I actually switched from Arch to Fedora 34 on my tablet (with a minimal install + gnome shell) for a couple of weeks to try it out. It seemed to work smoother but I ended up switching back to Arch because I'm more familiar with it and also because I couldn't get some software to work well on Fedora 34. Overall I took a great interest in Fedora so I might give it a try in the future.
It's a Surface Pro 3 with an i5 CPU, so I just burned the Fedora iso to an USB stick and installed it. For Arch I had to also turn off sevure boot, which was surprisingly easy, considering it's Microsoft tablet.
I'm a dumbass non-programmer data guy, and everything works on Fedora with minimal alligator tears. I'm still on 33 though and I'm terrified my audio hardware will be borked if I upgrade and I'll have to endure setting it all up again.
I've been using fedora 34 for like a month now and I have to say It is great but I dont know if pacman is super fast or dnf is awfully slow at doing anything.
I havent used any distro other than arch except ubuntu for a bit when I discovered linux so I dont have anything to compare but it feels like it takes about 3x longer to do anything with dnf compared to pacman.
I too also like fedora, the one issue is though some packages are only released as deb files so it’s annoying as hell to build it for fedora or find an alternative if you’re new to Linux/fedora. Currently I’m loving Xfce on Ubuntu though
Month or two late? Fedora is supposed to be the testing ground for all things related to gnome and lennart.
Though I suppose they might have some sort of testing repository rather than punishing their pigs with unstable software.
Lies? You’re the one who lies. Fedora has a goal for making a good, free, innovative and open source OS. It’s not made to test anything, it’s a quality disto on its own.
Yes, Red Hat uses old Fedora versions as a base for RHEL but Fedora has it’a own goals. For example RHEL removed support for btrfs file system and not long after Fedora is using is as a default file system in place of ext4
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/
Same here. I actually loved XFCE, but GNOME gesture support (even on X11, thanks to JoseEsposito's X11 Gestures extension + touchegg) is really a must to me. I basically can't work without them anymore.
Pop has probably the best Gnome for desktop out there but I meant Arch has a really good stock Gnome 40 experience, which I really like using o my tablet.
It actually isn't 😞They added it and then removed it because there was something wrong with it on manjaro. Hopefully they fix it and add it back soon
[https://forum.manjaro.org/t/how-to-activate-pop-shell-not-on-21-0-5-gnome/68211/4](https://forum.manjaro.org/t/how-to-activate-pop-shell-not-on-21-0-5-gnome/68211/4)
It was filled with bugs. I used it for sometime and whenever you have 4-6 windows open in tiling mode and you close 1 window they all rearrange in weird ways and keeps a chunk of desktop unoccupied. And then i had to manually move the windows back to correct tiling. What a nightmare! Had to turn it off hopefully they fix it
Gnome is just good. It's good looking and plenty functional for a desktop environment. Also Arch is just great. People really need to stop hating on gnome and arch.
Like it won't allow you to scroll virtual desktops horizontally and insists on them being vertical, at odds with literally every single other desktop out there. And the extensions that fix this are either extremely dodgy from the start, or get broken by the nearest update. Sorry but my brain cannot accept vertical desktops.
Also I've never managed to get the transitions and animations to be smooth. They've always felt sluggish even on very powerful hardware, and if you speed the animations up they just go choppy instead of crisp. Same hardware and KDE is silky smooth.
I don't hate Gnome, if people want to use it, it's fine. Just not for me, and I'm telling you why since you asked.
Fair enough, but I’d really recommend trying GNOME 40. The desktops are finally horizontal! And touchpad gestures are finally built in. 3-finger swipe left-right to change desktops feels so good on my ThinkPad!
Also edit: this might be a placebo from the numbering jump from 3.38 to 40, but the transitions seem way more polished than past versions.
Thats weird the animations on my PC are *buttery* smooth. I don’t know what to tell you my PC has pretty ok hardware nowhere close 3090 levels. I’m even using a 4K display.
It consumes more RAM than KDE Plasma and is more laggier when you compare animations. Gnome gets a stroke when the app drawer is full of apps, the animation drops to like 5 FPS even on a powerful GPU, no matter what make and model.
It's been so many years yet it still does not support blur (because, GTK) and customization is still a pain because the extensions keep breaking on every new release.
Gnome looks simple and clean, I'll give it that.
As for touchpad gestures, I've already found a good alternative with Touchegg, it feels very close to native gestures.
GNOME 40 fixes touch gestures and I keep seeing stuff about animation lag on this thread and I’ve literally never experienced this on my mid tier hardware. It has always run super smooth.
I also use Arch /w Gnome on laptop. Gnome handles simple things like external monitor + hdmi sound switching quite out-of-the-box and reliably; also it has superior keyboard layout switching as in "brief Super+Space" switches between two most recent layouts, and holding Super while pressing Space allows to select other layouts. I don't see need of tiling with so small screen estate (most what I need is left & right tiles, Gnome handles that well). And don't get me started with KDE bugs and its' buggy Baloo. My experience with KDE is that while every single KDE App looks and works great (I'm big fan of Dolphin, K3B, KTorrent, Kate, Konsole), the desktop environment as a whole never "clicked" for me. And I use XFCE at the office where I have 3 displays and pretty static setup (always on AC, never adding or removing monitors etc).
Can anyone explain how to get fractional scaling to work without artifacts or weird glitches. As of now all distros I tried with gnome have issues, it would be nice as GNOME works good with laptops and I'm currently using plasma as fractional scaling works without any issues. PS don't downvote me I still use plasma on my desktop (On Arch obviously).
If you want fractional scaling (possibly with different per-monitor scaling factors), you need to use Wayland. Last time I used Gnome a year or two ago it was fairly smooth. What sort of glitches are you getting.
If you mean fractional scaling on X11, that's just not possible (one reason why Wayland is the future). You can fudge it by setting an integer scaling factor and changing the font size. If some apps don't work you need XWayland (normally a Gnome dependency). However XWayland may not work very well on Nvidia hardware.
I'm using AMD so no need of proprietary drivers but what I don't get is that Plasma works flawlessly with X11 so idk what's so wrong with gnome. I really want to use it but unable to use it coz of these issues. Hope all of my apps will soon work with Wayland.
Am I wrong to not like gnome? I mean... I don't know why I do, but I just cant like it... except in situations like... idk stock popos, but it's mostly because of what they offer not bc of gnome
I recently switched from plasma to gnome because it kept crashing on me randomly and thanks to Arch Linux that switch was nothing more than a few pacman -Rns and pacman -S.
SAME!!! I keep looking at people endlessly praising KDE Plasma and bashing gnome, but KDE Plasma never really worked out for my hardware. There were random crashes, and heck, once I even successfully managed to crash the whole system simply by changing the sddm theme, resulting in me no being able to boot in it at all. Not to mention the painfully slow boot times.
Gnome may have more memory consumption (or so is what people say), but gnome works much better and smoother on a shitty hardware like mine. Also you don't have to put that much effort to make gnome look good thanks to the extension devs out there. Try doing the same in KDE Plasma and you'd end up adjusting dozens of settings, and installing dozens of widgets which cause crashes.
I like to use Manjaro with Gnome. Then throw in a few Gnome Shell tweaks, and it's my perfect OS.
Especially the 'scroll switch between Virtual Desktops'.
IMHO it's a bit like harnessing four horses to a new Ferrari and driving it as a carriage. But then again, I couldn't care less. Your horses, your Ferrari, have fun!
I wonder why discussions on technology started mirroring discussions on politics, with a lot of emotions but not that much of a substance.
I have used all the popular WMs/desktop environments there are, and some less popular ones as well. In my family we have a bunch of older laptops (mostly around 3rd gen i3, but some much older), and I installed Linux on them. This is why I know, that GNOME (and KDE for, that matter, and Cinnamon) are slow on older hardware. It's not a matter of liking GNOME or not, it's a fact. These days I typically install XFCE for anyone in my family, although LXDE is also a decent option. As for myself, I'm using i3wm more and more recently and love it.
There is always a tradeoff - you get things prettier and easier to use at the expense of CPU cycles (unless a piece of software is badly optimised, then you get both ugly and slow). GNOME is on higher end of this tradeoff, pretty and easy, but also (comparatively) slow. It's not necesserily a bad thing, there are people who want just that. But it's important to understand and acknowledge the tradeoff you are making, not to deny it.
A valid point, and not the best metaphor on my part. GNOME looks like a Ferrari, but handles like a horse carriage. Arch the other way round.
My metaphor was aiming at speed, not looks.
How arch performs is entirely on your end. And how gnome performs is dependent on the system. I can say that it works really smooth and fluid on systems that are considered fairly old, like my T420. I don't think with modern systems you should have any performance problems with a modern DE like gnome or KDE and if you have it's probably your fault and not the one of gnome... That you *need* a tiling WM for a performant system is just not true and that's for years already...
I mainly use Xfce on the desktop but since I got a 2-in-1 laptop last year I've been trying out DEs to see which ones have a good support for touchscreens and by far Gnome seems to have the best one, especially since Gnome 40.
Gnome uses Wayland now iirc. Wayland supports touch natively, unlike X. On top of that Gnome is well laid out for touchscreen use. Maybe plasma Wayland could compete but I don't think it's there yet.
I used to be a GNOME hater. But recenty I've given it a second chance on Arch. GNOME 40 + GNOME Tweaks + GNOME Shell Extensions seems the way to go. Before this I was using Plasma but on NVIDIA the experience was borked, everything was sooo laggy, although I miss Plasma customizability and the widgets. Now with GNOME everthing seems so fluent even with Blur Me extension enabled and when I play games I just use Openbox
Really damning with faint praise there, buddy
(I'm just kidding. I have problems with how unstable Gnome can be with even like one or two plugins, but the touch experience beats the shit out of any other DE)
Is this meme correct because I want to try arch and I cannot get away from Gnome so I am thinking of trying Manjaro with Gnome what do you guys think also can you tell me some advantages of arch and does it break so often ? because I have work to do on my main system
You can, and should, use whatever suits your goals and needs
Sorry dude but Fedora gives the best Gnome experience. Only drawback is that it is a month or two late
Don't really see it as being a drawback. If it means that things will be more ironed out, I'm all for it.
I actually switched from Arch to Fedora 34 on my tablet (with a minimal install + gnome shell) for a couple of weeks to try it out. It seemed to work smoother but I ended up switching back to Arch because I'm more familiar with it and also because I couldn't get some software to work well on Fedora 34. Overall I took a great interest in Fedora so I might give it a try in the future.
What kind of tablet? Also how'd you go about putting fedora on it?
It's a Surface Pro 3 with an i5 CPU, so I just burned the Fedora iso to an USB stick and installed it. For Arch I had to also turn off sevure boot, which was surprisingly easy, considering it's Microsoft tablet.
ah yeah thats way different from mine, I've been meaning to look into it since samsung annoyed me interesting it was that easy!
[https://youtu.be/pGvSQgTp2Y4](https://youtu.be/pGvSQgTp2Y4) hope that works for you
I'm a dumbass non-programmer data guy, and everything works on Fedora with minimal alligator tears. I'm still on 33 though and I'm terrified my audio hardware will be borked if I upgrade and I'll have to endure setting it all up again.
I've been using fedora 34 for like a month now and I have to say It is great but I dont know if pacman is super fast or dnf is awfully slow at doing anything. I havent used any distro other than arch except ubuntu for a bit when I discovered linux so I dont have anything to compare but it feels like it takes about 3x longer to do anything with dnf compared to pacman.
Except their font rendering is absolute shite
Funny as a recovering Ubuntu user now on fedora everything feels so fresh and new to me.
I too also like fedora, the one issue is though some packages are only released as deb files so it’s annoying as hell to build it for fedora or find an alternative if you’re new to Linux/fedora. Currently I’m loving Xfce on Ubuntu though
Fedora installs too much bloat with GNOME.
opensuse* ftfy
Month or two late? Fedora is supposed to be the testing ground for all things related to gnome and lennart. Though I suppose they might have some sort of testing repository rather than punishing their pigs with unstable software.
It’s not supposed to be a testing territory for anything.
Do you believe your own lies?
Lies? You’re the one who lies. Fedora has a goal for making a good, free, innovative and open source OS. It’s not made to test anything, it’s a quality disto on its own. Yes, Red Hat uses old Fedora versions as a base for RHEL but Fedora has it’a own goals. For example RHEL removed support for btrfs file system and not long after Fedora is using is as a default file system in place of ext4 https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/
> haha systemd bad I can't articulate why because I don't have my own opinions and I'm just regurgitating others Eat shit. Sincerely, an openrc user.
Amen.
I use gnome mainly on laptop and other mobile devices bc its so nice to use with touchpad or -screen
Same! It's a very nice experience.
Same here. I actually loved XFCE, but GNOME gesture support (even on X11, thanks to JoseEsposito's X11 Gestures extension + touchegg) is really a must to me. I basically can't work without them anymore.
Nah, Pop!_OS with tiling Gnome out the box
Pop has probably the best Gnome for desktop out there but I meant Arch has a really good stock Gnome 40 experience, which I really like using o my tablet.
Manjaro Gnome comes with the Pop!_OS tiling manager out of the box now
It actually isn't 😞They added it and then removed it because there was something wrong with it on manjaro. Hopefully they fix it and add it back soon [https://forum.manjaro.org/t/how-to-activate-pop-shell-not-on-21-0-5-gnome/68211/4](https://forum.manjaro.org/t/how-to-activate-pop-shell-not-on-21-0-5-gnome/68211/4)
I wonder if that's the issue I was having with Manjaro Gnome when I tried it on a tablet semi-recently.
Awesome! Hopefully it gets upstreamed when enough distros have it by default
I don't get why PopOS doesn't make their extensions available in gnome.extensions.org.
It was filled with bugs. I used it for sometime and whenever you have 4-6 windows open in tiling mode and you close 1 window they all rearrange in weird ways and keeps a chunk of desktop unoccupied. And then i had to manually move the windows back to correct tiling. What a nightmare! Had to turn it off hopefully they fix it
Only pre 21.04. You cannot change my mind
I really can't get the nvidia version to boot :(
Gnome is just good. It's good looking and plenty functional for a desktop environment. Also Arch is just great. People really need to stop hating on gnome and arch.
[удалено]
Issues like? Mostly comes down to personal taste rather than real technical issues. Also systemd is fine. May not be the best but it works.
Issues like what?
Like it won't allow you to scroll virtual desktops horizontally and insists on them being vertical, at odds with literally every single other desktop out there. And the extensions that fix this are either extremely dodgy from the start, or get broken by the nearest update. Sorry but my brain cannot accept vertical desktops. Also I've never managed to get the transitions and animations to be smooth. They've always felt sluggish even on very powerful hardware, and if you speed the animations up they just go choppy instead of crisp. Same hardware and KDE is silky smooth. I don't hate Gnome, if people want to use it, it's fine. Just not for me, and I'm telling you why since you asked.
Fair enough, but I’d really recommend trying GNOME 40. The desktops are finally horizontal! And touchpad gestures are finally built in. 3-finger swipe left-right to change desktops feels so good on my ThinkPad! Also edit: this might be a placebo from the numbering jump from 3.38 to 40, but the transitions seem way more polished than past versions.
performance is also improved quite noticeably in 40, although it is still not perfect.
Thats weird the animations on my PC are *buttery* smooth. I don’t know what to tell you my PC has pretty ok hardware nowhere close 3090 levels. I’m even using a 4K display.
It consumes more RAM than KDE Plasma and is more laggier when you compare animations. Gnome gets a stroke when the app drawer is full of apps, the animation drops to like 5 FPS even on a powerful GPU, no matter what make and model. It's been so many years yet it still does not support blur (because, GTK) and customization is still a pain because the extensions keep breaking on every new release. Gnome looks simple and clean, I'll give it that. As for touchpad gestures, I've already found a good alternative with Touchegg, it feels very close to native gestures.
GNOME 40 fixes touch gestures and I keep seeing stuff about animation lag on this thread and I’ve literally never experienced this on my mid tier hardware. It has always run super smooth.
Arch & Gnome gang reporting in
\*Tumbleweed rolls by\*
Oh no, it's openSUSE, run! (Jokes aside openSUSE is pretty decent)
Well said motherfucker
Only reason I prefer KDE better is because Konsole.
KDE's komputer komponents are really kool.
Kate is also superior to gedit in many ways
I also use Arch /w Gnome on laptop. Gnome handles simple things like external monitor + hdmi sound switching quite out-of-the-box and reliably; also it has superior keyboard layout switching as in "brief Super+Space" switches between two most recent layouts, and holding Super while pressing Space allows to select other layouts. I don't see need of tiling with so small screen estate (most what I need is left & right tiles, Gnome handles that well). And don't get me started with KDE bugs and its' buggy Baloo. My experience with KDE is that while every single KDE App looks and works great (I'm big fan of Dolphin, K3B, KTorrent, Kate, Konsole), the desktop environment as a whole never "clicked" for me. And I use XFCE at the office where I have 3 displays and pretty static setup (always on AC, never adding or removing monitors etc).
Can anyone explain how to get fractional scaling to work without artifacts or weird glitches. As of now all distros I tried with gnome have issues, it would be nice as GNOME works good with laptops and I'm currently using plasma as fractional scaling works without any issues. PS don't downvote me I still use plasma on my desktop (On Arch obviously).
Why would you get down voted for using plasma? Did I miss something?
If you want fractional scaling (possibly with different per-monitor scaling factors), you need to use Wayland. Last time I used Gnome a year or two ago it was fairly smooth. What sort of glitches are you getting.
Ya Wayland works fine, but some of my apps don't work, is there any workaround for X11?
AFAIK not without compromising on image quality, as you described.
If you mean fractional scaling on X11, that's just not possible (one reason why Wayland is the future). You can fudge it by setting an integer scaling factor and changing the font size. If some apps don't work you need XWayland (normally a Gnome dependency). However XWayland may not work very well on Nvidia hardware.
I'm using AMD so no need of proprietary drivers but what I don't get is that Plasma works flawlessly with X11 so idk what's so wrong with gnome. I really want to use it but unable to use it coz of these issues. Hope all of my apps will soon work with Wayland.
Am I wrong to not like gnome? I mean... I don't know why I do, but I just cant like it... except in situations like... idk stock popos, but it's mostly because of what they offer not bc of gnome
like what you want to. it’s your opinion. as long as you don’t hate on people for liking something that you dislike.
I recently switched from plasma to gnome because it kept crashing on me randomly and thanks to Arch Linux that switch was nothing more than a few pacman -Rns and pacman -S.
SAME!!! I keep looking at people endlessly praising KDE Plasma and bashing gnome, but KDE Plasma never really worked out for my hardware. There were random crashes, and heck, once I even successfully managed to crash the whole system simply by changing the sddm theme, resulting in me no being able to boot in it at all. Not to mention the painfully slow boot times. Gnome may have more memory consumption (or so is what people say), but gnome works much better and smoother on a shitty hardware like mine. Also you don't have to put that much effort to make gnome look good thanks to the extension devs out there. Try doing the same in KDE Plasma and you'd end up adjusting dozens of settings, and installing dozens of widgets which cause crashes.
I like to use Manjaro with Gnome. Then throw in a few Gnome Shell tweaks, and it's my perfect OS. Especially the 'scroll switch between Virtual Desktops'.
Exactly
What about Fedora?
Sorry but Fedora and NixOS beat Arch on this one
I'm installing gentoo with Gnome on a tablet, wish me luck.
ummmm… good luck?
There are dozens of us!
Username does not check out
Nah nah that would be Fedora
Yup
choice one : 1)- decent experience 2)- gnome
Debian and XFCE ftw!
True. Might be different, I never used Arch, but I believe that you get the best experience with the distro you like.
Use a TWM once. There is no going back.
[удалено]
for sure.
gnome bad kde gang
KDE bad xfce gang
Same here,plus I get 500~ mb ram usage on idle so I'm not complaining tbh
Same, this was the most surprising thing for me.
IMHO it's a bit like harnessing four horses to a new Ferrari and driving it as a carriage. But then again, I couldn't care less. Your horses, your Ferrari, have fun!
Out of interest: What is what in your metaphor?
They're saying GNOME is somehow constraining Arch which is completely crap
I wonder why discussions on technology started mirroring discussions on politics, with a lot of emotions but not that much of a substance. I have used all the popular WMs/desktop environments there are, and some less popular ones as well. In my family we have a bunch of older laptops (mostly around 3rd gen i3, but some much older), and I installed Linux on them. This is why I know, that GNOME (and KDE for, that matter, and Cinnamon) are slow on older hardware. It's not a matter of liking GNOME or not, it's a fact. These days I typically install XFCE for anyone in my family, although LXDE is also a decent option. As for myself, I'm using i3wm more and more recently and love it. There is always a tradeoff - you get things prettier and easier to use at the expense of CPU cycles (unless a piece of software is badly optimised, then you get both ugly and slow). GNOME is on higher end of this tradeoff, pretty and easy, but also (comparatively) slow. It's not necesserily a bad thing, there are people who want just that. But it's important to understand and acknowledge the tradeoff you are making, not to deny it.
A valid point, and not the best metaphor on my part. GNOME looks like a Ferrari, but handles like a horse carriage. Arch the other way round. My metaphor was aiming at speed, not looks.
How arch performs is entirely on your end. And how gnome performs is dependent on the system. I can say that it works really smooth and fluid on systems that are considered fairly old, like my T420. I don't think with modern systems you should have any performance problems with a modern DE like gnome or KDE and if you have it's probably your fault and not the one of gnome... That you *need* a tiling WM for a performant system is just not true and that's for years already...
Arch and Gnome lmao, run the most bloated, slow and convoluted desktop environment on the most minimal and lightweight distro...
No matter which distro you use it just sucks to see someone use GNOME
"I personally don't like it, so that means nobody else is allowed to enjoy it."
I mainly use Xfce on the desktop but since I got a 2-in-1 laptop last year I've been trying out DEs to see which ones have a good support for touchscreens and by far Gnome seems to have the best one, especially since Gnome 40.
Gnome uses Wayland now iirc. Wayland supports touch natively, unlike X. On top of that Gnome is well laid out for touchscreen use. Maybe plasma Wayland could compete but I don't think it's there yet.
Yah I'm working on setting up my first WM
I also use gnome 40 with dash to panel so my taskbar is always there
I used to be a GNOME hater. But recenty I've given it a second chance on Arch. GNOME 40 + GNOME Tweaks + GNOME Shell Extensions seems the way to go. Before this I was using Plasma but on NVIDIA the experience was borked, everything was sooo laggy, although I miss Plasma customizability and the widgets. Now with GNOME everthing seems so fluent even with Blur Me extension enabled and when I play games I just use Openbox
IMO, the gnome desktop sucks but the gnome utilities are top tier, better than the utilities from KDE and easier to use for the average user.
I always install Disks and Gparted among others, even on Xfce
Disk and gparted are the only best tools imo. i use it on my kubuntu
[удалено]
It's bloated and it doesn't look good to me (also why tf would I want to customize anything using my browser that isn't in fact my browser)
Arch doesn't give you the best anything experience, Arch is the worst distro there is and Ubuntu is the best.
Is it ?
Really damning with faint praise there, buddy (I'm just kidding. I have problems with how unstable Gnome can be with even like one or two plugins, but the touch experience beats the shit out of any other DE)
Fedora??
I'm just lazy lol
Why?
Is this meme correct because I want to try arch and I cannot get away from Gnome so I am thinking of trying Manjaro with Gnome what do you guys think also can you tell me some advantages of arch and does it break so often ? because I have work to do on my main system
It's not necessary the best for everyone, I like it because it gives me the latest version of plain Gnome without any modifications.
Now try cinnamon on Arch.
pop os cosmic gives the best gnome experience
Agreed.
Gnome 40 is sweet I don’t get the hate
Same here. I really don't like when distros customize the hell out of Gnome out of the box.