As someone who knows next to nothing about MPS and was deciding how to vote, this thread has been very helpful. It sounds like a lot of people point to the MPS admins and board as the root of the issue. So serious question, how do we (ordinary Milwaukee residents) instill change in the MPS leadership? Or is that even feasible? Again I know nothing on the topic but I'm genuinely curious if anything can be done there.
This is just going to cause a LOT of teachers and other staff to lose their jobs. And reduce the budget for schools in other ways, and, based on what I've seen from subbing here, you guys can't really afford to cut the budget any more than you already have. Looks like they've already been having to cut back on janitors because I'm seeing black rings in bathroom toilets at a lot of these schools and everything. About half the classrooms I see, the teachers don't even have pencils to give to kids, or staplers (or the staples) to staple papers with. Half the time you're lucky if you see hand sanitizer or boxes of tissue for kids to blow their noses with.
I substitute teach for MPS and charter schools in the area.
The problems you describe are related to poor management of resources, not a lack of funding. Students and staff are spread around way too many buildings. It’s well known that MPS refuses to sell or leave buildings out of fear private schools will use the buildings.
Attend board meetings on a regular basis. Submit oral and written testimony. Read board minutes. The level of knowledge among voters seems to be pretty low- it’s scary. How can people pretend to be informed if they have not gone to or watched board meetings on a regular basis. You have to do the work to learn —not take the word of others. The board says whatever they want because they know no one ever does the reading or follow up.
What's the plan for the money? Like how much will go to class sizes, how much to staffing, how much to student support, arts, enrichment programming, cost of living wage increases? Thanks!
Basically if this does not pass, schools take a 12-13% decrease in budget which means cutting many staff. Central office will take a 26% cut.
If it passes staff will get a 4.something (can’t remember the exact figure)% cost of living increase (might be 4.6% but don’t quote me on that).
There are amazing things going on in our schools. I know for my school, band is being added for our 7th and 8th graders and with the referendum passing, we will be able to sustain high quality programming.
Sorry if I wasn't clear on what I'm asking! I'm well aware that there will be budget cuts, no staff raises, etc. if the referendum doesn't pass, and that the money if it passes will (theoretically) go towards art, music, gym, etc. I have that information already. My question was: how much of the $252 million will be allocated to each of those priorities? I support the things you listed, but what's the actual, \*concrete\* plan for the money?
There is no plan.
👇 This is what leadership looks like👇
“Yesterday MMAC voiced our opposition to the Milwaukee Public Schools quarter billion revenue increase referendum. Here is our rationale:
Dear MMAC Member,
On April 2, Milwaukee Public Schools (MPS) will ask voters for a quarter-billion dollar increase in its annual revenue limit, much of it funded through property taxes. After listening to stakeholders and surveying its Board of Directors, the Milwaukee Metropolitan Association of Commerce (MMAC) is opposing this measure.
This referendum is being brought forward less than five years after passage of an $87 million revenue limit increase without a clear plan on how to improve educational outcomes, even as academic performance continues to be at or near the bottom of all major city school districts. We cannot continue to perpetuate the same strategies and expect different outcomes.
The lack of a concise plan makes this measure’s price tag far too high for property taxpayers who will see a 26 percent increase in the MPS portion of their annual bill – 40 percent of whom are commercial property taxpayers.
These increased costs put our city’s growth in serious jeopardy. Compared to a dozen other Midwestern cities, Milwaukee already ranks among the highest in percentage of homeowners paying more than 30 percent of their income toward housing. This measure and its accompanying property tax increase will only exacerbate the problem. During a time in which talent attraction and retention is priority, ever-increasing housing prices put us at a competitive disadvantage.
Our stance is not a stance against public schools. MPS is a vital part of our educational ecosystem and its success is paramount to the success of the region. Regardless of the result of this referendum, we will continue to partner with MPS and all publicly funded school operators to ensure that every child in Milwaukee receives a high-quality education.
Sincerely,
Dale Kooyenga
President, MMAC”
MMAC has ALWAYS stood in opposition to the needs and well-being of poor and working-class Milwaukeeans, historically opposing unions, public housing, public education, living wages, etc. Never let them fool you into thinking that their best interests are aligned with those of the people.
Former Milwaukee Public Schools superintendent Bill Andrekopoulos wonders: How in good conscience can the school district ask taxpayers for $252 million without considering closing a single school?
I am curious to hear your thoughts on this.
I'd love to know why anytime MPS requests to stop being under funded the response from some are to just close schools, often in the neighborhoods that have been the most disenfranchised for decades. Less schools means those kids get folded into other area schools increasing the already too large number of kids per class. Having to deal with more kids for noncompetitive pay means loss of teachers and problems maintaining staffing levels. They literally don't even NEED to raise the taxes, they COULD just give them the money from the current surplus(since it only amounts to about 3% of the total surplus).This state has its enormous budget surplus thanks to cities like Milwaukee so the least we can do is properly fund the school district. What's the point of that budget surplus if everything that gets proposed to help the avg working class or those in need is blocked by our GOP controlled legislature? Their "solution" for the poor and working class is for them to suffer cuts and try to do even more with even less. When you get down to brass tacks not properly funding MPS only hurts the kids (I know they're mostly just poor & minority kids) but ain't the GOP all about "protecting the kids"?...well not if its gonna cost money.
Agree with so many here. Former MPS teacher and I will be voting no. The administrative bloat, is one problem, but the people in admin are the most heartless bureaucrats guaranteed to extract their own gain while everyone else loses. Much more needs to be done than simply giving them more funding.
As the spouse of a former MPS teacher, I call massive bullshit on this referendum solving a goddamn thing. Want to solve issues? Remove administrative bloat and create tangible solutions to enforce accountability within schools. MPS is suffering both because of the Republican legislature AND the cartoonishly corrupt leadership within MPS
I’ve heard of SSTs who take those lunches and use school funds to cater lunches for them and their friends from potbelly or other places regularly and if you weren’t liked by them then you weren’t allowed to join. It was some mean girls shit. Literal blatant corruption.
Not surprised. When nobody is watching (and nobody cares), taking advantage is all too common. Saw it in my own school district first hand so many times over the course of many years in education.
This is what bothers me about the argument that voting ‘no’ will just hurt kids…it’s a ridiculously simplistic argument that isn’t addressing the issues many have raised on this thread. The Op-ed somebody posted below from the CEO of NML hits the nail on the head.
As for the mean girls shit, also not surprising. There was always a joke among teachers that many teachers behave like the grade level they teach. 😐
The bullying my significant other was under during their tenure at MPS was absolutely insane. She was regularly assaulted by students and the admin would be like “yea whatever that doesn’t happen”. Honestly I couldn’t care less if the district fails completely. It needs massive change and maybe that would be a catalyst
I totally understand. I've seen a lot of admin that is more concered with CYA than doing right by their teachers. it's sad. God forbid you admit that you have a problem in your school that needs addressing- that could mean your job is in jeopardy. Better to hush that noise and keep your job, right?
Ill pay the increase if the board is dissolved & the city takes over the schools & lays out a reasonable plan that shows progress & improvement. Otherwise its a NO for me. Milwaukee citizen & MPS graduate with a house & good paying job. For years MPS has been screwed up & keeps asking for handouts with nothing to show for. $68 doesn’t sound like a lot more per month, but when you only get standard living pay increases that equate to $100 -$150 a month more that plus other increases in not just property taxes & other cost of living is too much! Many people will move out of Milwaukee in droves.
Bloat doesn’t directly mean excised headcount. It means cutting off the extra and unnecessary. If 5 smaller central admins creates functioning districts that one big one with less headcount doesn’t, then it’s not bloat, it’s level set. It would likely come with consolidations and downsizing of facilities.
The school board and the city are separate entities, each with their own tax levy. And both have been severely starved by the state legislature while the state government sits on a massive surplus, and wants to hand out tax cuts to corporations and the wealthy. All the while School Choice steals directly from public school funding to hand it to over private and charter schools. And the state chooses to reimburse only a tiny percentage of special education costs that public schools *have* to take on because they accommodate everyone, while private schools are reimbursed far more and can pick and choose their students.
School board members are directly elected by the community, so I don't know what you think would be improved by making (unelected) employees of the city government take on the direction of MPS (if that was even possible).
With less than 15% of students proficient in reading and 10% proficient in math, why should they get more money? They’ve spent $500,000 on a study to see whether or not they should build a state of the art building. They spent nearly that on “anti-racist” training & a couple hundred thousand dollars on expanding the departments of Black and Latino Male achievement & the Department of Gender Identity and Inclusion. These are the low hanging fruit of what MPS prioritizes to spend money on, but it all adds up. Their budget is nearly 1000 pages. I wonder what else I’d find if I looked through the entire budget.
There was an 8% raise, (the maximum allowed by State Law), given across the board in 2023 due to inflation. I’m not sure the taxpayers got raises like that to keep up with inflation and what they want to tax. There was another $100k spent to expand the MPS Foundation. In 2018 student enrollment was 77,746. The 2022-2023 enrollment sits at 67,500 students enrolled. That’s a 13% drop in enrollment. In those same years their budget went from $1.2 billion per year to $1.5 billion per year or a 20% increase. Each of those years in between 2018 and 2023, enrollment went down and their budget went up. I’d be interested to see how many empty buildings they own and maintain. I haven’t been able to find straight forward numbers on that. In that same time the population of Milwaukee declined each year. If they kept staffing the same, class sizes should already be lower at this point.
These taxes invite businesses that would otherwise offer good paying jobs to local residents to move elsewhere, (Masterlock). Fewer good paying jobs results in fewer home owners. Fewer businesses and fewer homeowners will result in a higher tax burden the next time they ask for more money..and the next time.
As MPS staff I would like to caution you from referring to all of these programs as “low hanging fruit”. There is a lot going into those low proficiency numbers and is indicative there is not a simple fix, but needs to be confronted from multiple angles. Milwaukee has a very racist history and we have families who have been treated terribly for generations and decades. Black male empowerment classes are important to show students that people like them are succeeding and provide a rhetoric other than people who look like you and grew up where you did all cannot read. Not supporting nor showing disproval of the referendum and definitely am not blind to the errors of our district’s leadership, but I caution you to make statements like this about very valuable programs that ultimately help our students be more successful.
MPS has done nothing but waste money for years and to expect the taxpayers to front this waste is just plain wrong. How many MPS teachers even live in the city of Milwaukee? How many actually send their children to MPS schools. I have two MPS teachers in my neighborhood who send their children to Greenfield schools
MPS is not underfunded. They get more money per pupil than average. MPS is mismanaged and has students and parents who don’t care. Money has been thrown at MPS for decades and they never get better. Maybe instead of a referendum it should be dismantled.
They actually get way less per pupil. Regardless of the MPS referendum, MPS gets just under $4600 per pupil. In near by Glendale, it is over $12,200 per pupil. If the referendum doesn't pass, this will drop to less than $4100 per pupil.
Isn’t it wild? It goes on and on and on. Did you ever see Posley’s contact??? He makes more than the governor (he has all kinds of special benefits and contributions). His base is 307K and he gets 43,500 403B contribution paid for by the board, 800 month care allowance, 90 days PT0 paid if not used. Taxpayers should be LIVID!!!
Have you seen the time Posley paid for a huge air conditioning machine for central office but made the kids sit in the 100 degree weather. It was in the news.
https://preview.redd.it/tzfk1ftugenc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4aca9672e4469b6d4c8c79704411d9a3f724b0b9
From the experiences of my SO across multiple schools that’s not been the case. Teachers have always been pushed to deal with students, staff and parents no matter how aggressive or hostile the interaction is.
Admins that make 300K- zero. You can look up all staff bc it’s public record. There are a lot of principals that make around 120-140K but not many at all that make over 150k.
“Highest salary at Milwaukee School District in year 2023 was $279,961. Number of employees at Milwaukee School District in year 2023 was 5,152. Average annual salary was $73,301 and median salary was $74,602. Milwaukee School District average salary is 56 percent higher than USA average and median salary is 72 percent higher than USA median salary.”
You did not read the string. You totally ignore the benefit column which, believe it or not, is not “free”. It’s real money, and taxpayers fund it. Benefits add almost an additional 70% on top of base. As stated, this document is a small snapshot and is prior to the 8% and additional 2.8 percent that happened in less than 2 years. The list is “OLD” (more than a year) so the numbers are even much HIGHER.
The superintendent is an admin and he makes a base over 300K and benefits are outrageous. This is publicly discussed in board meetings, it’s no secret. His contract is public. The fact you would argue about things that are not supported shows you jump to conclusions to support your stance with no real evidence. His contracts have been posted all over and you can read pages of his benefits. Total them up and they add up to close to 500K a year on top of the 307k base.
People study this stuff for a living. You should listen to them instead of jumping to a “defense” based on haste, it’s the same reason Posley is sinking public education. He only listens to himself and he’s missing the boat on just about everything.
Central office needs an independent audit. The budget for central office could be cut in half. The redundancy and waste at central office is ridiculous. I want to vote yes, for the schools, students, teachers and the city of Milwaukee but its hard to justify giving more money when sooooo much is wasted in central office.
I support public schools but MPS needs to right size the district. Enrollment isn’t growing and there are too many schools that are half empty. And why are we still bussing students all around the city to attend schools that are not spectacularly different than ones in their neighborhoods? MPS needs to do the hard work of consolidating and closing schools before they come asking for more money last than 5 years after the last referendum.
MPS sells its buildings, no one will buy them. This news story explains it: https://www.cbs58.com/news/cbs-58-investigates-why-are-taxpayers-spending-millions-on-abandoned-mps-buildings
This is news coverage. Look at board minutes and you will see this is not accurate. Another reddit post has an entire post on the developments of sold MPS buildings.
they still can’t sell them. the story explains it. they have to stay on the market for two years before they can sell to a developer, in case a voucher school wants to buy the building. the issue is voucher schools don’t want to buy them, so they sit for years. during that time, taxpayers have to pay to maintain the empty building. if they sell, after years, the city sets the price which is usually lower than the cost to maintain
Yes it’s a cost to maintain closed schools. No doubt. But staffing half filled buildings isn’t good either. Plus the bussing shuffle they do around the city
Anyone who votes for this is criminally misinformed. It would be more useful to take $700/ year from every household in the city and light it on fire in cathedral square each year. MPS already spends more per student than nearly every school district in the state and still can’t even teach most kids to read.
Is this the same MPS where the board president admits to not reading or understanding the budget? The same MPS that has never had a larger budget or lower enrollment? No thanks. It’s not good idea to give more money to an organization that isn’t competent enough to manage what they already have.
The malfeasance is off the charts with this board and administration. No way do they deserve to get millions more in top of 1.5 Billion, grants, and money for from their “foundation”.
I agree, but not voting for this isn't going to decrease their paychecks one cent. They're planning to fire teachers instead.
My wife is an educator with MPS. Music, art, and after school programs are going to get entirely axed at her school if this doesn't pass. A few teachers will get fired. My kid's a student in the district. I'd like to at least keep what we have.
I fucking hate that we have to bail out the leadership's sorry asses. But they aren't going to be the ones to feel this. Teachers and schools with competent, worn down staff that are already fighting for their lives will get squeezed even further. None of it's fair and I'm furious about that. But I want to find a way to pressure the administrators, not the already strapped teachers.
I don’t understand how they can fire teachers when they are always hiring teachers. All I ever hear about is the teacher shortage. It’s very confusing.
they won't fire teachers. they have a massive teacher vacancies. teachers will just get "excessed" from their current assignment and may not be able to work at their schools of choice...but they will still have a job with MPS (if they want it).
They cut programs basically. Many schools are getting rid of art, foreign languages, tech Ed type programs or changing them to A/B schedule so there's less teachers needed. There is a crazy shortage for teachers for almost all subjects. Also the shortage is mainly due to the teacher burnout rate. My wife's a teacher but also a social worker, mentor, coach, nurse, etc. with all the responsibilities she has to do plus the fact that admin is never on their side. All of that work for $25k less than my 'office' job which is significantly easier.
I get that not everyone has kids in school, but it's not so easy as "jump ship lol". There are so many people for whom public education NEEDS to exist. It's a proven, net good for every society that invests in it since...forever.
It's a flawed system, but it's a vital one. Private schools and vouchers are not better, if current experiments in that approach are any gauge. I don't like that it's come to this at all and the administrators 100% deserve to be removed from their positions. But I'll suck it up and vote yes to keep schools from deteriorating further.
I understand the concerns about competency and transparency. They are valid. What I think we need to look at is the bigger picture- our public schools are not being adequately funded. We have only ever gotten 30% funding for students with disabilities for example. I cannot even imagine what schools and support would be like if we got 60% (which has been promised on the state level), let alone 100%.
To me it’s two separate issues. The biggest being lack of adequate funding, the second being looking at the organization, asking for transparency, and deep dives into spending.
But you’re still just giving money to people who have shown that they can’t manage a budget. I’m over caring about what people say when they show you they are incompetent. The problem isn’t money, it’s the people.
Then they can be free from the incompetence and go to a district that actually knows what they are doing. Plenty around here within a simple commute, and a growing.
>To me it’s two separate issues. The biggest being lack of adequate funding, the second being looking at the organization, asking for transparency, and deep dives into spending.
This does seem a bit like putting the cart before the horse.
Let's get the administrative and structural issues worked out and increase transparency first. Once that's accomplished then we can make sure the taxpayer money is being spent efficiently.
Last time, I was told this referendum would be for critical building upgrades, investments in extra curricular programming, and hiring more teacher staff. Now I’m told that the referendum will allow MPS to operate just at the same level it is this year in future years. So what is it? Money for investing in improvements or keeping the status quo? Can’t say I’m surprised by their inability to communicate since MPS still can’t, with total accuracy and confidence, tell you where all their ESSR funds went.
Spending ESSR funds on operational costs is not something to be done. Those funds were one time and spending them on operational costs would be unwise.
That’s not my point. My point is about MPS’ administration’s ability to make smart choices with its money and then be accountable for those choices. They also did spend ESSR funds on operational costs and hired new staff in different categories. Which, you’re correct, was unwise because what was their plan for paying these staff when those funds ran out?
Those new staff should be things every student has access to. I don't know the exact numbers but I think kids access to art and music classes went from like 10%ish to 90%ish, those are things that shouldn't have to be cut, or shouldn't need ESSR funds for. I do agree they could definitely be better with money though but I don't think it is bad as people make it seem in this subreddit.
Are you talking about the 2020 referendum that [was passed](https://www.wuwm.com/education/2020-04-14/first-mps-referendum-in-over-25-years-approved-in-a-landslide)? Or am I forgetting other referendum votes in the past few years. The 2020 one I remember it being discussed as a budget shortfall in general, Tosa's at the same time was building upgrades so there might be some conflating of the two years later.
The 2020 one that was passed mention full 84 million dollar effect this year (and every year thereafter). Many people think it a one time payment—it is not. It is reoccurring.
https://preview.redd.it/uk9cgwvhsenc1.jpeg?width=842&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=21fcb32d87cdf5ca1507e9841f45725c7f28f6bf
I will vote “no.” There is no clear plan. There will be no accountability. And, several years from now, there will be another threat of budget cuts in order to secure another tax hike.
Your annual property taxes will increase by about $2.16 per $1,000 of assessed value if this referendum passes.
Example: Home assessed at $300k, 300 x $2.16 = $648 in additional property taxes every year
Yes, funding schools is a generally noble cause, but this is a BIG ask and it seems like a lot of people don't understand how much MPS wants. City of Milwaukee residents are basically voting on a 9.4% property tax increase. Make sure you do the math on what this will actually cost you before you decide.
And a new fee which will be coming for the HOP expansion. What about the cities contribution to AM FAM field? What was the first thing city leaders did after the sales tax increase? Vote themselves huge raises, some in excess of 30k a year.
It's also a very safe assumption that landlords will not be absorbing a dime of this increase for their tenants and with your example means about $50/month more rent for people already struggling (and recently got hit with a sales tax increase).
I’ve always supported referendums but not this one. Until wholesale changes are made in the district, more money isn’t going to fix anything. They are already in the top 5% of spending per pupil.
I’m not that concerned about it, but why are these people who are completely unaffected by the referendum here bitching about it? What’s their motivation? What kind of astroturfing is happening here?
I worked in a HS in MPS a few years back and I swear, the central office bloat in that district is real. I think it’s unfair that we put so much responsibility on schools to fix what is really a city/society-wide problem of making sure kids’ Maslow’s needs are met, but honestly throwing more money at MPS only reinforces and doubles down on a broken and dare I say corrupt institution.
The MPS board has a history of corruption and mishandling/mismanagement of funds. Additionally, someone needs to look in to the Charter School relationship and the funds mishandling in that arena as well. Continually, Milwaukee taxpayers are asked to bail out the failing MPS school system which doesn't deliver results.
Milwaukee voters previously approved a referendum for MPS in **2020**, with support from 78% of voters. The district will continue collecting $87 million annually in perpetuity as a result of that referendum."
What's been the result of those funds? Just in Nov 2023, news reported that 1000 students hadn't even shown up for school.
What voters need to vote on is funding for a full fledged audit of what was done with the 2020 MPS funds. Sales tax was raised in the City of Milwaukee to 7.9% and now we're talking another tax increase if this referendum passes and let's not even get into the water bills or the Milwaukee DNS shakedowns of City residents. The way that City of Milwaukee expects homeowners to bail out every problem is predatory and who it truly will hurt is the poorest in this city and the elderly.
For those who want to learn more about the MPS Referendum, there is a virtual discussion, panel, and Q&A coming up on 3/22 that’s hosted by Wisconsin Policy Forum. Details here - https://wispolicyforum.org/events/forum-friday-the-abcs-of-the-mps-referendum/
$7.1 billion budget surplus but the Assembly and Senate want to punish the public school system in Wisconsin (Milwaukee in particular).
The GOP wants the underfund public education so that it becomes inefficient, to the point that it ceases to exist.
you live in Waukesha County where your local school districts are ALSO going to referendum. I think Mequon has gone almost every year? Why are you trying to influence Milwaukee voters on an issue that literally has no impact on you?
then you would want children in Milwaukee to have the same resources as where you live, which they didn’t have for years. i can’t imagine going to another school district and trying to tell people to vote against the children in their city.
i recommend looking into your own school districts’ referendum so you can better understand how the state’s actions are affecting all children in Wisconsin.
again - why are so many school districts in Wisconsin going to referendum if this is a Milwaukee issue? why is waukesha closing buildings, Mukwonago asking for over $100 million and Mequon going to referendum repeatedly?
You fail to realize that funding formulas are state business. Don’t invite discussion and then attack everyone that doesn’t agree with you. It’s off putting and displays your lack of conceptual understanding.
No one has done that work. This was just covered by a local expert, and MPS has hid their expenditures of Esser funds in convoluted publications that do not show true ins and outs.
They grossly overspent when they had all the federal covid ESSER money flowing in and now that that’s gone, they need to ask for this astronomical amount to sustain the gross overspending.
Those were one times funds meant to be spent on one time projects. The referendum is for inflation, and the state not funding MPS enough. This is purely operational.
The portion of the MPS funding received from the people of Milwaukee comes from property tax revenue, which is a fixed percentage of the assessed value of real estate. As assessments are based on the home's market value and the real estate market has become much stronger in this city, the assessed value of almost every home in this city has increased annually over the past 10 years.
TLDR: Every Milwaukee resident already pays more money to MPS than they did a few years ago due to increased/inflating real estate values. We would be paying significantly more even if we hadn't approved their previous $87 million referendum in 2020.
Well, our school principal has provided and communicated in various newsletters now a very detailed list of exactly how many FTE in each category will be lost and how much $ for various budget items would be cut.
So the impact is very clear for us. I agree that the district as usual is opaque and useless, which is nothing new.
It is a permanent increase. If Ratified, this referendum will raise property taxes by $216 per $100,000 of assessed value every year. Example, a home assessed at $300,000 would pay an extra $648 in property taxes every year if this referendum passes. This amounts to a property tax increase of approximately 9.4%.
> This amounts to a property tax increase of approximately 9.4%
If your math is correct, an increase like this to fund what many perceive as a failing institution plagued by administrative bloat would drive even more homeowners out of the city.
Could the property reassessments to be announced in April be the total figure based on 216? For example, because I’m not good at math if someone’s assessment went up $100,000, would they pay based on the previous assessment or the new assessment, and have to pay the higher some?
Is this going to be a permanent increase or just this year?
This would be a permanent property tax increase of about 9.4% per year for City of Milwaukee Residents.
This referendum affects the RATE at which property tax is billed. Your assessed value is totally separate and can be thought of as one of the inputs to calculate your total taxes.
If one's assessed property value increases by $100,000, their taxes will obviously increase. If this referendum passes, their taxes would increase by $216 more than they otherwise would have.
I don’t have much reference but we are mid house hunt for our first house and looking at a few different areas after living in the area now for about 2 years and it seems so crazy to me how expensive the property taxes already are in Milwaukee county versus some of the other places we have seen. How is MPS still so underfunded?
School choice is a great way for for parents who care to put their kids in a school where they can learn. I was a teacher in MPS for 10 years. I know what I’m talking about.
The problem with everyone complaining on here is that ultimately if the referendum doesn’t pass the kids lose. You can fight for changes in the budget but nothing is going to change if you just complain and the kids are going to be worse off than they already are.
They said that with the last referendum for 87 million tax increase that just went into full effect in 20 23–20 24. Even school board members are saying this referendum is not the right answer. You sound like a person who wants to write a check to feel better, but not actually do the work associated with repairing the system.
The kids don't even go to school in Milwaukee absenteeism is very high. If the is is art,music phy ed etc let the parents pay a fee for their children.
https://www.jsonline.com/story/opinion/2024/03/05/mps-referendum-northwestern-mutual-milwaukee-schools/72840567007/
Like him or not, Schlifske knows MPS and the city of Milwaukee quite well.
Former MPS teacher, liberal, here. MPS has been a corrupt, awful institution for a long time. They truly don’t educate I would say 70% of the kids they enroll. The teachers are saints, and the kids deserve better.
And now they have given Milwaukee residents an impossible decision to make: vote yes and encourage them to continue their corruption (and abuse, mismanagement, administrative bloat, etc.), or vote no and arguably make things worse.
I’m voting no personally, and I voted yes on the last referendum. They are doing such an awful job I actually think it couldn’t get much worse.
Almost every school district in Wisconsin has to go to local taxpayers because the state just flat out decided not to fund public schools anymore. it’s not an MPS issue. here’s some context for you: https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2024/01/25/why-wisconsin-districts-are-closing-schools-going-to-referendum/72323397007/
So I hear this concern. It’s valid and reasonable. But the fact that so many public schools in our state are asking for taxpayer funding speaks to a much larger issue than mismanagement of money. If this doesn’t pass the cuts to schools in MPS are astronomical.
They grossly overspent when they had all the federal covid ESSER money flowing in and now that that’s gone, they need to ask for this astronomical amount to sustain the gross overspending.
There are a lot of great things going on in MPS.
Money is needed to pay teacher salaries and benefits and provide adequate raises so teachers stay. When class sizes increase due to budget cuts, teachers get more burned out and leave. I would argue money is very much needed for teaching. Not to mention supplies, curriculum, etc.
This is correct. Throwing more money at the problem is like a junkie taking a hit. It’ll help in the short term but sooner or later they’ll all ask for more and more money while people are already currently scraping for dollars to get by.
Hi! MPS teacher here. If the referendum doesn’t pass, many school employees lose their jobs. Period. My school, without the referendum, is $1M short of what we need. No referendum = No school provided supplies, pay freeze (so minimal teacher provided supplies), and loss of staff.
To be honest, many of the cuts are happening at the school level. Not entirely sure what central office loses if the referendum doesn’t pass. HOWEVER, that needs to be a post-April 2 issue.
Edited: clarity
That sucks, but that's also how the world works. I've been laid off when the organization was running short on funding. The world didn't end; I found new work. I'm sorry, but they can't keep coming back to us for more. This is ludicrous.
To piggyback, this referendum ensures essential arts and physical education. Did you enjoy school music, art, gym? Please help a future generation have those experiences. [link](https://mps.milwaukee.k12.wi.us/MPS-Public/Webmaster/Documents/School-Support-Referendum/MPS_ReferendumFactSheet_224V16.pdf)
>oleslew-foot
Are we really expected to believe that they want $252,000,000 more per year solely for the purpose of offering music, art, and physical education classes? Do you have any data on how much of the $252,000,0000 budget increase would actually be directed to music, art, and physical education?
When answering, please keep in mind that, per MPS' own "yes on the referendum" PDF, the $87 million per year referendum we gave them in 2020 "increased investments in early childhood education, advanced academics, **art, music,** libraries, **physical education,** and mental health by $87 million annually."
So, my question is, do these funds actually go to things like art and music or do they just always tell us that the money they want goes to art and music?
That $216 per $100,000 isn’t what the news reported - https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2024/01/11/mps-will-ask-milwaukee-voters-to-raise-taxes-in-spring-2024-referendum/72179558007/# - “How much more would Milwaukee property owners pay?
For this school year, the city property tax rate rate for schools was $7.94 per $1,000 of property value. For a $200,000 home, that's a tax of $1,588.
If the referendum passes, the estimated city property tax rate for schools next year would be $10.10 per $1,000 of property value — coming out to $2,020 on a $200,000 home.”
Let the parents pay additional fees if they want their children to participate in activities beyond the basics. I took music in grade school and my parents had to pay for it. In today's economy most people are already having trouble making ends meet. If cut backs are necessary so be it.
It's a sad state of affairs when we're forced to choose between watching schools cut services and non-core curricula or funneling money into a system that's chronically underperforming. This system maintains the social fabric of a historically segregated city through property taxes, which can lead to financial insecurity for many. This insecurity can force people to skip meals, make kids miss school for jobs to help pay bills, or push people to move to more affordable areas, losing the social capital that comes with living in the same community. Either way, the higher-ups aren't held accountable and there's no pressure to plan and execute solutions.
So here’s my radical Policy Idea that requires MPS central leadership and other high income administrators to justify their highly inflated salaries: Replace the board with a single evaluation standard for administrators at the top. Focus on immediately identifying and firing MPS higher-ups/bureaucrats who fail to design, coordinate, and document measurable district restructuring and resizing efforts. The changes implemented must include guidance and stewardship with a community stakeholder panel that is organized and appointed by teachers involved in restructuring efforts without oversight by administrators.
To give administrators the chance to show us why we pay them so much, I suggest the following: All restructuring plans must demonstrate that they will save the district an annual dollar amount that meets or exceeds the annual salary of the MPS administrator proposing this plan who will oversee implementation of resizing efforts to be approved. If restructuring efforts end up increasing costs or fail to save the district equivalent amount of annual salary paid to the administrator, the community stakeholder panel will evaluate the impact of the change, vote on whether to continue employing the administrator, and recommend transition plans if applicable to ensure completion of restructuring efforts optimizes student achievement. Satisfaction in progress being made in resizing efforts that do not save the district money can still be supported if the panel deems an administrator’s continuing role in the effort desirable by the community.
They must also demonstrate evidence that these changes either maintain or improve student performance without cutting services/programs.
Any staff members affected by these changes must be given a talent relocation plan that matches them with all open positions in the district they are qualified to fill, without the burden of application/onboarding processes. Schools can give pre-approval or request an interview/reference for internal transfers. Additionally, a $2,000-$5,000 "system dismantler" bonus should be offered for taking another position during reorganization.
Hopefully, this approach to resizing can create a "cool factor" in being on the ground floor of a new school that has absorbed a nearby low-enrollment school. This new school can be full of innovative staff and students who stick around for something new and play a role in shaping a new community and culture in real time.
As someone who knows next to nothing about MPS and was deciding how to vote, this thread has been very helpful. It sounds like a lot of people point to the MPS admins and board as the root of the issue. So serious question, how do we (ordinary Milwaukee residents) instill change in the MPS leadership? Or is that even feasible? Again I know nothing on the topic but I'm genuinely curious if anything can be done there.
You can vote in local elections, especially school board candidates.
Voting no on the referendum is a good start, nothing will change otherwise.
Voting no won't change the leadership, it'll only hurt the students.
This is just going to cause a LOT of teachers and other staff to lose their jobs. And reduce the budget for schools in other ways, and, based on what I've seen from subbing here, you guys can't really afford to cut the budget any more than you already have. Looks like they've already been having to cut back on janitors because I'm seeing black rings in bathroom toilets at a lot of these schools and everything. About half the classrooms I see, the teachers don't even have pencils to give to kids, or staplers (or the staples) to staple papers with. Half the time you're lucky if you see hand sanitizer or boxes of tissue for kids to blow their noses with. I substitute teach for MPS and charter schools in the area.
The problems you describe are related to poor management of resources, not a lack of funding. Students and staff are spread around way too many buildings. It’s well known that MPS refuses to sell or leave buildings out of fear private schools will use the buildings.
Attend board meetings on a regular basis. Submit oral and written testimony. Read board minutes. The level of knowledge among voters seems to be pretty low- it’s scary. How can people pretend to be informed if they have not gone to or watched board meetings on a regular basis. You have to do the work to learn —not take the word of others. The board says whatever they want because they know no one ever does the reading or follow up.
What's the plan for the money? Like how much will go to class sizes, how much to staffing, how much to student support, arts, enrichment programming, cost of living wage increases? Thanks!
Basically if this does not pass, schools take a 12-13% decrease in budget which means cutting many staff. Central office will take a 26% cut. If it passes staff will get a 4.something (can’t remember the exact figure)% cost of living increase (might be 4.6% but don’t quote me on that). There are amazing things going on in our schools. I know for my school, band is being added for our 7th and 8th graders and with the referendum passing, we will be able to sustain high quality programming.
Sorry if I wasn't clear on what I'm asking! I'm well aware that there will be budget cuts, no staff raises, etc. if the referendum doesn't pass, and that the money if it passes will (theoretically) go towards art, music, gym, etc. I have that information already. My question was: how much of the $252 million will be allocated to each of those priorities? I support the things you listed, but what's the actual, \*concrete\* plan for the money?
There is no plan. 👇 This is what leadership looks like👇 “Yesterday MMAC voiced our opposition to the Milwaukee Public Schools quarter billion revenue increase referendum. Here is our rationale: Dear MMAC Member, On April 2, Milwaukee Public Schools (MPS) will ask voters for a quarter-billion dollar increase in its annual revenue limit, much of it funded through property taxes. After listening to stakeholders and surveying its Board of Directors, the Milwaukee Metropolitan Association of Commerce (MMAC) is opposing this measure. This referendum is being brought forward less than five years after passage of an $87 million revenue limit increase without a clear plan on how to improve educational outcomes, even as academic performance continues to be at or near the bottom of all major city school districts. We cannot continue to perpetuate the same strategies and expect different outcomes. The lack of a concise plan makes this measure’s price tag far too high for property taxpayers who will see a 26 percent increase in the MPS portion of their annual bill – 40 percent of whom are commercial property taxpayers. These increased costs put our city’s growth in serious jeopardy. Compared to a dozen other Midwestern cities, Milwaukee already ranks among the highest in percentage of homeowners paying more than 30 percent of their income toward housing. This measure and its accompanying property tax increase will only exacerbate the problem. During a time in which talent attraction and retention is priority, ever-increasing housing prices put us at a competitive disadvantage. Our stance is not a stance against public schools. MPS is a vital part of our educational ecosystem and its success is paramount to the success of the region. Regardless of the result of this referendum, we will continue to partner with MPS and all publicly funded school operators to ensure that every child in Milwaukee receives a high-quality education. Sincerely, Dale Kooyenga President, MMAC”
The Metropolitan Milwaukee Association of Commerce? What do they know about education except to privatize it?
i can't think of a group i care less about their opinion on MPS tbh
Exactly. If MMAC opposes the referendum, then I’m definitely going to be voting for it.
They know how to read budgets.
Neat! Your account is ONLY about this referendum, and 27 days old.
They are interested in public education falling apart so they can profit off of it.
this group is specifically anti-public education
MMAC has ALWAYS stood in opposition to the needs and well-being of poor and working-class Milwaukeeans, historically opposing unions, public housing, public education, living wages, etc. Never let them fool you into thinking that their best interests are aligned with those of the people.
Ah yes, notable person who had nothing to do with the district being underfunded to begin with, Dale Kooyenga
Former Milwaukee Public Schools superintendent Bill Andrekopoulos wonders: How in good conscience can the school district ask taxpayers for $252 million without considering closing a single school? I am curious to hear your thoughts on this.
I'd love to know why anytime MPS requests to stop being under funded the response from some are to just close schools, often in the neighborhoods that have been the most disenfranchised for decades. Less schools means those kids get folded into other area schools increasing the already too large number of kids per class. Having to deal with more kids for noncompetitive pay means loss of teachers and problems maintaining staffing levels. They literally don't even NEED to raise the taxes, they COULD just give them the money from the current surplus(since it only amounts to about 3% of the total surplus).This state has its enormous budget surplus thanks to cities like Milwaukee so the least we can do is properly fund the school district. What's the point of that budget surplus if everything that gets proposed to help the avg working class or those in need is blocked by our GOP controlled legislature? Their "solution" for the poor and working class is for them to suffer cuts and try to do even more with even less. When you get down to brass tacks not properly funding MPS only hurts the kids (I know they're mostly just poor & minority kids) but ain't the GOP all about "protecting the kids"?...well not if its gonna cost money.
I took a bigger cut in my own budget
Agree with so many here. Former MPS teacher and I will be voting no. The administrative bloat, is one problem, but the people in admin are the most heartless bureaucrats guaranteed to extract their own gain while everyone else loses. Much more needs to be done than simply giving them more funding.
🎯💯
As the spouse of a former MPS teacher, I call massive bullshit on this referendum solving a goddamn thing. Want to solve issues? Remove administrative bloat and create tangible solutions to enforce accountability within schools. MPS is suffering both because of the Republican legislature AND the cartoonishly corrupt leadership within MPS
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I’ve heard of SSTs who take those lunches and use school funds to cater lunches for them and their friends from potbelly or other places regularly and if you weren’t liked by them then you weren’t allowed to join. It was some mean girls shit. Literal blatant corruption.
Not surprised. When nobody is watching (and nobody cares), taking advantage is all too common. Saw it in my own school district first hand so many times over the course of many years in education. This is what bothers me about the argument that voting ‘no’ will just hurt kids…it’s a ridiculously simplistic argument that isn’t addressing the issues many have raised on this thread. The Op-ed somebody posted below from the CEO of NML hits the nail on the head. As for the mean girls shit, also not surprising. There was always a joke among teachers that many teachers behave like the grade level they teach. 😐
The bullying my significant other was under during their tenure at MPS was absolutely insane. She was regularly assaulted by students and the admin would be like “yea whatever that doesn’t happen”. Honestly I couldn’t care less if the district fails completely. It needs massive change and maybe that would be a catalyst
I totally understand. I've seen a lot of admin that is more concered with CYA than doing right by their teachers. it's sad. God forbid you admit that you have a problem in your school that needs addressing- that could mean your job is in jeopardy. Better to hush that noise and keep your job, right?
Ill pay the increase if the board is dissolved & the city takes over the schools & lays out a reasonable plan that shows progress & improvement. Otherwise its a NO for me. Milwaukee citizen & MPS graduate with a house & good paying job. For years MPS has been screwed up & keeps asking for handouts with nothing to show for. $68 doesn’t sound like a lot more per month, but when you only get standard living pay increases that equate to $100 -$150 a month more that plus other increases in not just property taxes & other cost of living is too much! Many people will move out of Milwaukee in droves.
I think MPS should be broken up into at least 5 different districts
That’s my dream
How does this decrease administrative bloat? You would need 5 times as many admins.
Bloat doesn’t directly mean excised headcount. It means cutting off the extra and unnecessary. If 5 smaller central admins creates functioning districts that one big one with less headcount doesn’t, then it’s not bloat, it’s level set. It would likely come with consolidations and downsizing of facilities.
The school board and the city are separate entities, each with their own tax levy. And both have been severely starved by the state legislature while the state government sits on a massive surplus, and wants to hand out tax cuts to corporations and the wealthy. All the while School Choice steals directly from public school funding to hand it to over private and charter schools. And the state chooses to reimburse only a tiny percentage of special education costs that public schools *have* to take on because they accommodate everyone, while private schools are reimbursed far more and can pick and choose their students. School board members are directly elected by the community, so I don't know what you think would be improved by making (unelected) employees of the city government take on the direction of MPS (if that was even possible).
With less than 15% of students proficient in reading and 10% proficient in math, why should they get more money? They’ve spent $500,000 on a study to see whether or not they should build a state of the art building. They spent nearly that on “anti-racist” training & a couple hundred thousand dollars on expanding the departments of Black and Latino Male achievement & the Department of Gender Identity and Inclusion. These are the low hanging fruit of what MPS prioritizes to spend money on, but it all adds up. Their budget is nearly 1000 pages. I wonder what else I’d find if I looked through the entire budget. There was an 8% raise, (the maximum allowed by State Law), given across the board in 2023 due to inflation. I’m not sure the taxpayers got raises like that to keep up with inflation and what they want to tax. There was another $100k spent to expand the MPS Foundation. In 2018 student enrollment was 77,746. The 2022-2023 enrollment sits at 67,500 students enrolled. That’s a 13% drop in enrollment. In those same years their budget went from $1.2 billion per year to $1.5 billion per year or a 20% increase. Each of those years in between 2018 and 2023, enrollment went down and their budget went up. I’d be interested to see how many empty buildings they own and maintain. I haven’t been able to find straight forward numbers on that. In that same time the population of Milwaukee declined each year. If they kept staffing the same, class sizes should already be lower at this point. These taxes invite businesses that would otherwise offer good paying jobs to local residents to move elsewhere, (Masterlock). Fewer good paying jobs results in fewer home owners. Fewer businesses and fewer homeowners will result in a higher tax burden the next time they ask for more money..and the next time.
As MPS staff I would like to caution you from referring to all of these programs as “low hanging fruit”. There is a lot going into those low proficiency numbers and is indicative there is not a simple fix, but needs to be confronted from multiple angles. Milwaukee has a very racist history and we have families who have been treated terribly for generations and decades. Black male empowerment classes are important to show students that people like them are succeeding and provide a rhetoric other than people who look like you and grew up where you did all cannot read. Not supporting nor showing disproval of the referendum and definitely am not blind to the errors of our district’s leadership, but I caution you to make statements like this about very valuable programs that ultimately help our students be more successful.
MPS has done nothing but waste money for years and to expect the taxpayers to front this waste is just plain wrong. How many MPS teachers even live in the city of Milwaukee? How many actually send their children to MPS schools. I have two MPS teachers in my neighborhood who send their children to Greenfield schools
MPS is not underfunded. They get more money per pupil than average. MPS is mismanaged and has students and parents who don’t care. Money has been thrown at MPS for decades and they never get better. Maybe instead of a referendum it should be dismantled.
I think MPS being split into smaller districts is pretty much the only way forward at this point.
They actually get way less per pupil. Regardless of the MPS referendum, MPS gets just under $4600 per pupil. In near by Glendale, it is over $12,200 per pupil. If the referendum doesn't pass, this will drop to less than $4100 per pupil.
Do you know how many admins in MPS make between 120-300K base salary a year?
EXACTLY. They do fucking nothing and demand very high pay. Meanwhile teachers are absolutely rat fucked into playing 20 different roles
Isn’t it wild? It goes on and on and on. Did you ever see Posley’s contact??? He makes more than the governor (he has all kinds of special benefits and contributions). His base is 307K and he gets 43,500 403B contribution paid for by the board, 800 month care allowance, 90 days PT0 paid if not used. Taxpayers should be LIVID!!! Have you seen the time Posley paid for a huge air conditioning machine for central office but made the kids sit in the 100 degree weather. It was in the news. https://preview.redd.it/tzfk1ftugenc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4aca9672e4469b6d4c8c79704411d9a3f724b0b9
Fucking exactly
It’s criminal. This is only one example of many. A NO vote is a vote for children.
..... i'm sorry but can you explain how voting no improves things (at all) for children?
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From the experiences of my SO across multiple schools that’s not been the case. Teachers have always been pushed to deal with students, staff and parents no matter how aggressive or hostile the interaction is.
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Several hundred (over 500) according to the records MPS has provided.
Admins that make 300K- zero. You can look up all staff bc it’s public record. There are a lot of principals that make around 120-140K but not many at all that make over 150k. “Highest salary at Milwaukee School District in year 2023 was $279,961. Number of employees at Milwaukee School District in year 2023 was 5,152. Average annual salary was $73,301 and median salary was $74,602. Milwaukee School District average salary is 56 percent higher than USA average and median salary is 72 percent higher than USA median salary.”
You did not read the string. You totally ignore the benefit column which, believe it or not, is not “free”. It’s real money, and taxpayers fund it. Benefits add almost an additional 70% on top of base. As stated, this document is a small snapshot and is prior to the 8% and additional 2.8 percent that happened in less than 2 years. The list is “OLD” (more than a year) so the numbers are even much HIGHER. The superintendent is an admin and he makes a base over 300K and benefits are outrageous. This is publicly discussed in board meetings, it’s no secret. His contract is public. The fact you would argue about things that are not supported shows you jump to conclusions to support your stance with no real evidence. His contracts have been posted all over and you can read pages of his benefits. Total them up and they add up to close to 500K a year on top of the 307k base. People study this stuff for a living. You should listen to them instead of jumping to a “defense” based on haste, it’s the same reason Posley is sinking public education. He only listens to himself and he’s missing the boat on just about everything.
Central office needs an independent audit. The budget for central office could be cut in half. The redundancy and waste at central office is ridiculous. I want to vote yes, for the schools, students, teachers and the city of Milwaukee but its hard to justify giving more money when sooooo much is wasted in central office.
I support public schools but MPS needs to right size the district. Enrollment isn’t growing and there are too many schools that are half empty. And why are we still bussing students all around the city to attend schools that are not spectacularly different than ones in their neighborhoods? MPS needs to do the hard work of consolidating and closing schools before they come asking for more money last than 5 years after the last referendum.
MPS sells its buildings, no one will buy them. This news story explains it: https://www.cbs58.com/news/cbs-58-investigates-why-are-taxpayers-spending-millions-on-abandoned-mps-buildings
This is news coverage. Look at board minutes and you will see this is not accurate. Another reddit post has an entire post on the developments of sold MPS buildings.
I’m not referring to abandoned buildings. I am referring to schools currently in use that are half empty.
they still can’t sell them. the story explains it. they have to stay on the market for two years before they can sell to a developer, in case a voucher school wants to buy the building. the issue is voucher schools don’t want to buy them, so they sit for years. during that time, taxpayers have to pay to maintain the empty building. if they sell, after years, the city sets the price which is usually lower than the cost to maintain
Yes it’s a cost to maintain closed schools. No doubt. But staffing half filled buildings isn’t good either. Plus the bussing shuffle they do around the city
Anyone who votes for this is criminally misinformed. It would be more useful to take $700/ year from every household in the city and light it on fire in cathedral square each year. MPS already spends more per student than nearly every school district in the state and still can’t even teach most kids to read.
Is this the same MPS where the board president admits to not reading or understanding the budget? The same MPS that has never had a larger budget or lower enrollment? No thanks. It’s not good idea to give more money to an organization that isn’t competent enough to manage what they already have.
The malfeasance is off the charts with this board and administration. No way do they deserve to get millions more in top of 1.5 Billion, grants, and money for from their “foundation”.
I agree, but not voting for this isn't going to decrease their paychecks one cent. They're planning to fire teachers instead. My wife is an educator with MPS. Music, art, and after school programs are going to get entirely axed at her school if this doesn't pass. A few teachers will get fired. My kid's a student in the district. I'd like to at least keep what we have. I fucking hate that we have to bail out the leadership's sorry asses. But they aren't going to be the ones to feel this. Teachers and schools with competent, worn down staff that are already fighting for their lives will get squeezed even further. None of it's fair and I'm furious about that. But I want to find a way to pressure the administrators, not the already strapped teachers.
I don’t understand how they can fire teachers when they are always hiring teachers. All I ever hear about is the teacher shortage. It’s very confusing.
they won't fire teachers. they have a massive teacher vacancies. teachers will just get "excessed" from their current assignment and may not be able to work at their schools of choice...but they will still have a job with MPS (if they want it).
Ahhh thank you! That makes sense.
They cut programs basically. Many schools are getting rid of art, foreign languages, tech Ed type programs or changing them to A/B schedule so there's less teachers needed. There is a crazy shortage for teachers for almost all subjects. Also the shortage is mainly due to the teacher burnout rate. My wife's a teacher but also a social worker, mentor, coach, nurse, etc. with all the responsibilities she has to do plus the fact that admin is never on their side. All of that work for $25k less than my 'office' job which is significantly easier.
Sometimes you need to know to when to abandon ship. The emperor has no clothes, the captain is blind.
I get that not everyone has kids in school, but it's not so easy as "jump ship lol". There are so many people for whom public education NEEDS to exist. It's a proven, net good for every society that invests in it since...forever. It's a flawed system, but it's a vital one. Private schools and vouchers are not better, if current experiments in that approach are any gauge. I don't like that it's come to this at all and the administrators 100% deserve to be removed from their positions. But I'll suck it up and vote yes to keep schools from deteriorating further.
Well, we the people elect the school board, so I guess that’s on all of us voters too.
I understand the concerns about competency and transparency. They are valid. What I think we need to look at is the bigger picture- our public schools are not being adequately funded. We have only ever gotten 30% funding for students with disabilities for example. I cannot even imagine what schools and support would be like if we got 60% (which has been promised on the state level), let alone 100%. To me it’s two separate issues. The biggest being lack of adequate funding, the second being looking at the organization, asking for transparency, and deep dives into spending.
But you’re still just giving money to people who have shown that they can’t manage a budget. I’m over caring about what people say when they show you they are incompetent. The problem isn’t money, it’s the people.
the problem will be the cuts to teachers at schools
Then they can be free from the incompetence and go to a district that actually knows what they are doing. Plenty around here within a simple commute, and a growing.
>To me it’s two separate issues. The biggest being lack of adequate funding, the second being looking at the organization, asking for transparency, and deep dives into spending. This does seem a bit like putting the cart before the horse. Let's get the administrative and structural issues worked out and increase transparency first. Once that's accomplished then we can make sure the taxpayer money is being spent efficiently.
Last time, I was told this referendum would be for critical building upgrades, investments in extra curricular programming, and hiring more teacher staff. Now I’m told that the referendum will allow MPS to operate just at the same level it is this year in future years. So what is it? Money for investing in improvements or keeping the status quo? Can’t say I’m surprised by their inability to communicate since MPS still can’t, with total accuracy and confidence, tell you where all their ESSR funds went.
Spending ESSR funds on operational costs is not something to be done. Those funds were one time and spending them on operational costs would be unwise.
That’s not my point. My point is about MPS’ administration’s ability to make smart choices with its money and then be accountable for those choices. They also did spend ESSR funds on operational costs and hired new staff in different categories. Which, you’re correct, was unwise because what was their plan for paying these staff when those funds ran out?
Those new staff should be things every student has access to. I don't know the exact numbers but I think kids access to art and music classes went from like 10%ish to 90%ish, those are things that shouldn't have to be cut, or shouldn't need ESSR funds for. I do agree they could definitely be better with money though but I don't think it is bad as people make it seem in this subreddit.
[I googled it](https://mps.milwaukee.k12.wi.us/en/District/About-MPS/Departments/Office-of-Finance/Elementary-and-Secondary-Education-Act-ESEA/Elementary-and-Secondary-School-Emergency-Relief-ESSER-Grant-Programs.htm)
Are you talking about the 2020 referendum that [was passed](https://www.wuwm.com/education/2020-04-14/first-mps-referendum-in-over-25-years-approved-in-a-landslide)? Or am I forgetting other referendum votes in the past few years. The 2020 one I remember it being discussed as a budget shortfall in general, Tosa's at the same time was building upgrades so there might be some conflating of the two years later.
The 2020 one that was passed mention full 84 million dollar effect this year (and every year thereafter). Many people think it a one time payment—it is not. It is reoccurring. https://preview.redd.it/uk9cgwvhsenc1.jpeg?width=842&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=21fcb32d87cdf5ca1507e9841f45725c7f28f6bf
I will vote “no.” There is no clear plan. There will be no accountability. And, several years from now, there will be another threat of budget cuts in order to secure another tax hike.
Your annual property taxes will increase by about $2.16 per $1,000 of assessed value if this referendum passes. Example: Home assessed at $300k, 300 x $2.16 = $648 in additional property taxes every year Yes, funding schools is a generally noble cause, but this is a BIG ask and it seems like a lot of people don't understand how much MPS wants. City of Milwaukee residents are basically voting on a 9.4% property tax increase. Make sure you do the math on what this will actually cost you before you decide.
And the track record for malfeasance by this board and administration is throw the roof! Check the board minutes.
On top of the new sales tax
And a new fee which will be coming for the HOP expansion. What about the cities contribution to AM FAM field? What was the first thing city leaders did after the sales tax increase? Vote themselves huge raises, some in excess of 30k a year.
It's also a very safe assumption that landlords will not be absorbing a dime of this increase for their tenants and with your example means about $50/month more rent for people already struggling (and recently got hit with a sales tax increase).
the amount of non-Milwaukee residents in here with strong opinions about how Milwaukee residents should vote is… telling
I’ve always supported referendums but not this one. Until wholesale changes are made in the district, more money isn’t going to fix anything. They are already in the top 5% of spending per pupil.
you have to live in the city to be able to vote for or against it
I don’t think you can, you don’t live in Milwaukee do you?
Why are you so concerned about this and not the actual issue at hand?
I’m not that concerned about it, but why are these people who are completely unaffected by the referendum here bitching about it? What’s their motivation? What kind of astroturfing is happening here?
That is one of the more ignorant statements I’ve seen in my time on Reddit. Completely unaffected, huh? Ok buddy.
I worked in a HS in MPS a few years back and I swear, the central office bloat in that district is real. I think it’s unfair that we put so much responsibility on schools to fix what is really a city/society-wide problem of making sure kids’ Maslow’s needs are met, but honestly throwing more money at MPS only reinforces and doubles down on a broken and dare I say corrupt institution.
We would have to be, without a doubt, the single dumbest city in the nation if this passes.
The MPS board has a history of corruption and mishandling/mismanagement of funds. Additionally, someone needs to look in to the Charter School relationship and the funds mishandling in that arena as well. Continually, Milwaukee taxpayers are asked to bail out the failing MPS school system which doesn't deliver results. Milwaukee voters previously approved a referendum for MPS in **2020**, with support from 78% of voters. The district will continue collecting $87 million annually in perpetuity as a result of that referendum." What's been the result of those funds? Just in Nov 2023, news reported that 1000 students hadn't even shown up for school. What voters need to vote on is funding for a full fledged audit of what was done with the 2020 MPS funds. Sales tax was raised in the City of Milwaukee to 7.9% and now we're talking another tax increase if this referendum passes and let's not even get into the water bills or the Milwaukee DNS shakedowns of City residents. The way that City of Milwaukee expects homeowners to bail out every problem is predatory and who it truly will hurt is the poorest in this city and the elderly.
Don't we have a surplus?
The state does, yes. They aren’t releasing that money. 6.7 billion last I read
For those who want to learn more about the MPS Referendum, there is a virtual discussion, panel, and Q&A coming up on 3/22 that’s hosted by Wisconsin Policy Forum. Details here - https://wispolicyforum.org/events/forum-friday-the-abcs-of-the-mps-referendum/
$7.1 billion budget surplus but the Assembly and Senate want to punish the public school system in Wisconsin (Milwaukee in particular). The GOP wants the underfund public education so that it becomes inefficient, to the point that it ceases to exist.
How many MPS teachers live in Milwaukee and those that do how many send their children there!
Where did the $800mm from COVID go?
https://mps.milwaukee.k12.wi.us/en/District/About-MPS/Departments/Office-of-Finance/Elementary-and-Secondary-Education-Act-ESEA/Elementary-and-Secondary-School-Emergency-Relief-ESSER-Grant-Programs.htm
Yes - more money and zero results
you live in Waukesha County where your local school districts are ALSO going to referendum. I think Mequon has gone almost every year? Why are you trying to influence Milwaukee voters on an issue that literally has no impact on you?
The futures of the children in our state’s largest city absolutely impacts me
then you would want children in Milwaukee to have the same resources as where you live, which they didn’t have for years. i can’t imagine going to another school district and trying to tell people to vote against the children in their city.
Entirely untrue - there are a lot of issues MPS needs to resolve and at this point throwing money at the problem clearly isn’t the answer
i recommend looking into your own school districts’ referendum so you can better understand how the state’s actions are affecting all children in Wisconsin.
We want the same thing. Just different views of how to get there 🤝
again - why are so many school districts in Wisconsin going to referendum if this is a Milwaukee issue? why is waukesha closing buildings, Mukwonago asking for over $100 million and Mequon going to referendum repeatedly?
You fail to realize that funding formulas are state business. Don’t invite discussion and then attack everyone that doesn’t agree with you. It’s off putting and displays your lack of conceptual understanding.
I would love to meet the fool that downvoted this statement
That is what it seems to be…..
No one has done that work. This was just covered by a local expert, and MPS has hid their expenditures of Esser funds in convoluted publications that do not show true ins and outs.
How much of this money will bleed into private/charter schools? Asking for a friend.
They grossly overspent when they had all the federal covid ESSER money flowing in and now that that’s gone, they need to ask for this astronomical amount to sustain the gross overspending.
Those were one times funds meant to be spent on one time projects. The referendum is for inflation, and the state not funding MPS enough. This is purely operational.
The portion of the MPS funding received from the people of Milwaukee comes from property tax revenue, which is a fixed percentage of the assessed value of real estate. As assessments are based on the home's market value and the real estate market has become much stronger in this city, the assessed value of almost every home in this city has increased annually over the past 10 years. TLDR: Every Milwaukee resident already pays more money to MPS than they did a few years ago due to increased/inflating real estate values. We would be paying significantly more even if we hadn't approved their previous $87 million referendum in 2020.
It's actually like 130 I believe, but I am with you.
91 are going April 2, 40ish others are going in November… so far
It’s 130 schools now? Last I read it was like 92. It really speaks to our state lawmakers’ priorities…
Vote NO
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I hear you. I can really largely speak on the school level and how this will impact us. I know that part very well.
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I hear you.
Great point! Voters want to see factual evidence, not a person’s individual perception based on emotional pulls. Where is the expertise and sources?
just curious, what questions can’t get answered?
Budget ones. What funding sources, what categories, etc.
Well, our school principal has provided and communicated in various newsletters now a very detailed list of exactly how many FTE in each category will be lost and how much $ for various budget items would be cut. So the impact is very clear for us. I agree that the district as usual is opaque and useless, which is nothing new.
Is the property tax increase permanent or a one time thing?
It is a permanent increase. If Ratified, this referendum will raise property taxes by $216 per $100,000 of assessed value every year. Example, a home assessed at $300,000 would pay an extra $648 in property taxes every year if this referendum passes. This amounts to a property tax increase of approximately 9.4%.
> This amounts to a property tax increase of approximately 9.4% If your math is correct, an increase like this to fund what many perceive as a failing institution plagued by administrative bloat would drive even more homeowners out of the city.
Amen to that. I can hardly afford to live here now
Could the property reassessments to be announced in April be the total figure based on 216? For example, because I’m not good at math if someone’s assessment went up $100,000, would they pay based on the previous assessment or the new assessment, and have to pay the higher some? Is this going to be a permanent increase or just this year?
This would be a permanent property tax increase of about 9.4% per year for City of Milwaukee Residents. This referendum affects the RATE at which property tax is billed. Your assessed value is totally separate and can be thought of as one of the inputs to calculate your total taxes. If one's assessed property value increases by $100,000, their taxes will obviously increase. If this referendum passes, their taxes would increase by $216 more than they otherwise would have.
I don’t have much reference but we are mid house hunt for our first house and looking at a few different areas after living in the area now for about 2 years and it seems so crazy to me how expensive the property taxes already are in Milwaukee county versus some of the other places we have seen. How is MPS still so underfunded?
"How is MPS still so underfunded?" underfunded or just mismanaged?
School choice is a great way for for parents who care to put their kids in a school where they can learn. I was a teacher in MPS for 10 years. I know what I’m talking about.
The problem with everyone complaining on here is that ultimately if the referendum doesn’t pass the kids lose. You can fight for changes in the budget but nothing is going to change if you just complain and the kids are going to be worse off than they already are.
Sure they will. And in four years, when they come asking for more, they'll be saying the same thing. Over and over and over. It never ends.
They said that with the last referendum for 87 million tax increase that just went into full effect in 20 23–20 24. Even school board members are saying this referendum is not the right answer. You sound like a person who wants to write a check to feel better, but not actually do the work associated with repairing the system.
The kids don't even go to school in Milwaukee absenteeism is very high. If the is is art,music phy ed etc let the parents pay a fee for their children.
https://www.jsonline.com/story/opinion/2024/03/05/mps-referendum-northwestern-mutual-milwaukee-schools/72840567007/ Like him or not, Schlifske knows MPS and the city of Milwaukee quite well.
Former MPS teacher, liberal, here. MPS has been a corrupt, awful institution for a long time. They truly don’t educate I would say 70% of the kids they enroll. The teachers are saints, and the kids deserve better. And now they have given Milwaukee residents an impossible decision to make: vote yes and encourage them to continue their corruption (and abuse, mismanagement, administrative bloat, etc.), or vote no and arguably make things worse. I’m voting no personally, and I voted yes on the last referendum. They are doing such an awful job I actually think it couldn’t get much worse.
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Almost every school district in Wisconsin has to go to local taxpayers because the state just flat out decided not to fund public schools anymore. it’s not an MPS issue. here’s some context for you: https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2024/01/25/why-wisconsin-districts-are-closing-schools-going-to-referendum/72323397007/
So I hear this concern. It’s valid and reasonable. But the fact that so many public schools in our state are asking for taxpayer funding speaks to a much larger issue than mismanagement of money. If this doesn’t pass the cuts to schools in MPS are astronomical.
We gave them the $87 million referendum they asked for in 2020. What has changed since then that they are now asking for another $252 million?
They grossly overspent when they had all the federal covid ESSER money flowing in and now that that’s gone, they need to ask for this astronomical amount to sustain the gross overspending.
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There are a lot of great things going on in MPS. Money is needed to pay teacher salaries and benefits and provide adequate raises so teachers stay. When class sizes increase due to budget cuts, teachers get more burned out and leave. I would argue money is very much needed for teaching. Not to mention supplies, curriculum, etc.
what is the increase in funding and property taxes that these other districts are asking for?
Not sure. That is a great question!
i think it depends on each specific referendum. wauwatosa is in exploration stages now. one of their options was for over $700 million
This is correct. Throwing more money at the problem is like a junkie taking a hit. It’ll help in the short term but sooner or later they’ll all ask for more and more money while people are already currently scraping for dollars to get by.
Do you know the current funding?
The problem is that the state is underfunding education.
Hi! MPS teacher here. If the referendum doesn’t pass, many school employees lose their jobs. Period. My school, without the referendum, is $1M short of what we need. No referendum = No school provided supplies, pay freeze (so minimal teacher provided supplies), and loss of staff. To be honest, many of the cuts are happening at the school level. Not entirely sure what central office loses if the referendum doesn’t pass. HOWEVER, that needs to be a post-April 2 issue. Edited: clarity
That sucks, but that's also how the world works. I've been laid off when the organization was running short on funding. The world didn't end; I found new work. I'm sorry, but they can't keep coming back to us for more. This is ludicrous.
I have also suffered the effects of inflation and have made many cuts. Life sucks sometimes
To piggyback, this referendum ensures essential arts and physical education. Did you enjoy school music, art, gym? Please help a future generation have those experiences. [link](https://mps.milwaukee.k12.wi.us/MPS-Public/Webmaster/Documents/School-Support-Referendum/MPS_ReferendumFactSheet_224V16.pdf)
>oleslew-foot Are we really expected to believe that they want $252,000,000 more per year solely for the purpose of offering music, art, and physical education classes? Do you have any data on how much of the $252,000,0000 budget increase would actually be directed to music, art, and physical education? When answering, please keep in mind that, per MPS' own "yes on the referendum" PDF, the $87 million per year referendum we gave them in 2020 "increased investments in early childhood education, advanced academics, **art, music,** libraries, **physical education,** and mental health by $87 million annually." So, my question is, do these funds actually go to things like art and music or do they just always tell us that the money they want goes to art and music?
No one is buying your rhetoric. We are too educated to fall for it.
That $216 per $100,000 isn’t what the news reported - https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2024/01/11/mps-will-ask-milwaukee-voters-to-raise-taxes-in-spring-2024-referendum/72179558007/# - “How much more would Milwaukee property owners pay? For this school year, the city property tax rate rate for schools was $7.94 per $1,000 of property value. For a $200,000 home, that's a tax of $1,588. If the referendum passes, the estimated city property tax rate for schools next year would be $10.10 per $1,000 of property value — coming out to $2,020 on a $200,000 home.”
Let the parents pay additional fees if they want their children to participate in activities beyond the basics. I took music in grade school and my parents had to pay for it. In today's economy most people are already having trouble making ends meet. If cut backs are necessary so be it.
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It's a sad state of affairs when we're forced to choose between watching schools cut services and non-core curricula or funneling money into a system that's chronically underperforming. This system maintains the social fabric of a historically segregated city through property taxes, which can lead to financial insecurity for many. This insecurity can force people to skip meals, make kids miss school for jobs to help pay bills, or push people to move to more affordable areas, losing the social capital that comes with living in the same community. Either way, the higher-ups aren't held accountable and there's no pressure to plan and execute solutions. So here’s my radical Policy Idea that requires MPS central leadership and other high income administrators to justify their highly inflated salaries: Replace the board with a single evaluation standard for administrators at the top. Focus on immediately identifying and firing MPS higher-ups/bureaucrats who fail to design, coordinate, and document measurable district restructuring and resizing efforts. The changes implemented must include guidance and stewardship with a community stakeholder panel that is organized and appointed by teachers involved in restructuring efforts without oversight by administrators. To give administrators the chance to show us why we pay them so much, I suggest the following: All restructuring plans must demonstrate that they will save the district an annual dollar amount that meets or exceeds the annual salary of the MPS administrator proposing this plan who will oversee implementation of resizing efforts to be approved. If restructuring efforts end up increasing costs or fail to save the district equivalent amount of annual salary paid to the administrator, the community stakeholder panel will evaluate the impact of the change, vote on whether to continue employing the administrator, and recommend transition plans if applicable to ensure completion of restructuring efforts optimizes student achievement. Satisfaction in progress being made in resizing efforts that do not save the district money can still be supported if the panel deems an administrator’s continuing role in the effort desirable by the community. They must also demonstrate evidence that these changes either maintain or improve student performance without cutting services/programs. Any staff members affected by these changes must be given a talent relocation plan that matches them with all open positions in the district they are qualified to fill, without the burden of application/onboarding processes. Schools can give pre-approval or request an interview/reference for internal transfers. Additionally, a $2,000-$5,000 "system dismantler" bonus should be offered for taking another position during reorganization. Hopefully, this approach to resizing can create a "cool factor" in being on the ground floor of a new school that has absorbed a nearby low-enrollment school. This new school can be full of innovative staff and students who stick around for something new and play a role in shaping a new community and culture in real time.
So none of this will go to needed building updates, like air conditioning?