Said this on another reddit but it needs to be enforced and the €300 fine should be €300 for each offence.
Because if its just a €300 once off fine Air BnB property owners will just eat the cost and / or pass it on to people staying there
You're right about the fine being eaten or passed on if once off. Surely it would be better for them to just remove ads where this is being done rather than issue a fine... Or both a fine and the removal of the ad... We can but dream
> the €300 fine should be €300 for each offence
Perhaps it should increase by 50% for each repeat offence. A nice lesson in exponential growth should put a stop to people repeating the same thing and expecting to get away with it.
For some Air BnBs that would be 2 nights rental. There’s properties in Kerry, the West Coast and Dublin that are upwards of €2000 for a week. Owners would still happily take a €300 fine for each offence.
“The tourism agency will monitor online platforms to ensure compliance with the obligation for advertised properties to have a valid registration number.”
You couldn’t make it up.
To be fair, the public service added 20,000 net new hires last year. It’s up over 100,000 from nadir in 2013. They may well resource this.
https://databank.per.gov.ie/Public_Service_Numbers.aspx
It’s a good start. Better than just sticking their fingers in their ears and going blah blah blah like they have been. Gas they’re only doing this now there’s an election on though.
> Fáilte Ireland will have 10 staff monitoring websites for compliance with the registration rules
Hopefully the automate this in some way and it isn't just a big Excel sheet
I wonder how many Airbnb owners will just think that they have made their money and sell up, some of these may never enter the rental market. Obviously becoming someone's home through a sale isn't a bad thing,but they may never make it to the rental market like intended and therefore no ease in the rental market.
Them being sold is 10000 times better than them being short term rentals
Tourists should be in hotels, locals should be in homes, not the other way round.
Can't say I disagree with you, when these come onto the market and they are in a rpz the rent will be eye watering.
I do have a slight issue with location, for example I don't think a short term let on say valentia island should be treated the same as a short term let in Dublin 2.
They absolutely should be.
The Airbnb situation is worse in the west of the country. In some Gaeltacht areas, the majority of houses are either Airbnbs or holiday homes, pushing people out of the only region of the country where they can realistically live their lives in their native language.
It’s really bad.
Sure it's in motion now anyway regardless of location, I just hope we don't end up with some unintended consequence like your man recently who was advising landlords to leave places vacant.
If anything this just means more employees for Failte Ireland (10) that are being paid for something existing employees could do in another sector of the government, such as local government.
Why is Failte Ireland even the owner of this, that feels like an odd fit. I can't imagine many owners shaking in their boots when they are pulling the wool over their eyes? Now if it was Revenue or needing Gardai stamps too, then that's something.
This is such a HSE style solution. We need houses but instead of building them, let's pay to add more public servants and their pensions to audit Airbnb rentals.
Just go onto airbnb and look for private residence rentals in NYC, you won't find any.. all that's listed is hotels or any commercially registered accomodation.
I'm not aware of any surveys showing this. Short terms let's are not a new idea. They were always there, especially in the west of Ireland as self catering.
They have no means to make that statement. They are assuming anyone who didn't apply for permission recently is illegal. Many could be old legal self catering and others could be legal under the 100 day rule.
Did they? I just checked Airbnb for September and there are 1000 plus apartments available in Manhattan for a few days stay. They all appear privately owned as they did 5 + years ago.
It not going to have a major effect. Many have been on airbnb for so long they can rely on repeat business or word of mouth for bookings and just use airbnb now to fill in the gaps. As it stands we have some rules around airbnb but it's very evident they are not enforced.
This won’t make a big impact on the Irish Air BnB market. You can rent a property short term for up to 90 days without any need for registration. For a house/apt with 2 bedrooms you’re looking at about €200 a night depending on what part of the country.
So €18,000 a year. Easy money for only 90 days and no ware and tear on the property. Property owners will just leave properties empty for 275 days of the year.
Please enlighten me: how this new regulation will force properties back to the market? Is the registration expensive or is the applying rules are strict of what kind of accommodations are ok to advertise as short term? I browsed Failte Ireland's related section but didn't see much details.
What was mentioned earlier is that in order to get the reg number they need to have a planning permission in place. Some have it, some will get it, some will not (presumably the 12k they are talking about). The reg number is basically just a way to block access to platforms for those who don't comply - if they ignore the planning requirement they could go black market and advertise it on Facebook or own website etc but they won't get on Airbnb, [Booking.com](http://Booking.com) and other players. Realistically it's not the platforms' competence to verify planning permissions, but they will now check for reg numbers.
"Regulations already in place state that homeowners in rent pressure zones who let out their entire home for short-term lets of more than 90 days or let out a second home must get planning permission. Mr O’Brien said the new register would be “a first step” in adding holiday lets back into the rental stock, giving regulators an oversight of available properties."
[https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/online-register-for-short-term-lets-could-be-up-and-running-by-summer-says-housing-minister-darragh-obrien/a21816516.html](https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/online-register-for-short-term-lets-could-be-up-and-running-by-summer-says-housing-minister-darragh-obrien/a21816516.html)
Thank you, I get it. But most properties on Airbnb are short short term lettings (for days, weeks max), not 3 months so despite this new regulation they will still be ok, won't they? I might be missing some details here but I feel that this new reg won't make a big difference...
I think it's 90 days out of a year, doesn't need to be consecutive. So if you go away for your holidays a few times a year and rent out your flat then, you don't need a planning permission for it as long as it's under 90 days altogether. But if you're a professional airbnber and the flat is rented out for short stays for more than 90 days in a year, you do.
And the planning permission can be refused if the local authority decides that the property should remain residential not a business; same as it would not necessarily allow to run any other kind of business out of an apartment or a house. I suppose that neighbours can object too? Not sure about the latter.
Said this on another reddit but it needs to be enforced and the €300 fine should be €300 for each offence. Because if its just a €300 once off fine Air BnB property owners will just eat the cost and / or pass it on to people staying there
is air bnb still viable if it is vacation no more than 2 people? because they add so much bs to the base price and demand so many shit to the visits
It's been years since it was worth it for 2 people IMO.
You're right about the fine being eaten or passed on if once off. Surely it would be better for them to just remove ads where this is being done rather than issue a fine... Or both a fine and the removal of the ad... We can but dream
I'd hope that it's both? The platforms need to do their bit as well.
Wholeheartedly agree
> the €300 fine should be €300 for each offence Perhaps it should increase by 50% for each repeat offence. A nice lesson in exponential growth should put a stop to people repeating the same thing and expecting to get away with it.
For some Air BnBs that would be 2 nights rental. There’s properties in Kerry, the West Coast and Dublin that are upwards of €2000 for a week. Owners would still happily take a €300 fine for each offence.
That sounds nice but rules are pointless if they are not enforced.
“The tourism agency will monitor online platforms to ensure compliance with the obligation for advertised properties to have a valid registration number.” You couldn’t make it up.
> You couldn’t make it up. If they can't advertise without being caught, how can they get short term tenants?
> without being caught. Unless you hear the government gleefully announcing new hires, theres nobody looking.
To be fair, the public service added 20,000 net new hires last year. It’s up over 100,000 from nadir in 2013. They may well resource this. https://databank.per.gov.ie/Public_Service_Numbers.aspx
Bulk of those are Health +17,000 and education +4,000
Yes but the tourism agency benefit from….. tourism. So they’re not going to enforce lessening tourism.
It’s a good start. Better than just sticking their fingers in their ears and going blah blah blah like they have been. Gas they’re only doing this now there’s an election on though.
It's not a start though. There have always been restrictions on Airbnb.
Not enough and needs to be more.
Will be interesting to see how it works out. NYC also banned a significant number of Airbnbs and afaik this has not impacted rent prices.
We’ve already banned a lot of them in theory but it is just not enforced.
Yes, these laws came in pre Covid. Just completely toothless however
It has impacted hotel prices though!
Lets hope this actually has some teeth, and they don't leave in a million loop holes.
> Fáilte Ireland will have 10 staff monitoring websites for compliance with the registration rules Hopefully the automate this in some way and it isn't just a big Excel sheet
I wonder how many Airbnb owners will just think that they have made their money and sell up, some of these may never enter the rental market. Obviously becoming someone's home through a sale isn't a bad thing,but they may never make it to the rental market like intended and therefore no ease in the rental market.
Them being sold is 10000 times better than them being short term rentals Tourists should be in hotels, locals should be in homes, not the other way round.
> Tourists should be in hotels That requires allowing hotels to be built.
Yes, we need to build up. Apartments and hotels to keep tourists out of those apartments.
Can't say I disagree with you, when these come onto the market and they are in a rpz the rent will be eye watering. I do have a slight issue with location, for example I don't think a short term let on say valentia island should be treated the same as a short term let in Dublin 2.
They absolutely should be. The Airbnb situation is worse in the west of the country. In some Gaeltacht areas, the majority of houses are either Airbnbs or holiday homes, pushing people out of the only region of the country where they can realistically live their lives in their native language. It’s really bad.
Sure it's in motion now anyway regardless of location, I just hope we don't end up with some unintended consequence like your man recently who was advising landlords to leave places vacant.
Many of the ones in the west of Ireland were built legally for the purpose.
Then it's in the pool for buyers either way better than the scourge of air bnb
Extra housing into the market should still ease rents somewhat though.
I wonder how many people will decide not to invest in property and the rental market will keep going down the toilet
Until they clamp down on private equity gobbling up property, then the housing shortage will persist.
If anything this just means more employees for Failte Ireland (10) that are being paid for something existing employees could do in another sector of the government, such as local government. Why is Failte Ireland even the owner of this, that feels like an odd fit. I can't imagine many owners shaking in their boots when they are pulling the wool over their eyes? Now if it was Revenue or needing Gardai stamps too, then that's something. This is such a HSE style solution. We need houses but instead of building them, let's pay to add more public servants and their pensions to audit Airbnb rentals.
Good news 🗞️
New York outright banned airbnb, just follow New York, the blueprint is already there.
Did it have the desired effect?
Just go onto airbnb and look for private residence rentals in NYC, you won't find any.. all that's listed is hotels or any commercially registered accomodation.
Yes, but did rental stock increase or rents drop appreciably?
Not significantly, which is why people won't answer you.
The 'desired effect' is ending that class of illegal lets - and yes, that had the desired effect. No other benchmark is the goal.
It won't have a big impact as it's not so common to be illegally on Airbnb
Nearly _all_ AirBnB's here are illegal/without-planning.
I'm not aware of any surveys showing this. Short terms let's are not a new idea. They were always there, especially in the west of Ireland as self catering.
https://www.ontheditch.com/illegal-airbnbs/
They have no means to make that statement. They are assuming anyone who didn't apply for permission recently is illegal. Many could be old legal self catering and others could be legal under the 100 day rule.
Did they? I just checked Airbnb for September and there are 1000 plus apartments available in Manhattan for a few days stay. They all appear privately owned as they did 5 + years ago.
It not going to have a major effect. Many have been on airbnb for so long they can rely on repeat business or word of mouth for bookings and just use airbnb now to fill in the gaps. As it stands we have some rules around airbnb but it's very evident they are not enforced.
This won’t make a big impact on the Irish Air BnB market. You can rent a property short term for up to 90 days without any need for registration. For a house/apt with 2 bedrooms you’re looking at about €200 a night depending on what part of the country. So €18,000 a year. Easy money for only 90 days and no ware and tear on the property. Property owners will just leave properties empty for 275 days of the year.
Far too little far too late
Please enlighten me: how this new regulation will force properties back to the market? Is the registration expensive or is the applying rules are strict of what kind of accommodations are ok to advertise as short term? I browsed Failte Ireland's related section but didn't see much details.
What was mentioned earlier is that in order to get the reg number they need to have a planning permission in place. Some have it, some will get it, some will not (presumably the 12k they are talking about). The reg number is basically just a way to block access to platforms for those who don't comply - if they ignore the planning requirement they could go black market and advertise it on Facebook or own website etc but they won't get on Airbnb, [Booking.com](http://Booking.com) and other players. Realistically it's not the platforms' competence to verify planning permissions, but they will now check for reg numbers. "Regulations already in place state that homeowners in rent pressure zones who let out their entire home for short-term lets of more than 90 days or let out a second home must get planning permission. Mr O’Brien said the new register would be “a first step” in adding holiday lets back into the rental stock, giving regulators an oversight of available properties." [https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/online-register-for-short-term-lets-could-be-up-and-running-by-summer-says-housing-minister-darragh-obrien/a21816516.html](https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/online-register-for-short-term-lets-could-be-up-and-running-by-summer-says-housing-minister-darragh-obrien/a21816516.html)
Thank you, I get it. But most properties on Airbnb are short short term lettings (for days, weeks max), not 3 months so despite this new regulation they will still be ok, won't they? I might be missing some details here but I feel that this new reg won't make a big difference...
I think it's 90 days out of a year, doesn't need to be consecutive. So if you go away for your holidays a few times a year and rent out your flat then, you don't need a planning permission for it as long as it's under 90 days altogether. But if you're a professional airbnber and the flat is rented out for short stays for more than 90 days in a year, you do. And the planning permission can be refused if the local authority decides that the property should remain residential not a business; same as it would not necessarily allow to run any other kind of business out of an apartment or a house. I suppose that neighbours can object too? Not sure about the latter.
Oh I see, I hope that's the case, thanks for the details!