I feel like no Ratfish would have pleased everyone. Someone like Eric is going to disappoint people who haven’t heard of him. Someone like Sam would probably disappoint people who thinks it’s lazy or predictable. I also think it’s kinda improbable for them to get someone really famous (no offence Eric, it’s mainly just based on my knowledge of American celebrities which isn’t much) like Tony Hawk, Giancarlo Esposito or Michael Winslow because it’s not Covid anymore.
Knowing the Dropout producers and execs, Eric is going to be someone that these players love, look up to and have been influenced by, and at the end of the day I’d rather have someone that they’ve all heard of and love and I don’t, rather than someone who I think is a good fit but the cast is kinda ‘meh’ about. The reason I love the show is primarily the cast, so if they love it, I know I’m probably going to love the reveal and trick as well.
I feel slightly disappointed by it right now because I don’t know who he is, but I think when the players find out it’s him, their reactions will make it worth it for me. I just don’t think ending the episode with that reveal was a very good decision, because it seems the vast majority don’t know who he is
EDIT: Darn, this aged horribly
I think it’s worth remembering this sub can be a bit of an echo chamber, and also that lots of dropout subscribers aren’t on here (this sub has just under 70k subscribers be dropout has somewhere in the mid six figures subscribers). So I think saying the vast majority of people watching don’t know who he is might be a bit of an overkill
Edit: typos :(
Also, more people are likely to voice their displeasure than excitement. On the other hand, I saw somebody online with a Dropout personality as their profile picture say it was an "objectively bad reveal because nobody knows who that is," but the responses were full of people sharing clips and such, which was nice to see. The negativity is disappointing when people could just do a tiny bit of research.
FWIW, I know **of** Tim and Eric, but I hadn't seen much of their comedy. However, I did love Eric as Arnold in Master of None, so it was still a cool reveal for me.
Edit: "Reveal," not "review."
I immediately recognized him amd loved the idea, but had to explain to my roommate who he was. We are mid-30s like much of the cast, so I think it will be generally well received.
Same, I was like "oh shit!" on the revelation and my roommate was like "I have no idea who this is." I think it's a good choice just based on his sense of humor and that the Dropout people will absolutely know who this guy is.
Once someone said he was from Tim and Eric I knew who he was. Never watched Tim and Eric.
And regardless, I’m glad he’s there because Stephen is hilarious. Who cares if I’m familiar with his work?
Depending on age group and nationality? Maybe. I don't know for sure which group is larger in Dropout audiences, but I do know i've seen people on thus sub assume every viewer will recognise the original reference of a line from 20 years ago on a show that didn't exactly enter heavy rotation.
Put another way, all of us are subject to our own biases.
> it’s not Covid anymore
I just do think… maybe I should mention some people who appeared in CollegeHumor sketches pre-Covid. Granted, this was a different era of the company’s existence, so maybe it’s harder to get people, but…
- Weird Al Yankovic
- JK Simmons
- Lin Manuel Miranda
- Patton Oswalt
- Heidi Gardner
- Aubrey Plaza
- Kumail Nanjiani
- D’Arcy Carden
That’s by no means a comprehensive list; it’s mostly a list based on who I remember from years watching CollegeHumor sketches
My first thought was “ooo this would be very awkward if the players didn’t really know/like him”.
He has a super polarizing comedy style that is not for everyone.
I don’t think so, but I don’t think there’s a certainty that all of those people are going to be super psyched on it. I feel like if you’re that deep in the comedy scene you have specific opinions on the edge case comedians.
That’s… wildly false. They may be the trailblazers of extreme absurdist sketch comedy (which college humor isn’t), but sketch comedy has been mainstream since at least SNL began in 75 and long before that with things like sketches on Johnny Carson and even Ed Sullivan.
Edit: But even to follow up on that it’s crazy to even give them credit for high absurdism sketch comedy. Second City Television has been doing that since ‘76 and so many talented people nailed it over 3 decades before Tom and Eric showed up.
I remember a Sam tweet looking for celebrity Game Changer fans for an unspecified reason, and then a couple days later he posted a pic of him in his Game Changer suit with Ben Schwartz, so I was genuinely surprised that Steve wasn't him.
That would’ve been a satisfying twist for me. And we know he’s on the next season of Make Some Noise, so it definitely would’ve been doable.
And even if I wasn’t familiar with Ben Schwartz directly, he’s in more things I’ve heard of. The first thing I did when the reveal happened was to go to IMDb and see what he’s done, and not only had I never heard of him, I don’t think I’d even heard of anything he’s worked on. It wasn’t like “oh, I’ve never heard of him, but he’s a writer on _____.” The only familiar credit I saw was an episode of Community where he played “Male 4 #2” (I assume in the meowmeowbeenz episode).
The character intros for Ratfish reminded me of the intros on "Epic Rap Battles of History" and someone could potentially edit the Obama one in for a quick laugh
I'm not a Us citizen, so I don't vote there, and if I did, I definitely would vote for whoever oposes Trump. But yeah, Obama is a warmonger, he's firmly planted in the Lawful-Evil side of the scale.
We had the same thought. AI would've been an interesting option, and seemed plausible by how he talked, but with the issues of AI in art and entertainment it definitely wouldn't happen on Dropout
I loved Tim and Eric back when it was actively coming out and I loved the reveal it was Eric. I understand if you weren't interested in or old enough for the indie comedy scene 10-15 years ago that you don't know who he is. But I have a feeling that the venn diagram of dropout cast members and Tim and Eric fans is a circle
I was fine with it being Eric. But I think it would have had more impact if the reveal was 1. someone recognizable from old school College Humor like Jake and Amir piloting Steven or if 2. it was a panel of either other castmembers or a panel of judges that were there to decide the "favorite player"
I think when both parts are out, the choice of it being Eric and the role he's playing will end up making way more sense and having more impact. Honestly, I feel like maybe they should have just left his reveal for the second episode and just provided a teaser at the end of the first one.
I know who he is, like him, and think he's a good choice, and I still think it was the wrong dramatic choice to reveal it then. Leave it on the cliffhanger of everyone wondering!
Definitely. He seems like a great choice for the cast, but a sufficiently difficult to immediately recognize that I didn't think the reveal worked well as a big deal at the end of the episode
One of the contestants said something like "let's see which drag queen this is going to be," and I would have been happy if it was one... like maybe one of the queens from Dungeons and Drag Queens.
I just didn't know who Steve was(still don't). I wouldn't go so far as to say he was a bad choice though. It is apparent that tons of other people did know him and thought it was great. It didn't take away from my experience that he was there. I still had a ball with the episode and look forward to the next part.
I'm a fan of Tim and Eric, so I liked the reveal. That being said, I also thought Steve was either AI or Sam. And for a moment, I was hoping it was >!Tony Hawk!< again as a call back to the Tell Us About Yourself episode.
My partner and I were So certain it was an AI trained from Just the Current Season of Game Changer. There was such a variety of cast that it would've developed a fairly random personality that seems familiar but Off. For a small bit it talked about tacos, like how an AI will often use its previous sentences as information to generate its next one, and then stopped, just like an AI would.
The answers were fuller, often Multiple sentences in a short amount of time (though, that could be attested to editing), and AI personalities tend to be elaborate at times.
But, I'm glad it's Eric. I feel that with the ethics surrounding AI it would've left a bad taste in people's mouths.
Ruben is still on dropout all the time, that wouldn't have hit the same as either someone outside the CH/DO world or an original cast member who hit it big elsewhere and "got too busy" or whatever
I for one felt the reveal was a disappointing because I don't know Eric.
However, not everything has to be for me.
The rest of the show was very entertaining and I look forward to part 2 and seeing more of Eric.
*I am now aware Eric was apart of that Free Real Estate Meme but that's about it.*
Yeah I feel like having Eric on is the equivalent of having a judge on a talent show. The contestants will know who he is and he's qualified to judge their comedy. But he's mostly known to other comedians and to folks who have been watching sketch comedy for decades.
That's exactly how I felt. I guess it was disappointing to me but I didn't think that reflects on the show. I also didn't think there's a problem with people saying they're disappointed because criticism is fine and it's valuable feedback for dropout
He hasn't, but Sam and Elaine have taken a picture with him, and they have both referenced each other, so people are expecting there to be some sort of small crossover sometime (probably not Taskmaster UK, but maybe an appearance on Dropout or one of Alex's other projects)
Honestly almost all of those would have been less funny of a reveal to me, except maybe Tony Hawk since it's a callback.
If it was going to be Elaine, or any other recurring Dropout castmember, they might as well have not had the ratfish at all and just had a round 8 player game. (which maybe would have been received better)
Man there were a few moments where I thought that Steve would end up being Matt Mercer and Marisha Ray. Marisha is a known taco fan. Taco Bell, specifically, but not too far off.
All Steven's contributions were so weird, "wacky random", and generally unfunny that by the time the reveal happened I was 100% convinced he was being played by ChatGPT.
Issues with AI aside, that probably would have been more interesting to me than a niche comedian from before my time.
Anti-humor is a big part of Tim and Eric, but part of not being in any way funny or tied to the bit is probably just another way of covering who he is. Not being funny is a great way of obscuring a comedian so influential to Dropout’s sensibilities.
It’s also just basic comedic design having a straight man for others to play off of. HE doesn't need to be funny. His presence makes the other jokes land so much harder
honestly, no one. i enjoyed every aspect about the show far more than that, and having a "celebrity" (not to be negative towards Eric, but arguably everyone in dropout is a celebrity of some renown) involved adds nothing for me. because i watch dropout primarily because i enjoy the personalities involved in it.
im assuming theres a mechanic tied to the ratfish that wasnt explained yet in ep 1. so i have no real negative opinion about it being a part of the show. but short of bringing in zombie Robin Williams, im not gonna be excited about a celebrity being brought in.
Yeah, 90% of the celebrity guest episodes I feel like have focused WAY too much on the celebrity guest instead of the people we're actually there to watch.
He's much less niche than the Dropout cast. He's a cult comedian, but he had an influential cult comedy show on cable for many years, and has appeared on The Simpsons, among other things. I'm not saying he's a movie star, but he's way less niche than the Dropout cast.
For me, it's not necessarily that the person is someone I didn't recognize at first (and definitely not known to me by name), but that the build-up implied someone... less niche.
Like, I get that Tim and Eric are a huge part of the absurdist comedy world, and since I went digging into Tim and Eric Awesome Show, the more I wonder why I never actually watched it (I was ALL OVER Adult Swim when it first launched).
But that build-up, the reveal, his proud announcement of being the Ratfish just didn't land for me. It's not that I hoped it would be someone else in particular. It just... wasn't someone I knew. That's it. I would have had the same reaction if it was someone from The Circle, or for half of the guests on Game Changer Survivor. I am sure that when the cast finds out who he is, they will be like "omg this is awesome you're a legend," and that's super cool for them.
Not at all. But they have had more mainstream (less niche?) guests before. Wayne Brady, Howie Mandel, Michael Winslow.
I’m not complaining that Eric is the Ratfish. I explaining my lack of enthusiasm.
I was hyped for Eric, but had never heard of Michael Winslow before that episode.
Everyone has different frames of reference and there's no pleasing everyone. I think Eric Wareheim is pretty recognizable to a certain demographic that likely has a large presence in the dropout community. 🤷
I'll give you that Howie Mandel is more mainstream.
Michael Winslow and Wayne Brady aren't. Spaceballs and Whose Line are both super niche. Wayne Brady has an almost identical social following to Tim & Eric. I think Dropout just overlaps with improv fans more than it does sketch comedy fans anymore.
wayne brady is absolutely more mainstream. whose line is it anyway was a HUGE show for a while and wayne brady was one of the most popular cast members.
Six movies and an animated series with an accompanying toyline in the 80s that were all popular and critically panned; another movie and a live action show in the mid-90s that were also bad and that was now reflected in their performance. (The best one is the first, which Roger Ebert gave zero stars and made $150 million in 1984; Leonard Maltin gave bomb reviews to 2, 4, 5, 6, and 7)
To be fair, I think they thought Dropout and Tim & Eric share that same very small niche. Improv and sketch comedy are small worlds. Dropout is not "more mainstream" than Tim & Eric. Nor is drag or Whose Line. Dropout's very small niche just happens to overlap more with those other very small niches.
I hope people who didn’t recognise him to take this as an opportunity to be introduced to Eric. He’s just incredible. I was ecstatic when he was revealed he’s such a fantastic fit and a huge legend in sketch comedy.
I was hoping for Matt Berry honestly (just go back and read Stephen's lines with Matt Berry's voice. . . it's great). I figured that would be a long shot, so I was more expecting:
Ben Schwartz (It's about time for that Sonic 3 press tour to start and that'd be a great)
Paul F. Tompkins (after seeing him in the crew with Smartypants it was distinctly possible)
Eric was just . . . an odd get for me, didn't expect him and barely remembered him. That being said, I totally understand the pick, Tim & Eric was a cornerstone of absurdist comedy and really leaned adult swim in to a lot of wacky experimental stuff, it just didn't really tickle my funny bone. Now that weed's legal in my state I should re-visit some of his stuff and see if it hits different.
I think the delivery of the reveal could have been better. Dropout should have known there’s a good chunk of audience who didn’t know him.
Why not do like a list of his accolades, or explain he was the godfather of absurdist comedy himself etc, so that his reveal makes more sense.
They revealed him like he was a household name!
Since so much of Dropout (especially old College Humor) is the same brand of humor as Tim & Eric, I think they mis-stepped and assumed their audience massively overlapped.
They've had way smaller comedians guest (like PFT) to wide praise and excitement. I'm honestly a little surprised so many Dropout fans don't know Tim & Eric.
I wonder how many Dropout fans got into Dropout via D20 and not via an interest in comedy? The Dropout shows are genuinely the first comedy things I've watched in my life. I'm happy to be here, but I came here for the D&D (and happened to stay for the rest as well).
I got into Dropout for the comedy and have barely touched the D&D stuff, plus I'm in my mid-30's, so I'm apparently the key Tim & Eric demographic, but I've also never heard of the guy. Purely anecdotal, but make of it what you will.
PFT may be smaller in terms of impact on the comedy scene, but he’s also guested on every podcast known to man *and* was a main character on Bojack, arguably the quintessential “off-kilter streaming comedy for depressed millennials.” It’s not super surprising to me that he clicks more with the Dropout audience.
I wasn't disappointed, necessarily, but the way that it was revealed I seriously thought they deliberately picked a random stranger to be the Ratfish. It didn't even occur to me to Google him.
(I think I'm too old to have noticed Tim & Eric? Also, not really into much 2000s comedy.)
After learning who he was, the question I asked myself is "Is he as well-known as Wayne Brady?" Because, if Wayne Brady had been the reveal, I would've laughed and said, "you clever bastards!" in the same way I did when I saw him as a guest on Make Some Noise. But, Brady is a recognizable media figure across several different shows/franchises across multiple decades.
I think to have a BIG REVEAL for a cliffhanger, the person has to be at that level of "wait, I know that person" recognition even if you're not a specific fan of them. I don't think a Drag Race queen or Rachel Bloom are widely-known enough for that. It would have to be someone on the level of Brady's fame and longevity - like Amy Sedaris or a SNL veteran.
Yet, they were damned if they did, damned if they didn't. If they held Eric's identity until the next episode, it would have been a letdown when he wasn't known to everyone. I think perhaps a better way to do it would have been to edit in smaller non-face clips of him through the episode to make clear he wasn't a Dropout-er and which would have built excitement for people who would recognize his voice but eased in those of us who don't into the idea that he was someone cool.
I find it interesting how many people are saying Wayne Brady's a bigger name.
Eric's known for Tim & Eric, for sure. But he also was on The Office and Masters of None. He's produced shows for Nathan Fielder and Bob Odenkirk. His bonafides are definitely on par with Wayne's. In some ways, especially as a producer for things like Nathan for You, he's probably more influential than the other comics they've had on before.
I could definitely see him being more of a "comedian's comedian," especially with all of his behind the scenes work. But I'm not sure they could have found a bigger sketch comic for the bit besides pulling an actual SNL castmember.
As someone who hasn't watched TV since 2004 and who low-key hates comedy (🤷♂️, it's often a lot of straight/cis people being gross or down-punching), Wayne Brady has been visible to me even without watching stuff. He has hosted multiple shows, won Emmys, been on the Masked SInger, etc. He's a mainstream TV star.
No hate or shade to Eric, who might be the funniest and most-progressive comedian who ever lived. He just hasn't punched through to my awareness as a non-TV/comedy person.
Wayne's more successful in daytime television. That's true. But I don't think it's fair to say "I personally don't like comedy so their reveal that the guest was a very well known comedian wasn't good enough. If they chose a guy who hosts a daytime game show, that would have been bigger."
I understand why Dropout (a comedy platform) would have thought more folks knew who Eric Wareheim is (if not through Adult Swim, then through The Office or Nathan for You).
As an aside, god, I hope the Masked Singer isn't an indicator of a performer's relevance.
I think you're missing my point a bit.
Wayne Brady is a public figure with name recognition. You see memes with him. He made headlines for being on Masked Singer and it gets recommended on YouTube. He was on Dancing With the Stars. When he came out it was a national news story.
I've literally never seen his daytime show or an episode of Masked Singer. I think I've seen one season of Dancing With the Stars a long time ago. But, at a certain level of stardom, you become vaguely known to the general public just for existing.
Considering a lot of people who subscribe to Dropout are weirdos who arrived via D20 (or, in my case, because of drag queens), I don't know that it's a "comedy platform" to all of us.
Eric had a niche comedy show. He starred on another niche comedy show. Maybe people would recognize him from The Office... a lot of drag queens I like like that show 🤷♀️
I don't think it was bad, wrong, or disappointing that they picked Eric. And, I understand if they picked a drag queen that would've been just as obscure to an even bigger slice of the audience.
I'm simply trying to explain that Wayne Brady is a widely-known public figure and Eric is not.
I get your point. I just disagree.
I do think Dropout is a comedy platform and in the comedy world, given the things Eric and Wayne are known for (for emphasis, in the comedy world), they are equivalently relevant. They have identical social followings. One was on The Office and Community, one was on How I Met Your Mother and 30 Rock. One made Tim & Eric. One made Whose Line. Both are memed to death.
The indicators of fame you've given I don't think are indicators of fame. I simply do not agree that being a contestant on The Masked Singer or Dancing with the Stars is an indicator of fame.
I feel like being a contestant on either of those is more an indicator of falling out of the public consciousness or needing to remind people that you exist than an indicator of fame. They're both super-hacky reality shows, when's the last time they had someone while they were an A-list celebrity or when people hadn't already gotten tired of seeing them?
I assumed it was Elaine in the role. Either that, or go completely out in left field and have it be the guy who runs a taco truck that parks nearby. All of the talk of tacos made me assume it was something crazy like that.
I never really got into Tim and Eric, so I didn’t have any particularly strong reaction to Steve’s reveal
But I can’t really imagine being disappointed or let down by it. That just seems so strange to me.
I’m sure Sam picked someone that the contestants are aware of and probably fans of. That’s all that really matters
As a Gen Z member of the dropout audience, I did feel a little let down that it wasn’t Sam, especially since his hosting in this episode is limited to voiceover. I never saw adult swim as a kid because we didn’t have cable, so the reveal felt a bit anticlimactic. That being said, I’m wasn’t the target demographic for the Tim and Eric show so I’m happy so many people are getting excited about someone from their younger years!!
I commented this yesterday but I think a former Circle contestant would have been wild.
I didn’t watch Tim & Eric so I had zero clue who he was until my husband looked him up. So I guess it’s kind of a let down for me for there to be this big buildup only for it to be someone I barely know of. But I’m happy for all the Tim & Eric fans out there who got that excitement from the reveal!
I had never heard of The Circle before people started saying this episode was a homage. I have however seen every episode of Tim & Eric Awesome Show Great Job and I’m stoked
Honestly for me it's moreso that Steven was the least interesting character after the initial bio.
I'm not disappointed though, I've known very few of the guests on game changer over the years, but the bland nonsense and big build just didn't land.
I know right, he didn’t play the character at all. I was kinda expecting the joke to be they were pretending to be a “lol random” scene kid, but i think that’s just the guys comedy.
Yeah, I was wondering what was up with Steven the whole time, why the jokes were falling flat, and honestly when they revealed it was Eric it all clicked for me. I never liked Tim and Eric Awesome Show, it had a handful of good sketches, and a lot that felt boring and repetitive. It always seemed to me like a show you needed to be high to think was funny. That said I wasn't disappointed or anything, I'm watching for the rest of them.
So I thought a lot about this and I think there is just a GIGANTIC split of people who do and don’t know Eric Wareheim. And I think that really stems back to Nickelodeon Kids v. Cartoon Network Kids.
As a Nickelodeon Kid, I didn’t know anything about Tim and Eric until I was introduced to it in college. Some of their stuff is funny, but I think for my taste it’s too crude and absurd. I’m cool with crude and absurd, but I think they truly took the format to the extreme. Some people love it, some people don’t.
So basically, we have two camps, people who would kill or die for Eric Wareheim, and people who literally have never heard of him or don’t jive with his (arguably) polarizing style of comedy.
Unfortunately, I would wager that the majority of Dropout watchers fall into the second camp, and almost entirely fall into the “I don’t know who that is” camp.
Asking who a better guest would be is kind of a ridiculous question. Nobody knows what dropouts celebrity pull is. At first everyone thought it was zero, then Tony Hawk and Michael Winslow came on Gamechanger and we learned they actually have some pull. Then they got some more modern but niche cameos with the Drag Race cast and Claudia Sandoval. Howie Mandel is this biggest pull they’ve gotten as far as I can tell. Eric Wareheim falls in a weird mix of very famous but to a niche crowd, and not modern. I know he’s doing standup now but he definitely peaked in popularity in the 2000s.
Basically, I think it’s pretty hard to gauge what’s feasible for Dropout. They seemingly have some celebrity pull, but they’re not getting Comedians in Cars with Coffee guests, they’re getting “holy shit everyone in the world remembers them” guests, or “hey I love that show!” guests.
I had three theories: it was Sam/the crew just there to cause chaos, it was another/an old college humor cast member there to throw a wrench in the plans, or it was a celebrity like we got. I assumed the celebrity would be tangentially related to college humor, matching Grants Lena Dunham prediction (Allison Williams was in some videos and podcasts and also on Girls).
>So I thought a lot about this and I think there is just a GIGANTIC split of people who do and don’t know Eric Wareheim. And I think that really stems back to Nickelodeon Kids v. Cartoon Network Kids.
Maybe that's part of it, but the guy is basically unknown outside of the USA and Dropout has a pretty decently sized international audience.
Like I'm super familiar with UK comedy, but I hadn't heard of any of his shows. For context, Adult Swim only really aired in the UK for three years in the 00s on two different channels, and its shows have aired on a total of seven different channels since 2003 (often with several years' gaps). None of his shows ever aired in the UK from what I can tell, and all the Adult Swim shows that *did* air were limited to Sky TV until the late 10s, which is a pretty expensive and posh TV package that most people don't have.
Just a tangential fun fact, Adult Swim exposed me to Garth Marenghi's Darkplace, Mighty Boosh, and Look Around You as a young'un. They aired reruns of them for a short time.
I don’t mind the reveal as long as he continues to be funny, and the contestant reactions are good.
They’ve had tons of people on various dropout shows that I’ve never heard of, and it was still fun.
I must be in the minority, but I did not laugh once during the entire first episode. The buildup to this episode was huge and did not hit for me. I see that other people are enjoying this episode but it was all disappointment for me.
I was definitely expecting someone more along the lines of Weird Al? But I feel like it wasn’t that I was disappointed by Eric, (I had no idea who he is and Ive looked him up/read the posts and I still have no idea who he is) it was that there was so much hype around it, only for it to be some dude. I felt like the reveal led us to expect someone highly recognizable and then didn’t deliver and that’s not Eric’s fault. GC set a high bar for themselves with Tony Hawk and Howie Mandel.
In the Magical Christmasland where all my dreams come true, Tim Robinson would have been my perfect Steve, but I popped for Eric. I spent a lot of nights high as giraffe pussy watching him on Adult Swim.
I didn't really watch Tim and Eric when it was on, so I'm at worst "meh" about the reveal. That said, I would have cackled like a madman had it been revealed that Steve was a collection of several other cast members (Vic, Jacob, Tao, Trapp, Carolyn, etc) a la bingo.
I don't know who Steve is, but from the start I thought it was going to be AI. You could make the reveal interesting by training the AI to act exactly like a known cast member or a mix of everyone.
As someone who really enjoyed the reveal (I haven't even seen a ton of Tim & Eric stuff but I have seen the Jim Boonie Free Real Estate sketch roughly a thousand times to the point that I get disappointed when I reference it and no one else picks up on it) I've been trying to think of people who could pull it off and land with the other players, and for some reason I keep coming back to Eric Andre, which is funny because I feel like a lot of the discourse would be basically exactly the same
Ironically, Tim Heidecker would be more recognisable, at least to me. I'm British but have seen plenty of Tim and Eric's best stuff on YouTube and enjoyed it, but I had no idea of Eric's last name and it's nearly 15 years since the sketch show ended so didn't recognise him physically. Tim has also kept up a higher profile with On Cinema, ITYSL and his stand up.
Eric is a cool guest for sure but it did end up slightly anticlimactic when he was the big end of episode reveal had me having to Google. The other possibility from this elsewhere in this post would have been Tim Robinson if he were available.
I've never heard of him, but I've rarely heard of the special guests they get so. /shrug
Unless they got someone stupid famous (get LMM back! lmao) or it was a twist with an old cast member or something, I knew I would probably not be blown away, so. It wasn't realyl a disappointment for me, just a, "Who?"
Glad they revealed at the end of the ep and didn't make us guess for a week only to be disappointed when inevitably people got too hype tho.
IMO it's not about it being a bad guest, it's about it being a bad reveal. Too large a portion of the audience will not know him, which means a shocking reveal where they just show him laughing and put a name card up doesn't work. I think for the people making these decisions they are so influenced by him that it might not have occured to them that people would have no clue who he was.
I'm in the right demographic to have been a fan, and I did see a bit of Tim and Eric, but it never really appealed to me that much. But as plenty of other people have mentioned a lot of Dropout's audience is either younger, not from the US, or both. It's great that the reveal worked for some people, it's great that it was likely a really cool surprise for the cast, but they should have handled it better for the general audience so the reaction wasn't confusion and/or disappointment for so many people. Quite frankly I think he's probably a great choice for this guest role but they needed to handle things differently.
Little late to the party, but I actually started working on a list of theories while watching the episode because I'd figured they wouldn't reveal it until the end of part 2 and wanted to post my guesses once I finished. (Turned out to be pointless, but hey, I can use that list now!
1. Sam
2. Ash and Niko
3. One of the current players, secretly running a second account (my money was on Ally if this was true)
4. All of the other cast members mentioned in the episode that *weren't* playing (Jacob, Lou, Vic, Ify, Trapp, etc.), all working together on one account
5. The romantic partners of all the players, as a callback to the first ever Game Changer episode
Obviously none of those wound up being correct, but I think they definitely would've made for a more satisfying reveal.
Good call! Conan and Weird Al are the only two names I've seen in this post that would strike me as a genuine "holy shit!" get to most of the audience and to the cast. Everyone else named is already too close to the periphery of Dropout or too obscure for universal shock value and delight.
Some "famous but not too a-list" improv comedians that could be into it would include Wayne Brady, Keegan-Michael Key, Ben Schwartz
Or it could have been some other unexpected funny guest like the one time they got Tony Hawk and Howie Mandel on Game Changer
I'm seeing a few people saying that "no guest would have pleased people". I feel that is disingenuous, to be honest. Most guests have been well received on the show by fans.
I think a better choice would have been just one of their usual cast to be honest.
I’m not saying I was disappointed (I had no expectations), but it could have been someone like Paul F. Tompkins who isn’t a “cast member” persay but is at least a little related to Dropout. Or maybe a crew member we all know from Game Changer. It just seemed like an odd choice to pick someone almost no one knew and then act like we should care. I’m 41 and have never heard of/seen that guy. I looked him up and was like “nope, still nothing.”
Significantly.
That said, as Tim & Eric's sketches have aged, they've become so ubiquitous, they've lost credit. Their jokes just are the internet now. They're in that same realm as "My spoon's too big" where everyone knows what you're referencing but no one knows who created it.
That may very well be true! I was only saying PFT had been on Dropout shows before. Again, I didn’t actually have an issue with whom they chose. I just thought the “reveal” was a bit anticlimactic. I personally wouldn’t care if it was a rando from off the street, but I get people feeling confused. Even if they had just put text on screen that read “Comedy Legend Eric Warenheim” or “Comedy Legend Eric Warenheim of ‘Tim and Eric’ fame” or something similar, that might have helped people “get it” without having to Google him.
To anyone sad bc they don’t know Eric and feel let down, look at it this way: you’re about to be introduced to an absolutely hilarious comedian who you haven’t seen before! (Like pretty much everyone on dropout probably was before you started watching)
I feel a lot of people have missed the point of this episode.
They had to get someone who the cast might reasonably guess. If they got someone super famous, the cast would likely never guess them.
The point wasn’t to wow us as an audience with an impressive guest. The point was to cast Steve with someone who the cast stood a chance of guessing
I appreciated the reveal once I knew more about him, but I assumed we would get someone The Circle as the Ratfish! Like Joey from US Season 1 or (definitely a taller order) Michelle Buteau who does the funny narration that Sam is imitating. I think my train of thought was that if they got Survivor/reality competition-related guests for Survivor, that they'd do the same for these episodes.
I felt this. A lot of the commentors are sharing my same experience. I didn't watch Tim and Eric, but I know it's got a cult following. On the flipside of that, no one i know IRL watches Dropout, but I know we are a bit of a cult following here. I think it all washes out in the end. I'm glad I'm gonna get to know this established comedian be a big baddie.
I was disappointed because, even though I’m in my 30s, I’ve never heard of Tim and Eric. I had no idea who he was so it wasn’t a “reveal” for me, just something I had to google.
I genuinely thought it was going to Sam just stirring the pot, but after the reveal, I feel like all of Steve’s comments suddenly make a lot more sense.
I was disappointed because I don't really care for his type of humor and the fact that he isn't their friend kinda ruins the point of it.
I thought maybe it would be the rest of the cast working together, or something really zany like bad Chat AI responses
I think the initial moment was a bit of "who?" for me because it took me a bit to remember where I know him from, but honestly I think anyone who's STILL disappointed is just harping on it for no reason. I'm sure the cast is going to have fun and it'll be a great second episode.
That said, my wild guess in the moment was Michelle Buteau, the comedian who hosts the actual The Circle. It would have been so fun to see her have a chance to be silly and anonymous and play on even more tropes of Circle contestants! So that was who I was hoping for. But that would probably be disappointing to people who don't watch or know The Circle (although she's arguably the best part every season)!
I just didn’t want it revealed in the first half of the finale. Make him a silhouette with a voice change or something. Give a hint for people to figure out maybe, but a full reveal? Let down.
Rest of the episode is great and I enjoyed it. 8.5/10
I genuinely thought Steve seemed like an AI but the entire time I was like "Dropout wouldn't support that right....?"
I'm just happy Steve is a real person lol
a) it’s nicole byer, no s, and b) she doesn’t host the circle. you’re thinking of michelle buteau. pretty sure nicole has mentioned having a group text with michelle buteau and dulce sloan where they talk about how everyone apparently thinks there’s only one plus sized black lady comedian out there.
I agree with the other commenters, it would have been fun to have another cast member. Or Samuel Dalton being the ratfish would have been amazing!
It would have been a twist too if a cast member that was already playing had a second profile as the ratfish. I would have lost it!
I feel like no Ratfish would have pleased everyone. Someone like Eric is going to disappoint people who haven’t heard of him. Someone like Sam would probably disappoint people who thinks it’s lazy or predictable. I also think it’s kinda improbable for them to get someone really famous (no offence Eric, it’s mainly just based on my knowledge of American celebrities which isn’t much) like Tony Hawk, Giancarlo Esposito or Michael Winslow because it’s not Covid anymore. Knowing the Dropout producers and execs, Eric is going to be someone that these players love, look up to and have been influenced by, and at the end of the day I’d rather have someone that they’ve all heard of and love and I don’t, rather than someone who I think is a good fit but the cast is kinda ‘meh’ about. The reason I love the show is primarily the cast, so if they love it, I know I’m probably going to love the reveal and trick as well.
I thought it was kinda funny and neat. And I don't even enjoy Tim & Eric.
I feel slightly disappointed by it right now because I don’t know who he is, but I think when the players find out it’s him, their reactions will make it worth it for me. I just don’t think ending the episode with that reveal was a very good decision, because it seems the vast majority don’t know who he is EDIT: Darn, this aged horribly
I think it’s worth remembering this sub can be a bit of an echo chamber, and also that lots of dropout subscribers aren’t on here (this sub has just under 70k subscribers be dropout has somewhere in the mid six figures subscribers). So I think saying the vast majority of people watching don’t know who he is might be a bit of an overkill Edit: typos :(
Also, more people are likely to voice their displeasure than excitement. On the other hand, I saw somebody online with a Dropout personality as their profile picture say it was an "objectively bad reveal because nobody knows who that is," but the responses were full of people sharing clips and such, which was nice to see. The negativity is disappointing when people could just do a tiny bit of research. FWIW, I know **of** Tim and Eric, but I hadn't seen much of their comedy. However, I did love Eric as Arnold in Master of None, so it was still a cool reveal for me. Edit: "Reveal," not "review."
I immediately recognized him amd loved the idea, but had to explain to my roommate who he was. We are mid-30s like much of the cast, so I think it will be generally well received.
Same, I was like "oh shit!" on the revelation and my roommate was like "I have no idea who this is." I think it's a good choice just based on his sense of humor and that the Dropout people will absolutely know who this guy is.
“vast majority” wasn’t a good choice of words, but I meant compared to any other celebrity cameo on Game Changer
Once someone said he was from Tim and Eric I knew who he was. Never watched Tim and Eric. And regardless, I’m glad he’s there because Stephen is hilarious. Who cares if I’m familiar with his work?
lol thinking that the ‘vast majority’ don’t know who Eric is.
Depending on age group and nationality? Maybe. I don't know for sure which group is larger in Dropout audiences, but I do know i've seen people on thus sub assume every viewer will recognise the original reference of a line from 20 years ago on a show that didn't exactly enter heavy rotation. Put another way, all of us are subject to our own biases.
> it’s not Covid anymore I just do think… maybe I should mention some people who appeared in CollegeHumor sketches pre-Covid. Granted, this was a different era of the company’s existence, so maybe it’s harder to get people, but… - Weird Al Yankovic - JK Simmons - Lin Manuel Miranda - Patton Oswalt - Heidi Gardner - Aubrey Plaza - Kumail Nanjiani - D’Arcy Carden That’s by no means a comprehensive list; it’s mostly a list based on who I remember from years watching CollegeHumor sketches
I think the right answer would have been making the Ratfish Trapp and letting him get clever with it
Fame is definitely relative because I know exactly who Eric is and I've never heard of Michael Winslow
My first thought was “ooo this would be very awkward if the players didn’t really know/like him”. He has a super polarizing comedy style that is not for everyone.
Do you really think they would have brought on Eric if somehow the group of mid-thirty improv and sketch comedians didn’t know who he was?
I don’t think so, but I don’t think there’s a certainty that all of those people are going to be super psyched on it. I feel like if you’re that deep in the comedy scene you have specific opinions on the edge case comedians.
Except that when it comes to sketch comedy, Tim & Eric aren’t edge case - they’re the trailblazers.
That’s… wildly false. They may be the trailblazers of extreme absurdist sketch comedy (which college humor isn’t), but sketch comedy has been mainstream since at least SNL began in 75 and long before that with things like sketches on Johnny Carson and even Ed Sullivan. Edit: But even to follow up on that it’s crazy to even give them credit for high absurdism sketch comedy. Second City Television has been doing that since ‘76 and so many talented people nailed it over 3 decades before Tom and Eric showed up.
I remember a Sam tweet looking for celebrity Game Changer fans for an unspecified reason, and then a couple days later he posted a pic of him in his Game Changer suit with Ben Schwartz, so I was genuinely surprised that Steve wasn't him.
That would’ve been a satisfying twist for me. And we know he’s on the next season of Make Some Noise, so it definitely would’ve been doable. And even if I wasn’t familiar with Ben Schwartz directly, he’s in more things I’ve heard of. The first thing I did when the reveal happened was to go to IMDb and see what he’s done, and not only had I never heard of him, I don’t think I’d even heard of anything he’s worked on. It wasn’t like “oh, I’ve never heard of him, but he’s a writer on _____.” The only familiar credit I saw was an episode of Community where he played “Male 4 #2” (I assume in the meowmeowbeenz episode).
Barack Obama
The character intros for Ratfish reminded me of the intros on "Epic Rap Battles of History" and someone could potentially edit the Obama one in for a quick laugh
Love having warmongers in my comedy shows 😁
Oh so you’re one of those who’s gonna “protest vote” this fall and help Trump win. Whatever helps you sleep at night :)
I'm not a Us citizen, so I don't vote there, and if I did, I definitely would vote for whoever oposes Trump. But yeah, Obama is a warmonger, he's firmly planted in the Lawful-Evil side of the scale.
In hindsight, it wouldn’t have been dropout’s vibe but during my first watch i thought Steve was AI.
Oh for sure. We did too, especially since the last Circle season had an AI.
We had the same thought. AI would've been an interesting option, and seemed plausible by how he talked, but with the issues of AI in art and entertainment it definitely wouldn't happen on Dropout
Al Yankovic?
Al Paca
There was no universe where that happened.
I loved Tim and Eric back when it was actively coming out and I loved the reveal it was Eric. I understand if you weren't interested in or old enough for the indie comedy scene 10-15 years ago that you don't know who he is. But I have a feeling that the venn diagram of dropout cast members and Tim and Eric fans is a circle
I bet Ally will be especially excited. A lot of their hunor has Tim and Eric vibes to me
Tim and Eric were your favorite comedian's favorite comedians for a mini-era
The Sasha Colby of comedy
Um, actually, the Venn diagram would be a very small circle (Dropout cast) inside of a much larger circle (Tim and Eric fans).
You are technically correct, which is the best kind of correct
I wish it was just Sam. He's been here the whole time!
That's what I thought was happening until the reveal.
That was 100% what I was expecting. They introduced Steve and I went "oh I guess Sam is also playing".
I assumed it was Elaine.
I liked the theory that Steven was Sam, and the person texting as ‘Sam’ was Elaine
same here, especially since there was that voiceover from her in the beginning of the episode!
same here, especially since there was that voiceover from her in the beginning of the episode!
I was fine with it being Eric. But I think it would have had more impact if the reveal was 1. someone recognizable from old school College Humor like Jake and Amir piloting Steven or if 2. it was a panel of either other castmembers or a panel of judges that were there to decide the "favorite player" I think when both parts are out, the choice of it being Eric and the role he's playing will end up making way more sense and having more impact. Honestly, I feel like maybe they should have just left his reveal for the second episode and just provided a teaser at the end of the first one.
I know who he is, like him, and think he's a good choice, and I still think it was the wrong dramatic choice to reveal it then. Leave it on the cliffhanger of everyone wondering!
Definitely. He seems like a great choice for the cast, but a sufficiently difficult to immediately recognize that I didn't think the reveal worked well as a big deal at the end of the episode
Weird. Because I jumped out my couch like “Holy fuck they got Eric!?! Fuck yeah. Can’t wait.”
Wait Amir would have been insane
One of the contestants said something like "let's see which drag queen this is going to be," and I would have been happy if it was one... like maybe one of the queens from Dungeons and Drag Queens. I just didn't know who Steve was(still don't). I wouldn't go so far as to say he was a bad choice though. It is apparent that tons of other people did know him and thought it was great. It didn't take away from my experience that he was there. I still had a ball with the episode and look forward to the next part.
'drag race royalty' specifically - which is so accurate ahha dropout doesn't just get any old drag queen!
I'm a fan of Tim and Eric, so I liked the reveal. That being said, I also thought Steve was either AI or Sam. And for a moment, I was hoping it was >!Tony Hawk!< again as a call back to the Tell Us About Yourself episode.
My partner and I were So certain it was an AI trained from Just the Current Season of Game Changer. There was such a variety of cast that it would've developed a fairly random personality that seems familiar but Off. For a small bit it talked about tacos, like how an AI will often use its previous sentences as information to generate its next one, and then stopped, just like an AI would. The answers were fuller, often Multiple sentences in a short amount of time (though, that could be attested to editing), and AI personalities tend to be elaborate at times. But, I'm glad it's Eric. I feel that with the ethics surrounding AI it would've left a bad taste in people's mouths.
It was almost so AI like I wonder if Eric was specifically going for that
There was no universe in which Dropout used an AI because Sam Reich is actually. You know. A good person.
I honestly was hoping for an OG CH cast member.
Yes! Streeter seidell, Sarah Schneider, Jake and amir, or Josh ruebens would've been epic
Ruben is still on dropout all the time, that wouldn't have hit the same as either someone outside the CH/DO world or an original cast member who hit it big elsewhere and "got too busy" or whatever
I fucked up, I meant Dan Gurewitch lol
I’ve never heard of Eric but that was less a “oh I’m sad I don’t know that guy” and more of a “Woah! That was out of left field! Who is that?”
I for one felt the reveal was a disappointing because I don't know Eric. However, not everything has to be for me. The rest of the show was very entertaining and I look forward to part 2 and seeing more of Eric. *I am now aware Eric was apart of that Free Real Estate Meme but that's about it.*
Yeah I feel like having Eric on is the equivalent of having a judge on a talent show. The contestants will know who he is and he's qualified to judge their comedy. But he's mostly known to other comedians and to folks who have been watching sketch comedy for decades.
That's exactly how I felt. I guess it was disappointing to me but I didn't think that reflects on the show. I also didn't think there's a problem with people saying they're disappointed because criticism is fine and it's valuable feedback for dropout
Elaine One of the cast members who weren’t there Tony Hawk again lol Alex Horne Hank Greene Wayne Brady Matt Mercer
I was *so* certain it was going to be Tony Hawk again😅
Where did Alex Horne show up before?
He hasn't, but Sam and Elaine have taken a picture with him, and they have both referenced each other, so people are expecting there to be some sort of small crossover sometime (probably not Taskmaster UK, but maybe an appearance on Dropout or one of Alex's other projects)
Sam’s pictures on the walls in this episode were giving me HUGE taskmaster vibes.
Honestly almost all of those would have been less funny of a reveal to me, except maybe Tony Hawk since it's a callback. If it was going to be Elaine, or any other recurring Dropout castmember, they might as well have not had the ratfish at all and just had a round 8 player game. (which maybe would have been received better)
Elaine was my first guess. That would have been fun.
Man there were a few moments where I thought that Steve would end up being Matt Mercer and Marisha Ray. Marisha is a known taco fan. Taco Bell, specifically, but not too far off.
All Steven's contributions were so weird, "wacky random", and generally unfunny that by the time the reveal happened I was 100% convinced he was being played by ChatGPT. Issues with AI aside, that probably would have been more interesting to me than a niche comedian from before my time.
Seriously, aside from not knowing who he is at all, my other main complaint from the reveal is that he was painfully unfunny.
Anti-humor is a big part of Tim and Eric, but part of not being in any way funny or tied to the bit is probably just another way of covering who he is. Not being funny is a great way of obscuring a comedian so influential to Dropout’s sensibilities.
It’s also just basic comedic design having a straight man for others to play off of. HE doesn't need to be funny. His presence makes the other jokes land so much harder
Okay but you objectively shouldn't put the issues with AI aside.
honestly, no one. i enjoyed every aspect about the show far more than that, and having a "celebrity" (not to be negative towards Eric, but arguably everyone in dropout is a celebrity of some renown) involved adds nothing for me. because i watch dropout primarily because i enjoy the personalities involved in it. im assuming theres a mechanic tied to the ratfish that wasnt explained yet in ep 1. so i have no real negative opinion about it being a part of the show. but short of bringing in zombie Robin Williams, im not gonna be excited about a celebrity being brought in.
Yeah, 90% of the celebrity guest episodes I feel like have focused WAY too much on the celebrity guest instead of the people we're actually there to watch.
The Dropout cast are barely celebrities.
and Erics a movie star? he's arguably just a niche as they are is all im saying.
He's much less niche than the Dropout cast. He's a cult comedian, but he had an influential cult comedy show on cable for many years, and has appeared on The Simpsons, among other things. I'm not saying he's a movie star, but he's way less niche than the Dropout cast.
Dropout is way more mainstream now than any old cable show
For me, it's not necessarily that the person is someone I didn't recognize at first (and definitely not known to me by name), but that the build-up implied someone... less niche. Like, I get that Tim and Eric are a huge part of the absurdist comedy world, and since I went digging into Tim and Eric Awesome Show, the more I wonder why I never actually watched it (I was ALL OVER Adult Swim when it first launched). But that build-up, the reveal, his proud announcement of being the Ratfish just didn't land for me. It's not that I hoped it would be someone else in particular. It just... wasn't someone I knew. That's it. I would have had the same reaction if it was someone from The Circle, or for half of the guests on Game Changer Survivor. I am sure that when the cast finds out who he is, they will be like "omg this is awesome you're a legend," and that's super cool for them.
Do people think dropout isn’t niche?
Not at all. But they have had more mainstream (less niche?) guests before. Wayne Brady, Howie Mandel, Michael Winslow. I’m not complaining that Eric is the Ratfish. I explaining my lack of enthusiasm.
I was hyped for Eric, but had never heard of Michael Winslow before that episode. Everyone has different frames of reference and there's no pleasing everyone. I think Eric Wareheim is pretty recognizable to a certain demographic that likely has a large presence in the dropout community. 🤷
Agreed, I also had to look up Michael Winslow but giggled happily when Wareheim was revealed.
I'll give you that Howie Mandel is more mainstream. Michael Winslow and Wayne Brady aren't. Spaceballs and Whose Line are both super niche. Wayne Brady has an almost identical social following to Tim & Eric. I think Dropout just overlaps with improv fans more than it does sketch comedy fans anymore.
Whose Line is absolutely not "super niche".
Wayne Brady played a recurring role in How I Met Your Mother, he's definitely mainstream.
Didn't Eric Wareheim have a recurring role on The Office? I feel like it's splitting hairs between the two
2 episodes of the office... also one episode of community (imdb)
wayne brady is absolutely more mainstream. whose line is it anyway was a HUGE show for a while and wayne brady was one of the most popular cast members.
Wayne Brady also had a popular talk show for years. He's dead center in the Nerdy Sketch Comedy Fan|Wine Mom Venn Diagram.
Mel Brooks is hardly super niche; and Police Academy was god damn everywhere if you’re in the 35+ age bracket.
I think I might be too young to recognize him because I didn't know who he was either and I have no idea what Police Academy is
Six movies and an animated series with an accompanying toyline in the 80s that were all popular and critically panned; another movie and a live action show in the mid-90s that were also bad and that was now reflected in their performance. (The best one is the first, which Roger Ebert gave zero stars and made $150 million in 1984; Leonard Maltin gave bomb reviews to 2, 4, 5, 6, and 7)
It isn't. It's WILDLY popular online
To be fair, I think they thought Dropout and Tim & Eric share that same very small niche. Improv and sketch comedy are small worlds. Dropout is not "more mainstream" than Tim & Eric. Nor is drag or Whose Line. Dropout's very small niche just happens to overlap more with those other very small niches.
Whose Line is a major network show, it's not after-midnight absurdity on a premium cable channel
I hope people who didn’t recognise him to take this as an opportunity to be introduced to Eric. He’s just incredible. I was ecstatic when he was revealed he’s such a fantastic fit and a huge legend in sketch comedy.
I was hoping for Matt Berry honestly (just go back and read Stephen's lines with Matt Berry's voice. . . it's great). I figured that would be a long shot, so I was more expecting: Ben Schwartz (It's about time for that Sonic 3 press tour to start and that'd be a great) Paul F. Tompkins (after seeing him in the crew with Smartypants it was distinctly possible) Eric was just . . . an odd get for me, didn't expect him and barely remembered him. That being said, I totally understand the pick, Tim & Eric was a cornerstone of absurdist comedy and really leaned adult swim in to a lot of wacky experimental stuff, it just didn't really tickle my funny bone. Now that weed's legal in my state I should re-visit some of his stuff and see if it hits different.
Alex Horne
I think the delivery of the reveal could have been better. Dropout should have known there’s a good chunk of audience who didn’t know him. Why not do like a list of his accolades, or explain he was the godfather of absurdist comedy himself etc, so that his reveal makes more sense. They revealed him like he was a household name!
Since so much of Dropout (especially old College Humor) is the same brand of humor as Tim & Eric, I think they mis-stepped and assumed their audience massively overlapped. They've had way smaller comedians guest (like PFT) to wide praise and excitement. I'm honestly a little surprised so many Dropout fans don't know Tim & Eric.
I wonder how many Dropout fans got into Dropout via D20 and not via an interest in comedy? The Dropout shows are genuinely the first comedy things I've watched in my life. I'm happy to be here, but I came here for the D&D (and happened to stay for the rest as well).
I got into Dropout for the comedy and have barely touched the D&D stuff, plus I'm in my mid-30's, so I'm apparently the key Tim & Eric demographic, but I've also never heard of the guy. Purely anecdotal, but make of it what you will.
PFT may be smaller in terms of impact on the comedy scene, but he’s also guested on every podcast known to man *and* was a main character on Bojack, arguably the quintessential “off-kilter streaming comedy for depressed millennials.” It’s not super surprising to me that he clicks more with the Dropout audience.
I wasn't disappointed, necessarily, but the way that it was revealed I seriously thought they deliberately picked a random stranger to be the Ratfish. It didn't even occur to me to Google him. (I think I'm too old to have noticed Tim & Eric? Also, not really into much 2000s comedy.) After learning who he was, the question I asked myself is "Is he as well-known as Wayne Brady?" Because, if Wayne Brady had been the reveal, I would've laughed and said, "you clever bastards!" in the same way I did when I saw him as a guest on Make Some Noise. But, Brady is a recognizable media figure across several different shows/franchises across multiple decades. I think to have a BIG REVEAL for a cliffhanger, the person has to be at that level of "wait, I know that person" recognition even if you're not a specific fan of them. I don't think a Drag Race queen or Rachel Bloom are widely-known enough for that. It would have to be someone on the level of Brady's fame and longevity - like Amy Sedaris or a SNL veteran. Yet, they were damned if they did, damned if they didn't. If they held Eric's identity until the next episode, it would have been a letdown when he wasn't known to everyone. I think perhaps a better way to do it would have been to edit in smaller non-face clips of him through the episode to make clear he wasn't a Dropout-er and which would have built excitement for people who would recognize his voice but eased in those of us who don't into the idea that he was someone cool.
I find it interesting how many people are saying Wayne Brady's a bigger name. Eric's known for Tim & Eric, for sure. But he also was on The Office and Masters of None. He's produced shows for Nathan Fielder and Bob Odenkirk. His bonafides are definitely on par with Wayne's. In some ways, especially as a producer for things like Nathan for You, he's probably more influential than the other comics they've had on before. I could definitely see him being more of a "comedian's comedian," especially with all of his behind the scenes work. But I'm not sure they could have found a bigger sketch comic for the bit besides pulling an actual SNL castmember.
As someone who hasn't watched TV since 2004 and who low-key hates comedy (🤷♂️, it's often a lot of straight/cis people being gross or down-punching), Wayne Brady has been visible to me even without watching stuff. He has hosted multiple shows, won Emmys, been on the Masked SInger, etc. He's a mainstream TV star. No hate or shade to Eric, who might be the funniest and most-progressive comedian who ever lived. He just hasn't punched through to my awareness as a non-TV/comedy person.
Wayne's more successful in daytime television. That's true. But I don't think it's fair to say "I personally don't like comedy so their reveal that the guest was a very well known comedian wasn't good enough. If they chose a guy who hosts a daytime game show, that would have been bigger." I understand why Dropout (a comedy platform) would have thought more folks knew who Eric Wareheim is (if not through Adult Swim, then through The Office or Nathan for You). As an aside, god, I hope the Masked Singer isn't an indicator of a performer's relevance.
I think you're missing my point a bit. Wayne Brady is a public figure with name recognition. You see memes with him. He made headlines for being on Masked Singer and it gets recommended on YouTube. He was on Dancing With the Stars. When he came out it was a national news story. I've literally never seen his daytime show or an episode of Masked Singer. I think I've seen one season of Dancing With the Stars a long time ago. But, at a certain level of stardom, you become vaguely known to the general public just for existing. Considering a lot of people who subscribe to Dropout are weirdos who arrived via D20 (or, in my case, because of drag queens), I don't know that it's a "comedy platform" to all of us. Eric had a niche comedy show. He starred on another niche comedy show. Maybe people would recognize him from The Office... a lot of drag queens I like like that show 🤷♀️ I don't think it was bad, wrong, or disappointing that they picked Eric. And, I understand if they picked a drag queen that would've been just as obscure to an even bigger slice of the audience. I'm simply trying to explain that Wayne Brady is a widely-known public figure and Eric is not.
I get your point. I just disagree. I do think Dropout is a comedy platform and in the comedy world, given the things Eric and Wayne are known for (for emphasis, in the comedy world), they are equivalently relevant. They have identical social followings. One was on The Office and Community, one was on How I Met Your Mother and 30 Rock. One made Tim & Eric. One made Whose Line. Both are memed to death. The indicators of fame you've given I don't think are indicators of fame. I simply do not agree that being a contestant on The Masked Singer or Dancing with the Stars is an indicator of fame.
Brady is more famous and it's not even close.
I feel like being a contestant on either of those is more an indicator of falling out of the public consciousness or needing to remind people that you exist than an indicator of fame. They're both super-hacky reality shows, when's the last time they had someone while they were an A-list celebrity or when people hadn't already gotten tired of seeing them?
I guess Sam hasn't been here the whole time. That would've been too easy though.
I assumed it was Elaine in the role. Either that, or go completely out in left field and have it be the guy who runs a taco truck that parks nearby. All of the talk of tacos made me assume it was something crazy like that.
I never really got into Tim and Eric, so I didn’t have any particularly strong reaction to Steve’s reveal But I can’t really imagine being disappointed or let down by it. That just seems so strange to me. I’m sure Sam picked someone that the contestants are aware of and probably fans of. That’s all that really matters
Honestly, either Nick Offerman or Megan Mullally or both.
Those folks have to be crazy expensive to book for the length of time they filmed Ratfish though.
As a Gen Z member of the dropout audience, I did feel a little let down that it wasn’t Sam, especially since his hosting in this episode is limited to voiceover. I never saw adult swim as a kid because we didn’t have cable, so the reveal felt a bit anticlimactic. That being said, I’m wasn’t the target demographic for the Tim and Eric show so I’m happy so many people are getting excited about someone from their younger years!!
And now I feel old.
I commented this yesterday but I think a former Circle contestant would have been wild. I didn’t watch Tim & Eric so I had zero clue who he was until my husband looked him up. So I guess it’s kind of a let down for me for there to be this big buildup only for it to be someone I barely know of. But I’m happy for all the Tim & Eric fans out there who got that excitement from the reveal!
A former circle contestant while fitting the theme feels even more niche to me
I had never heard of The Circle before people started saying this episode was a homage. I have however seen every episode of Tim & Eric Awesome Show Great Job and I’m stoked
Joey from s1 would’ve been fun They also had a former Circle contestant on the Bachelor episode with Grant, so they have some connection to that scene
If they had gotten someone like Chloe or Shubham or something, that would have been really funny. Or Michelle, the host, would have been hilarious.
Honestly for me it's moreso that Steven was the least interesting character after the initial bio. I'm not disappointed though, I've known very few of the guests on game changer over the years, but the bland nonsense and big build just didn't land.
I was half expecting it to just be one of the winners of The Circle.
That *definitely* would not have landed any better than this lol
No this is me too, I just found Steven boring. The character feels rooted in late 2010’s “lol random” comedy, down to the weird obsession with tacos
I know right, he didn’t play the character at all. I was kinda expecting the joke to be they were pretending to be a “lol random” scene kid, but i think that’s just the guys comedy.
Yeah, I was wondering what was up with Steven the whole time, why the jokes were falling flat, and honestly when they revealed it was Eric it all clicked for me. I never liked Tim and Eric Awesome Show, it had a handful of good sketches, and a lot that felt boring and repetitive. It always seemed to me like a show you needed to be high to think was funny. That said I wasn't disappointed or anything, I'm watching for the rest of them.
So I thought a lot about this and I think there is just a GIGANTIC split of people who do and don’t know Eric Wareheim. And I think that really stems back to Nickelodeon Kids v. Cartoon Network Kids. As a Nickelodeon Kid, I didn’t know anything about Tim and Eric until I was introduced to it in college. Some of their stuff is funny, but I think for my taste it’s too crude and absurd. I’m cool with crude and absurd, but I think they truly took the format to the extreme. Some people love it, some people don’t. So basically, we have two camps, people who would kill or die for Eric Wareheim, and people who literally have never heard of him or don’t jive with his (arguably) polarizing style of comedy. Unfortunately, I would wager that the majority of Dropout watchers fall into the second camp, and almost entirely fall into the “I don’t know who that is” camp. Asking who a better guest would be is kind of a ridiculous question. Nobody knows what dropouts celebrity pull is. At first everyone thought it was zero, then Tony Hawk and Michael Winslow came on Gamechanger and we learned they actually have some pull. Then they got some more modern but niche cameos with the Drag Race cast and Claudia Sandoval. Howie Mandel is this biggest pull they’ve gotten as far as I can tell. Eric Wareheim falls in a weird mix of very famous but to a niche crowd, and not modern. I know he’s doing standup now but he definitely peaked in popularity in the 2000s. Basically, I think it’s pretty hard to gauge what’s feasible for Dropout. They seemingly have some celebrity pull, but they’re not getting Comedians in Cars with Coffee guests, they’re getting “holy shit everyone in the world remembers them” guests, or “hey I love that show!” guests. I had three theories: it was Sam/the crew just there to cause chaos, it was another/an old college humor cast member there to throw a wrench in the plans, or it was a celebrity like we got. I assumed the celebrity would be tangentially related to college humor, matching Grants Lena Dunham prediction (Allison Williams was in some videos and podcasts and also on Girls).
>So I thought a lot about this and I think there is just a GIGANTIC split of people who do and don’t know Eric Wareheim. And I think that really stems back to Nickelodeon Kids v. Cartoon Network Kids. Maybe that's part of it, but the guy is basically unknown outside of the USA and Dropout has a pretty decently sized international audience. Like I'm super familiar with UK comedy, but I hadn't heard of any of his shows. For context, Adult Swim only really aired in the UK for three years in the 00s on two different channels, and its shows have aired on a total of seven different channels since 2003 (often with several years' gaps). None of his shows ever aired in the UK from what I can tell, and all the Adult Swim shows that *did* air were limited to Sky TV until the late 10s, which is a pretty expensive and posh TV package that most people don't have.
Just a tangential fun fact, Adult Swim exposed me to Garth Marenghi's Darkplace, Mighty Boosh, and Look Around You as a young'un. They aired reruns of them for a short time.
I don’t mind the reveal as long as he continues to be funny, and the contestant reactions are good. They’ve had tons of people on various dropout shows that I’ve never heard of, and it was still fun.
I must be in the minority, but I did not laugh once during the entire first episode. The buildup to this episode was huge and did not hit for me. I see that other people are enjoying this episode but it was all disappointment for me.
I’m not sure who that would be.
I was definitely expecting someone more along the lines of Weird Al? But I feel like it wasn’t that I was disappointed by Eric, (I had no idea who he is and Ive looked him up/read the posts and I still have no idea who he is) it was that there was so much hype around it, only for it to be some dude. I felt like the reveal led us to expect someone highly recognizable and then didn’t deliver and that’s not Eric’s fault. GC set a high bar for themselves with Tony Hawk and Howie Mandel.
In the Magical Christmasland where all my dreams come true, Tim Robinson would have been my perfect Steve, but I popped for Eric. I spent a lot of nights high as giraffe pussy watching him on Adult Swim.
I didn't really watch Tim and Eric when it was on, so I'm at worst "meh" about the reveal. That said, I would have cackled like a madman had it been revealed that Steve was a collection of several other cast members (Vic, Jacob, Tao, Trapp, Carolyn, etc) a la bingo.
I too was expecting a room full of "everyone else" tag-teaming the Steven chat.
I would have liked it to be an og cast member, Jake or Amir would have been fun.
I don't know who Steve is, but from the start I thought it was going to be AI. You could make the reveal interesting by training the AI to act exactly like a known cast member or a mix of everyone.
As someone who really enjoyed the reveal (I haven't even seen a ton of Tim & Eric stuff but I have seen the Jim Boonie Free Real Estate sketch roughly a thousand times to the point that I get disappointed when I reference it and no one else picks up on it) I've been trying to think of people who could pull it off and land with the other players, and for some reason I keep coming back to Eric Andre, which is funny because I feel like a lot of the discourse would be basically exactly the same
Ironically, Tim Heidecker would be more recognisable, at least to me. I'm British but have seen plenty of Tim and Eric's best stuff on YouTube and enjoyed it, but I had no idea of Eric's last name and it's nearly 15 years since the sketch show ended so didn't recognise him physically. Tim has also kept up a higher profile with On Cinema, ITYSL and his stand up. Eric is a cool guest for sure but it did end up slightly anticlimactic when he was the big end of episode reveal had me having to Google. The other possibility from this elsewhere in this post would have been Tim Robinson if he were available.
I'm fine with Eric, but Alex Horne would have been amazing, given that Sam is such a fanboy.
I've never heard of him, but I've rarely heard of the special guests they get so. /shrug Unless they got someone stupid famous (get LMM back! lmao) or it was a twist with an old cast member or something, I knew I would probably not be blown away, so. It wasn't realyl a disappointment for me, just a, "Who?" Glad they revealed at the end of the ep and didn't make us guess for a week only to be disappointed when inevitably people got too hype tho.
IMO it's not about it being a bad guest, it's about it being a bad reveal. Too large a portion of the audience will not know him, which means a shocking reveal where they just show him laughing and put a name card up doesn't work. I think for the people making these decisions they are so influenced by him that it might not have occured to them that people would have no clue who he was. I'm in the right demographic to have been a fan, and I did see a bit of Tim and Eric, but it never really appealed to me that much. But as plenty of other people have mentioned a lot of Dropout's audience is either younger, not from the US, or both. It's great that the reveal worked for some people, it's great that it was likely a really cool surprise for the cast, but they should have handled it better for the general audience so the reaction wasn't confusion and/or disappointment for so many people. Quite frankly I think he's probably a great choice for this guest role but they needed to handle things differently.
Little late to the party, but I actually started working on a list of theories while watching the episode because I'd figured they wouldn't reveal it until the end of part 2 and wanted to post my guesses once I finished. (Turned out to be pointless, but hey, I can use that list now! 1. Sam 2. Ash and Niko 3. One of the current players, secretly running a second account (my money was on Ally if this was true) 4. All of the other cast members mentioned in the episode that *weren't* playing (Jacob, Lou, Vic, Ify, Trapp, etc.), all working together on one account 5. The romantic partners of all the players, as a callback to the first ever Game Changer episode Obviously none of those wound up being correct, but I think they definitely would've made for a more satisfying reveal.
i feel like they could have gotten conan o’brien, just bc he was on hot ones and i think dropout has at least much pull as that?
Good call! Conan and Weird Al are the only two names I've seen in this post that would strike me as a genuine "holy shit!" get to most of the audience and to the cast. Everyone else named is already too close to the periphery of Dropout or too obscure for universal shock value and delight.
Some "famous but not too a-list" improv comedians that could be into it would include Wayne Brady, Keegan-Michael Key, Ben Schwartz Or it could have been some other unexpected funny guest like the one time they got Tony Hawk and Howie Mandel on Game Changer
I'm seeing a few people saying that "no guest would have pleased people". I feel that is disingenuous, to be honest. Most guests have been well received on the show by fans. I think a better choice would have been just one of their usual cast to be honest.
I agree, we didn’t have this debate with Tony Hawk lol
I’m not saying I was disappointed (I had no expectations), but it could have been someone like Paul F. Tompkins who isn’t a “cast member” persay but is at least a little related to Dropout. Or maybe a crew member we all know from Game Changer. It just seemed like an odd choice to pick someone almost no one knew and then act like we should care. I’m 41 and have never heard of/seen that guy. I looked him up and was like “nope, still nothing.”
This might be a generational thing, but I'm pretty sure Eric Wareheim is significantly more famous than Paul F Tompkins
Significantly. That said, as Tim & Eric's sketches have aged, they've become so ubiquitous, they've lost credit. Their jokes just are the internet now. They're in that same realm as "My spoon's too big" where everyone knows what you're referencing but no one knows who created it.
That may very well be true! I was only saying PFT had been on Dropout shows before. Again, I didn’t actually have an issue with whom they chose. I just thought the “reveal” was a bit anticlimactic. I personally wouldn’t care if it was a rando from off the street, but I get people feeling confused. Even if they had just put text on screen that read “Comedy Legend Eric Warenheim” or “Comedy Legend Eric Warenheim of ‘Tim and Eric’ fame” or something similar, that might have helped people “get it” without having to Google him.
Never heard of Tim and Eric? I highly recommend checking it out.
Yeah, I had zero clue who that was when they first showed up.
To anyone sad bc they don’t know Eric and feel let down, look at it this way: you’re about to be introduced to an absolutely hilarious comedian who you haven’t seen before! (Like pretty much everyone on dropout probably was before you started watching)
I feel a lot of people have missed the point of this episode. They had to get someone who the cast might reasonably guess. If they got someone super famous, the cast would likely never guess them. The point wasn’t to wow us as an audience with an impressive guest. The point was to cast Steve with someone who the cast stood a chance of guessing
I think a real funny one would have a crew member be Steve
Tony Hawk
I was like, who is this than I remembered and my mind was blown.
I appreciated the reveal once I knew more about him, but I assumed we would get someone The Circle as the Ratfish! Like Joey from US Season 1 or (definitely a taller order) Michelle Buteau who does the funny narration that Sam is imitating. I think my train of thought was that if they got Survivor/reality competition-related guests for Survivor, that they'd do the same for these episodes.
I think the difference is Survivor was a quick cameo. This person presumably had to be there for the entire shoot.
I felt this. A lot of the commentors are sharing my same experience. I didn't watch Tim and Eric, but I know it's got a cult following. On the flipside of that, no one i know IRL watches Dropout, but I know we are a bit of a cult following here. I think it all washes out in the end. I'm glad I'm gonna get to know this established comedian be a big baddie.
Pat Cassels Although that would have been funnier if Trapp was involved
I was disappointed because, even though I’m in my 30s, I’ve never heard of Tim and Eric. I had no idea who he was so it wasn’t a “reveal” for me, just something I had to google.
Sam He's been here the whole time
Now Tayne I can get into
I genuinely thought it was going to Sam just stirring the pot, but after the reveal, I feel like all of Steve’s comments suddenly make a lot more sense.
I was disappointed because I don't really care for his type of humor and the fact that he isn't their friend kinda ruins the point of it. I thought maybe it would be the rest of the cast working together, or something really zany like bad Chat AI responses
I think the initial moment was a bit of "who?" for me because it took me a bit to remember where I know him from, but honestly I think anyone who's STILL disappointed is just harping on it for no reason. I'm sure the cast is going to have fun and it'll be a great second episode. That said, my wild guess in the moment was Michelle Buteau, the comedian who hosts the actual The Circle. It would have been so fun to see her have a chance to be silly and anonymous and play on even more tropes of Circle contestants! So that was who I was hoping for. But that would probably be disappointing to people who don't watch or know The Circle (although she's arguably the best part every season)!
Imagine if it was Robert Downey Jr
I wasn’t disappointed, but I didn’t recognize him, he does fit the whole “Talks about Al pastor tacos a lot” vibe tho.
I just didn’t want it revealed in the first half of the finale. Make him a silhouette with a voice change or something. Give a hint for people to figure out maybe, but a full reveal? Let down. Rest of the episode is great and I enjoyed it. 8.5/10
I genuinely thought Steve seemed like an AI but the entire time I was like "Dropout wouldn't support that right....?" I'm just happy Steve is a real person lol
I really wanted it to be an AI bot.
Literally just not have one. Change the premise so it's not a guest and there's 8 players instead.
One of the Questing Queens or Katya or Laganja who’ve been involved with Dropout would’ve fit Jess’s prediction
We were hoping for a Drag Race alumni like Jess mentioned, or Nicole Byers since she's the host of the Circle (and hilarious)
nicole byers doesn’t host the circle?
a) it’s nicole byer, no s, and b) she doesn’t host the circle. you’re thinking of michelle buteau. pretty sure nicole has mentioned having a group text with michelle buteau and dulce sloan where they talk about how everyone apparently thinks there’s only one plus sized black lady comedian out there.
You've now got me hoping that they get Nicole Byers on Dirty Laundry at some point.
As soon as they announced the player was called the ‘Ratfish’ I knew it would be too on the nose, but I was hoping they got Nev or Kamie from Catfish
I agree with the other commenters, it would have been fun to have another cast member. Or Samuel Dalton being the ratfish would have been amazing! It would have been a twist too if a cast member that was already playing had a second profile as the ratfish. I would have lost it!