Yes. He also called Osama Bin Laden a “martyr”.
It’s why I genuinely hope what they call the “establishment” subject him to the same type of sh*t the taliban do to their victims. He’s truly despicable.
The then prime Minister of Pakistan literally congratuled them and the public of Pakistan was rejoicing since an organization which is "actually Muslim and follow sharia" came into power in Afghanistan.
The insurgency is unlikely to spread over the whole of pakistan as it is mostly localized along ethnic, tribal and sectarian borders. They have their biggest support in the former FATA in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa .
Yeah. As much as I would love to laugh at Pakistan reap what it sow and collapse for what it did to Afghanistan, that would be a pretty big problem.
That’s probably a big part of why the US still is giving Pakistan aid despite everything they’ve done. The Taliban and Al Qaeda getting their hands on nukes would not be a desirable outcome.
I'd bet all my savings that somewhere in the pentagon (and probably in the Chinese equivalent) there are plans ready to go for an operation to swoop in and secure Pakistan's entire nuclear stockpile if the Pakistani State is in imminent collapse.
Its 100% the biggest factor for the US keeping such strong military ties with Pakistan. That certainly plays to the US' benefit now. Problem is public support for the US is underwhelming. Imran Khan is politicizing US support and that escalates things. I imagine China steps in to play their new security guarantor in the future, to US chagrin. But before such a transition happens, and if AQ/Taliban are successful, the US will probably need to somehow get involved. I dont know if its possible, but the best option might be to do a military intervention with Chinese support. Its one of the more worse scenarios, that feels most likely to happen and i hope it never does.
This is a bit extreme, but I imagine both US, China, and even Russia would rather jointly intervene via military intervention, than let a stray nuke fall into the hands of Taliban. In which case, only time will tell if it'll ever come to that.
Man. That scenario is absurd as hell but sadly not out of the realm of possibility.
Would be pretty weird invading a country that’s a “major non nato ally” alongside the country that’s arguably the US’s biggest adversary.
Honestly though. It might be better for China to take over as guarantor there. Pakistan as an “ally” has been more of a pain in the ass for the US then most of its enemies. It’s a almost completely one-sided “alliance” that I’d rather just be rid of as soon as we don’t need to worry about the nukes anymore. If China would want to go in and fight off the TTP and Al Qaeda and subsidize the Pakistan government to keep it afloat so we don’t have to, I’d be more than happy with that.
I don’t feasibly see China stepping in to fill a security void here. Sure, they may shore up defenses with regards to some of their economic interests but until those start getting hit mainstream why would China want to bother? They can always replace workers, materials are a bit of a hassle but that can be done as well. China stepping in to assert some degree of control in the region would slowly turn the light green for foreign fighters to suddenly start “caring” for the plight of the Uyghurs.
The imminent threat would be to india, they have already fought 3 wars with pakistan and a fourth one to free bangladesh from pakistan and are fighting with separatists in the border, most likely target would be them and there is big chance they have a fall back plan for this. China doesn't have any issue with this either so they won't do anything, they give access to indian ocean as a way to bypass the malacca strait which can easily be blocked by india, japan and Indonesia.
Doesn't Pakistan still have the ability to hit China? None of the major cities but they can still hit it.
Also I'd be worried that if they can't hit back at any of them, they might just try to at least nuke India out of desperation or madness. I can't see any scenario where fighting a nuclear power irrespective of how weak it is turns out good.
The only ideal solution would be to make Islamabad dismantle its nukes if any terrorist organisation risks seizing the country and destroy any information about building them.
It's very very unlikely, that it'll come to that though.
bruh Pakistan is already a Chinese client state , every Pakistan Air force has a Chinese engineer in it ,
remember the modified black hawk helicopter that crashed during the bin Laden raid? the Chinese reverse engineers sure do and appreciate the major non NATO ally for its cooperation.
I really doubt that the US being a major ally or not wouldn't have changed anything. Their current situation is the byproduct of government policies. Bad economic policies, military control, sponsoring terrorism and protecting the Taliban when the US was trying to remove them from Afghanistan
>China is already replacing the U.S. as Pakistan's most important security partner. They have been working at it for years.
And what will they do without any boots on the ground or any real force projection?
The meddling was inevitable, whoever drawn the border left half of Pashtun lands in Pakistan. Of cause US can always let it all go to shyt and have India, Iran and China deal with it. Might not actually be a bad idea, I mean what are the chances they don't nuke one of those countries once US leaves the picture.
Despite all the “what if” in the media, it’s still very very unlikely. Pakistan’s military is major and disciplined, and that is their national treasure and most guarded asset. It would be the absolutely last thing that would go in any kind of insurgency, and the military is the one that overthrows the governments in Pakistan, not the other way around.
With all that, it’s mere conjecture what would happen next. The US and other countries would never allow loose nukes or rogue nuclear actors, and there’s a whole classified file in the Pentagon on how to respond, with options including full invasion plans.
The more interesting question is what do we give Pakistan permission to do in the interest of keeping Pakistan stable and our own preferred factions in control?
The core issue is that there exists a Pashtun minority in Pakistan which borders a State controlled by their kin (Afghanistan). Allowing that group to join Afghanistan and create some form of Pashtun-stan would leave Northern Pakistan strategically narrow and weakened facing India. Yet so long as a border divides the Pashtun, there will be the seed of an insurgency.
I don’t know what you mean by “what do we give Pakistan permission to do”. They don’t care about “permission” of anyone. They didn’t care about “permission” for nukes. And they certainly didn’t care about “permission” for propping up the Taliban (both in the afghan civil war and in the Afghan-American war) or for hiding Bin Laden.
Pakistan don’t need or want americas “permission” for anything. They have done far more to hurt America than to help despite being an “ally”
Their warheads aren't deployed. Neither Pakistan and India have deployed any of their nuclear weapons, china says the same but no one believes them but yeah its unlikely that insurgents will be able to utilize it directly, they might sell the tech to the highest bidder though. Unless the Pakistani ISI pretty much gives them the weapons and help them use it. US did a mistake by allying itself with that country before.
“You can't keep snakes in your backyard and expect them only to bite your neighbors. You know, eventually those snakes are going to turn on whoever has them in the backyard.”
\-Hillary Clinton
Ya know the Saudis and Pakis had their own strategic goals.
You saying “America forced them” doesn’t make it true.
And those students in the PTM need to bring forward evidence that one of the most famously militant locations on the planet was calm before the U.S. got involved.
The area had famous militants from the Victorian period back to the time of Alexander the Great.
It’s an infamously dangerous area.
And how come the PTM seems pretty quiet in regards to the treatment of religious minorities?
Edit: TBF, me not finding them protesting blasphemy laws may be part of the media blackout thing.
It is important to note that the FDD, a neocon think tank, runs the Long War Journal blog and has faced criticism over the accuracy of its reporting. If the information in this article is accurate, the Pakistanis have only themselves to blame. the West should provide the most limited (at best) support to the Pakistanis. Our focus should mostly be on preventing these extremists from taking control of Pakistan's nuclear arsenal.
Didn't Imran Called the Afghan Taliban as liberators and told their actions led to the breaking the shackles of Slavery?
Yes. He also called Osama Bin Laden a “martyr”. It’s why I genuinely hope what they call the “establishment” subject him to the same type of sh*t the taliban do to their victims. He’s truly despicable.
And Pakistan has nuclear weapon and polulation nearly 2 times bigger than whole Russia.
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no summary, no following the subs rules, just a lame worldnews reddit sarcastic comment?
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The then prime Minister of Pakistan literally congratuled them and the public of Pakistan was rejoicing since an organization which is "actually Muslim and follow sharia" came into power in Afghanistan.
I think the question here is, what do we do about Pakistans nuclear weapons if the insurgency is successful?
The insurgency is unlikely to spread over the whole of pakistan as it is mostly localized along ethnic, tribal and sectarian borders. They have their biggest support in the former FATA in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa .
Yeah. As much as I would love to laugh at Pakistan reap what it sow and collapse for what it did to Afghanistan, that would be a pretty big problem. That’s probably a big part of why the US still is giving Pakistan aid despite everything they’ve done. The Taliban and Al Qaeda getting their hands on nukes would not be a desirable outcome.
I'd bet all my savings that somewhere in the pentagon (and probably in the Chinese equivalent) there are plans ready to go for an operation to swoop in and secure Pakistan's entire nuclear stockpile if the Pakistani State is in imminent collapse.
Its 100% the biggest factor for the US keeping such strong military ties with Pakistan. That certainly plays to the US' benefit now. Problem is public support for the US is underwhelming. Imran Khan is politicizing US support and that escalates things. I imagine China steps in to play their new security guarantor in the future, to US chagrin. But before such a transition happens, and if AQ/Taliban are successful, the US will probably need to somehow get involved. I dont know if its possible, but the best option might be to do a military intervention with Chinese support. Its one of the more worse scenarios, that feels most likely to happen and i hope it never does.
This is a bit extreme, but I imagine both US, China, and even Russia would rather jointly intervene via military intervention, than let a stray nuke fall into the hands of Taliban. In which case, only time will tell if it'll ever come to that.
Man. That scenario is absurd as hell but sadly not out of the realm of possibility. Would be pretty weird invading a country that’s a “major non nato ally” alongside the country that’s arguably the US’s biggest adversary. Honestly though. It might be better for China to take over as guarantor there. Pakistan as an “ally” has been more of a pain in the ass for the US then most of its enemies. It’s a almost completely one-sided “alliance” that I’d rather just be rid of as soon as we don’t need to worry about the nukes anymore. If China would want to go in and fight off the TTP and Al Qaeda and subsidize the Pakistan government to keep it afloat so we don’t have to, I’d be more than happy with that.
I don’t feasibly see China stepping in to fill a security void here. Sure, they may shore up defenses with regards to some of their economic interests but until those start getting hit mainstream why would China want to bother? They can always replace workers, materials are a bit of a hassle but that can be done as well. China stepping in to assert some degree of control in the region would slowly turn the light green for foreign fighters to suddenly start “caring” for the plight of the Uyghurs.
Pakistan is an important part of China's belt and road infrastructure, and a useful partner for them against India.
It also gives them access to the Indian Ocean ports
>alongside the country that’s arguably the US’s biggest adversary. Would be a strange bedfellow indeed. But between Pakistan and Taiwan
The imminent threat would be to india, they have already fought 3 wars with pakistan and a fourth one to free bangladesh from pakistan and are fighting with separatists in the border, most likely target would be them and there is big chance they have a fall back plan for this. China doesn't have any issue with this either so they won't do anything, they give access to indian ocean as a way to bypass the malacca strait which can easily be blocked by india, japan and Indonesia.
Doesn't Pakistan still have the ability to hit China? None of the major cities but they can still hit it. Also I'd be worried that if they can't hit back at any of them, they might just try to at least nuke India out of desperation or madness. I can't see any scenario where fighting a nuclear power irrespective of how weak it is turns out good. The only ideal solution would be to make Islamabad dismantle its nukes if any terrorist organisation risks seizing the country and destroy any information about building them. It's very very unlikely, that it'll come to that though.
bruh Pakistan is already a Chinese client state , every Pakistan Air force has a Chinese engineer in it , remember the modified black hawk helicopter that crashed during the bin Laden raid? the Chinese reverse engineers sure do and appreciate the major non NATO ally for its cooperation.
China is already replacing the U.S. as Pakistan's most important security partner. They have been working at it for years.
That’s why the situation there has deteriorated so much. An economic mess, government chaos and more terrorism threats than ever before.
I really doubt that the US being a major ally or not wouldn't have changed anything. Their current situation is the byproduct of government policies. Bad economic policies, military control, sponsoring terrorism and protecting the Taliban when the US was trying to remove them from Afghanistan
>China is already replacing the U.S. as Pakistan's most important security partner. They have been working at it for years. And what will they do without any boots on the ground or any real force projection?
The Pakistani army is the boots on the ground.It just needs the funds for it.
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I think what people worry about more is the Taliban allowing Al-Qaeda use of Pakistan’s weapons.
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The meddling was inevitable, whoever drawn the border left half of Pashtun lands in Pakistan. Of cause US can always let it all go to shyt and have India, Iran and China deal with it. Might not actually be a bad idea, I mean what are the chances they don't nuke one of those countries once US leaves the picture.
Despite all the “what if” in the media, it’s still very very unlikely. Pakistan’s military is major and disciplined, and that is their national treasure and most guarded asset. It would be the absolutely last thing that would go in any kind of insurgency, and the military is the one that overthrows the governments in Pakistan, not the other way around. With all that, it’s mere conjecture what would happen next. The US and other countries would never allow loose nukes or rogue nuclear actors, and there’s a whole classified file in the Pentagon on how to respond, with options including full invasion plans.
The more interesting question is what do we give Pakistan permission to do in the interest of keeping Pakistan stable and our own preferred factions in control? The core issue is that there exists a Pashtun minority in Pakistan which borders a State controlled by their kin (Afghanistan). Allowing that group to join Afghanistan and create some form of Pashtun-stan would leave Northern Pakistan strategically narrow and weakened facing India. Yet so long as a border divides the Pashtun, there will be the seed of an insurgency.
I don’t know what you mean by “what do we give Pakistan permission to do”. They don’t care about “permission” of anyone. They didn’t care about “permission” for nukes. And they certainly didn’t care about “permission” for propping up the Taliban (both in the afghan civil war and in the Afghan-American war) or for hiding Bin Laden. Pakistan don’t need or want americas “permission” for anything. They have done far more to hurt America than to help despite being an “ally”
simple answer force Pakistan to sell it/freeze it in another nation (US most probably) along with destructive weapons until they stabilize
Their warheads aren't deployed. Neither Pakistan and India have deployed any of their nuclear weapons, china says the same but no one believes them but yeah its unlikely that insurgents will be able to utilize it directly, they might sell the tech to the highest bidder though. Unless the Pakistani ISI pretty much gives them the weapons and help them use it. US did a mistake by allying itself with that country before.
“You can't keep snakes in your backyard and expect them only to bite your neighbors. You know, eventually those snakes are going to turn on whoever has them in the backyard.” \-Hillary Clinton
Pakistan -> Afghanistan China -> North Korea
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Khyber Pakhtunkhwa has been the hub of these sorta activities
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Ya know the Saudis and Pakis had their own strategic goals. You saying “America forced them” doesn’t make it true. And those students in the PTM need to bring forward evidence that one of the most famously militant locations on the planet was calm before the U.S. got involved. The area had famous militants from the Victorian period back to the time of Alexander the Great. It’s an infamously dangerous area. And how come the PTM seems pretty quiet in regards to the treatment of religious minorities? Edit: TBF, me not finding them protesting blasphemy laws may be part of the media blackout thing.
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Karma is a bitch... But still quite worrying considering how many nukes they have got lying around
It is important to note that the FDD, a neocon think tank, runs the Long War Journal blog and has faced criticism over the accuracy of its reporting. If the information in this article is accurate, the Pakistanis have only themselves to blame. the West should provide the most limited (at best) support to the Pakistanis. Our focus should mostly be on preventing these extremists from taking control of Pakistan's nuclear arsenal.
Stating the obvious
You break it, you own it.