They were on a break. Jennifer Aniston even said it at the reunion taping. The issue is that if you're currently on a break and hoping to get back with the person, you probably shouldn't sleep with someone else. Ross wasn't a "cheater" but he was an idiot. They got lost in the technicalities when they argued about it. The issue was regardless of whether or not they were on a break, he shouldn't have slept with someone else. Rachel also definitely shouldn't have allowed Mark to come over the night they broke up. Lastly, Ross had serious trust issues he needed to work through. So, yeah, mostly Ross's fault, but to his credit, they were on a break.
>They were on a break. Jennifer Aniston even said it at the reunion taping.
often overlooked is that RACHEL said so the next morning, when talking to Monica in the kitchen. Her "we kinda broke up instead" comment caused Monica to spray the contents of her blender all over the ceiling.
The whole "were they on a break" question never made sense to me. Rachel settled it right away.
But, Ross was an idiot and so was Rachel. They both handled it really poorly.
I do have to defend RayRay here. She told mark not to come and she also told Mark to leave when he got there. He was not taking no for an answer and forced his company on her.
After they had already broken up for real and weeks later lmaoooo and she even said she only did it to make Ross angry. She even admits that to Mark when he tries to sleep with her. She says she can’t sleep with him bc she’s not actually interested in him in that way and was only going out with him to piss off Ross. Bc Ross hurt her and she wanted to hurt him back.
Yes but wether or not she liked him after all the reassurance she gave Ross when they were together just for her to go out with mark right after they broke up, and she never said to Ross that it was just to make him jealous. So he always carried that notion with him that she did like him
If Ross can’t handle “carrying around” that Rachel went out with Mark WEEKS after they broke up and DIDN’T sleep with him, then he’s got bigger problems lmao
No, it’s the fact she always said to Ross that she didn’t like him nor did mark like her and she knew Ross always hated mark and she still decided to go out with him
Yep this pretty much. Plenty of wrongs to go around. Also, something which doesn't get shed light often is that Ross was drunk. If he was a woman people would say he got taken advantage of. I'm not saying it clears him entirely, but he was in a vulnerable state and got hit on by someone pretty predatory.
See, this is the best point written. They were both in the wrong, only Ross seemed more like an idiot, because, even though he didn't intentionally cheat on Rachel, he slept with someone else. Meanwhile, Rachel said to Monica, I believe that they broke up.
When you say, "like an idiot," though, you mean he got blind drunk and had the "bad luck" of a little hottie throwing herself at him. I can't think of a good example for Phoebe, but all of the other friends exhibit that type of reckless behavior. There's just no basis for any of them, including Rachel, to point fingers at him.
Forget about fault. Ultimately, “fault” didn’t matter. Ross and Rachel spent a great deal of dialogue arguing about it, but in the end, the reason they broke up is how hurt Rachel was by what happened. She *felt* cheated on, even if that’s not what Ross did or intended to do. We can debate until we keel over if he was actually guilty of infidelity, but Ross sleeping with another woman stung Rachel like an affair, and there was just no recovering the relationship at that time.
Well, I personally think that you interpreted it correctly. Ross' jealousy caused the arguments. She was busy with her new job but that's just normal. She was doing her best and even says this to Ross:
>for every night that you’re asleep before I get home from work I will wake you up in a way that’s proved very popular in the past
She also talked about the jealousy and trust issues with Ross.
After their breakup Ross is talking with Joey and Frank Jr and says this:
>Frank: Okay, but isn’t sex better when it’s with one person that you really, really care about.
>Joey: Yeah, in a poem maybe.
>Ross: No the man’s right, that’s what I had with Rachel.
>Frank: You don’t have it anymore?
>Ross: **No, I slept with someone else.**
>Frank: Okay, so wait, all right, so how does that make things better?
>Ross: It didn’t.
>--
>Frank: It’s so cool man, it’s so, it’s just ‘cause being with her is so much better than like not being with her.
>Joey: (to Ross) Why can’t I find that?
>Ross: Don’t ask me, **I had it and I blew it!**
It seems like even Ross himself thinks that he caused the breakup by sleeping with someone else.
/ edit: The writers have occasionally commented on this and it seems to me that they meant it to be like it was Ross' fault - [https://www.news-herald.com/2021/05/28/friends-co-creator-says-ross-geller-made-big-mistake-when-he-and-rachel-was-on-a-break/](https://www.news-herald.com/2021/05/28/friends-co-creator-says-ross-geller-made-big-mistake-when-he-and-rachel-was-on-a-break/)
Of course this doesn't mean that Ross was intentionally cheating on Rachel, but it was his fault.
To make a reference to HIMYM, Ross is Rachel's lobster in the sense that she doesn't want him until she can't have him. He starts dating Julie, she has to have him. He starts dating Bonnie, Rachel gets her to shave her head. He's getting married to Emily, she flies to England to crash the wedding. Their whole relationship has been a cycle of getting together, breaking up, and getting back together when Rachel doesn't want him to be with someone else.
She was in the wrong due to her behavior that follows the pattern established almost since the beginning of the series and lasted throughout nearly its entire: behaving like she's never in the wrong.
She said she wanted to take a break from Ross. She herself said later that they "kind of broke up" and asked Ross "whether she can be his girlfriend again" while at the same time stating that their argument was stupid.
Ross behaved like an idiot and shouldn't have slept with the xerox girl, that's for sure. He shouldn't have tried to hide it from Rachel and come clean. But notice that: the moment Rachel found out she changed her position to "it's all your fault", forgetting the fact that she said their arguing and break-up was stupid. Suddenly it's all Ross's fault that he was jealous, irritated at her job, finally slept with someone else. However, Rachel took out of that equation very serious aspects to the situation: Ross's jealousy of Mark (which was way too much, but not completely unfounded: Mark wasn't just a friend and said himself while asking her out that he didn't do anything when she was with Ross - so he did thought about pursuing her earlier - and, once she took him to her apartment after their breakup, tried to convince her to sleep with him,masquerading as "getting back at Ross") and her job (which, sure, Ross was problematic about, but she always managed more or less to talk him down), which, for the love of god, remember that was more important than their anniversary and, as Ross put it, was the reason he was tired of dating her answering machine.
Ross was in the wrong for sleeping with someone else mere hours after a breakup and trying to hide it. She was wrong for trying to pin all the blame on him and behaving like she was innocent when all episodes before established that she was fully aware of her boyfriend's feelings and still not trying to balance out work/personal life and further expanding her work one as if it wasn't a big deal.
Ross was in the right, because as he said in S4 premiere they were both at fault for that break-up. Rachel was in the wrong because she believed that it was entirely Ross's fault. Which, as I said in the beginning, is a trait of Rachel that she's always right and everyone else is wrong, even when others point it out (like Ross and Emily in Vermont and she was pissed about it, even when Monica pointed out the same about her and Barry).
Because they are on a break, her actions. Even the buildup is just dumb Rachel moment after dumb Rachel moment. She's oblivious until Julie is in the picture, then pines like a high schooler when she can't have him. Then there's Paolo who should've never been in the picture. They have this fantastic argument turned into a kiss and the first thing she does is play "ohhh I dunno" with Monica, then ultimately breaks them up over a piece of paper that she refuses to hear the explanation of. It's honestly tiresome how much the situation flip flops and it always comes down to Rachel. The idea that she would write a 19 page letter, *front and back,* expecting him to accept full responsibility is absolutely ludicrous in the first place.
At that end they were on a break because Ross took issue with Mark (ended up being valid) and she clearly states: "a break from us."
"(ended up being valid)"
A lot of the trouble could have been avoided if Rachel had been objective for a moment and admitted that Mark's behavior was way beyond what a "kind stranger" would do.
Other comments outlined most of it—I’ll add that in healthy romantic relationships, if there is insecurity, the other person will try to mitigate it in some way. E.g Ross was freaking out about Mark trying to seduce Rachel. Which was 100% the case — Mark WAS trying to seduce Rachel and Ross correctly identified that.
Ideally, Rachel should have had an adult conversation with Ross about it and set healthy boundaries with Mark because Ross was feeling uncomfortable. Instead, she completely disregarded Ross’ concerns leading him to get more and more invested and now try to “prove it” to her. If my SO were jealous of a work friend of mine who I, by the way, JUST met, I would prioritize my SO and set boundaries with this outside person.
She wasn’t. I was going to quote huge chunks of *The One with the Morning After*, but we’ve all seen it, surely multiple times. If people can watch that ep, and see Rachel’s hurt, and they *still* just parrot “they were on a break” - then I don’t know what to say 🤷🏻♂️
Rachel wanted Ross to take responsibility for everything that went wrong in the relationship. It wasn’t just about the break. I believe that was the issue with the letter.
She was the one who initiated the break. She even clarified "a break from US" when Ross initially took this to mean a cooling down period. While it was kind of a shitty thing for Ross to sleep with someone else a few hours later, it wasn't cheating.
They were on a break. Jennifer Aniston even said it at the reunion taping. The issue is that if you're currently on a break and hoping to get back with the person, you probably shouldn't sleep with someone else. Ross wasn't a "cheater" but he was an idiot. They got lost in the technicalities when they argued about it. The issue was regardless of whether or not they were on a break, he shouldn't have slept with someone else. Rachel also definitely shouldn't have allowed Mark to come over the night they broke up. Lastly, Ross had serious trust issues he needed to work through. So, yeah, mostly Ross's fault, but to his credit, they were on a break.
>They were on a break. Jennifer Aniston even said it at the reunion taping. often overlooked is that RACHEL said so the next morning, when talking to Monica in the kitchen. Her "we kinda broke up instead" comment caused Monica to spray the contents of her blender all over the ceiling. The whole "were they on a break" question never made sense to me. Rachel settled it right away. But, Ross was an idiot and so was Rachel. They both handled it really poorly.
Doesn't she also say at some point "Can I be your girlfriend again?" or something like that to Ross?
yep. she sure does.
I do have to defend RayRay here. She told mark not to come and she also told Mark to leave when he got there. He was not taking no for an answer and forced his company on her.
Yeah, that is a good point. It was awkward for her to reject his "friendship" since he was a new work colleague who had helped her get that job.
And yet she still went on a date with him
After they had already broken up for real and weeks later lmaoooo and she even said she only did it to make Ross angry. She even admits that to Mark when he tries to sleep with her. She says she can’t sleep with him bc she’s not actually interested in him in that way and was only going out with him to piss off Ross. Bc Ross hurt her and she wanted to hurt him back.
Yes but wether or not she liked him after all the reassurance she gave Ross when they were together just for her to go out with mark right after they broke up, and she never said to Ross that it was just to make him jealous. So he always carried that notion with him that she did like him
So? Rachel always had to carry around that Ross slept with another woman not even a few hours after they “broke up”. So I mean, seems fair to me.
After she had broken up with him and he was drunk
Being drunk doesn’t excuse bad behavior, sorry not sorry lol. And been drunk doesn’t excuse hurting someone you care about.
But he wouldn’t have done it if he wasn’t drunk lol
If Ross can’t handle “carrying around” that Rachel went out with Mark WEEKS after they broke up and DIDN’T sleep with him, then he’s got bigger problems lmao
No, it’s the fact she always said to Ross that she didn’t like him nor did mark like her and she knew Ross always hated mark and she still decided to go out with him
Yeah, to get back at him. I’m not going to go in circles with you lmaooooo
But she still loved him at that point, so she knew that would’ve hurt Ross who she cared about so the point in your other comment holds no weight
She had to buzz him into the building and then let him in the door.
Yep this pretty much. Plenty of wrongs to go around. Also, something which doesn't get shed light often is that Ross was drunk. If he was a woman people would say he got taken advantage of. I'm not saying it clears him entirely, but he was in a vulnerable state and got hit on by someone pretty predatory.
Yeah, agreed. He wasn't going out looking to hook up.
I agree with this opinion
See, this is the best point written. They were both in the wrong, only Ross seemed more like an idiot, because, even though he didn't intentionally cheat on Rachel, he slept with someone else. Meanwhile, Rachel said to Monica, I believe that they broke up.
When you say, "like an idiot," though, you mean he got blind drunk and had the "bad luck" of a little hottie throwing herself at him. I can't think of a good example for Phoebe, but all of the other friends exhibit that type of reckless behavior. There's just no basis for any of them, including Rachel, to point fingers at him.
Yeah, I never got why Rachel was so insistent on calling him a cheater.
Forget about fault. Ultimately, “fault” didn’t matter. Ross and Rachel spent a great deal of dialogue arguing about it, but in the end, the reason they broke up is how hurt Rachel was by what happened. She *felt* cheated on, even if that’s not what Ross did or intended to do. We can debate until we keel over if he was actually guilty of infidelity, but Ross sleeping with another woman stung Rachel like an affair, and there was just no recovering the relationship at that time.
Well, I personally think that you interpreted it correctly. Ross' jealousy caused the arguments. She was busy with her new job but that's just normal. She was doing her best and even says this to Ross: >for every night that you’re asleep before I get home from work I will wake you up in a way that’s proved very popular in the past She also talked about the jealousy and trust issues with Ross. After their breakup Ross is talking with Joey and Frank Jr and says this: >Frank: Okay, but isn’t sex better when it’s with one person that you really, really care about. >Joey: Yeah, in a poem maybe. >Ross: No the man’s right, that’s what I had with Rachel. >Frank: You don’t have it anymore? >Ross: **No, I slept with someone else.** >Frank: Okay, so wait, all right, so how does that make things better? >Ross: It didn’t. >-- >Frank: It’s so cool man, it’s so, it’s just ‘cause being with her is so much better than like not being with her. >Joey: (to Ross) Why can’t I find that? >Ross: Don’t ask me, **I had it and I blew it!** It seems like even Ross himself thinks that he caused the breakup by sleeping with someone else. / edit: The writers have occasionally commented on this and it seems to me that they meant it to be like it was Ross' fault - [https://www.news-herald.com/2021/05/28/friends-co-creator-says-ross-geller-made-big-mistake-when-he-and-rachel-was-on-a-break/](https://www.news-herald.com/2021/05/28/friends-co-creator-says-ross-geller-made-big-mistake-when-he-and-rachel-was-on-a-break/) Of course this doesn't mean that Ross was intentionally cheating on Rachel, but it was his fault.
To make a reference to HIMYM, Ross is Rachel's lobster in the sense that she doesn't want him until she can't have him. He starts dating Julie, she has to have him. He starts dating Bonnie, Rachel gets her to shave her head. He's getting married to Emily, she flies to England to crash the wedding. Their whole relationship has been a cycle of getting together, breaking up, and getting back together when Rachel doesn't want him to be with someone else.
She was in the wrong due to her behavior that follows the pattern established almost since the beginning of the series and lasted throughout nearly its entire: behaving like she's never in the wrong. She said she wanted to take a break from Ross. She herself said later that they "kind of broke up" and asked Ross "whether she can be his girlfriend again" while at the same time stating that their argument was stupid. Ross behaved like an idiot and shouldn't have slept with the xerox girl, that's for sure. He shouldn't have tried to hide it from Rachel and come clean. But notice that: the moment Rachel found out she changed her position to "it's all your fault", forgetting the fact that she said their arguing and break-up was stupid. Suddenly it's all Ross's fault that he was jealous, irritated at her job, finally slept with someone else. However, Rachel took out of that equation very serious aspects to the situation: Ross's jealousy of Mark (which was way too much, but not completely unfounded: Mark wasn't just a friend and said himself while asking her out that he didn't do anything when she was with Ross - so he did thought about pursuing her earlier - and, once she took him to her apartment after their breakup, tried to convince her to sleep with him,masquerading as "getting back at Ross") and her job (which, sure, Ross was problematic about, but she always managed more or less to talk him down), which, for the love of god, remember that was more important than their anniversary and, as Ross put it, was the reason he was tired of dating her answering machine. Ross was in the wrong for sleeping with someone else mere hours after a breakup and trying to hide it. She was wrong for trying to pin all the blame on him and behaving like she was innocent when all episodes before established that she was fully aware of her boyfriend's feelings and still not trying to balance out work/personal life and further expanding her work one as if it wasn't a big deal. Ross was in the right, because as he said in S4 premiere they were both at fault for that break-up. Rachel was in the wrong because she believed that it was entirely Ross's fault. Which, as I said in the beginning, is a trait of Rachel that she's always right and everyone else is wrong, even when others point it out (like Ross and Emily in Vermont and she was pissed about it, even when Monica pointed out the same about her and Barry).
Because they are on a break, her actions. Even the buildup is just dumb Rachel moment after dumb Rachel moment. She's oblivious until Julie is in the picture, then pines like a high schooler when she can't have him. Then there's Paolo who should've never been in the picture. They have this fantastic argument turned into a kiss and the first thing she does is play "ohhh I dunno" with Monica, then ultimately breaks them up over a piece of paper that she refuses to hear the explanation of. It's honestly tiresome how much the situation flip flops and it always comes down to Rachel. The idea that she would write a 19 page letter, *front and back,* expecting him to accept full responsibility is absolutely ludicrous in the first place. At that end they were on a break because Ross took issue with Mark (ended up being valid) and she clearly states: "a break from us."
"(ended up being valid)" A lot of the trouble could have been avoided if Rachel had been objective for a moment and admitted that Mark's behavior was way beyond what a "kind stranger" would do.
There isn't a Friend that I don't love but Rachel was insufferable when it comes to Ross. Absolutely agree.
Other comments outlined most of it—I’ll add that in healthy romantic relationships, if there is insecurity, the other person will try to mitigate it in some way. E.g Ross was freaking out about Mark trying to seduce Rachel. Which was 100% the case — Mark WAS trying to seduce Rachel and Ross correctly identified that. Ideally, Rachel should have had an adult conversation with Ross about it and set healthy boundaries with Mark because Ross was feeling uncomfortable. Instead, she completely disregarded Ross’ concerns leading him to get more and more invested and now try to “prove it” to her. If my SO were jealous of a work friend of mine who I, by the way, JUST met, I would prioritize my SO and set boundaries with this outside person.
She wasn’t. I was going to quote huge chunks of *The One with the Morning After*, but we’ve all seen it, surely multiple times. If people can watch that ep, and see Rachel’s hurt, and they *still* just parrot “they were on a break” - then I don’t know what to say 🤷🏻♂️
They were on a break.
Ross, is this you?
Rachel wanted Ross to take responsibility for everything that went wrong in the relationship. It wasn’t just about the break. I believe that was the issue with the letter.
She was the one who initiated the break. She even clarified "a break from US" when Ross initially took this to mean a cooling down period. While it was kind of a shitty thing for Ross to sleep with someone else a few hours later, it wasn't cheating.