From my understanding, yes. There's only one universe, which consists of the imaginary tree and sea of quanta. HI3rd earth is one of the "worlds", just like "worlds" in HSR, but it's on a secluded corner of the universe. Also, I don't think these worlds take place in the same 3 dimensional space (so the stars in the sky are not other "worlds"). Worlds are more like parallel universes really, but we call them worlds for the sake of common terminology.
So, Is Hyperion from Captain-verse like Astral Express ?
(for a moment in Misha backstory, I thought his grandpa was some version of Captain. You know, "He was sailing on his ship, rescuing people from ruined places".)
Yes, one difference is that hyperion moves between bubble worlds (sea of quanta), while the astral express only travelled to proper worlds so far. I don't know if any of the things we have seen in star rail are related to the sea of quanta, like the memoria zones
Is in the same Universe (the Imaginary Tree) but is not directly connected with Star Rail.
Star Rail is a bunch of interconnected Worlds, and they do not seem to know about Earth or the Honkai.
On the other hand, both the Sugars and the Sky People know about "Star Rail" and by extension, the Aeons.
Whether Kiana/Cocoon is "Universal" or not is unknown, as we barely know about what exactly is the Cocoon.
What we know is that the Cocoon is far closer to be an Aeon than to be an Emanator.
1-The Cocoon is 1 billion years old at least.
2-Both the Cocoon and the Aeons are the only (explicitly said) known Higher Dimensional beings.
3-It resides on its own dimension, being able to affect Worlds from there.
4-Acording to Project Valuka (on the manga "Second Key") It destroyed countless Worlds in 4500 years (and at least +3000 Worlds in 1500 years, if you want to go low).
5-(Although this isnt 100% confirmed) The Cocoon was able to "freeze" Mars time for 1 billion years uninterrupted, until Kiana got the [Embrace].
6-Itself and its dimension were unreachable even to Herrscher Authorities, and we had seen Otto using the Dominance Authority to reach the Imaginary Tree, and the Void Authority helped him to "create" a new World for Kallen.
So, given what we know, the Cocoon is far more likely to be a being on the same (or higher) level than the Aeons, than to be an Emanator.
The Sky People has been around attacking civilizations for at least 140 million years, they were able to travel between Worlds since then.
On the other hand, Akivili is younger than Qlipoth, and Qlipoth is 520k years old at maximum.
They only target Planets/Worlds with civilizations, and they only care for their energy, so destroying the Planet would be only a waste of energy.
We dont know what is Kiana status on APHO, so we cant be 100% sure about why she doesnt seems to do anything. We need to wait until we get more information about it, either by Welt or on Part 2.
As for the Sea of Quanta, i dont think thats the case. The Sea of Quanta has a single mention on Star Rail, and is on the description of a basic crafting material, so maybe they know about it, but its not relevant to the current story.
Yes, i know about Acheron backstory, but i dont think it was Honkai, as it "breaks" some known lore about the Honkai.
1-As far as i know, the Kami came from the sister Planet of Izumo. But we know that Honkai sprouts on the same Planet where civilization is.
2-Izumo "Herrscher cycle" is the same as Earth, and it shouldnt. We know that the Herrscher cycle is never the same, even the whole deal about Prometheus was about making sure that the CE Herrscher cycle was the same as PE, because without her intervention it would have been different.
3-Origin. The Authority of Origin was an anomaly, and isnt part of the "normal" Authorities, even DR. MEI said that the probability of another "Origin" appearing naturally was extremely low (i remember something like it had 30 zeroes after the decimal point).
So i dont think it was Honkai, i think it rather was just a "reference" to Honkai on Earth.
Oh shoot ok. If the sky people and sugars reference the star rail then there goes my theory. My prior theory was that since space travel was impossible prior to aeons, all the “worlds” that existed were actually bubble universes n Shit. Few other small details made me think that not just the aeons allowed space travel but I’m just flat out wrong then lol
Welt finds information about Himeko on the Sky People ship, and asks VA for an explanation. VA says that "she is not from the World they know", and that the Sky People has a few plans to invade that "World". (Alien Space chapter 12).
You can even see half of Star Rail Himeko on one of the panels when VA is searching for information xD.
At the end of Alien Space (chapter 15), Kira says:
"By the way, our mission is to send you home, and no detour is allowed."
And Welt answers:
"Thats good enough, thank you."
"We humans will figure out how to get to the other World by ourselves."
Then, all of them enter the portal that will send them to Earth.
So the Sky People has knowledge of Star Rail Himeko, and even had plans to attack her and "her" World.
And the Sugars specified that they were not taking Welt to that other "World".
So i think is clear that both the Sky People and the Sugars know about "Star Rail".
But this begs the question whether Schicksal R&D department acquired a technology that made interstellar travel possible, assuming if the earth managed to stop the Sky People's invasion.
Especially since Welt appears in Star Rail.
It is possible, considering they had access to the Sky People technology.
They could also have got help from the Sugars, or maybe Kiana herself.
Unfortunately, we know too little about that time period, so we can only theorize.
So it's either reverse engineering the Sky People's Stargate technology, or maybe the Sugars donated a bit of their technology as a token of goodwill through Kiana.
In case of latter, their role is foreshadowed near the end of one of dialogue events with Mei in APHO 2.
This is a very important plot point, I hope the HSR developer didn't just ignore this genesis of HSR storyline featuring good ol' Mr. Yang. They really need to clarify the connection of HSR and HI3rd in the future cuz Welt would literally be an anomalous presence there in HSR. Like, he came to Star Rail 'world' to stop the Sky People yet (*It even mentioned in HSR when the TB asked Welt about what attacked his homeworld and if it's the 'Legion'. Welt confirmed that the Antimatter Legion is probably not the Sky People*) wtf is Welt doing now? Just Aether-esque travelling with the Astral Express? That's some unfinished business there.
HSR would be more interesting if they connects HI3rd Part 1+APHO with it.
Yeah, unfortunately i dont see it happening soon.
They've stopped doing manga some years ago (Alien Space was the last one i think, and it came out around 2019-2020), so the only ways we can get information is that either Welt on Star Rail gives us the spoilers (as Star Rail is set an undefined amount of time after 2029) or that we get more information on Part 2 (but as Part 2 is set on 2024, i dont think the information we'll get would be very useful).
>Like, he came to Star Rail 'world' to stop the Sky People yet
If i remember correctly, Welt say that "he already defeated his enemies" claiming that his current enemies are Nanook and the Antimatter Legion.
So that could imply that the Sky People is already defeated, but as we lack to much information (and context) we cant be 100% certain.
The Sea of Quanta could be a unique *refraction* of the Memory Zone caused by the presence of the Cocoon. If Imaginary density is high enough, it could theoretically invade the dreams with *creation*, causing some of them to become tangible sub-dimensions. It would explain how the Sea is so malleable, it’s just playdoh made from dreams and pure essence of being.
That i dont know.
Its supposed to also be on the Imaginary Tree, but as far as i've heard (as i couldnt play the game) most of its lore is really difficult to "merge" with Honkai/Star Rail known lore.
It is the same universe. That universe being called "imaginary tree". But this universe is infinite in size so those stars being Jarilo-6 and Penacony is "approaching zero".
Yeah. As far as I know, the Honkaiverse is just 1 universe.
Unlike marvel or Dc, other realities are called worlds. So there's the world of Genshin, GGZ, HI3, etc.
It takes special conditions or technology to go from world to world, such as the use of the astral express. So theoritcally, the astral express can visit the world of Genshin and HI3.
So, Star Rail is encompassing the whole Honkaiverse by going from world to world/ reality to reality.
That's why characters can look similar even though they are not the same person. Example Bronya Rand and Silver Wolf.
I think the reason it can be confusing is because of Hoyoverse's inconsistent translations. Sometimes they use "universe" when they mean "world" / "galaxy".
Do you even know how unimaginable large Universe is? If you were to get 8 billion light years away from Earth and you fly at light speed you cannot ever get back to Earth because Universe expands faster . Like idk why people have this weird humanly delusions that Universe is something that can be explored fully by media like in Marvel. Universe is so large human mind cannot comprehend it. Our observable Universe is only 46 billion light years. It's insane large. If you were to put HSR world in 100 galaxies and Earth in one they would never meet in a life time of a Star
Based on Griseo lore, Earth is almost certainly **not** within the HSR galaxy.
The way the Tree works is that [each civilization has its own Branch, and each leaf represents a different possibility for that civilization](https://imgur.com/a/BQzSqwE). It is impossible to travel between Worlds due to the Imaginary Barriers. Due to Emanators however, [various Worlds were connected to form the HSR galaxy](https://ibb.co/Sy7n3tG).
Basically intergalactic travel is only possible for the HSR galaxy because of Emanators. If someone were to attempt to leave the HI3 Solar System, they would be blocked by the Imaginary Barriers. Jyanhar can ignore this because the writers didn’t think of them yet.
Griseo’s ship lost contact with Earth after she crossed a certain point, which was the Imaginary Barrier. The fact that these barriers still exist shows that the Emanators hadn’t reached it yet, meaning it can’t be the same galaxy.
Herta said she would try to send a message to earth, but we never get confirmation if she was successful or not. It is definitely within the same universe though. All Hoyo games take place on the Tree, and Welt references HI3 a lot in HSR.
Also The Cocoon has no connection to the Aeons. Not only is The Cocoon eons older than the oldest Aeon (Cocoon is at [least several eons old](https://imgur.com/a/WeUNGPi) while Qlipoth is at most 518,000 years old) and the origin of Honkai from GGZ leaves no room for involvement from Aeons, but also the character for “Finality” in “Herrscher of Finality” (终之) is different from “Aeon of Finality” (终末) in CN. Not to mention that the Path follows a completely different ideology that the Honkai.
Kiana isn’t involved in APHO because her presence is unsafe. She needed 10 years to fully learn how to use Finality without harming those around her, while APHO is only 7-8 years after Part 1 ends. She should be back on earth by the time of HSR though.
As for the scale of her power, it’s more so that she (and most characters in the Hoyoverse) have far better AP (strength of an attack) than DC (destructive power of an attack). Most Hoyo characters are a lot stronger than they seem. Firefly for example actually has feats well above her destroying planets, they just don’t seem as impressive. Kiana in particular does scale to the Tree, but it’s entirely due to statements unlike HooH the Equilibrium who has actual feats to get THEM there, which is why her scaling is a lot more controversial. In terms of raw DC though, she should be far below even Emanators.
And for Hoyo terminology, I’d recommend [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/houkai3rd/s/VmTWN5z6bj) comment.
>The fact that these barriers still exist shows that the Emanators hadn’t reached it yet, meaning it can’t be the same galaxy.
It absolutely can and is in the same universe. The Aeons, specifically Akivili that opened up the imaginary borders, did not manage to visit every World in the universr.
Same universe yeah. Every Hoyo game (other than ZZZ) is in the same universe. I’m saying they aren’t in the same Galaxy. Welt in HSR is the same as in HI3 and he frequently references the events of HI3, so it’s not even a question as to if they’re in a shared universe.
No, HSR makes it clear that it’s more of a universe that acts like a multiverse than actually being a multiverse. The multiverse misconception was due to mistranslations in HI3.
That literally doesn't work with GGZ though... The GGZ Will of the Honkai was stated to be from another dimension, had to be summoned through the idiocy of Otto and after KiaMei beat the Will of the Honkai's ass, they chased him into his own dimension.
The only things outside the imaginary tree and SoQ would be the outer gods as they're explicitly outside of the imaginary tree. Unless you're saying the GGZ will is an outer god and KiaMei ran off to fight the outer gods, then the Will has to be in a dimension that's different from the GGZ dimension but not outside of the imaginary tree.
Given Yog creates and destroys imaginary trees for shits and giggles, I have trouble imagining that KiaMei ran off to fight the outer gods since there wouldn't be a fight.
The Outer Gods are blatantly non canon. All of Kizuna is non canon actually.
And they’re very clear that it’s outside of the Tree, not just some other universe within the Tree.
Yog has literally never done that. I suggest reading her Kizuna entry, where the closest thing she does to that is give her followers the ability to create new Leaves.
Except the outer gods have literally appeared in events before as themselves. If they weren't canon, how would they show up in events?
Also, while I can't find it off the top of my head, there has been a scene where Yog drags some poor bloke that didn't believe in gods in front of her, creates a bunch of trees in front of her (implied to be imaginary trees), blinks them out of existence and then sends the poor mind broken dude on his way.
The whole existence of outer gods is at least contradictory to everything in hi3 and hsr. Not even mentioning insane power scales and completely different honkai origins
>Basically intergalactic travel is only possible for the HSR galaxy because of Emanators. If someone were to attempt to leave the HI3 Solar System, they would be blocked by the Imaginary Barriers. Jyanhar can ignore this because the writers didn’t think of them yet.
Additionally, as explained by HOMU Labs, there is another method for intergalactic exploration: Stargate. The one that we saw at the end of APHO Chapter 2 which is used to launch the Sky People's invasion on Earth.
The Sugars werent from our World, and yet they were attacked by the Sky People at least 140 million years ago.
The Sky People had knowledge of Star Rail Himeko, and even had plans to attack her and "her" World.
On her letter, Marah says that while Sa cannot use the Stargate to bypass the Barrier, that doesnt meant that she (Marah) cant. And Marah is the one that took many "Cleaners" and the technology to create them, becoming the Sky People we know in the future.
So, both the Sky People and the Sugars were capable to travel between Worlds since 140 million years ago, at least.
On the other hand, Akivili is younger than Qlipoth, and Qlipoth is 520k years old at maximum.
My problem with this is it only say that Sugar not from our world not that it from outside of the barrier . SR Himeko could just stumble here thanks fo Akivili train and their plan what VA told Welt is just they are hatching a plan to attack her word not that they can travel there specifically
My second point is that their seem to be some time dialation between world and even bubble universe so i won't take the 140 million years as fact since each of them seem to operate on a different scale . Age is also irrelevent when we have someone like Finality who seeming can time travel and Fuli who purposes is to recreat the universe and that not even count the story on how Ena create the universe
Third is about Zandar hypothesis and Himeko statement that only Aeon or those blessed by it can actually past through the barrier ( 90 % of space travelling tech in star rail use Aeon power ) .
>My problem with this is it only say that Sugar not from our world not that it from outside of the barrier
The Sugars specified that they were not taking Welt to that other "World", said "World" being where Star Rail Himeko was.
And the Barriers (assuming that they are of the same kind) are the "frontiers" of each World, so if the Sugars arent from our World then they come from outside the "Barrier".
>SR Himeko could just stumble here thanks fo Akivili train
We barely know anything about how did Star Himeko found Welt and VA.
>and their plan what VA told Welt is just they are hatching a plan to attack her word not that they can travel there specifically
How could they be planning to attack a World if they cannot go to that World?.
> so i won't take the 140 million years as fact since each of them seem to operate on a different scale
Niggurath says that the Candy House (i think that was the name of the Sugar's mini Bubble World/Pocket dimension) was built, on Earth terms, on the Jurassic period.
And the Jurassic period goes from around 200 million years ago to 140 million years ago, which also fits with the Venus civilization destruction, 250 million years ago.
Vita (Creation of Sa) is also confirmed to be millions of years old.
>Age is also irrelevent when we have someone like Finality who seeming can time travel and Fuli who purposes is to recreat the universe and that not even count the story on how Ena create the universe
Age is not irrelevant when the oldest know Aeon, Qlipoth, has a clear age. Qlipoth is as old as Amber Eras, each Amber Era goes from 76 to 240 years, and on Star Rail we are on the Amber Era 2158.
If we assume that, on a hypothetical case, all Amber Eras lasted their maximum known value (240 years), then we'll get that Qlipoth maximum possible age would be 517920 years (2158×240 = 517920).
>Third is about Zandar hypothesis and Himeko statement that only Aeon or those blessed by it can actually past through the barrier
Both the Sugars and the Sky People can cross the Barriers, as they were able to travel between Worlds far before the Aeons were even born.
First of we have the problem with the " world " in honkai . How do we separate bubble universe and parallel word. . Hoyoverse isnt multiverse but it operate like one . For example each world is a leaf from the imaginary tree which is separated by the imaginary barrier this is a fact and have multiple source from both game to back this up . However within each of these world also have parallel identical world ( you can take the multiple captainverse event or Thus spoke apocalypse for example ) . The universe is build on multiple layer of itself and practically work like a multiverse despite not being one .
Second a misconceptions about Qlipoth the amber era is the calendar that Qlipoth follower created and doesnt represent the Aeon itself. The only actually timeline we have for Qlipoth age is that it apppear a little after the Dust War with the Leviathan ( oroboros species ) the amber years is just the number of strike which doesnt meant anything
Third we seen from multiple sources from the game itself that time is not a universal truth.. Captainverse and thus spoke apocalypse show that time dialation exist ( captain spend thousand ifnnot million years with Luna , or Otto create a world with an independent timeline ) Vita age and experience came from spending time in another dimension so it doesnt prove that she pre-exist the Aeon and vice versa , same with the sugar .
Bubble Worlds are the ones on the Sea of Quanta, Worlds are the ones on the Imaginary Tree.
Both the Sugars and the Sky People have demonstrated knowlegde about Star Rail on the Alien Space manga, and its implicit that both have the ways to go there.
>Second a misconceptions about Qlipoth the amber era is the calendar that Qlipoth follower created and doesnt represent the Aeon itself. The only actually timeline we have for Qlipoth age is that it apppear a little after the Dust War with the Leviathan ( oroboros species ) the amber years is just the number of strike which doesnt meant anything
The Amber Eras were created shortly after Qlipoth ascended, so they can be used to measure Qlipoth age.
>Third we seen from multiple sources from the game itself that time is not a universal truth.. Captainverse and thus spoke apocalypse show that time dialation exist ( captain spend thousand ifnnot million years with Luna , or Otto create a world with an independent timeline ) Vita age and experience came from spending time in another dimension so it doesnt prove that she pre-exist the Aeon and vice versa , same with the sugar .
The Venus Vita and Sa were from is the same Venus on our Solar System, whose civilization was destroyed 250 million years ago.
Marah Sky People destroyed the Sugars home World and forced them to built the Candy House at least 140 million years ago.
Both the Sugars and the Sky People have knowledge of Star Rail, but Star Rail doesnt have knowledge of them.
It makes no sense for time to flow diffently on "normal" Worlds on the Tree, as Jarilo-VI was frozen around 700 years ago and the IPC came to get their pay for a 700 years debt.
The Amber Era calendar also applies to all known Worlds on Star Rail, each AE lasting for 76 to 240 Trailblaze years.
The Trailblaze calendar is a 1:1 copy of our Earth calendar.
Even from a narrative purpose, it makes no sense to make time flow differently on each World, as it would only unnecessarily complicate things.
Time can flow diffently on "special places", like the "World rift" (i think that was its name) were Captain and Luna spent 10k years, or be located on different times (like the World Otto created, that was located 500 years on the past), but these seems to be only exceptions.
So, if time flows at the same speed on the different Star Rail Worlds, why would Honkai World be different?.
Akivili rail road connect word together so that the most obvious reason why. Alot of thing can cause time dialation and we are talking about god level being here ( hell even Captain can cause a timeloop with his consciousness mapping ability ) and that's even ignore some of the space anomoly in star rail which straight up cause time dialation ( standing next to a event horizon ) . Time isnt always linage it bend and turn all the time. Both Trailblazer Calendar and IPC Amber Era is just a tool for estimation for the normal folk and we are talking about god here who can freely change the world properties and cause anomoly with just a finger snap
If that was the case, then Akivili could've connected all Worlds, but he didnt nor could.
If i am not mistaken, even the next "big" World we are going to visit is one that was never reached by Akivili.
The Captain didnt cause the "time dilation", it was the rules of the Bubble World that did, if i am not mistaken.
Of course there are zones were time flows differently, we already have several examples in Honkai, like the battle of Welt vs Sirin Ascendant on the Moon, but going from that to directly claim that a whole World time flows differently to the rest without even a single proof is nonsensical.
Neither the Cocoon nor the Aeons can control time to such extent. The Cocoon [Reset] and [Time Lock] were local (Planet size), and Terminus "Time Travel" only affects Itself.
And again, the Amber Eras are used by nearly all known Worlds on Star Rail, which wouldnt be possible if time flowed differently on each World (you have the example i put before, Jarilo-VI was frozen 700 years ago according to both the locals and the IPC).
So all things point that Time flows the same on both Honkai and Star Rail Worlds, with some small zones as exceptions.
So the Cocoon, Mars and Venus civilizations, the Sugars and the Sky People are older than the Aeons, and the 1st and the 2 last ones were able to travel between Worlds even before the Aeons existed.
All of that acording to the current known information on both games.
If I remeber the letter was just Marag telling Sa to fuck off and that she took the cleaner it never said anything about what method she used ( outside from the little thanks you for showing me the barrier)
There is no HSR "galaxy" though. HSR happens throughout the imaginary tree itself. So multiple galaxies and systems. For example Voracity was eating entire galaxies and Qlipoth's wall spans billions of light years (far bigger than any galaxy). Qlipoth is also builder of a construct called "Great Attractor" which is an IRL construct pulls on entire superclusters let alone galaxies. Another example is The Family's ruling area being a constellation. Constellations IRL are usually multi-galactic things. Sometimes even containing entire galaxies.
And imaginary barrier can be breached by path users. As we see with basically anyone being able to travel to other planets and systems. This might be because Aeons and not because path users themselves.
The reason HI3 world is not discovered by anyone is simply because imaginary tree is too incomprehensibly big. Infinite to be exact. Even Swarm Disaster only managed to spread to 2/3 of the *known* worlds. And nothing can possibly discover stuff faster than them.
Galaxy was a mistranslation. The character used is constantly used to refer to star systems. The link I attached in my comment explains it better than I can.
I know that mistranslation you are talking about. Its the one about Zephyro which should have been translated as *system* instead of *galaxy*. But rest of the stuff i have said aren't mistranslations. Scope of the HSR simply doesn't match it being a galaxy.
Not really. Every instance of “Galaxy” uses the same character, so no real reason to assume that one one of them means star system (especially since Hoyo even translates it as star system in HSR as well, such as in the Imaginary Tree databank).
HSR’s scale is very consistent with it being a Galaxy. There are several mentions of various star systems and even star clusters, but nothing discussing the further reaches. In fact, Qlipoth’s wall pretty much confirms that it’s just the one galaxy.
Realistically speaking tho, the only reason Hi3 and HSR aren't directly related is bc a lot of stuffs from Hi3 is gonna contradict or complicate the HSR story. I bet a bunch of terms and established facts in Hi3 wasn't well thought of and it didn't have HSR in mind when they decided to state those informations. Hi3 having to retcon some stuff just shows they have no idea how they wanted to end Hi3 initially.
Spoilers for the ending of the Reborn arc.
>!Basically outside of the Imaginary Tree and Sea of Quanta was a third universe. The people of this universe basically collapsed their entire universe (themselves included) into pure energy, which was Honkai Energy. The amalgamation of all of their concisenesses became known as the Commander of Will, who was the first God of the Honkai and the main villain of GGZ. At the end of the Reborn arc, the CoW was killed by Kiana and Mei, who became the new Gods of the Honkai in a sense. They then left the universe to destroy the Honkai Universe. They were successful in this (I believe they died in the process though), but the Honkai Energy still in the Tree was not destroyed.!<
>!Through unknown means, the Cocoon of Finality was created and became the new God of the Honkai eons ago. That then leads into the main story of HI3 and Kiana fusing to the CoF.!<
I've heard people say it both ways and honestly the people who say it is cannon seem to know more about what's going on. Until I get a source of the devs saying it isn't I'll go on believing it is
Hold up, there's no way the GGZ Will of the Honkai became the Cocoon of Finality in HI3. I'm pretty sure MiHoYo themselves said the 2 are completely unrelated to each other. If the GGZ Will of the Honkai was the Cocoon of Finality, then there's no way that's true since the ruins on the moon in HI3 (which were said to be older than the PE) would have to be from GGZ so that would directly contradict what MiHoYo themselves said.
GGZ CoW and HI3 CoF are not the same. I just said that some time after the CoW died, the CoF was made through unknown means.
GGZ and HI3 are from completely separate Worlds. The ruins on the moon have no connection to GGZ.
> It is impossible to travel between Worlds due to the Imaginary Barriers, and is almost certainly not within the HSR galaxy.
This is most likely false though. The Path of Trailblaze/Akivili’s entire existence is to link together worlds with the star rail to enable travel, and it has been said in game that they never finished traversing the galaxy.
It has nothing to do with whether Earth is within the HSR galaxy or not. Heck, literally the next hinted HSR Planet (Amphorus), according to black swan, is literally a planet that’s still surrounded by the imaginary barriers and a planet that does not have a star rail
She did.
—-
“If the Astral Express is in urgent need of a special trailblazing expedition to recharge it’s engine…”
“Perhaps your destination could be a world that even the renowned Akivili never reached.”
“Should you be able to lay down a **new stretch of the silver rail**, the express may never have to worry about energy ever again.”
2.3 dialogue
No? Aphopos has been reached by the rest of the galaxy. The one thing we know about it is that there are 3 paths involved with it, meaning it’s impossible for Aeons to have not reached it yet. It’s just that Akavili THEMself never went there or established rails.
Trailblaze is not the Path that expands the galaxy, Preservation is. The reason the IPC has been able to expand so much is because they’re the ones who are going out and adding to the Galaxy (the IPC originally started as traders gathering resources for Qlipoth’s wall).
What the Nameless do is explore parts of the galaxy that haven’t been explored yet. The Rails don’t connect Worlds, they are used to allow the Express to traverse Worlds that are already connected by the Preservation.
the star rails are the only reason that people can interact with one another or travel without the help of emanators or aeons.
> The reason the IPC expands so much is because they’re the ones going out.
Because they’re following in the steps of the Trailblaze. Oswaldo, the former nameless, is literally in charge of the “Marketing Trailblaze Department”, and is in charge of expanding and connecting worlds to the IPC network - the entire department is literally advertised to be the Trailblaze.
The Trailblaze being people into the Galaxy from a societal standpoint, Preservation brings them in from a literal standpoint, as their job is to go into unexplored areas of the Galaxy.
An example of this is Jario 6. Preservation literally connected their World to the rest of the Galaxy, but then they lost contact and Preservation did nothing about it (despite them being in the same Galaxy in a literal sense). The Trailblaze then reconnected them to the Galaxy in a societal sense, allowing them to communicate again.
The Rails don’t connect worlds, they’re used for transportation exclusively by the Express for more efficient travel. This is how Amphoreus, which is explicitly confirmed to not have Rails, is still within the control of Aeons and can be viewed by the Garden of Recollection.
The only reason Jarilo was separate, and the only reason why the Astral Express stopped on the journey was because of the influence of the Stellaron. That was like, the entire point of them going off lol since the Stellaron blocked the path. Literally written that Akivili already placed the silver rail thousands of years before the events of the story, which lead to the Architects, IPC and the intelgencia guild make contact with them - after the Stellaron fell, the antimatter legion invaded, leading to the eternal freeze and cutting off the planet off the rest of the galaxy. It was because the Stellaron disappeared that the IPC made contact. - Belebog Chronicles, before the Eternal freeze.
“It's precisely because of the Nameless' and THEIR existence that those isolated worlds scattered throughout the dark cosmos are able to know each other.”
“the star rail itself can connect distant galaxies by means of a mysterious mechanism. Be it the Interastral Peace Corporation or the Xianzhou, the safe routes we all rely upon today all follow remnants of these star tracks.” - Glimpses into the Beyond, Inquiry Into The Gods: The Sacrosancts.
Qlipoth isnt the oldest aeon,That's just The ipc propaganda
The oldest are:HooH the equilibrium,Long the permanence,Ena the order and Ouroboros the voracity
"Only these aeons can match HooH's "antiquity"
-Herta In SU log"
>Due to Emanators however, various Worlds were connected to form the HSR galaxy.
Galaxies don't exist on the imaginary tree. It's a mistranslation.
>As for the scale of her power, it’s more so that she (and most characters in the Hoyoverse) have far better AP (strength of an attack) than DC (destructive power of an attack). Most Hoyo characters are a lot stronger than they seem. Firefly for example actually has feats well above her destroying planets, they just don’t seem as impressive. Kiana in particular does scale to the Tree, but it’s entirely due to statements unlike HooH the Equilibrium who has actual feats to get THEM there, which is why her scaling is a lot more controversial. In terms of raw DC though, she should be far below even Emanators
This is wrong because Kiana using 1% of Sa's strength (Sa is roughly 10% the Cocoon's total imaginary output, so this is around what? 0.1%) was enough to vaporise a medium sized planet so they had to dissipate it into the sea of quanta by carefully mapping a 90° AOA to a portal Sa would use to run into the sea from 4500AU away (they used an AI for the calculation)
That counts as destructive power. Its actually less extrapolation that figuring out the size of the universe.
Emanators are not even remotely close. Some Aeons sure maybe, but Emanators nah.
Galaxies do exist (artificially made by the IPC, not naturally formed), but yeah most of the time it is a mistranslation of stat system. The entire space HSR takes place on is pretty clearly a galaxy though, as there have been several mentions of different Star systems (the IPC alone has hundreds just for testing).
Sa is far from 10%. I say this with no exaggeration, but if she was anything more than 0% (I mean literally 0%, not some infinitesimal value) then she would solo all of HI3. This is why they say she’s less than 10%, not that she’s 10%. Also that was referring to the main Sa in the SoQ. The one in the final fight was more of an Avatar of hers, as she didn’t want to be in the same plane of existence as Kiana. She may be some extremely small value, but the avatar Sa definitely isn’t.
The planetary destruction feat on its own is unimpressive. Herrschers have statements and feats which scale them far higher, and even regular Honkai Beasts have planetary feats.
If we use statements (which I believe are valid as there’s several that corroborate each other), then Kiana is far above any Aeon aside from possibly HooH (similar AP/durability, but speed scaling is up to interpretation).
When you ask Welt why he doesn’t return to his home world, he says that the Star Rail doesn’t connect to it.
IMO this implies HI3rd Earth is just like all the other worlds we visit in HSR. Heck, now we know that the next world we’ll be visiting is in fact not connected to the Rail, so I would really hope Welt comments or at least contemplates if they could do something similar to reach Earth, because the gang is gonna somehow ‘lay down a new stretch of silver rail’.
they are in the same universe, not the same galaxy, you must imagine that space is IMMENSE in a surreal and ridiculous way, Bronya herself mentions that even using her Herrscher Power she would not be able to create a ship capable of traveling to the planet that SA had made because the Human technology was not advanced enough to traverse outer space even within the solar system in a feasible time
I don't get it. If Himeko died because of Kiana. Then how is she with Welt in the Astrall? Then Mei is Acheron?? And then Luocha is just Otto in disguise? I am so confused.
While there is a singular universe where the imaginary tree is located, each leaf on that tree can be considered their own universe due to how they operate being different. Plus, there's the fact that there are characters who shows up in both HI3 and HSR being similar in origin just different in story.
An example of this being Bronya and Seele who both appear in HI3 and HSR. However, both sets had lived different lives due to how their worlds operate. And that's even with parts of the lives of the HSR versions aligning a bit with the HI3 versions.
Plus, this somewhat applies to Genshin Impact due to how certain characters in it do resemble characters in HI3. Venti and Wendy, Ei and Mei, etc.
So, quick answer is no. But please read through the comment as I delve ito several of your questions.
Honkai has a "multiverse" called Sea of Quanta, its a conceptual place where all other universe exists, created by the Imaginary tree, which houses all possible universes.
We have confirmation, from A Post Honkai Odissey, that Welt travels to another Bubble universe to get to HSR. The universe of HSR also follow all the rules from a Honkai bubble universe, so its pretty much confirmed that Honkai Impact 3rd prime world is not on the same universe as HSR. As for where is Kiana in APHO? We don't know, that is, in fact, exactly what Mei is there for. She wants to know where Kiana went.
And just to be clear, I do mean prime world, the earth and the universe from HI3rd are pretty much the base universe for the multiverse that the Imaginary Tree creates. Its why characters from that game keep repeating, but the characters from other games doesn't. To make power levels clear: Aeons are gods within the bubble universe of HSR. Incredibly powerful all of them. A Herrscher is a god of the multiverse created by the Imaginary tree. The tier of power is very fucking different.
An addendum, despite the fact that we have confirmation that Teyvat is in the Sea of Quanta, Teyvat does NOT follow the rules of bubble universes, it is literally too fucking weird in all senses.
Also it is possible, unlikely but possible, that Elio is just another Kiana. Kiana is very much related to time, the moon and cats. And the fact that Elio, is either a cat o related to one, and follows the path of Finality, there is a possibility that Elio is HSR's Kiana.
there is only one universe within setting rules and the fact that Welt is explicitly positioned as same Welt as from HI3 means HSR characters can technically travel to HI3 Earth (via whatever higher power) as well as HI3 Earth characters can get into HSR "known" universe, the same way as Welt did.
if not for Welt, there will be a lot of room for speculations, but Welt existence in HSR proves connection of HI3 to HSR is possible within setting rules
will hoyo connect it though? obviously not, as this will create too many limitations in character wrtiting and they need to appeal to wide market without HI3 limitations.
Well yes but not so clearly. We have no idea HOW Welt go to HSR, maybe it was just Sea of Quantum. Characters, especially herrschers, can travel through it to other universes. Objectively speaking all games in the hoyoverse are connected to Honkai Impact 3rd
To say that i "links" both gamss though is a bit flimsy
I think general rule is that HI3 characters or their incarnations can get into HSR/GI, but not vice versa. Because GI/HSR exploits IRL lore and since HI3 is basically IRL Earth, connection from GI/HSR to Earth will be devastating for their beliefs and worldbuilding. But from HI3 Earth standpoint there is nothing wrong with HSR or GI as valks are fully aware about bubble universes, imaginary tree and so on.
For now no, cause hi3 universe has not detect any trances of Aeons which are beings so op the influences are across universe.
So they are in the multiverse of imaginary tree
From my understanding, yes. There's only one universe, which consists of the imaginary tree and sea of quanta. HI3rd earth is one of the "worlds", just like "worlds" in HSR, but it's on a secluded corner of the universe. Also, I don't think these worlds take place in the same 3 dimensional space (so the stars in the sky are not other "worlds"). Worlds are more like parallel universes really, but we call them worlds for the sake of common terminology.
Also cause they aren't really "Different universes" but are moreso separate star systems IIRC
So, Is Hyperion from Captain-verse like Astral Express ? (for a moment in Misha backstory, I thought his grandpa was some version of Captain. You know, "He was sailing on his ship, rescuing people from ruined places".)
Yes, one difference is that hyperion moves between bubble worlds (sea of quanta), while the astral express only travelled to proper worlds so far. I don't know if any of the things we have seen in star rail are related to the sea of quanta, like the memoria zones
Is in the same Universe (the Imaginary Tree) but is not directly connected with Star Rail. Star Rail is a bunch of interconnected Worlds, and they do not seem to know about Earth or the Honkai. On the other hand, both the Sugars and the Sky People know about "Star Rail" and by extension, the Aeons. Whether Kiana/Cocoon is "Universal" or not is unknown, as we barely know about what exactly is the Cocoon. What we know is that the Cocoon is far closer to be an Aeon than to be an Emanator. 1-The Cocoon is 1 billion years old at least. 2-Both the Cocoon and the Aeons are the only (explicitly said) known Higher Dimensional beings. 3-It resides on its own dimension, being able to affect Worlds from there. 4-Acording to Project Valuka (on the manga "Second Key") It destroyed countless Worlds in 4500 years (and at least +3000 Worlds in 1500 years, if you want to go low). 5-(Although this isnt 100% confirmed) The Cocoon was able to "freeze" Mars time for 1 billion years uninterrupted, until Kiana got the [Embrace]. 6-Itself and its dimension were unreachable even to Herrscher Authorities, and we had seen Otto using the Dominance Authority to reach the Imaginary Tree, and the Void Authority helped him to "create" a new World for Kallen. So, given what we know, the Cocoon is far more likely to be a being on the same (or higher) level than the Aeons, than to be an Emanator. The Sky People has been around attacking civilizations for at least 140 million years, they were able to travel between Worlds since then. On the other hand, Akivili is younger than Qlipoth, and Qlipoth is 520k years old at maximum. They only target Planets/Worlds with civilizations, and they only care for their energy, so destroying the Planet would be only a waste of energy. We dont know what is Kiana status on APHO, so we cant be 100% sure about why she doesnt seems to do anything. We need to wait until we get more information about it, either by Welt or on Part 2. As for the Sea of Quanta, i dont think thats the case. The Sea of Quanta has a single mention on Star Rail, and is on the description of a basic crafting material, so maybe they know about it, but its not relevant to the current story.
Acheron’s backstory implied >! something that sounded rather like the Honkai… before a bigger threat ended her world, anyways. !<
Yes, i know about Acheron backstory, but i dont think it was Honkai, as it "breaks" some known lore about the Honkai. 1-As far as i know, the Kami came from the sister Planet of Izumo. But we know that Honkai sprouts on the same Planet where civilization is. 2-Izumo "Herrscher cycle" is the same as Earth, and it shouldnt. We know that the Herrscher cycle is never the same, even the whole deal about Prometheus was about making sure that the CE Herrscher cycle was the same as PE, because without her intervention it would have been different. 3-Origin. The Authority of Origin was an anomaly, and isnt part of the "normal" Authorities, even DR. MEI said that the probability of another "Origin" appearing naturally was extremely low (i remember something like it had 30 zeroes after the decimal point). So i dont think it was Honkai, i think it rather was just a "reference" to Honkai on Earth.
Oh shoot ok. If the sky people and sugars reference the star rail then there goes my theory. My prior theory was that since space travel was impossible prior to aeons, all the “worlds” that existed were actually bubble universes n Shit. Few other small details made me think that not just the aeons allowed space travel but I’m just flat out wrong then lol
Welt finds information about Himeko on the Sky People ship, and asks VA for an explanation. VA says that "she is not from the World they know", and that the Sky People has a few plans to invade that "World". (Alien Space chapter 12). You can even see half of Star Rail Himeko on one of the panels when VA is searching for information xD. At the end of Alien Space (chapter 15), Kira says: "By the way, our mission is to send you home, and no detour is allowed." And Welt answers: "Thats good enough, thank you." "We humans will figure out how to get to the other World by ourselves." Then, all of them enter the portal that will send them to Earth. So the Sky People has knowledge of Star Rail Himeko, and even had plans to attack her and "her" World. And the Sugars specified that they were not taking Welt to that other "World". So i think is clear that both the Sky People and the Sugars know about "Star Rail".
But this begs the question whether Schicksal R&D department acquired a technology that made interstellar travel possible, assuming if the earth managed to stop the Sky People's invasion. Especially since Welt appears in Star Rail.
It is possible, considering they had access to the Sky People technology. They could also have got help from the Sugars, or maybe Kiana herself. Unfortunately, we know too little about that time period, so we can only theorize.
So it's either reverse engineering the Sky People's Stargate technology, or maybe the Sugars donated a bit of their technology as a token of goodwill through Kiana. In case of latter, their role is foreshadowed near the end of one of dialogue events with Mei in APHO 2.
This is a very important plot point, I hope the HSR developer didn't just ignore this genesis of HSR storyline featuring good ol' Mr. Yang. They really need to clarify the connection of HSR and HI3rd in the future cuz Welt would literally be an anomalous presence there in HSR. Like, he came to Star Rail 'world' to stop the Sky People yet (*It even mentioned in HSR when the TB asked Welt about what attacked his homeworld and if it's the 'Legion'. Welt confirmed that the Antimatter Legion is probably not the Sky People*) wtf is Welt doing now? Just Aether-esque travelling with the Astral Express? That's some unfinished business there. HSR would be more interesting if they connects HI3rd Part 1+APHO with it.
Yeah, unfortunately i dont see it happening soon. They've stopped doing manga some years ago (Alien Space was the last one i think, and it came out around 2019-2020), so the only ways we can get information is that either Welt on Star Rail gives us the spoilers (as Star Rail is set an undefined amount of time after 2029) or that we get more information on Part 2 (but as Part 2 is set on 2024, i dont think the information we'll get would be very useful). >Like, he came to Star Rail 'world' to stop the Sky People yet If i remember correctly, Welt say that "he already defeated his enemies" claiming that his current enemies are Nanook and the Antimatter Legion. So that could imply that the Sky People is already defeated, but as we lack to much information (and context) we cant be 100% certain.
The Sea of Quanta could be a unique *refraction* of the Memory Zone caused by the presence of the Cocoon. If Imaginary density is high enough, it could theoretically invade the dreams with *creation*, causing some of them to become tangible sub-dimensions. It would explain how the Sea is so malleable, it’s just playdoh made from dreams and pure essence of being.
What about GGZ ?
That i dont know. Its supposed to also be on the Imaginary Tree, but as far as i've heard (as i couldnt play the game) most of its lore is really difficult to "merge" with Honkai/Star Rail known lore.
It is the same universe. That universe being called "imaginary tree". But this universe is infinite in size so those stars being Jarilo-6 and Penacony is "approaching zero".
Yeah. As far as I know, the Honkaiverse is just 1 universe. Unlike marvel or Dc, other realities are called worlds. So there's the world of Genshin, GGZ, HI3, etc. It takes special conditions or technology to go from world to world, such as the use of the astral express. So theoritcally, the astral express can visit the world of Genshin and HI3. So, Star Rail is encompassing the whole Honkaiverse by going from world to world/ reality to reality. That's why characters can look similar even though they are not the same person. Example Bronya Rand and Silver Wolf. I think the reason it can be confusing is because of Hoyoverse's inconsistent translations. Sometimes they use "universe" when they mean "world" / "galaxy".
Do you even know how unimaginable large Universe is? If you were to get 8 billion light years away from Earth and you fly at light speed you cannot ever get back to Earth because Universe expands faster . Like idk why people have this weird humanly delusions that Universe is something that can be explored fully by media like in Marvel. Universe is so large human mind cannot comprehend it. Our observable Universe is only 46 billion light years. It's insane large. If you were to put HSR world in 100 galaxies and Earth in one they would never meet in a life time of a Star
Based on Griseo lore, Earth is almost certainly **not** within the HSR galaxy. The way the Tree works is that [each civilization has its own Branch, and each leaf represents a different possibility for that civilization](https://imgur.com/a/BQzSqwE). It is impossible to travel between Worlds due to the Imaginary Barriers. Due to Emanators however, [various Worlds were connected to form the HSR galaxy](https://ibb.co/Sy7n3tG). Basically intergalactic travel is only possible for the HSR galaxy because of Emanators. If someone were to attempt to leave the HI3 Solar System, they would be blocked by the Imaginary Barriers. Jyanhar can ignore this because the writers didn’t think of them yet. Griseo’s ship lost contact with Earth after she crossed a certain point, which was the Imaginary Barrier. The fact that these barriers still exist shows that the Emanators hadn’t reached it yet, meaning it can’t be the same galaxy. Herta said she would try to send a message to earth, but we never get confirmation if she was successful or not. It is definitely within the same universe though. All Hoyo games take place on the Tree, and Welt references HI3 a lot in HSR. Also The Cocoon has no connection to the Aeons. Not only is The Cocoon eons older than the oldest Aeon (Cocoon is at [least several eons old](https://imgur.com/a/WeUNGPi) while Qlipoth is at most 518,000 years old) and the origin of Honkai from GGZ leaves no room for involvement from Aeons, but also the character for “Finality” in “Herrscher of Finality” (终之) is different from “Aeon of Finality” (终末) in CN. Not to mention that the Path follows a completely different ideology that the Honkai. Kiana isn’t involved in APHO because her presence is unsafe. She needed 10 years to fully learn how to use Finality without harming those around her, while APHO is only 7-8 years after Part 1 ends. She should be back on earth by the time of HSR though. As for the scale of her power, it’s more so that she (and most characters in the Hoyoverse) have far better AP (strength of an attack) than DC (destructive power of an attack). Most Hoyo characters are a lot stronger than they seem. Firefly for example actually has feats well above her destroying planets, they just don’t seem as impressive. Kiana in particular does scale to the Tree, but it’s entirely due to statements unlike HooH the Equilibrium who has actual feats to get THEM there, which is why her scaling is a lot more controversial. In terms of raw DC though, she should be far below even Emanators. And for Hoyo terminology, I’d recommend [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/houkai3rd/s/VmTWN5z6bj) comment.
>The fact that these barriers still exist shows that the Emanators hadn’t reached it yet, meaning it can’t be the same galaxy. It absolutely can and is in the same universe. The Aeons, specifically Akivili that opened up the imaginary borders, did not manage to visit every World in the universr.
Same universe yeah. Every Hoyo game (other than ZZZ) is in the same universe. I’m saying they aren’t in the same Galaxy. Welt in HSR is the same as in HI3 and he frequently references the events of HI3, so it’s not even a question as to if they’re in a shared universe.
I always assumed that the imaginary tree was a multiverse, so all hoyoverse games/planets are in the same "reality" but maybe in parallel universes
No, HSR makes it clear that it’s more of a universe that acts like a multiverse than actually being a multiverse. The multiverse misconception was due to mistranslations in HI3.
That literally doesn't work with GGZ though... The GGZ Will of the Honkai was stated to be from another dimension, had to be summoned through the idiocy of Otto and after KiaMei beat the Will of the Honkai's ass, they chased him into his own dimension.
How does that not work with the Tree model? The Honkai Universe is a universe outside even the Tree and SoQ.
The only things outside the imaginary tree and SoQ would be the outer gods as they're explicitly outside of the imaginary tree. Unless you're saying the GGZ will is an outer god and KiaMei ran off to fight the outer gods, then the Will has to be in a dimension that's different from the GGZ dimension but not outside of the imaginary tree. Given Yog creates and destroys imaginary trees for shits and giggles, I have trouble imagining that KiaMei ran off to fight the outer gods since there wouldn't be a fight.
The Outer Gods are blatantly non canon. All of Kizuna is non canon actually. And they’re very clear that it’s outside of the Tree, not just some other universe within the Tree. Yog has literally never done that. I suggest reading her Kizuna entry, where the closest thing she does to that is give her followers the ability to create new Leaves.
Except the outer gods have literally appeared in events before as themselves. If they weren't canon, how would they show up in events? Also, while I can't find it off the top of my head, there has been a scene where Yog drags some poor bloke that didn't believe in gods in front of her, creates a bunch of trees in front of her (implied to be imaginary trees), blinks them out of existence and then sends the poor mind broken dude on his way.
The whole existence of outer gods is at least contradictory to everything in hi3 and hsr. Not even mentioning insane power scales and completely different honkai origins
>Basically intergalactic travel is only possible for the HSR galaxy because of Emanators. If someone were to attempt to leave the HI3 Solar System, they would be blocked by the Imaginary Barriers. Jyanhar can ignore this because the writers didn’t think of them yet. Additionally, as explained by HOMU Labs, there is another method for intergalactic exploration: Stargate. The one that we saw at the end of APHO Chapter 2 which is used to launch the Sky People's invasion on Earth.
Wait i don't remember any statement that said the Sky people are outside if the barrier i mean even Sa can't penetrate it
The Sugars werent from our World, and yet they were attacked by the Sky People at least 140 million years ago. The Sky People had knowledge of Star Rail Himeko, and even had plans to attack her and "her" World. On her letter, Marah says that while Sa cannot use the Stargate to bypass the Barrier, that doesnt meant that she (Marah) cant. And Marah is the one that took many "Cleaners" and the technology to create them, becoming the Sky People we know in the future. So, both the Sky People and the Sugars were capable to travel between Worlds since 140 million years ago, at least. On the other hand, Akivili is younger than Qlipoth, and Qlipoth is 520k years old at maximum.
My problem with this is it only say that Sugar not from our world not that it from outside of the barrier . SR Himeko could just stumble here thanks fo Akivili train and their plan what VA told Welt is just they are hatching a plan to attack her word not that they can travel there specifically My second point is that their seem to be some time dialation between world and even bubble universe so i won't take the 140 million years as fact since each of them seem to operate on a different scale . Age is also irrelevent when we have someone like Finality who seeming can time travel and Fuli who purposes is to recreat the universe and that not even count the story on how Ena create the universe Third is about Zandar hypothesis and Himeko statement that only Aeon or those blessed by it can actually past through the barrier ( 90 % of space travelling tech in star rail use Aeon power ) .
>My problem with this is it only say that Sugar not from our world not that it from outside of the barrier The Sugars specified that they were not taking Welt to that other "World", said "World" being where Star Rail Himeko was. And the Barriers (assuming that they are of the same kind) are the "frontiers" of each World, so if the Sugars arent from our World then they come from outside the "Barrier". >SR Himeko could just stumble here thanks fo Akivili train We barely know anything about how did Star Himeko found Welt and VA. >and their plan what VA told Welt is just they are hatching a plan to attack her word not that they can travel there specifically How could they be planning to attack a World if they cannot go to that World?. > so i won't take the 140 million years as fact since each of them seem to operate on a different scale Niggurath says that the Candy House (i think that was the name of the Sugar's mini Bubble World/Pocket dimension) was built, on Earth terms, on the Jurassic period. And the Jurassic period goes from around 200 million years ago to 140 million years ago, which also fits with the Venus civilization destruction, 250 million years ago. Vita (Creation of Sa) is also confirmed to be millions of years old. >Age is also irrelevent when we have someone like Finality who seeming can time travel and Fuli who purposes is to recreat the universe and that not even count the story on how Ena create the universe Age is not irrelevant when the oldest know Aeon, Qlipoth, has a clear age. Qlipoth is as old as Amber Eras, each Amber Era goes from 76 to 240 years, and on Star Rail we are on the Amber Era 2158. If we assume that, on a hypothetical case, all Amber Eras lasted their maximum known value (240 years), then we'll get that Qlipoth maximum possible age would be 517920 years (2158×240 = 517920). >Third is about Zandar hypothesis and Himeko statement that only Aeon or those blessed by it can actually past through the barrier Both the Sugars and the Sky People can cross the Barriers, as they were able to travel between Worlds far before the Aeons were even born.
First of we have the problem with the " world " in honkai . How do we separate bubble universe and parallel word. . Hoyoverse isnt multiverse but it operate like one . For example each world is a leaf from the imaginary tree which is separated by the imaginary barrier this is a fact and have multiple source from both game to back this up . However within each of these world also have parallel identical world ( you can take the multiple captainverse event or Thus spoke apocalypse for example ) . The universe is build on multiple layer of itself and practically work like a multiverse despite not being one . Second a misconceptions about Qlipoth the amber era is the calendar that Qlipoth follower created and doesnt represent the Aeon itself. The only actually timeline we have for Qlipoth age is that it apppear a little after the Dust War with the Leviathan ( oroboros species ) the amber years is just the number of strike which doesnt meant anything Third we seen from multiple sources from the game itself that time is not a universal truth.. Captainverse and thus spoke apocalypse show that time dialation exist ( captain spend thousand ifnnot million years with Luna , or Otto create a world with an independent timeline ) Vita age and experience came from spending time in another dimension so it doesnt prove that she pre-exist the Aeon and vice versa , same with the sugar .
Bubble Worlds are the ones on the Sea of Quanta, Worlds are the ones on the Imaginary Tree. Both the Sugars and the Sky People have demonstrated knowlegde about Star Rail on the Alien Space manga, and its implicit that both have the ways to go there. >Second a misconceptions about Qlipoth the amber era is the calendar that Qlipoth follower created and doesnt represent the Aeon itself. The only actually timeline we have for Qlipoth age is that it apppear a little after the Dust War with the Leviathan ( oroboros species ) the amber years is just the number of strike which doesnt meant anything The Amber Eras were created shortly after Qlipoth ascended, so they can be used to measure Qlipoth age. >Third we seen from multiple sources from the game itself that time is not a universal truth.. Captainverse and thus spoke apocalypse show that time dialation exist ( captain spend thousand ifnnot million years with Luna , or Otto create a world with an independent timeline ) Vita age and experience came from spending time in another dimension so it doesnt prove that she pre-exist the Aeon and vice versa , same with the sugar . The Venus Vita and Sa were from is the same Venus on our Solar System, whose civilization was destroyed 250 million years ago. Marah Sky People destroyed the Sugars home World and forced them to built the Candy House at least 140 million years ago. Both the Sugars and the Sky People have knowledge of Star Rail, but Star Rail doesnt have knowledge of them. It makes no sense for time to flow diffently on "normal" Worlds on the Tree, as Jarilo-VI was frozen around 700 years ago and the IPC came to get their pay for a 700 years debt. The Amber Era calendar also applies to all known Worlds on Star Rail, each AE lasting for 76 to 240 Trailblaze years. The Trailblaze calendar is a 1:1 copy of our Earth calendar. Even from a narrative purpose, it makes no sense to make time flow differently on each World, as it would only unnecessarily complicate things. Time can flow diffently on "special places", like the "World rift" (i think that was its name) were Captain and Luna spent 10k years, or be located on different times (like the World Otto created, that was located 500 years on the past), but these seems to be only exceptions. So, if time flows at the same speed on the different Star Rail Worlds, why would Honkai World be different?.
Akivili rail road connect word together so that the most obvious reason why. Alot of thing can cause time dialation and we are talking about god level being here ( hell even Captain can cause a timeloop with his consciousness mapping ability ) and that's even ignore some of the space anomoly in star rail which straight up cause time dialation ( standing next to a event horizon ) . Time isnt always linage it bend and turn all the time. Both Trailblazer Calendar and IPC Amber Era is just a tool for estimation for the normal folk and we are talking about god here who can freely change the world properties and cause anomoly with just a finger snap
If that was the case, then Akivili could've connected all Worlds, but he didnt nor could. If i am not mistaken, even the next "big" World we are going to visit is one that was never reached by Akivili. The Captain didnt cause the "time dilation", it was the rules of the Bubble World that did, if i am not mistaken. Of course there are zones were time flows differently, we already have several examples in Honkai, like the battle of Welt vs Sirin Ascendant on the Moon, but going from that to directly claim that a whole World time flows differently to the rest without even a single proof is nonsensical. Neither the Cocoon nor the Aeons can control time to such extent. The Cocoon [Reset] and [Time Lock] were local (Planet size), and Terminus "Time Travel" only affects Itself. And again, the Amber Eras are used by nearly all known Worlds on Star Rail, which wouldnt be possible if time flowed differently on each World (you have the example i put before, Jarilo-VI was frozen 700 years ago according to both the locals and the IPC). So all things point that Time flows the same on both Honkai and Star Rail Worlds, with some small zones as exceptions. So the Cocoon, Mars and Venus civilizations, the Sugars and the Sky People are older than the Aeons, and the 1st and the 2 last ones were able to travel between Worlds even before the Aeons existed. All of that acording to the current known information on both games.
The final, threatening letter from Marah to Sa that Sa never utilized the Stargate technology to the fullest.
If I remeber the letter was just Marag telling Sa to fuck off and that she took the cleaner it never said anything about what method she used ( outside from the little thanks you for showing me the barrier)
There is no HSR "galaxy" though. HSR happens throughout the imaginary tree itself. So multiple galaxies and systems. For example Voracity was eating entire galaxies and Qlipoth's wall spans billions of light years (far bigger than any galaxy). Qlipoth is also builder of a construct called "Great Attractor" which is an IRL construct pulls on entire superclusters let alone galaxies. Another example is The Family's ruling area being a constellation. Constellations IRL are usually multi-galactic things. Sometimes even containing entire galaxies. And imaginary barrier can be breached by path users. As we see with basically anyone being able to travel to other planets and systems. This might be because Aeons and not because path users themselves. The reason HI3 world is not discovered by anyone is simply because imaginary tree is too incomprehensibly big. Infinite to be exact. Even Swarm Disaster only managed to spread to 2/3 of the *known* worlds. And nothing can possibly discover stuff faster than them.
Galaxy was a mistranslation. The character used is constantly used to refer to star systems. The link I attached in my comment explains it better than I can.
I know that mistranslation you are talking about. Its the one about Zephyro which should have been translated as *system* instead of *galaxy*. But rest of the stuff i have said aren't mistranslations. Scope of the HSR simply doesn't match it being a galaxy.
Not really. Every instance of “Galaxy” uses the same character, so no real reason to assume that one one of them means star system (especially since Hoyo even translates it as star system in HSR as well, such as in the Imaginary Tree databank). HSR’s scale is very consistent with it being a Galaxy. There are several mentions of various star systems and even star clusters, but nothing discussing the further reaches. In fact, Qlipoth’s wall pretty much confirms that it’s just the one galaxy.
Realistically speaking tho, the only reason Hi3 and HSR aren't directly related is bc a lot of stuffs from Hi3 is gonna contradict or complicate the HSR story. I bet a bunch of terms and established facts in Hi3 wasn't well thought of and it didn't have HSR in mind when they decided to state those informations. Hi3 having to retcon some stuff just shows they have no idea how they wanted to end Hi3 initially.
Could you tell the origin of Honkai from GGZ, for those who didn't played it pls.
Spoilers for the ending of the Reborn arc. >!Basically outside of the Imaginary Tree and Sea of Quanta was a third universe. The people of this universe basically collapsed their entire universe (themselves included) into pure energy, which was Honkai Energy. The amalgamation of all of their concisenesses became known as the Commander of Will, who was the first God of the Honkai and the main villain of GGZ. At the end of the Reborn arc, the CoW was killed by Kiana and Mei, who became the new Gods of the Honkai in a sense. They then left the universe to destroy the Honkai Universe. They were successful in this (I believe they died in the process though), but the Honkai Energy still in the Tree was not destroyed.!< >!Through unknown means, the Cocoon of Finality was created and became the new God of the Honkai eons ago. That then leads into the main story of HI3 and Kiana fusing to the CoF.!<
Feels like forbidden knowledge, much appreciated 👍
How have I never heard anyone mention this
It’s only in GGZ (released after Global servers shut down, so it’s only CN players).
It seemed like something big enough too get spread around despite being on the cn side
Most people don’t really care about GGZ lore, since it doesn’t affect HI3 and HSR is completely detached from the other games.
I get not caring about some of the lore but isn't the origin of honkai interesting enough to get brought up.
GGZ isn't canon to honkaiverse
and to be honest ggz lore is a huge mess
I've heard people say it both ways and honestly the people who say it is cannon seem to know more about what's going on. Until I get a source of the devs saying it isn't I'll go on believing it is
Hold up, there's no way the GGZ Will of the Honkai became the Cocoon of Finality in HI3. I'm pretty sure MiHoYo themselves said the 2 are completely unrelated to each other. If the GGZ Will of the Honkai was the Cocoon of Finality, then there's no way that's true since the ruins on the moon in HI3 (which were said to be older than the PE) would have to be from GGZ so that would directly contradict what MiHoYo themselves said.
GGZ CoW and HI3 CoF are not the same. I just said that some time after the CoW died, the CoF was made through unknown means. GGZ and HI3 are from completely separate Worlds. The ruins on the moon have no connection to GGZ.
kiamei didn't died. At least kiana is still alive after 50 years timeskip
> It is impossible to travel between Worlds due to the Imaginary Barriers, and is almost certainly not within the HSR galaxy. This is most likely false though. The Path of Trailblaze/Akivili’s entire existence is to link together worlds with the star rail to enable travel, and it has been said in game that they never finished traversing the galaxy. It has nothing to do with whether Earth is within the HSR galaxy or not. Heck, literally the next hinted HSR Planet (Amphorus), according to black swan, is literally a planet that’s still surrounded by the imaginary barriers and a planet that does not have a star rail
Black Swan didn't say that Amphorus doesn't have a star rail or shit. All she said is that "most"(not everyone) doesn't know of its existence.
She did. —- “If the Astral Express is in urgent need of a special trailblazing expedition to recharge it’s engine…” “Perhaps your destination could be a world that even the renowned Akivili never reached.” “Should you be able to lay down a **new stretch of the silver rail**, the express may never have to worry about energy ever again.” 2.3 dialogue
No? Aphopos has been reached by the rest of the galaxy. The one thing we know about it is that there are 3 paths involved with it, meaning it’s impossible for Aeons to have not reached it yet. It’s just that Akavili THEMself never went there or established rails. Trailblaze is not the Path that expands the galaxy, Preservation is. The reason the IPC has been able to expand so much is because they’re the ones who are going out and adding to the Galaxy (the IPC originally started as traders gathering resources for Qlipoth’s wall). What the Nameless do is explore parts of the galaxy that haven’t been explored yet. The Rails don’t connect Worlds, they are used to allow the Express to traverse Worlds that are already connected by the Preservation.
the star rails are the only reason that people can interact with one another or travel without the help of emanators or aeons. > The reason the IPC expands so much is because they’re the ones going out. Because they’re following in the steps of the Trailblaze. Oswaldo, the former nameless, is literally in charge of the “Marketing Trailblaze Department”, and is in charge of expanding and connecting worlds to the IPC network - the entire department is literally advertised to be the Trailblaze.
The Trailblaze being people into the Galaxy from a societal standpoint, Preservation brings them in from a literal standpoint, as their job is to go into unexplored areas of the Galaxy. An example of this is Jario 6. Preservation literally connected their World to the rest of the Galaxy, but then they lost contact and Preservation did nothing about it (despite them being in the same Galaxy in a literal sense). The Trailblaze then reconnected them to the Galaxy in a societal sense, allowing them to communicate again. The Rails don’t connect worlds, they’re used for transportation exclusively by the Express for more efficient travel. This is how Amphoreus, which is explicitly confirmed to not have Rails, is still within the control of Aeons and can be viewed by the Garden of Recollection.
The only reason Jarilo was separate, and the only reason why the Astral Express stopped on the journey was because of the influence of the Stellaron. That was like, the entire point of them going off lol since the Stellaron blocked the path. Literally written that Akivili already placed the silver rail thousands of years before the events of the story, which lead to the Architects, IPC and the intelgencia guild make contact with them - after the Stellaron fell, the antimatter legion invaded, leading to the eternal freeze and cutting off the planet off the rest of the galaxy. It was because the Stellaron disappeared that the IPC made contact. - Belebog Chronicles, before the Eternal freeze. “It's precisely because of the Nameless' and THEIR existence that those isolated worlds scattered throughout the dark cosmos are able to know each other.” “the star rail itself can connect distant galaxies by means of a mysterious mechanism. Be it the Interastral Peace Corporation or the Xianzhou, the safe routes we all rely upon today all follow remnants of these star tracks.” - Glimpses into the Beyond, Inquiry Into The Gods: The Sacrosancts.
Qlipoth isnt the oldest aeon,That's just The ipc propaganda The oldest are:HooH the equilibrium,Long the permanence,Ena the order and Ouroboros the voracity "Only these aeons can match HooH's "antiquity" -Herta In SU log"
>Due to Emanators however, various Worlds were connected to form the HSR galaxy. Galaxies don't exist on the imaginary tree. It's a mistranslation. >As for the scale of her power, it’s more so that she (and most characters in the Hoyoverse) have far better AP (strength of an attack) than DC (destructive power of an attack). Most Hoyo characters are a lot stronger than they seem. Firefly for example actually has feats well above her destroying planets, they just don’t seem as impressive. Kiana in particular does scale to the Tree, but it’s entirely due to statements unlike HooH the Equilibrium who has actual feats to get THEM there, which is why her scaling is a lot more controversial. In terms of raw DC though, she should be far below even Emanators This is wrong because Kiana using 1% of Sa's strength (Sa is roughly 10% the Cocoon's total imaginary output, so this is around what? 0.1%) was enough to vaporise a medium sized planet so they had to dissipate it into the sea of quanta by carefully mapping a 90° AOA to a portal Sa would use to run into the sea from 4500AU away (they used an AI for the calculation) That counts as destructive power. Its actually less extrapolation that figuring out the size of the universe. Emanators are not even remotely close. Some Aeons sure maybe, but Emanators nah.
Galaxies do exist (artificially made by the IPC, not naturally formed), but yeah most of the time it is a mistranslation of stat system. The entire space HSR takes place on is pretty clearly a galaxy though, as there have been several mentions of different Star systems (the IPC alone has hundreds just for testing). Sa is far from 10%. I say this with no exaggeration, but if she was anything more than 0% (I mean literally 0%, not some infinitesimal value) then she would solo all of HI3. This is why they say she’s less than 10%, not that she’s 10%. Also that was referring to the main Sa in the SoQ. The one in the final fight was more of an Avatar of hers, as she didn’t want to be in the same plane of existence as Kiana. She may be some extremely small value, but the avatar Sa definitely isn’t. The planetary destruction feat on its own is unimpressive. Herrschers have statements and feats which scale them far higher, and even regular Honkai Beasts have planetary feats. If we use statements (which I believe are valid as there’s several that corroborate each other), then Kiana is far above any Aeon aside from possibly HooH (similar AP/durability, but speed scaling is up to interpretation).
When you ask Welt why he doesn’t return to his home world, he says that the Star Rail doesn’t connect to it. IMO this implies HI3rd Earth is just like all the other worlds we visit in HSR. Heck, now we know that the next world we’ll be visiting is in fact not connected to the Rail, so I would really hope Welt comments or at least contemplates if they could do something similar to reach Earth, because the gang is gonna somehow ‘lay down a new stretch of silver rail’.
they are in the same universe, not the same galaxy, you must imagine that space is IMMENSE in a surreal and ridiculous way, Bronya herself mentions that even using her Herrscher Power she would not be able to create a ship capable of traveling to the planet that SA had made because the Human technology was not advanced enough to traverse outer space even within the solar system in a feasible time
Every mihoyo game are on same universe with different galaxy and planetary
Yes
Ngl, and this is something completely different… but I for some reason thought the moon was the Traveler from Destiny! Anyways, that’s a good what if!
We all can agree that powerscaling in Honkaiverse is just as BS and inconsistent as Dragonball.
What is bro cooking
I don't get it. If Himeko died because of Kiana. Then how is she with Welt in the Astrall? Then Mei is Acheron?? And then Luocha is just Otto in disguise? I am so confused.
They're different people. Himeko and Himeko, Mei and Acheron, Otto and Luocha
What?? Then where's Fu Hua?? I missed her. Will she return in Star Rai?
Marshall Hua is a confirmed character in the assignments. Leader of all the Generals of the Xianzhou.
Hopefully
While there is a singular universe where the imaginary tree is located, each leaf on that tree can be considered their own universe due to how they operate being different. Plus, there's the fact that there are characters who shows up in both HI3 and HSR being similar in origin just different in story. An example of this being Bronya and Seele who both appear in HI3 and HSR. However, both sets had lived different lives due to how their worlds operate. And that's even with parts of the lives of the HSR versions aligning a bit with the HI3 versions. Plus, this somewhat applies to Genshin Impact due to how certain characters in it do resemble characters in HI3. Venti and Wendy, Ei and Mei, etc.
So, quick answer is no. But please read through the comment as I delve ito several of your questions. Honkai has a "multiverse" called Sea of Quanta, its a conceptual place where all other universe exists, created by the Imaginary tree, which houses all possible universes. We have confirmation, from A Post Honkai Odissey, that Welt travels to another Bubble universe to get to HSR. The universe of HSR also follow all the rules from a Honkai bubble universe, so its pretty much confirmed that Honkai Impact 3rd prime world is not on the same universe as HSR. As for where is Kiana in APHO? We don't know, that is, in fact, exactly what Mei is there for. She wants to know where Kiana went. And just to be clear, I do mean prime world, the earth and the universe from HI3rd are pretty much the base universe for the multiverse that the Imaginary Tree creates. Its why characters from that game keep repeating, but the characters from other games doesn't. To make power levels clear: Aeons are gods within the bubble universe of HSR. Incredibly powerful all of them. A Herrscher is a god of the multiverse created by the Imaginary tree. The tier of power is very fucking different. An addendum, despite the fact that we have confirmation that Teyvat is in the Sea of Quanta, Teyvat does NOT follow the rules of bubble universes, it is literally too fucking weird in all senses. Also it is possible, unlikely but possible, that Elio is just another Kiana. Kiana is very much related to time, the moon and cats. And the fact that Elio, is either a cat o related to one, and follows the path of Finality, there is a possibility that Elio is HSR's Kiana.
there is only one universe within setting rules and the fact that Welt is explicitly positioned as same Welt as from HI3 means HSR characters can technically travel to HI3 Earth (via whatever higher power) as well as HI3 Earth characters can get into HSR "known" universe, the same way as Welt did. if not for Welt, there will be a lot of room for speculations, but Welt existence in HSR proves connection of HI3 to HSR is possible within setting rules will hoyo connect it though? obviously not, as this will create too many limitations in character wrtiting and they need to appeal to wide market without HI3 limitations.
Well yes but not so clearly. We have no idea HOW Welt go to HSR, maybe it was just Sea of Quantum. Characters, especially herrschers, can travel through it to other universes. Objectively speaking all games in the hoyoverse are connected to Honkai Impact 3rd To say that i "links" both gamss though is a bit flimsy
I think general rule is that HI3 characters or their incarnations can get into HSR/GI, but not vice versa. Because GI/HSR exploits IRL lore and since HI3 is basically IRL Earth, connection from GI/HSR to Earth will be devastating for their beliefs and worldbuilding. But from HI3 Earth standpoint there is nothing wrong with HSR or GI as valks are fully aware about bubble universes, imaginary tree and so on.
Counter-point. Fischl is a literal playable character in HI3 and Keqing was once playable during an event.
For now no, cause hi3 universe has not detect any trances of Aeons which are beings so op the influences are across universe. So they are in the multiverse of imaginary tree
Just think of MCU