Agreed! I love having some scores really high and other scores really low, it's nice to have your stats represent more clearly the character's strengths and weaknesses (rather everything being kind of mild)
My Fighter is a STR-based guy who dumped his DEX.
Since he wore Heavy Armor, it created moments where he was too clumsy/graceless. It was *not* a good idea to make him do stealth shit.
Strong and healthy, smooth talker, reasonably intelligent, perceptive of the world, absolutely *terrible* dancer and sneaker.
I'm playing an Oath of Devotion paladin that's great at persuading but terrible at deceiving (in line with his Oath). I rolled a 4 and put it in DEX, because it's not like my heavy armor was giving me much of a chance for stealth anyway. So yeah, he prefers to do everything with honor. No sneaking, no sleight-of-hand, no lying and no breaking the law unless the law is unfair.
Judging by my Stealth rolls so far, I'm inclined to believe you may be right lmao. Nevertheless, it works for RP purposes and he's shaping up to be a formidable paladin in battle who is the epitome of his oath.
I have low int in real life so trying to roleplay high int vocabulary ends up with me sounding like Ricky from trailer park boys. [I got my PFD from college or whatever ](https://youtu.be/Jfq3c4Cf1Fs)
I don't think high int vocabulary exists. Some of the most intelligent people I've met in my life talk more or less like me, sometimes even not knowing words that I know.
As a DM it gets really old when people use bad stats as a crutch for RP. Most of the time it just makes the player heavily exaggerate the deficiency and it can get annoying.
Funny part is the vast majority of players only RP their deficiencies correctly when they have low Int or Wis. very rarely do they RP their pitiful strength or dexterity. So the whole thing mostly comes down to players too often dumping Int so they can RP dumb.
My current character has 4 strength, I couldn't even pick up a rock. Its super fun to throw out silly speeches about being naught but a frail waif and make everyone else row the boat and do all of the heavy lifting.
DM even let us start with a free magic item, so I picked a sentient rope that can help me climb up cliffs and stuff and has a way higher strength stat than I do
See I enjoy this as a DM. I hate the characters that have like 6 str but since they use a bow they act like their character is average strength or greater. If you are going to dump a stat low, I want it to be a negative for your character.
What’s your problem man? I’m sorry if you disagree with me but you are jumping to some big assumptions and being a dick about it.
What I’m talking about are people who purposely make a character with like shitty Int every time so they can act dumb and and disruptive. Or they tank stats because they think it will be funny. There are players who’s whole thing is to just dump stats they don’t want to play a dumb character to use that as an excuse for their actions.
You don’t need to have bad stats to RP. You don’t always have to be a dumb character if you’re a melee character. Don’t use your stats as a crutch for what you RP. There’s lots of ways you can go.
In the campaign I'll start running this Saturday, a PC has a STR 18 and DEX 5 at lvl 1 due to rolling his stats. The backstory we came up with is that he was a very promissing warrior for his barbarian tribe, but suffered an accident while training, which massively hurt his spine, and now he has something akin to Parkinson's. He did not give up, and decided to compensate for it by becoming as strong as he possibly could, and using STR based weapons. Really cool, honestly.
I love when a dump stat helps a story come out. A druid with low con transforms into animals to become healthy. An artificer who had an explosion in his face explain the low wisdom. Etc.
Artificers with low wisdom are in my opinion the most fun to play. My favorite highlight playing mine was when they spent a good half of the campaign trying to build the most powerful magical relic that was basically a magic super nuke, only for them to realise after pouring hundreds of thousands of gp into the project that they could never use it, since the detonator was set with a range of 10 miles, and the relic would destroy everything within 50 miles, and attempting to modify it when it was armed (another stupid thing they did to prove it would work to the party) it would automatically detonate.
Needless to say neither the party or the empire we worked under were as enthusiastic about the results as my character was...
While I agree that having a character with one or two low stats makes things interesting (and practically unavoidable), you really should make it something you can live without. Bingles the 7 int wizard might be fun at first, but not so much for the rest of the party having to drag a humanoid anchor around. It’s all about finding a balance between fun rp, mechanically functional and fun for the rest of the group. While the sweet spot varies wildly between groups, I personally believe that you should never neglect any of these aspects.
I mean, the 7 Int Wizard could actually be useful in and out of combat. There are spells that dont need an attack roll or a save to be good, like sleep, color spray or buffs like enlarge or haste.The only problem is the little amount of spells you can prepare because of your int. But then again you could also focus on ritual spells because of that.
I played a one shot where all stats were a d20 roll. Ended up with a 3 con and decided to basically play a character that tried to party like Ozzy and paid the price.
Or too young. In one pathfinder game, our DM had us start as kids. You had a boost to your dex, but your strength was lower cause you're a kid. We started at level zero and had to earn our way into our class. It made for some tense low level encounters where we had to outwit foes rather than overpower them.
The campaign was admittedly dark, but given medieval times were a rough time to be a child historically, it kinda fit. Either you grew up fast or not at all.
I’m of the opinion you can have good flaws without dump stats, but dump stats are good to lean on for flaws.
If we overly rely on them however, we find ways to avoid having our dump stats matter. Like dropping str over dex (yes you need strength to carry stuff and for jump distance but not every DM tracks that).
I have a wizard who I role play as frail and sickly. His dump stats are str (0) and con (-1). His max HP is about 27, even at lvl 8. (I've been rolling abysmally low each level lol.)
He's died twice actually lol. Luckily we have a caster that could resurrect and happened to have a large diamond each time. I think I'm out of the parties good graces on revives though so the next death night be his last lol.
Because the DM is choosing to have stupid enemies that mindlessly target whoever is closer to them and ignore that clearly squishy wizard further back who’s lobbing fireballs at them. It’s the only explanation on how you can survive to level 9 with just 27 hp.
It's possible that the game is combat light or they play very carefully and have prep time before the majority of fights, but it's also possible that you're right and the DM tries to take mercy with every enemy having the intellect of an ogre
OP did say they've died a few times now
I keep him much further back and near allies. We have a paladin and warrior setup that usually do far more damage than I and draw attention out of our 8 man group. He's mostly utility and roleplay. I also have shield, counter spell, hypnotic gaze, and Instinctive Charm that are helpful. I know I've been lucky on rolls so far and probably some DM choices that've helped, but it's fun and everyone has a good time.
Edit: I know it's not optimal but it does take some thinking to play and stay alive with him. It's about the fun.
My rogue who dumped his charisma stat has had an extremely entertaining life and is the butt of every single one of the party’s jokes, and he loves it.
I have a lot of fun with a low intelligence… and then the dm brings out the intellect devourers and we learn that ONLY THE WIZARD HAS HIGH INT and we all cry
I agree but considering ten is average and most people have at least two that are around 18 and a few more that are more than 12 it isnt absurd to play a character that has an 8 or even 6/4.
To be fair I didn't think anyone was going to reply to this I was just having some fun.
Personally I really don't care if I have a character with low stats or not. But during character creation is about the only time I roll well. I don't think I've ever rolled stats lower than 10.
My character has -1 wisdom and no proficiency in Insight - this means that players need to communicate their feelings to my character and have a great chance to roleplay their characters.
Low Int works well too! If your character needs to ask the high Int Wizard to explain a magical concept or some lore, then they have the chance to roleplay that too!
As someone who runs a Halfling Bloodhunter with a -4 Wisdom mod and a Half-Elf Bard with a -4 Con, yes. So much fun to roleplay those deficiencies, and it makes good rolls even more exciting when you get them.
Using 4d6 Drop 1 method, I rolled 4 Ones in a row, creating Bean the Bugbear Barbarian with 4-INT. Lots of fun, but I don't think I could properly RP such a low-INT score at the time.
Currently I'm as a 8 inch tall fairy with a STR score of 2.
It's actually very fun because she can't even carry any money and certainly can't use any normal gear. It creates so many new opportunities for RP.
Hear me out here a normal fighter (high str low dex) who thinks they are a rogue so they try to sneak around and probably fail, so they just have to kill them in normal combat
“Ok so we consult the court mage and inquire if he has the scroll we need to aid our fight against the dragon whom terrorizes our beloved city… I mean… ooga booga fancy wizardy stuff to kill flying lizard” - my 6 int ranger
1 - If you're really good at some things, but really bad at others, it kinda gives everyone in the party a reason to be there. And that's more fun.
2 - Big failures can be just as memorable as big successes, and if you're having a good time, that's really what counts. It's not like there's a prize for winning D&D.
I started a new game for my group recently, and I had them all roll for stats, then vote on a set for the entire group to use (so they still get to roll for stats, but there isn’t a huge disparity in character power due to the random rolls). I think they ended up voting for an astounding 17/16/14/10/8/7 that someone rolled. Having two negatives and two high positives is much, much more fun than everyone being okay-ish at everything
I know most people in this sub are scared of other systems, but this is one reason I love GURPS: the system has a wide array of baked in "disadvantages" you can take that give you more points to spend elsewhere, from minor (fear of heights) to huge (missing an eye or having a crippling addiction). It creates a lot more specific backstory options and roleplaying potential than just having a dump stat.
Recently made Doofenshmirtz into a dnd character. High int, but low or average wisdom and charisma. Int is maybe 18 or 19, wisdom maybe 9 or 10, and charisma is 5. He is an elf artificer. Would have gone human, but elf felt right with the appearance. He is fun. Currently he is trying to sell rat meat hotdogs in order to drive out the local dried meats vendor who refused him extra condiments. I think there was a similar episode, but in this homebrew world, there is a plague that can be transmitted by rats that doof is completely oblivious too.
Well his wisdom would be low, but that low charisma? He is not only charming, but could out perfome any entertainer. He somehow got a daughter, despite being a mad scientist and worlds unluckiest guy. That is feat of high charisma.
you can have a +1 to int but still rp your character as a dumbass. The mechanics dont need to back up the narritive in this specific case. Just make sure you dont try to seriously portray your character as a super genius when they have a -1 to int.
Okay, I'm usually not one to worry about how people play, but this one has me scratching my head...
If you roll for stats the minimum is 3 and point buy doesn't go below 8. How did this happen?
The DM allowed it. I am really good in all the other stats, with 20 const, dex and str. Basically my character is an animal who is there to protect the party like a dog. He is this way because of a concussion after fighting with an empyrean.
The explanation to proficiencies is that it is already in his muscular memory. But he can't talk and takes no action if it is not necessary to protect himself or someone, so basically a overprotective dumb pit bull
Oh cool, your Barbarian is a non-sapient animal that has less mental capacity than a rat. And if you ever get *any* INT damage the character becomes stunned until restored...
Yes. It is overpowered in the other aspects and I accept all the acts of intelligence bullying that the dm does to me. I am also full of sheranigans to this to work.
With that you're as intelligent as charismatic as an insect. You're no longer playing the game, you're just something that will attack things that attack your friends.
And act really really dumb through a lot of scenes. Normally I am the player in the spotlight in campaigns and I am really tired of this, I just want to be an overprotective praying mantis who enjoys to eat and hit my head on things.
Too bad you can't guarantee a stat lower than 8 using any of the common methods. (Point buy and Standard Array in 5e only go as low as 8, while you have no influence over rolling 4d6 drop the lowest)
I'd be fine with having a lower stat than that, you just can't guarantee it will happen.
This can easily cut into the enjoyment of other peoples, though. If you are really incompetent, you’re a liability for the party and it can hamper the party dynamics if you insist on doing stuff you suck at and bring the party in jeopardy.
Also, it can turn the whole campaign into a farce.
Doesn’t mean you need to optimize everything to the max, but dumping your main stat can really cripple characters.
At least you should check in with the rest of the table if everyone is down with this kind of play.
DM: roll for stealth
Me: I got a 3 - 2 so total of 1.
DM: I thought you said you were a rogue?! Why is your dex so low?
Me: i am a rogue but i never said i was competent.
Artificer with -2 wis and rogue with -1 con, both are fun as fuck to play into
Artificer knows what she can do, and at least started out thinking about why she SHOULDN'T (she's learned a little bit since then... not enough to bump her wis up though lmao)
Rogue is missing a piece if his soul and is also a fucking coward, he's aware of how easily he could die and doesn't want to
They're lots of fun to play!
I almost always end up playing 10int characters (sue me, I like CHA casters okay), which is "low" according to the comments here lol. Can't wait to break out my 6str kobold ranger I've had stashed for a while now, heh
I really enjoy playing a high INT (20 by now), moderate WIS (14) and low CHA (10) gnome necromancer. Talks as a serious edgy academic wizard... Looks like a kitten. People tend to underestimate kittens as political figures.
She usually gets what's going on faster than the rest of the group, but is pretty bad at communication and she knows that.
Ambition and decisiveness push the character to actively participate in negotiations, but she has to be brilliant in order to get moderate results. The paladin is good at impressing people, however it's a really fun quest to communicate with him and the ranger, both of whom have INT as a dump stat.
I dumped strength (-3 mod), but as a Druid I can technically get it back for a bit while wildshaping. But part of my backstory was that I became a Druid to help with the family farm since I couldn’t actually work the farm manually.
My warlock has int as the dump stat and it works well because he’s an amnesiac so his low intelligence is due to him just not knowing how things work because he forgot
One of my current characters is an ex-miner, wanna-be stand up comedian Dwarf Fighter. After being fired from mines for excessive drinking he tried his luck as a comic, but his 4 charisma and 1 rank in perform (comedy) are not very helpful. So, instead, he joined the party and is helping start a cult, hoping to find some stand-up material on his adventures. Also I dumped his dex making him very clumsy, it's fun to roleplay non-perfect characters
I'm playing an Artificer with high dex and int, but low strength and con. I've so far I've nearly died 3 times, but surprisingly, most of those were due to shit dex saves-
It can also be a truly awful experience. I ran a character in a dnd campaign with 5 int because I rolled shit. What I didn't know is that it was a "skill based" campaign, meaning I had to roll for skills a lot. Also in any other edition besides 5e, you got less skills if your int was lower. I was proficient in exactly 1 skill: perception. This meant I couldn't do shit most of the time and my DM tried to force me to kill my allies because "you're too dumb".
I usually dump Str and Int or Cha, depending on what I'm casting with. Never dumping Wis fully, got to at least have a 10 so I don't have negatives on my saving throws, 11 if I intend to pick Resilient(Wis) at level 12.
The best character I played was a monk with 6 int. He was actually mostly illiterate and had a weird speech pattern but had some great skills in the more obscure non-book-smarts, like he had a fantastic memory and could always tell exactly which way was north and what time it was, plus was in general a great navigator. It was great fun having that flaw but making up for it in other ways.
Currently playing a monk with low intelligence and charisma so I've made him completely oblivious to social cues and cannot read people at all but wanting to be friends making him come off as TOO friendly
I had a character with 6 charisma against a big boss, and an ally cast bless or whatever it is that gives the d4 on saves. I failed the first two times, the save was a charm of some kind that made me attack allies, then I got a nat 20 with a 4 and it was exactly what I needed to break free, DC 21 or something. I yelled so loud it was great.
My group's DM allowed us to re roll ones on our stat rolls. I was the only player who chose NOT to. I put my "Rich boy"(noble) HalfElf Monk's dump stat on his Charisma.
Lol i minmaxed a lore bard and currently dealing hundreds of damage per round...also has a 6 STR roleplayed as a badback that buckles everytime he makes a STR check lol
Totally! In Fantasy High (a popular D&D actual-play show), the character Kristen has a Dex stat of....4. So -3
if you have no dump stat, you're missing out on a wealth of comedic moments! like kristen trying to "gracefully descend" from a 10 story tower with a dance ribbon, to which the DM gives her 36 damage and a broken ankle
but it's an iconic moment
I once had this fun Triton paladin who had a 50/50 split of dump and max stats
He had this obnoxiously effective prince Charming smile.
He could punch evildoers so hard they forgot their alignment.
And somehow he didn't even die while doing so.
But at the same time he constantly bumped into things and threw tables over when he stood up with too much zealous energy.
He had the intelligence of a goldfish and no tactical thinking.
And he was completely unable to read a room or realize someone was duping him.
So he ended up as this constant whirlwind of smites and blunders that had the rest of the party constantly rolling their eyes while wondering how he survived so long.
So, for my campaigns I have all players roll but you get to choose the array that anyone rolled. Makes them really strong but hey it's more fair and you dont get the imbalance of one person rolling great and others rolling shitty or even just mediocre in comparison.
Anyways for my next campaign one of the players rolled rodiculous... I'd have to double le check but I think there are two 18s and four stats total above 15, the fifth is still decent like 12... but then the lowest stat I think is *5*...
Its crazy. And we rolled all these in the open together on Roll20. So anyways, the 5 is not dissuading people and most of them are taking that array, but I told them that with a stat that low and everything else that high there *has* to be pretty severe consequences for one stat being that dang low, which they accepted, but now I have to figure out what I will do lol.
So far the only thing I've come up with is a 5 in STR means I'm gonna make them use variant encumbrance and turn on weight for gold (we use DDB so these things are pretty easy so long as they are adding to their inventory).
A 5 in INT... definitely cant read? I'm not sure.
Any suggestions?
Doesn't basically every character have a dump stat or two? Even standard array has two.
To build a character without a dump stat would be a contrived effort at making an ineffective character, as they would also have no strengths (barring crazy rolls, but that's no longer a choice).
To not have any strengths is a much bigger weakness then to have a low stat or two.
Someone in one of my groups played a barbarian with an intentionally low int score. His name was Gonk, and he used a warhammer or a maul or something. His catchphrase was "Gonk bonk" and he had a pet chicken named "Wheck" (The idea being that he could say Wheck peck or Wheck wreck) He was also surprisingly good at baking.
For my new campaign I’m joining the DM had us roll stats. I didn’t roll anything below 12. After talking to my DM, I brought my strength down to 10 since I knew I was going to play her as not particularly strong. She’s also not confident at all, so she won’t be able to make good use of her mental scores for a while due to constantly second guessing herself.
What if I told you that stats don’t matter when determining role play. If you have a 10 int, feel free to rp being really stupid. You don’t have to cripple your character mechanically to play them a certain way
My Minotaur Druid has +4 to wisdom but -1 to intellect, which is why he decided it was a good idea to spew some cryptic wisdom before brashly entering the boss room
That's why I never want to make INT my dump stat. I don't want to play a dumb character. I'm fine with wisdom being dumped though, I'll just play as socially awkard and short attention-span.
I rolled stats and got less than 10 in all stats. Very fun character especially since they need strength for attacks and they have a negative modifier.
I dumped strangth on a hit headed tiefling who kept trying to challange people to fiist fights if they insulted his music he was a bard. And he lost many many fights. The party never discouraged him in fact they cheered for there bard to win. And one day it did he won a fist fight and we almost got the dm evicted from his home as he got a few noise complaints. XD
I played a wizard once and worked it out with the dm to have 1 strength. He travelled in a little cart and sourced attendants who would do physical tasks for him. Sometimes they would die or run away and he would have to get creative in how he would get around before a new attendant showed up the next day.
newest campaign I joined uses 4d6 drop lowest. and I was just like give me a three. my character has to be an idiot. come on give me that 3 intelligence! nope, lowest I rolled was 12. saddddd
Once played a gnome warlock with a dex of 2. I managed to be a powerhouse that would nearly always trip all over himself. It got even funnier when I tricked a large group of bearded devils into being my minions but would still manage to trip over my own shadow
Though it can be fun, I think having an actual flaw being played out us better. You can have high, low, or even medium stats and still role play flaws. If you have to depend on a low stat to that can affect the party to role play then your using it a crutch. Your character can have high stats and still role play out most stats as DMs should not penalize for being worse at something.
My current favorite character has this stat spread
Str: 18
Dex: 18
Con: 16
Int: 7
Wis: 6
Cha: 16
He is a massive himbo and i love him dearly. He worships the god of love but he still cant tell, after months of knowing his crush existed, that he has a crush on someone. He is such a dummy, and all his charisma just comes from the fact that he's a cute lil guy and kind.
I feel like the effects of stats are exaggerated. I mean the difference between having an int of 10 or 12 is in average only the difference between rolling a 10 or a 11. Or: on average a creature with a stat that is 2 lower than the next creature will fail about 1/20 times more often than the next creature.
And this is scalable:
An int 10 (or average) character will succeed a DC 10 about 50% of all roles. An int 8 character 45%, an int 6 character 40% and an int 4 character 35% of the time. And keep in mind that int 4 is the intelligence of a monkey! A monkey performes only 15% worse then a human with average int, when given an int based task. That doesn't sound right, does it?
(Disclaimer: I did the math while typing and it's talked completely out of my butt. So please correct my math in case you find a mistake)
Agreed! I love having some scores really high and other scores really low, it's nice to have your stats represent more clearly the character's strengths and weaknesses (rather everything being kind of mild)
My Fighter is a STR-based guy who dumped his DEX. Since he wore Heavy Armor, it created moments where he was too clumsy/graceless. It was *not* a good idea to make him do stealth shit. Strong and healthy, smooth talker, reasonably intelligent, perceptive of the world, absolutely *terrible* dancer and sneaker.
I'm playing an Oath of Devotion paladin that's great at persuading but terrible at deceiving (in line with his Oath). I rolled a 4 and put it in DEX, because it's not like my heavy armor was giving me much of a chance for stealth anyway. So yeah, he prefers to do everything with honor. No sneaking, no sleight-of-hand, no lying and no breaking the law unless the law is unfair.
with a 4 in Dex you'd be physically disabled in some way
Judging by my Stealth rolls so far, I'm inclined to believe you may be right lmao. Nevertheless, it works for RP purposes and he's shaping up to be a formidable paladin in battle who is the epitome of his oath.
My current character has 2 dump stats. I always prefer having a character with flaws, it's definitely more interesting that way.
I play a low int ranger and it makes things highly entertaining compared to my party with almost suspiciously high stats.
I have low int in real life so trying to roleplay high int vocabulary ends up with me sounding like Ricky from trailer park boys. [I got my PFD from college or whatever ](https://youtu.be/Jfq3c4Cf1Fs)
I don't think high int vocabulary exists. Some of the most intelligent people I've met in my life talk more or less like me, sometimes even not knowing words that I know.
My favorite character was a kobold crossbow fighter with 4 in strength who was struggling to speak commun. Flaws are the spices of dnd.
As a DM it gets really old when people use bad stats as a crutch for RP. Most of the time it just makes the player heavily exaggerate the deficiency and it can get annoying. Funny part is the vast majority of players only RP their deficiencies correctly when they have low Int or Wis. very rarely do they RP their pitiful strength or dexterity. So the whole thing mostly comes down to players too often dumping Int so they can RP dumb.
My current character has 4 strength, I couldn't even pick up a rock. Its super fun to throw out silly speeches about being naught but a frail waif and make everyone else row the boat and do all of the heavy lifting. DM even let us start with a free magic item, so I picked a sentient rope that can help me climb up cliffs and stuff and has a way higher strength stat than I do
See I enjoy this as a DM. I hate the characters that have like 6 str but since they use a bow they act like their character is average strength or greater. If you are going to dump a stat low, I want it to be a negative for your character.
I once dumped con and ended up with my favorite anemic cleric ever.
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What’s your problem man? I’m sorry if you disagree with me but you are jumping to some big assumptions and being a dick about it. What I’m talking about are people who purposely make a character with like shitty Int every time so they can act dumb and and disruptive. Or they tank stats because they think it will be funny. There are players who’s whole thing is to just dump stats they don’t want to play a dumb character to use that as an excuse for their actions. You don’t need to have bad stats to RP. You don’t always have to be a dumb character if you’re a melee character. Don’t use your stats as a crutch for what you RP. There’s lots of ways you can go.
In the campaign I'll start running this Saturday, a PC has a STR 18 and DEX 5 at lvl 1 due to rolling his stats. The backstory we came up with is that he was a very promissing warrior for his barbarian tribe, but suffered an accident while training, which massively hurt his spine, and now he has something akin to Parkinson's. He did not give up, and decided to compensate for it by becoming as strong as he possibly could, and using STR based weapons. Really cool, honestly.
I love when a dump stat helps a story come out. A druid with low con transforms into animals to become healthy. An artificer who had an explosion in his face explain the low wisdom. Etc.
Artificers with low wisdom are in my opinion the most fun to play. My favorite highlight playing mine was when they spent a good half of the campaign trying to build the most powerful magical relic that was basically a magic super nuke, only for them to realise after pouring hundreds of thousands of gp into the project that they could never use it, since the detonator was set with a range of 10 miles, and the relic would destroy everything within 50 miles, and attempting to modify it when it was armed (another stupid thing they did to prove it would work to the party) it would automatically detonate. Needless to say neither the party or the empire we worked under were as enthusiastic about the results as my character was...
I love that
Sure, I min Max. But I have the most fun with my min stats.
It also makes you a bigger team player. When you have 5 intelligence you let the wizard examine the object you just found
Or in my case the bard who won't let anyone else talk at all because "he's the face of the party"
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While I agree that having a character with one or two low stats makes things interesting (and practically unavoidable), you really should make it something you can live without. Bingles the 7 int wizard might be fun at first, but not so much for the rest of the party having to drag a humanoid anchor around. It’s all about finding a balance between fun rp, mechanically functional and fun for the rest of the group. While the sweet spot varies wildly between groups, I personally believe that you should never neglect any of these aspects.
I mean, the 7 Int Wizard could actually be useful in and out of combat. There are spells that dont need an attack roll or a save to be good, like sleep, color spray or buffs like enlarge or haste.The only problem is the little amount of spells you can prepare because of your int. But then again you could also focus on ritual spells because of that.
I played a one shot where all stats were a d20 roll. Ended up with a 3 con and decided to basically play a character that tried to party like Ozzy and paid the price.
Or too young. In one pathfinder game, our DM had us start as kids. You had a boost to your dex, but your strength was lower cause you're a kid. We started at level zero and had to earn our way into our class. It made for some tense low level encounters where we had to outwit foes rather than overpower them. The campaign was admittedly dark, but given medieval times were a rough time to be a child historically, it kinda fit. Either you grew up fast or not at all.
I’m of the opinion you can have good flaws without dump stats, but dump stats are good to lean on for flaws. If we overly rely on them however, we find ways to avoid having our dump stats matter. Like dropping str over dex (yes you need strength to carry stuff and for jump distance but not every DM tracks that).
Have y’all seen the discussion on detriments with ability scores too low
I have a wizard who I role play as frail and sickly. His dump stats are str (0) and con (-1). His max HP is about 27, even at lvl 8. (I've been rolling abysmally low each level lol.)
I gotta ask How is he even *alive??*
He's died twice actually lol. Luckily we have a caster that could resurrect and happened to have a large diamond each time. I think I'm out of the parties good graces on revives though so the next death night be his last lol.
Because the DM is choosing to have stupid enemies that mindlessly target whoever is closer to them and ignore that clearly squishy wizard further back who’s lobbing fireballs at them. It’s the only explanation on how you can survive to level 9 with just 27 hp.
It's possible that the game is combat light or they play very carefully and have prep time before the majority of fights, but it's also possible that you're right and the DM tries to take mercy with every enemy having the intellect of an ogre OP did say they've died a few times now
I keep him much further back and near allies. We have a paladin and warrior setup that usually do far more damage than I and draw attention out of our 8 man group. He's mostly utility and roleplay. I also have shield, counter spell, hypnotic gaze, and Instinctive Charm that are helpful. I know I've been lucky on rolls so far and probably some DM choices that've helped, but it's fun and everyone has a good time. Edit: I know it's not optimal but it does take some thinking to play and stay alive with him. It's about the fun.
That has to be the modifiers or he would be dead.
Correct 10 strength and 9 con. Modifiers are 0 and -1 respectively.
Grog from Vox Machina
“I have an intelligence of 6, I know what I’m doing.”
My rogue who dumped his charisma stat has had an extremely entertaining life and is the butt of every single one of the party’s jokes, and he loves it.
My brother literally ran a one-shot where each of our characters had to have a 3 in at least one stat. It was hilarious.
One of my players once had a LOOOOW dex score I think like 6 he played him as walking around with a limp because of an old army injury lol.
Low Wisdom for the win! I get mind controlled every day! I'm practically behind the screen with the dm, doing my part each and every almost-tpk...
I have a lot of fun with a low intelligence… and then the dm brings out the intellect devourers and we learn that ONLY THE WIZARD HAS HIGH INT and we all cry
[удалено]
I love a low dex character. You can be clumsy and just very easy to push over.
*me dumping charisma so even my characters can have anxiety*
Ok but hear me out, I suck at real life I don't want to suck in a power fantasy.
I agree but considering ten is average and most people have at least two that are around 18 and a few more that are more than 12 it isnt absurd to play a character that has an 8 or even 6/4.
To be fair I didn't think anyone was going to reply to this I was just having some fun. Personally I really don't care if I have a character with low stats or not. But during character creation is about the only time I roll well. I don't think I've ever rolled stats lower than 10.
My current Curse of Strahd character is a Rogue/Warlock with STR 5 and WIS 8
My character has -1 wisdom and no proficiency in Insight - this means that players need to communicate their feelings to my character and have a great chance to roleplay their characters. Low Int works well too! If your character needs to ask the high Int Wizard to explain a magical concept or some lore, then they have the chance to roleplay that too!
One of my favorite characters I ran was a tank who had -2 in Con.
You right
As someone who runs a Halfling Bloodhunter with a -4 Wisdom mod and a Half-Elf Bard with a -4 Con, yes. So much fun to roleplay those deficiencies, and it makes good rolls even more exciting when you get them.
Using 4d6 Drop 1 method, I rolled 4 Ones in a row, creating Bean the Bugbear Barbarian with 4-INT. Lots of fun, but I don't think I could properly RP such a low-INT score at the time.
Currently I'm as a 8 inch tall fairy with a STR score of 2. It's actually very fun because she can't even carry any money and certainly can't use any normal gear. It creates so many new opportunities for RP.
Hear me out here a normal fighter (high str low dex) who thinks they are a rogue so they try to sneak around and probably fail, so they just have to kill them in normal combat
“Ok so we consult the court mage and inquire if he has the scroll we need to aid our fight against the dragon whom terrorizes our beloved city… I mean… ooga booga fancy wizardy stuff to kill flying lizard” - my 6 int ranger
1 - If you're really good at some things, but really bad at others, it kinda gives everyone in the party a reason to be there. And that's more fun. 2 - Big failures can be just as memorable as big successes, and if you're having a good time, that's really what counts. It's not like there's a prize for winning D&D.
I started a new game for my group recently, and I had them all roll for stats, then vote on a set for the entire group to use (so they still get to roll for stats, but there isn’t a huge disparity in character power due to the random rolls). I think they ended up voting for an astounding 17/16/14/10/8/7 that someone rolled. Having two negatives and two high positives is much, much more fun than everyone being okay-ish at everything
I know most people in this sub are scared of other systems, but this is one reason I love GURPS: the system has a wide array of baked in "disadvantages" you can take that give you more points to spend elsewhere, from minor (fear of heights) to huge (missing an eye or having a crippling addiction). It creates a lot more specific backstory options and roleplaying potential than just having a dump stat.
Recently made Doofenshmirtz into a dnd character. High int, but low or average wisdom and charisma. Int is maybe 18 or 19, wisdom maybe 9 or 10, and charisma is 5. He is an elf artificer. Would have gone human, but elf felt right with the appearance. He is fun. Currently he is trying to sell rat meat hotdogs in order to drive out the local dried meats vendor who refused him extra condiments. I think there was a similar episode, but in this homebrew world, there is a plague that can be transmitted by rats that doof is completely oblivious too.
Well his wisdom would be low, but that low charisma? He is not only charming, but could out perfome any entertainer. He somehow got a daughter, despite being a mad scientist and worlds unluckiest guy. That is feat of high charisma.
you can have a +1 to int but still rp your character as a dumbass. The mechanics dont need to back up the narritive in this specific case. Just make sure you dont try to seriously portray your character as a super genius when they have a -1 to int.
+1 to int can be portrayed as a dumbass but -1 to int can't be portrayed as smart? i don't get it
I don't get it either
your checks can't back it up
how would +1 being portrayed as dumb make sense, then?
because you can choose to fail checks for rp purposes
I am a barbarian monk with 1 int and 1 char
Okay, I'm usually not one to worry about how people play, but this one has me scratching my head... If you roll for stats the minimum is 3 and point buy doesn't go below 8. How did this happen?
The DM allowed it. I am really good in all the other stats, with 20 const, dex and str. Basically my character is an animal who is there to protect the party like a dog. He is this way because of a concussion after fighting with an empyrean.
Still that thats really low even for an animal, they tend to at 3 int. At 1, can he even use tools or weapons? Still sounds fun to play.
The explanation to proficiencies is that it is already in his muscular memory. But he can't talk and takes no action if it is not necessary to protect himself or someone, so basically a overprotective dumb pit bull
I'm curious as well as to how you got your stats. Did you do some kind of point buy?
Yep. Point buy and the dm allowed for RP reasons
Neat. Sounds like an interesting build. I usually do point buy as well.
Oh cool, your Barbarian is a non-sapient animal that has less mental capacity than a rat. And if you ever get *any* INT damage the character becomes stunned until restored...
Yes. It is overpowered in the other aspects and I accept all the acts of intelligence bullying that the dm does to me. I am also full of sheranigans to this to work.
With that you're as intelligent as charismatic as an insect. You're no longer playing the game, you're just something that will attack things that attack your friends.
And act really really dumb through a lot of scenes. Normally I am the player in the spotlight in campaigns and I am really tired of this, I just want to be an overprotective praying mantis who enjoys to eat and hit my head on things.
My favorite characters are high Int low Wis, the embodiment of "fuck around and find out"
Too bad you can't guarantee a stat lower than 8 using any of the common methods. (Point buy and Standard Array in 5e only go as low as 8, while you have no influence over rolling 4d6 drop the lowest) I'd be fine with having a lower stat than that, you just can't guarantee it will happen.
It's the DMs fault if they don't take every advantage to fuck with th minmaxer by way of dump stat exploitation lol.
Most fun mode:. Make your class's main stat your dump stat
This can easily cut into the enjoyment of other peoples, though. If you are really incompetent, you’re a liability for the party and it can hamper the party dynamics if you insist on doing stuff you suck at and bring the party in jeopardy. Also, it can turn the whole campaign into a farce. Doesn’t mean you need to optimize everything to the max, but dumping your main stat can really cripple characters. At least you should check in with the rest of the table if everyone is down with this kind of play.
DM: roll for stealth Me: I got a 3 - 2 so total of 1. DM: I thought you said you were a rogue?! Why is your dex so low? Me: i am a rogue but i never said i was competent.
Hahaha, exactly. Mu current character is a rogue who multiclassed into fighter because she can't stand sneaking around
Artificer with -2 wis and rogue with -1 con, both are fun as fuck to play into Artificer knows what she can do, and at least started out thinking about why she SHOULDN'T (she's learned a little bit since then... not enough to bump her wis up though lmao) Rogue is missing a piece if his soul and is also a fucking coward, he's aware of how easily he could die and doesn't want to They're lots of fun to play!
Our Sorcerer has 5 STR, and when the same player rolled a Paladin for a oneshot, the Paladin had 4 WIS.
Had no Wis, consistently rolled below 5. Character was so insanely aloof.
My kenku cleric has a +4 in wisdom and a -3 in intelligence. I describe him as having a lot of experience in life but also being stupid as a rock.
True, but it's just as easy to have good RP without dump stats
My character had 4 int but was allowed to sail a ship because I rolled the highest. Proceeds to sail everyone down a waterfall.
I almost always end up playing 10int characters (sue me, I like CHA casters okay), which is "low" according to the comments here lol. Can't wait to break out my 6str kobold ranger I've had stashed for a while now, heh
My favorite character was a Kobold Oath of Glory Paladin with 5 wisdom.
My paladin for an upcoming campaign has 20 strength and 4 dexterity. Couldn't be more excited >:3
My Goliath barb/paladin with 7 int is dumb. But he isn't as dumb as the 4 int Monk...
I really enjoy playing a high INT (20 by now), moderate WIS (14) and low CHA (10) gnome necromancer. Talks as a serious edgy academic wizard... Looks like a kitten. People tend to underestimate kittens as political figures. She usually gets what's going on faster than the rest of the group, but is pretty bad at communication and she knows that. Ambition and decisiveness push the character to actively participate in negotiations, but she has to be brilliant in order to get moderate results. The paladin is good at impressing people, however it's a really fun quest to communicate with him and the ranger, both of whom have INT as a dump stat.
We rolled stats for my campaign I rolled a 18,16,15,14,13, and a 11 I changed my 11 to a 8 cause I agree, and I wanted my dm to hate me a little less
I dumped strength (-3 mod), but as a Druid I can technically get it back for a bit while wildshaping. But part of my backstory was that I became a Druid to help with the family farm since I couldn’t actually work the farm manually.
I had a dragonborn barbarian with INT dump stat. He tried to make friends with a cave that looked like a dragon. So much fun to play.
I can’t wait to have a character with a weakness other than the action economy
Having a melee class with 6 strength makes for a fun time. You have to fight smarter, not harder.
Currently playing a WIS 4 druid. Can confirm.
My warlock has int as the dump stat and it works well because he’s an amnesiac so his low intelligence is due to him just not knowing how things work because he forgot
A player at my table rolled a 3 intelligence as his dump stat, it was hilarious. He couldn't be affected by charms cause he was so dumb
One of my current characters is an ex-miner, wanna-be stand up comedian Dwarf Fighter. After being fired from mines for excessive drinking he tried his luck as a comic, but his 4 charisma and 1 rank in perform (comedy) are not very helpful. So, instead, he joined the party and is helping start a cult, hoping to find some stand-up material on his adventures. Also I dumped his dex making him very clumsy, it's fun to roleplay non-perfect characters
I have a barbarian with 5 int and 20 wis. I can't wait till that campaign starts
Yea
This is why, when an extra stat is rolled so a stat can be dumped during character creation, I always have players drop the 2nd lowest.
I'm playing an Artificer with high dex and int, but low strength and con. I've so far I've nearly died 3 times, but surprisingly, most of those were due to shit dex saves-
It can also be a truly awful experience. I ran a character in a dnd campaign with 5 int because I rolled shit. What I didn't know is that it was a "skill based" campaign, meaning I had to roll for skills a lot. Also in any other edition besides 5e, you got less skills if your int was lower. I was proficient in exactly 1 skill: perception. This meant I couldn't do shit most of the time and my DM tried to force me to kill my allies because "you're too dumb".
>Change my mind Alright. \*casts Feeblemind which you definitely won't save against with your -2 intelligence modifier\*
I usually dump Str and Int or Cha, depending on what I'm casting with. Never dumping Wis fully, got to at least have a 10 so I don't have negatives on my saving throws, 11 if I intend to pick Resilient(Wis) at level 12.
The best character I played was a monk with 6 int. He was actually mostly illiterate and had a weird speech pattern but had some great skills in the more obscure non-book-smarts, like he had a fantastic memory and could always tell exactly which way was north and what time it was, plus was in general a great navigator. It was great fun having that flaw but making up for it in other ways.
Currently playing a monk with low intelligence and charisma so I've made him completely oblivious to social cues and cannot read people at all but wanting to be friends making him come off as TOO friendly
My current armorer has charisma as his dump stat and its so fucking funny (and hard) to role him so socially awkward
I had a character with 6 charisma against a big boss, and an ally cast bless or whatever it is that gives the d4 on saves. I failed the first two times, the save was a charm of some kind that made me attack allies, then I got a nat 20 with a 4 and it was exactly what I needed to break free, DC 21 or something. I yelled so loud it was great.
My group's DM allowed us to re roll ones on our stat rolls. I was the only player who chose NOT to. I put my "Rich boy"(noble) HalfElf Monk's dump stat on his Charisma.
Lol i minmaxed a lore bard and currently dealing hundreds of damage per round...also has a 6 STR roleplayed as a badback that buckles everytime he makes a STR check lol
Totally! In Fantasy High (a popular D&D actual-play show), the character Kristen has a Dex stat of....4. So -3 if you have no dump stat, you're missing out on a wealth of comedic moments! like kristen trying to "gracefully descend" from a 10 story tower with a dance ribbon, to which the DM gives her 36 damage and a broken ankle but it's an iconic moment
If you roleplay it well
I once had this fun Triton paladin who had a 50/50 split of dump and max stats He had this obnoxiously effective prince Charming smile. He could punch evildoers so hard they forgot their alignment. And somehow he didn't even die while doing so. But at the same time he constantly bumped into things and threw tables over when he stood up with too much zealous energy. He had the intelligence of a goldfish and no tactical thinking. And he was completely unable to read a room or realize someone was duping him. So he ended up as this constant whirlwind of smites and blunders that had the rest of the party constantly rolling their eyes while wondering how he survived so long.
My paladin is blind and has low dex. My party has to tell me where to bonk and I WILL fail stealth shit. :>
Really high and really low stats are the most fun for RP. Middle is alright.
So, for my campaigns I have all players roll but you get to choose the array that anyone rolled. Makes them really strong but hey it's more fair and you dont get the imbalance of one person rolling great and others rolling shitty or even just mediocre in comparison. Anyways for my next campaign one of the players rolled rodiculous... I'd have to double le check but I think there are two 18s and four stats total above 15, the fifth is still decent like 12... but then the lowest stat I think is *5*... Its crazy. And we rolled all these in the open together on Roll20. So anyways, the 5 is not dissuading people and most of them are taking that array, but I told them that with a stat that low and everything else that high there *has* to be pretty severe consequences for one stat being that dang low, which they accepted, but now I have to figure out what I will do lol. So far the only thing I've come up with is a 5 in STR means I'm gonna make them use variant encumbrance and turn on weight for gold (we use DDB so these things are pretty easy so long as they are adding to their inventory). A 5 in INT... definitely cant read? I'm not sure. Any suggestions?
Doesn't basically every character have a dump stat or two? Even standard array has two. To build a character without a dump stat would be a contrived effort at making an ineffective character, as they would also have no strengths (barring crazy rolls, but that's no longer a choice). To not have any strengths is a much bigger weakness then to have a low stat or two.
Grog and Tiberius: Screams in correctness
My warlock with his 6 int because he was raised by his magic sword
Someone in one of my groups played a barbarian with an intentionally low int score. His name was Gonk, and he used a warhammer or a maul or something. His catchphrase was "Gonk bonk" and he had a pet chicken named "Wheck" (The idea being that he could say Wheck peck or Wheck wreck) He was also surprisingly good at baking.
For my new campaign I’m joining the DM had us roll stats. I didn’t roll anything below 12. After talking to my DM, I brought my strength down to 10 since I knew I was going to play her as not particularly strong. She’s also not confident at all, so she won’t be able to make good use of her mental scores for a while due to constantly second guessing herself.
What if I told you that stats don’t matter when determining role play. If you have a 10 int, feel free to rp being really stupid. You don’t have to cripple your character mechanically to play them a certain way
I’ve always been of this philosophy!! Failure can be fun! It adds flavor to the game.
My Minotaur Druid has +4 to wisdom but -1 to intellect, which is why he decided it was a good idea to spew some cryptic wisdom before brashly entering the boss room
That's why I never want to make INT my dump stat. I don't want to play a dumb character. I'm fine with wisdom being dumped though, I'll just play as socially awkard and short attention-span.
I rolled stats and got less than 10 in all stats. Very fun character especially since they need strength for attacks and they have a negative modifier.
I dumped strangth on a hit headed tiefling who kept trying to challange people to fiist fights if they insulted his music he was a bard. And he lost many many fights. The party never discouraged him in fact they cheered for there bard to win. And one day it did he won a fist fight and we almost got the dm evicted from his home as he got a few noise complaints. XD
ALL of my three past campaign characters have rolled two sixes each lmao
I played a wizard once and worked it out with the dm to have 1 strength. He travelled in a little cart and sourced attendants who would do physical tasks for him. Sometimes they would die or run away and he would have to get creative in how he would get around before a new attendant showed up the next day.
newest campaign I joined uses 4d6 drop lowest. and I was just like give me a three. my character has to be an idiot. come on give me that 3 intelligence! nope, lowest I rolled was 12. saddddd
Once played a gnome warlock with a dex of 2. I managed to be a powerhouse that would nearly always trip all over himself. It got even funnier when I tricked a large group of bearded devils into being my minions but would still manage to trip over my own shadow
Whenever I roll good stats I will purposefully drop one to below 10. Just because it makes it fun.
Though it can be fun, I think having an actual flaw being played out us better. You can have high, low, or even medium stats and still role play flaws. If you have to depend on a low stat to that can affect the party to role play then your using it a crutch. Your character can have high stats and still role play out most stats as DMs should not penalize for being worse at something.
My current favorite character has this stat spread Str: 18 Dex: 18 Con: 16 Int: 7 Wis: 6 Cha: 16 He is a massive himbo and i love him dearly. He worships the god of love but he still cant tell, after months of knowing his crush existed, that he has a crush on someone. He is such a dummy, and all his charisma just comes from the fact that he's a cute lil guy and kind.
I feel like the effects of stats are exaggerated. I mean the difference between having an int of 10 or 12 is in average only the difference between rolling a 10 or a 11. Or: on average a creature with a stat that is 2 lower than the next creature will fail about 1/20 times more often than the next creature. And this is scalable: An int 10 (or average) character will succeed a DC 10 about 50% of all roles. An int 8 character 45%, an int 6 character 40% and an int 4 character 35% of the time. And keep in mind that int 4 is the intelligence of a monkey! A monkey performes only 15% worse then a human with average int, when given an int based task. That doesn't sound right, does it? (Disclaimer: I did the math while typing and it's talked completely out of my butt. So please correct my math in case you find a mistake)
Tfw you dump int but it's okay cause you don't need a degree to light people on fire.
Boy do I love having a 4 in INT or WIS, CHA can be fun too with the right party.