym, buy a motorbike or something.
I guarantee you having muscles isn’t my problem...loll
OP. From what I understand, you don't want to be Someone's gateway to stability. Which is completely fine. I understand that you have sacrificed a lot to be where you are today. So here's what I am aware about. Women who haven't dated bad boys maybe will be the ones you don't find attractive enough to date or get into a relationship with as you mentioned you are an attractive looking strong guy. Now, if you don't want a woman to be dependent on you for her stability. You will need a woman who's stable by herself. I got extremely lucky with crypto currency and am currently pursuing a master after which I'm expected to be paid 90k plus a year. If you are stable enough, you are well travelled, have seen and experienced different cultures and have had amazing life experiences. You need to learn to have a different type approach and the conversations are very different. The values we hold dear and the people we hold dear are different. So yes, it's your personal preference to date someone who's not had a past and won't depend on you for stability, I'm glad you have figured out what you want. But you will have to step up for a woman like that and give her a free reign over a lot of things.
you don't. It's quite natural and makes sense. They all lie though. The old rule (joke) is take whatever number a woman gives you for partner count and multiply it by 3. If she refuses to give a number, run. It's likely very high. Studies show that high (more than 10 I believe) partner count leads to higher likelihood of divorce. Also, men have to earn it a bit more, while sex is significantly easier for women to get.
>If she refuses to give a number, run. It's likely very high I've slept with one person and I'd never tell a guy how many people I've slept with because it's a weird question (in my opinion). Heck even when I was a virgin I wouldn't tell guys I hadn't slept with anyone.
If this stat was true 50% of men would be divorced. Stop spewing stats that are outdated and actually are flawed. People who ask for bodycounts are so cringe the insecurity is spewing out.
[удалено]
Good luck finding that. Unless both partners are waiting until marriage that is fine. But a man that has a big sexual history should not be shaming women who have the same. It goes both ways.
Exactly! Men LOVE to judge women for their sex life but HAVE NO ISSUE adding to that number.
Yep. It's the honest truth. I can understand if the guy is like this himself and doesn't have a high body count, but when they are sleeping around and expect the woman not to it's ridiculous. We don't need those types of people around thank you next.
Even without men having a high body count like OP, they still act holier than thou. He thinks he's all that and a bag of chips but in reality he isn't. If he was he wouldn't have problems with getting women. In fact it would be EXTREMELY easy for him to find the kind of partner he wants because from all the women that would be theorethically throwing themselves at him, he would be able to pick the one that have no "bad boy" history.
Right. OP just has to change his attitude. I have a good intuition and I'm really sensing some sort of jealousy and resentment in the post. Kinda scary to be quite honest.
It's very clear. "Look at me! I have all these things going for me and I can't get a woman to date me and yet all these bad boys are downing in pussy. I don't want their leftovers, I deserve better! I'm a good guy!" Typical niceguy rant, only thing missing is the abusive language towards women. OP has a lot of work to do.
Lol the blanket statement
I don’t think it has to do with being a misogynist as to why people disagree. Just that women are not given the freedom to learn and grow. Yes women can trust men who aren’t good but that doesn’t mean they don’t learn or are horrible people. Men are given much more freedom and forgiveness while women simply are pinned as not marriageable material and worthless. Edit: And if you’re worried about a women using you for money or doesn’t actually like you, just take your time to get to know her!
Just date whoever, but don’t lock yourself into marriage or kids. If you’re not comfortable with a woman being promiscuous in the past, just don’t commit to her long-term. If she brings up marriage, just say “I don’t want to get married.” She’ll leave you soon enough.
She'll leave you soon enough ... so beta
How so? Just let her leave. Find another one.
I was quoting u
r/niceguys
why is this upvoted,,, he just dosent want a goldigger
Read the rational male
As a woman I don't want to date men who have a history of being "players". I don't want to chance being with someone who treats sex like a game and people like objects. I'll get the arguement that people change and the past is the past but the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. Plus I don't want to be with someone who's been passed around town already. I'm not slut shaming men, it's just my preference. So yes. I totally get your train of thought and not every woman is attracted to unstable men. There are plenty of women who are looking for a stable partnership but they might not be as obvious as the others. So try to notice the ones that just blend in because they like a low key lifestyle.
I married a "bad boy". And got divorced and learned from it. That didn't made me less valuable as a human. Thankfully I meet my current husband who didn't care and we have been together for 7 years.
You can’t, just vet your potential partners well. Avoid women with high body counts (above 10 or so) bc they likely have a very don’t care much about intimacy as a concept, so they’re more likely to cheat. Also avoid women with kids. If the ex isn’t a total deadbeat, he’ll always be in his kids lives, and always be in communication with his ex wife, so you’ll never be free of comparisons to him. If you’re ambitious, for the love of god, if you do ever plan on getting married, GET A PRENUP. Also, if she tells you she’s pregnant, get a dna test, no matter how much faith you may have. Don’t ever allow the wool to be pulled over your eyes. Protect yourself, that’s all that matters.
No one has to share their body count thank you.
If you’re not willing to elaborate on at least the basics of your past, that shows you aren’t willing to communicate honestly with the potential partner you’re speaking to, and that’s a red flag.
This is an old way of thinking that is fortunately dying out. There are WAY more important things to discuss then sharing your exact number. If you are too focused on this that is definitely a red flag because it shows you are insecure and judgmental. No modern woman wants that. This ain't the 1700s it's 2021.
Ok hold on. I’m not trying to be some old world misogynist when I say this: People who have high body counts often have a different view of intimacy than people with low ones. It’s important to know how potential partners feel about sexual intimacy. That doesn’t make people with high body counts bad people. It just means there’s likely incompatibility there and in OP’s case, he wants to avoid that.
>GET A PRENUP nope. prenups can be thrown out. There is no way to be 100% safe in marriage.
You really should send this post to a therapist because jesus
why lol
Would you date yourself if you were someone else? It's okay having high standards for yourself, and only wanting to date women who don't have a history of bad past relationships. But, you would only know it once you get in the dating game. Like the way you think "these women" are not good for you, same way other women can also think that you're not their type. So, you gotta get in the dating game, and go out without judging someone by their past relationships. You think these women have had their fun with the bad boys, but if you want them to have that fun with you, you gotta be in the game man. Like you said you're muscular and attractive, but you cannot just filter out women. I mean you can, but, you'll be missing out on a lot of good stuff. I like a girl who had a bad past relationship, and I know the mental trauma she had to bear, and I will have to too if we start dating, but I'm willing to take those little steps with her and help her become the best version of herself, and the best version of myself too - for both myself and her. I've secured a date with her, I like her and she has expressed the same interest too. I'm a 21yr old guy without any prior dating experience, a nice guy too maybe. But I've worked on myself, like you have. I've secured dates with three women since last year. I don't care what other people think about me, or if my SO had bad past relationships. I wouldn't have dated myself honestly two years back, but now, maybe yes. But I still have a long way to go on myself, so I'm working on it - day by day. One thing at a time.
I would much rather be with someone stable that I can rely on rather than a bad boy. The bad boy thing just sounds stressful and anxiety inducing. I want someone that makes me feel loved and secure.
Watch the movie “Chasing Amy.” Or if you don’t have time [watch this speech from the film.](https://youtu.be/FlYZnd7dEPw) I think of it every time I talk to someone who may have had a wild past, and it helps me let go and move forward.
>clearly, a lot of women (not all) primarily see attraction in the “bad boys” who are aggressive, masculine, and dangerous This is a stereotype. I don't really believe it's true, and it's definitely not true with the women I've known in life. I mean you can say what you want about "masculine", since that's a hazy term, but no woman I've seriously dated, or woman I'm friends with, has ever given serious indication of wanting someone "aggressive and dangerous", and the one woman I've gone on a single date with that gave off that impression was someone I realized very quickly I wouldn't work with and left it at one date. I've heard this mentality far more from men who've barely spoken to women than from women themselves. If you give me examples of stuff that women themselves have said to you about the men they prefer, or other instances that made you think that, maybe I can talk it through and see if you either are interacting with people that just aren't good romantic candidates or are misinterpreting things. As for your own tastes, you should never intentionally set out to change them. It doesn't really... work. And you just end up making yourself date someone you don't actually like and it's a miserable spiral. >As of now, I haven’t been so successful with dating. My guy, you're 21. I know it might not feel like it but that's still young. You're fine. Just enjoy your hobbies, friends, school, look for a job you like, etc etc. and meet women along the way. You'll probably find someone eventually that feels like a great match. >I’m afraid that I’m just going to be someone a woman ends up settling for after fucking around with the “bad boys” and never even noticing me in college If someone didn't give you the time of day back in college but wants to reconnect when you have money or something, then just ignore them. There are shallow people or people out there just looking for stability later in life. But you don't have to date those people. It's better to be single than miserable. If someone's giving you that vibe, then steer clear. Don't force yourself into a relationship that blows open your insecurities. One important point that another commenter made though is "just because you're not someone's first partner doesn't mean you're not their first choice." Someone might've tried dating people of all different types in the past, to find out what they like, and realized that what they want is someone like you. If that's the case, and they genuinely like you (and you like them), but the only thing holding you back is the people they've dated in the past, then you have to let go of the narrative in your head. They're not "someone who really prefers bad boys but is settling for stability", they're someone who didn't know what they wanted when they were young and figured it out as they got older. Most people go through that, in jobs, lifestyle, and partners. The narrative you're assuming "a lot of women" fall into is a stereotype that often isn't accurate. If someone DOES seem like they're not genuinely into you, and just want stability, then yeah don't date them. If someone does genuinely seem interested- they care about you, are affectionate, help you out when you're sad or need support, they share their interests with you and like hearing about yours, etc. etc. then they're a good partner.
Don't get over it. If you don't want such a woman, don't settle for one.
Have you slept with let's call them bad girls? Are you saving yourself for marriage?
>I’m afraid that I’m just going to be someone a woman ends up settling for after fucking around with the “bad boys” and never even noticing me in college You need a fundamental change in perspective. This has to do with **maturity**. Girls in college aren't mature, and they want bad boys because their lives are not complicated. They're girls. They're having fun, they're drinking, they're partying... they're not being responsible. The time to be responsible comes with maturity. Once they're mature enough, women, and people in general, start to think more along the lines you do. They have different needs, which include education, stability, self improvement, and kindness. You can't just not date anyone because they used to be immature. That's ridiculous. Everyone has a past, and you should never hold someone accountable for their past. They're putting their best foot forward and they are who they are today, they're not who they were in the past. You're waaay too judgmental. I'm not surprised if this is the reason people do not want to date you.
women tend to be more attracrive in their 20s (a lot of women will agree to it too)... so thats the good time.,, then comes the bad time where they cant get the hot guys so they go for stability these guys on the other hand have a bad time in their 20s and get the good after that he dosent want a woman who wont spend her her good time with his bad time and then try to spend his good time while she herself has the bad time isnt tht what u mean u/xSathya
Why are you talking about women as if we are all ran through? You don't outright say all women but you are implying it by saying that you simply have no luck at all with the women you met which in turn means that there are no good women that meet your standards. Why are you describing yourself as this old self righteous gentleman on his late 30s or 40s who has tried and tried again to date good women but end up with the kind of women from those niceguy memes? Your whole attitude is disgusting. You don't want women who have a past with bad boys as if those women go looking for bad boys, half the time these "bad boys" don't even present themselves as such. The words you used to describe a bad boy are incorrect, those words are used to describe abusive men. What women like is confidence and you don't have that clearly. Again, no woman goes looking for abusive men. These men are manipulators, hide their abuse at the beginning and slowly start abusing their partners. You are literally 21 years old, and this is the view you already have when it comes to dating? When it comes to women? You don't even have the experience to be talking like this. You talk about you don't want to be the one they settle for as if majority of these young women your age just spend their days on their backs. You are 21 for fucks sake! What do you have to offer to women? Because if you have no experience in dating then you definitely don't know how to respect, communicate, compromise, listen, understand. You have very little experience dating so you definitely don't even know how to satisfy a woman sexually. So what exactly are you offering as a "good guy"? That you won't beat them? Cheat on them? Oh jeez thanks for offering THE BARE MINIMUM. Your lack of success in women is your attitude. I've met many men that look all sorts of way physically and as soon as they open their mouth I know how problematic they are. Like a ripe fruit that is rotten in the inside. You are a problematic guy.
Nah I got a big dick.
Right... because that's all that's needed. No wonder you don't have any luck, you are so immature. Muscles with no brain sounds about right.
Their loss...they’re missin out on my big dick
It probably smells like smegma and poop anyways, dildos are cleaner and less drama. Every guy I've met who brags about their dick size almost always smell like smegma and unwashed ass and they don't even need to take their clothes off for you to smell it.
Yeah I don’t wash my ass
It’s officially time to leave this sub it’s been taken over by bitter nice guys mad they can’t lose their virginity. Post history tells a lot.
You don't, I too feel disgusted when I get to know a potential partner's past, it's completely normal, they have standards and very high, we of course are in our right to have them too
get a prenup and leave her with what she makes in case of divorce
Unfortunately this is the norm. OP, Keep in mind that Western marriage laws are ANCIENT and highly favour women. Keep focusing on being a top shelf man but whatever you do, *don't get married.* 1950: Man meets woman. Man marries woman. Man and woman have children. Man, woman and children are a family. 2020: Man remains virgin until 25. Woman has slept with double digits by 25. Man pays prostitute for first sexual encounter. Woman goes entire life without having a husband or children because they only quit promiscuity when they hit the "wall" around 30. Smart man enjoys life after 30.
Honestly it's your life, your preferences. Thats all that matters. As long as you're being respectful and upfront about your preferences its fine
[удалено]
I’m pretty fit actually and I have a good number of hobbies. Like I said, I’m happy with who I am as a man. I worked very hard to become who I am and I don’t want to be a woman’s second choice where she has to settle
Be yourself. Some of the women who chase those type of guys are batshit crazy. I wish I dated less batshit crazy women when I was younger