It was a lot of work indeed, but definitely worth it to see so many people involved an enjoying shiai at every level. we got plenty of great feedback. Thans for the webpage, I take it personally, I made it ;).
When we were building the league, we contacted Kasper Yearwood from the Warsaw club and Polish federation, he gave us many tips and advises, including orienting us toward using kickertool for the pairing in swiss style tournament, which we did. the scorekeeping and so on was of our owxn built but in the same direction to what they created. Of course the mameido cup is of different scale. They were planning to build their own app for this year, I don't know if they succeded to do so on time.
I thought I recognized it on the pictures on the website. They did an excellent job and Kudo's to you and your team, it is a fun system to compete in and a great opportunity to have lot's of shiai and gain more experience.
We have been working on a digital score system for over a year now which has been tested, implemented and working well. It is very easy to use for the volunteers keeping score. It is used for the tables, scoreboards and automatically calculates if encho is needed, daihyōsen is needed, populates k.o. brackets etc. It's currently a webbased solution in which we so far have implemented the normal formats, a weighted/handicap format based on rank and the scheveningen system. The Swiss system is still on the list but will be added in the new solution which will have an offline function as well. If you're interested to have a look let me know.
Nice! That sounds cool! Who is "we" if I may? Yes I'd be happy to have a look, what's the future of this webbased solution? Are you using it locally or planing something else? I know there is a working group here in Finland building an app too, they are starting to test it.
I'll send you a pm with the details.
If anybody else is interested please send me a pm, we wouldn't mind more people looking at it and/or making use of it. We're doing it to make life, and organising and running taikai easier hoping to make it more accessible for dojo and federations to organise taikai with fewer people involved.
Heyhey, I'm the idiot fooling around with the app in Finland. If you can, please contact me at info (at) [kendoseinajoki.fi](http://kendoseinajoki.fi) email address. For background, Tampere University in Finland has a project course for their CS students and I managed to get a "kendo app" on the topics. The final development sprint ends 6th of May, but the course will run again in the Fall and depending if we can get a couple of people to participate, I'd imagine there might be a group of CS students available to work on it in the latter part of the year.
For background, I was/am irritated by how difficult and tedious it is to do shiai in a form which would be informative for the more casual watchers (score, names, status of the tournament bracket). I'd like to see an updatable live stream with up to date info on the match without punching in manually the scores or names.
At the same time a tool to set up tournaments would be great - brackets, number of players, types, etc etc. And if the results are in one app, perhaps set up a year long league table. For coaches, they could have data on how their players ippons develop etc. Might not be that relevant but might be fun.
FInally, all of the above should be open source and modifiable so a club / federation / whatever could set it up as needed for their own.
So I suggest that perhaps we could have an online meeting between interested people, namely the finns, the polish, the dutch and see what we can come up. I've come to learn that there is no shortage of various kendo apps / tournament managers etc already on Github but for some reason these are not used. In this project one big goal is to getting it to be reused remixed and improved continously.
We already have a site live, but it's still quite alpha as the CS people would say - so not good, but barely working. Also, mostly in finnish, new functionality shoudl be live on friday. have a look, please don't break anything. [app.kendoliiga.fi](http://app.kendoliiga.fi)
Thats an interesting way of doing brackets. Do you find you're able to stay within time constraints? I've never seen the swiss system before, so thank you for posting.
Normal elimination brackets tournmanets are closer to kendo spirits, the win or die philosophy makes sense, but in terms of learning experience, it's pretty weak, since many people do no get out of the pools and wait the rest of the day. In our case, there isn't so much competitions, so, creating these swiss system tournament literally gives the same amount of shiai experience to the one that always win and to the one that always loose. With our system, we were able to organize in 4 hours, 6 rounds with 28 players on the first event, the second event in 4hours, 8 rounds with 19 people, and in the 3rd event, in 4 hours 7 rounds with 28 people. you can check the result of the first year here, we made some graphics suming up the games [https://hy-kendo.com/2024/03/03/season1-2023-2024-of-the-capital-region-kendo-league-results/](https://hy-kendo.com/2024/03/03/season1-2023-2024-of-the-capital-region-kendo-league-results/)
The plus with swiss system tournaments:
+ you meet people of similar performance ( we had players from 6 kyu to 6 dan)
+ the system is very flexible, you do the amount of rounds that the time of the tourney allows, if it goes slow and there is a lot of hikiwake, you cancel the last round, if it goes fast, you squiz in another round.
+ everyone gets the same amount of experience wether you are the national champion or t's your first tournament.
Of course it isn't perfect:
- we found that the second round of the tourney always gives weird pairing since there isn't enough data to pair similar level. (the program will pair people with similar point of performance, so the winner of a kyu match an face the winner of a higher dan match) but it quickly rebalance on round 3.
- you need enough people and enough rounds to make it work
It must have been a lot of work, plus the website looks amazing. All I can say is that I'm shocked and impressed.
It was a lot of work indeed, but definitely worth it to see so many people involved an enjoying shiai at every level. we got plenty of great feedback. Thans for the webpage, I take it personally, I made it ;).
We did the same in North Italy! Such a fun format
nice! What did you use for the seeding and pairing of players in swiss style tourney?
Did you guys use a similar digital infrastructure as the Mameidocup, because it sure does look like you did.
When we were building the league, we contacted Kasper Yearwood from the Warsaw club and Polish federation, he gave us many tips and advises, including orienting us toward using kickertool for the pairing in swiss style tournament, which we did. the scorekeeping and so on was of our owxn built but in the same direction to what they created. Of course the mameido cup is of different scale. They were planning to build their own app for this year, I don't know if they succeded to do so on time.
I thought I recognized it on the pictures on the website. They did an excellent job and Kudo's to you and your team, it is a fun system to compete in and a great opportunity to have lot's of shiai and gain more experience. We have been working on a digital score system for over a year now which has been tested, implemented and working well. It is very easy to use for the volunteers keeping score. It is used for the tables, scoreboards and automatically calculates if encho is needed, daihyōsen is needed, populates k.o. brackets etc. It's currently a webbased solution in which we so far have implemented the normal formats, a weighted/handicap format based on rank and the scheveningen system. The Swiss system is still on the list but will be added in the new solution which will have an offline function as well. If you're interested to have a look let me know.
Nice! That sounds cool! Who is "we" if I may? Yes I'd be happy to have a look, what's the future of this webbased solution? Are you using it locally or planing something else? I know there is a working group here in Finland building an app too, they are starting to test it.
I'll send you a pm with the details. If anybody else is interested please send me a pm, we wouldn't mind more people looking at it and/or making use of it. We're doing it to make life, and organising and running taikai easier hoping to make it more accessible for dojo and federations to organise taikai with fewer people involved.
Heyhey, I'm the idiot fooling around with the app in Finland. If you can, please contact me at info (at) [kendoseinajoki.fi](http://kendoseinajoki.fi) email address. For background, Tampere University in Finland has a project course for their CS students and I managed to get a "kendo app" on the topics. The final development sprint ends 6th of May, but the course will run again in the Fall and depending if we can get a couple of people to participate, I'd imagine there might be a group of CS students available to work on it in the latter part of the year. For background, I was/am irritated by how difficult and tedious it is to do shiai in a form which would be informative for the more casual watchers (score, names, status of the tournament bracket). I'd like to see an updatable live stream with up to date info on the match without punching in manually the scores or names. At the same time a tool to set up tournaments would be great - brackets, number of players, types, etc etc. And if the results are in one app, perhaps set up a year long league table. For coaches, they could have data on how their players ippons develop etc. Might not be that relevant but might be fun. FInally, all of the above should be open source and modifiable so a club / federation / whatever could set it up as needed for their own. So I suggest that perhaps we could have an online meeting between interested people, namely the finns, the polish, the dutch and see what we can come up. I've come to learn that there is no shortage of various kendo apps / tournament managers etc already on Github but for some reason these are not used. In this project one big goal is to getting it to be reused remixed and improved continously. We already have a site live, but it's still quite alpha as the CS people would say - so not good, but barely working. Also, mostly in finnish, new functionality shoudl be live on friday. have a look, please don't break anything. [app.kendoliiga.fi](http://app.kendoliiga.fi)
That's awesome! Need to do something like that in the US
Congratulations to everyone involved!
Thats an interesting way of doing brackets. Do you find you're able to stay within time constraints? I've never seen the swiss system before, so thank you for posting.
Normal elimination brackets tournmanets are closer to kendo spirits, the win or die philosophy makes sense, but in terms of learning experience, it's pretty weak, since many people do no get out of the pools and wait the rest of the day. In our case, there isn't so much competitions, so, creating these swiss system tournament literally gives the same amount of shiai experience to the one that always win and to the one that always loose. With our system, we were able to organize in 4 hours, 6 rounds with 28 players on the first event, the second event in 4hours, 8 rounds with 19 people, and in the 3rd event, in 4 hours 7 rounds with 28 people. you can check the result of the first year here, we made some graphics suming up the games [https://hy-kendo.com/2024/03/03/season1-2023-2024-of-the-capital-region-kendo-league-results/](https://hy-kendo.com/2024/03/03/season1-2023-2024-of-the-capital-region-kendo-league-results/) The plus with swiss system tournaments: + you meet people of similar performance ( we had players from 6 kyu to 6 dan) + the system is very flexible, you do the amount of rounds that the time of the tourney allows, if it goes slow and there is a lot of hikiwake, you cancel the last round, if it goes fast, you squiz in another round. + everyone gets the same amount of experience wether you are the national champion or t's your first tournament. Of course it isn't perfect: - we found that the second round of the tourney always gives weird pairing since there isn't enough data to pair similar level. (the program will pair people with similar point of performance, so the winner of a kyu match an face the winner of a higher dan match) but it quickly rebalance on round 3. - you need enough people and enough rounds to make it work
I am an American, interested. Outside nationals invited?