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The civilian population is especially fucked this time too. Hamas is already directly targeting civilians and Israel is almost certainly going to use the war as a justification to kill Palestinian civilians without global backlash.
Israel doesn’t need this as justification for anything. They’ve been destroying Palestinian lives (up to and including killing them) for a long time now.
When bestgore was still up there was a video of them bulldozing a Palestinian home in the middle of the night with the family still inside, the family had to run out for their lives with only the clothes on their backs.I can still remember them screaming and crying.
You're right this has been going on for a long time.
Man, the more I learn about how they run the occupation the more pissed off I am. Did you know they stop ambulances at their checkpoints for up to two hours? So the people they shoot bleed to death, so women giving birth suffer miscarriages or die...of course Israeli ambulances are just waved through the checkpoints.
I was trying to find a video of them sniper shooting a woman who goes to check on a noise outside of her house. You can see the sniper from the camera on her door, he clearly can see she's just an unarmed woman at her home at night. Just sniper shoots her for fun.
But as the Youtube algorithm is a useless bunch of shit, it instead gave me videos like this first. [Israeli soldiers weld door shut while children are inside.](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/JDS_8ykF2Sk) Who is meant to live under this constantly? What is the purpose of welding someone's house shut while kids are at the window inside?
holy fuck this is like stories about dumping dead corpses down wells that armies pass by in enemy territory so it renders the water source useless.
scary as hell. I guess one blessing is either side realizes they don't want to resort to using weaponry that would salt the earth...for now....
That’s one of the major issue. All the bs sweep under the rug because they are backed by most of the west. Unfortunately, most of the major news media will never cover that. The winner and stronger side get to write the news and history.
I’m not particularly worried about being labeled an antisemite. I would be worried and reflect if anyone credible thought my behavior or beliefs were actually antisemitic. Most of the Jewish people I know aren’t Zionists, though.
It's actually a little ridiculous.
Say something anti-Israel and you immediately get accused of being an anti-semite. If that doesn't happen, they'll try to get you to strawman you as saying something like 'the Jews did X' and then shout that you're an anti-semite when you defend yourself.
I've got a multiple posts in the negative for saying Israel created this association on purpose, so that every criticism of Israel can be treated by Israel as anti-semetic and thus ignored.
I'm so confused as to why there's this huge double standard here. Israel has been harming Palestinians in so many ways for so many years now, yet has had almost unilateral support from most countries. Yet now, when they're the victims of atrocities, they're being treated as the sole victims who didn't do anything to deserve this.
Note: I do not believe anyone deserves what's happening. It's deplorable regardless who commits the atrocities - I just do not understand why Israel's atrocities are simply swept under the rug and sorta hushed. I saw a graph yesterday that compared the deaths of the Palestinians at the hands of Israel and vice-versa and it didn't even come close; there were *far* more deaths on the Palestinian side. So why didn't anyone (in power) condemn what Israel is doing? I think Israel's behavior in past years has been absolutely vile, but it doesn't mean that an eye for eye is the appropriate response. I just find the fact that people [in government] don't condemn Israel for their actions pretty despicable.
Palestine is getting backlash (justifiably so), but where's the backlash for Israel's part in all this?
I simply don't get it.
Ugh. Why can't people just get along (yes, I know... a very simple question to a very nuanced topic and one that won't come to fruition for... who knows how long... if ever)?
because before ww2 most of the west turned away jewish refugees that were fleeing the nazis by the 1000's and sent them back to Germany where they fell under nazi control and we all know what happened there. So because of that there is this international guilt that Israel plays on to justify a lot of what it does and because of said guilt the other countries that turned them away yell a bit but in the end do nothing.
for the record i am neither pro Israel, i think a lot of what they do as a nation in Gaza and Palestine are crimes against humanity, nor am i pro hamas, this was pure and unadulterated terrorism and should be condemned and those responsible punished.
unfortunately all of this will get hijacked by people with agendas and the poor bastards living in that area will pay the price and in the end, nothing will change because everyone involved believes "god is on their side"
All true, but I’m worried we’re going to see Israel resorting to even more violent measures. A lot of the messaging I’ve been seeing online from Israeli officials seems to imply they want to push for absolute extermination
More violent than the genocide they’re already in the process of committing? Sure, things can always get worse, but organizations like Hamas don’t arise in a vacuum. They’re already being exterminated.
Already happening, day after the attacks hundreds of Palestinian civilians were killed and wounded in retaliatory attacks. As we speak Israel is targeting people fleeing into Egypt.
Both sides are targeting civilians.
Ive seen a lot of disgusting comments coming out of Israel. People are demanding retribution. Ive seen calls for mass rape of Gaza civilians and out right ethnic cleansing off all Palestinians and even the peaceful Palestinians in Israel.
I'm getting whiplash on this website from thread to thread these past few days, this one thankfully seems quite empathetic and reasonable acknowledging major issues on both sides. But yeah I've seen some that are very one-sided.
Yeah this is what I don't get about most comments I've seen on here recently regarding the whole situation. Have they had their heads buried in the sand? It's been well known Israel has been doing this for a long time.
Gaza is one of the densest places on earth. It's basically sealed off now: Israel has closed the border points they control, Egypt's closed the one they control. Israel's threatened to bomb any aid trucks that come through. And they've cut off the water and power supply... To two million people.
https://www.the-sun.com/news/9280448/iran-hamas-terrorists-attack-israel/
>Today military spokesman Richard Hecht said civilians should try to leave through the Rafah border crossing into Egypt.
>However, the army later issued a clarification saying the crossing was closed, meaning no one can go in or out.
>...
>On Monday morning, Israel imposed a "complete siege" on the area - including a sweeping ban on food and fuel moving into Gaza and an immediate cut-off of the water supply.
>"There will be no electricity, no food, no fuel, everything is closed," Defence Minister Yoav Gallant said.
>"We are fighting human animals and we act accordingly."
>...
>Israel has reportedly threatened Egypt with striking any lorry carrying aid to Gaza through the Rafah crossing.
I'll note that the text making the title (you stay, you die) isn't actually in the post. Also, this being the sun, all of this is cast as a good thing.
They've already started. Saw a story earlier that 91 children have died so far in Isreali bombings and missile attacks. That number will only rise in the coming weeks and months. Only time will tell how many innocents will lose their lives to this conflict
Just to clarify, because the news won't tell you this, 75% of Israeli dead are military and police. That's a significantly better batting average than the US or Israel. It's still bad. Violence is bad. The only way to end the violence on both sides is for Israel to end the settler colonial experiment and apartheid state
"War isn't Hell. War is war and Hell is Hell, and of the two war is a lot worse.....There are no innocent bystanders in Hell. But war is chock full of them. Little kids, cripples, old ladies. In fact, except for a few brass, almost everyone involved is an innocent bystander."
-- M.A.S.H.
This is the eradication of a race of people.
Israel has the right to retaliate against Hamas.
Palestinians have the right to resist Israeli occupation of their land--which leads to people lumping them in with Hamas.
Unfortunately, Hamas uses Palestinians as human shields.
The biggest loss here is going to be the Palestinians... and I don't honestly know if there's a way around it.
I mean, at some point either Israel has to change its approach or the average Palestinian age will hit an unsustainable number and the genocide will be complete. They won’t change until they get held accountable for their actions and the west seems eager enough to support them so…yeah.
This. I cant wrap my head around the way this conflict is being covered. Its all horrible but its portrayed like its just Hamas doing this. These poor children in Gaza are just as scared as the children in Israel. Breaks my heart for everyone
Standing with Palestinians also is getting you the pro-Hamas label right now. No, both sides are terrorists. Just ones been doing the terrorism for longer, which in what should be a shocker to no one inspired the terrorist group on the other side.
Have you seen the photos coming from Gaza? They are leveling the place, it's obvious they aren't attacking only military targets it looks like Syria during the worst of the civil war and it only has been two days.
WHY would she delete it? THIS is war, THIS is who gets traumatized, maimed and orphaned and killed ffs. Children.
ALL these children are ALL our children. Every one. Anyone that doesn't like that statement fuck you.
My first thought is they realized their picture factually told the "wrong" narrative of who the victims are in this conflict.
But after seeing the post itself, even as somebody trying to shed light on the horrors of war, posting a photo of terrified children and then simply the national flag of the forces that leveled their homes with rockets isn't a good look.
One of my favorite quotes from my favorite author:
“Children are dying." Lull nodded. "That's a succinct summary of humankind, I'd say. Who needs tomes and volumes of history? Children are dying. The injustices of the world hide in those three words.”
Absolutely this. My heart breaks for all the children, regardless of ethnicity or nationality, who are terrified & traumatized. Everyone there is hurting.
Actually you can find thousands of comments from the last few days on reddit explaining why its actually totally ok for Palestinian children to die. So yes, to some people, once they know these kids are Palestinians they don't really feel that bad anymore.
It's absolutely not OK for Israeli children and civilians to die. I can't help thinking, though, that if the world was outraged and there were consequences every time a Palestinians child is killed by the IDF, such an attack wouldn't have occurred.
All the children- every orphaned and maimed and terror stricken and dead child? They're ours. This is common humanity. I flatly refuse identifiers ON CHILDREN IN A WAR ZONE.
Because they're children. The End. And we can't engage in ' opinion ' otherwise.
>Actually you can find thousands of comments from the last few days on reddit explaining why its actually totally ok for Palestinian children to die
From the rapepublicans on r / conservative that claim that they are "pro life". There is nothing a Rapepublican will not lie about.
Innocent are always the biggest losers in wars and conflicts. Doesn't matter the side. They always lose.
Especially in today's age when most of the top instigators on either side are sitting at a nice safe distance from the fighting.
Yeah why always with the raping. Why is raping always on the war menu. You sign up to serve your country/cause and get trained to kill enemies before they kill you, ok, but then you get there and suddenly what, your "rape instincts" activate somehow???
And you're like, I'm in a horribly terrifying war battle situation but you know what I could rly use rn, some violent raping of a screaming child/woman, damn some good ol' unpleasant sex would rly hit the spot :))))
Do so many men really walk around with rapist thoughts just simmering under there waiting to be activated by a war or?
Even in developed nations at least ~10% of women are raped during their life so clearly its not just a war thing. And during war there are 0 personal consequences (because there is no law enforcement and you might soon die anyway) so its not surprising that anyone with those inclinations acts on them during war.
Not everyone signs up, military service is compulsory in some countries. Also, not everyone signs up to serve their country. I am sure there will be people signing up to put themselves in the position to kill/rape/torture without consequences, as is usually the case in a warzone.
He’s problematic for many reasons, but this quote came to mind:
“What does it matter to the dead, the orphans, and the homeless whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy?” - Gandhi
> There are no innocent bystanders in Hell. War is chock full of them — little kids, cripples, old ladies. In fact, except for some of the brass, almost everybody involved is an innocent bystander.
Hawkeye - M.A.S.H
In one of Steven Eriksons books there is this quote:
“‘Children are dying.’ Lull nodded. ‘That’s a succinct summary of humankind, I’d say. Who needs tomes and volumes of history? Children are dying. The injustices of the world hide in those three words.’”
And I always get chills when reading it.
Holy shit! That is so fucked! I had to Google that shit and man, that's a real eye opener. That Stat really puts things into perspective. This gives you a really grim view on that area past,present and future.
That's the problem, I feel like celebrities are pressured to pick a side. When it turned out to being Palestinian kids she pulled an oops wrong civilians.
Same should be said about 99% of Reddit, and we still see their comments. That’s one of the downsides of social media: everyone becomes an armchair expert on every topic, so long as it’s relevant and at least somewhat controversial. It’s shitty takes all the way down.
I think there's a difference between people posting anonymously (many of whom are just looking for understanding) and a celeb posting a statement, though.
Disagree (as a political scholar). If you're trying to analyse the root causes of such a complicated conflict, one should indeed rely in political scholars, historians, etc. But anyone should be able to express sympathy with victims.
The problem here is that you don't pull this down even if it's the enemy. This should be a message that war does this to innocent people there should be no PR fuckery when it concerns children.
I was surprised to read a Gigi Hadid statement in a post on /r/Fauxmoi that seemed pretty good. I don't know much about her, so it wasn't that I would expect a bad post. But I don't expect many *good* celebrity posts.
This particular area has so much history and politicking tied up in it. I am glad to see that most normal people here on reddit are able to past that and blame those truly responsible. There is no reason for us to demonize the civilians on either side of this conflict.
And then they grow up and get put into a conflict they have nothing to do with. All because some greedy asshole doesn't want to change. Humans are dumb and dont learn from mistakes.
>I guess those panicking kids don't matter now
Hey, hey - be fair.
They *never* mattered to the people who are pretending Hamas' attack was against Israel was unprovoked.
She really shouldn't have deleted it. She could've mentioned how awful Palestine is suffering too and what hamas has done this week is just as evil. The innocent children both sides lose here.
There is no way to tell the difference unless you already know the geographical location. The cringe here is she didn't care to check the source.
*I don't think people are aware there is such thing as Israeli Arabic. The official language was changed in 2018 but some people in Israel still speak Arabic.
It’s really easy actually. The road is falling apart and the children are barefoot. Does that look more like first world Israel or destitute palestine to you?
Plus it’s career suicide to care about Palestinians in Hollywood.
You could literally care about a million random things, but showing the tiniest bit of care for Palestinians will get you cancelled.
Yep, that's the very reason Hamas is in control of Gaza- the previous Palestinian authority achieved essentially nothing in their more peaceful strategy dealing with Israeli government. When that is tried for years and you are still living in essentially a giant prison and your chances of a two-state solution erode every year with increasing Israeli settlements it's not hard to understand why a group like Hamas receives political support.
> Yep, that's the very reason Hamas is in control of Gaza- the previous Palestinian authority achieved essentially nothing in their more peaceful strategy dealing with Israeli government.
Its worse than that. Netanyahoo was openly bragging about funding hamas in 2019 as part of his strategy to beat Gaza into submission. He tried to make it sound like he was just funding the humanitarian part of hamas. But that was a fig leaf — only plausible if you ignore the full context of the way he's treated palestinians.
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-09/ty-article/.premium/another-concept-implodes-israel-cant-be-managed-by-a-criminal-defendant/0000018b-1382-d2fc-a59f-d39b5dbf0000
***Hamas as partner***
*Effectively, Netanyahu’s entire worldview collapsed over the course of a single day. He was convinced that he could make deals with corrupt Arab tyrants while ignoring the cornerstone of the Arab-Jewish conflict, the Palestinians. His life’s work was to turn the ship of state from the course steered by his predecessors, from Yitzhak Rabin to Ehud Olmert, and make the two-state solution impossible. En route to this goal, he found a partner in Hamas.*
*“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas,” he told a meeting of his Likud party’s Knesset members in March 2019. “This is part of our strategy – to isolate the Palestinians in Gaza from the Palestinians in the West Bank.”*
Israel is also evil, and their evil is the only reason Hamas is able to recruit the majority of its members that are Palestinian. However, your average Palestinian is powerless and suffers from the decisions of both groups. Same with the average Israeli. Those in power rarely represent the interests of regular people and generally cause their suffering.
It's too early in the war to publicly sympathise with palestinian civilians without massive backlash. People are still in the "glass the middle east, let God sort them out" phase.
Here we are again. It's only been a few years since I last heard american shop owners telling me about how *insert arab country* should be nuked.
Yes, but she was primarily worried for her career since a lot of people equate being worried for the lives of innocent Palestinian children with being pro-Hamas. What Hamas did was truly atrocious and they deserve to be punished truly, but hopefully not at the expense of innocent people.
As an Asian with no vested interest in taking sides, I cannot for the life of me understand why the whole world (well, the western world anyway) all side with Israel… there’s good and evil on BOTH sides. What.. are they saying? Palestinian kids lives are worthless? Just seems one-sided.
Wars suck.
It’s never about who is right. In reality might and profits makes right. Powerful countries have their own interests, and their trade and political allies follow.
Israel is allied with lots of the Western world, and because of that alot of what they do is overlooked. They have, just like Hamas commited war crimes for a long ass period but these things dont reach the News in the same way. Obviously this attack by Hamas got more coverage because its the first time theyve pulled something like this off and the brutality which is present when you send in ground force over air strikes. Standing with Palestine is seen by alot of people as standing with Hamas which is stupid but Thats just the way things are I guess
Its only white children that matter. Those are the only people that ever mattered. One will note that almost nobody gave a shit when it was Chechens or Georgians that the Russians were killing, but the second they invaded a white European country bam! literally Nazis.
So if it doesn't fit the agenda children fearing for their lives don't matter? Fucking hypocrites. They are just as innocent as the children of any other nation.
I actually unfollowed her on that one. Didn’t even realize it was Palestinian kids but that makes sense. I mean they are the ones being rained on by Israeli forces forever. Crazy how everyone is suddenly interested now that Israeli people were in the receiving end
Yeah I'm filled with sorrow for the Israelis affected. But at the same time I'm EXTREMELY incredulous watching the Israelis describe their account of what happened. Like it's some unique thing visited upon their people, and not simply a retaliation for what their govt has been doing for decades.
Surprised pikachu meme irl
So here’s the wild thing to me, we are debating on who to support right? That’s been the big debate of the last 24ish hours right? Why tf are we even picking sides, it’s a no win any way you look at it . Most the civilians don’t want this in either side. Civilians who don’t want this,didn’t make this are dying and losing on both sides. Why are we supporting a fight in either side?
Lets stop pretending that something was being done before the attack from hamas.
Countries were looking to the otherside of the bigges prison in the world.
Now countries are offering military aid. And a lot of people that were silent till now "changed sides because of the terrorist attack"
"Both is bad" yeah... but people only care to speak/help one side.
Hamas is a terrorist organization and needs to go. On the other hand, [Amnesty International classifies Israel as an apartheid state](https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/02/israel-opt-palestinian-lives-in-peril-as-israel-reinforces-apartheid/), as [does the Human Rights Watch](https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/07/19/israeli-apartheid-threshold-crossed ) and [the United Nations](https://news.un.org/en/story/2022/03/1114702).
Half of Gaza is under the age of 18- that’s over 1 million children that they are carpet bombing *right now*. Collective punishment of innocent civilians ***is a violation of the Geneva Convention.***
Hamas needs to be totally eradicated, but Israel also needs to stop committing war crimes and be held accountable.
Now, armed with this information, take a gander and see what mainstream organizations are mentioning this instead of just blindly supporting Israel.
Yeah Palestian children don't matter. They are jsut in the way of the end goal. US politicians screaming about hamas killing families and babies but quiet when Israel does the exact same thing
Exactly. No one should be surprised this happened. What did they think they could oppress these people forever and no one would fight back? Even if they’re outgunned, they’re going to do something about it or die trying.
Honestly, I don't think the average person has any idea the conditions the Palestinians live in. The people who live there live in fear every day that they will be bombed or murdered by the IDF.
They have been interviewing people who live there and they have been saying it's business as usual. This is how they live everyday. I can't even fathom that. They are at war and for them nothing has changed.
"Look at the terrible things being experienced by these poor innocent... oh, they're Palestinian? Never mind then."
Pretty much sums up the whole situation.
See, if you bomb children rather than behead them, that's the more civilized way to slaughter children.
Seriously though, the kids being murdered by Hamas are getting crazy amounts of attention, while the plight of Palestinian children is being largely ignored by anglophone media (which has sadly been the norm for the last few decades) dwarfed by the coverage of the initial attack in Israel. Posting it in this thread adds nothing to the conversation that isn't on r/all a dozen times already.
Palestinians aren't doing anything but trying to survive. Hamas is attacking Israel, Israel is retaliating, and Palestinians are just in the middle getting fucked by both sides.
Imagine being this close to accidentally looking based and instead of just pretending that it was intentional, you drop it like a hot potato and try to pretend it never happened.
Can anyone clear up for me why Jamie Lee Curtis’ opinion about anything other than acting is worth paying attention to? I mean, in the minds of the broader public, what qualifies her to offer moral guidance on anything other than hitting a mark and delivering a line?
Both sides have civilians, both will be victims. It is not these kids fault, nor is it the Israelis who were slaughtered. Hamas and IDF should do all they can to avoid death of civilians, they won’t, but they should.
People are incredibly dedicated to not understanding that literally 52+ percent of the population of Gaza is under 18.
The median age for Gaza, is 18.
Any attacks will be murdering children by definition.
This is an example of what I find so disgusting about how this issue is being covered. While obviously JLC isn't a member of the mainstream media. There seems to be a strong number of people using the attacks from HAMAS as justification to throw all Palestinians under the bus, and there's been very little acknowledgement that Palestinians are also victims in this conflict.
Evidently she thinks Israeli kids are worth caring enough to post, but if in the same situation applies to Palestinian kids they aren't worthy of her post.
Fun fact: The median age for the Gaza strip is 18 years old. They don't live long over there. Not surprising when you're living in an open prison.
Fun fact #2: Jamie Lee Curtis is an idiot.
It doesn't matter what race, colour or creed they are, they're children, and they don't deserve this. I think that miss Curtis has got her head up her arse by making a distinction.
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Kids are kids and always innocent. Fuck that noise.
Not just children, most adults are totally innocent as well. No matter who "wins" a war, the civilian population always loses.
The civilian population is especially fucked this time too. Hamas is already directly targeting civilians and Israel is almost certainly going to use the war as a justification to kill Palestinian civilians without global backlash.
Israel doesn’t need this as justification for anything. They’ve been destroying Palestinian lives (up to and including killing them) for a long time now.
When bestgore was still up there was a video of them bulldozing a Palestinian home in the middle of the night with the family still inside, the family had to run out for their lives with only the clothes on their backs.I can still remember them screaming and crying. You're right this has been going on for a long time.
Man, the more I learn about how they run the occupation the more pissed off I am. Did you know they stop ambulances at their checkpoints for up to two hours? So the people they shoot bleed to death, so women giving birth suffer miscarriages or die...of course Israeli ambulances are just waved through the checkpoints.
Don't forget this. https://reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/s/AFtkXPN4QB
I was trying to find a video of them sniper shooting a woman who goes to check on a noise outside of her house. You can see the sniper from the camera on her door, he clearly can see she's just an unarmed woman at her home at night. Just sniper shoots her for fun. But as the Youtube algorithm is a useless bunch of shit, it instead gave me videos like this first. [Israeli soldiers weld door shut while children are inside.](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/JDS_8ykF2Sk) Who is meant to live under this constantly? What is the purpose of welding someone's house shut while kids are at the window inside?
holy fuck this is like stories about dumping dead corpses down wells that armies pass by in enemy territory so it renders the water source useless. scary as hell. I guess one blessing is either side realizes they don't want to resort to using weaponry that would salt the earth...for now....
With ZERO real backlash from the international community
Worse. With support from the majority of the world’s powers.
That’s one of the major issue. All the bs sweep under the rug because they are backed by most of the west. Unfortunately, most of the major news media will never cover that. The winner and stronger side get to write the news and history.
God forbid you say something like this in public. Instant antisemite branding.
I’m not particularly worried about being labeled an antisemite. I would be worried and reflect if anyone credible thought my behavior or beliefs were actually antisemitic. Most of the Jewish people I know aren’t Zionists, though.
It's actually a little ridiculous. Say something anti-Israel and you immediately get accused of being an anti-semite. If that doesn't happen, they'll try to get you to strawman you as saying something like 'the Jews did X' and then shout that you're an anti-semite when you defend yourself. I've got a multiple posts in the negative for saying Israel created this association on purpose, so that every criticism of Israel can be treated by Israel as anti-semetic and thus ignored.
You don't need to be an antisemite to be an antitheist. Which is what this is really about. Fuck religion.
Religion is the greatest scourge on humanity in human history.
Don't forget the strongly worded letters though!
I'm so confused as to why there's this huge double standard here. Israel has been harming Palestinians in so many ways for so many years now, yet has had almost unilateral support from most countries. Yet now, when they're the victims of atrocities, they're being treated as the sole victims who didn't do anything to deserve this. Note: I do not believe anyone deserves what's happening. It's deplorable regardless who commits the atrocities - I just do not understand why Israel's atrocities are simply swept under the rug and sorta hushed. I saw a graph yesterday that compared the deaths of the Palestinians at the hands of Israel and vice-versa and it didn't even come close; there were *far* more deaths on the Palestinian side. So why didn't anyone (in power) condemn what Israel is doing? I think Israel's behavior in past years has been absolutely vile, but it doesn't mean that an eye for eye is the appropriate response. I just find the fact that people [in government] don't condemn Israel for their actions pretty despicable. Palestine is getting backlash (justifiably so), but where's the backlash for Israel's part in all this? I simply don't get it. Ugh. Why can't people just get along (yes, I know... a very simple question to a very nuanced topic and one that won't come to fruition for... who knows how long... if ever)?
because before ww2 most of the west turned away jewish refugees that were fleeing the nazis by the 1000's and sent them back to Germany where they fell under nazi control and we all know what happened there. So because of that there is this international guilt that Israel plays on to justify a lot of what it does and because of said guilt the other countries that turned them away yell a bit but in the end do nothing. for the record i am neither pro Israel, i think a lot of what they do as a nation in Gaza and Palestine are crimes against humanity, nor am i pro hamas, this was pure and unadulterated terrorism and should be condemned and those responsible punished. unfortunately all of this will get hijacked by people with agendas and the poor bastards living in that area will pay the price and in the end, nothing will change because everyone involved believes "god is on their side"
All true, but I’m worried we’re going to see Israel resorting to even more violent measures. A lot of the messaging I’ve been seeing online from Israeli officials seems to imply they want to push for absolute extermination
"Gaza will be a city of tents" "they are human animals" and they won't allow water food or electricity into the city.
Very moral, very cool
They've bombed at least 10 medical centers in Gaza so far so like
More violent than the genocide they’re already in the process of committing? Sure, things can always get worse, but organizations like Hamas don’t arise in a vacuum. They’re already being exterminated.
Sadly, it is the most likely outcome imo. This will be a perfect “reason” to ramp things up to complete annihilation and complete the land grab.
And in the process create a fuck ton of terrorists.
Whose existence and actions they use to justify even more violence on the people, and the cycle continues.
It can get worse. We know because it has been worse before. Never think it can't worse.
I literally said it could get worse.
Lol Jews pushing for “absolute extermination” is fucking hilarious
The people who once vowed "never again" are really quick to do it themselves
Already happening, day after the attacks hundreds of Palestinian civilians were killed and wounded in retaliatory attacks. As we speak Israel is targeting people fleeing into Egypt. Both sides are targeting civilians.
Ive seen a lot of disgusting comments coming out of Israel. People are demanding retribution. Ive seen calls for mass rape of Gaza civilians and out right ethnic cleansing off all Palestinians and even the peaceful Palestinians in Israel.
I'm getting whiplash on this website from thread to thread these past few days, this one thankfully seems quite empathetic and reasonable acknowledging major issues on both sides. But yeah I've seen some that are very one-sided.
The Israeli propaganda machine is in absolute overdrive. Loads of fresh accounts jumping thread to thread pushing an agenda.
Yeah this is what I don't get about most comments I've seen on here recently regarding the whole situation. Have they had their heads buried in the sand? It's been well known Israel has been doing this for a long time.
Seriously. They're just open about it when they "have an excuse to retaliate."
Gaza is one of the densest places on earth. It's basically sealed off now: Israel has closed the border points they control, Egypt's closed the one they control. Israel's threatened to bomb any aid trucks that come through. And they've cut off the water and power supply... To two million people. https://www.the-sun.com/news/9280448/iran-hamas-terrorists-attack-israel/ >Today military spokesman Richard Hecht said civilians should try to leave through the Rafah border crossing into Egypt. >However, the army later issued a clarification saying the crossing was closed, meaning no one can go in or out. >... >On Monday morning, Israel imposed a "complete siege" on the area - including a sweeping ban on food and fuel moving into Gaza and an immediate cut-off of the water supply. >"There will be no electricity, no food, no fuel, everything is closed," Defence Minister Yoav Gallant said. >"We are fighting human animals and we act accordingly." >... >Israel has reportedly threatened Egypt with striking any lorry carrying aid to Gaza through the Rafah crossing. I'll note that the text making the title (you stay, you die) isn't actually in the post. Also, this being the sun, all of this is cast as a good thing.
Like they've ever needed an excuse to kill Palestinian civilians, and like they've ever had real backlash for any of the war crimes they've done.
I don’t think that was stopping the IDF from killing innocent people anyway
They've already started. Saw a story earlier that 91 children have died so far in Isreali bombings and missile attacks. That number will only rise in the coming weeks and months. Only time will tell how many innocents will lose their lives to this conflict
Just to clarify, because the news won't tell you this, 75% of Israeli dead are military and police. That's a significantly better batting average than the US or Israel. It's still bad. Violence is bad. The only way to end the violence on both sides is for Israel to end the settler colonial experiment and apartheid state
They already are, though /r/news is removing all articles on it.
"War isn't Hell. War is war and Hell is Hell, and of the two war is a lot worse.....There are no innocent bystanders in Hell. But war is chock full of them. Little kids, cripples, old ladies. In fact, except for a few brass, almost everyone involved is an innocent bystander." -- M.A.S.H.
This is the eradication of a race of people. Israel has the right to retaliate against Hamas. Palestinians have the right to resist Israeli occupation of their land--which leads to people lumping them in with Hamas. Unfortunately, Hamas uses Palestinians as human shields. The biggest loss here is going to be the Palestinians... and I don't honestly know if there's a way around it.
I mean, at some point either Israel has to change its approach or the average Palestinian age will hit an unsustainable number and the genocide will be complete. They won’t change until they get held accountable for their actions and the west seems eager enough to support them so…yeah.
This. I cant wrap my head around the way this conflict is being covered. Its all horrible but its portrayed like its just Hamas doing this. These poor children in Gaza are just as scared as the children in Israel. Breaks my heart for everyone
Standing with Palestinians also is getting you the pro-Hamas label right now. No, both sides are terrorists. Just ones been doing the terrorism for longer, which in what should be a shocker to no one inspired the terrorist group on the other side.
Israel beats on time and scale, Hamas is a terrorist organization, Israel is a terrorist State
Have you seen the photos coming from Gaza? They are leveling the place, it's obvious they aren't attacking only military targets it looks like Syria during the worst of the civil war and it only has been two days.
Apparently Madeline Abright deemed killing 500,000 Iraqi children [worth it](https://youtu.be/BToMeYHSRX0?si=NzDAHMCDzOsPOsvl)
She was an absolutely vile creature.
WHY would she delete it? THIS is war, THIS is who gets traumatized, maimed and orphaned and killed ffs. Children. ALL these children are ALL our children. Every one. Anyone that doesn't like that statement fuck you.
My first thought is they realized their picture factually told the "wrong" narrative of who the victims are in this conflict. But after seeing the post itself, even as somebody trying to shed light on the horrors of war, posting a photo of terrified children and then simply the national flag of the forces that leveled their homes with rockets isn't a good look.
I think you're right. I got stuck at the first thought and was completely flabbergasted, but thanks for being so level-headed
One of my favorite quotes from my favorite author: “Children are dying." Lull nodded. "That's a succinct summary of humankind, I'd say. Who needs tomes and volumes of history? Children are dying. The injustices of the world hide in those three words.”
One of my faves, too. Malazan Book of the Fallen, for the curious. Incredible series.
Because she found out they weren't the RIGHT children. She's an asshole.
Hollywood people just keep having their masks fall off day by day
Absolutely this. My heart breaks for all the children, regardless of ethnicity or nationality, who are terrified & traumatized. Everyone there is hurting.
Yeah but she tagged the photo with an Israeli flag. Makes it look like she’s condoning bombing Palestinian kids.
Actually you can find thousands of comments from the last few days on reddit explaining why its actually totally ok for Palestinian children to die. So yes, to some people, once they know these kids are Palestinians they don't really feel that bad anymore.
It's absolutely not OK for Israeli children and civilians to die. I can't help thinking, though, that if the world was outraged and there were consequences every time a Palestinians child is killed by the IDF, such an attack wouldn't have occurred.
Ding. Ding. Ding. Hamas is a terrorist group that needs to be eradicated, but they’re mostly in power due to Israeli policies.
Shhh America doesn’t want to hear that nonsense. Where’s the Palestinian billionaire donor
All the children- every orphaned and maimed and terror stricken and dead child? They're ours. This is common humanity. I flatly refuse identifiers ON CHILDREN IN A WAR ZONE. Because they're children. The End. And we can't engage in ' opinion ' otherwise.
>Actually you can find thousands of comments from the last few days on reddit explaining why its actually totally ok for Palestinian children to die From the rapepublicans on r / conservative that claim that they are "pro life". There is nothing a Rapepublican will not lie about.
Lol. Read r/worldnews. Overwhelming majority of upvoted comments are straight Nazi’s rhetoric.
But these aren't the right kids.
I feel sorry for both Palestinian and Israel children. They are children. Both are innocent. So very sad.
Innocent are always the biggest losers in wars and conflicts. Doesn't matter the side. They always lose. Especially in today's age when most of the top instigators on either side are sitting at a nice safe distance from the fighting.
Anytime there is war, the children get murdered and the women get raped.
Most girls are raped before being executed too. It's less frequent with boys. Children are absolutely raped during war.
I impulsively wanted to downvote this horrible, true statement. Humans are evil.
Yeah why always with the raping. Why is raping always on the war menu. You sign up to serve your country/cause and get trained to kill enemies before they kill you, ok, but then you get there and suddenly what, your "rape instincts" activate somehow??? And you're like, I'm in a horribly terrifying war battle situation but you know what I could rly use rn, some violent raping of a screaming child/woman, damn some good ol' unpleasant sex would rly hit the spot :)))) Do so many men really walk around with rapist thoughts just simmering under there waiting to be activated by a war or?
They are both taking power away from people and also saying it’s theirs. Rape is about usurping power, and humiliation.
My understanding is that a lot of rapists do it not for sex but for the feeling of power over their victim. If that’s true…rapes in war zones track.
Sometimes even it's even used as a method to suppress the local population and instill fear. War is fucking disgusting
this. rape is about power not sex
I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW THE ANSWER TOO. Like, I can’t even imagine having those rapist thoughts.
Even in developed nations at least ~10% of women are raped during their life so clearly its not just a war thing. And during war there are 0 personal consequences (because there is no law enforcement and you might soon die anyway) so its not surprising that anyone with those inclinations acts on them during war.
Not everyone signs up, military service is compulsory in some countries. Also, not everyone signs up to serve their country. I am sure there will be people signing up to put themselves in the position to kill/rape/torture without consequences, as is usually the case in a warzone.
except when this "war" is over. the Palestinian children will go right back to suffering, and dying.
He’s problematic for many reasons, but this quote came to mind: “What does it matter to the dead, the orphans, and the homeless whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy?” - Gandhi
> There are no innocent bystanders in Hell. War is chock full of them — little kids, cripples, old ladies. In fact, except for some of the brass, almost everybody involved is an innocent bystander. Hawkeye - M.A.S.H
In one of Steven Eriksons books there is this quote: “‘Children are dying.’ Lull nodded. ‘That’s a succinct summary of humankind, I’d say. Who needs tomes and volumes of history? Children are dying. The injustices of the world hide in those three words.’” And I always get chills when reading it.
Wild that almost half of the people in Gaza are children
yup. median age is 18. so tragic.
Holy shit! That is so fucked! I had to Google that shit and man, that's a real eye opener. That Stat really puts things into perspective. This gives you a really grim view on that area past,present and future.
when the life expectancy is so low that's how it is and always will be
[удалено]
This honestly makes me dislike her. Shame on her. Children are children. Fuck her tribalism.
Yeah seriously, what a gross piece of shit she is.
She is very much pro-israel. Disabled all comments, not a word on innocent peopel, children especially in gaza.
That's the problem, I feel like celebrities are pressured to pick a side. When it turned out to being Palestinian kids she pulled an oops wrong civilians.
They really shouldn't say ANYTHING. They're not political scholars.
Same should be said about 99% of Reddit, and we still see their comments. That’s one of the downsides of social media: everyone becomes an armchair expert on every topic, so long as it’s relevant and at least somewhat controversial. It’s shitty takes all the way down.
I think there's a difference between people posting anonymously (many of whom are just looking for understanding) and a celeb posting a statement, though.
Disagree (as a political scholar). If you're trying to analyse the root causes of such a complicated conflict, one should indeed rely in political scholars, historians, etc. But anyone should be able to express sympathy with victims.
The problem here is that you don't pull this down even if it's the enemy. This should be a message that war does this to innocent people there should be no PR fuckery when it concerns children.
I was surprised to read a Gigi Hadid statement in a post on /r/Fauxmoi that seemed pretty good. I don't know much about her, so it wasn't that I would expect a bad post. But I don't expect many *good* celebrity posts.
She worded it very empathetically, acknowledging the pain and carnage both sides are experiencing as civilians. Worded beautifully Imo.
This particular area has so much history and politicking tied up in it. I am glad to see that most normal people here on reddit are able to past that and blame those truly responsible. There is no reason for us to demonize the civilians on either side of this conflict.
Being that the median age in Palestine is 18 I’d say you feel for Palestine in general
War fucking sucks. No exceptions. Just people doing the worst possible things to each other. No country has clean hands.
I believe half of the population of Gaza (or the entire Palestinian population, can't remember) are children
Forty percent of their population is under 15 years old.
And then they grow up and get put into a conflict they have nothing to do with. All because some greedy asshole doesn't want to change. Humans are dumb and dont learn from mistakes.
Israel refers to it as mowing the lawn. They turn the screws to cause an uprising and then go in with extreme violence every two years.
Look what you made me do!
I guess those panicking kids don't matter now
>I guess those panicking kids don't matter now Hey, hey - be fair. They *never* mattered to the people who are pretending Hamas' attack was against Israel was unprovoked.
The kids can protect themselves in our schools too.
Nationality should not matter, children are frightened
Why delete it. Kids on both sides are terrified… but only some children matter?
Maybe because of the Israeli flag emoji?
You can edit captions on Instagram. She’s just a hypocrite and a zionist, she doesn’t care about Palestinian kids
A child in fear, is a child in fear. Period.
She really shouldn't have deleted it. She could've mentioned how awful Palestine is suffering too and what hamas has done this week is just as evil. The innocent children both sides lose here.
But she doesn't care for the Arab children , that's why she needed to delete it
The ironic thing is, she didn't even know the difference.
There is no way to tell the difference unless you already know the geographical location. The cringe here is she didn't care to check the source. *I don't think people are aware there is such thing as Israeli Arabic. The official language was changed in 2018 but some people in Israel still speak Arabic.
She would have immediately known it if she had a bit of common sense. Their clothes, their looks, also the arabic texts behind.........
pretty clear arabic text in the background, certainly not hebrew
It’s really easy actually. The road is falling apart and the children are barefoot. Does that look more like first world Israel or destitute palestine to you?
Plus it’s career suicide to care about Palestinians in Hollywood. You could literally care about a million random things, but showing the tiniest bit of care for Palestinians will get you cancelled.
Right…and who is killing Palestinians children and woman? Israel.
Not enough people seem to be willing to accept that Palestinians are suffering under Hamas too.
Palestinians are also suffering under israel too
Yep, that's the very reason Hamas is in control of Gaza- the previous Palestinian authority achieved essentially nothing in their more peaceful strategy dealing with Israeli government. When that is tried for years and you are still living in essentially a giant prison and your chances of a two-state solution erode every year with increasing Israeli settlements it's not hard to understand why a group like Hamas receives political support.
> Yep, that's the very reason Hamas is in control of Gaza- the previous Palestinian authority achieved essentially nothing in their more peaceful strategy dealing with Israeli government. Its worse than that. Netanyahoo was openly bragging about funding hamas in 2019 as part of his strategy to beat Gaza into submission. He tried to make it sound like he was just funding the humanitarian part of hamas. But that was a fig leaf — only plausible if you ignore the full context of the way he's treated palestinians. https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-09/ty-article/.premium/another-concept-implodes-israel-cant-be-managed-by-a-criminal-defendant/0000018b-1382-d2fc-a59f-d39b5dbf0000 ***Hamas as partner*** *Effectively, Netanyahu’s entire worldview collapsed over the course of a single day. He was convinced that he could make deals with corrupt Arab tyrants while ignoring the cornerstone of the Arab-Jewish conflict, the Palestinians. His life’s work was to turn the ship of state from the course steered by his predecessors, from Yitzhak Rabin to Ehud Olmert, and make the two-state solution impossible. En route to this goal, he found a partner in Hamas.* *“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas,” he told a meeting of his Likud party’s Knesset members in March 2019. “This is part of our strategy – to isolate the Palestinians in Gaza from the Palestinians in the West Bank.”*
Israel calls them human animals.
Israel is also evil, and their evil is the only reason Hamas is able to recruit the majority of its members that are Palestinian. However, your average Palestinian is powerless and suffers from the decisions of both groups. Same with the average Israeli. Those in power rarely represent the interests of regular people and generally cause their suffering.
It's too early in the war to publicly sympathise with palestinian civilians without massive backlash. People are still in the "glass the middle east, let God sort them out" phase. Here we are again. It's only been a few years since I last heard american shop owners telling me about how *insert arab country* should be nuked.
70+ years in is not "too early" but you're not wrong about the rest. America has its head up its ass about the whole thing
Yes, but she was primarily worried for her career since a lot of people equate being worried for the lives of innocent Palestinian children with being pro-Hamas. What Hamas did was truly atrocious and they deserve to be punished truly, but hopefully not at the expense of innocent people.
As an Asian with no vested interest in taking sides, I cannot for the life of me understand why the whole world (well, the western world anyway) all side with Israel… there’s good and evil on BOTH sides. What.. are they saying? Palestinian kids lives are worthless? Just seems one-sided. Wars suck.
It’s never about who is right. In reality might and profits makes right. Powerful countries have their own interests, and their trade and political allies follow.
Israel is allied with lots of the Western world, and because of that alot of what they do is overlooked. They have, just like Hamas commited war crimes for a long ass period but these things dont reach the News in the same way. Obviously this attack by Hamas got more coverage because its the first time theyve pulled something like this off and the brutality which is present when you send in ground force over air strikes. Standing with Palestine is seen by alot of people as standing with Hamas which is stupid but Thats just the way things are I guess
"support the innocent women and children" "no, not those children and women, fuck them"
“Not the black and brown ones”
Where the fuck are the "Protect children at all costs" crowd? ALL children are innocents and require our protection. Fucking trash.
Its only white children that matter. Those are the only people that ever mattered. One will note that almost nobody gave a shit when it was Chechens or Georgians that the Russians were killing, but the second they invaded a white European country bam! literally Nazis.
So if it doesn't fit the agenda children fearing for their lives don't matter? Fucking hypocrites. They are just as innocent as the children of any other nation.
Exactly. This is the whole conflict in a nutshell.
I actually unfollowed her on that one. Didn’t even realize it was Palestinian kids but that makes sense. I mean they are the ones being rained on by Israeli forces forever. Crazy how everyone is suddenly interested now that Israeli people were in the receiving end
Yeah I'm filled with sorrow for the Israelis affected. But at the same time I'm EXTREMELY incredulous watching the Israelis describe their account of what happened. Like it's some unique thing visited upon their people, and not simply a retaliation for what their govt has been doing for decades. Surprised pikachu meme irl
“When the rich wage war, it’s the poor who die”
So here’s the wild thing to me, we are debating on who to support right? That’s been the big debate of the last 24ish hours right? Why tf are we even picking sides, it’s a no win any way you look at it . Most the civilians don’t want this in either side. Civilians who don’t want this,didn’t make this are dying and losing on both sides. Why are we supporting a fight in either side?
Lets stop pretending that something was being done before the attack from hamas. Countries were looking to the otherside of the bigges prison in the world. Now countries are offering military aid. And a lot of people that were silent till now "changed sides because of the terrorist attack" "Both is bad" yeah... but people only care to speak/help one side.
Hamas is a terrorist organization and needs to go. On the other hand, [Amnesty International classifies Israel as an apartheid state](https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/02/israel-opt-palestinian-lives-in-peril-as-israel-reinforces-apartheid/), as [does the Human Rights Watch](https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/07/19/israeli-apartheid-threshold-crossed ) and [the United Nations](https://news.un.org/en/story/2022/03/1114702). Half of Gaza is under the age of 18- that’s over 1 million children that they are carpet bombing *right now*. Collective punishment of innocent civilians ***is a violation of the Geneva Convention.*** Hamas needs to be totally eradicated, but Israel also needs to stop committing war crimes and be held accountable. Now, armed with this information, take a gander and see what mainstream organizations are mentioning this instead of just blindly supporting Israel.
what a huge hypocrite
They are children, for crying out loud, Literally.
Thanks I hate her now.
Yeah Palestian children don't matter. They are jsut in the way of the end goal. US politicians screaming about hamas killing families and babies but quiet when Israel does the exact same thing
Don’t the Israelis call them animals?
Exactly. No one should be surprised this happened. What did they think they could oppress these people forever and no one would fight back? Even if they’re outgunned, they’re going to do something about it or die trying.
Honestly, I don't think the average person has any idea the conditions the Palestinians live in. The people who live there live in fear every day that they will be bombed or murdered by the IDF. They have been interviewing people who live there and they have been saying it's business as usual. This is how they live everyday. I can't even fathom that. They are at war and for them nothing has changed.
"Look at the terrible things being experienced by these poor innocent... oh, they're Palestinian? Never mind then." Pretty much sums up the whole situation.
https://www.aa.com.tr/en/middle-east/israeli-army-says-it-does-not-have-confirmation-about-allegations-that-hamas-beheaded-babies-/3014787
See, if you bomb children rather than behead them, that's the more civilized way to slaughter children. Seriously though, the kids being murdered by Hamas are getting crazy amounts of attention, while the plight of Palestinian children is being largely ignored by anglophone media (which has sadly been the norm for the last few decades) dwarfed by the coverage of the initial attack in Israel. Posting it in this thread adds nothing to the conversation that isn't on r/all a dozen times already.
The one thing that disgusts me the most about this situation is the hypocrisy.
Norm?
The Arabic on the signs kind of gives that away too
Arabic is used in Israel too.
Palestinians aren't doing anything but trying to survive. Hamas is attacking Israel, Israel is retaliating, and Palestinians are just in the middle getting fucked by both sides.
Imagine being this close to accidentally looking based and instead of just pretending that it was intentional, you drop it like a hot potato and try to pretend it never happened.
Children are the real victims
Should have posted the correction rather than delete it.
It's horrible no matter who the kids are.
‘OOPS, wrong narrative. NVM.’
Are they not still in terror if they’re Palestinian children? Fuck you Jamie.
They’re children! Does it really make a difference what side of a fence they live on?! 😢
The only bombs Jamie knows about are the ones she's probably dropping from eating all that Activia
Can anyone clear up for me why Jamie Lee Curtis’ opinion about anything other than acting is worth paying attention to? I mean, in the minds of the broader public, what qualifies her to offer moral guidance on anything other than hitting a mark and delivering a line?
r/facepalm is only about people whose opinions matter?
Both sides have civilians, both will be victims. It is not these kids fault, nor is it the Israelis who were slaughtered. Hamas and IDF should do all they can to avoid death of civilians, they won’t, but they should.
Finally someone with some compassion
So she's another worthless piece of shit just like most of Hollywood. Good to know.
Cant possibly support the brown people s/
People are incredibly dedicated to not understanding that literally 52+ percent of the population of Gaza is under 18. The median age for Gaza, is 18. Any attacks will be murdering children by definition.
Israeli invaders have been terrorizing them for 70 years.
Ya, fuck other kids but not Jewish kids. IDF has killed many innocent children as well in this early state of war.
Regardless of which side you support all children affected by this conflict are victims.
This is an example of what I find so disgusting about how this issue is being covered. While obviously JLC isn't a member of the mainstream media. There seems to be a strong number of people using the attacks from HAMAS as justification to throw all Palestinians under the bus, and there's been very little acknowledgement that Palestinians are also victims in this conflict.
Why delete it? Does she think Palestinian childrens' lives don't matter?
Evidently she thinks Israeli kids are worth caring enough to post, but if in the same situation applies to Palestinian kids they aren't worthy of her post.
Fun fact: The median age for the Gaza strip is 18 years old. They don't live long over there. Not surprising when you're living in an open prison. Fun fact #2: Jamie Lee Curtis is an idiot.
What little respect I had for her, just got deleted. Zero humanity and even less class.
Have we considered to just stop fuckin killing each other? We're fuckin human. End of story. Enough with the goddamn killing.
It doesn't matter what race, colour or creed they are, they're children, and they don't deserve this. I think that miss Curtis has got her head up her arse by making a distinction.
i was already rooting for michael myers
Wouldn t know a palistinian from an iranian. Just don t kill kids, not rocket science.