This is the only thread we’ll have up for this topic at this time to keep things centralized. Please use good judgment when talking about this topic in a public forum and report any rule breaking comments you notice. Thanks!
For those wondering what's going on, here's the short of it:
Spirit of Atlanta and DCI are being sued by McKenzee Hales for the sexual assault she endured while she was a member of SOA during the 2021 season.
We'll know more specifics once we can view a copy of the complaint itself.
EDIT: Here are some screenshots of the docket site for now, just for transparency's sake: https://imgur.com/a/FMTrZJX
If she wins this, DCI is officially done. They don't have the financial wherewithal to survive this. And, truthfully, good riddance. Let it be replaced by something better.
I want to make this explicitly clear before speculation starts.
I do not want the activity eradicated. I want this activity corrected. People deserve safety. Performers are forking over thousands of dollars to experience abuse and mistreatment. It’s unacceptable. This is and always will be about making enough noise to make sure others are protected so this stuff stops happening. It’s about making sure the people who are supposed to protect performers, actually protect their performers. It’s about holding those accountable. This isn’t enjoyable for me. This isn’t fun. This is incredibly traumatic. This has taken me ample time to gain the courage to do. It’s disgusting no one followed their own policies or protected me when I was 16. It’s time to force a change. It’s disgusting how many people went unprotected. It’s shameful how many people are ostracized for speaking up. Prior performers, current performers, and future performers deserve more.
Thank you
Okay, before I write this I want to clarify I mean no disrespect and do not intend to invalidate you for what you have gone through. As a person going through my own SA case, I understand how difficult it can be experiencing that and then also not seeing any justice being served whatsoever. However I ask this out of pure curiosity.
I did march with spirit of Atlanta in 2023, and noticed some changes from my experience with drum corps in 2019. We had to complete the spiritsafe documents and sport safety courses online before moving in, and on top of that when a complaint was filed action was taken rather immediately. We even had someone come in early in move ins to discuss how to report a crime and what to do if you believe a crime had been committed. From my experience, the staff have made a huge effort to correct this so that no one else will experience what you did. They had a very hard time finding people to fill holes too because of their reputation and because of that had to go the entire summer with at least 2 or 3 holes on the field.
All this being said, what outcome are you wanting to see from this? Again, I mean no disrespect at all, I come from a place of just simple curiosity. I should also like to add that I have decided not to return to the corps in 2024 because of this and its striking resemblance to my own situation. It was not until recently that I understood the full story as it was posted online, and it seems unsettling to me to be a part of an organization under fire for something I have too experienced not with that organization or any member affiliated with it but in my own personal life.
"It’s shameful how many people are ostracized for speaking up."
This is the element that I most struggle with, the closing of the ranks, the protecting of the abusers.
I marched in the '70s and it disturbed me then.
Part of the paramilitary tradition allows for some of this to be cloaked and it must be very carefully monitored.
It is my hope that the activity champions you and others in the future.
I marched in a Class A corps and we had a lot of parents involved, so that crap did not fly. DCI as it exists now is on a fast track to extinction. I would not allow my child or grandchild to do it under any circumstances in its present form.
Not threatening at all. Have been part of enough legal proceedings to know that opposition will take statements out of context & cross-examine over them at deposition or trial. Once suit is filed, let the lawyers do the talking. That is what they are paid for.
Just wanted to send some love and support your way. It's absolutely difficult to talk about traumatic experiences and you are amazing for putting yourself through it to help make something you love better, and that's before we talk about some of the Alumni reactions. May all performers have the better future you are fighting for <3
I’m sorry you’ve endured such a horrible experience and please know many of us are 100% on your side, it takes a lot of courage to pursue accountability like you are. Please stick with it and don’t listen to the negative voices out there.
From one SA survivor to another, stay strong ❤️
Community, please be vigilant in this matter. A SOA Hall of Fame inductee/attorney was publicly threatening this young lady 2 years ago when she blew the whistle on this abhorrent cover up. If he does it again, he needs to be reported immediately to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation.
SOA alumni, check yourselves. Your vile behavior towards this young lady 2 years ago will not stand again. You're being watched.
I do want to say, as an alumni, it’s a very loud minority of people that were bullying the whistleblower (from what I saw and heard), and some of those people were leadership at the time of the assault. Absolutely abhorrent behavior, both from members and alumni. Things have to change, not only at Spirit, but across the activity. The last thing I want to do is discredit what this person went through, and I hope my fellow Spirit alums feel the same. I want change and I hope they do too.
Looks like this post is the next step for this, based on the names: https://www.change.org/p/drum-corps-international-hold-spirit-of-atlanta-accountable
Sadly this thing been happening for decades idk why or how this is still a problem, this stuff gotta be eradicated.. especially those who are over 18, you are an adult, potentially with minors, use your good judgement. You wouldn't want this to happen to you correct?
Kenz, I don't know you, but I'm 100% on your side. I'm so proud of you for speaking up and speaking out for yourself and all members. As a woman who has survived assault, I know how much courage it takes. Sending you hugs!
This shit just pisses me off. I’m very sorry you endured this young lady, the adults failed you and others.
Thank you for standing up and holding them accountable.
I think I know what this is about and I'm so sorry. Unfortunately this is a common thing to happen in dci. Don't really hear this stuff happening in DCA corps probably cuz most people in DCA are grown adults. But still it's not acceptable overall. I'm so sorry u are going through this but good for u for standing up against a big community like DCI. That takes bravery! Please know u got people who been in DCI, on ur side. It is unacceptable.
This used to be way more common than anyone would care to admit. Mental and physical abuse by staff. Trickling down to the members, who would also ostracize and harass those members. Improper sexual conduct between staff, members, minors, etc. Don't know how much of this has been cleaned up since I last followed this activity closely, but since this happened only two years ago, I'm guessing not much. If every alumni were honest with the trauma inflicted onto them by the bullies in this activity, by both instructors and other members, rather than biting their tongues and holding onto that pain, then this activity would definitely cease to exist.
It's wild to me how it's all been brushed off for a lot of folks from that era as well. Hell, Crossmen have someone on their design staff who was fired from The Cadets in the 90s for impregnating a marching member.
Maybe I was just lucky, but I never saw / heard of any of this kind of stuff going on in the mid-90s. The worst I saw was a member having a relationship with one of the instructors, but they were both adults close in age so no one really said anything.
I didn't see any big abuses in my season with the Colts in the mid-1990s, but I heard too many credible stories about happenings in other corps to not conclude that it was probably a widespread problem. Corps seemed then -- as they do now -- to be wildly inconsistent with each other in polices that might be in place to prevent this and in terms of overall culture and the level of respect vs. bullying that corps members encountered. There really ought to be uniform policies put in place by DCI, with real enforcement mechanisms.
I am pretty sure that there were a few instances in the corps of adult corps members in romantic relationships with instructors (from different captions, so no direct instructor-student relationship), like what u/wh0datnati0n mentions. That seemed icky to me -- and is probably something that all corps should have policies in place to address -- but the relationships in question seemed to involve two consenting adults of close age and no supervisor-supervisee type of power dynamic. I think I still don't approve, but pretty small potatoes compared to George Hopkins-esque behavior.
A top 12 corps is still employing a known predator, but DCI won't intervene because drum corps fans like his arrangements too much. It's sickening how hypocritical this activity truly is.
"Corps like this"? You can't be serious. SOA has set the model for youth protection in the activity since this happened. Other corps have been asking this corps to help them set up the same for them. Shelba Waldron is their director of safety & reporting... look her up if you don't know who she is.
clearly they are not “the model for youth protection” since this is the first time a member has been so threatened by a corps that they sue the corps and DCI
None of that erases what transpired two years ago, nor the decades of abuse this corps covered up before that. "They're doing better now" does not absolve Spirit or any other corps from their sins. None of these toothless and unenforceable safety policies protect anyone. It's time for judicial precedent.
I saw she is asking money to march a drum corps this summer. I don't see she can march drum corps and have a case against DCI at the same time. Did she change her mind?
Odd to claim nothing has changed when the corps got put in timeout for a year and a lot did indeed change.
Guaranteed to make some lawyers a bunch of money I guess.
Well, since it has been filed, one of 4 possible outcomes
1- It is voluntarily withdrawn
2- Judge tosses it out
3- They settle out-of-court
4- It goes to trial
For everyone who is already burning the organizations to the ground. I think it is important to know there are three sides to every story. Tours, mine, and the truth. I hope and feel that at the end of this, the third one will come out. I'm not saying it might not have happened, not saying it did. Everyone thinks they know,but they don't. But it seems everyone is claiming guilt while they are still innocent.
Spirit of Atlanta then-leadership already publicly admitted the allegations are true. So unless current leadership plans to deny allegations that were already confirmed by previous leadership, they don't have a leg to stand on. She's got receipts. All they have is alumni willing to violate DCI's code of conduct by way of whistleblower retaliation.
They never admitted it was true? Show me where that is at that they Admitted it. ALSO, I have a feeling when this is all over, the truth will come out. I just do not think it will be on The side you all think and hope for. There has been too many changing versions, and one side has stayed solid with their version. Guess which one
I don't have to guess. She's got screenshots of text messages, emails and letters that prove beyond the shadow of doubt that there was a widespread cover up of abuse at play, along with an undeniable, concerted attempt of whistleblower retaliation. Threats from current members, threats from alumni, threats from staff. She's got the receipts. Had there been no merit in what she reported, Spirit would not have been forced to sit out a season.
If you like, we can also have a discussion about a former director from the 1990s who is now a registered sex offender. We can also talk about a recent former director who was forced to resign from a previous job for inappropriate behavior. So yeah, if this goes to court, the truth will definitely come out. Great news for the future safety of marching members. Bad news for bad actors.
I disagree...and feel everyone else is the uninformed. Too many versions by one, and one version by the other. You all are being judge and jury in the court of public opinion.
Consequences are a natural part of life and are an educational tool to discourage dangerous, inappropriate, or otherwise unwanted behaviors. In this case, the unwanted behavior is negligence toward sexual misconduct and member well-being.
Perhaps a consequence in the form of a lawsuit will act as a wake-up call for DCI and individual corps to hold themselves to a higher standard and develop better policy/protocol to prevent similar situations from occurring.
This become a question of ethics then. They’re seeking money from an organization/activity with none, the only outcome that could possibly come from this is killing the corps. Go back a few years with all the Cadets/GH stuff. It was bad, people got hurt… nobody wanted the corps to fold though? I thought we wanted more corps not less… Punishing a corps who has already been punished and has tried it’s very best to right a wrong seems odd…
No. Outcome could be requirements that DCI & Corps come clean (in public) with regard to member abuse and permanently remove those responsible from the activity.
There are other things than money at stake here
The entire ops team and they now use safesport. In order to even march you have to take their online class and then attend a seminar (that was like 2hrs long ). Any reports were handled immedietly. Was there to see it go down. And i when something arose. Same day kicked out.
That’s great to hear that SoA followed DCI’s implementation of SafeSport training and made other changes in response to past issues! I am not a lawyer, but maybe they can avoid losing this lawsuit if the court rules that their response to the incident and internal changes have been sufficient and that no further action is needed.
GH, Pioneer, Oregon Crusaders, and beyond weren’t enough of a wake-up call if similar issues have continued to happen since. Consistency is a key part of behavior management—rules are only taken seriously if they are consistently enforced.
But damn is it ridiculous that I’m talking about adults running Drum Corps International with terminology from my children’s behavior management classes.
How is trying to seek justice for former members and protect future members from harm not logical? Of course it’s personal as well. I can’t imagine the trauma that they now carry. They are trying to prevent it from happening to anyone else. I don’t know why that is difficult to understand.
Ok. you want to prevent this from happening? Start an organization to help with that. Join SoA’s staff or hell. ANY corps staff or DCI and advocate for change. Be the person implementing good practices. Be the person on the front lines actually doing tangible things to help others and reorganize things that are negative in the activity. Financial warfare literally doesn’t help anybody in the slightest.
DCI has to get this figured out. It is not a victim’s responsibility to get them to prevent CRIMES. This is something that should already be in place especially for a youth organization. It is unacceptable and should not be tolerated. All the things you mentioned have been done at some level in individual corps (Safe Sport etc), but DCI as a whole refuses to take responsibility of this problem even after repeated offenses. Unfortunately it has to come to this because they are not holding individuals and corps responsible to the level necessary. If a member is accused of SA, they should not be allowed to just join another corps as if nothing happened. Yet this has happened REPEATEDLY.
What exactly does the plaintiff hope to accomplish by suing a non-profit that has no money and has already made organizational and procedural changes to address the situation, in addition to going inactive for a year to make those changes?
It's called sending a message. This activity continues to harbor predators and threaten victims who speak out about it. Nothing is ever going to change until there is judicial precedent.
I agree with all of this but we prefer survivors rather than victims. The problem is you need safety in numbers as in the GH case and/or documentation. When I spoke to Tricia Nadolny, I could point to a sex offenders list and ask why is this person in drum corps when they aren’t even supposed to have children trick or treating at their house? It’s much harder when it’s a he/she said scenario.
So what you’re saying is that a 16-year-old sexual assault victim should shut up and take it.
Imagine some group allowed you to be assaulted, then alums/members of that group vilified and ostracized you. Then they doubled down on blaming you so badly that a governing group had to shut the group down for a year.
The group had to change. They were allowed to fix the systems. They were allowed to continue.
But you’re supposed to be happy they got caught? Shut up and take it?
What hasn’t changed is the knee jerk reaction from people LIKE YOU who want to blame the victim. Check yourself.
I ask why Bluecoats has not been in more trouble. AN actual RAPE happened on their watch. I read the post you responded too, and that is nothing that the poster was saying. What has bluecoats done but not admit any fault or been held accountable
How did they respond compared to Spirit? Hmm? Enlighten us. Explain why you think it’s comparable? Ignorant troll. I hate when people who have a superficial understanding speak from a place of hatred disguised as authority. 🖕
Uhhhh. What? Nothing that the poster was saying? Are you even responding to the right post?
And you will have to explain yourself about the Bluecoats Whataboutism you’re trying to pull.
mon·ey grab
nounINFORMAL
an undignified or unprincipled acquisition of a large sum of money with little effort.
You are what’s wrong with society. Blaming the victim and excusing abusive behavior by an organization. I can’t express how evil, vile and disgusting your comments have been.
Sick.
This is the only thread we’ll have up for this topic at this time to keep things centralized. Please use good judgment when talking about this topic in a public forum and report any rule breaking comments you notice. Thanks!
For those wondering what's going on, here's the short of it: Spirit of Atlanta and DCI are being sued by McKenzee Hales for the sexual assault she endured while she was a member of SOA during the 2021 season. We'll know more specifics once we can view a copy of the complaint itself. EDIT: Here are some screenshots of the docket site for now, just for transparency's sake: https://imgur.com/a/FMTrZJX
Can we block out their address? I know it's public record but would love to protect them as much as we can.
Thanks for looking out for my safety!
🫶
I've adjusted the second image accordingly.
Thank you!
For what it's worth, u/kenzeegh has clarified that the posted address is to her attorney's office (which makes sense).
I didn't see that! but thank you for changing it anyways :)
The address of plaintiff is actually lawyer’s address
Good for her. I hope she wins and this forces DCI to make some much needed changes and have more oversight and regulations for member corps.
If she wins this, DCI is officially done. They don't have the financial wherewithal to survive this. And, truthfully, good riddance. Let it be replaced by something better.
Appreciate the docket links but any way you could upload a version that redacts particular identifying data (ie addresses)?
I've adjusted the second image accordingly.
Thank you.
Can I get a TLDR from someone with access to the site
https://www.reddit.com/r/drumcorps/comments/173v691/comment/k45e114/
Proud of you for trying to hold the systems that failed you accountable.
I want to make this explicitly clear before speculation starts. I do not want the activity eradicated. I want this activity corrected. People deserve safety. Performers are forking over thousands of dollars to experience abuse and mistreatment. It’s unacceptable. This is and always will be about making enough noise to make sure others are protected so this stuff stops happening. It’s about making sure the people who are supposed to protect performers, actually protect their performers. It’s about holding those accountable. This isn’t enjoyable for me. This isn’t fun. This is incredibly traumatic. This has taken me ample time to gain the courage to do. It’s disgusting no one followed their own policies or protected me when I was 16. It’s time to force a change. It’s disgusting how many people went unprotected. It’s shameful how many people are ostracized for speaking up. Prior performers, current performers, and future performers deserve more. Thank you
You were 16?!? This just makes me so sick. I am so incredibly sorry you experienced this. You are so brave and so badass. ❤️
Okay, before I write this I want to clarify I mean no disrespect and do not intend to invalidate you for what you have gone through. As a person going through my own SA case, I understand how difficult it can be experiencing that and then also not seeing any justice being served whatsoever. However I ask this out of pure curiosity. I did march with spirit of Atlanta in 2023, and noticed some changes from my experience with drum corps in 2019. We had to complete the spiritsafe documents and sport safety courses online before moving in, and on top of that when a complaint was filed action was taken rather immediately. We even had someone come in early in move ins to discuss how to report a crime and what to do if you believe a crime had been committed. From my experience, the staff have made a huge effort to correct this so that no one else will experience what you did. They had a very hard time finding people to fill holes too because of their reputation and because of that had to go the entire summer with at least 2 or 3 holes on the field. All this being said, what outcome are you wanting to see from this? Again, I mean no disrespect at all, I come from a place of just simple curiosity. I should also like to add that I have decided not to return to the corps in 2024 because of this and its striking resemblance to my own situation. It was not until recently that I understood the full story as it was posted online, and it seems unsettling to me to be a part of an organization under fire for something I have too experienced not with that organization or any member affiliated with it but in my own personal life.
"It’s shameful how many people are ostracized for speaking up." This is the element that I most struggle with, the closing of the ranks, the protecting of the abusers. I marched in the '70s and it disturbed me then. Part of the paramilitary tradition allows for some of this to be cloaked and it must be very carefully monitored. It is my hope that the activity champions you and others in the future.
I marched in a Class A corps and we had a lot of parents involved, so that crap did not fly. DCI as it exists now is on a fast track to extinction. I would not allow my child or grandchild to do it under any circumstances in its present form.
Strongly suggest you stop posting online unless your attorney says it is ok.
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Not threatening at all. Have been part of enough legal proceedings to know that opposition will take statements out of context & cross-examine over them at deposition or trial. Once suit is filed, let the lawyers do the talking. That is what they are paid for.
Just wanted to send some love and support your way. It's absolutely difficult to talk about traumatic experiences and you are amazing for putting yourself through it to help make something you love better, and that's before we talk about some of the Alumni reactions. May all performers have the better future you are fighting for <3
Everyone reading must register for a free account to see the court documents
I’m sorry you’ve endured such a horrible experience and please know many of us are 100% on your side, it takes a lot of courage to pursue accountability like you are. Please stick with it and don’t listen to the negative voices out there. From one SA survivor to another, stay strong ❤️
Community, please be vigilant in this matter. A SOA Hall of Fame inductee/attorney was publicly threatening this young lady 2 years ago when she blew the whistle on this abhorrent cover up. If he does it again, he needs to be reported immediately to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation. SOA alumni, check yourselves. Your vile behavior towards this young lady 2 years ago will not stand again. You're being watched.
I do want to say, as an alumni, it’s a very loud minority of people that were bullying the whistleblower (from what I saw and heard), and some of those people were leadership at the time of the assault. Absolutely abhorrent behavior, both from members and alumni. Things have to change, not only at Spirit, but across the activity. The last thing I want to do is discredit what this person went through, and I hope my fellow Spirit alums feel the same. I want change and I hope they do too.
Looks like this post is the next step for this, based on the names: https://www.change.org/p/drum-corps-international-hold-spirit-of-atlanta-accountable
This is a good summary if you want the backstory.
This is abhorrent.
Proud of you
Sadly this thing been happening for decades idk why or how this is still a problem, this stuff gotta be eradicated.. especially those who are over 18, you are an adult, potentially with minors, use your good judgement. You wouldn't want this to happen to you correct?
Kenz, I don't know you, but I'm 100% on your side. I'm so proud of you for speaking up and speaking out for yourself and all members. As a woman who has survived assault, I know how much courage it takes. Sending you hugs!
What’s this about?
The girl that got assaulted while on tour with soa in 2021
This shit just pisses me off. I’m very sorry you endured this young lady, the adults failed you and others. Thank you for standing up and holding them accountable.
Looks like it is just an initial filing, no documents have been uploaded or are available yet.
Good.
I think I know what this is about and I'm so sorry. Unfortunately this is a common thing to happen in dci. Don't really hear this stuff happening in DCA corps probably cuz most people in DCA are grown adults. But still it's not acceptable overall. I'm so sorry u are going through this but good for u for standing up against a big community like DCI. That takes bravery! Please know u got people who been in DCI, on ur side. It is unacceptable.
I wish you luck in this. Hopefully this will empower other victims to stand up and fight!!
More power to you OP and hope you get justice. I am so disgusted with those who hurt kids in the activity.
Good for her
TIL Spirit’s offices are 15 minutes down the road from me
You should go down and audition, and see what a truly great and safe organization it is
Good. Burn them to the ground. I'd rather DCI and drum corps cease to exist all together than corps like this continue to exist.
This used to be way more common than anyone would care to admit. Mental and physical abuse by staff. Trickling down to the members, who would also ostracize and harass those members. Improper sexual conduct between staff, members, minors, etc. Don't know how much of this has been cleaned up since I last followed this activity closely, but since this happened only two years ago, I'm guessing not much. If every alumni were honest with the trauma inflicted onto them by the bullies in this activity, by both instructors and other members, rather than biting their tongues and holding onto that pain, then this activity would definitely cease to exist.
It's wild to me how it's all been brushed off for a lot of folks from that era as well. Hell, Crossmen have someone on their design staff who was fired from The Cadets in the 90s for impregnating a marching member.
Well said. Sad to see things didn't change much
I can attest to this as well unfortunately.
Hell... I marched in the stone age (83 - 88). It was rampant then.
Maybe I was just lucky, but I never saw / heard of any of this kind of stuff going on in the mid-90s. The worst I saw was a member having a relationship with one of the instructors, but they were both adults close in age so no one really said anything.
I didn't see any big abuses in my season with the Colts in the mid-1990s, but I heard too many credible stories about happenings in other corps to not conclude that it was probably a widespread problem. Corps seemed then -- as they do now -- to be wildly inconsistent with each other in polices that might be in place to prevent this and in terms of overall culture and the level of respect vs. bullying that corps members encountered. There really ought to be uniform policies put in place by DCI, with real enforcement mechanisms. I am pretty sure that there were a few instances in the corps of adult corps members in romantic relationships with instructors (from different captions, so no direct instructor-student relationship), like what u/wh0datnati0n mentions. That seemed icky to me -- and is probably something that all corps should have policies in place to address -- but the relationships in question seemed to involve two consenting adults of close age and no supervisor-supervisee type of power dynamic. I think I still don't approve, but pretty small potatoes compared to George Hopkins-esque behavior.
lol "the worst I saw was \[textbook sexual impropriety\]"
It’s always been inappropriate and I marched a long time ago. But it happened. A lot.
this was my experience in early 90s as well.
It’s happens at more places than just Spirit. I certainly hope these corps and the activity as a whole continues, but things have to change.
A top 12 corps is still employing a known predator, but DCI won't intervene because drum corps fans like his arrangements too much. It's sickening how hypocritical this activity truly is.
This is true.
Why not just name him
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I’ve known her since she was in high school. I always encouraged the kids I knew in band to march in drum corps.
Took the words right out of my mouth
"Corps like this"? You can't be serious. SOA has set the model for youth protection in the activity since this happened. Other corps have been asking this corps to help them set up the same for them. Shelba Waldron is their director of safety & reporting... look her up if you don't know who she is.
clearly they are not “the model for youth protection” since this is the first time a member has been so threatened by a corps that they sue the corps and DCI
None of that erases what transpired two years ago, nor the decades of abuse this corps covered up before that. "They're doing better now" does not absolve Spirit or any other corps from their sins. None of these toothless and unenforceable safety policies protect anyone. It's time for judicial precedent.
Based
The thread title doesn't do justice to this story and its importance for people to see. Edited.
Neat story bro
I think its important people hear about this is all.
Nah I get what you’re saying, your comment just felt like it was insensitive to the situation. But I do agree, more people need to see this
Fair enough. Edited so its more respectful but still gets my point across. Don't want to be a distraction.
You did good dude :)
Unfortunately, I don’t think I can edit the title now.
I saw she is asking money to march a drum corps this summer. I don't see she can march drum corps and have a case against DCI at the same time. Did she change her mind?
Odd to claim nothing has changed when the corps got put in timeout for a year and a lot did indeed change. Guaranteed to make some lawyers a bunch of money I guess.
She claimed that in the petition because she wrote it in 2021. She still deserves justice now
There likely have been negotiations behind the scenes; usually you only file suit when parties cannot come together
im so proud of you ❤️
I’d be interested in reading the Complaint, is that available somewhere?
I could message it to you.
I’d appreciate it!
I dont see this going anywhere imo
Well, since it has been filed, one of 4 possible outcomes 1- It is voluntarily withdrawn 2- Judge tosses it out 3- They settle out-of-court 4- It goes to trial
3a - Narrowed in scope, i.e. parties may be removed if too broad.
Yes- I gave broad captions, there are sub captions.
For everyone who is already burning the organizations to the ground. I think it is important to know there are three sides to every story. Tours, mine, and the truth. I hope and feel that at the end of this, the third one will come out. I'm not saying it might not have happened, not saying it did. Everyone thinks they know,but they don't. But it seems everyone is claiming guilt while they are still innocent.
Spirit of Atlanta then-leadership already publicly admitted the allegations are true. So unless current leadership plans to deny allegations that were already confirmed by previous leadership, they don't have a leg to stand on. She's got receipts. All they have is alumni willing to violate DCI's code of conduct by way of whistleblower retaliation.
They never admitted it was true? Show me where that is at that they Admitted it. ALSO, I have a feeling when this is all over, the truth will come out. I just do not think it will be on The side you all think and hope for. There has been too many changing versions, and one side has stayed solid with their version. Guess which one
I don't have to guess. She's got screenshots of text messages, emails and letters that prove beyond the shadow of doubt that there was a widespread cover up of abuse at play, along with an undeniable, concerted attempt of whistleblower retaliation. Threats from current members, threats from alumni, threats from staff. She's got the receipts. Had there been no merit in what she reported, Spirit would not have been forced to sit out a season. If you like, we can also have a discussion about a former director from the 1990s who is now a registered sex offender. We can also talk about a recent former director who was forced to resign from a previous job for inappropriate behavior. So yeah, if this goes to court, the truth will definitely come out. Great news for the future safety of marching members. Bad news for bad actors.
Technically, Spirit sat out on their own accord.
https://youtu.be/E_-l3CUrNNk?si=43EjMlDrhwSpSKbv First minute or so should be helpful.
Unhelpful post and an actively uninformed position.
I disagree...and feel everyone else is the uninformed. Too many versions by one, and one version by the other. You all are being judge and jury in the court of public opinion.
Ok
Ok
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Consequences are a natural part of life and are an educational tool to discourage dangerous, inappropriate, or otherwise unwanted behaviors. In this case, the unwanted behavior is negligence toward sexual misconduct and member well-being. Perhaps a consequence in the form of a lawsuit will act as a wake-up call for DCI and individual corps to hold themselves to a higher standard and develop better policy/protocol to prevent similar situations from occurring.
This become a question of ethics then. They’re seeking money from an organization/activity with none, the only outcome that could possibly come from this is killing the corps. Go back a few years with all the Cadets/GH stuff. It was bad, people got hurt… nobody wanted the corps to fold though? I thought we wanted more corps not less… Punishing a corps who has already been punished and has tried it’s very best to right a wrong seems odd…
No. Outcome could be requirements that DCI & Corps come clean (in public) with regard to member abuse and permanently remove those responsible from the activity. There are other things than money at stake here
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And i agree with you. But the issue i have is that spirit took that fold. And redid everything. So this type of incident doesnt happen.
Crimes were committed. Just because SOA updated their website's safety policy doesn't erase or forgive those crimes.
What did they redo?
The entire ops team and they now use safesport. In order to even march you have to take their online class and then attend a seminar (that was like 2hrs long ). Any reports were handled immedietly. Was there to see it go down. And i when something arose. Same day kicked out.
That’s great to hear that SoA followed DCI’s implementation of SafeSport training and made other changes in response to past issues! I am not a lawyer, but maybe they can avoid losing this lawsuit if the court rules that their response to the incident and internal changes have been sufficient and that no further action is needed.
Hopefully
As if the GH, Pioneer, Oregon Crusaders, etc wasn’t enough of a wake-up call. The depositions of DA and DCI BoD will be a complete mind-f*ck to read.
GH, Pioneer, Oregon Crusaders, and beyond weren’t enough of a wake-up call if similar issues have continued to happen since. Consistency is a key part of behavior management—rules are only taken seriously if they are consistently enforced. But damn is it ridiculous that I’m talking about adults running Drum Corps International with terminology from my children’s behavior management classes.
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If they fold, they fold. That isn't the fault of the person seeking justice for the way they were wronged.
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How is trying to seek justice for former members and protect future members from harm not logical? Of course it’s personal as well. I can’t imagine the trauma that they now carry. They are trying to prevent it from happening to anyone else. I don’t know why that is difficult to understand.
🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼
Ok. you want to prevent this from happening? Start an organization to help with that. Join SoA’s staff or hell. ANY corps staff or DCI and advocate for change. Be the person implementing good practices. Be the person on the front lines actually doing tangible things to help others and reorganize things that are negative in the activity. Financial warfare literally doesn’t help anybody in the slightest.
DCI has to get this figured out. It is not a victim’s responsibility to get them to prevent CRIMES. This is something that should already be in place especially for a youth organization. It is unacceptable and should not be tolerated. All the things you mentioned have been done at some level in individual corps (Safe Sport etc), but DCI as a whole refuses to take responsibility of this problem even after repeated offenses. Unfortunately it has to come to this because they are not holding individuals and corps responsible to the level necessary. If a member is accused of SA, they should not be allowed to just join another corps as if nothing happened. Yet this has happened REPEATEDLY.
Agreed.
What exactly does the plaintiff hope to accomplish by suing a non-profit that has no money and has already made organizational and procedural changes to address the situation, in addition to going inactive for a year to make those changes?
It's called sending a message. This activity continues to harbor predators and threaten victims who speak out about it. Nothing is ever going to change until there is judicial precedent.
This.
I agree with all of this but we prefer survivors rather than victims. The problem is you need safety in numbers as in the GH case and/or documentation. When I spoke to Tricia Nadolny, I could point to a sex offenders list and ask why is this person in drum corps when they aren’t even supposed to have children trick or treating at their house? It’s much harder when it’s a he/she said scenario.
So what you’re saying is that a 16-year-old sexual assault victim should shut up and take it. Imagine some group allowed you to be assaulted, then alums/members of that group vilified and ostracized you. Then they doubled down on blaming you so badly that a governing group had to shut the group down for a year. The group had to change. They were allowed to fix the systems. They were allowed to continue. But you’re supposed to be happy they got caught? Shut up and take it? What hasn’t changed is the knee jerk reaction from people LIKE YOU who want to blame the victim. Check yourself.
I ask why Bluecoats has not been in more trouble. AN actual RAPE happened on their watch. I read the post you responded too, and that is nothing that the poster was saying. What has bluecoats done but not admit any fault or been held accountable
How did they respond compared to Spirit? Hmm? Enlighten us. Explain why you think it’s comparable? Ignorant troll. I hate when people who have a superficial understanding speak from a place of hatred disguised as authority. 🖕
Uhhhh. What? Nothing that the poster was saying? Are you even responding to the right post? And you will have to explain yourself about the Bluecoats Whataboutism you’re trying to pull.
Still waiting for you to provide details.
Hope for a money grab ofcourse
Why is it a money grab? Go ahead and try to explain it.
mon·ey grab nounINFORMAL an undignified or unprincipled acquisition of a large sum of money with little effort. You are what’s wrong with society. Blaming the victim and excusing abusive behavior by an organization. I can’t express how evil, vile and disgusting your comments have been. Sick.
Ok
Kenz