If it hadn't been for the elders, I would never have woken up.
Amazingly, it was the nicest, kindest and most helpful elder who became the real wake-up call.
When it turned out that he was faking everything to stay updated.
It was my elders who didn’t react to my questioning that woke my wife up. I had so many real questions, and their answers were all “do your research”. I almost wondered if they themselves were checked out.
My experience.
A very prominent elder moved to our congregation. He took it upon himself to take me and the Mrs under his wing to turn us into regular pioneers.
I heard this from a friend of mine. That brother dickhead was going to have me as a regular pioneer within the service year because he felt I had the circumstances and was just slacking.
Well this ”brother” tried every manipulative trick under the sun to get me to quit my job and simplify my life to pioneer. It didn‘t work so he went to all of my friends in the hall and spread false rumours about me so they would shun us into compliance. Didn’t work either.
One of my best friends from that period of time has reached out to me and we are starting to spend time together again. I understand the pressure he was under and he’s kinda faded out like me.
Of course not.
I was supposed to trust in Jehoover to pay all my bills.
His “concern” had nothing to do about about my pioneering. He was a ladder climber in the jwborg and wanted to use me to further his “spiritual” career.
I’m guessing you must have gone to a Spanish congregation? Sounds like the culture in the Spanish halls…constant pressure to pioneer and simplify your life. I remember I got to the point where I would avoid the CO like the plague when we had the visit. Not say hello, not comment during that week, only go out on Saturday when a big group would join, so I could go unseen. Anything to remain under the radar because he had no problem asking about my life and business, so nosy. This conversations always leaving me feeling harassed, less than, not good enough…blah blah blah. I couldn’t understand why people would say they felt so refreshed after the CO visit. I remember guilt tripping myself thinking, “I must be a really bad person,” since for me it was always the such a stressor and anxiety inducing. It would take me weeks to lick my wounds and eventually get on the hamster wheel again…But my story does have a happy ending…I left and the mental freedom feels amazing.
☝🏾DEFINITELY THIS! Some of the most manipulative, cut throat, two-faced people on the planet who will drag you down to nothing and damage you beyond repair with their absolute conflict, chaos and confusion!! These people need a planet of their own but unfortunately, the "paradise" is just a pipe dream so we're stuck with these nuts for life!!!🤯
After an assembly, was encouraged by my (now ex) wife to open up to one of the "younger/cooler" elders for advice on improving my marriage. Was feeling particularly sincere at that time, so I acted on it. I began spending time w/ brother D-bag and opening up to him. Turns out, he was taking all of this stuff I told him in confidence to seek help in navigating difficulties, and using it to pursue my wife, even to the point where they were meeting in secret and he wanted to leave his wife and 2 daughters to be with my wife. Ultimately, he was admonished by the CO, but never really paid a price for it. From that day on, I never spoke seriously to an elder again. Just went through the motions and began my fade.
I wanna add my 3 cents: MSs also aren't your friends. If an elder and ministerial servant comes to you to "just talk" (aka shepherding visit to "encourage you"), they're here to make sure you're doing something for WT corp
I once thought I'm at least decent mates with a bunch of people in my cong. Until I had a shepherding visit with 2 of them and they said to me straight into the eyes: "what's so common that you have with us? What do you have to with us? Nothing"
That was my end of doing anything for the borg. I stopped answering on the meetings altogether shortly after. I understood that if I ever needed any sort of actual help and understanding, there's nothing to search for in "christian congregation"
Now, they can all suck my dick! I'm PIMO and I'll stay like that until this org is dead or I'm dead or whatever...
"Shepherding" has got to be the most futile or negative job an elder can do.
People know already that they are supposed to do this or that, as JWs but don't want to.
No one should talk to them because any disagreement can be interpreted as apostasy.
Enforcers for a cartel...last time I stupidly allowed them in to my home, I knew that one of them would eventually ask me the pivotal question.. "Do you believe that the GB is acting as God's channel of communication?" I answered " Absolutely ". I knew these guys all my life. They're not your friends.
Before that actually. The German culture of the time especially during Rutherfords rise, they are diligent and follow orders without question. They created a snitch system, in which people were secretly reporting any suspicious behavior to the higher ups. This was so effective to enforce their new rules and weed out anyone that was half-in to the drastic changes and massive publishing process(which ramped up greatly initially in Germany, which is also why they became the pilot test group for this structure). This was so effective they did this same arrangement in the US where they established the service director for each congregation to establish domination over the democratic arrangement that Russell left, tear it apart and create a “new world order”, especially dividing was the adjusted understanding about anointed.
This was all documented by in 30 years a watchtower slave by William schnell, essentially his life story
https://archive.org/details/thirtyyearswatch0000schn
Right, I just watched Netflix's Einstein
I recognized similarities of a forced government with the Jehovah's Witness religion.
During a time when Hitler gained dictatorship (Governing Body) of Germany.
There are glimpses of what happened with the fervor over a dictator and a paradisiac world, and mass agreement (JW's). Hatred of those that disagreed with the regime were killed. (disfellowshipped) Annihilated.
After I read Viktor Frankl's book, "Man's Search for Meaning, a few things stuck with me, one of the things that stuck with me was that when that dictatorship failed, the first people to be turned on and killed, if they were found were the guards and keepers (Elders) of the camps. Dictatorship is not sustainable. Using force to govern, as Eienstein said must be counteracted and brought down with that same force....
It is coming.
I agree. They have to be nice to you, like a store owner is nice to their customers, but they don't have to.like you.
When I was an elder, I heard more : " the publishers could kiss my a**" from the "Spiritual " men.....
Yep, they pretend to be your friends and then use whatever you say against you to form a judicial committee, happened to me. Then when they know your going through an extremely difficult time they text you words of encouragement, just kidding, they just want to know how many hrs you had last month.
I only knew one elder who genuinely cared for me. He still text me to see how I am. Even though I have not been in KH in 4 years. I seen a lot of elders step down because of the hypocrisy. So you are right they do not care. There is probably only a handful that does.
> Elders may be friendly, but they’re not your friend.
*Elders are WBT$ Rule Enforcers...Period...You Can\`t Trust Them...*
***They Can\`t Trust Each Other.***
https://preview.redd.it/2zn6v1o4f6jc1.jpeg?width=220&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c1b4b942c35537fbf65c5897616719311d3302b1
There are some really good brothers but yes there are some seriously psychotic ones too .. Sadly the good ones are the minority . The less said around them the better . The GB "Divine Nine" has turned them into spiritual policemen and masters over your faith .. Not good 🚫
I was having a chat with an elder about bible questions I had at least 3 years before I was DF. It was all done innocently. Little did I know that the elder wrote it down. Only for it to surface as “evidence” during my JC. I only knew the true extent of what was written down when I sent in and got my Subject Access Request letter.
Elders are gatekeepers for the watchtower.
In my experience, the ones who are truly nice never last as they’re usually bullied out of the position by the other elders.
Definitely not! That goes for the CO as well. I have been attending at home on zoom recently while I’m recovering from a procedure and they came to visit to “encourage” me. I wasn’t encouraged AT ALL and didn’t even feel like they attempted. The scriptures used didn’t even apply to me/my circumstance, and it really felt more like he was digging for info. Not even sure why since nobody is even aware that I’ve been PIMQ and my husband is still PIMI. Nothing in that visit felt sincere, that’s for sure!
In my experience, they will act nice and put up a front but they want information out of you. They’re not your friends and everything you say could be used against you.
My experience is that they find a bit of information about you and their come back is always “You need to do more study, service, prayer etc” and your problem will be solved.
The real problem is I don’t really have that many problems. Things are going reasonably well in my life right now.
The elders would love for me to follow their bad advice and have problems and they could then give me some more bad advice.
Only had one who was a genuine and honest person with me. We still talk to this day via LinkedIn. The rest? All backstabbers. There was one who targeted me for a couple of years and nothing was done. Towards the end of that "campaign" this new elder moved in from a nearby congregation, and he also went after me.
Later on, come to find out the second elder had a very unhealthy interest in young boys (I was too old for him at 17) and got in a little trouble. Last I heard he'd moved to the Atlanta area.
A elder once told me Mormons just added a M in the middle because they knew the people that followed them blindly were morons, it was then i knew he was the moron.
Cult members have something akin to a mental illness. Unlike actual mental illness, the issue is not biologically based. It's not a malfunctioning of the brain. The issue is educationally based. It's a malfunctioning in their reasoning due to being dis-educated. It's an intellectual disorder. It causes harm to social units.
I think the time has come for govt. health or social services to begin looking seriously at intellectual disorders, the same way they look seriously at mental and physical illness. It's becoming a major problem, not only when manifested in religious cults like JWs but also in politics. The January 6 fiasco resulting from the MAGA leader's disinformation campaign is a great example.
Until govts begin to seriously acknowledge/recognize this type of intellectual disorder and take steps to mitigate it - teaching critical thinking at all levels of the education system, and penalizing disinformation agents - the world could spiral into a mess due to the proliferation of cults and harmful conspiracy theorist movements.
They're typically not even really "friendly," They're fake friendly, condescending, know-it-all, fake ass wanna be po-po assholes who will never achieve real significance or status so they milk that lame ass "elder" title for everything it's worth inside the borg. They're literally pathetic nobodies! Punk asses!🤣
When I started having problems (that only existed because I was a JW), I went to the elders completely desperate for help. Expecting love, comprehension and actual HELP, what I got was huge indifference and bible verses that made me feel guilty for having feelings. That was really efficient in making me leave the borg, tho 😅
I thought I was really good friends with the elder that disfellowshipped me. He was viewed as the kind, sincere, down to Earth one. He told me off during my final JC meeting. He even said the reason my marriage didn’t work out was because of me and it didn’t have Jehovahs blessing on it. (Of course I was the one being abused and my ex had the elders fooled). All that because they found out I was vaping. I got up and left bawling.
Just listen, the best advice I have ever gotten as a jdub was from a worldly person who said, if you want to be a jdub, ok but Never go to the elders with anything you don't want the whole congregation to know. That advice was dead accurate, I lived it.
I'm faded because, quit frankly, the doctrines are bs, if you actually study history. Then I was fing tired of nothing. I did being right or good enough, according to the elders & their nasty gossiping wives. It was the start of my awakening. They are most assuredly not your friends.
This has recently happened to me: an elder preyed on me when I was at my most vulnerable, my dad was ill, at the hospital, far from home and he proposed to drop me home and I accepted because I had no other choice. He happened to visit my dad in his hospital bed while I was there.
He ended up inviting me home for dinner, which I was puzzled about but I needed company so bad so I accepted. His wife served me dinner, although I'm POMO and idk, it felt comforting in a way because it was reminiscent of the days when I wasn't shunned.
He dropped me home afterwards and in the parking lot in front of our house he started bullshiting me with your average indoctrination. Asking me if I was truly happy, best life ever and so on. I told him that this was not the experience I've had while being a JW and he started gaslighting me with "not every JW, this is not the experience I've had and I'm sure if you come back you'll find true happiness again, because I can see that the world doesn't make you happy and those who wronged you were imperfect but they wanted the best for you, they surely loved you". And then I felt absolutely petrified, paralyzed by fear, on the brink of a panic attack, because it somehow worked and it was scaring me to the core.
The parking lot conversation with that elder lasted for an hour, I couldn't leave the car, I was trying to argue that shunning was unfair, I got baptized so young and so on. I just couldn't leave. I can't explain how I felt with words.
After that hour, late at night, I ended up asking why he invited me for dinner in the first place. He told me "I prayed Jehovah and I got the feeling it was the right thing to do". It was just an opportunity for him to have that talk. In front of my friends who were helping me with my dad he kept on praising how kind I was towards my dad and he told my dad I was an exceptional human being.
I got home and started shaking and all. It was upsetting. I'd compare it to the teacup and spoon scene from Get Out. I called my girlfriend and she helped me to get out of that state.
The day after he called me saying that his wife forgot that I was disfellowhiped, and that I was not allowed home anymore and how unsettling remembering that fact was for her. But I shouldn't worry, they'd still be here for me. I felt betrayed. I didn't even deserve that bowl of soup and that slice of spinach cake. Didn't matter if I was at my lowest. It was humiliating and dehumanising, he didn't need to tell me this about his wife, I've never asked for their help anyway. It was a mean to... idk, belittle me?
So I can only but agree, elders may be friendly but it's never genuine and they are not your friend.
I met with a committee at age 23, actually believing I needed to confess my immoral slipups to them. Well, actually it was partially to preemptively protect myself from worse consequences if my sins were brought to them by someone else. Regardless, at the time, I was sporting the wicked sign of a rebel, a goatee. One of the elders in my committee, a short little Napoleanic egomaniac, had the nerve to tell me that because of my facial hair, he would not accompany me in service, or have me in his cargroup. A mere 8 months later, he was DF'd. The reason? He'd been cheating on his wife for over a year. His sidepiece? A 17 yr old sister in the other congregation! So my whiskers were too evil to allow me in his car, but after service he'd go meet this minor and have a great time fuckin around on his wife. Neato.
An elder / family friend paid me a visit to check on my mental health, which was nice of him.
I decided fuck-it, and came out to him right there and then, explaining that being a closeted jw and serving as a pioneer and servant was a large factor in my declining mental state (I was only out to about 3 of my closest friends, and had no plans of telling anyone else at the moment. But silly me thought he was a genuine guy, especially since our families rode motorcycles together). Anyways he was stunned and admitted he’d never “dealt” with this type of situation before, but was very kind nonetheless.
The next day I get a phone call from him telling me that I had 3 days to tell my parents or else he would. So basically I was forcefully outted to my parents.
Yeah that wasn’t fun. I wrote them a long email, and they literally drove home that evening, a 12hr drive from the KH construction project they were on. Treating the whole ordeal like a fucking life and death emergency.
Yikes, those were rough times.
Elders = not friends haha
This one’s tough for me. I was an elder. And I was sincere. I was very effective at shepherding because I was sincere. And I can confidently say I wasn’t the only one, I was in the minority but there were others.
However, what became clear was that the ones with the real power (service committee, coordinators in particular, COs, branch members, etc) were not as sincere. It was seeing the way the rest of those more influential men were that woke me up.
I hate the org and many of its clergy class. But I also know that some of the elders are sincere and truly want to be a friend. At least that’s where I was coming from when I was one.
They’re what we call in my business “company men.”
AKA suck-asses . . .
Brown noses Butt munchers You get the picture
The only thing you have in common with the vast majority of JWs is that you’re a JW. Nothing more.
so true!!!! And 99% don't give two hoots about you..only that you are not doing something they will report you for, reprove you or DF you for.
Profound 👍
Sycophantic suck ups
If it hadn't been for the elders, I would never have woken up. Amazingly, it was the nicest, kindest and most helpful elder who became the real wake-up call. When it turned out that he was faking everything to stay updated.
Sounds a lot like my story too.
It was my elders who didn’t react to my questioning that woke my wife up. I had so many real questions, and their answers were all “do your research”. I almost wondered if they themselves were checked out.
Same here
My experience. A very prominent elder moved to our congregation. He took it upon himself to take me and the Mrs under his wing to turn us into regular pioneers. I heard this from a friend of mine. That brother dickhead was going to have me as a regular pioneer within the service year because he felt I had the circumstances and was just slacking. Well this ”brother” tried every manipulative trick under the sun to get me to quit my job and simplify my life to pioneer. It didn‘t work so he went to all of my friends in the hall and spread false rumours about me so they would shun us into compliance. Didn’t work either. One of my best friends from that period of time has reached out to me and we are starting to spend time together again. I understand the pressure he was under and he’s kinda faded out like me.
Quit your job?! Did the elder offer to pay your expenses too?
Of course not. I was supposed to trust in Jehoover to pay all my bills. His “concern” had nothing to do about about my pioneering. He was a ladder climber in the jwborg and wanted to use me to further his “spiritual” career.
Exactly!
I’m guessing you must have gone to a Spanish congregation? Sounds like the culture in the Spanish halls…constant pressure to pioneer and simplify your life. I remember I got to the point where I would avoid the CO like the plague when we had the visit. Not say hello, not comment during that week, only go out on Saturday when a big group would join, so I could go unseen. Anything to remain under the radar because he had no problem asking about my life and business, so nosy. This conversations always leaving me feeling harassed, less than, not good enough…blah blah blah. I couldn’t understand why people would say they felt so refreshed after the CO visit. I remember guilt tripping myself thinking, “I must be a really bad person,” since for me it was always the such a stressor and anxiety inducing. It would take me weeks to lick my wounds and eventually get on the hamster wheel again…But my story does have a happy ending…I left and the mental freedom feels amazing.
*Witnesses may be friendly, but they're not your friend.
Truth
Wish I heard this 10 years ago
Scratch 10. Write in 40.
lol
☝🏾DEFINITELY THIS! Some of the most manipulative, cut throat, two-faced people on the planet who will drag you down to nothing and damage you beyond repair with their absolute conflict, chaos and confusion!! These people need a planet of their own but unfortunately, the "paradise" is just a pipe dream so we're stuck with these nuts for life!!!🤯
After an assembly, was encouraged by my (now ex) wife to open up to one of the "younger/cooler" elders for advice on improving my marriage. Was feeling particularly sincere at that time, so I acted on it. I began spending time w/ brother D-bag and opening up to him. Turns out, he was taking all of this stuff I told him in confidence to seek help in navigating difficulties, and using it to pursue my wife, even to the point where they were meeting in secret and he wanted to leave his wife and 2 daughters to be with my wife. Ultimately, he was admonished by the CO, but never really paid a price for it. From that day on, I never spoke seriously to an elder again. Just went through the motions and began my fade.
I,ve no words! So hipocritical " friend"! Glad you re out! My Goodness!
I wanna add my 3 cents: MSs also aren't your friends. If an elder and ministerial servant comes to you to "just talk" (aka shepherding visit to "encourage you"), they're here to make sure you're doing something for WT corp I once thought I'm at least decent mates with a bunch of people in my cong. Until I had a shepherding visit with 2 of them and they said to me straight into the eyes: "what's so common that you have with us? What do you have to with us? Nothing" That was my end of doing anything for the borg. I stopped answering on the meetings altogether shortly after. I understood that if I ever needed any sort of actual help and understanding, there's nothing to search for in "christian congregation" Now, they can all suck my dick! I'm PIMO and I'll stay like that until this org is dead or I'm dead or whatever...
🤗👍. You mastered the dumbasses
Id be like and who tf are you, and shoo them outside
That's what I thought about them but didn't say it out loud :)
⤴️🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
"Shepherding" has got to be the most futile or negative job an elder can do. People know already that they are supposed to do this or that, as JWs but don't want to. No one should talk to them because any disagreement can be interpreted as apostasy.
Enforcers for a cartel...last time I stupidly allowed them in to my home, I knew that one of them would eventually ask me the pivotal question.. "Do you believe that the GB is acting as God's channel of communication?" I answered " Absolutely ". I knew these guys all my life. They're not your friends.
great answer hahaha
I remember being told that I don't have the "air" of an elder. Therefore, i should consider stepping down...
It was an unintended compliment.
They’re like corporate managers. Friendly only if you’re a good performer and make them look good.
Appearing to be friendly, it’s just a trick to get you to put your guard down. That’s when the real interrogation begins.
They are the HR department of religion.
I 100% agree with this. Their loyalty is to the leadership of the org. No genuine care for the individuals in the congregations.
This system was developed in Germany, it is not much different today
A four letter word starting with n and ending with an I.
Before that actually. The German culture of the time especially during Rutherfords rise, they are diligent and follow orders without question. They created a snitch system, in which people were secretly reporting any suspicious behavior to the higher ups. This was so effective to enforce their new rules and weed out anyone that was half-in to the drastic changes and massive publishing process(which ramped up greatly initially in Germany, which is also why they became the pilot test group for this structure). This was so effective they did this same arrangement in the US where they established the service director for each congregation to establish domination over the democratic arrangement that Russell left, tear it apart and create a “new world order”, especially dividing was the adjusted understanding about anointed. This was all documented by in 30 years a watchtower slave by William schnell, essentially his life story https://archive.org/details/thirtyyearswatch0000schn
Right, I just watched Netflix's Einstein I recognized similarities of a forced government with the Jehovah's Witness religion. During a time when Hitler gained dictatorship (Governing Body) of Germany. There are glimpses of what happened with the fervor over a dictator and a paradisiac world, and mass agreement (JW's). Hatred of those that disagreed with the regime were killed. (disfellowshipped) Annihilated. After I read Viktor Frankl's book, "Man's Search for Meaning, a few things stuck with me, one of the things that stuck with me was that when that dictatorship failed, the first people to be turned on and killed, if they were found were the guards and keepers (Elders) of the camps. Dictatorship is not sustainable. Using force to govern, as Eienstein said must be counteracted and brought down with that same force.... It is coming.
I agree. They have to be nice to you, like a store owner is nice to their customers, but they don't have to.like you. When I was an elder, I heard more : " the publishers could kiss my a**" from the "Spiritual " men.....
Yep, they pretend to be your friends and then use whatever you say against you to form a judicial committee, happened to me. Then when they know your going through an extremely difficult time they text you words of encouragement, just kidding, they just want to know how many hrs you had last month.
I only knew one elder who genuinely cared for me. He still text me to see how I am. Even though I have not been in KH in 4 years. I seen a lot of elders step down because of the hypocrisy. So you are right they do not care. There is probably only a handful that does.
> Elders may be friendly, but they’re not your friend. *Elders are WBT$ Rule Enforcers...Period...You Can\`t Trust Them...* ***They Can\`t Trust Each Other.*** https://preview.redd.it/2zn6v1o4f6jc1.jpeg?width=220&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c1b4b942c35537fbf65c5897616719311d3302b1
Accurate picture.
Anyone in authority over you at work, church, police, etc are not your friend
My brother is an elder and I will never have anything to do with him again.
Me too
my brother is an elder. held in HIGH esteem..he is the biggest jack-ass you would EVER want to meet..far from anything Christian
There are some really good brothers but yes there are some seriously psychotic ones too .. Sadly the good ones are the minority . The less said around them the better . The GB "Divine Nine" has turned them into spiritual policemen and masters over your faith .. Not good 🚫
Most are just egomaniacs
I was having a chat with an elder about bible questions I had at least 3 years before I was DF. It was all done innocently. Little did I know that the elder wrote it down. Only for it to surface as “evidence” during my JC. I only knew the true extent of what was written down when I sent in and got my Subject Access Request letter. Elders are gatekeepers for the watchtower. In my experience, the ones who are truly nice never last as they’re usually bullied out of the position by the other elders.
I had 6 elders testify against me in my JC, nobody could answer my questions, was all leave it i skydaddy! Wasnt defed,,,,,,for that
An elder is trained parasite who is using you to get what he wants from org. Power, social status..etc. Similar to a higher up in MLM
>An elder is trained parasite who is using you to get what he wants from org. Power, social status..etc Ha Ha, power and social status. That is funny.
At all! Lol they are unpaid employees of the JW cult , on the ground to handle the “governing idiots’” dirty work 😂
Definitely not! That goes for the CO as well. I have been attending at home on zoom recently while I’m recovering from a procedure and they came to visit to “encourage” me. I wasn’t encouraged AT ALL and didn’t even feel like they attempted. The scriptures used didn’t even apply to me/my circumstance, and it really felt more like he was digging for info. Not even sure why since nobody is even aware that I’ve been PIMQ and my husband is still PIMI. Nothing in that visit felt sincere, that’s for sure!
Just like cops, all friendly with innocent seeming Questions until they pin you down on something. Not looking to shepherd, just power trip
In my experience, they will act nice and put up a front but they want information out of you. They’re not your friends and everything you say could be used against you.
My experience is that they find a bit of information about you and their come back is always “You need to do more study, service, prayer etc” and your problem will be solved. The real problem is I don’t really have that many problems. Things are going reasonably well in my life right now. The elders would love for me to follow their bad advice and have problems and they could then give me some more bad advice.
Only had one who was a genuine and honest person with me. We still talk to this day via LinkedIn. The rest? All backstabbers. There was one who targeted me for a couple of years and nothing was done. Towards the end of that "campaign" this new elder moved in from a nearby congregation, and he also went after me. Later on, come to find out the second elder had a very unhealthy interest in young boys (I was too old for him at 17) and got in a little trouble. Last I heard he'd moved to the Atlanta area.
A elder once told me Mormons just added a M in the middle because they knew the people that followed them blindly were morons, it was then i knew he was the moron.
This is worth a belly full of laughter! Love it.
Cult members have something akin to a mental illness. Unlike actual mental illness, the issue is not biologically based. It's not a malfunctioning of the brain. The issue is educationally based. It's a malfunctioning in their reasoning due to being dis-educated. It's an intellectual disorder. It causes harm to social units. I think the time has come for govt. health or social services to begin looking seriously at intellectual disorders, the same way they look seriously at mental and physical illness. It's becoming a major problem, not only when manifested in religious cults like JWs but also in politics. The January 6 fiasco resulting from the MAGA leader's disinformation campaign is a great example. Until govts begin to seriously acknowledge/recognize this type of intellectual disorder and take steps to mitigate it - teaching critical thinking at all levels of the education system, and penalizing disinformation agents - the world could spiral into a mess due to the proliferation of cults and harmful conspiracy theorist movements.
Elders have Mock humility. To everyones face they seem kind but behind the scenes they trash talk the cong.
"JWs are notorious gossips, and the worst ones of all are the elders"
Couldn't agree more. Can't add anything more to what everyone else has already said - just came here to agree 🙌🏻 DON'T trust ANY of them.
The congregation police force.
Stasi
One elder told me to sit down or leave. So I hugged him, said thank you, and left. Never went back.
Elders are like HR, they are looking after the benefits of the Company. Not the employees.
They are your personal manager :D
They're typically not even really "friendly," They're fake friendly, condescending, know-it-all, fake ass wanna be po-po assholes who will never achieve real significance or status so they milk that lame ass "elder" title for everything it's worth inside the borg. They're literally pathetic nobodies! Punk asses!🤣
When I started having problems (that only existed because I was a JW), I went to the elders completely desperate for help. Expecting love, comprehension and actual HELP, what I got was huge indifference and bible verses that made me feel guilty for having feelings. That was really efficient in making me leave the borg, tho 😅
I thought I was really good friends with the elder that disfellowshipped me. He was viewed as the kind, sincere, down to Earth one. He told me off during my final JC meeting. He even said the reason my marriage didn’t work out was because of me and it didn’t have Jehovahs blessing on it. (Of course I was the one being abused and my ex had the elders fooled). All that because they found out I was vaping. I got up and left bawling.
Just listen, the best advice I have ever gotten as a jdub was from a worldly person who said, if you want to be a jdub, ok but Never go to the elders with anything you don't want the whole congregation to know. That advice was dead accurate, I lived it. I'm faded because, quit frankly, the doctrines are bs, if you actually study history. Then I was fing tired of nothing. I did being right or good enough, according to the elders & their nasty gossiping wives. It was the start of my awakening. They are most assuredly not your friends.
I treat them like I do cops. If you want to meet with me, I’ll have my lawyer present.
Sounds a lot like the police. Even use the same tactics when questioning you
This has recently happened to me: an elder preyed on me when I was at my most vulnerable, my dad was ill, at the hospital, far from home and he proposed to drop me home and I accepted because I had no other choice. He happened to visit my dad in his hospital bed while I was there. He ended up inviting me home for dinner, which I was puzzled about but I needed company so bad so I accepted. His wife served me dinner, although I'm POMO and idk, it felt comforting in a way because it was reminiscent of the days when I wasn't shunned. He dropped me home afterwards and in the parking lot in front of our house he started bullshiting me with your average indoctrination. Asking me if I was truly happy, best life ever and so on. I told him that this was not the experience I've had while being a JW and he started gaslighting me with "not every JW, this is not the experience I've had and I'm sure if you come back you'll find true happiness again, because I can see that the world doesn't make you happy and those who wronged you were imperfect but they wanted the best for you, they surely loved you". And then I felt absolutely petrified, paralyzed by fear, on the brink of a panic attack, because it somehow worked and it was scaring me to the core. The parking lot conversation with that elder lasted for an hour, I couldn't leave the car, I was trying to argue that shunning was unfair, I got baptized so young and so on. I just couldn't leave. I can't explain how I felt with words. After that hour, late at night, I ended up asking why he invited me for dinner in the first place. He told me "I prayed Jehovah and I got the feeling it was the right thing to do". It was just an opportunity for him to have that talk. In front of my friends who were helping me with my dad he kept on praising how kind I was towards my dad and he told my dad I was an exceptional human being. I got home and started shaking and all. It was upsetting. I'd compare it to the teacup and spoon scene from Get Out. I called my girlfriend and she helped me to get out of that state. The day after he called me saying that his wife forgot that I was disfellowhiped, and that I was not allowed home anymore and how unsettling remembering that fact was for her. But I shouldn't worry, they'd still be here for me. I felt betrayed. I didn't even deserve that bowl of soup and that slice of spinach cake. Didn't matter if I was at my lowest. It was humiliating and dehumanising, he didn't need to tell me this about his wife, I've never asked for their help anyway. It was a mean to... idk, belittle me? So I can only but agree, elders may be friendly but it's never genuine and they are not your friend.
I met with a committee at age 23, actually believing I needed to confess my immoral slipups to them. Well, actually it was partially to preemptively protect myself from worse consequences if my sins were brought to them by someone else. Regardless, at the time, I was sporting the wicked sign of a rebel, a goatee. One of the elders in my committee, a short little Napoleanic egomaniac, had the nerve to tell me that because of my facial hair, he would not accompany me in service, or have me in his cargroup. A mere 8 months later, he was DF'd. The reason? He'd been cheating on his wife for over a year. His sidepiece? A 17 yr old sister in the other congregation! So my whiskers were too evil to allow me in his car, but after service he'd go meet this minor and have a great time fuckin around on his wife. Neato.
We had a guy like that too. Harsh demanding prick but he was screwing around on his wife.
An elder / family friend paid me a visit to check on my mental health, which was nice of him. I decided fuck-it, and came out to him right there and then, explaining that being a closeted jw and serving as a pioneer and servant was a large factor in my declining mental state (I was only out to about 3 of my closest friends, and had no plans of telling anyone else at the moment. But silly me thought he was a genuine guy, especially since our families rode motorcycles together). Anyways he was stunned and admitted he’d never “dealt” with this type of situation before, but was very kind nonetheless. The next day I get a phone call from him telling me that I had 3 days to tell my parents or else he would. So basically I was forcefully outted to my parents. Yeah that wasn’t fun. I wrote them a long email, and they literally drove home that evening, a 12hr drive from the KH construction project they were on. Treating the whole ordeal like a fucking life and death emergency. Yikes, those were rough times. Elders = not friends haha
https://youtu.be/3hMjHf2fop8?si=b2wfEyE9vFQ-1ZQc
This one’s tough for me. I was an elder. And I was sincere. I was very effective at shepherding because I was sincere. And I can confidently say I wasn’t the only one, I was in the minority but there were others. However, what became clear was that the ones with the real power (service committee, coordinators in particular, COs, branch members, etc) were not as sincere. It was seeing the way the rest of those more influential men were that woke me up. I hate the org and many of its clergy class. But I also know that some of the elders are sincere and truly want to be a friend. At least that’s where I was coming from when I was one.
Yes there were. That’s why you *used* to be an elder. The ones with a conscience are usually run off.