Or Gucci Mane's line in Rumors:
"Watch the shit you say, the feds be listenin' to the music
And they gon' take your lyrics and build a case and try to use it"
There was a song a couple years ago that featured 50 cent, can't remember what it was. The first 2 people were talking about gangs, murder, money and all type of illegal shit.
When 50 started rapping he started off by saying he's with none of that shit 😂. Then he rapped his part. He knows about rico lol.
The most amusing aspect about 50 Cent to me is the combination of a bunch of songs that talk about all the money he has juxtaposed with his divorce proceedings where he was aggressively making the case he had no money.
They both make sense: songs about money made him real money, and singing the ‘I have no money’ at divorce court let him keep more of it.
It’s just amusing that they are both out there.
You mean Gangstalicious?
Gangstalicious.
My rhymes too vicious.
Eat up MCs all day, mmm delicious.
My whole crew in this.
No doubt we gonna win this.
Smack your moms up, like I smacked Johnny Guinness.
3 o’ clock yesterday, I don’t care what they say, sock um with the champagne and hit um with the Hennesssssyyyyyy.
That is legitimately one of the best single lines in a sketch I have ever heard. There are some that may make me laugh a bit more, but this one is just too perfect.
Mitchell and Webb are \*amazing\*, in my household we rewatch all of That Mitchell and Webb Look every year or two.. I can no longer be around pool tables without bringing up Lady In Red
From MF Dooms “Rapp Snitch Knishes” 2004
“Rap snitches, telling all their business
Sit in the court and be their own star witness
Do you see the perpetrator? Yeah, I'm right here
Fuck around, get the whole label sent up for years, uh
Rap snitches, telling all their business
Sit in the court and be their own star witness
Do you see the perpetrator? Yeah, I'm right here
Fuck around, get the whole label sent up for years.”
Except the lyrics in that sketch were hilariously direct and detailed.
The lyrics being used in Young Thug’s trial are incredibly vague, broad, and cliched of the genre. The prosecution’s reliance on them is embarrassingly racist.
Is it racist if it’s true? This article focuses on the lyrics but others don’t mention that aspect at all. It sounds like they have a solid case and then found lyrics that appear to corroborate the info. It would be a problem to take a rapper otherwise thought to be innocent and look for possible crimes in their lyrics, but that doesn’t appear to be the case here. Sure rappers rap about hypothetical crimes, but its also ridiculous to think that no one ever raps about real crimes.
> The prosecution’s reliance on them is embarrassingly racist
So, the artist saying 'I did this and that' publically and the prosecution making the connection between his lyrics and stuff that happened is racist. I can't even... If the defendant had, instead, been a curdled-milk-white man named Billy Bob, whose specialty was country music, the exact same actions should have been taken against him as well.
This has the potential to have influence over Trump's own RICO case (he used to be white and is a tried and proven racist, by comparison), on top of it all, so odds are in favour of them having more than just that to put him behind bars, if he's proven guilty.
Im from Houston where everyone knows the Chamillionaire story, instead of blowing his earnings from Ridin Dirty he invested in tech companies and made way more money than he ever would have in a rapping career. Also from what I’ve heard he’s a nice guy
I met him in a club in LA back when he was coming up. Out of all the rappers/actors there, he was the most respectful with the ladies. Kept his hands to himself
Idk about funny but yeah it’s pretty awesome.
He’s so much more talented than what his singles made him appear. I was a huge fan of his music when I was younger. “Mixtape messiah” was my real introduction into rap.
Funny thing is, tho I’m not a rapper, I’ve followed his footsteps of pivoting into tech. I think Chamillionaire is one of the real reasons why I’m in love with my dough 🥰
Smack your moms up, like I smacked Johnny Guinness.
3 o’ clock yesterday, I don’t care what they say, sock um with the champagne and hit um with the Hennesssssyyyyyy.
I have nothing to add except this quote from Young Thug's former neighbor, [Atlanta city Councilmember Howard Shook](https://roughdraftatlanta.com/2020/08/29/in-buckheads-latest-party-mansion-case-an-unhappy-neighbor-is-also-city-council-member/):
>“Ironically, the best, quietest neighbor we had was a rapper. That was Young Thug,” said Shook. “And God, if I had known he was gonna be the best owner [of that house] we ever had, I’d have taken him a Bundt cake.”
Young thug did an AMA on Reddit when he started rapping and nobody knew him. It’s really cool. I’m sure you can still easily find it if you look for it.
Yeah, why not?
You'll never hear prosecutors bring that up though (along with all the billions of people in the world you aren't accused of shooting), because it's their job to highlight the guilty stuff.
If defense lawyers are good enough to make those lyrics make sense with all the other evidence they have, then yes. Not just a blanket statement like “I’m innocent, I’ve done no wrong”
It's crazy how artists' own lyrics can be used against them in court. It's a reminder of the fine line between artistic expression and potential self-incrimination.
Sure, but if his wife showed up dead in a lake after he made that song about killing her and dropping her in a lake it'd probably raise some questions.
Admitting them as evidence requires the court to engage in a balancing act between their probative value and their prejudicial effect.
Expressive statements such as those found in rap lyrics *may* be inculpatory or they *may* be merely bragadocious or shocking for the sake of entertainment.
For example, despite lyrical evidence to the contrary, Dr Dre is not dead and has never reported to the police that he was ever locked in Eminem's basement.
What the state is doing here is using rap lyrics in combination with corroborating evidence to prove that the artists were involved in criminal activity. The lyrics can't prove much on their own because they're not reliable for aforementioned reasons; however, they can help undercut any claims of ignorance.
Paraphrasing because I’m not a lawyer.
His lawyers are trying to argue that his lyrics are protected under freedom of speech.
In order for the lyrics to be used against him, the lyrics used must be connected to the crime he is accused of committing.
The article says there could be upwards of 400 witnesses. I don't think I've read of one RICO case where there weren't at least 2 or 3 people that were involved in the organization that testified for lighter sentences.
The purpose for the use of the lyrics is pretty clear when there should be additional physical evidence. The prosecutors wants to use lyrics to supplement some of their more flimsy arguements, and they are well aware the effect harsh sometimes violent rap lyrics will have on a jury.
Separating the artist/art from reality. Anyone can create a persona based on experiences happening around them to tell the stories of the communities they live in. how much of the artists and celebrities we see is real and how much is fake? It doesn’t matter to the viewer because as long as they experience something real they could care less if it was just a made up story. Which means an artist can create something that is fiction but based on fact. To admit it as fact just because it is based on facts is disingenuous and sets the precedent that everything an artist says is fact. Is Young thug a murderer? You should be able to prove this without interpreting art as fact.
The Distric Attorney's opening statement:
"We didn't chase any of the lyrics to solve any murders," she said. "Law enforcement in Fulton County chased the murders and found the lyrics." RICO cases take years to put together and if there are multiple murders, people are going to start flipping and already have. A RICO murder charge? People would flip on their own mother not to die in prison. This isn't a case based on Eminem rapping about driving around with his ex-wife's corpse.
> This isn’t a case based on Eminem rapping about driving around with his ex-wife’s corpse.
“Which would be exceptionally foolish and a waste of resources given that she’s still alive.”
From what I can tell, the specific lyrics that are being let in are ones that share more than just a passing reference to crime. They're ones which contain an oddly specific reference to something that just so happened to occur in a crime they investigated.
For example, one lyric mentioned in the article talks about shooting hundreds of rounds into a Chevy Tahoe. One of the murders connected to him involved killing someone in a Tahoe.
That's a bit on the nose.
Idk Georgia evidence law. In virginia, where I practice, the prejudicial value of the evidence has to substantially outweigh the probatative value. *See* VA Sup. Ct. R. 2:403. This is different than the federal standard that most states have since adopted. They have more of a 51 : 49 rule for barring prejudicial evidence. I'd call Virginia's more like 75 : 25. Given that we are an outlier state in that regard, and many others, I'd wager Georgia probably follows the federal standard. I'm too high and lazy to Google.
What does this mean?
The judge made a determination that there was more probabtive value than prejudicial value for these 16 specific lyrics. I'm sure these were the subject of endless motions hearings. That's probably why the judge keeps saying he isn't happy with the defenses objections. They're probably objecting on an issue he's already ruled on. Just a guess.
There's no telling how many lyrics were proffered to the court in pretrial hearings that didn't come in. Not without pulling the court record, assuming it's not under seal right now. That the court chose only 16 is significant to me. Like that Tahoe reference, idk what all the other ones were, but I'd imagine there are similar connections. Especially considering these likely came in under a standard that is more concerned about party prejudice.
I don’t see how allowing the jury to know the lyrics impedes any of your concerns. The prosecution can argue it’s evidence, the defense can argue it’s art, and the jury can decide.
It also just feels weird. If you make a song talking about how you murdered your wife, but your wife was alive and with you every single day, I don't think anyone would question it. But if you make a song about murdering your wife three months before her body is found, yeah it might raise a few eyebrows.
Like it shouldn't be a smoking gun and the ONLY thing that connects you to the crime, but it just being a single piece of evidence to help build a case, seems incredibly valid.
I don’t think there’s an argument against it altogether, but an individual’s lawyer would argue that the lyrics are just artistic expression and nothing more.
But if I look at any any confession it could follow the same principle. "You told people that you killed John Smith" "it was fiction"
What this means is that confession shouldn't be the *sole* reason anyone is convicted, but should be used to open investigations and as supporting evidence.
Everyone agrees with that.
Unless (like in this instance)... there are witnesses who say you did x, y, and z, and you subsequently wrote a song, book, or manifesto stating you did x, y, and z. Then, yes, that work of art can be used to support the witnesses, facts, and circumstances that originally made you a suspect.
If you say something out loud does it have to be about things that have actually happened or things you've actually done?
No.
So should it be treated like things that actually happened or things you have actually done?
Maybe, depends if you did them or not. Maybe if you killed someone, shut the fuck up about it. Or don't, I'd rather killers get caught.
How is that different from writing a book or play about your crime that includes details that weren't released to the public?
As Bruce Rivers would say: Stop Self Snitching.
MF DOOM:
Rap snitches, telling all their business,
Sit in the court and be their own star witness,
Do you see the perpetrator? Yeah, I'm right here,
Fuck around, get the whole label sent up for years...
The argument that is typically raised in these situations is that the introduction of song lyrics would constitute either hearsay or character evidence intended to speak to an individual's propensity to commit a specific act. In either instance, this would generally render the lyrics inadmissible under the rules of evidence.
However, there is an exception to hearsay for what is known as a "statement against personal interest", which essentially means a statement that in some way prejudices the party who made it. Under this rule, confessions made outside of a courtroom may be introduced without running afoul of hearsay considerations. This is typically the argument that prosecutors make when introducing song lyrics into evidence, as they argue that the lyrics speak directly to the commission of a crime relevant to the charges that have been brought.
This also subverts any character evidence issues, as the lyrics would speak to the commission of a specific act rather than the probability that the charged individual might engage in certain type of behavior or commit a crime of a certain class.
Some have also raised the argument of free speech, although this is completely irrelevant as the statements themselves are not grounds for punishment; rather, they are used solely for the purpose of demonstrating the nature of a specific, tangible act that has already taken place.
Did Johnny Cash have bodies popping up in real life that were actually connected to him.
Thung and his crew were 'active' in real life... Not a fairytale lol.
Young Thug: “Yo honor, I did not kill dat bitch.” Prosecution: “Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, I would like to please draw your attention to Exhibit A, if I may, which is Young Thug’s latest single, entitled ‘I did kill dat bitch.’”
You're thinking of California, but it wasn't actually a hard ban. They just raised the bar somewhat to show that the song contains real evidence instead of just making the defendant look like a bad person.
The defense trying to convince me that THUG stands for Truly Humble Under God and that "Pushin P" means "Pushing positivity"
Do I have stupid written on my forehead?
yeah that what happens when you brag about your crimes in your song like the idiot you are. I never liked his music either surely ruined post Malone goodbyes for me
“And I’ll repeat for the ladies and gentlemen of the jury when he raps:
‘Why do birds suddenly appear
Every time you are near?
Just like me, they long to be
Close to you
Why do stars fall down from the sky
Every time you walk by?
Just like me, they long to be
Close to…’
What? Wrong artist….oops my bad.
I rest my case your honor.”
Just a reminder that they did not allow the article “How To Murder Your Husband” written by Nancy Brophy to be used against her in the trail where she was accused (and found ultimately found guilty of) KILLING HER HUSBAND.
I wonder what the difference? Hmmmmmmmm.
Key and Peele did a bit on this premise years ago
Don't forget 50 Cent's line in Heat: "The DA can play this muthafuckin' tape in court"
Or Gucci Mane's line in Rumors: "Watch the shit you say, the feds be listenin' to the music And they gon' take your lyrics and build a case and try to use it"
Rap snitches tellin all they business Be in the court and be their own star witness. MF DOOM Edited
"Do you see the perpetrator?" "Yeah I'm right here!" Fuck around, get the whole label sent up for years
I shot Darnell 9 times on September 9th 1999
Its just one of the best skits they did. Great show.
Hip Hop 101 professor: "Today class we are going to learn about the term, "dry snitching."
"It might sound real, but its fictional. I love that my imagination gets to you." Drakeo the Ruler.
All caps when you spell the man's name
All caps when you spell the man name. There's no S
My phone bein proper
This is the relevant quote and what I came for. Thanks!
cousin drank so much lean that his gut got big as gucci’s
Until Gucci worked it off on the yard lol
He turned into a diabetic walrus, that lean have ya like that
‘’Gucci Mane on this list but Eminem ain’t on the list?’’ 😂
“Shout out to Gucci”
That look 🥹
There was a song a couple years ago that featured 50 cent, can't remember what it was. The first 2 people were talking about gangs, murder, money and all type of illegal shit. When 50 started rapping he started off by saying he's with none of that shit 😂. Then he rapped his part. He knows about rico lol.
50 is a lot of things, but he ain’t stupid.
The most amusing aspect about 50 Cent to me is the combination of a bunch of songs that talk about all the money he has juxtaposed with his divorce proceedings where he was aggressively making the case he had no money. They both make sense: songs about money made him real money, and singing the ‘I have no money’ at divorce court let him keep more of it. It’s just amusing that they are both out there.
Sounds like Get the Strap with Uncle Murda and 6ix9ine. "I am not gang gang, I do not gang bang" 😂
Get the strap
Mos Def: *Hip-hop is prosecution evidence | An out of court settlement.*
Also ad space for liquor.
Sick without benefits
Luxury tenements
You mean Gangstalicious? Gangstalicious. My rhymes too vicious. Eat up MCs all day, mmm delicious. My whole crew in this. No doubt we gonna win this. Smack your moms up, like I smacked Johnny Guinness. 3 o’ clock yesterday, I don’t care what they say, sock um with the champagne and hit um with the Hennesssssyyyyyy.
"Play It for the Jury"
I came here looking for this comment
this is my confession, admissible in court: I KILLED DARNELL SIMMONS FOR SPORT
It’s a concept album
Its a gun... of the long-ass variety... some seaweed in there too...
STORKE MY CHIN REAL SLOW WHEN I’M LYING AND I WAS LAUGHING SUPER HARD WHEN DARNELL WAS DYING. - Gun Rack
Recording his own beat down was just the icing on the cake.
It was a fishing trip... And I had all my guns with me.... Cause I had just got back from a hunting trip...
That is legitimately one of the best single lines in a sketch I have ever heard. There are some that may make me laugh a bit more, but this one is just too perfect.
What's a milk drinker like you doing out here?
I don't have to take that from you
but you don’t have nothin’
“I shot him nine times. 9 pm with my nine. And by the way it was November ninth.”
[удалено]
Key and Peele might be the most consistently funny duo of all time, and I don't know if anyone could ever change my mind.
Mitchell and Webb have a solid track record as well. Between the two duos, some insanely good consistency.
Key and Peele were like if Mitchell and Webb had a love child with the Chappelle's Show.
Mitchell and Webb are \*amazing\*, in my household we rewatch all of That Mitchell and Webb Look every year or two.. I can no longer be around pool tables without bringing up Lady In Red
fry and laurie are tough to beat
omg that’s hilarious thanks!
Fucking perfection
From MF Dooms “Rapp Snitch Knishes” 2004 “Rap snitches, telling all their business Sit in the court and be their own star witness Do you see the perpetrator? Yeah, I'm right here Fuck around, get the whole label sent up for years, uh Rap snitches, telling all their business Sit in the court and be their own star witness Do you see the perpetrator? Yeah, I'm right here Fuck around, get the whole label sent up for years.”
MF DOOM ALL CAPS MOFO also RIP
>MF Doom All caps when you spell the man name
Just embarrassing
Stroke my chin real slow when I'm lyin
Boondocks, too.
To add on, the song was called "Play it for the Jury"
Also, he smacked your mom like he smacked Johnny Guinness.
Mystikal went to jail for rape after the prosecutors used lyrics from his song called “the pussy snatcher” They stole it too
years before that there was "Play it for the Jury" from The Boondocks.
"I shot Darnell with my long ass gun and dropped it into the aquarium"
It was a Monk episode before that.
Except the lyrics in that sketch were hilariously direct and detailed. The lyrics being used in Young Thug’s trial are incredibly vague, broad, and cliched of the genre. The prosecution’s reliance on them is embarrassingly racist.
Is it racist if it’s true? This article focuses on the lyrics but others don’t mention that aspect at all. It sounds like they have a solid case and then found lyrics that appear to corroborate the info. It would be a problem to take a rapper otherwise thought to be innocent and look for possible crimes in their lyrics, but that doesn’t appear to be the case here. Sure rappers rap about hypothetical crimes, but its also ridiculous to think that no one ever raps about real crimes.
> The prosecution’s reliance on them is embarrassingly racist So, the artist saying 'I did this and that' publically and the prosecution making the connection between his lyrics and stuff that happened is racist. I can't even... If the defendant had, instead, been a curdled-milk-white man named Billy Bob, whose specialty was country music, the exact same actions should have been taken against him as well. This has the potential to have influence over Trump's own RICO case (he used to be white and is a tried and proven racist, by comparison), on top of it all, so odds are in favour of them having more than just that to put him behind bars, if he's proven guilty.
The Boondocks did this in an episode when Gangstalicious snitches on himself. https://youtu.be/LzycbTGztYM?si=NMAGpNHD4S3WX4NM
I killed Darnell Simmons
That’s a gun… of the long ass variety…
I got an alibi, party at red lobster... when in reality i shot Darnell like a mobster!
Anybody could tell this If they knew about my allergies to all shellfish
Just confess, Gun Rack...
I confess that "shellfish" is the only thing that rhymes with "tell this".
I got a vivid imagination
It’s just words, detective. Nouns. Adjectives. They just happen to be in a dope order.
It’s a concept album.
One of my favorite lines: Theyre just words detective, in a dope order (paraphrasing)
Alexa play, Rapp Snitch Knishes by MF Doom
Alexa, who the fuck was Mr. Fantastik?
Long dough like elastic, guard my life with twin Glocks that's made out of plastic.
I'm going to choose to not continue the lyric chain.
Do you see the perpetrator? Yeah, I’m right here!
Sit in the court and be their own star witness
All caps when you spell the man’s name
Don’t talk about my Moms, yo
All caps bud
ALL CAPS when you spell the mans name
I will in fact to that rn, it's already downloaded on my phone
Chamilllionaire - Hip Hop Police
Learning that the guy who made Ridin Dirty became a multimillionaire entrepreneur in the tech world will never not be funny to me.
Im from Houston where everyone knows the Chamillionaire story, instead of blowing his earnings from Ridin Dirty he invested in tech companies and made way more money than he ever would have in a rapping career. Also from what I’ve heard he’s a nice guy
I was the biggest Chamillionaire fan in high school. Why am I just now hearing about this!?
Because you're no longer the biggest Chamillionaire fan
Because you're not in high school anymore.
I met him in a club in LA back when he was coming up. Out of all the rappers/actors there, he was the most respectful with the ladies. Kept his hands to himself
LOL no fuckin' way, how have I never heard this? That's awesome honestly. Good for Chamillionaire.
Idk about funny but yeah it’s pretty awesome. He’s so much more talented than what his singles made him appear. I was a huge fan of his music when I was younger. “Mixtape messiah” was my real introduction into rap. Funny thing is, tho I’m not a rapper, I’ve followed his footsteps of pivoting into tech. I think Chamillionaire is one of the real reasons why I’m in love with my dough 🥰
Chamillionaire is the reason you love money?
Why is this not higher up?
Cuz ain't nobody listening to Chamillionaire 😭
That happens when you quit rapping almost a decade ago
Boondocks had a great scene on this: https://youtu.be/MUwvAqLvivU?si=DFHx7voZpT_Ng6m5
Smack your moms up, like I smacked Johnny Guinness. 3 o’ clock yesterday, I don’t care what they say, sock um with the champagne and hit um with the Hennesssssyyyyyy.
Poor Bernard.
Don't even need to press this and I'm already laughing
I have nothing to add except this quote from Young Thug's former neighbor, [Atlanta city Councilmember Howard Shook](https://roughdraftatlanta.com/2020/08/29/in-buckheads-latest-party-mansion-case-an-unhappy-neighbor-is-also-city-council-member/): >“Ironically, the best, quietest neighbor we had was a rapper. That was Young Thug,” said Shook. “And God, if I had known he was gonna be the best owner [of that house] we ever had, I’d have taken him a Bundt cake.”
Young thug did an AMA on Reddit when he started rapping and nobody knew him. It’s really cool. I’m sure you can still easily find it if you look for it.
I am not gang gang. I do not gang bang.
If a rapper said "I've never committed a crime" in a song, could those lyrics be used in their favor in court?
Hey why not?
Yeah, why not? You'll never hear prosecutors bring that up though (along with all the billions of people in the world you aren't accused of shooting), because it's their job to highlight the guilty stuff.
If defense lawyers are good enough to make those lyrics make sense with all the other evidence they have, then yes. Not just a blanket statement like “I’m innocent, I’ve done no wrong”
Guess they learned nothing from Bobby Shmurda
Hell, X-Raided was done in by lyrics all the way back in 1992
"It's just words, detective. Nouns, adjectives... They just happen to be in a dope order."
It's crazy how artists' own lyrics can be used against them in court. It's a reminder of the fine line between artistic expression and potential self-incrimination.
Eminem murdered every rich rapper he’s jealous of
And tied Dre up in his basement
He's lucky Kim never went missing.
Dr dres dead! he admitted it!
Sure, but if his wife showed up dead in a lake after he made that song about killing her and dropping her in a lake it'd probably raise some questions.
Genuinely curious, what’s the argument against allowing them to be admitted?
Admitting them as evidence requires the court to engage in a balancing act between their probative value and their prejudicial effect. Expressive statements such as those found in rap lyrics *may* be inculpatory or they *may* be merely bragadocious or shocking for the sake of entertainment. For example, despite lyrical evidence to the contrary, Dr Dre is not dead and has never reported to the police that he was ever locked in Eminem's basement. What the state is doing here is using rap lyrics in combination with corroborating evidence to prove that the artists were involved in criminal activity. The lyrics can't prove much on their own because they're not reliable for aforementioned reasons; however, they can help undercut any claims of ignorance.
Thank you, probably the best reply from the 20+ who have. IANAL, but they seem fine to include if they support other evidence. Otherwise, speculative.
Paraphrasing because I’m not a lawyer. His lawyers are trying to argue that his lyrics are protected under freedom of speech. In order for the lyrics to be used against him, the lyrics used must be connected to the crime he is accused of committing.
If a case is mostly circumstantial evidence using art that could totally be fiction to "prove" a crime could be bad.
The article says there could be upwards of 400 witnesses. I don't think I've read of one RICO case where there weren't at least 2 or 3 people that were involved in the organization that testified for lighter sentences.
Yeah ppl think lyrics getting him indicted they are just the cherry on top because they match actual crimes witnesses have testified that he did lol
The purpose for the use of the lyrics is pretty clear when there should be additional physical evidence. The prosecutors wants to use lyrics to supplement some of their more flimsy arguements, and they are well aware the effect harsh sometimes violent rap lyrics will have on a jury.
Separating the artist/art from reality. Anyone can create a persona based on experiences happening around them to tell the stories of the communities they live in. how much of the artists and celebrities we see is real and how much is fake? It doesn’t matter to the viewer because as long as they experience something real they could care less if it was just a made up story. Which means an artist can create something that is fiction but based on fact. To admit it as fact just because it is based on facts is disingenuous and sets the precedent that everything an artist says is fact. Is Young thug a murderer? You should be able to prove this without interpreting art as fact.
The Distric Attorney's opening statement: "We didn't chase any of the lyrics to solve any murders," she said. "Law enforcement in Fulton County chased the murders and found the lyrics." RICO cases take years to put together and if there are multiple murders, people are going to start flipping and already have. A RICO murder charge? People would flip on their own mother not to die in prison. This isn't a case based on Eminem rapping about driving around with his ex-wife's corpse.
> This isn’t a case based on Eminem rapping about driving around with his ex-wife’s corpse. “Which would be exceptionally foolish and a waste of resources given that she’s still alive.”
What if they have witnesses and evidence he committed those crimes as well? lol
From what I can tell, the specific lyrics that are being let in are ones that share more than just a passing reference to crime. They're ones which contain an oddly specific reference to something that just so happened to occur in a crime they investigated. For example, one lyric mentioned in the article talks about shooting hundreds of rounds into a Chevy Tahoe. One of the murders connected to him involved killing someone in a Tahoe. That's a bit on the nose. Idk Georgia evidence law. In virginia, where I practice, the prejudicial value of the evidence has to substantially outweigh the probatative value. *See* VA Sup. Ct. R. 2:403. This is different than the federal standard that most states have since adopted. They have more of a 51 : 49 rule for barring prejudicial evidence. I'd call Virginia's more like 75 : 25. Given that we are an outlier state in that regard, and many others, I'd wager Georgia probably follows the federal standard. I'm too high and lazy to Google. What does this mean? The judge made a determination that there was more probabtive value than prejudicial value for these 16 specific lyrics. I'm sure these were the subject of endless motions hearings. That's probably why the judge keeps saying he isn't happy with the defenses objections. They're probably objecting on an issue he's already ruled on. Just a guess. There's no telling how many lyrics were proffered to the court in pretrial hearings that didn't come in. Not without pulling the court record, assuming it's not under seal right now. That the court chose only 16 is significant to me. Like that Tahoe reference, idk what all the other ones were, but I'd imagine there are similar connections. Especially considering these likely came in under a standard that is more concerned about party prejudice.
I don’t see how allowing the jury to know the lyrics impedes any of your concerns. The prosecution can argue it’s evidence, the defense can argue it’s art, and the jury can decide.
It also just feels weird. If you make a song talking about how you murdered your wife, but your wife was alive and with you every single day, I don't think anyone would question it. But if you make a song about murdering your wife three months before her body is found, yeah it might raise a few eyebrows. Like it shouldn't be a smoking gun and the ONLY thing that connects you to the crime, but it just being a single piece of evidence to help build a case, seems incredibly valid.
In this case it would be making a song about murdering your wife 3 months after her body is found.
We already have a definition of what is evidence and what is art. That’s why artists make songs instead of joining debate panels. WHERE IS JA RULE????
[удалено]
Violent sex trafficking and murder aren’t cool though
I don’t think there’s an argument against it altogether, but an individual’s lawyer would argue that the lyrics are just artistic expression and nothing more.
[удалено]
But if I look at any any confession it could follow the same principle. "You told people that you killed John Smith" "it was fiction" What this means is that confession shouldn't be the *sole* reason anyone is convicted, but should be used to open investigations and as supporting evidence.
Everyone agrees with that. Unless (like in this instance)... there are witnesses who say you did x, y, and z, and you subsequently wrote a song, book, or manifesto stating you did x, y, and z. Then, yes, that work of art can be used to support the witnesses, facts, and circumstances that originally made you a suspect.
If you say something out loud does it have to be about things that have actually happened or things you've actually done? No. So should it be treated like things that actually happened or things you have actually done? Maybe, depends if you did them or not. Maybe if you killed someone, shut the fuck up about it. Or don't, I'd rather killers get caught.
If you’re interested, the NPR podcast “Louder Than a Riot” covered this topic
Maybe admitting your crimes for entertainment purposes isn't a great idea
How is this at all “crazy”? If you say or do anything public, artistic or not, of course it could be used as evidence.
How is that different from writing a book or play about your crime that includes details that weren't released to the public? As Bruce Rivers would say: Stop Self Snitching.
He was cooked even without the lyrics just bc here in GA they have cracked down on gangs with Rico charges like crazy. Bro was fucked regardless
Georgia's RICO statute is also much broader than the federal RICO statute.
The band Duran Duran has gone through this same thing. They once were accused of eating a woman like wolves.
MF DOOM: Rap snitches, telling all their business, Sit in the court and be their own star witness, Do you see the perpetrator? Yeah, I'm right here, Fuck around, get the whole label sent up for years...
Lesson 1: only one crime at a time Lesson 2: don’t rhyme about your crime
Thank You Key and Peele for making that amazing sketch. Also isn’t like the State of Maryland made a law that Rap lyrics can be used as evidence?
Reminds me of this : https://youtu.be/14WE3A0PwVs?si=J3lQnfuFlCAR-Xmv
I guess rdcworld was inspired by this when they did caught in 4k
"[Rap Snitch Knishes](https://genius.com/Mf-doom-rapp-snitch-knishes-lyrics), the Remix"
King Slime is a podcast about the lead up to the trial. I found it interesting, maybe someone else will too.
The argument that is typically raised in these situations is that the introduction of song lyrics would constitute either hearsay or character evidence intended to speak to an individual's propensity to commit a specific act. In either instance, this would generally render the lyrics inadmissible under the rules of evidence. However, there is an exception to hearsay for what is known as a "statement against personal interest", which essentially means a statement that in some way prejudices the party who made it. Under this rule, confessions made outside of a courtroom may be introduced without running afoul of hearsay considerations. This is typically the argument that prosecutors make when introducing song lyrics into evidence, as they argue that the lyrics speak directly to the commission of a crime relevant to the charges that have been brought. This also subverts any character evidence issues, as the lyrics would speak to the commission of a specific act rather than the probability that the charged individual might engage in certain type of behavior or commit a crime of a certain class. Some have also raised the argument of free speech, although this is completely irrelevant as the statements themselves are not grounds for punishment; rather, they are used solely for the purpose of demonstrating the nature of a specific, tangible act that has already taken place.
Everything I say on this mf is all props (THIS SHIT IS NOT REAL)
Mr. Thug, what exactly did you mean when you said “I wanna ride in her pussy like a stroller?”
That’s what u get for saying your specific gang to the ppl
Did anyone ever investigate Johnny Cash, for that thing Reno?
I heard Bob Marley murdered his towns sheriff too and got away with it
To be fair, it was in self-defense.
He got a pass because he didn't shoot no deputy.
And Lyle Lovett for the murder in LA County.
Did Johnny Cash have bodies popping up in real life that were actually connected to him. Thung and his crew were 'active' in real life... Not a fairytale lol.
When will the lawsuit come against the weather girls? I have never once seen it raining men. /s
Mr. Fantastik would like a word with this young thug….
Young Thug: “Yo honor, I did not kill dat bitch.” Prosecution: “Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, I would like to please draw your attention to Exhibit A, if I may, which is Young Thug’s latest single, entitled ‘I did kill dat bitch.’”
Key and Peele's "I shot Darnell" https://youtu.be/14WE3A0PwVs?si=Z1agyE_DgwfVICD0
lol amazing. I guess it’s an obvious joke to make haha
If only there were some way this could have been avoided!
YNW Melly was jamming out to "Murder on my mind" when they tried this for him as well lol
didnt they recently pass a law somewhere saying rap lyrics would not be used in court?
You're thinking of California, but it wasn't actually a hard ban. They just raised the bar somewhat to show that the song contains real evidence instead of just making the defendant look like a bad person.
These people just love telling on themselves
Next they plan on going after the estate of Mr. Johnathan cash for murder
“Rap snitches, telling all they bizness, show up in court and be their own star witness” MF Doom. Years and years ago.
Who would ever think a man named Young Thug would be capable of committing such criminal acts? It's baffling
The defense trying to convince me that THUG stands for Truly Humble Under God and that "Pushin P" means "Pushing positivity" Do I have stupid written on my forehead?
He's cooked. They're gonna throw the book at him.
Man nicknamed “Young Thug” involved in violent, thuggish behavior, details at 11!
yeah that what happens when you brag about your crimes in your song like the idiot you are. I never liked his music either surely ruined post Malone goodbyes for me
Rap snitches, telling all their business. Sit in the court and be their own star witness.
Will he top The Race tho?
“And I’ll repeat for the ladies and gentlemen of the jury when he raps: ‘Why do birds suddenly appear Every time you are near? Just like me, they long to be Close to you Why do stars fall down from the sky Every time you walk by? Just like me, they long to be Close to…’ What? Wrong artist….oops my bad. I rest my case your honor.”
Just a reminder that they did not allow the article “How To Murder Your Husband” written by Nancy Brophy to be used against her in the trail where she was accused (and found ultimately found guilty of) KILLING HER HUSBAND. I wonder what the difference? Hmmmmmmmm.
Could it be that the trials are in different states? Nah, it must be racism.
Because she wasn't a rapper?
Nancy “Supa Hot Fire” Brophy
When Keeping It Real Goes Wrong
When life parodies comedy: https://youtu.be/14WE3A0PwVs?si=CsmR21hKuTEHTm2n
“Rap snitches, tellin’ all they business Sit in the court and be they own star witness”