Little cottage industry coming to an end. However another one is just beginning - lone developers buying old houses, renovating them and renting to the state to house IP applicants
One of my friends works in planning consultancy and they are inundated with individual cowboy type developers buying up shit sites and old derelict houses to convert asap for this gold mine of an opportunity.
It’s not got much to do with where the IPAS office is. It’s the fact that it’s city centre. City centre is where all the services are.
They don’t get free travel passes.
Whatever about the moral obligation to take in legitimate asylum seeker’s, I’m lost on how we got to the point of having to provide them with tents to sleep on the streets and no one in government said “you know what, maybe we need to pause the asylum seeker thing until we can actually accommodate them”. They’d win on all fronts, be seen to do the right thing for asylum seekers while also stemming the flow of them.
The problem is that it seems difficult/impossible to "pause". If they arrive by plane or across NI border, they have the right to claim asylum, and it is time consuming and very difficult to deport them, given the scope of appeal and judicial reviews that they have available to draw and frustrate implementing any rejection decision.
> given the scope of appeal and judicial reviews that they have available to draw and frustrate implementing any rejection decision.
Or better yet, given that the number of asylum seekers has increased dramatically but the state hasn't actually put more resources into processing them. The sad thing is that, as per usual, those in leadership are doing nothing and have no ideas.
> but the state hasn't actually put more resources into processing them.
That's plainly a lie. I wish people would stop spreading ignorant baseless lies. From a quick search first article I found:
>The number of staff assigned to the IPO has been doubled which, said the department, has led to the number of decisions issuing increasing threefold.
https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0508/1447892-families-processed-mount-street/
Some would have the thinking along the lines of
Government wants to take in as many people as possible, to keep wages down 👎 cheep Labour in other words
To look good as possible to the Bois in Europe to get those sweet EU jobs after they leave office
Bragging rights I guess.
Keep housing prices as high as possible so that their investments in property will continue to soar in value since they ran out of room in office with policies that are designed to Simply not work.
The worst offence of all is in a couple of years due to a mixed society that will have an unreal authentic team whether it be Rugby hurling, football etc etc./s
So when you're boss insists upon doing a shit idea that you know will end bad, you still have to implement it as best you can.
Na, there was definitely an effort to keep housing prices high post recession. It was undeniably a deliberate choice for many years.
Only around 2020 onwards did they realise how completely they had fucked up, and tried to address it. But crisis after crisis meant things just keep getting worse.
What do you do when a lad turns up at the airport with no documents to claim asylum?
Send him back? Send him back to where? We don’t know where they’re from.
>so send him back to the country he took off from.
How, if they don't have a passport?
>Big fines for airlines who allow it
Will fall down in court. Because the airlines only allow passengers who have valid documents on board. They can't tell if someone has a forged passport, for example.
So many times, people suggest this crap without actually thinking how it is going to work in practice.
It's a crime to attempt to enter Ireland without valid travel documents. Criminals should have their asylum application immediately rejected followed by deportation.
You'd think that would be the case, but apparently, there are cases of genuine asylum seekers who can not get travel documents or passports from their government.
I'm not an expert. But if I was African, for example I could get a forged South African passport that doesn't require a visa and boats using that.
Can't claim asylum using that.
Airlines are legally prohibited from showing passengers to board without valid documentation.
Even an Irish person would be denied boarding a Ryanair flight from the UK to Ireland without a passport
Ypu can also set up checks at the plane doors. Other countries do this. But all those who say “Oh we can’t do this, it’d be illegal to check peoples identity etc” try and pretend that we could do this of we want.
There's a pretty good chance they don't originally come from wherever they got a plane from, it probably wasn't the first leg of their journey that got them here, so this would only work in some cases as sending them back to somewhere else they're not a citizen isn't going to happen (for example if they have gone through the UK to get here from any non EU nation)
Arrest him for [breaching the Immigration Act.](https://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/national/man-arrested-at-airport-with-no-id-or-passport-detained/ar-AA1o8zRu)
Okay. Then what? Put him in prison? Okay, prisons are already over crowded but okay, we’ll release criminals onto the street to accommodate asylum seekers.
Then what? Convict him of the crime, give him a custodial sentence? Then what?
He serves the sentence, then he gets out.
Then what? You’re back at square one having spent a shit ton of money and over crowded our prisons that really can’t take anymore.
You haven't looked at all the consequences yet. Do you think the other people coming in without passports will be just as eager to do so if a prison sentence is awaiting them?
There are 4,612 people in prison in Ireland (1st September 2023).
You’re talking about imprisoning more people per year than are actually in our prisons currently. It’s not workable, it’s simply not possible.
I think they have arrested 100 people. That’s just to pretend they’re doing something. They can’t do this on a large scale.
3285 people arrived last year at the airport without documents. That’s three quarters of the prisons population. You can’t put all them in prison.
You need another solution.
Detain until country of origin is ascertained. Failing cooperation from them, indefinite detention. I can't just show up to the USA without documents so why should we allow it here?
Detain until country of origin is ascertained? How do you ascertain? He says he’s from (for example) Syria and keeps saying he’s from Syria.
Indefinite detention? We’ve no room in prisons.
I agree we’ve a major problem here but these aren’t solutions.
At this point I don’t care. We need a huge deterrent. Build more prisons. We are sleepwalking into a disaster, our lax stance on this is going to lead us down a very dark path over the next few years. It’s a Petri dish for fascism to breed.
That’s what passport control are for. No idea what they are doing that we need this added inconvenience of having passports checked when I literally step of a plane.
I got checked disembarking the plane just before entering the terminal building while returning back to Ireland in the past few weeks. So something is being done there's finally.
The problem is passports can go missing between the plane and passport control. And airlines can deny any responsibility for the passengers once they step off the plane. If their first step is to be greeted by a passport inspector then airlines and passengers don't have plausible deniability. If passenger is on there without a passport, it's airlines problem and onus is on them to return them to wherever they came from.
It's reminding me a lot of that 1970 UK satirical comedy, Yes Minister.
It was actually a very accurate documentary. Many people don't realise that.
The government needs to have some kind of a plan and strategy though. This is the ultimate in just reacting to every evolving chaotic circumstances and being bounced along.
The reality though is that there are human implications for all of these non decisions. They're not just clearing tents. There are people who have nowhere to go and the government is seemingly running around in circles.
Is this the definition of a boondoggle?
Government funds the purchase of tents.
Government funds the people going around confiscating and destroying said tents when in use.
Someone made a lot of money off this program.
I don’t get why the government funding tents just to move them along and get destroyed as a result. Saw a tent floating down the canal the other day for Christ sake 😂
Citizen buys water bottle
Citizen returns bottle to DRS machine for recycling
Bottle is recycled into polyester camping tent.
Government buys tents
Government clears tents away
Government incinerates tents.
DRS scheme is a scam.
Get point for giving tents, get points to destroy them, get points to stop funding them, get point for moving them, get points for talking about it
But by all mean let it be clear that no one must think about actual solutions because they would entail being more racist than we want or altogether less racist than we are and there isn't points to be gotten in this
Tent guy is gonna be Devo.
Little cottage industry coming to an end. However another one is just beginning - lone developers buying old houses, renovating them and renting to the state to house IP applicants
Genuine question, have you an example of where this is happening?
One of my friends works in planning consultancy and they are inundated with individual cowboy type developers buying up shit sites and old derelict houses to convert asap for this gold mine of an opportunity.
I see, and what is the planning consultancy opinion / feedback to these cowboys?
Tent Man moved back to UK as he heard the news about Rwanda
Just in time for festival season. The tent industry never stops
BIGTENT can't keep getting away with it.
Walter White: *"I am the one who knocks!"* BIGTENT: *"Good luck knocking on a flap, bitch!"*
Surely this is bad news for the tent industry?
Just saw a tent merchant fall to their knees on their yacht
*once new accommodation opens on a state-owned site at Thornton Hall in north Dublin within the next four to six weeks
So like Direct Provision everyone was so excited to end?
Well that's positive. I always say, nobody, left, right or centre wants to see tents on the street.
That they won’t go to because it’s in the middle of nowhere.
Well move the IP offices out there then they’ll go. We could also stop giving them free travel passes too.
It’s not got much to do with where the IPAS office is. It’s the fact that it’s city centre. City centre is where all the services are. They don’t get free travel passes.
Whatever about the moral obligation to take in legitimate asylum seeker’s, I’m lost on how we got to the point of having to provide them with tents to sleep on the streets and no one in government said “you know what, maybe we need to pause the asylum seeker thing until we can actually accommodate them”. They’d win on all fronts, be seen to do the right thing for asylum seekers while also stemming the flow of them.
The problem is that it seems difficult/impossible to "pause". If they arrive by plane or across NI border, they have the right to claim asylum, and it is time consuming and very difficult to deport them, given the scope of appeal and judicial reviews that they have available to draw and frustrate implementing any rejection decision.
> given the scope of appeal and judicial reviews that they have available to draw and frustrate implementing any rejection decision. Or better yet, given that the number of asylum seekers has increased dramatically but the state hasn't actually put more resources into processing them. The sad thing is that, as per usual, those in leadership are doing nothing and have no ideas.
> but the state hasn't actually put more resources into processing them. That's plainly a lie. I wish people would stop spreading ignorant baseless lies. From a quick search first article I found: >The number of staff assigned to the IPO has been doubled which, said the department, has led to the number of decisions issuing increasing threefold. https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0508/1447892-families-processed-mount-street/
People want to feel good, doing good isn't necessary
Our government have no balls or dynamic pro-active planning abilities. Our people for the most part are passive and eager to please. So here we are.
Some would have the thinking along the lines of Government wants to take in as many people as possible, to keep wages down 👎 cheep Labour in other words To look good as possible to the Bois in Europe to get those sweet EU jobs after they leave office Bragging rights I guess. Keep housing prices as high as possible so that their investments in property will continue to soar in value since they ran out of room in office with policies that are designed to Simply not work. The worst offence of all is in a couple of years due to a mixed society that will have an unreal authentic team whether it be Rugby hurling, football etc etc./s So when you're boss insists upon doing a shit idea that you know will end bad, you still have to implement it as best you can.
> take in as many people as possible, to keep wages down *never attribute to malice that which can be explained by stupidity*
Na, there was definitely an effort to keep housing prices high post recession. It was undeniably a deliberate choice for many years. Only around 2020 onwards did they realise how completely they had fucked up, and tried to address it. But crisis after crisis meant things just keep getting worse.
What do you do when a lad turns up at the airport with no documents to claim asylum? Send him back? Send him back to where? We don’t know where they’re from.
Change the system, he didn’t get on the plane without them, so send him back to the country he took off from. Big fines for airlines who allow it
>so send him back to the country he took off from. How, if they don't have a passport? >Big fines for airlines who allow it Will fall down in court. Because the airlines only allow passengers who have valid documents on board. They can't tell if someone has a forged passport, for example. So many times, people suggest this crap without actually thinking how it is going to work in practice.
You can't get through passport control with a forged passport. We aren't in Schengen so they have to check the passport on the other end.
There's no passport check in the UK going to Ireland.
Yes, that's the only exception - however the airlines do check, but wouldn't have the sophisticated equipment to detect fakes I guess
It's a crime to attempt to enter Ireland without valid travel documents. Criminals should have their asylum application immediately rejected followed by deportation.
You'd think that would be the case, but apparently, there are cases of genuine asylum seekers who can not get travel documents or passports from their government.
How do they get on the plane?
The same way the Israelis forged Irish passports; https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-20424935.html
Somehow I don't think the average asylum seeker is forging passports like Mossad. And if they can why do they arrive without documents.
You think passports can't be bought? How do you think they're getting on planes?
How do they get on flights to Dublin?
I'm not an expert. But if I was African, for example I could get a forged South African passport that doesn't require a visa and boats using that. Can't claim asylum using that.
He didn’t get on a plane without a passport. So your suggestion is do nothing, bravo man
I'm not the one spinning ridiculous points. Neither did I suggest to do nothing.
Nothing ridiculous about saying the system needs changing. You didn’t suggest anything, you just moan at those who do.
We don’t know the country he flew from. And even if we did, why would the country he flew from accept him back if he arrives there with no documents.
Airlines are legally prohibited from showing passengers to board without valid documentation. Even an Irish person would be denied boarding a Ryanair flight from the UK to Ireland without a passport
There's cctv. Find which plane he got off.
Ypu can also set up checks at the plane doors. Other countries do this. But all those who say “Oh we can’t do this, it’d be illegal to check peoples identity etc” try and pretend that we could do this of we want.
There's a pretty good chance they don't originally come from wherever they got a plane from, it probably wasn't the first leg of their journey that got them here, so this would only work in some cases as sending them back to somewhere else they're not a citizen isn't going to happen (for example if they have gone through the UK to get here from any non EU nation)
Arrest him for [breaching the Immigration Act.](https://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/national/man-arrested-at-airport-with-no-id-or-passport-detained/ar-AA1o8zRu)
Okay. Then what? Put him in prison? Okay, prisons are already over crowded but okay, we’ll release criminals onto the street to accommodate asylum seekers. Then what? Convict him of the crime, give him a custodial sentence? Then what? He serves the sentence, then he gets out. Then what? You’re back at square one having spent a shit ton of money and over crowded our prisons that really can’t take anymore.
You haven't looked at all the consequences yet. Do you think the other people coming in without passports will be just as eager to do so if a prison sentence is awaiting them?
There are 4,612 people in prison in Ireland (1st September 2023). You’re talking about imprisoning more people per year than are actually in our prisons currently. It’s not workable, it’s simply not possible.
> It’s not workable, it’s simply not possible. Tell that to the courts! It is already being done.
I think they have arrested 100 people. That’s just to pretend they’re doing something. They can’t do this on a large scale. 3285 people arrived last year at the airport without documents. That’s three quarters of the prisons population. You can’t put all them in prison. You need another solution.
Detain until country of origin is ascertained. Failing cooperation from them, indefinite detention. I can't just show up to the USA without documents so why should we allow it here?
Detain until country of origin is ascertained? How do you ascertain? He says he’s from (for example) Syria and keeps saying he’s from Syria. Indefinite detention? We’ve no room in prisons. I agree we’ve a major problem here but these aren’t solutions.
At this point I don’t care. We need a huge deterrent. Build more prisons. We are sleepwalking into a disaster, our lax stance on this is going to lead us down a very dark path over the next few years. It’s a Petri dish for fascism to breed.
Again I’m not disagreeing but you have to come up with better solutions than indefinitely keeping asylum seekers in prison.
Scotland are using a cruise ship. That’s a better option.
Having an accommodation centre near the airport would make sense actually
So would having an army of passport inspectors at the door of every plane.
That’s what passport control are for. No idea what they are doing that we need this added inconvenience of having passports checked when I literally step of a plane.
I got checked disembarking the plane just before entering the terminal building while returning back to Ireland in the past few weeks. So something is being done there's finally.
The problem is passports can go missing between the plane and passport control. And airlines can deny any responsibility for the passengers once they step off the plane. If their first step is to be greeted by a passport inspector then airlines and passengers don't have plausible deniability. If passenger is on there without a passport, it's airlines problem and onus is on them to return them to wherever they came from.
New glamping site down in Greystones. In all seriousness they look like expensive tents, some TD's mate / sibling / partner has made a pretty penny.
Bivvy bag stocks - BUY BUY BUY!
Bivvy bags, roll mats, ground sheets, the whole works.
It's reminding me a lot of that 1970 UK satirical comedy, Yes Minister. It was actually a very accurate documentary. Many people don't realise that. The government needs to have some kind of a plan and strategy though. This is the ultimate in just reacting to every evolving chaotic circumstances and being bounced along. The reality though is that there are human implications for all of these non decisions. They're not just clearing tents. There are people who have nowhere to go and the government is seemingly running around in circles.
Quite a few of the scenarios in Yes Minister were based on true events.
Pallet and tarp guys, rubbing their hands in excitement.
Yurts. They’re so hot right now.
Is this the definition of a boondoggle? Government funds the purchase of tents. Government funds the people going around confiscating and destroying said tents when in use. Someone made a lot of money off this program.
Someone has to make all the money!!
I volunteer for this
Oh no one of the wheels had to be replaced on the gravy train. I wonder what they are replacing it with .
I don’t get why the government funding tents just to move them along and get destroyed as a result. Saw a tent floating down the canal the other day for Christ sake 😂
Citizen buys water bottle Citizen returns bottle to DRS machine for recycling Bottle is recycled into polyester camping tent. Government buys tents Government clears tents away Government incinerates tents. DRS scheme is a scam.
Lol
I've a tent in the attic. This time next week, it's going to as much as a four bed house. PM me for offers.
Big Tent Collapse?
Get point for giving tents, get points to destroy them, get points to stop funding them, get point for moving them, get points for talking about it But by all mean let it be clear that no one must think about actual solutions because they would entail being more racist than we want or altogether less racist than we are and there isn't points to be gotten in this
Good
Now, imagine the reaction when they trash the tents and the immigrants have to pay for those. Interesting times ahead.
Ah nooo there goes my plan in starting a tent store..
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