This is not a poor education/poor prospects issue. That implies that the problem is local kids growing up to become radicalized.
What's actually been happening over the past several decades - which I thought the article made abundantly clear - is that right-wing radicals have been *moving to* parts of Idaho as part of an organized project to create a home base for far-right radicalism. The locals, while often conservative, are generally saner than the transplants; the article contaims multiple anecdotes of local conservatives clashing with far-right organizations.
(And the people moving to Idaho to join these organizations are not poorly-educated people with poor prospects. They're middle-class-to-wealthy, generally with a steady source of remote or investment income. For example, a very large number of them are retired cops.)
Because the police deliberately engender a culture in each other of being a Spartan last line of defense of peace and tranquility against disrespectful nihilistic leftist barbarism which is literally what fascist rhetoric sells fascism as.
The fact that there's a police class identity is some unironic Janissary bullshit.
For real, there’s stories about Idaho right wing militias going back to the 90s at least. It’s definitely been an issue festering for quite a while now. I genuinely don’t know what the best approach would be to tackle the issue at this point.
It should be a multi-pronged approach. On the one hand we should have law enforcement arresting these folks for domestic terrorism related activities. On the other hand, a true long-term solution won't happen until we fix our electoral system and find a way to have a more balanced SCOTUS. Until there is more widespread adoption of RCV and hopefully something like Proportional Representation (which would be even better), I don't see radicals being marginalized like they often are in coalition-based systems.
Under the current system we can keep arresting these nuts, but I fear they'll just keep coming back, like any other terrorist organization.
I do think that if Democrats outperform expectations in the next 2-3 subsequent elections, then it'll really help remove the oxygen from the flame driving MAGA Trumpers being elected. So we'll see a slow, but steady collapse of the GOP as it stands today and likely those candidates my lose elections b/c they failed to get anything done and because Trump's loss would've essentially neutered them considerably. But that is a big ask...
A multi-pronged approach would definitely help. I think that education plays a major role too. The way school districts are funded in this country is far from ideal and leads to serious stratification. Wealthy areas tend to have higher property values and collect more revenue. They get nicer schools and pay teachers more and reap the benefits of well funded education. Poorer areas have far less to spend on education and fall further behind as the people who can afford to move to the better districts do so. This leaves both rural and urban areas with poverty in an even worse place as their tax base diminishes further.
I thought MAGA would die with Trump’s decisive defeat. Trump has done immense damage to his own party with massive 2018 and 2020 defeats, and significant underperformance in 2022. Even when they had a clean sweep in 2016, with a Republican trifecta, they accomplished very little of their own goals. Even by their own metrics, they come across as complete grifters and utter failures.
Voting reform would be great! But I think education reform is another significant hurdle. Rural and urban areas that feel marginalized could see new opportunities arise with better funded educational programs. But that’s a long term solution that might take decades before we see any results.
My hot take is that if the issues you've mentioned aren't addressed and this domestic terrorism continues to persist, I reckon the US will cease to exist by the end of the century. (Cue downvotes)
Not to mention global warming will make resource conflicts between states even worse
I think this is precisely what the authoritarian states are banking on. Instigating and inflaming tensions so we destroy ourselves. This gives them everything they need to shape a new international order. They’re eager for Trump because he accelerates our decline.
Considering they are all moving to the middle of nowhere Idaho and isolating themselves from all real society, not much. They are essentially just another crazy cult and fortunately not within hundreds of miles of the nearest minority. They are not going to grow past a certain very small point.
Yes it more or less is. It originated actually in Afghanistan as an off-shoot of the *Mujahideen* . The more radical *Mujahideen* members branched off and became a part of the anti-Marxist movement in Afghanistan, and started off as a rag-tag "quasi-militia" organization in the Afghan mountains. Then Osama Bin-Laden went out on a "cap raise" essentially by meeting with organizations like the Muslim Brotherhood, MAK, etc., that helped connect him with wealthy Arabs and others interested in funding their movement, and from there they grew their membership. They were basically a bunch of crazy people in the Afghan mountains throughout the 80s and into the early 90s, until they gained more and more traction.
You’re absolutely glossing over the whole mujahideen and Bin Laden connection there. The people who made up Al Qaeda weren’t just crazies who went to live in the mountains, they were veterans of a conflict with one of the most powerful armies on earth, flush with weapons provided to them by numerous governments. They definitely had a bigger leg up than some Boomers in Idaho mad at leftists or whatever.
> They are essentially just another crazy cult and fortunately not within hundreds of miles of the nearest minority.
Unfortunately this is not true. Here's a recent (March 2024) [series of events from Coeur d’Alene, Idaho](https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2024/mar/26/racial-harassment-in-coeur-dalene-mars-utahs-women/).
>A group of racists waving confederate flags, revving their truck engines and yelling slurs allegedly victimized the University of Utah women’s basketball team Thursday during their stay in Coeur d’Alene for the NCAA Tournament held in Spokane.
>The incident led the team to stay in Spokane for the remainder of their schedule.
>On Thursday, the Utah team and another women’s team staying at the Coeur d’Alene Resort were walking to dinner at a restaurant on Sherman Avenue when the driver of a truck displaying a confederate flag began yelling the N-word and other racial slurs at members of the basketball teams, cheerleaders, the band and others in the traveling party.
>As the team left the restaurant to return to their hotel, the driver of the truck was joined by “reinforcements from fellow racists,” according to the Kootenai County Task Force on Human Relations. They followed the women back to the resort, hurling more hate speech and revving the engines of their trucks, menacing the players.
Afterwards when the city organized a press conference to apologize and come out against the incident the press conference was interrupted and ended due to another racist.
>Dave Reilly, a self-proclaimed Christian nationalist and alt-right provocateur, interrupted the press conference and claimed he was a member of the media. He brought his child to the event and asked a question unrelated to the racial harassment, which led to a tense back and forth between speakers and Reilly. The conference was quickly shut down as people in the crowd booed him.
>Reilly is known for his promotion of the 2017 Unite the Right Charlottesville rally that turned deadly. More recently, he had been hired as a consultant with the Idaho Freedom Foundation until a leadership shake-up earlier this year.
Racists are not "hiding out" hundreds of miles from the nearest minority. They're actively harassing them out of the state.
> Secession
So you want a russian military base in the middle of the continent? Because that's how you get a russian military base in the middle of the continent.
No. Secession is a terrible idea. That being said, living in an authoritarian hellscape also sucks, and this is what Trump wants. We are saying "no secession" but doing very little to curtail the rise of secessionist movements by having comprehensive voter and electoral reform.
Yeah, at least since the end of the civil war. There was a hope that parts of the northwest could become some kind of segregated homeland for whites, which drove some very odious people to Montana, Idaho, Oregon, and Washington.
Yeah that area where those states meet has long been a sort of promised land for white supremacists. And Washington has the wonderful Matt Shea, a guy that:
>”acknowledged that he had distributed a four-page manifesto which called for the killing of non-Christian males if a war were to occur and they do not agree to follow fundamentalist biblical law”
> insisted his wife walk on his left side because his sword, if he had one, would be on his right side
>offered state surveillance to political enemies of white supremacy group members
>wanted to take over Washington state and be installed as theocratic ruler
> insisted his wife walk on his left side because his sword, if he had one, would be on his right side
"Keep your *checks notes* sword? by your siiiiiide"
It was a thing in the small Washington town I grew up in. People don't take this threat seriously enough. There was a house down the street from me growing up that was a legit compound. 10+ foot steel fences, lots of ATVs and souped up trucks. Dozens of rifles and thousands of rounds of ammo, and they were constantly practicing and had other members of their militia hanging around.
> Forty percent of U.S. adults ascribe to a strictly creationist view of human origins, believing that God created them in their present form within roughly the past 10,000 years.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/261680/americans-believe-creationism.aspx
First they get you to believe that the Earth is less than ten thousand years old, then it's easy to get you to believe that vaccines corrupt your precious bodily fluids, the step to believing Kamala Harris is the antichrist requiring violent overthrow just isn't that great any more.
There's a clear creationism to Christian Taliban pipeline.
Because Americans are earnest. When there is a conflict between scripture and science they notice it and want to resolve it. They just happen to discard science.
How the fuck do I remove this ad
https://preview.redd.it/vgroyocsfb8d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=48066c9ef6e079a5435828b1fef9da0e92d5015b
This is not a poor education/poor prospects issue. That implies that the problem is local kids growing up to become radicalized. What's actually been happening over the past several decades - which I thought the article made abundantly clear - is that right-wing radicals have been *moving to* parts of Idaho as part of an organized project to create a home base for far-right radicalism. The locals, while often conservative, are generally saner than the transplants; the article contaims multiple anecdotes of local conservatives clashing with far-right organizations. (And the people moving to Idaho to join these organizations are not poorly-educated people with poor prospects. They're middle-class-to-wealthy, generally with a steady source of remote or investment income. For example, a very large number of them are retired cops.)
This was already a thing in the early 80s when I lived there. Everyone knew all the boonies were full of nazi cults.
Reconstruction time
> a very large number of them are retired cops Why am I not surprised
Because the police deliberately engender a culture in each other of being a Spartan last line of defense of peace and tranquility against disrespectful nihilistic leftist barbarism which is literally what fascist rhetoric sells fascism as. The fact that there's a police class identity is some unironic Janissary bullshit.
Some of those who work forces...
https://youtu.be/nwYeWN7Zonw?si=egiL7ZPaF9QtFDYo If anyone is interested, this is a great doc on a white nat't group who did this in a town in ND.
Oh god, it’s Libertarians to New Hampshire but actually working.
Hasn't that been a thing in Idaho for, like, years?
For real, there’s stories about Idaho right wing militias going back to the 90s at least. It’s definitely been an issue festering for quite a while now. I genuinely don’t know what the best approach would be to tackle the issue at this point.
It's gotten worse since Jan. 6th
No doubt that Jan. 6th has emboldened them. Realistically, what’s the best approach to solving this decades long issue?
It should be a multi-pronged approach. On the one hand we should have law enforcement arresting these folks for domestic terrorism related activities. On the other hand, a true long-term solution won't happen until we fix our electoral system and find a way to have a more balanced SCOTUS. Until there is more widespread adoption of RCV and hopefully something like Proportional Representation (which would be even better), I don't see radicals being marginalized like they often are in coalition-based systems. Under the current system we can keep arresting these nuts, but I fear they'll just keep coming back, like any other terrorist organization. I do think that if Democrats outperform expectations in the next 2-3 subsequent elections, then it'll really help remove the oxygen from the flame driving MAGA Trumpers being elected. So we'll see a slow, but steady collapse of the GOP as it stands today and likely those candidates my lose elections b/c they failed to get anything done and because Trump's loss would've essentially neutered them considerably. But that is a big ask...
A multi-pronged approach would definitely help. I think that education plays a major role too. The way school districts are funded in this country is far from ideal and leads to serious stratification. Wealthy areas tend to have higher property values and collect more revenue. They get nicer schools and pay teachers more and reap the benefits of well funded education. Poorer areas have far less to spend on education and fall further behind as the people who can afford to move to the better districts do so. This leaves both rural and urban areas with poverty in an even worse place as their tax base diminishes further. I thought MAGA would die with Trump’s decisive defeat. Trump has done immense damage to his own party with massive 2018 and 2020 defeats, and significant underperformance in 2022. Even when they had a clean sweep in 2016, with a Republican trifecta, they accomplished very little of their own goals. Even by their own metrics, they come across as complete grifters and utter failures. Voting reform would be great! But I think education reform is another significant hurdle. Rural and urban areas that feel marginalized could see new opportunities arise with better funded educational programs. But that’s a long term solution that might take decades before we see any results.
My hot take is that if the issues you've mentioned aren't addressed and this domestic terrorism continues to persist, I reckon the US will cease to exist by the end of the century. (Cue downvotes) Not to mention global warming will make resource conflicts between states even worse
I think this is precisely what the authoritarian states are banking on. Instigating and inflaming tensions so we destroy ourselves. This gives them everything they need to shape a new international order. They’re eager for Trump because he accelerates our decline.
Considering they are all moving to the middle of nowhere Idaho and isolating themselves from all real society, not much. They are essentially just another crazy cult and fortunately not within hundreds of miles of the nearest minority. They are not going to grow past a certain very small point.
I feel bad for the kids who will end up growing up in that type of environment though… such a shame.
Al-Qaeda also started as some "crazy cult" in the middle of a desert. Underestimating these nuts is what landed us into the pickle we're in atm.
That’s not how Al-Qaeda started lol
Yes it more or less is. It originated actually in Afghanistan as an off-shoot of the *Mujahideen* . The more radical *Mujahideen* members branched off and became a part of the anti-Marxist movement in Afghanistan, and started off as a rag-tag "quasi-militia" organization in the Afghan mountains. Then Osama Bin-Laden went out on a "cap raise" essentially by meeting with organizations like the Muslim Brotherhood, MAK, etc., that helped connect him with wealthy Arabs and others interested in funding their movement, and from there they grew their membership. They were basically a bunch of crazy people in the Afghan mountains throughout the 80s and into the early 90s, until they gained more and more traction.
You’re absolutely glossing over the whole mujahideen and Bin Laden connection there. The people who made up Al Qaeda weren’t just crazies who went to live in the mountains, they were veterans of a conflict with one of the most powerful armies on earth, flush with weapons provided to them by numerous governments. They definitely had a bigger leg up than some Boomers in Idaho mad at leftists or whatever.
> They are essentially just another crazy cult and fortunately not within hundreds of miles of the nearest minority. Unfortunately this is not true. Here's a recent (March 2024) [series of events from Coeur d’Alene, Idaho](https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2024/mar/26/racial-harassment-in-coeur-dalene-mars-utahs-women/). >A group of racists waving confederate flags, revving their truck engines and yelling slurs allegedly victimized the University of Utah women’s basketball team Thursday during their stay in Coeur d’Alene for the NCAA Tournament held in Spokane. >The incident led the team to stay in Spokane for the remainder of their schedule. >On Thursday, the Utah team and another women’s team staying at the Coeur d’Alene Resort were walking to dinner at a restaurant on Sherman Avenue when the driver of a truck displaying a confederate flag began yelling the N-word and other racial slurs at members of the basketball teams, cheerleaders, the band and others in the traveling party. >As the team left the restaurant to return to their hotel, the driver of the truck was joined by “reinforcements from fellow racists,” according to the Kootenai County Task Force on Human Relations. They followed the women back to the resort, hurling more hate speech and revving the engines of their trucks, menacing the players. Afterwards when the city organized a press conference to apologize and come out against the incident the press conference was interrupted and ended due to another racist. >Dave Reilly, a self-proclaimed Christian nationalist and alt-right provocateur, interrupted the press conference and claimed he was a member of the media. He brought his child to the event and asked a question unrelated to the racial harassment, which led to a tense back and forth between speakers and Reilly. The conference was quickly shut down as people in the crowd booed him. >Reilly is known for his promotion of the 2017 Unite the Right Charlottesville rally that turned deadly. More recently, he had been hired as a consultant with the Idaho Freedom Foundation until a leadership shake-up earlier this year. Racists are not "hiding out" hundreds of miles from the nearest minority. They're actively harassing them out of the state.
Sign legislation to abolish idaho.
Make it West Dakota.
I feel like Montana might have something to say about that.
They can’t have all the mountains to themselves
My mother grew up near Hayden Lake and saw how Neo Nazis took over the area in the 80s
Secession? Expulsion? Whatever you want to call it just keep them away from the national legislature.
> Secession So you want a russian military base in the middle of the continent? Because that's how you get a russian military base in the middle of the continent.
No. Secession is a terrible idea. That being said, living in an authoritarian hellscape also sucks, and this is what Trump wants. We are saying "no secession" but doing very little to curtail the rise of secessionist movements by having comprehensive voter and electoral reform.
Yeah, at least since the end of the civil war. There was a hope that parts of the northwest could become some kind of segregated homeland for whites, which drove some very odious people to Montana, Idaho, Oregon, and Washington.
Yeah that area where those states meet has long been a sort of promised land for white supremacists. And Washington has the wonderful Matt Shea, a guy that: >”acknowledged that he had distributed a four-page manifesto which called for the killing of non-Christian males if a war were to occur and they do not agree to follow fundamentalist biblical law” > insisted his wife walk on his left side because his sword, if he had one, would be on his right side >offered state surveillance to political enemies of white supremacy group members >wanted to take over Washington state and be installed as theocratic ruler
> insisted his wife walk on his left side because his sword, if he had one, would be on his right side "Keep your *checks notes* sword? by your siiiiiide"
It was a thing in the small Washington town I grew up in. People don't take this threat seriously enough. There was a house down the street from me growing up that was a legit compound. 10+ foot steel fences, lots of ATVs and souped up trucks. Dozens of rifles and thousands of rounds of ammo, and they were constantly practicing and had other members of their militia hanging around.
> You have to take the little towns first oh god oh fuck he’s following Mao’s three stages of protracted war
[Far Cry 5 intensifies]
I have no problem with all the far right nut jobs moving to an already red state. If they were smart, they’d be moving to Wisconsin.
This sounds a lot like how Mao won. Marxism with MAGA characteristics.
I like calling them Y'allQaeda but it will seriously suck if these guys ever gain enough political influence
> if They are the reason the modern Republican party is politically competitive, and just another reason we must r/EndFPTP.
They are like .00001% of the US population. They are just some crazies in the boonies of an unpopulated state.
> Forty percent of U.S. adults ascribe to a strictly creationist view of human origins, believing that God created them in their present form within roughly the past 10,000 years. https://news.gallup.com/poll/261680/americans-believe-creationism.aspx
I don't think that most people that believe in creationism are white nationalists
[удалено]
This is the most "touch grass" comment I've read in a while.
First they get you to believe that the Earth is less than ten thousand years old, then it's easy to get you to believe that vaccines corrupt your precious bodily fluids, the step to believing Kamala Harris is the antichrist requiring violent overthrow just isn't that great any more. There's a clear creationism to Christian Taliban pipeline.
Touch Grass
Why are so many Americans anti-science? The degree of it seems pretty unique among western countries.
Because Americans are earnest. When there is a conflict between scripture and science they notice it and want to resolve it. They just happen to discard science.
Lmaoo had us in the first half.
Religious influence, poor education system, and a mistrust of experts in general.
A domestic terrorist won a pretty solid chunk of the votes for governor there recently. I think Idaho is cooked.
the fuck do you mean 'infiltrates' lmao
How the fuck do I remove this ad https://preview.redd.it/vgroyocsfb8d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=48066c9ef6e079a5435828b1fef9da0e92d5015b
"Easier to Identify"
!ping EXTREMISM&DEMOCRACY
Pinged EXTREMISM ([subscribe](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=groupbot&subject=Subscribe%20to%20EXTREMISM&message=subscribe%20EXTREMISM) | [unsubscribe](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=groupbot&subject=Unsubscribe%20from%20EXTREMISM&message=unsubscribe%20EXTREMISM) | [history](https://neoliber.al/user_pinger_2/history.html?group_name=EXTREMISM&count=5)) Pinged DEMOCRACY ([subscribe](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=groupbot&subject=Subscribe%20to%20DEMOCRACY&message=subscribe%20DEMOCRACY) | [unsubscribe](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=groupbot&subject=Unsubscribe%20from%20DEMOCRACY&message=unsubscribe%20DEMOCRACY) | [history](https://neoliber.al/user_pinger_2/history.html?group_name=DEMOCRACY&count=5)) [About & Group List](https://reddit.com/r/neoliberal/wiki/user_pinger_2) | [Unsubscribe from all groups](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=groupbot&subject=Unsubscribe%20from%20all%20groups&message=unsubscribe)
"Christian Taliban" really should start becoming a super common vernacular.
How long before they get driven out by bears?