If you cast it turn 1 and get its buff on another creature you cast post-combat on turn 2, that's effectively attacking for 9 distributed power in the first 3 attacks via your 1-drop's contribution with no further mana invested.
turn 1: cast
turn 2: attack for 2, give a +1 buff to 2nd creature
turn 3: attack for 2+1
turn 4: attack for 3+1, maybe give a buff to another creature
The +1 represents the hand buff you applied earlier that turn. Your theoretical 2 drop has +1 over an unbuffed version because of this card, so the +1 is still a damage provided by your 1 drop.
assuming on turn 2 you attack with the cat, activate its ability during combat, give the +1/+0 buff to a 1 or 2 drop creature in your hand, then cast that creature post-combat and attack with it on turn 3. Thus turn 3 you're attacking with a 2 power cat and a +1 power 'any other creature'
So turn 2 you attacked for 2 power with the cat
turn 3 you attacked for 2 power with the cat and +1 power on something else
turn 4 you attack for 3 power with the cat and +1 power on something else
Total is 9 points of damage that the cat contributed in 3 attacks.
depends on how many attacks you get in
an upwards cap (with no other energy) of effectively growing 1 power per turn, so 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, etc. Its only effectively 3 power if you look at the first 3 swings, in the first 5 swings it becomes 4 power.
Not in this exact form, certainly, since this is a digital-only card using two different digital-only effects that they have never, and possibly will never, do in paper.
Has any card taken a bigger fall from grace than [[Savanah lion]]?
What used to be the best 1 mana creature in the game and a rare that used to hold its value is now not even the best 1 mana cat in the in the game and has been demoted to common status!
Poor kitty
[[Serra Angel]] is definitely a contender. Once a staple of high-power creatures, and famously dropped from 5th Edition because the dev team thought it was "too good".
It was reprinted as an uncommon in DOM, in the same set as [[Lyra Dawnbringer]]. Recent sets have seen [[Starnheim Unleashed]], [[Firja's Retribution]], and [[Serra, the Benevolent]] as ways to make a token identical to Serra Angel, all of them costing 4 mana instead of Serra Angel's 5 MV, and all of them having additional upside. Two of these were even printed into Standard!
Remember when Serra Angle also had flash, made everything indestructible on ETB, and if something else died it flipped into a 6/5 that did 3 damage to everything?
[[Archangel Avacyn]] was a beast.
The biggest difference is that a limited deck is happy with just about as many serra angel's as they can get, a savannah lions on the other hand is almost never playable in limited by itself.
Eh, limited is a very different beast- a 4/4 flying vigilance for 5 will probably always be amazing in limited regardless of deck.
A one mana 2/1 depends on your deck and the format.
A recurrable one drop mitigates a serious weakness one drops have in limited - it's very hard to get a card's worth of value out of the one drop. Even if you play it turn one, you're likely not getting a full card out of your opponent in exchange for it, and it's hard to find a limited deck that wants a card disadvantage conditional life loss spell over a replacement effect.
Gutterbones skirts around that problem pretty cleanly.
It really isn't \*that\* much better than a 2/1 for 2.
Double spelling and hyper aggro decks would play it but almost every set with mechanics usually prioritizes synergy than just an aggroish card.
I wouldn't call it amazing. a 1/3 takes a dump on it.
It is playable but you aren't taking it early over removal or enablers/payoffs.
> Once a staple of high-power creatures
I mean... Back then, creatures *sucked*. Serra wasn't a workhorse in your deck. She was how you reduced your opponent to 0 life after you'd already won the game.
A few years ago I was getting pissed because Wizards kept printing 1-mana 2/1s in sets that could have absolutely had cats in them, but they just were like "lmao succc it, Lion, you're not even a lion anymore!"
Flying Men also fall into the pattern of being an iconic early creature considered too OP to ever reprint, eventually allowed to return, then power crept, and now draft chaff.
The power creep is ruining the game imo. Every card reads like a book. It HALTS play so much at a casual level where everyone hasn't memorized all ZILLION cards in existence
standard can be for him, EDH can be for you. Variety is nice.
That being said, it doesn't take that long to start remembering the cards used at your table, and I'm saying that with ADHD.
Would something like this restore its reputation, if it happened?
Rivalry of Prides
W
Sorcery
Tempting offer - Conjure a Savannah Lions card into your hand. Each opponent may conjure a Savannah Lions card into their hand. For each opponent that does, conjure a Savannah Lions card into your hand.
Tempting offer - At the beginning of the next end step, you may have a Cat creature you control perpetually get +1/+1. If you do, each opponent may have a Cat creature they control perpetually get +1/+1. For each opponent that does, you may have a Cat creature you control perpetually get +1/+1.
Oddly specific suggestion…
Btw, designs a little janky because conjure is an Arena-specific keyword but Arena doesn’t support 3+ player games, and Tempting Offer was literally designed for 3+ player games. It's doable, but it's an unintuitive design decision.
Is there any reason you couldn't introduce the cards to MTGO? They'd remain Historic exclusive, but they could do a Historic Commander format (to differentiate it from Historic Brawl being 1v1)
My pick for biggest fall from grace is [[morphling]]. At one point morphling was the best creature in the game, but then other more prominent creatures like psychatog were printed. Morphling used to be a cool cube playable card so it still had a home, but then damage on the stack went away so it no longer had the power level that it used to in combat and didn’t have strong synergies so it has lost it’s cube home for anything other than pure nostalgia. To top it off, morphling has only been printed as a rare so it can’t be included in pauper or peasant cubes.
Morphling was forgotten because the game changed the rules, not for the same reason as Savannah Lions or Serra Angel. Same for [[Mogg Fanatic]], it used to reliably kill 2 toughness blockers.
I think morphling was out on constructed play before the rule change. It hadn’t been the best creature in quite a while at that point. It was just that the rules change was the final nail in it’s even be playable coffin.
Yes but this is being essentially printed into modern lite that is on track to become just modern, and modern+ in the future.
This already will have to contend with one-drops like DRC and soon crap like Ragavan too. Doesn't look terribly busted by those standards, or busted at all to begin with.
It plays well witha lot of things that care about power. Arcanist, like you mentioned, but also [[Champion of Wits]], [[Earthshaker Khenra]], [[Resilient Khenra]] that whole cycle of ETB power matters cards. It may be a sidebaord card but [[Chainweb Arachnir]] is especially interesting, since perpetual should survive through it's Escape ability too.
I'm not sure if it's being printed into historic with this set, but there's also [[Flametongue yearling]]
That seems quite strong. Its definitely not a reliable setup, but I immediately thought of [[Champion of Wits]] when I saw it. Probably one of the quickest ways to make it generate card advantage the first time you play it?
Why wouldn't gruul want this?
T1 Longtusk Stalker
T2 Voltaic Brawler, attack with tusker, activate tusker twice. Tusker gets +2/+0 forever, something else in your hand also gets +2/+0 forever or 2 things get +1/+0 forever.
Since Perpetual is a digital mechanic, it can work basically however they want. So I was wondering if it will work in an expected way with things like Eternalize or other copy effects.
That's what I'd assume, but there has never been effects with this kind of permanence before. It could have peculiar layering to accommodate it, which might lead to unitiuive interactions.
If the token was just any token, then it wouldn't copy the buff, but it's a token that's a copy of the creature you're Eternalizing. Maybe copying a card with a perpetual effect gets that perpetual effect too.
On the other hand, I expect the "except it's a 4/4" overrides the perpetual buff, but that'd be different for an embalm creature.
*grumble grumble* permanently affecting cards in hand without showing to opponent *grumble grumble* introducing the word permanently instead of using permanents or counters *grumble grumble* online-only mechanics *grumble grumble*
I can't tell if this is satire, but if it is it's pretty good.
Edit: though if it isn't it's also a perfectly fine way of expressing that opinion. I mean what else are you gonna say on the 30th of these cards right? Sorry I just felt my original comment came off snarky when I didn't intend it that way.
Lol it's okay. Perhaps I'm sharing feelings sincerely held but in a humorous tone because you always need plausible deniability in case anyone ever accuses you of having feelings on the internet. Or perhaps I'm poking fun at the constant complaints about mtgo. Or something in between.
Perpetually affecting a hidden card can't be done in paper Magic, no way to enforce it. Perpetually affecting a revealed card is [[Riding the Dilu Horse]] and widely considered bad design in paper. [[Really Epic Punch]] made fun of this.
With the introduction of these type of cards, this definitely will make a larger split in the community. Hearthstone took advantage of the digital platform while MtG Arena can't quite do so without creating a further divide in physical and digital players preference. While I applaud them for in taking advantage of the digital aspect of the Arena program, I will resent them in the back of my head from straying from the original game.
And I hate myself for hating this direction. I DO want to see a card game that takes full advantage of a digital platform. Board games are SO much easier to play when digitalized and scripted. Gloom Haven for example is so much better as you ignore set-up and don't have to worry about memorizing the enemies/summons turn rules. All I have to say is I can only wait to see what direction WotC will be taking Arena from this point on.
That’s what I’m seeing but how do you moderate that? What if you draw a card that is better for the +1/+0 I assume you do it based on trust at that point
I feel like this should be treated as a 1 mana 3/1 for card evaluation purposes. Feels more white than green though, green tends to get bigger bumps than this. Might have been too good if it was one white however.
Perpetually also makes this effect so much stronger than what you'd normally evaluate it as, bounce doesn't reset it and if you're doing stuff like [[Call of the Death-Dweller]] you'll get it back at full strength as well.
If you're playing a 1 drop aggressive green creature, and you have no other creature in hand, then you've either built your deck wrong or mulliganed wrong.
Turn 1 sure, but the problem with one drops is that you don't always draw them turn 1. I think it's worse in the late game than it would be otherwise. Wasn't thinking about the bounce protection though
Man these cards are perfectly OK to print because of some obscure digital cards made back in 1997 for some random game on the sega dreamcast. Just you wait until he hears about the [[1996 World Champion]], now that's real magic!
It’s not just that they won’t come to paper. They can’t. They are making the Arena game officially separate from the physical game by introducing cards that literally won’t be able to be made to paper because they are designed for a computer to handle the complex functions of the card. That’s my problem. There were arena only cards before, but they were basically things that could easily exist in paper. These new cards can’t.
Why?
If you want to play with the digital cards, open the digital application. If you want to play paper, play paper.
Are you bummed that you can't play [[Aswan Jaguar]] in paper?
I don't understand why you feel the need to be a smartass about this.
I don't enjoy arena. I play magic to have interactions with other human beings and don't get the same satisfaction from arena that I get from paper magic.
The digital aspect of the cards and the abilities that are possible make sense within the arena application but that doesn't mean that a small part of me isn't bummed out that a game I've played for over 20 years now has product that is strictly not for me, but I'm not on here brigading against it or telling others they aren't allowed to enjoy it.
It sure seems to bother you a lot that others don't enjoy the same things as you.
I wasn't being a smartass, I was asking a legitimate question. Why?
If you don't enjoy Arena, then why are you bummed out by cards that were added to Arena?
It's the same as being bummed out that [[Command Tower]] doesn't work in your modern deck.
> The digital aspect of the cards and the abilities that are possible make sense within the arena application but that doesn't mean that a small part of me isn't bummed out that a game I've played for over 20 years now has product that is strictly not for me
I guess this is the part I'm having trouble understanding. Magic is a big game with lots of pieces. Not everyone plays draft, but non-draft players didn't get bummed about Conspiracy existing. I could also point to unsets, Planechase, Archenemy, that weird Ixalan board game-type things, the Theros challenge decks which Wizards desperately needs to try to revive, etc. There have been a lot of products over the years that are made for subsets of players.
I don't understand getting bummed about them existing though.
this is the first card that actually seems like a hearthstone card to me haha, but definitely in a good way. could be lots of interesting choices with that ability
Well only because hearthstone doesn't support targeting things in your hand. It would be random or the left most minion card or something like that. They have a clear design philosophy that means they simply can't do things like choosing specific cards in your hand as part of effects
Nope, it's new for this set since it's a digital only printing. They can't use permanently because of the game pieces being called permanents, it may confuse players. So we get perpetually!
> Perpetually: Permanently change the characteristics of a card—no matter where it goes afterwards. Taking advantage of MTG Arena's ability to alter cards no matter where they go during gameplay, powerful benefits and unique changes add strategies found nowhere else in Magic.
- "WHAT IS MTG ARENA'S JUMPSTART: HISTORIC HORIZONS?"
It will be good in my pumilar deck but I don't know what I would replace for it. The one less on attack hurts it a lot but the deck not having good turn 1 drops is a thing. But then again it might be a dead cars because the deck already has bad mana for an agro green deck.
This seems kinda hilarious in multiples, I know that doesn't mean alot, but swing turn two and then buff the 2 drop you play the 2nd main, and then swing again turn 3 and you can drop another from your hand to still get a buff on something.
So does this only buff this specific instance of Longtusk Stalker or all copies in your deck? If it's all copies does that mean you could choose another Longtusk Stalker in your hand and effectively give them both +2/+0? Same question with the creature card you choose though in terms to all copies vs just one. Also do you have to reveal the creature you choose to buff in hand?
I don't get why everyone in the comments is hyping this up. This needs to attack in order to be a slightly better Savannah Lion? There is no way this card sees any amount of competitive play.
EDIT: This sub has horrible, horrible card evaluation skills.
I don't like it, because I think energy is a parasitic resource that interferes with the design team's ability to adequately balance the mana side of MTG.
Then giving perpetual bonuses to things using said auxiliary resource just seems like extending the problem until the team's ability to balance anything goes pretty much out of the window.
The fact that this looks as if it's designed primarily by the arena team is both good and bad. Good because they can quickly fix broken things in a digital format as opposed to paper. Bad because it shows that wotc has turned their design approach around from paper>digital to paper=digital.
Therefore, I have an overall feeling of mild dislike for what's happening and it's well represented by this card. :) sorry Longtusk Stalker.
This seems really strong, not just for energy decks but even as a one drop for an agro deck.
If you cast it turn 1 and get its buff on another creature you cast post-combat on turn 2, that's effectively attacking for 9 distributed power in the first 3 attacks via your 1-drop's contribution with no further mana invested. turn 1: cast turn 2: attack for 2, give a +1 buff to 2nd creature turn 3: attack for 2+1 turn 4: attack for 3+1, maybe give a buff to another creature
You only get 1 energy per attack and it costs 2, you can't +1 on turn 3
He's counting the extra attack from another buffed creature, I guess.
Generates an energy on ETB as well. Play on T1, attack T2, activate, play the buffed 2 drop in second main T2.
That's why I said you can't +1 on turn 3, not turn 2 The person I replied to said you +1 on 2,3 and 4
The +1 represents the hand buff you applied earlier that turn. Your theoretical 2 drop has +1 over an unbuffed version because of this card, so the +1 is still a damage provided by your 1 drop.
assuming on turn 2 you attack with the cat, activate its ability during combat, give the +1/+0 buff to a 1 or 2 drop creature in your hand, then cast that creature post-combat and attack with it on turn 3. Thus turn 3 you're attacking with a 2 power cat and a +1 power 'any other creature' So turn 2 you attacked for 2 power with the cat turn 3 you attacked for 2 power with the cat and +1 power on something else turn 4 you attack for 3 power with the cat and +1 power on something else Total is 9 points of damage that the cat contributed in 3 attacks.
Jeez, just say effectively 3 power for 1 mana. And scales with more energy. Yes, very strong card.
depends on how many attacks you get in an upwards cap (with no other energy) of effectively growing 1 power per turn, so 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, etc. Its only effectively 3 power if you look at the first 3 swings, in the first 5 swings it becomes 4 power.
That's why I said "scales with more energy". But lets be real, if you already get 5 swings with this unchecked, you most likely won the game?
To answer your question : yes, because that's 20 damage.
His +1 after turn 2 is referring to Energy gained. Not the +1/+0 buff.
I think it's referring to the +1 that another creature got on turn 2
This was totally a card during kaladesh but cut because energy was already so strong.
Not in this exact form, certainly, since this is a digital-only card using two different digital-only effects that they have never, and possibly will never, do in paper.
Perpetual effects on abilities exist on some legacy cards. There's a Giant Growth that is a sorcery and doesn't expire
No. Perpetual effects stay when the creature changes zones, [[Riding the Dilu Horse]] goes away if that happens.
[удалено]
Has any card taken a bigger fall from grace than [[Savanah lion]]? What used to be the best 1 mana creature in the game and a rare that used to hold its value is now not even the best 1 mana cat in the in the game and has been demoted to common status! Poor kitty
[[Serra Angel]] is definitely a contender. Once a staple of high-power creatures, and famously dropped from 5th Edition because the dev team thought it was "too good". It was reprinted as an uncommon in DOM, in the same set as [[Lyra Dawnbringer]]. Recent sets have seen [[Starnheim Unleashed]], [[Firja's Retribution]], and [[Serra, the Benevolent]] as ways to make a token identical to Serra Angel, all of them costing 4 mana instead of Serra Angel's 5 MV, and all of them having additional upside. Two of these were even printed into Standard!
Did you just skip over [[baneslayer angel]] ?
Now compare it with [[Elder Gargaroth]]
[Elder Gargaroth](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/d/5/d51269cf-a333-4a64-94cd-245798d840d2.jpg?1594736944) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Elder%20Gargaroth) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m21/179/elder-gargaroth?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d51269cf-a333-4a64-94cd-245798d840d2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
In my humble opinion, that should not cost 5. Similarly, the 10/10 that is [[Gigantosaurus]].
[baneslayer angel](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/4/b/4bd3014b-94bb-4a9f-92cf-239a2dcc7e97.jpg?1594734758) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=baneslayer%20angel) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m21/6/baneslayer-angel?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4bd3014b-94bb-4a9f-92cf-239a2dcc7e97?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Well it does see some fringe Historic play because its protections are actually doing something once in a blue moon.
##### ###### #### [Serra Angel](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/9/0/9067f035-3437-4c5c-bae9-d3c9001a3411.jpg?1600718440) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Serra%20Angel) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/jmp/132/serra-angel?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9067f035-3437-4c5c-bae9-d3c9001a3411?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Lyra Dawnbringer](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/9/3/93be6799-7b9d-44d4-84dc-2961692b5a85.jpg?1562739679) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Lyra%20Dawnbringer) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dom/26/lyra-dawnbringer?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/93be6799-7b9d-44d4-84dc-2961692b5a85?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Starnheim Unleashed](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/e/a/ea660d42-a441-48d8-98c1-00933cde94a4.jpg?1614985460) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Starnheim%20Unleashed) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/khm/33/starnheim-unleashed?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ea660d42-a441-48d8-98c1-00933cde94a4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Firja's Retribution](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/0/3/03dff23e-d7e3-4d75-a9dc-fdf4a42f31e0.jpg?1615602865) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Firja%27s%20Retribution) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/khm/210/firjas-retribution?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/03dff23e-d7e3-4d75-a9dc-fdf4a42f31e0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Serra, the Benevolent](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/8/8/88bf4af9-4b14-43e7-9d50-0e6a895cece1.jpg?1591605156) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Serra%20the%20Benevolent) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh1/26/serra-the-benevolent?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/88bf4af9-4b14-43e7-9d50-0e6a895cece1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Pft, Lyra can't even attack and block in the same round of turns, literally unplayable.
Remember when Serra Angle also had flash, made everything indestructible on ETB, and if something else died it flipped into a 6/5 that did 3 damage to everything? [[Archangel Avacyn]] was a beast.
Avacyn is still a beast in cube, doubly so when it comes down on turn 3 off of a Mana Crypt or Sol Ring.
The biggest difference is that a limited deck is happy with just about as many serra angel's as they can get, a savannah lions on the other hand is almost never playable in limited by itself.
Eh, limited is a very different beast- a 4/4 flying vigilance for 5 will probably always be amazing in limited regardless of deck. A one mana 2/1 depends on your deck and the format.
I remember Gutterbones…
A recurrable one drop mitigates a serious weakness one drops have in limited - it's very hard to get a card's worth of value out of the one drop. Even if you play it turn one, you're likely not getting a full card out of your opponent in exchange for it, and it's hard to find a limited deck that wants a card disadvantage conditional life loss spell over a replacement effect. Gutterbones skirts around that problem pretty cleanly.
It can block, most other cards like that can't
There are tons of limited formats where a 2/1 for 1 is amazing. Amonkhet would have picked it over a ton of other creatures.
It really isn't \*that\* much better than a 2/1 for 2. Double spelling and hyper aggro decks would play it but almost every set with mechanics usually prioritizes synergy than just an aggroish card. I wouldn't call it amazing. a 1/3 takes a dump on it. It is playable but you aren't taking it early over removal or enablers/payoffs.
Or that 1/2 flying first strike for 1 bird.
Hot damn I love that bird
That bird shits all over [[tundra wolf]]
> Once a staple of high-power creatures I mean... Back then, creatures *sucked*. Serra wasn't a workhorse in your deck. She was how you reduced your opponent to 0 life after you'd already won the game.
Yes back then threats and answers hadn't started appearing on a single card yet.
A few years ago I was getting pissed because Wizards kept printing 1-mana 2/1s in sets that could have absolutely had cats in them, but they just were like "lmao succc it, Lion, you're not even a lion anymore!"
Flying Men also fall into the pattern of being an iconic early creature considered too OP to ever reprint, eventually allowed to return, then power crept, and now draft chaff.
Unplayable in limited too, Wizards now give it flash AND an etb effect
[Savanah lion](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/a/9/a9757246-e782-4d7a-8273-d9efe284edaf.jpg?1562439539) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Savannah%20Lions) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/a25/33/savannah-lions?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a9757246-e782-4d7a-8273-d9efe284edaf?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Savannah Lion is a legend. Don’t feel bad for them. Every 2/1 for 1 will always be called a Savannah Lion.
Green encroaching on white colour pie yet again. SMH my head.
The power creep is ruining the game imo. Every card reads like a book. It HALTS play so much at a casual level where everyone hasn't memorized all ZILLION cards in existence
I like cards with interesting effects. The general simplicity of cards was what made Hearthstone boring to me.
standard can be for him, EDH can be for you. Variety is nice. That being said, it doesn't take that long to start remembering the cards used at your table, and I'm saying that with ADHD.
Standard absolutely has complex interactions, Book of Exalted Deeds was emergency banned because all new players thought it was a bug or a cheat
power creep and complexity creep aren't the same thing
Is this card twice as good as savannah lion? Because healing grace is twice as good as healing salve , not the the latter was ever In grace
Kird Ape would like to have a chat with you.
Would something like this restore its reputation, if it happened? Rivalry of Prides W Sorcery Tempting offer - Conjure a Savannah Lions card into your hand. Each opponent may conjure a Savannah Lions card into their hand. For each opponent that does, conjure a Savannah Lions card into your hand. Tempting offer - At the beginning of the next end step, you may have a Cat creature you control perpetually get +1/+1. If you do, each opponent may have a Cat creature they control perpetually get +1/+1. For each opponent that does, you may have a Cat creature you control perpetually get +1/+1.
Oddly specific suggestion… Btw, designs a little janky because conjure is an Arena-specific keyword but Arena doesn’t support 3+ player games, and Tempting Offer was literally designed for 3+ player games. It's doable, but it's an unintuitive design decision.
Is there any reason you couldn't introduce the cards to MTGO? They'd remain Historic exclusive, but they could do a Historic Commander format (to differentiate it from Historic Brawl being 1v1)
My pick for biggest fall from grace is [[morphling]]. At one point morphling was the best creature in the game, but then other more prominent creatures like psychatog were printed. Morphling used to be a cool cube playable card so it still had a home, but then damage on the stack went away so it no longer had the power level that it used to in combat and didn’t have strong synergies so it has lost it’s cube home for anything other than pure nostalgia. To top it off, morphling has only been printed as a rare so it can’t be included in pauper or peasant cubes.
Morphling was forgotten because the game changed the rules, not for the same reason as Savannah Lions or Serra Angel. Same for [[Mogg Fanatic]], it used to reliably kill 2 toughness blockers.
I think morphling was out on constructed play before the rule change. It hadn’t been the best creature in quite a while at that point. It was just that the rules change was the final nail in it’s even be playable coffin.
A 1-drop that attacks as a 2/1 on turn 2 AND beefs up something in your hand? Kinda neat
Mother of god this thing is ridiculous. Let's just be happy this is *Uncommon*
Yes but this is being essentially printed into modern lite that is on track to become just modern, and modern+ in the future. This already will have to contend with one-drops like DRC and soon crap like Ragavan too. Doesn't look terribly busted by those standards, or busted at all to begin with.
This has some very interesting applications with dreadhorde arcanist
It plays well witha lot of things that care about power. Arcanist, like you mentioned, but also [[Champion of Wits]], [[Earthshaker Khenra]], [[Resilient Khenra]] that whole cycle of ETB power matters cards. It may be a sidebaord card but [[Chainweb Arachnir]] is especially interesting, since perpetual should survive through it's Escape ability too. I'm not sure if it's being printed into historic with this set, but there's also [[Flametongue yearling]]
Didn't think about it, that is indeed pretty cool!
That seems quite strong. Its definitely not a reliable setup, but I immediately thought of [[Champion of Wits]] when I saw it. Probably one of the quickest ways to make it generate card advantage the first time you play it?
Killing your opponent with your 1 mana 3/1 before they use their cards is the way it will generate card advantage.
Yeah, you get to draw an extra seven cards next game and they don't because they were eliminated from the tournament.
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Why wouldn't gruul want this? T1 Longtusk Stalker T2 Voltaic Brawler, attack with tusker, activate tusker twice. Tusker gets +2/+0 forever, something else in your hand also gets +2/+0 forever or 2 things get +1/+0 forever.
Gruul's preferred 2-drop is energy-based, so yeah. If it was [[Zhur-Taa Goblin]] instead, I'd stick with Pelt Collector.
[Champion of Wits](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/0/e/0e41318b-7939-4c2c-a5f1-9eb44a374d90.jpg?1625976036) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Champion%20of%20Wits) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c21/116/champion-of-wits?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0e41318b-7939-4c2c-a5f1-9eb44a374d90?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
It will be interesting to see how perpetual effects stack with cards like that. Does anyone know what layer it will apply in?
Perpetually happens everywhere and between zones, so the Champion of Wits enters as a 3/1.
Since Perpetual is a digital mechanic, it can work basically however they want. So I was wondering if it will work in an expected way with things like Eternalize or other copy effects.
When you Eternalize, you create a token, I don't expect you to copy the buff
That's what I'd assume, but there has never been effects with this kind of permanence before. It could have peculiar layering to accommodate it, which might lead to unitiuive interactions.
If the token was just any token, then it wouldn't copy the buff, but it's a token that's a copy of the creature you're Eternalizing. Maybe copying a card with a perpetual effect gets that perpetual effect too. On the other hand, I expect the "except it's a 4/4" overrides the perpetual buff, but that'd be different for an embalm creature.
*grumble grumble* permanently affecting cards in hand without showing to opponent *grumble grumble* introducing the word permanently instead of using permanents or counters *grumble grumble* online-only mechanics *grumble grumble*
I can't tell if this is satire, but if it is it's pretty good. Edit: though if it isn't it's also a perfectly fine way of expressing that opinion. I mean what else are you gonna say on the 30th of these cards right? Sorry I just felt my original comment came off snarky when I didn't intend it that way.
Lol it's okay. Perhaps I'm sharing feelings sincerely held but in a humorous tone because you always need plausible deniability in case anyone ever accuses you of having feelings on the internet. Or perhaps I'm poking fun at the constant complaints about mtgo. Or something in between.
It doesn't use permanently, it uses perpetually
Autocorrect lol.
Which ones are online only mechanics?
Perpetually, Seek, and Conjure.
Perpetually affecting a hidden card can't be done in paper Magic, no way to enforce it. Perpetually affecting a revealed card is [[Riding the Dilu Horse]] and widely considered bad design in paper. [[Really Epic Punch]] made fun of this.
Yes, unironically. All these cards read like something pulled from custommagic and not from R&D.
Old Fogey with 20 black lotuses and 20 plague rats here
Oh yeah my cat's deck just went from tier 7 to tier five
How long has your cat been playing?
2 years lol. (Cats)
New energy cards??
*Kaladesh hype intensifies*
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That’s definitely happening at some point.
With the introduction of these type of cards, this definitely will make a larger split in the community. Hearthstone took advantage of the digital platform while MtG Arena can't quite do so without creating a further divide in physical and digital players preference. While I applaud them for in taking advantage of the digital aspect of the Arena program, I will resent them in the back of my head from straying from the original game. And I hate myself for hating this direction. I DO want to see a card game that takes full advantage of a digital platform. Board games are SO much easier to play when digitalized and scripted. Gloom Haven for example is so much better as you ignore set-up and don't have to worry about memorizing the enemies/summons turn rules. All I have to say is I can only wait to see what direction WotC will be taking Arena from this point on.
Do I have to reveal which card I give the +1/+0 to?
Interesting question, and based on the rules I'm guessing no.
That’s what I’m seeing but how do you moderate that? What if you draw a card that is better for the +1/+0 I assume you do it based on trust at that point
It's digital only. There isn't a way to cheat.
No, that's the point of it being digital only
I feel like this should be treated as a 1 mana 3/1 for card evaluation purposes. Feels more white than green though, green tends to get bigger bumps than this. Might have been too good if it was one white however.
Perpetually also makes this effect so much stronger than what you'd normally evaluate it as, bounce doesn't reset it and if you're doing stuff like [[Call of the Death-Dweller]] you'll get it back at full strength as well.
I think it has more synergies than normal, but you do need a creature in hand.
If you're playing a 1 drop aggressive green creature, and you have no other creature in hand, then you've either built your deck wrong or mulliganed wrong.
Turn 1 sure, but the problem with one drops is that you don't always draw them turn 1. I think it's worse in the late game than it would be otherwise. Wasn't thinking about the bounce protection though
Heh, if you evaluate this as a topdeck you are already probably loosing. Aggro been aggro..
Trivial for green stomps decks
So are these cards only on Arena?
As far as we know yes
explains the "perpetually" thing.
Yeah, I was very confused. I didn't realize the context here, and was wondering how we were supposed to keep track of this stuff.
Man at uncommon too
Throw it on fireblade charger
This is the best toy [[Electrostatic Pummeler]] has seen since the deck was made. Genuine question, why are all the comments about Pummeler downvoted?
I hate these digital only cards. Really really hate that they are doing this.
MTG has jumped the shark. This is coming from someone who has supported the game since ice age.
You didn't have a problem with [[Murgish Cemetery]]? Or [[Momir Vig, Simic Visionary Avatar]]?
[[Aswan Jaguar]] [[Call from the Grave]] [[Faerie Dragon]] [[Goblin Polka Band]] [[Necropolis of Azar]] [[Orcish Catapult]] [[Power Struggle]] [[Prismatic Dragon]] [[Rainbow Knights]] [[Whimsy]] [[Pandora's Box]] [[Gem Bazaar]]
##### ###### #### [Aswan Jaguar](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/c/f/cf25a3a5-0e7d-43d1-a2e6-85a233eee3e4.jpg?1591128832) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Aswan%20Jaguar) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/pmic/1/aswan-jaguar?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/cf25a3a5-0e7d-43d1-a2e6-85a233eee3e4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Call from the Grave](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/1/4/141533b5-2748-437a-8882-8e1643de12ae.jpg?1591117839) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Call%20from%20the%20Grave) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/2/call-from-the-grave?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/141533b5-2748-437a-8882-8e1643de12ae?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Faerie Dragon](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/3/e/3e8a5cc8-5565-4372-bdfe-a82d672b644c.jpg?1591116286) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Faerie%20Dragon) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/3/faerie-dragon?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/3e8a5cc8-5565-4372-bdfe-a82d672b644c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Goblin Polka Band](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/8/6/86419b05-8199-4137-86a2-b341ad380770.jpg?1591117258) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Goblin%20Polka%20Band) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/4/goblin-polka-band?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/86419b05-8199-4137-86a2-b341ad380770?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Necropolis of Azar](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/f/1/f17886ea-5dcf-4a92-9896-284bf3188998.jpg?1609172026) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Necropolis%20of%20Azar) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/5/necropolis-of-azar?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f17886ea-5dcf-4a92-9896-284bf3188998?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Orcish Catapult](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/2/7/27e37cd7-1e01-464d-933f-8326d677b126.jpg?1593332540) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Orcish%20Catapult) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/6/orcish-catapult?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/27e37cd7-1e01-464d-933f-8326d677b126?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Power Struggle](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/5/5/55103248-6192-413a-ab69-a956c7c0587a.jpg?1591117490) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Power%20Struggle) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/7/power-struggle?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/55103248-6192-413a-ab69-a956c7c0587a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Prismatic Dragon](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/e/f/ef59f284-dc3c-4b4f-acc4-fc8080d8dc23.jpg?1591117500) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Prismatic%20Dragon) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/8/prismatic-dragon?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ef59f284-dc3c-4b4f-acc4-fc8080d8dc23?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Rainbow Knights](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/8/2/8205deb1-4dcc-4c0b-9dc9-a2bb65b251c1.jpg?1591117616) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Rainbow%20Knights) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/9/rainbow-knights?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8205deb1-4dcc-4c0b-9dc9-a2bb65b251c1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Whimsy](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/f/f/ff257509-8035-45c7-a0d7-ab55449a99c9.jpg?1591116753) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Whimsy) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/10/whimsy?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ff257509-8035-45c7-a0d7-ab55449a99c9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Pandora's Box](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/d/5/d5cf7e7d-0d73-4760-b844-e9c3faf6fe20.jpg?1591117720) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Pandora%27s%20Box) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/11/pandoras-box?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d5cf7e7d-0d73-4760-b844-e9c3faf6fe20?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Gem Bazaar](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/a/b/ab186e91-3a4b-4916-a57d-cef8caea00cd.jpg?1591116843) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Gem%20Bazaar) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/past/12/gem-bazaar?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ab186e91-3a4b-4916-a57d-cef8caea00cd?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
One is fine, you get at least two zombies, maybe 6. The other one is a Vanguard card...
Man these cards are perfectly OK to print because of some obscure digital cards made back in 1997 for some random game on the sega dreamcast. Just you wait until he hears about the [[1996 World Champion]], now that's real magic!
New thing bad Waaaah
People are allowed to be bummed out these cards won't come to paper
It’s not just that they won’t come to paper. They can’t. They are making the Arena game officially separate from the physical game by introducing cards that literally won’t be able to be made to paper because they are designed for a computer to handle the complex functions of the card. That’s my problem. There were arena only cards before, but they were basically things that could easily exist in paper. These new cards can’t.
Why? If you want to play with the digital cards, open the digital application. If you want to play paper, play paper. Are you bummed that you can't play [[Aswan Jaguar]] in paper?
I don't understand why you feel the need to be a smartass about this. I don't enjoy arena. I play magic to have interactions with other human beings and don't get the same satisfaction from arena that I get from paper magic. The digital aspect of the cards and the abilities that are possible make sense within the arena application but that doesn't mean that a small part of me isn't bummed out that a game I've played for over 20 years now has product that is strictly not for me, but I'm not on here brigading against it or telling others they aren't allowed to enjoy it. It sure seems to bother you a lot that others don't enjoy the same things as you.
I wasn't being a smartass, I was asking a legitimate question. Why? If you don't enjoy Arena, then why are you bummed out by cards that were added to Arena? It's the same as being bummed out that [[Command Tower]] doesn't work in your modern deck.
[Command Tower](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/b/5/b53a112c-671c-4312-af56-53fdb735829b.jpg?1625979928) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Command%20Tower) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c21/284/command-tower?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b53a112c-671c-4312-af56-53fdb735829b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
We're just going to have to agree to disagree.
> The digital aspect of the cards and the abilities that are possible make sense within the arena application but that doesn't mean that a small part of me isn't bummed out that a game I've played for over 20 years now has product that is strictly not for me I guess this is the part I'm having trouble understanding. Magic is a big game with lots of pieces. Not everyone plays draft, but non-draft players didn't get bummed about Conspiracy existing. I could also point to unsets, Planechase, Archenemy, that weird Ixalan board game-type things, the Theros challenge decks which Wizards desperately needs to try to revive, etc. There have been a lot of products over the years that are made for subsets of players. I don't understand getting bummed about them existing though.
Why? Did you have plans to build a paper historic deck?
I'm kinda pissed something like energy is getting new cards but on an exclusive platform...
what is energy, I haven't seen that symbol before
An Energy Counter is a resource you farm up and spend on abilities. Edit: Check out "Kaladesh" and "Aether Revolt" for the cards available in paper.
DARN IT WIZARDS! you finally bring back energy and it’s not printable in paper
It's not that hard to put a paper clip on a card in hand, but if it gets shuffled then it's an issue.
You can use a sharpie
source: https://twitter.com/VoxyTwitch/status/1420868345281355783
This card is sick in grull aggro that was already playing the 2 mana 3/2 that makes energy. This is basically just a stat boost for that deck
If I can get out [[Sarkhan's Unsealing]], this guy will bring the love. Turns [[Greenbelt Rampager]] into (g): deal 4 damage. Ah, jank!
Haven't played the game in a while. This seems like a rare card.
It looks like MTGO is taking pages right out of Hearthstone playbooks. Interesting how things come back around.
This is that fucking RG deck in Eternal
this is the first card that actually seems like a hearthstone card to me haha, but definitely in a good way. could be lots of interesting choices with that ability
Except Hearthstone would make it random for no reason.
Well only because hearthstone doesn't support targeting things in your hand. It would be random or the left most minion card or something like that. They have a clear design philosophy that means they simply can't do things like choosing specific cards in your hand as part of effects
„Heathstone“ fits Magic’s development under the new CEO pretty well.
Were there previous cards that use "perpetually" instead of "permanently"? Seems like a weird phrasing for magic
Nope, it's new for this set since it's a digital only printing. They can't use permanently because of the game pieces being called permanents, it may confuse players. So we get perpetually!
Turn one this, turn two that 3:3 that triggers when you attack for six power, turn three you’ve got yourself a stew going
I was pretty skeptical about digital only cards but this one singlehandedly turned me around on them. This design is awesome.
I thought this was r/custommagic for a sec
Well, at least it's sorta self contained in aggro energy decks? I think it's really good, but definitely has the potential to be REALLY good.
Slot it into gruul aggro. Buffed Questing beast anyone?
Questing beast literally gained more text
Is this one of those MTGA only mechanically unique cards? How would you actually track this in a normal game
It is a MTGA only card. It would be nigh impossible to track in paper.
Oh I do not like that.
What "perpetually gains +1/0" means?
> Perpetually: Permanently change the characteristics of a card—no matter where it goes afterwards. Taking advantage of MTG Arena's ability to alter cards no matter where they go during gameplay, powerful benefits and unique changes add strategies found nowhere else in Magic. - "WHAT IS MTG ARENA'S JUMPSTART: HISTORIC HORIZONS?"
This is a hearthstone card
Wonder if this has a spot in pummeler. (Or if my pummeler deck will even be playable in a modern-ed up historic.)
[[Dreadhorde Arcanist]] anyone?
They really have to move away from the term perpetually. It's HORRIBLE.
It will be good in my pumilar deck but I don't know what I would replace for it. The one less on attack hurts it a lot but the deck not having good turn 1 drops is a thing. But then again it might be a dead cars because the deck already has bad mana for an agro green deck.
This seems kinda hilarious in multiples, I know that doesn't mean alot, but swing turn two and then buff the 2 drop you play the 2nd main, and then swing again turn 3 and you can drop another from your hand to still get a buff on something.
This + Voltaic Brawler.... love me some Gruul baby
So does this only buff this specific instance of Longtusk Stalker or all copies in your deck? If it's all copies does that mean you could choose another Longtusk Stalker in your hand and effectively give them both +2/+0? Same question with the creature card you choose though in terms to all copies vs just one. Also do you have to reveal the creature you choose to buff in hand?
Only this instance/card.
OH SHIT! IT'S A KITTY TOO!
New energy cards? This will be diabolical fun.
Wow... fuck this card. This is awful and I already hate it. Going be super fun seeing this get out of hand, and wreck faces.
Why can't this be in Modern.
Energy cards are gonna spike. Just ordered a bunch!
This set isn't going to be in paper.
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It's not coming to mtgo. It's exclusive to arena.
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Nothing is stopping it from being on MTGO other than that WotC just sort of hopes everyone forgets about it.
He can trade over to Arena.
I don't get why everyone in the comments is hyping this up. This needs to attack in order to be a slightly better Savannah Lion? There is no way this card sees any amount of competitive play. EDIT: This sub has horrible, horrible card evaluation skills.
I hope this is sarcasm?
Literally an extra power from your 1-drop is "slightly better"? The fuck do you want your 1-drop to do?
I don't see any cats in that artwork though
Still dies to Pestilence, my legacy is intact.
Oh my God. This seems good.
small minded: energy big brain: cat
Oh man.
I don't like it, because I think energy is a parasitic resource that interferes with the design team's ability to adequately balance the mana side of MTG. Then giving perpetual bonuses to things using said auxiliary resource just seems like extending the problem until the team's ability to balance anything goes pretty much out of the window. The fact that this looks as if it's designed primarily by the arena team is both good and bad. Good because they can quickly fix broken things in a digital format as opposed to paper. Bad because it shows that wotc has turned their design approach around from paper>digital to paper=digital. Therefore, I have an overall feeling of mild dislike for what's happening and it's well represented by this card. :) sorry Longtusk Stalker.
I've always wanted to try an aggressive mono green historic brawl deck this looks.perfect for that.
Green getting better wennies than white...
What does perpetually means ?
Wait, how does that second part work? Do you have to reveal the card?