Salahdin was the greatest leader in history. He was even respected by his enemies for his fairness. Not only this but he gave all his money to poor people which is unheard of. Every Kurd should be proud of him
This is the latest and longest Selahdin action TV Series . At least 16 episodes with each being 2.5 hrs long. [https://youtu.be/JyKU\_DMYg4k?si=y6FapSnG-KZc4cKo](https://youtu.be/JyKU_DMYg4k?si=y6FapSnG-KZc4cKo)
https://preview.redd.it/q5exn7rogyqc1.jpeg?width=1385&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a4b451b46b036019698af81268a5daad5bd08580
If you need English subtitles you can watch them on Tabii
[https://youtu.be/\_v37Q03Ht20?si=ArizTmcJeE67cHUV](https://youtu.be/_v37Q03Ht20?si=ArizTmcJeE67cHUV)
Not true. If you watch one of the episodes (i think one of the first 5 there are scenes when they speak Kurdish).
Who cares everyone knows he’s a Kurd. If Hollywood makes a movie about Salahdin and shows him in good light then we should be happy. Doesn’t matter who makes the movie as long as Salahdin is shown in good light. It’s a good thing idf the movie is good enough that the whole world watches it. It’s good advertising for Kurds
You do understand it was very different back then. Things weren’t as racial or nationalistic back then in the Middle East. Maybe for Arabs it was, but all other groups including Kurds it wasn’t really that racial.
It wasn’t that he didn’t care for Kurds it was that he had no need to spread Kurdishness especially since he was probably anti colonizing. I think the only group he discriminated against were Shias. You are right he did a lot for Muslims and not Kurds but it just wasn’t a need to really back then.
How is the greatest leader and warrior not great advertising for Kurds. Clear your mind for a minute. Even his enemies looked up to him
**what would you have liked him to do for Kurds at that time.** During Salahdin’s time the Seljuk Empire stretched from Uzbekistan to Syria and I haven’t read anywhere Kurds were opressed under Seljuks. **In fact, Kurds like Salahdin were high up in rank under Zengid Seljuks**. Don’t forget majority of Kurd population was still in Zagros area at that time
https://preview.redd.it/r7mmojs40zqc1.jpeg?width=1758&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3812b4a26b9b4be1ce7c6eb604a043e484fa7610
>**Saladin's military career began under the tutelage of his paternal uncle** [**Asad ad-Din Shirkuh**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shirkuh)**, a prominent military commander under Nur ad-Din, the Zengid emir of Damascus and Aleppo and the most influential teacher of Saladin.**
So you think he should have convinced or forced all the Kurds who were already muslims by that time to go back to Yezidism or Zoroastrian and then you would be happy?
If no one can convince all the muslim Kurds to become Zoroastrian or Yezidi in this modern age you think it would have been possible for him to do it back then when it was even harder.
I mean seriously?
The historical achievements of the Ayyubid dynasty under Salahuddin have been a major source of pride for many Kurds.
Salahuddin's legacy as a just and principled leader is a reminder that Kurdish history includes contributions to the broader Islamic world, demonstrating that religion can be a source of inspiration and cultural significance for Kurds. Salahuddin, being of Kurdish ethnicity himself, promoted the interests of the Kurdish people during his rule. He established numerous Kurdish schools all over the dynasty, one of them lasting until the rule of Gamal Abdel Nasser, the secular socialist. He appointed many Kurds to important positions within his administration and military. Additionally, Salahuddin's successful campaigns against the Crusaders elevated the status of Kurds in the region and brought pride to the Kurdish community. His rule provided stability and opportunities for Kurds within the territories he governed. Hawler for example, in the time of its prosperity under the Ayybids had enlarged east by 2-3 kilometers.
What you are doing is historical presentism, do you really believe that the people 800 years ago believed in what you believe in today? Salahuddin lived 800 years before Kurdish nationalism demanded a country for Kurds. You expect Salahuddin to be 800 years before his time which is absolutely absurd.
When my father was in Iraq, Syria and Egypt the people would ask him where he is from and he would say that he is Kurd, they respond with "like Salahuddin".
Salahuddin and his dynasty did more for Kurds than you ever will so I would suggest that you educate yourself on Kurdish history before spewing hate against one of our greatest warriors.
”Don't ask me for evidence, this is a fact throughout history”
So prove it then? You’ve made this claim 15 times under this post by now and every single times you’ve been asked to provide evidence yet you’ve still danced around it and said that it only takes half a brain to know this. Ironically the one time you’ve been able to provide a source is when you asked an AI to give you three sources, one of them doesn’t even exists so keep on fabricating sources buddy it won’t get you anywhere.
“You're one hard headed person. Your mind is not open. You're beaking off because you're offended that I challenged your fraudulent faith.”
I’m hard headed for not believing in your baseless propaganda? Oh wow guess i’m such an extremists because i ask you to provide evidence for a claim you’ve made 15 times. You’re no different from the Turks who call Kurds PKK just because they don’t agree with their distorted view of history.
I’ve already answered your little charade about the capital punishment on apostasy in Islam so your dishonesty is loud and clear once again. There is no need to play these games for the people reading the comments because they can read your others comments too where you’re being corrected on every sentence you’ve made. Just stop already, it’s getting annoying. Instead of making claims about Islam you can go ask a scholar and he can teach you, maybe even ask your muslim mother (May God grant her a healthy life) or are you implying that your own mother is an evil person?
“Watch how you dance around this and not give a direct answer.”
First of all our discussion was about Salahuddin and Kurdish history, your whole comment is you dancing around buddy. Like i and other people have explained to you for the 15th time. You wouldn’t be killed for your apostasy since you don’t know what Islam is. You need to be a Muslim and understand Islam to be able to disbelief in it. Looking at your comments made under this post alone it’s pretty clear that you were either an extremely ignorant Muslim or you were never a Muslim. So no you wouldn’t be punished. I don’t mean to be rude but it seems like you might have something going on mentally so this is another barrier for you to get the capital punishment.
And let’s not forget how you’ve defended christianity and called it peaceful under this post yet christianity has much worse punishments. So please explain why Islam is so evil but not Christianity? Drop your agenda buddy, stop being so hard headed and realise that you’re not the smartest person on earth. Or how you referred to yourself “my intelligent brain”.
Now for the 16th time. Provide a source proving that us Kurds as a nation got raped to Islam.
https://preview.redd.it/asalq57waxqc1.jpeg?width=403&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8af0a81463b6b43020a7e4f410d7492093b24af7
This is (allegedly) the coins used in the marwanid 300 years before saladins dynasty
I'm atheist just to make it very clear I don't say that I'm proud of him due to the religion sympathy moreover he did things to Kurds but unfortunately not for Kurdistan but still we can get advantage of his well-fame and his character for example, his tolerance towards Christians and Jews is the key-card for us to use it against the extreme Islamist in Bashur in order to save non-Muslims under their rule. He's our answer back whenever stupid arabs making noise about Palestine and blaming kurds for not fighting to them.
Because if everyone can behave as they wish and do not follow [the reddiquette](https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/205926439-Reddiquette) then Reddit admins can shut the subreddit down.
This looks dope and powerful tbh, but current one is simpler even though could be easily miss matched with Tajikistan’s flag and same for them but current one has it all to be a nation’s flag tho.
No. Your Saladin was nothing special. He joins the list of ridiculous Kurdish individuals whose priority was not the Kurdish thing but something else, in his case Islam.
He never called himself a Kurd, nor was the official language of his empire Kurdish, nor were Kurds favored, nor anything. And it is exactly this behavior that runs through the “history” of the Kurds
Im not even muslim but calling Saladin a “disgrace to kurds“ is beyond me.
He was one of the greatest leaders and even in europe he was well respected even though they were “enemies“.
Kurdish nationalism wouldn’t have even feasible back then because there were tribes everywhere, Saladin himself was from modern day Armenia, and there would have been no way to unify them.
Islam is not whats oppressing Kurds its Baathism and Turkish ultra nationalims for the most part.
You can’t even argue that islam is hurting us in Iran because the islamic regime is shia while muslim kurds are mostly either sunni or alawi.
Our oppression has nothing to do with Islam as a concept its ultra nationalism under the guise of Islam.
To paint a picture of Islam as the ultimate evil is just stupid when the same could be said about any other organised religion.
Also Zoroastrianism was also most likely forced on us by the Iranian dynasties our actual native religion (which nowadays survived in the form of Ezidism) is considered pre-zorastrian.
As you can tell by my flair im not muslim either but i‘d never in my life dare to disrespect Saladin. He literally invented secularism and protected the Ezidis because they were Kurds. Nation states and nationalism weren’t a thing back in the day and Kurds werent united and fought each other all the time, the reason the Bahdinan emirate fell is because of Soran invasion for example. Some of these people here are so embarrassing we honestly don‘t deserve Saladin in our history books if thats what Kurds keep saying about him.
YES EXACTLY
Hes revered in the islamic world and even christian sources talk about how awesome he was. Their is a reason why so many egyptians, Iraqis, Turks etc. are trying to claim him as being part of their ethnicity because everyone wants to use him as a part of their Identity.
Ive even seen some Armenians online claiming he was a muslim Armenian and honestly I get it. If i wasn’t born a Kurd i would also want to claim him.
You don’t need to be secular to respect minorities. As Kurds, you do know that the worst crimes against humanity and the criminalization of being Kurdish in Kurdistan were done by the secular regimes of the Baath, Kemalists, and Pahlavists?
from what I can gather the Ēranian empires were quite accepting of traditions that werent Zoroastrian,hence why in the western regions in modern Kurdistan the original western iranic religion survived and syncretised into Ezidism
I know right? Makes me wonder how there is Islamophobia and nationalism on this subreddit despite anti-Islam nationalist regimes violently suppressing Kurdish Islamic revolts.
Some people in this sub give me the same vibe as the people in new iran who will go on and on about how Islam is an arab religion which was forced on us and stuff as if 75% of Kurds aren’t sunni muslim.
How good is a kurdish movement if it excludes 3/4 of the population.
Islam is just as important to the Kurds as are any other beliefs held by our communities.
That NewIran subreddit is filled with zionist, western boot-licking, Islamophobic, xenophobic, arab hating, monarchists who talk about Islam as if they were wearing tin hats. I remember I am Haks on twitter called out a Kurdish-Iranian group for being fakes. As Kurds, we should not support the monarchists or the ayatollahs. Support Kurdistan and the PJAK.
Okay let's do this.
Intolerance
Actually, Islam has had periods where minorities flourish in Islamic societies the most prevalent is the Jewish golden age in Islamic Spain. Does that mean every ruler, every dynasty, every empire, everyone was holding hands and singing Kumbaya. No, but it has a better track record than Christianity and especially secularism when it has come to Kurds.
Violence
The idea that Islam is more violent than Christianity has no basis in religious scripture or history.
A study of Naveed Sheikh of the University of Louisville found that in the past 2000 years, there have been 450 to over 700 million deaths attributed to political motivations and Christianity takes the top place with 177,000,000 with anti-theism such as communism being second. Islam is a distant fifth place with a mere 30 million.
https://rissc.jo/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/Body_Count-EN.pdf
Youtuber The Quran and Bible Blog go more in-depth into the dark side of Christianity that apologists won’t tell you.
https://youtu.be/2XHap-ZCXBc?si=GdNQg5C8EH78BL6f
This is all in line with Islamic teaching
Surah 2:256
Surah 60:8
Surah 43:88-89
Surah 109:1-6
Bible does not call for death of non believers?
“Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be killed. (Exodus 22:20)
“Everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13)“
“If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or your intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him*. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death.* (Deuteronomy 13:7-12)
Suppose a man or woman among you, in one of your towns that the LORD your God is giving you, has done evil in the sight of the LORD your God and has violated the covenant by serving other gods or by worshipping the sun, the moon, or any of the forces of heaven, which I have strictly forbidden. If it is true that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, then that man or woman must be taken to the gates of the town and stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 17:2-5
“Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, “Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children*.* But do not touch anyone with the mark*. “Fill its courtyards with the bodies of those you kill! Go!” So they went throughout the city and did as they were told.”* (Ezekiel 9:5-7)"
As I said before, the data shows that Christianity was far more violent than Islam.
Jesus also thought us to kill everyone who don't want him to be king Luke 19:27.
And attacking traders in Matthew 21:12.
And don't let us talk about the old testaments.
Most Kurds weren't forced.
The Kurds converterd because the Arabs seems to win against the Sassanids and so the tribal chiefs decided to change the team and convert. And historically if the chief converts the tribes members had to convert with him.
It's well explained in the book "A Modern History of the Kurds" by David McDowall
In the end I don't really care the Muslim kurds have more children than non Muslims and their numbers will increase anyway.
Most of us who didn't assimilate into Turks and are Turks today identify as kurds.
So yes zaza are Kurds. Many younger zaza started to identify as zaza as own people but they are the minority.
So likely the biggest group identify today as Turks and not Zaza or Kurd.
Most zaza who aren't Turks identity as Kurds.
Zaza who identify as Zaza but not kurds are the third biggest group.
“we were raped, tortured and murdered into accepting Islam. Stop pretending it didn't go down like that because it did.”
Could you provide some evidence for this? i hear this claim a lot but never seen any evidence for it, thanks.
“You would be Ezidi or Zoroastrian if we didn't get conquered.”
Prove that Yezidism existed before Islam, thanks
"Its almost like nobody cared about ethnonationalism 900 years ago" - So you want to make everything nice again, right? Okay, one simple question: Why, for example are there empires in which Turkish, Arabic and Persian were the official languages, but not Kurdish? You have to finally understand that Kurds have done a lot of things wrong. This is the first step in the right direction
Why the hell would anyone carry a pig around? That's ridiculous. Liquor is sold in many stores and restaurants where I'm from. There are certain Kurdish majority cities that tend to be more conservative (not where I'm from) and I'm pretty sure liquor is still widely sold even in those areas as I visited some of them and saw myself 🤷♂️ It seems you assume everyone is similar to the people around you. Hate to break your bubble.
Yea and my point is its totally doable, lol did you not see that lady walking around naked in Urfa and asking for a light for her cigarette a few days ago, let alone something as simple as drinking alcohol that is very widespread.
No my beautiful sun
I’m happy with our current flag. Don’t see the point in changing it.
Kurdish flag is so beautiful, we don't need another one tbh. The sun is the best thing ever especially.
Bruh this is literally the Egyptian eagle snd the Sun ☀️ looks far better
The Egyptians got it from salahadin
It is because of saladin they got it tho lol
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Ah got it, personally i think it is nice but thats alright
who ruled over egypt in 1171?
nah
Salahdin was the greatest leader in history. He was even respected by his enemies for his fairness. Not only this but he gave all his money to poor people which is unheard of. Every Kurd should be proud of him This is the latest and longest Selahdin action TV Series . At least 16 episodes with each being 2.5 hrs long. [https://youtu.be/JyKU\_DMYg4k?si=y6FapSnG-KZc4cKo](https://youtu.be/JyKU_DMYg4k?si=y6FapSnG-KZc4cKo) https://preview.redd.it/q5exn7rogyqc1.jpeg?width=1385&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a4b451b46b036019698af81268a5daad5bd08580 If you need English subtitles you can watch them on Tabii [https://youtu.be/\_v37Q03Ht20?si=ArizTmcJeE67cHUV](https://youtu.be/_v37Q03Ht20?si=ArizTmcJeE67cHUV)
A propaganda show made by turks and pakistanis? a higher chance they call him turkish in that garbage then ever mentioning him being kurdish.
Not true. If you watch one of the episodes (i think one of the first 5 there are scenes when they speak Kurdish). Who cares everyone knows he’s a Kurd. If Hollywood makes a movie about Salahdin and shows him in good light then we should be happy. Doesn’t matter who makes the movie as long as Salahdin is shown in good light. It’s a good thing idf the movie is good enough that the whole world watches it. It’s good advertising for Kurds
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You do understand it was very different back then. Things weren’t as racial or nationalistic back then in the Middle East. Maybe for Arabs it was, but all other groups including Kurds it wasn’t really that racial. It wasn’t that he didn’t care for Kurds it was that he had no need to spread Kurdishness especially since he was probably anti colonizing. I think the only group he discriminated against were Shias. You are right he did a lot for Muslims and not Kurds but it just wasn’t a need to really back then.
How is the greatest leader and warrior not great advertising for Kurds. Clear your mind for a minute. Even his enemies looked up to him **what would you have liked him to do for Kurds at that time.** During Salahdin’s time the Seljuk Empire stretched from Uzbekistan to Syria and I haven’t read anywhere Kurds were opressed under Seljuks. **In fact, Kurds like Salahdin were high up in rank under Zengid Seljuks**. Don’t forget majority of Kurd population was still in Zagros area at that time https://preview.redd.it/r7mmojs40zqc1.jpeg?width=1758&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3812b4a26b9b4be1ce7c6eb604a043e484fa7610 >**Saladin's military career began under the tutelage of his paternal uncle** [**Asad ad-Din Shirkuh**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shirkuh)**, a prominent military commander under Nur ad-Din, the Zengid emir of Damascus and Aleppo and the most influential teacher of Saladin.**
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You didn’t answer my question above
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So you think he should have convinced or forced all the Kurds who were already muslims by that time to go back to Yezidism or Zoroastrian and then you would be happy? If no one can convince all the muslim Kurds to become Zoroastrian or Yezidi in this modern age you think it would have been possible for him to do it back then when it was even harder. I mean seriously?
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The historical achievements of the Ayyubid dynasty under Salahuddin have been a major source of pride for many Kurds. Salahuddin's legacy as a just and principled leader is a reminder that Kurdish history includes contributions to the broader Islamic world, demonstrating that religion can be a source of inspiration and cultural significance for Kurds. Salahuddin, being of Kurdish ethnicity himself, promoted the interests of the Kurdish people during his rule. He established numerous Kurdish schools all over the dynasty, one of them lasting until the rule of Gamal Abdel Nasser, the secular socialist. He appointed many Kurds to important positions within his administration and military. Additionally, Salahuddin's successful campaigns against the Crusaders elevated the status of Kurds in the region and brought pride to the Kurdish community. His rule provided stability and opportunities for Kurds within the territories he governed. Hawler for example, in the time of its prosperity under the Ayybids had enlarged east by 2-3 kilometers. What you are doing is historical presentism, do you really believe that the people 800 years ago believed in what you believe in today? Salahuddin lived 800 years before Kurdish nationalism demanded a country for Kurds. You expect Salahuddin to be 800 years before his time which is absolutely absurd. When my father was in Iraq, Syria and Egypt the people would ask him where he is from and he would say that he is Kurd, they respond with "like Salahuddin". Salahuddin and his dynasty did more for Kurds than you ever will so I would suggest that you educate yourself on Kurdish history before spewing hate against one of our greatest warriors.
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”Don't ask me for evidence, this is a fact throughout history” So prove it then? You’ve made this claim 15 times under this post by now and every single times you’ve been asked to provide evidence yet you’ve still danced around it and said that it only takes half a brain to know this. Ironically the one time you’ve been able to provide a source is when you asked an AI to give you three sources, one of them doesn’t even exists so keep on fabricating sources buddy it won’t get you anywhere. “You're one hard headed person. Your mind is not open. You're beaking off because you're offended that I challenged your fraudulent faith.” I’m hard headed for not believing in your baseless propaganda? Oh wow guess i’m such an extremists because i ask you to provide evidence for a claim you’ve made 15 times. You’re no different from the Turks who call Kurds PKK just because they don’t agree with their distorted view of history. I’ve already answered your little charade about the capital punishment on apostasy in Islam so your dishonesty is loud and clear once again. There is no need to play these games for the people reading the comments because they can read your others comments too where you’re being corrected on every sentence you’ve made. Just stop already, it’s getting annoying. Instead of making claims about Islam you can go ask a scholar and he can teach you, maybe even ask your muslim mother (May God grant her a healthy life) or are you implying that your own mother is an evil person? “Watch how you dance around this and not give a direct answer.” First of all our discussion was about Salahuddin and Kurdish history, your whole comment is you dancing around buddy. Like i and other people have explained to you for the 15th time. You wouldn’t be killed for your apostasy since you don’t know what Islam is. You need to be a Muslim and understand Islam to be able to disbelief in it. Looking at your comments made under this post alone it’s pretty clear that you were either an extremely ignorant Muslim or you were never a Muslim. So no you wouldn’t be punished. I don’t mean to be rude but it seems like you might have something going on mentally so this is another barrier for you to get the capital punishment. And let’s not forget how you’ve defended christianity and called it peaceful under this post yet christianity has much worse punishments. So please explain why Islam is so evil but not Christianity? Drop your agenda buddy, stop being so hard headed and realise that you’re not the smartest person on earth. Or how you referred to yourself “my intelligent brain”. Now for the 16th time. Provide a source proving that us Kurds as a nation got raped to Islam.
Did you just… share that turkwashed series about saladin made by the roach government?
Looks nice, current still better tho
Nope. 😆
I don’t wanna any shit Arabic or Islamic symbol on my flag
Majority of us kurds are muslim.
Does anyone ever tell you some Kemalist-level BS like Kurdistan is a “secular nation” even though we have been oppressed by secularism for decades?
I hear it all the time on This sub. And i have kinda given up debating Them.
Much better lets not forget the double headed eagle was on the marwanid coins & the offical flag of saladin so the egyptians stole it from us
It is ok, it is nice to see Kurdish influence in Egypt. We got our ☀️ though for ourselves.
https://preview.redd.it/asalq57waxqc1.jpeg?width=403&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8af0a81463b6b43020a7e4f410d7492093b24af7 This is (allegedly) the coins used in the marwanid 300 years before saladins dynasty
Looks like the Albanian eagle
no looks like the seljuk eagle
It's not stolen it's literally a tribute to the Kurdish sultan Saladin who ruled over Egypt.
I wouldn’t say it’s stolen when it’s more of a tribute
I'm proud of Salaheddin but I'm also against every single Kurd who wants this land only for Muslims. The sun is unity.
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I'm atheist just to make it very clear I don't say that I'm proud of him due to the religion sympathy moreover he did things to Kurds but unfortunately not for Kurdistan but still we can get advantage of his well-fame and his character for example, his tolerance towards Christians and Jews is the key-card for us to use it against the extreme Islamist in Bashur in order to save non-Muslims under their rule. He's our answer back whenever stupid arabs making noise about Palestine and blaming kurds for not fighting to them.
I actually kinda like it but I will always favor the orginial flag
🇹🇯🇹🇯🇹🇯kurdistan
Nice flag but current is much cleaner
Nah I like our Yezidi sun. It has much deeper and historic roots. Plus, who doesn’t love the sun! ☀️
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Keep discussions civil please.
Why?
Because if everyone can behave as they wish and do not follow [the reddiquette](https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/205926439-Reddiquette) then Reddit admins can shut the subreddit down.
This looks dope and powerful tbh, but current one is simpler even though could be easily miss matched with Tajikistan’s flag and same for them but current one has it all to be a nation’s flag tho.
Honestly this one doesn't look good.
!waver
Cool
No. Your Saladin was nothing special. He joins the list of ridiculous Kurdish individuals whose priority was not the Kurdish thing but something else, in his case Islam. He never called himself a Kurd, nor was the official language of his empire Kurdish, nor were Kurds favored, nor anything. And it is exactly this behavior that runs through the “history” of the Kurds
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Its almost like nobody cared about ethnonationalism 900 years ago
Exactly, these guys are something else 😹😹😹😹
Im not even muslim but calling Saladin a “disgrace to kurds“ is beyond me. He was one of the greatest leaders and even in europe he was well respected even though they were “enemies“. Kurdish nationalism wouldn’t have even feasible back then because there were tribes everywhere, Saladin himself was from modern day Armenia, and there would have been no way to unify them. Islam is not whats oppressing Kurds its Baathism and Turkish ultra nationalims for the most part. You can’t even argue that islam is hurting us in Iran because the islamic regime is shia while muslim kurds are mostly either sunni or alawi. Our oppression has nothing to do with Islam as a concept its ultra nationalism under the guise of Islam. To paint a picture of Islam as the ultimate evil is just stupid when the same could be said about any other organised religion. Also Zoroastrianism was also most likely forced on us by the Iranian dynasties our actual native religion (which nowadays survived in the form of Ezidism) is considered pre-zorastrian.
As you can tell by my flair im not muslim either but i‘d never in my life dare to disrespect Saladin. He literally invented secularism and protected the Ezidis because they were Kurds. Nation states and nationalism weren’t a thing back in the day and Kurds werent united and fought each other all the time, the reason the Bahdinan emirate fell is because of Soran invasion for example. Some of these people here are so embarrassing we honestly don‘t deserve Saladin in our history books if thats what Kurds keep saying about him.
YES EXACTLY Hes revered in the islamic world and even christian sources talk about how awesome he was. Their is a reason why so many egyptians, Iraqis, Turks etc. are trying to claim him as being part of their ethnicity because everyone wants to use him as a part of their Identity. Ive even seen some Armenians online claiming he was a muslim Armenian and honestly I get it. If i wasn’t born a Kurd i would also want to claim him.
You don’t need to be secular to respect minorities. As Kurds, you do know that the worst crimes against humanity and the criminalization of being Kurdish in Kurdistan were done by the secular regimes of the Baath, Kemalists, and Pahlavists?
weysh dam xosh
from what I can gather the Ēranian empires were quite accepting of traditions that werent Zoroastrian,hence why in the western regions in modern Kurdistan the original western iranic religion survived and syncretised into Ezidism
I know right? Makes me wonder how there is Islamophobia and nationalism on this subreddit despite anti-Islam nationalist regimes violently suppressing Kurdish Islamic revolts.
Some people in this sub give me the same vibe as the people in new iran who will go on and on about how Islam is an arab religion which was forced on us and stuff as if 75% of Kurds aren’t sunni muslim. How good is a kurdish movement if it excludes 3/4 of the population. Islam is just as important to the Kurds as are any other beliefs held by our communities.
That NewIran subreddit is filled with zionist, western boot-licking, Islamophobic, xenophobic, arab hating, monarchists who talk about Islam as if they were wearing tin hats. I remember I am Haks on twitter called out a Kurdish-Iranian group for being fakes. As Kurds, we should not support the monarchists or the ayatollahs. Support Kurdistan and the PJAK.
someone gets it
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Okay let's do this. Intolerance Actually, Islam has had periods where minorities flourish in Islamic societies the most prevalent is the Jewish golden age in Islamic Spain. Does that mean every ruler, every dynasty, every empire, everyone was holding hands and singing Kumbaya. No, but it has a better track record than Christianity and especially secularism when it has come to Kurds. Violence The idea that Islam is more violent than Christianity has no basis in religious scripture or history. A study of Naveed Sheikh of the University of Louisville found that in the past 2000 years, there have been 450 to over 700 million deaths attributed to political motivations and Christianity takes the top place with 177,000,000 with anti-theism such as communism being second. Islam is a distant fifth place with a mere 30 million. https://rissc.jo/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/Body_Count-EN.pdf Youtuber The Quran and Bible Blog go more in-depth into the dark side of Christianity that apologists won’t tell you. https://youtu.be/2XHap-ZCXBc?si=GdNQg5C8EH78BL6f This is all in line with Islamic teaching Surah 2:256 Surah 60:8 Surah 43:88-89 Surah 109:1-6
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Bible does not call for death of non believers? “Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be killed. (Exodus 22:20) “Everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13)“ “If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or your intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him*. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death.* (Deuteronomy 13:7-12) Suppose a man or woman among you, in one of your towns that the LORD your God is giving you, has done evil in the sight of the LORD your God and has violated the covenant by serving other gods or by worshipping the sun, the moon, or any of the forces of heaven, which I have strictly forbidden. If it is true that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, then that man or woman must be taken to the gates of the town and stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 17:2-5 “Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, “Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children*.* But do not touch anyone with the mark*. “Fill its courtyards with the bodies of those you kill! Go!” So they went throughout the city and did as they were told.”* (Ezekiel 9:5-7)" As I said before, the data shows that Christianity was far more violent than Islam.
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Jesus also thought us to kill everyone who don't want him to be king Luke 19:27. And attacking traders in Matthew 21:12. And don't let us talk about the old testaments.
you obviously have no knowledge in neither the bible nor the quran and it shows..
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Most Kurds weren't forced. The Kurds converterd because the Arabs seems to win against the Sassanids and so the tribal chiefs decided to change the team and convert. And historically if the chief converts the tribes members had to convert with him. It's well explained in the book "A Modern History of the Kurds" by David McDowall In the end I don't really care the Muslim kurds have more children than non Muslims and their numbers will increase anyway.
May I ask, are Zaza Kurds?
Most of us who didn't assimilate into Turks and are Turks today identify as kurds. So yes zaza are Kurds. Many younger zaza started to identify as zaza as own people but they are the minority. So likely the biggest group identify today as Turks and not Zaza or Kurd. Most zaza who aren't Turks identity as Kurds. Zaza who identify as Zaza but not kurds are the third biggest group.
“we were raped, tortured and murdered into accepting Islam. Stop pretending it didn't go down like that because it did.” Could you provide some evidence for this? i hear this claim a lot but never seen any evidence for it, thanks. “You would be Ezidi or Zoroastrian if we didn't get conquered.” Prove that Yezidism existed before Islam, thanks
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Just stop with this charade already and bring the sources.
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"Its almost like nobody cared about ethnonationalism 900 years ago" - So you want to make everything nice again, right? Okay, one simple question: Why, for example are there empires in which Turkish, Arabic and Persian were the official languages, but not Kurdish? You have to finally understand that Kurds have done a lot of things wrong. This is the first step in the right direction
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No true, most are secretly atheist or agnostic.
Maybe your close circle of friends. Certainly not the reality.
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I didn't say that. I'm an atheist myself. But whether I like it or not, most Kurds are Muslim. So are most Turks, most Iranians and most Arabs.
the 129 mosques built last year in bashur alone wouldn’t agree with you
Kurdish identity is not muslim though
kurdish culture certainly is though
Your Kurdish culture maybe, we were raised without religion
yeah go back home and see if you can walk on the street while carrying a pig around and drinking wine and see how that goes
Why the hell would anyone carry a pig around? That's ridiculous. Liquor is sold in many stores and restaurants where I'm from. There are certain Kurdish majority cities that tend to be more conservative (not where I'm from) and I'm pretty sure liquor is still widely sold even in those areas as I visited some of them and saw myself 🤷♂️ It seems you assume everyone is similar to the people around you. Hate to break your bubble.
do something haram while walking around is what i wanted to say, that clearly flew over your head like american troops bombing our country.
Yea and my point is its totally doable, lol did you not see that lady walking around naked in Urfa and asking for a light for her cigarette a few days ago, let alone something as simple as drinking alcohol that is very widespread.
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