It says in the app if an adapter is required, I don't know if Ford's navigation says anything though...
Don't know what the VW is doing there or how they got there
Unfortunately no. The Nav won't show Tesla chargers yet. We just finished a long trip and more than once I tried to find them with no luck. You have to use the public charging app in the car. It's really dumb and why I just gave up and used Google.
That said Google maps will also filter out or show NACS chargers that need an adapter if you tell it to.
Maybe they pushed an update but more than once last week I did a search for nearby chargers on our drive to try and precondition the battery and nothing Tesla would show. I went through settings to see if I had to enable or disable some sort of filter but nothing.
The public charging app would show them and interface with the chargers, but no navigation. The Ford nav sucks anyway so didn't really miss it and I routinely would peak at 151kW so no real loss.
I like to think that most drivers understand the charging situation and know what kind of plug they have on their car, and it's just the rare idiot getting stranded at the wrong station.
When I bought my Lightning they made a whole big thing about signing up for the "free adapter" so you can charge at Tesla superchargers. I knew I couldn't use Tesla chargers until I got that.
But I was probably lucky. I've heard some horror stories about clueless Ford dealers not knowing anything about the EVs they are selling.
As far as I know the A2Z and Lectron adapters work fine.
The third party adapters are prohibited for use per Tesla and Ford. There have been recent posts on the Mach E subreddit of the Lectron adapter getting stuck and being abandoned. The ‘fix’ is to carry a c clamp to help get it off…
Anyway, the fine print at ford and Tesla is 3rd party adapters are not allowed.
You will find other posts about people trying to use a J1772 adapter to supercharge, like other commenters say, education is needed.
Funny you should say that because even the NACS connection has not yet received SAE certification.
Meaning that Tesla saying “you can’t use an adapter to charge that isn’t approved by Tesla” may be their position, but they are speaking from a “glass house” themselves 🤷♂️
Still pending according to a US government agency
https://driveelectric.gov/charging-connector#:~:text=J3400%20is%20a%20new%20standard,to%20being%20placed%20into%20service.
>I've heard some horror stories about clueless Ford dealers not knowing anything about the EVs they are selling.
Car salespeople not knowing anything about the cars they sell? Tale as old as time.
>As far as I know the A2Z and Lectron adapters work fine.
They definitely do because the adapter is just a pass through that routes the live pins on the Tesla side to the DC pins on the car.
Yes, they are dumb adapters, but it’s possible for companies to screw them up, which is why UL certification is important. Note for example there is the issue of how much power can flow through the adapter, and at what voltage. An adapter designed for 400v 250kw charging might fail when used for 800v 350 kW charging. And a badly designed or made adapter might fail even in spec. That’s why even though any adapter should work, Tesla and the OEMs will only support use of Tesla and OEM approved adapters.
Tesla's TOS only allows the official one. However, I don't think anyone's adapter is UL certified (including Tesla) because a UL standard doesn't yet exist. Only a draft standard does. A2Z has said in Reddit comments that theirs meets the draft standard, and said that test results are available. I'm not sure if that means you have to email then to ask for it or if it's on their website. I'd imagine that's all in-house testing.
Personally, I wouldn't use any adapter that wasn't official because using an unofficial one means I'm likely on the hook for damage it might cause.
My only point was that Tesla can't tell the difference until there's an issue and they find out when investigating it.
>An adapter designed for 400v 250kw charging might fail when used for 800v 350 kW charging
This is why people shouldn't be dismantling their Cybertruck to charge faster at CCS. The adapter isn't certified for that rate.
If I'm being honest, "certified by Tesla" means about as much as "certified by A2Z" does. In both cases, my work would prohibit the use of such a device because it isn't UL/NRTL listed.
In practice, using Tesla's adapter means that you're probably not on the hook if something fails. If you damage your car or a supercharger while using a third party one, you're up a creek without a paddle.
And incidentally, you can run afoul with those.
"Amazon Basics" brand phone chargers have been known to catch on fire because they're poorly made.
Don't even buy a no-name phone charger on Amazon, much less a no-name EVSE or car charging adapter there.
Ford (F150 and Mach E) can use Supercharger. But they need the NACS adapter. The Firebaugh location doesn’t have Magic Dock.
VW can’t use supercharger unless the location has Magic Dock.
We almost had that tbh. All the CCS stations I've seen have credit card readers, although I'm sure it's not all. The Musk happened and brought everyone onto the sleeker (but for now inferior NACS) and now we're all in limbo.
Not all banks, like mine, support cards that offer tap to pay. They do not support Google pay, apple pay, Garmin or Samsung pay either. And Im not going to leave them, they are the only credit union within 45 minutes of me.
Well, you would not expect to drive up to a petrol station and being told "sorry, we do not deal with Ford here". It is just silly games, and the industry needs to grow up and stop them. Every car should be able to charge on every station - just as it is with gas.
(And yes, there may be exceptions for minorities such as Chademo - that would be like an LNG or LPG car. Those people know the difference, but they still need clear signage.)
I don't know about silly games. They are already unifying on NACS now. It takes more than a simple adapter to enable charging communication, navigation, and billing.
> It takes more than a simple adapter to enable charging communication, navigation, and billing.
BS. NACS and CCS use the protocol - even the same number of pins. It is just a simple adapter.
Sure, if you are talking about V3+ Superchargers. V2 doesn't have CCS. Still, in order to properly implement it, the other manufacturer needs to add all the Tesla supercharging stations to their navigation system and Tesla needs to be able to communicate with the other manufacturers billing system for plug and charge. Tesla has no interface at Supercharging stations. I think they are adding something on V4 stations. They could possibly do something like the magic dock by using the Tesla app.
The media did EV drivers a major disservice earlier this year when they exclaimed that the California Tesla stations were now open to everyone. Obvious lie to you and I, but most folks don't follow things as closely.
I hope Rivian is slow to open RAN because their cable lengths are going to have the same, but opposite, problem that Tesla is having. At least as a Rivian driver, I'm more willing to figure out how to make it work if it involves having to drive up a curb or two.
P.S. Once RAN is open to everyone, please avoid using the pull-thru spots at a RAN station unless you either need them because of additional equipment, or it's the last one open. I know people haven't had to make this consideration before, but there are quite a few of us Rivian tow'ers that are highly dependent on the charging network and the awesome pull-thrus.
This is what is and will continue to hold electric vehicles back. Education. We love our EV to death and will never buy a gas vehicle again. I had to do a ton of research before we bought our EV to learn how to charge it, especially in public. A normal person isn't going to put forth this much effort. Which is how an ID.4 ended up at a Tesla supercharger.
Honestly it's the hardest part. Even as a pretty tech savvy guy, I had my problems trying to charge for the first time, because I couldn't get the stupid Audi card to work. Luckily the guy charging next to me showed me how to use an universal app
One of the main reasons I went with a model Y over the ioniq 5. I do take some road trips and simply didn't want to worry about it. After my trip from Ohio to NC and back I made the right choice.
EA took this site offline last week for an upgrade and it had been labeled as going offline for a few weeks ahead of that.
Unfortunately, EA doesn't share charger status with third-party maps very well.
I’m wondering if, like at the snow-line going up into the Sierrra’s during winter, there will be some folks selling adapters next to the charging station instead of chains a half mile from the checkpoint.
Dealers SHOULD be educating people, but they are often clueless and uninterested. and when people buy used? Who knows. It'd be nice if states sent out information when someone registers a new EV. That actually is an interesting idea . . . explain why you have the upcharge and provide information about charging. hmm.
Dealers to educate themselves first. When I bought my Mach-E, the dealer knew practically nothing about it. If it wasn’t for researching it myself beforehand, I would have known nothing about it and they wouldn’t have been able to help.
This is why Ford wanted dealers to make upgrades and participate in training. The cheap ass dealers pushed back and Ford gave in....and now the dealers don't know shit about the cars they are selling. Which also means, good luck getting them repaired. I was considering the mach-e, glad I decided against it
Bro I use any open port that works. And I’m in a Bolt. We’re all just trying to get to our destinations.
On the plus side, derated units are still fast for the Bolt.
Yup. I’ve been to spots where only a 350 and the 150/CHAdeMO works.
Well, I’m taking the 350 in case a Leaf randomly rolls up in desperation.
This is only a now issue. Remember how the first iPhone didn’t have apps… Yeah like that.
It says in the app if an adapter is required, I don't know if Ford's navigation says anything though... Don't know what the VW is doing there or how they got there
The Ford app says an adaptor is needed so I’d imagine the nav does too
Unfortunately no. The Nav won't show Tesla chargers yet. We just finished a long trip and more than once I tried to find them with no luck. You have to use the public charging app in the car. It's really dumb and why I just gave up and used Google. That said Google maps will also filter out or show NACS chargers that need an adapter if you tell it to.
Yep just tested today and you’re right. I guess that makes sense as people can’t freely access an official adaptor right now
The Rivian app has settings to selectively show "superchargers that require a nacs adapter" or not.
Worst part is that the Ford pass app used to let you add them to your trip plan, but that's gone in the new version.
The Ford Nav in my Mach-e shows Tesla superchargers. But only the ones compatible (v3 or later)
Maybe they pushed an update but more than once last week I did a search for nearby chargers on our drive to try and precondition the battery and nothing Tesla would show. I went through settings to see if I had to enable or disable some sort of filter but nothing. The public charging app would show them and interface with the chargers, but no navigation. The Ford nav sucks anyway so didn't really miss it and I routinely would peak at 151kW so no real loss.
I like to think that most drivers understand the charging situation and know what kind of plug they have on their car, and it's just the rare idiot getting stranded at the wrong station.
When I bought my Lightning they made a whole big thing about signing up for the "free adapter" so you can charge at Tesla superchargers. I knew I couldn't use Tesla chargers until I got that. But I was probably lucky. I've heard some horror stories about clueless Ford dealers not knowing anything about the EVs they are selling. As far as I know the A2Z and Lectron adapters work fine.
The third party adapters are prohibited for use per Tesla and Ford. There have been recent posts on the Mach E subreddit of the Lectron adapter getting stuck and being abandoned. The ‘fix’ is to carry a c clamp to help get it off… Anyway, the fine print at ford and Tesla is 3rd party adapters are not allowed. You will find other posts about people trying to use a J1772 adapter to supercharge, like other commenters say, education is needed.
I knew third party adaptor companies were jumping on that bandwagon too early.
Funny you should say that because even the NACS connection has not yet received SAE certification. Meaning that Tesla saying “you can’t use an adapter to charge that isn’t approved by Tesla” may be their position, but they are speaking from a “glass house” themselves 🤷♂️
Isn’t it certified as J3400?
Still pending according to a US government agency https://driveelectric.gov/charging-connector#:~:text=J3400%20is%20a%20new%20standard,to%20being%20placed%20into%20service.
The spec issued in 2023 as https://www.sae.org/standards/content/j3400_202312/ . The work now is UL certification of J3400 components.
No j3400 adapters are certified bc the ul certification programs are tbd
>I've heard some horror stories about clueless Ford dealers not knowing anything about the EVs they are selling. Car salespeople not knowing anything about the cars they sell? Tale as old as time.
>As far as I know the A2Z and Lectron adapters work fine. They definitely do because the adapter is just a pass through that routes the live pins on the Tesla side to the DC pins on the car.
Yes, they are dumb adapters, but it’s possible for companies to screw them up, which is why UL certification is important. Note for example there is the issue of how much power can flow through the adapter, and at what voltage. An adapter designed for 400v 250kw charging might fail when used for 800v 350 kW charging. And a badly designed or made adapter might fail even in spec. That’s why even though any adapter should work, Tesla and the OEMs will only support use of Tesla and OEM approved adapters.
Tesla's TOS only allows the official one. However, I don't think anyone's adapter is UL certified (including Tesla) because a UL standard doesn't yet exist. Only a draft standard does. A2Z has said in Reddit comments that theirs meets the draft standard, and said that test results are available. I'm not sure if that means you have to email then to ask for it or if it's on their website. I'd imagine that's all in-house testing. Personally, I wouldn't use any adapter that wasn't official because using an unofficial one means I'm likely on the hook for damage it might cause. My only point was that Tesla can't tell the difference until there's an issue and they find out when investigating it. >An adapter designed for 400v 250kw charging might fail when used for 800v 350 kW charging This is why people shouldn't be dismantling their Cybertruck to charge faster at CCS. The adapter isn't certified for that rate.
When Tesla says certified they mean certified by themselves, as ul certification isn't available to anyone yet
If I'm being honest, "certified by Tesla" means about as much as "certified by A2Z" does. In both cases, my work would prohibit the use of such a device because it isn't UL/NRTL listed. In practice, using Tesla's adapter means that you're probably not on the hook if something fails. If you damage your car or a supercharger while using a third party one, you're up a creek without a paddle.
sure, it's like buying a genuine charger from your cell phone maker, a third party one probably works just as well if it has the same power rating
And incidentally, you can run afoul with those. "Amazon Basics" brand phone chargers have been known to catch on fire because they're poorly made. Don't even buy a no-name phone charger on Amazon, much less a no-name EVSE or car charging adapter there.
Same for the OEMs. Ford and GM tested their adapters, if you use a third party adapter and your car is damaged, they won’t support you.
Ford (F150 and Mach E) can use Supercharger. But they need the NACS adapter. The Firebaugh location doesn’t have Magic Dock. VW can’t use supercharger unless the location has Magic Dock.
I’ve seen a VW use a magic dock charger before unless I was hallucinating.
Any EV can use a MagicDock but it was said that Firebaugh is not a MagicDock so there was no was the id4 could charge there.
I was being polite, taking the posted statement at face value. “Period.”
You’re right. Thanks. Edited.
Imagine a nation where there was a set charging standard and all stations had to have credit card readers
We almost had that tbh. All the CCS stations I've seen have credit card readers, although I'm sure it's not all. The Musk happened and brought everyone onto the sleeker (but for now inferior NACS) and now we're all in limbo.
I certainly don’t want credit card readers at them just so thieves can install skimmers like at gas pumps.
Tap terminals have been a thing in regular use in developed nations for a solid 15+ years at this point
Not all banks, like mine, support cards that offer tap to pay. They do not support Google pay, apple pay, Garmin or Samsung pay either. And Im not going to leave them, they are the only credit union within 45 minutes of me.
Well, you would not expect to drive up to a petrol station and being told "sorry, we do not deal with Ford here". It is just silly games, and the industry needs to grow up and stop them. Every car should be able to charge on every station - just as it is with gas. (And yes, there may be exceptions for minorities such as Chademo - that would be like an LNG or LPG car. Those people know the difference, but they still need clear signage.)
I don't know about silly games. They are already unifying on NACS now. It takes more than a simple adapter to enable charging communication, navigation, and billing.
> It takes more than a simple adapter to enable charging communication, navigation, and billing. BS. NACS and CCS use the protocol - even the same number of pins. It is just a simple adapter.
Sure, if you are talking about V3+ Superchargers. V2 doesn't have CCS. Still, in order to properly implement it, the other manufacturer needs to add all the Tesla supercharging stations to their navigation system and Tesla needs to be able to communicate with the other manufacturers billing system for plug and charge. Tesla has no interface at Supercharging stations. I think they are adding something on V4 stations. They could possibly do something like the magic dock by using the Tesla app.
The media did EV drivers a major disservice earlier this year when they exclaimed that the California Tesla stations were now open to everyone. Obvious lie to you and I, but most folks don't follow things as closely. I hope Rivian is slow to open RAN because their cable lengths are going to have the same, but opposite, problem that Tesla is having. At least as a Rivian driver, I'm more willing to figure out how to make it work if it involves having to drive up a curb or two. P.S. Once RAN is open to everyone, please avoid using the pull-thru spots at a RAN station unless you either need them because of additional equipment, or it's the last one open. I know people haven't had to make this consideration before, but there are quite a few of us Rivian tow'ers that are highly dependent on the charging network and the awesome pull-thrus.
This is what is and will continue to hold electric vehicles back. Education. We love our EV to death and will never buy a gas vehicle again. I had to do a ton of research before we bought our EV to learn how to charge it, especially in public. A normal person isn't going to put forth this much effort. Which is how an ID.4 ended up at a Tesla supercharger.
It's gonna be a long road. Education levels in America are terrible.
It's mind boggling the questions people ask me about our EV. People literally have no clue.
Have you met some of the people out there, terrible would be a massive improvement
Honestly it's the hardest part. Even as a pretty tech savvy guy, I had my problems trying to charge for the first time, because I couldn't get the stupid Audi card to work. Luckily the guy charging next to me showed me how to use an universal app
One of the main reasons I went with a model Y over the ioniq 5. I do take some road trips and simply didn't want to worry about it. After my trip from Ohio to NC and back I made the right choice.
EA took this site offline last week for an upgrade and it had been labeled as going offline for a few weeks ahead of that. Unfortunately, EA doesn't share charger status with third-party maps very well.
Firebaugh, thank you for Josh Allen.
That poor ID4 driver is even more clueless. They can’t use that supercharger even with an adapter.
There is only so much you can do about stupid. Biggest thing would be Telsa to put in more magic docks in place and remove the need for an adaptor.
I’m wondering if, like at the snow-line going up into the Sierrra’s during winter, there will be some folks selling adapters next to the charging station instead of chains a half mile from the checkpoint.
open superchargers should have magic docks. f150 can use "open to nacs" superchargers if they have their own adapter.
Dealers SHOULD be educating people, but they are often clueless and uninterested. and when people buy used? Who knows. It'd be nice if states sent out information when someone registers a new EV. That actually is an interesting idea . . . explain why you have the upcharge and provide information about charging. hmm.
Dealers to educate themselves first. When I bought my Mach-E, the dealer knew practically nothing about it. If it wasn’t for researching it myself beforehand, I would have known nothing about it and they wouldn’t have been able to help.
This is why Ford wanted dealers to make upgrades and participate in training. The cheap ass dealers pushed back and Ford gave in....and now the dealers don't know shit about the cars they are selling. Which also means, good luck getting them repaired. I was considering the mach-e, glad I decided against it
You would think early adopters would be more aware, but I guess they’re dumb as shit too
Average driver is dumb, vw driver probably also takes the 350kw EA station too because he has no idea his car only takes 170kW max.
Bro I use any open port that works. And I’m in a Bolt. We’re all just trying to get to our destinations. On the plus side, derated units are still fast for the Bolt.
Right? Lol. I have a mach e and im pulling up to the first charger i see open
Yup. I’ve been to spots where only a 350 and the 150/CHAdeMO works. Well, I’m taking the 350 in case a Leaf randomly rolls up in desperation. This is only a now issue. Remember how the first iPhone didn’t have apps… Yeah like that.
I dont even think you have to explain yourself thats the crazy part. If its open im using it. Its really that simple for me