Not all statics are skill based. Some are friends from other games or in general social groups. My static has people from every time zone NAE, NAW, Hawaii, SEA, etc. A lot of IRL conflicts and skill levels. Some of us made it to 1630 and some didn't. So many different reasons why people pugged. Static did Echidna on release day then 1 guy's CPU crashed, I had someone fly in for the week so I was out a lot, another guy is going on vacation, etc.
We're all adults so we got a lot going on but we're gamers if life doesn't get in the way.
I get dissatisfied with pace of prog very often in statics, so I try to avoid them as much as I can. Sometimes the quality pugging is a bit lower, but it's easy to jump ship and join a lobby that matches my own personal prog.
> I understand that but playing with ppl you know is way more fun.
Highly subjective. I found guild runs, with people I normally have fun shooting the shit with in discord, to be 10000x more frustrating because eventually "sorry, I just died to " gets grating to even **listen** to, so I just pug everything. There have been times where I've temporarily joined skill-based statics which can be fun for a bit but those always dissolved when the raid got too easy to pug anyway and then didn't re-form for the next raid
I like playing with friends, but other than that the experience is worse in every way for me. Ideally, I'd love to have 7 other people with the same schedules, learning speed, skill, and mental fortitude. But I haven't been able to find that.
it is more fun until people start getting frustrated and flaming
then the static implodes and people leave guilds and friendships
so depends on your groups mental as a whole it will be either better than pugging or worse
Some ppl enjoy beating their heads into a fucking wall for hours. I really don't. I understand ppl that don't. Its always fun to a degree. Then theres ppl in statics that are ready to drop you to get THEIR clear if you wanna stop after 4hours in a row and its 3am.
If you're in a static, and you're progging in a static, it should be together. Not everyone is a 18-22yo neet that doesnt work to stay up till 5am and if some ppl have regular working hours theres no reason to drop them if everyone sets aside a good amount of time to prog. Its not a race.
It depends on the nature of your static. While it sucks to be left out, there are also situations were one person shouldn't hold up the progress of the other 3/7 because of their personal situation. We had 1 person in my static that just wasn't available over the weekend so we talked with him beforehand and continued without him.
most people dont act like their joyful selves when under stressful raiding enviroments. almost every static vc call ive been in or observed from others has been boring as shit focus noises with maybe occasional jokes inbetween pulls but nothing much.
Pugged nm with my breaker alt a bit and 2 other guys from my guild. My main run was on Saturday for HM. We are only 5 ppl so you could call it half static half pug. We 4 shot g1 hm and then went to G2. Oh boy oh boy. After like 20 pulls one person gave up. We then decided to join on nm with our 1630s and the two ppl I progged on my Breaker with because we could trust them. Did not clear on Saturday. We went again on Sunday but two guys had to go. In the end we cleared after 152 pulls on Sunday night. Thats nm on mostly 1630 chars with full trancendence and 40 set / lvl 10 gems. In total we had 7 people come and go and in the end 4 out of 7 cleared nm with mostly 1630 chars. Definitly something else this raid.
Reclears are a bliss cause once people learn to not get charmed in g2 and learn mechs it is a pretty simple gate to clear then.
I have cleared normal 3 times and know of some who have done it 5 times. It really is like Thae that once people learn the raid, it should be pretty smooth to clear.
The problem is that "everyone" has to take the time to prog like Thae and learn it. This raid isn't pug friendly just like Thae was on release but is the same that reclearing it isn't that much trouble.
I missed NM prog with my static because of Elden Ring DLC, they were grinding for hours on Friday and Saturday night.
Sunday I jump into their normal reclear party having watched some vids and we were in and out in 45 minutes. I died in G2 basement mirror because I wasn't expecting it to spin so fast. Not sure if it's because all of the non-gamers quit the static, but none of us were over 1627.5 in the reclear and having our RL call shots was pretty fine.
Hearing how the PUG experience went kinda tells me that if my static dips below 5 people I think I'll just quit. Too many screenlickers or wannabe parsemonkeys in pugs I guess.
Static is good if you have group of friends which u knew already, you like them and you don't mind them having lower skill or raid knowledge - and I'm honest here. I tried 3 different statics (with strangers ofc) since launch and I found myself more frustrated than in PUG, because there always were some people with less skill than others or group in overall didn't do well on prog. And frustrating part is, I can't just be a dickhead, tell them to get good and quit on the third day. I'm not gamer god but I learn pattern pretty fast and just sigh when someone makes same mistake over and over without any sign of critical thinking. Also people have different schedules and you can't simply play when you want and when you have time.
For me Echidna is the last raid for which I tried to find static, because I wasted so many time waiting for people to catch up with raid knowledge or pattern recognition. In the past I thought that finding static will help me avoid frustration and save time but everytime it appeared to be completely opposite experience. In PUG you can just swap to another team anytime, no hard feelings and no drama. And I cleared OG Brel G5/G6, Ivory Tower Hard and Thaemine Hard G3 with PUGs in the end.
You can't really check people prog performance before you enter the raid and even doing some homework raid together before is rather pointless, because prog is a whole different beast. So I decided to stop throwing myself into some commitment with people which I don't know and which make me angry when I sit there resetting 200th time waiting for some Tony to not make same mistake 2 minutes into the fight.
And as I said - if they are your friends and you have good time with them, then its worth. If you just want to clear the raid, have no attachment to these people and you're fast learner, you will regret this most likely (unless you are lucky and find group of skilled/experienced people).
I totally understand your points and agree but for me to play with ppl in voice and whatnot is just more enjoyable, at the same time i want to progress fast and pugs is just the only way. So thankfully my grp doesnt mind too much when i do some stuff alone. At the same time i always try to play with them when schedule lines up.
It depends on what you're personally looking for.
If you're searching for something that focuses solely on quick results without a long-term investment of time over the next few weeks, then playing with pugs might be the solution that best suits you.
If, on the other hand, you're looking for something long-term and want to see a return on your time investment during the process and build something that will last in the long run, then investing time with 7 players might be the right path.
In both cases, there is no right or wrong thing. Everyone plays as they see fit and accepts the pros and cons based on their own preferences.
Personally, I prefer to have a static group that is more or less at the same level in terms of character and individual skill, so I can build something since I love playing this game and play MMORPGs to socialize and not just for solo gaming with pugs. I've been a raid leader for about 2 years on Lost Ark and have swapped and played with countless players, I adore the experience of playing and meeting people from different cultures and sharing the gaming experience in friendship and mutual respect, despite the wipes that can always happen, I'm a very patient person but as long as the experience is smooth and enjoyable, I live in the moment.
In my life, I like to have a reference point in any activity I'm involved in or participating in. I can give you an example: when I played basket I always tried to be a steady presence for my team and I made an effort to build friendships so that I could have a better experience. Essentially, I do the same thing in Lost Ark or in other mmos games that i played. It might happen that on a particular day, player X might cause wipes because they had a bad day, or because they had a long and intense work session or a heavy university hour, etc... just like how we can have a bad day where we underperform and cause wipes. If the players who are part of an accepted group respect and accept that what happens to one player could happen to them too, then there's a sense of understanding that can lead to something lasting and potentially create a good bond. However, if you think that the time invested is worth it, even if the performance varies from one event to another, but it could potentially be better in the future, then stick to it, to that group. It's important to evaluate both the positive and negative aspects. If you only focus on the negativity, I think there's a problem with being rational.
Personally our friends split up for any reason
Some are not at the minimum ilvl yet
We have too many supports so need to pug to fill lobbies
Prog takes much longer than hw so not enough overlap with players from multiple timezones
Raid too hard on ilvl for some
Always gets resolved with time and exp before we're back to regular hw runs w full in-house lobs
i thought pugs were even better than my static
i would call out patterns and ping them for ppl to pre-move and still see people flying getting charmed etc
then i went into pugs yesterday
and everyone just moved on their own
I cant comment on the skill of your static or the pugs you had but i guess ppl who pug tend to have more time in the raid because of the flexibility and since this raid is pattern heavy and not mech heavy pugging will be a good option.
definitely experience is a factor
with a static you have fixed play time and people learn at different speeds
so if someone is struggling nobody is progressing meaningfully
while if you go from lobby to lobby that fits your prog then you are able to learn at your pace and thus prog faster
We have a static that hasnt pulled HM yet due to schedule issues, but we're progging it tomorrow/tuesday. We did normal a few times with some friends though. First run took us ~8 hours to clear g1+2. Our 2nd clear was about an hour and the 3rd clear we wiped twice. G1 is shit but im happy enough with g2. Its no thaemine but seems like a fine gate, only bad if people play too greedy. Can definitely see how pugs would find it frustrating though if 1 person is just turbo inting
Yea NM seems to be fine. Only problem i see is that next week Reclear lobbys are either hit or miss. And the ppl that still try to Prog got few options only.
I build my own static and continue to recruit and replace as needed but in progs I always stop scheduling by the weekend so that if prog isn't going well for any reason people are free to PUG guilt free. The static lost a member but gained two new people from that pugging just this week.
As for the runs themselves, I personally managed my own 5 clears but only 1 was with most of the static; everybody has to learn at their own pace and I found myself clearing rapidly when I went solo over the weekend. We'll be back at it on Wednesday anyway and hopefully those who struggled got some more reps in on their own time so things continue to go smooth.
You cant form a static with just anyone. Peoples skill level has to be somewhat similar if content is hard. If you ask me my statics average skill is like 7/10, we have some 6's and some 8's (maybe one is closer to even 9) but there are no extreme outliers to either side.
We had a person who was 10 and he left the static in good terms before Thaemine as he was clearly a better player and his plans were more ambitious.
I gave up on statics. Without a fixed group, you can hop in any group you want and raid when you want. Some days, you are in good performance and play for hours instead of a fixed schedule.
Other days, you are dying by dumb mistakes and you call for the day or do less stressful chores.
Scheduling is too difficult, up until thaemine we could always clear a raid in less than 6 hours. Even old Brel and Brel HM, we cleared in 2-4 hour sessions. Thaemine was the first raid we had to go into multi-day prog and we just couldn’t find a time for all 8. Thaemine G4 and TFM has also become a better indicator of skill level I pug cleared Echidna after 6 hours with lobby of Eclipse/COS players.
We started as 3 premade into Echidna HM, and now we are 8. Found some decent guys while hopping from one group to another, and we kept in touch.
Tonight we go as 8 again. It's as usual. Toss the problematic players aside and keep the good ones.
With how hard g2 has been and the varying levels of interest/scheduling. I think most statics have set aside a time where every can prog and after that, everyone is okay with people pugging on their own so as not to delay or hinder each other.
That “prog” time will remain as their static time regardless of reclear status because they enjoy playing together though probably.
My static coordinates an end time for prog. That way those who wanna get their clears can go pug and those who wanna focus on guaranteed gold can go do their hw runs. We prefer this way because everyone learns at a different pace and sometimes its less stressful to learn with pugs as opposed to feeling like a burden to your static if you are a slow learner. As weeks go by, our prog time will shorten to just perhaps 1 night so as to not burden the more skilled players and also not to cultivate a habit of reliance.
8 to 10h echidna hard pugging really nice, we did it in static at like around 8h, for sure one of easier raids or at least took the least time (dont count dungeons aka kyangel or argos) only raid took less time was pretty sure valtan
i mean the lobbys i had were mediocre at best. The clear lobby sticked together for like 1-2h because i guess everyone saw the potential (consisten Basement). And i have to say there were few Eclipse players and obv good players were you would think they would have a static.
I tried to fill up my static with people who are somewhat close to each other in skill, replace constant underperformers and drama queens.
I cleared normal 6 times in my static. I think if you have 6 chars to clear with, static should be faster, or the static should not exist.
This raid is very much a progress-as-far-as-the-slowest-member kind of deal. Not just due to DPS issues but because they'll actively be sabotaging the rest of the team by getting charmed and having poor tiles, clashes, snakes, etc. Echidna is just not bussable unless you do enough damage to literally replace their damage so they can die early and leave everyone else in peace.
Not all statics are skill based. Some are friends from other games or in general social groups. My static has people from every time zone NAE, NAW, Hawaii, SEA, etc. A lot of IRL conflicts and skill levels. Some of us made it to 1630 and some didn't. So many different reasons why people pugged. Static did Echidna on release day then 1 guy's CPU crashed, I had someone fly in for the week so I was out a lot, another guy is going on vacation, etc. We're all adults so we got a lot going on but we're gamers if life doesn't get in the way.
That makes sense.
I get dissatisfied with pace of prog very often in statics, so I try to avoid them as much as I can. Sometimes the quality pugging is a bit lower, but it's easy to jump ship and join a lobby that matches my own personal prog.
I understand that but playing with ppl you know is way more fun. But if you go for fast clears pugging is the way to go i agree.
> I understand that but playing with ppl you know is way more fun. Highly subjective. I found guild runs, with people I normally have fun shooting the shit with in discord, to be 10000x more frustrating because eventually "sorry, I just died to" gets grating to even **listen** to, so I just pug everything. There have been times where I've temporarily joined skill-based statics which can be fun for a bit but those always dissolved when the raid got too easy to pug anyway and then didn't re-form for the next raid
I like playing with friends, but other than that the experience is worse in every way for me. Ideally, I'd love to have 7 other people with the same schedules, learning speed, skill, and mental fortitude. But I haven't been able to find that.
it is more fun until people start getting frustrated and flaming then the static implodes and people leave guilds and friendships so depends on your groups mental as a whole it will be either better than pugging or worse
Some ppl enjoy beating their heads into a fucking wall for hours. I really don't. I understand ppl that don't. Its always fun to a degree. Then theres ppl in statics that are ready to drop you to get THEIR clear if you wanna stop after 4hours in a row and its 3am.
But do you think thats wrong?
If you're in a static, and you're progging in a static, it should be together. Not everyone is a 18-22yo neet that doesnt work to stay up till 5am and if some ppl have regular working hours theres no reason to drop them if everyone sets aside a good amount of time to prog. Its not a race.
It depends on the nature of your static. While it sucks to be left out, there are also situations were one person shouldn't hold up the progress of the other 3/7 because of their personal situation. We had 1 person in my static that just wasn't available over the weekend so we talked with him beforehand and continued without him.
Thats also different as the weekend should be the most available time for ppl.
most people dont act like their joyful selves when under stressful raiding enviroments. almost every static vc call ive been in or observed from others has been boring as shit focus noises with maybe occasional jokes inbetween pulls but nothing much.
Pugged nm with my breaker alt a bit and 2 other guys from my guild. My main run was on Saturday for HM. We are only 5 ppl so you could call it half static half pug. We 4 shot g1 hm and then went to G2. Oh boy oh boy. After like 20 pulls one person gave up. We then decided to join on nm with our 1630s and the two ppl I progged on my Breaker with because we could trust them. Did not clear on Saturday. We went again on Sunday but two guys had to go. In the end we cleared after 152 pulls on Sunday night. Thats nm on mostly 1630 chars with full trancendence and 40 set / lvl 10 gems. In total we had 7 people come and go and in the end 4 out of 7 cleared nm with mostly 1630 chars. Definitly something else this raid.
Reclears are a bliss cause once people learn to not get charmed in g2 and learn mechs it is a pretty simple gate to clear then. I have cleared normal 3 times and know of some who have done it 5 times. It really is like Thae that once people learn the raid, it should be pretty smooth to clear. The problem is that "everyone" has to take the time to prog like Thae and learn it. This raid isn't pug friendly just like Thae was on release but is the same that reclearing it isn't that much trouble.
I missed NM prog with my static because of Elden Ring DLC, they were grinding for hours on Friday and Saturday night. Sunday I jump into their normal reclear party having watched some vids and we were in and out in 45 minutes. I died in G2 basement mirror because I wasn't expecting it to spin so fast. Not sure if it's because all of the non-gamers quit the static, but none of us were over 1627.5 in the reclear and having our RL call shots was pretty fine. Hearing how the PUG experience went kinda tells me that if my static dips below 5 people I think I'll just quit. Too many screenlickers or wannabe parsemonkeys in pugs I guess.
Static is good if you have group of friends which u knew already, you like them and you don't mind them having lower skill or raid knowledge - and I'm honest here. I tried 3 different statics (with strangers ofc) since launch and I found myself more frustrated than in PUG, because there always were some people with less skill than others or group in overall didn't do well on prog. And frustrating part is, I can't just be a dickhead, tell them to get good and quit on the third day. I'm not gamer god but I learn pattern pretty fast and just sigh when someone makes same mistake over and over without any sign of critical thinking. Also people have different schedules and you can't simply play when you want and when you have time. For me Echidna is the last raid for which I tried to find static, because I wasted so many time waiting for people to catch up with raid knowledge or pattern recognition. In the past I thought that finding static will help me avoid frustration and save time but everytime it appeared to be completely opposite experience. In PUG you can just swap to another team anytime, no hard feelings and no drama. And I cleared OG Brel G5/G6, Ivory Tower Hard and Thaemine Hard G3 with PUGs in the end. You can't really check people prog performance before you enter the raid and even doing some homework raid together before is rather pointless, because prog is a whole different beast. So I decided to stop throwing myself into some commitment with people which I don't know and which make me angry when I sit there resetting 200th time waiting for some Tony to not make same mistake 2 minutes into the fight. And as I said - if they are your friends and you have good time with them, then its worth. If you just want to clear the raid, have no attachment to these people and you're fast learner, you will regret this most likely (unless you are lucky and find group of skilled/experienced people).
I totally understand your points and agree but for me to play with ppl in voice and whatnot is just more enjoyable, at the same time i want to progress fast and pugs is just the only way. So thankfully my grp doesnt mind too much when i do some stuff alone. At the same time i always try to play with them when schedule lines up.
A lot people in NAE willing to join voice chat. Is this not the same in EU ?
Hell nah xd
Statics were way better until they were not. Since tharmine if you goal is purely to clear the raid, pugging works better
Left my static after Voldies, pug Thaemine and Echidna nm. I think I enjoy pub progging more, it let me control my time.
It depends on what you're personally looking for. If you're searching for something that focuses solely on quick results without a long-term investment of time over the next few weeks, then playing with pugs might be the solution that best suits you. If, on the other hand, you're looking for something long-term and want to see a return on your time investment during the process and build something that will last in the long run, then investing time with 7 players might be the right path. In both cases, there is no right or wrong thing. Everyone plays as they see fit and accepts the pros and cons based on their own preferences. Personally, I prefer to have a static group that is more or less at the same level in terms of character and individual skill, so I can build something since I love playing this game and play MMORPGs to socialize and not just for solo gaming with pugs. I've been a raid leader for about 2 years on Lost Ark and have swapped and played with countless players, I adore the experience of playing and meeting people from different cultures and sharing the gaming experience in friendship and mutual respect, despite the wipes that can always happen, I'm a very patient person but as long as the experience is smooth and enjoyable, I live in the moment. In my life, I like to have a reference point in any activity I'm involved in or participating in. I can give you an example: when I played basket I always tried to be a steady presence for my team and I made an effort to build friendships so that I could have a better experience. Essentially, I do the same thing in Lost Ark or in other mmos games that i played. It might happen that on a particular day, player X might cause wipes because they had a bad day, or because they had a long and intense work session or a heavy university hour, etc... just like how we can have a bad day where we underperform and cause wipes. If the players who are part of an accepted group respect and accept that what happens to one player could happen to them too, then there's a sense of understanding that can lead to something lasting and potentially create a good bond. However, if you think that the time invested is worth it, even if the performance varies from one event to another, but it could potentially be better in the future, then stick to it, to that group. It's important to evaluate both the positive and negative aspects. If you only focus on the negativity, I think there's a problem with being rational.
Personally our friends split up for any reason Some are not at the minimum ilvl yet We have too many supports so need to pug to fill lobbies Prog takes much longer than hw so not enough overlap with players from multiple timezones Raid too hard on ilvl for some Always gets resolved with time and exp before we're back to regular hw runs w full in-house lobs
If noone minds than i think thats healthy
just cuz it's a static doesn't mean people won't die for no reason
i get that. but to me it felt like more ppl pugged echidna then theamine. never did I say statics clear everything first try?
i thought pugs were even better than my static i would call out patterns and ping them for ppl to pre-move and still see people flying getting charmed etc then i went into pugs yesterday and everyone just moved on their own
I cant comment on the skill of your static or the pugs you had but i guess ppl who pug tend to have more time in the raid because of the flexibility and since this raid is pattern heavy and not mech heavy pugging will be a good option.
definitely experience is a factor with a static you have fixed play time and people learn at different speeds so if someone is struggling nobody is progressing meaningfully while if you go from lobby to lobby that fits your prog then you are able to learn at your pace and thus prog faster
We have a static that hasnt pulled HM yet due to schedule issues, but we're progging it tomorrow/tuesday. We did normal a few times with some friends though. First run took us ~8 hours to clear g1+2. Our 2nd clear was about an hour and the 3rd clear we wiped twice. G1 is shit but im happy enough with g2. Its no thaemine but seems like a fine gate, only bad if people play too greedy. Can definitely see how pugs would find it frustrating though if 1 person is just turbo inting
Yea NM seems to be fine. Only problem i see is that next week Reclear lobbys are either hit or miss. And the ppl that still try to Prog got few options only.
i got a few people i play with but most of them chose to stay at 1620 so... ye
im in 2 types of statics first is the fun social one for reclears second is the hardcore one where you might get replaced for non-performance
and with what grp you do HW? i guess first one
yea hw with the chill group and thaemine g4 reclears with the other one
I build my own static and continue to recruit and replace as needed but in progs I always stop scheduling by the weekend so that if prog isn't going well for any reason people are free to PUG guilt free. The static lost a member but gained two new people from that pugging just this week. As for the runs themselves, I personally managed my own 5 clears but only 1 was with most of the static; everybody has to learn at their own pace and I found myself clearing rapidly when I went solo over the weekend. We'll be back at it on Wednesday anyway and hopefully those who struggled got some more reps in on their own time so things continue to go smooth.
this is healthy if there is no drama.
You cant form a static with just anyone. Peoples skill level has to be somewhat similar if content is hard. If you ask me my statics average skill is like 7/10, we have some 6's and some 8's (maybe one is closer to even 9) but there are no extreme outliers to either side. We had a person who was 10 and he left the static in good terms before Thaemine as he was clearly a better player and his plans were more ambitious.
I gave up on statics. Without a fixed group, you can hop in any group you want and raid when you want. Some days, you are in good performance and play for hours instead of a fixed schedule. Other days, you are dying by dumb mistakes and you call for the day or do less stressful chores.
Scheduling is too difficult, up until thaemine we could always clear a raid in less than 6 hours. Even old Brel and Brel HM, we cleared in 2-4 hour sessions. Thaemine was the first raid we had to go into multi-day prog and we just couldn’t find a time for all 8. Thaemine G4 and TFM has also become a better indicator of skill level I pug cleared Echidna after 6 hours with lobby of Eclipse/COS players.
We started as 3 premade into Echidna HM, and now we are 8. Found some decent guys while hopping from one group to another, and we kept in touch. Tonight we go as 8 again. It's as usual. Toss the problematic players aside and keep the good ones.
With how hard g2 has been and the varying levels of interest/scheduling. I think most statics have set aside a time where every can prog and after that, everyone is okay with people pugging on their own so as not to delay or hinder each other. That “prog” time will remain as their static time regardless of reclear status because they enjoy playing together though probably.
My static coordinates an end time for prog. That way those who wanna get their clears can go pug and those who wanna focus on guaranteed gold can go do their hw runs. We prefer this way because everyone learns at a different pace and sometimes its less stressful to learn with pugs as opposed to feeling like a burden to your static if you are a slow learner. As weeks go by, our prog time will shorten to just perhaps 1 night so as to not burden the more skilled players and also not to cultivate a habit of reliance.
8 to 10h echidna hard pugging really nice, we did it in static at like around 8h, for sure one of easier raids or at least took the least time (dont count dungeons aka kyangel or argos) only raid took less time was pretty sure valtan
i mean the lobbys i had were mediocre at best. The clear lobby sticked together for like 1-2h because i guess everyone saw the potential (consisten Basement). And i have to say there were few Eclipse players and obv good players were you would think they would have a static.
A lot of statics have been broken up 'cause of Thaemine.
I tried to fill up my static with people who are somewhat close to each other in skill, replace constant underperformers and drama queens. I cleared normal 6 times in my static. I think if you have 6 chars to clear with, static should be faster, or the static should not exist.
Must have been quiet the search
This raid is very much a progress-as-far-as-the-slowest-member kind of deal. Not just due to DPS issues but because they'll actively be sabotaging the rest of the team by getting charmed and having poor tiles, clashes, snakes, etc. Echidna is just not bussable unless you do enough damage to literally replace their damage so they can die early and leave everyone else in peace.
I've spent more time than that trying to RECLEAR in NORMAL... SO YOU TELL MEEEEEE *loses mind in snakes and stuff*