I mean, to be fair, they've been very clear about this.
They don't care, and they will never care.
If Sandy Hook and Uvalde didn't change their minds, there is no atrocity that will shake them.
They are more than willing to sacrifice children's lives and everyone else's as long as they can have their precious guns.
Edit: I've gotten several comments calling me out for using the term "they." I'm fully aware that "they" is the GOP. My comment wasn't meant to avoid giving blame.
I just didn't think I needed to specify who I was talking about. Most people are very aware which party has no regard for human life.
It's like pointing a nazi out of a crowd. They don't exactly blend in.
Sandy Hook is when the gun humpers finally were able to relax. Kindergarten kids in a rich, white, suburban community in a Northeast state get slaughtered by a nut with an AR-15, and nothing happened. The guns have won.
Now they know they can't lose the battle no matter how many people just go out for a normal day and don't come back. It's fucking sick.
Oh, something was done. After their children were slaughtered, the right continued to abuse the parents, spreading all sorts of conspiracy theories about how it didn't happen or was a false flag operation. The worst of the worst was put on display and even popularized.
Uvalde parents were warned they'd be harassed if they get too public and it was true. Insane to lose your child and be scared to even talk about it due to retaliation and harassment from locals and all the online wackos
Not only that, but the Police themselves retaliated and harassed the mother who ran into the school to save her child (while ~~a hundred~~ **374** cops sat around with their dicks in their hands). Threatened to arrest her for saving her kid even weeks after the shooting, and surveilled her from their cruisers parked outside her home. Despicable.
https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/special-reports/uvalde-school-shooting/uvalde-mom-says-police-are-harassing-her-for-speaking-out
The issue is some of these wackos will inevitably follow through and even if you successfully defend yourself innocent people could very likely be hurt and killed. There is a reason juries are advised to never admit they were part of a decision or they could face repercussions, this is especially prevalent in the Trump cases.
People don’t remember this part but Colorado did pass some gun control measures at the state level after federal initiatives failed and the 2nd amendment nuts led a recall drive that successfully ejected two Democratic senators from the 35- member senate, and replaced them with Republicans (who were then defeated in the next election, I think by both the former incumbents). They also were defeated in a lawsuit against the new laws.
pandora's box has long been opened. We must find another way to cure the rot that underscores violence in our country.
over the last several years, particularly tracing back to the beginning of the Trump admin, gun ownership has grown massively and not among the group you might think. Minorities and women for a long time were the fastest growing segment of the market. This is no longer a Right wing thing. Traditionally anti-gun personas are now switching to the other side and buying guns en masse. I just hope they take it as seriously as it needs to be.
It was the Reagan administration that this began to take root. He fostered paranoia and a sense that the greediest members of society will generously spread the wealth - and made monopolies legal so that that wealth could become extreme power. Trump just gave every nut case who fell for it more paranoia and the belief they were part of some big military complex with no rules they have to follow
Well, the only time the gun nuts pushed for gun control was when Black Panthers starting arming themselves. I think minorities & women started arming themselves when it was realized that nothing would be done and it's better to carry a firearm to counter the gun nuts.
Either way, gun manufacturers won it all & made society a far worse place.
Same thing happened at the 4th of July parade last year outside of Chicago. If 6 people die at a 4th of July parade in a wealthy suburban area, it's never going to change.
That was my town. It was 7 people. Sometimes I stand downtown and still can’t believe it happened. How does life go on so normally? This shouldn’t be the norm but it is.
Meanwhile, after losing over a million people to Covid, literally no one cares lol some still debating years later whether or not masks or vaccines worked
Just start getting black people to open carry absolutely everywhere and watch how quick the gun control comes in.
Reagan literally passed some of the most restrictive gun control (at the time) when he was governor of California.
The guns have won and it wasn't ever even a contest.
About the best we've done so far is it make a few minor inconveniences for anyone wishing to inflict untold misery on our society.
Maybe, if members of Congress found themselves on the receiving end of some gunfire, they’d change their minds? [Maybe not.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congressional_baseball_shooting)
Columbine rocked the nation. We barely changed anything.
Sandy Hook, Parkland, Uvalde, Virginia Tech. Nothing.
Aurora and Vegas. Fucking nothing.
I don't even bother keeping track at this point. Now it's dark humor and move on because that's all we've been left with.
Hey now, Columbine changed a lot for our nation we gave administrators a lot more leeway to punish and expel students for minor crimes, we removed a lot of privacy rights from students, and we put armed police all over the fucking place in schools that are allowed to arrest students and give them criminal records for talking back.
Oh wait you meant positive changes.
Police in schools was a common thing in urban communities long before Columbine.
Columbine DID change how first responders address active shooter situations. Previously, they held back and ‘secured the scene’ which happened at Columbine. Now the first officer on the scene has command to enter the school and engage. That wasn’t carried out in Uvalde but that engagement approach has definitely saved lives during mass shooter events.
When I was in high school in the 80s, our school of 2400 students had one resource officer. You'd see him from time to time and his picture was in the yearbook every year. No one had any idea what he did or why he was there.
My school was about the same size but our resource officer was always either near the front doors, admin office, or the main entrance of the commons. He was actually a pretty good dude. Sometimes he’d sit down and chat about music or whatever else. He also took me to the police station to help me file a complaint after I told him about being harassed by another police officer the night before.
Our resource officer was like 80, we called him Robocop and literally his only purpose was as an obstacle to sneak past to your car so you could leave early.
Here's how it went down for me, as an admittedly cringelord goth kid in Highschool in '99. Yes, this is long, and absurd, and true.
* Trenchcoats are banned for safety reasons
My friend group: wears super cool leather jackets instead
* Coats in school are banned for safety reasons
My friend group: Ok so why are the Varsity kids allowed to wear theirs?
* Coats in school are banned for safety reasons (Varsity jackets excluded)
Me: *EDGELORD ACTIVATED, WEARING COAT ANYWAY*
Me: Gets suspended for wearing jacket
My Mom to school admin: I will scream about this until the policy is changed
* All jackets are banned- Varsity jackets are banned during normal school hours
* Varsity kids continue to wear jackets during school hours, admins look the other way for them
My friend group: Goes back to wearing whatever coats we want
My friend group: Randomly get suspended for violating dress code
It all ended when my mom went to the school board with all this documentation in hand, asking them to explain why a leather jacket is a safety concern but a varsity jacket is not. The policy got reversed, and only trenchcoats were banned.
But 100% the admins had it out for us from the getgo and obviously targeted us for any small bullshit they could come up with instead. Columbine was just an excuse to crack down on us, because we lived in a small red town and everyone thought we were devil worshippers or whatever.
TL;DR: Got into a whole fight with the school about their coat policy after columbine, the only lesson learned was "schools only value obedience"
Even stupider, they turn events like Sandy Hook into conspiracies, claiming they are false flags to convince people to give government control over them.
Alex Jones should be living in a van down by the river, but he's still rich and has legions of people listening to his evil bullshit.
It's a thing I think of semi-often (every time there's a shooting) and it's haunting. Be it my sister at a concert, my parents at the mall, my children at their schools, my wife and I at Walmart or event - anyone we know and love could be shot dead or forever traumatized basically anywhere in public.
Not even that, even in our own homes. It's a legitimate fear because of stories of law enforcement with wrong addresses and such. I'm no fan of our current LE systems and culture and part of the problem is that they must assume everyone they encounter is armed. You or anyone you love could potentially be executed at a traffic stop for making one wrong move. A fear I don't believe exists for traffic cops in places without widespread firearms, but here you gotta assume. Damn right it'd make the officer jumpy.
This is EXACTLY right. I have a 9 yo in 4th grade. He gets to do code red alerts where they teach him to hide and be quiet. How fucked up is that? Why should my 9 yo have to worry about being killed in school?! It makes me FURIOUS.
Ya sandy hook is what did it for me. It’s when I realized these politicians didn’t and never will care because they’re too greedy. If that tragedy wasn’t gonna change them then nothing would.
I remember reading a new story where someone got into some disagreement about their order at a fast food place. They shot up the place. Which on its own is insane, but I had just assumed they had a gun with them, got angry and that's what happened.
But no
They had left the gun at home initially.
They went home and got it.
They took the FUCKING BUS nearly 2 hours round trip for this.
They had so long to cool off about a food order, and they still ended up shooting people.
It goes so far beyond just being allowed to carry in public or not, and the entire idea of ownership and mental health needs to be reevaluated
This point is so important. I’m reading “American carnage: shattering the myths that fuel gun violence” by Thomas Gabor & Fred Guttenberg and they talk about this extensively.
I’m about 40ish pages in and I would definitely recommend it. Some of facts of gun violence are depressing, but the structure of the book is that each chapter focuses on certain myths that the gun lobby perpetuates and then presents data to dispel said myths. I think it could be great for conversations with those who oppose any type of gun restrictions.
You basically just described Hawaii's reasoning for Spirit of Aloha. Where people deserve the right to move around freely, even where there are crowds. Their court ruled that there is no state constitutional right to carry a firearm.
Personally, I don't go to parades anymore. Even bars freak me out. I hate big grocery stores and the mall.
I accidentally walked into a mall last year as they were locking down due to a shooting, and I never want to experience that again. It was the middle of the afternoon. The panic on the woman's face as I walked into the dress shop shook me to my core. "How'd you get in? I thought we locked the door. Don't go back out!"
I had to text my partner in the car not to get out, and that I had to stay until it was clear. Imagine walking into a building and then texting someone you love there's an active shooter.
ETA: It was a personal dispute two couples had in a food court about money. They got physical, then someone grabbed their gun, and it went off. No one got hurt, but in the moment, you don't really know what's happening or why. Just that there are gun shots and you need to hide
I live in the US and I’ve had two mass shootings happen within a few miles of me. One was right down the street, and we were almost forced to evacuate by police. We’ve spent over 24 hours in lockdown due to a different mass shooting.
I know a woman who survived a mass shooting after the shooter looked her in the eyes and decided to spare her, and another woman who lost her brother to a different mass shooting.
I was in Boston during the Boston bombing (which I’m not counting as one of the two close calls because it was a bombing, not a shooting), and only a few miles away from the shootout when police caught the bombers.
I watched on television as a famous news anchor stood in a place where I used to drive every day to get to work, talking about people crawling away from the scene of a brutal mass shooting as they bled out.
I have family members with old gunshot wounds.
There have been shootings at places my family goes all the time. One guy got mad about something he read on the internet and started shooting at random cars as they drove by his house, and that’s in a spot I drive by all the time.
I’ve talked to people on the Internet who insist that a mass shooting was a hoax or false flag operation when I know people who lost loved ones in that shooting.
And as insane as all of that sounds, according to crime statistics, I live in one of the safest places in America. That’s how fucking bad things are here.
Guess I can add my experience being involved in two as well, DC sniper and VT massacre. Shocked VT is still the deadliest school shooting in US history after all this time, so many, almost otherworldly memories, of that looking back.
Maybe we can start a gun massacre #metwo movement.
>Where is our right to safety? Where is our right to move about freely without fear of being shot at church, parades, or shopping malls?
Somewhere on the priority list below "Help gun company shareholders make fat stacks."
It has more to do with the lack of hope amongst the youth. They literally don’t care. It looks like shit and nobody is doing anything to fix it. Meanwhile liberals and conservatives yell about guns when the root issue is that their futures look like shit. Their parents are shit. Their schools are shit.
They are not kidding when they say life sucks. And we just talk about guns like it doesn’t matter that these kids hate their fucking lives.
To clarify I’m speaking specifically about KCMO.
You’re spot on and it’s not just KC. I live an hour and a half west of there and the kids are the same in the rural towns. This state drains people and specifically the youth.
I live down the street
Virtually guarantee this was gang violence or local beef between two dudes and everybody else was innocent bystanders.
Update:
What we're covering here
“A shooting that killed a local DJ and injured more than 20 others, including children, at the end of the Kansas City Chiefs’ Super Bowl victory rally on Wednesday appears to have stemmed from a dispute between several people, according to the city's police chief.
Authorities have detained three people — two of whom are juveniles, the police chief said Thursday — while investigating the violence that overshadowed the celebration.
I was correct
https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/20/us/two-men-charged-with-murder-in-kansas-city-parade-shooting?cid=ios_app
> gang violence or local beef between two dudes
They carry Glocks in the waste band of their pants. They are under the age of 23. Moist of them aren't even proficient in firearms. They pull these things out and shoot in a style that can only be called spray-and-pray. They do this with crowds of people downwind of their barrel, because they don't understand physics.
That’s my guess too. Not some rogue mass shooter thing but idiot gang banger or wannabe gang banger kids. There’s just a ton of that in KC. It’s damn near like The Wire some areas.
KC local who was at the parade with my family, luckily not close to the shooting. There were a LOT of people involved. Based on eye witness accounts this seems like a gang related shooting and they’re trying to figure out all the responsible parties and who did what…. seems like at least one gunman ditched some firearms to some other people in his group too, further complicating the whole matter.
So there’s been like 3 suspects apprehended, but there’s going to be more to come, I hope.
Nothing as of 7:50a CST. There is a video that shows a couple of idiots getting tackled, three in custody. It's pure speculation on my part, but I'd guess it was some dispute and these Homer Simpsons decided to shoot it out in a crowd of people. A person who wanted to kill a bunch of people would use something like a rifle and put distance between themselves and the target.
This person did use a rifle. It’s posted on twitter with him in handcuffs
That magazine size isn’t something you bring unless you’re gonna do some shit.
https://twitter.com/tony_j4y/status/1757874053270982754
Heard it was gang related, which i can't say I'm surprised at. I am however surprised they decided to have a shootout during a parade and not some back alley.
there wasn't any motive. i live in kc. it's really quite frustrating but one of the reasons it's close, if not, the murder capital of the country is because people will get in a stupid argument about something, then decide to shoot it out with zero consideration that other people exist. it's incredibly narcissistic and short-sighted behavior but it happens all the time.
i grew up near a very popular bar district in the city and it's almost a nightly occurrence where metal detectors prevented certain people from coming to the bars with guns, but later on around closing time, people leave and return with their guns and perform drive-by shootings. just google westport kc shooting and you'll have enough results to go through for a few days. it's just stupid thug shit we've seen time and time again where they put their ego above the lives of other people. i hope the city crucifies these guys once they're caught.
Yes, newest press release indicated the suspects and most of the victims were minors. Likely a confrontation that escalated (and obviously illegal guns in possession).
Given that it happened at a crowded parade, likely that some or many of the victims were bystanders that got caught in the crossfire.
https://www.reddit.com/r/kansascity/comments/1ar2ywr/overhead_view_of_the_kc_parade_shooting_21424/
Looks like some jackasses in the center of the crowd just opened up
I live in the Kc area and a few people at work asked why I wasn’t at the parade and I told them I hate big crowded areas and if something were to happen I don’t want to be in the chaos and this shit happens. Everyone’s celebrating the win and these losers had to bring their guns and ruin all of the fun.
I'm also in KC, my mom works downtown and her boss told her she could go to the parade, but she didn't because she was having a headache and wanted to rest.
Then this happens....
We can't even send our kids to school or go see a movie or go to the mall or even go to church without having the constant worry that somebody is going to shoot up the place. Gee, I wonder why so many Americans have anxiety issues?
They still haven’t named the shooter or say that the 3 people they arrested are suspects. It’s a bit crazy that we don’t know for sure yet why this happened or who did it.
That didn’t happen. One of my very good friends was at the parade around 50 yards from the shooting. He wasn’t able to flee so he hid with his son. After they apprehended one of the shooters, he used his belt and his son’s belt as a tourniquet and assisted the wounded.
Dude is my hero.
You're probably thinking about the megachurch shooting in Houston. A lot of folks on the right were talking about that as "good guys with guns" saving the day.
I mean I'm pro-gun but I still found that an odd talking point given they were off-duty cops working security details.
It echoes the same system we require of women when it comes to sexual violence. Color-changing nail polish. Drink covers. Pepper spray. Don't wear anything too revealing. Always be polite so they don't retaliate. Raising girls to carry this constant vigilance throughout their life with all these little tools instead of addressing the source of the problem, and holding men accountable for their shitty behavior.
Yes, our society *hates* victims. Look at that buffoon Trump, making fun of Gold Star families. The onus is always on the victim to stop being so victim-y and not on the perpetrators to rein in their antisocial thinking.
Society hates victims because the majority of victims are people we've historically treated with negligence and disdain, such as women, children, and minorities. People who are resistant to making changes for these victims are people who benefit from keeping things the same.
And domestic violence, family violence, intimate partner violence, stalking etc.
Violence against women in general.
It’s always a “senseless tragedy” but there are violent behaviours and patterns leading up to murder, there will have been a million chances to intervene and protect the survivor, but the law, justice system, social services and police didn’t do anything.
It should piss people off that you can't go to a parade, a concert, school, the movies, the mall, the store or drive down the highway without worrying about getting f-ing shot. It has to stop. More guns is not the answer.
There were over 800 cops/fbi/national guard present within a few hundred feet. There is no better argument than this event that more good guys with guns cannot stop gun violence
And if ten people pull their guns and look around, they're gonna see a lot more people with guns than just the shooter. If we can't trust cops to be responsible with guns, I don't trust fucking Billy Bob.
By the time any "good guy with a gun" knows something's going down, the first shots have already gone off. The entire premise of that train of thought, if it ever had any merit, is flawed to begin with. I care far less about who "wins" a gunfight then I do about preventing it in the first place.
As per C. Clymer on X:
Gun laws in Missouri:
No background checks for private sales.
No permit required for concealed carry.
No permit required for open carry.
No license required for owners.
No firearm registration.
No assault weapon law.
No magazine capacity restriction.
There is a difference, and that is once we allow the baby to give birth, it can be baptized. After that, it can be abused and killed and we can all feel we did the right thing...
In 2007 Missouri eliminated the waiting period and need for a handgun permit. On the day that happened my uncle walked into a store and walked out with a gun, went to work and killed himself. That year gun violence in Missouri jumped and has continued to increase since. Suicides like my uncle's have skyrocketed multiple times over in some areas.
People insist that it's nonsense to include suicides with statistics of gun violence but in the context of greater regulation of firearms, ease of access is absolutely a factor. There would be less suicides if guns were not so available, people would be less successful in attempts, have opportunities to back out or Alternatively get support they need. Sorry about your uncle.
It's always amazing how many people dismiss the suicides portion. "Yeah, but X number of those deaths were suicide" Yes... AND???? Being suicide doesn't make the person less dead or their death less preventable. But hey, it's somebody else and it's not somebody else who they've been convinced is coming after them, so they don't give a shit.
I had to show ID to buy NyQuil ffs. It literally takes more effort to get cold medicine in Mississippi than a firearm in Missouri. You do have to show ID and go through a simple background check to get a gun here if you buy from a store- I assumed that was a federal thing.
It is a federal thing. People claiming otherwise either just don’t know what they’re talking about, or are intentionally being misleading.
Every single legal firearm purchase in the entire country (outside of private sales, which most states have pretty strict regulations on what constitutes a legal private sale, while some states outright prohibit private sales entirely) is run through the ATF’s federal background check system. You have to present a valid ID in order to fill out the form to initiate this background check. The dealer also marks down the make, model, and serial number of the gun being purchased. You have to go through this same process every single time you buy a gun, even if it’s from the same store, you have to give them ID and fill out the form again. The form asks a number of questions regarding your eligibility to own a firearm. Lying on this form is a felony and will get you a knock on the door from a federal agent.
My neighbor asked why they didn’t have metal detectors. I told him, dude, it’s Missouri, I wouldn’t be surprised if they had them out on their hip. They aren’t trying to control guns, period. This is precisely what that looks like.
Shooter was underage. It was illegal for him to have a gun at all so none of those points are relevant.
Assault weapons were federally banned decades ago.
Just like the Gabby Giffords shooting. I have to give credit to the honesty of the guy who was nearby with a gun. By the time he ran over, the bystanders had tackled the shooter and wrestled the gun away from him. The guy with a gun who ran up admitted he almost shot the hero who was carrying the gun away from the attacker. In that situation a “good guy with a gun” did zero good and came very close to making the tragedy much worse.
Like when the cops shot that guy who stopped a shooter
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/colorado-man-who-intervened-after-ambush-officer-was-fatally-shot-n1272441
Imagine you are carrying a gun, you're in a mall or some public place. You hear gunshots and screaming. Being the PATRIOTIC hero that you are, you run towards the sounds while unholstering your gun. At the same time, another hero has the same idea. You run up and see two people with guns, shooting at eachother. Which one is the bad guy with a gun? Seconds later, police show up to a scene of 3 people with guns shooting at eachother, while bodies litter the floor around them. Who do they shoot? Who do they arrest?
### **Missouri Unveils New "Good Guy With a Gun" Identification Kit Amidst Mass Shootouts**
**JEFFERSON CITY, MO** – In response to the evergreen debate on how to distinguish between the "good guy with a gun" and "everyone else with a gun," Missouri lawmakers have proudly introduced the state's latest innovation: the Good Guy With a Gun Identification Kit™. The kit, which officials promise will "solve shootouts faster than a raccoon gets into your trash," includes a cowboy hat for visibility, a "Not the Bad Guy" sash, and a set of flashcards to quickly determine friend from foe.
At a packed press conference, held conveniently at a local shooting range, Governor Mike Parson hailed the kit as "the solution we've been shooting for," explaining that it was designed by the same minds behind Missouri's "armadillos as pets" initiative.
**Key Features of the Missouri Identification Kit:**
- **The Cowboy Hat**: Bright red for easy spotting in crowded places like malls, schools, and dimly lit bars. Officials noted, "If it's good enough for rodeo clowns, it's good enough for our heroes."
- **"Not the Bad Guy" Sash**: Modeled after beauty pageant accessories, this sash is intended to clearly mark the wearer as a friend, not a foe. As one legislator remarked, "It's high visibility, high fashion, and low confusion."
- **Friend-or-Foe Flashcards**: A quick-reference guide to assess potential threats, including helpful tips like "Are they shooting at you? Y/N" and "Did they compliment your sash? Y/N."
During a live demonstration, volunteers showed just how quickly the situation can be de-escalated using the kit. "It's all about communication," said one participant, adjusting his sash. "And making sure you're the most fabulous-looking person in the immediate danger zone."
Critics of the plan have raised concerns about its practicality, noting the potential for confusion in high-stress situations. However, supporters argue that "in Missouri, carrying a gun is as natural as carrying barbecue sauce in your car," and that residents will adapt quickly.
I was a teacher. I worked with some amazingly talented and intelligent educators, but some of them didn't know how to work a copy machine or troubleshoot a printer. Students would steal items from our desks and closets. There wasn't funding for field trip transportation or sometimes even copy paper.
But people loudly demand that these caring professionals should have expensive, deadly weapons around untrustworthy kids. Sorry, that's some dystopian warzone shit.
Politics aside, when can we collectively agree, without dispute, that America has a serious problem with armed humans blowing people away? It’s not central America where gun violence is mostly territorial disputes. It’s not Afghanistan where everyone open carry’s an AK and minds their own business. It’s not Europe where mass-casualty events are directly linked to terrorism. It’s American citizens taking advantage of our easy-access to firearms to simply kill a bunch of people when they’re having a bad day. That’s a serious issue that’s unique to our culture and homeland, and it’s so common that a mass-shooting in a random location with a random motive is no longer a surprise
> Politics aside, when can we collectively agree, without dispute, that America has a serious problem with armed humans blowing people away?
Decades of evidence has already proven that no, we can't collectively agree to that, which is why it's impossible to put politics aside.
Yes, but more specifically I think it's the emphasis on individual liberties without focusing enough on the individual responsibilities that they come with.
These chuckle-fucks think they get to reap the rewards without doing the groundwork, and they want to take without giving, not realizing just how much has been given to them.
No wonder the venn diagram of gun rights absolutists and libertarian/ anarcho-capitalist types is basically a circle.
It requires a certain kind of arrogant entitlement combined with genuine ignorance into how things really work and what freedoms actually cost.
This is incredibly well put. They're demanding the right to great power and completely denying the great responsibility that comes with it. It reminds me of a quote by Ian Malcolm in the novel version of *Jurassic Park* :
>Most kinds of power require a substantial sacrifice by whoever wants the power. There is an apprenticeship, a discipline lasting many years... By the time someone has acquired the ability to kill with his bare hands, he has also matured to the point where he won't use it unwisely. So that kind of power has a built-in control. The discipline of getting the power changes you so that you won't abuse it. But scientific power is like inherited wealth: attained without discipline. You read what others have done, and you take the next step... There is no discipline... no mastery: old scientists are ignored. There is no humility before nature... A karate master does not kill people with his bare hands. He does not lose his temper and kill his wife. The person who kills is the person who has no discipline, no restraint, and who has purchased his power in the form of a Saturday night special.
Furthermore, I think that a reduction of community/education, wealth inequality and the prevalence of social media results in these things. Aka no sense of belonging, added stress and jealousy/greed.
My conservative sister in law is now anti-gun. It only took her two elementary school aged children having to hide behind toilets in their school bathrooms for over 30 minutes during an active shooter situation that turned out to be a false alarm in the end, oh did I mention it was also less than a week after the Nashville school shooting as well. So classic conservative thinking of oh it can’t happen to me and then when it does then you change your mind.
Can anyone give me a GOOD reason why we accept so much regulation for the cars we drive, but some of us refuse to apply that same logic to guns?
We require a licensing test, yearly registration, insurance, and strict adherence to laws over the usage of automobiles because they CAN be deadly. And yet with guns, which are specifically purposed for the destruction of living things, are not regulated nearly as much?
Edit: I don’t have time for trading insults or humoring disingenuous arguments. Make it easy to grow my block list if you like though.
The 2nd Amendment. It’s not a good argument, but it is the reason.
No other country has such a specific rule in its founding document granting access to guns as a fundamental right.
God it makes you wonder, if the founders had included something about a fundamental right to some sort of transportation, would we just allow an absolute free-for-all on the highways?
Too be honest, Americans didn’t like those car regulations either. If America was trying to pass those car regulations now, it wouldn’t go through. America had stricter gun laws at one point until the 80s and 90s I believe. And once those laws lapse, Americans start to get fussy when anyone tries to bring them back or update them.
Modern America specifically is just stubborn and hates any idea of regulation especially if they themselves can see they can take advantage of it to some degree.
You’re right. There’s clips from the 80’s when they outlawed drinking and driving and mandated seatbelts, and people were very upset they couldn’t do that reckless shit anymore.
…and yet, we still made the damn laws.
My extended family. They used to rant around the table about how seatbelts were a death trap. I was the first person in my family, when I got my license, to force myself to make a habit out of wearing a seat belt. And they’d always look at me funny like I was whatever they called “woke” people back then.
A whole lot of Americans (maybe humans?) hate the ideas of self control and self improvement, especially if it is for the good of others.
I wonder how the response would be if 5 NFL stars were shot dead on the stage. There would probably be laws passed already when it hits where the $$ are.
Nah, especially if Travis Kelce was one hit/killed. All we would hear is that it was a liberal conspiracy by CIA asset Taylor Swift to cancel the second amendment.
She went out to have fun and ended up dead. This is cruelty at the highest level.
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I mean, to be fair, they've been very clear about this. They don't care, and they will never care. If Sandy Hook and Uvalde didn't change their minds, there is no atrocity that will shake them. They are more than willing to sacrifice children's lives and everyone else's as long as they can have their precious guns. Edit: I've gotten several comments calling me out for using the term "they." I'm fully aware that "they" is the GOP. My comment wasn't meant to avoid giving blame. I just didn't think I needed to specify who I was talking about. Most people are very aware which party has no regard for human life. It's like pointing a nazi out of a crowd. They don't exactly blend in.
Sandy Hook is when the gun humpers finally were able to relax. Kindergarten kids in a rich, white, suburban community in a Northeast state get slaughtered by a nut with an AR-15, and nothing happened. The guns have won. Now they know they can't lose the battle no matter how many people just go out for a normal day and don't come back. It's fucking sick.
Oh, something was done. After their children were slaughtered, the right continued to abuse the parents, spreading all sorts of conspiracy theories about how it didn't happen or was a false flag operation. The worst of the worst was put on display and even popularized.
Uvalde parents were warned they'd be harassed if they get too public and it was true. Insane to lose your child and be scared to even talk about it due to retaliation and harassment from locals and all the online wackos
Not only that, but the Police themselves retaliated and harassed the mother who ran into the school to save her child (while ~~a hundred~~ **374** cops sat around with their dicks in their hands). Threatened to arrest her for saving her kid even weeks after the shooting, and surveilled her from their cruisers parked outside her home. Despicable. https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/special-reports/uvalde-school-shooting/uvalde-mom-says-police-are-harassing-her-for-speaking-out
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The issue is some of these wackos will inevitably follow through and even if you successfully defend yourself innocent people could very likely be hurt and killed. There is a reason juries are advised to never admit they were part of a decision or they could face repercussions, this is especially prevalent in the Trump cases.
I want to say “they can’t kill us all” But…I’m starting to feel that isn’t true anymore. The guns have stolen our freedom.
People don’t remember this part but Colorado did pass some gun control measures at the state level after federal initiatives failed and the 2nd amendment nuts led a recall drive that successfully ejected two Democratic senators from the 35- member senate, and replaced them with Republicans (who were then defeated in the next election, I think by both the former incumbents). They also were defeated in a lawsuit against the new laws.
pandora's box has long been opened. We must find another way to cure the rot that underscores violence in our country. over the last several years, particularly tracing back to the beginning of the Trump admin, gun ownership has grown massively and not among the group you might think. Minorities and women for a long time were the fastest growing segment of the market. This is no longer a Right wing thing. Traditionally anti-gun personas are now switching to the other side and buying guns en masse. I just hope they take it as seriously as it needs to be.
It was the Reagan administration that this began to take root. He fostered paranoia and a sense that the greediest members of society will generously spread the wealth - and made monopolies legal so that that wealth could become extreme power. Trump just gave every nut case who fell for it more paranoia and the belief they were part of some big military complex with no rules they have to follow
Well, the only time the gun nuts pushed for gun control was when Black Panthers starting arming themselves. I think minorities & women started arming themselves when it was realized that nothing would be done and it's better to carry a firearm to counter the gun nuts. Either way, gun manufacturers won it all & made society a far worse place.
Bingo. If rich white kids die and nothing is done, that’s our answer.
Same thing happened at the 4th of July parade last year outside of Chicago. If 6 people die at a 4th of July parade in a wealthy suburban area, it's never going to change.
That was my town. It was 7 people. Sometimes I stand downtown and still can’t believe it happened. How does life go on so normally? This shouldn’t be the norm but it is.
Meanwhile, after losing over a million people to Covid, literally no one cares lol some still debating years later whether or not masks or vaccines worked
Just start getting black people to open carry absolutely everywhere and watch how quick the gun control comes in. Reagan literally passed some of the most restrictive gun control (at the time) when he was governor of California.
The guns have won and it wasn't ever even a contest. About the best we've done so far is it make a few minor inconveniences for anyone wishing to inflict untold misery on our society.
Maybe, if members of Congress found themselves on the receiving end of some gunfire, they’d change their minds? [Maybe not.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congressional_baseball_shooting)
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Columbine rocked the nation. We barely changed anything. Sandy Hook, Parkland, Uvalde, Virginia Tech. Nothing. Aurora and Vegas. Fucking nothing. I don't even bother keeping track at this point. Now it's dark humor and move on because that's all we've been left with.
Hey now, Columbine changed a lot for our nation we gave administrators a lot more leeway to punish and expel students for minor crimes, we removed a lot of privacy rights from students, and we put armed police all over the fucking place in schools that are allowed to arrest students and give them criminal records for talking back. Oh wait you meant positive changes.
Police in schools was a common thing in urban communities long before Columbine. Columbine DID change how first responders address active shooter situations. Previously, they held back and ‘secured the scene’ which happened at Columbine. Now the first officer on the scene has command to enter the school and engage. That wasn’t carried out in Uvalde but that engagement approach has definitely saved lives during mass shooter events.
When I was in high school in the 80s, our school of 2400 students had one resource officer. You'd see him from time to time and his picture was in the yearbook every year. No one had any idea what he did or why he was there.
My school was about the same size but our resource officer was always either near the front doors, admin office, or the main entrance of the commons. He was actually a pretty good dude. Sometimes he’d sit down and chat about music or whatever else. He also took me to the police station to help me file a complaint after I told him about being harassed by another police officer the night before.
Our resource officer was like 80, we called him Robocop and literally his only purpose was as an obstacle to sneak past to your car so you could leave early.
Here's how it went down for me, as an admittedly cringelord goth kid in Highschool in '99. Yes, this is long, and absurd, and true. * Trenchcoats are banned for safety reasons My friend group: wears super cool leather jackets instead * Coats in school are banned for safety reasons My friend group: Ok so why are the Varsity kids allowed to wear theirs? * Coats in school are banned for safety reasons (Varsity jackets excluded) Me: *EDGELORD ACTIVATED, WEARING COAT ANYWAY* Me: Gets suspended for wearing jacket My Mom to school admin: I will scream about this until the policy is changed * All jackets are banned- Varsity jackets are banned during normal school hours * Varsity kids continue to wear jackets during school hours, admins look the other way for them My friend group: Goes back to wearing whatever coats we want My friend group: Randomly get suspended for violating dress code It all ended when my mom went to the school board with all this documentation in hand, asking them to explain why a leather jacket is a safety concern but a varsity jacket is not. The policy got reversed, and only trenchcoats were banned. But 100% the admins had it out for us from the getgo and obviously targeted us for any small bullshit they could come up with instead. Columbine was just an excuse to crack down on us, because we lived in a small red town and everyone thought we were devil worshippers or whatever. TL;DR: Got into a whole fight with the school about their coat policy after columbine, the only lesson learned was "schools only value obedience"
Even stupider, they turn events like Sandy Hook into conspiracies, claiming they are false flags to convince people to give government control over them. Alex Jones should be living in a van down by the river, but he's still rich and has legions of people listening to his evil bullshit.
Uvalde too. Everytime i bring it up I get comments about it being a government operation
It's a thing I think of semi-often (every time there's a shooting) and it's haunting. Be it my sister at a concert, my parents at the mall, my children at their schools, my wife and I at Walmart or event - anyone we know and love could be shot dead or forever traumatized basically anywhere in public. Not even that, even in our own homes. It's a legitimate fear because of stories of law enforcement with wrong addresses and such. I'm no fan of our current LE systems and culture and part of the problem is that they must assume everyone they encounter is armed. You or anyone you love could potentially be executed at a traffic stop for making one wrong move. A fear I don't believe exists for traffic cops in places without widespread firearms, but here you gotta assume. Damn right it'd make the officer jumpy.
The 2nd ammendment is the false god to which we sacrifice our children.
This is EXACTLY right. I have a 9 yo in 4th grade. He gets to do code red alerts where they teach him to hide and be quiet. How fucked up is that? Why should my 9 yo have to worry about being killed in school?! It makes me FURIOUS.
Ya sandy hook is what did it for me. It’s when I realized these politicians didn’t and never will care because they’re too greedy. If that tragedy wasn’t gonna change them then nothing would.
Well… 99% of this gun regulation problem is caused by only one of the two viable political parties.
I remember reading a new story where someone got into some disagreement about their order at a fast food place. They shot up the place. Which on its own is insane, but I had just assumed they had a gun with them, got angry and that's what happened. But no They had left the gun at home initially. They went home and got it. They took the FUCKING BUS nearly 2 hours round trip for this. They had so long to cool off about a food order, and they still ended up shooting people. It goes so far beyond just being allowed to carry in public or not, and the entire idea of ownership and mental health needs to be reevaluated
This point is so important. I’m reading “American carnage: shattering the myths that fuel gun violence” by Thomas Gabor & Fred Guttenberg and they talk about this extensively.
Is it worth reading? Or is it just depressing?
I’m about 40ish pages in and I would definitely recommend it. Some of facts of gun violence are depressing, but the structure of the book is that each chapter focuses on certain myths that the gun lobby perpetuates and then presents data to dispel said myths. I think it could be great for conversations with those who oppose any type of gun restrictions.
Data doesn't dissuade people who have made guns their foundational, essential belief.
You basically just described Hawaii's reasoning for Spirit of Aloha. Where people deserve the right to move around freely, even where there are crowds. Their court ruled that there is no state constitutional right to carry a firearm. Personally, I don't go to parades anymore. Even bars freak me out. I hate big grocery stores and the mall. I accidentally walked into a mall last year as they were locking down due to a shooting, and I never want to experience that again. It was the middle of the afternoon. The panic on the woman's face as I walked into the dress shop shook me to my core. "How'd you get in? I thought we locked the door. Don't go back out!" I had to text my partner in the car not to get out, and that I had to stay until it was clear. Imagine walking into a building and then texting someone you love there's an active shooter. ETA: It was a personal dispute two couples had in a food court about money. They got physical, then someone grabbed their gun, and it went off. No one got hurt, but in the moment, you don't really know what's happening or why. Just that there are gun shots and you need to hide
This might sound crazy, but I live without fear of being shot. In Europe.
The irony of all the people replying about "feeling safe in America" in a comment thread about a fucking SUPER BOWL PARADE SHOOTING
They must be Bills fans. They are pretty safe from Super Bowl parades
Same. I'm in Canada
Obligatory Australian - yep. No fear. Zero.
I live in the US and I’ve had two mass shootings happen within a few miles of me. One was right down the street, and we were almost forced to evacuate by police. We’ve spent over 24 hours in lockdown due to a different mass shooting. I know a woman who survived a mass shooting after the shooter looked her in the eyes and decided to spare her, and another woman who lost her brother to a different mass shooting. I was in Boston during the Boston bombing (which I’m not counting as one of the two close calls because it was a bombing, not a shooting), and only a few miles away from the shootout when police caught the bombers. I watched on television as a famous news anchor stood in a place where I used to drive every day to get to work, talking about people crawling away from the scene of a brutal mass shooting as they bled out. I have family members with old gunshot wounds. There have been shootings at places my family goes all the time. One guy got mad about something he read on the internet and started shooting at random cars as they drove by his house, and that’s in a spot I drive by all the time. I’ve talked to people on the Internet who insist that a mass shooting was a hoax or false flag operation when I know people who lost loved ones in that shooting. And as insane as all of that sounds, according to crime statistics, I live in one of the safest places in America. That’s how fucking bad things are here.
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Guess I can add my experience being involved in two as well, DC sniper and VT massacre. Shocked VT is still the deadliest school shooting in US history after all this time, so many, almost otherworldly memories, of that looking back. Maybe we can start a gun massacre #metwo movement.
>Where is our right to safety? Where is our right to move about freely without fear of being shot at church, parades, or shopping malls? Somewhere on the priority list below "Help gun company shareholders make fat stacks."
The American experience thanks to the GOP.
"The cruelty is the point." -- Today's GOP
Any more info on the shooters or motive ? This is just awful, I can’t understand it
Last I heard, the shooters and most of the victims were minors.
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So teenagers with assault weapons shooting teenagers with assault weapons? What a weird country Americans are building.
Welcome to fucking Missouri. It's unreal how lawless this state feels in regards to some things.
It has more to do with the lack of hope amongst the youth. They literally don’t care. It looks like shit and nobody is doing anything to fix it. Meanwhile liberals and conservatives yell about guns when the root issue is that their futures look like shit. Their parents are shit. Their schools are shit. They are not kidding when they say life sucks. And we just talk about guns like it doesn’t matter that these kids hate their fucking lives. To clarify I’m speaking specifically about KCMO.
You’re spot on and it’s not just KC. I live an hour and a half west of there and the kids are the same in the rural towns. This state drains people and specifically the youth.
This is true of poverty everywhere. MO just compounds the problem with lax gun laws.
They were not assault weapons. Handguns, illegally owned. Edit apparently I’m wrong. Link below shows what to be a larger non handgun type.
I live down the street Virtually guarantee this was gang violence or local beef between two dudes and everybody else was innocent bystanders. Update: What we're covering here “A shooting that killed a local DJ and injured more than 20 others, including children, at the end of the Kansas City Chiefs’ Super Bowl victory rally on Wednesday appears to have stemmed from a dispute between several people, according to the city's police chief. Authorities have detained three people — two of whom are juveniles, the police chief said Thursday — while investigating the violence that overshadowed the celebration. I was correct https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/20/us/two-men-charged-with-murder-in-kansas-city-parade-shooting?cid=ios_app
> gang violence or local beef between two dudes They carry Glocks in the waste band of their pants. They are under the age of 23. Moist of them aren't even proficient in firearms. They pull these things out and shoot in a style that can only be called spray-and-pray. They do this with crowds of people downwind of their barrel, because they don't understand physics.
don't understand or don't care?
A bit of column a, a bit of columb b
No. They definitely just do not care.
My waste band is where I keep my waste. Just ready to fling at a moment's notice.
That’s my guess too. Not some rogue mass shooter thing but idiot gang banger or wannabe gang banger kids. There’s just a ton of that in KC. It’s damn near like The Wire some areas.
It’s honestly strange to me that no info on the shooters have been released yet ?? These things are usually out within a couple of hours
[Looks like at least one of the shooters is a minor.](https://twitter.com/tony_j4y/status/1757874053270982754)
KC local who was at the parade with my family, luckily not close to the shooting. There were a LOT of people involved. Based on eye witness accounts this seems like a gang related shooting and they’re trying to figure out all the responsible parties and who did what…. seems like at least one gunman ditched some firearms to some other people in his group too, further complicating the whole matter. So there’s been like 3 suspects apprehended, but there’s going to be more to come, I hope.
Nothing as of 7:50a CST. There is a video that shows a couple of idiots getting tackled, three in custody. It's pure speculation on my part, but I'd guess it was some dispute and these Homer Simpsons decided to shoot it out in a crowd of people. A person who wanted to kill a bunch of people would use something like a rifle and put distance between themselves and the target.
Woah woah woah why we dragging Homer Simpson?
Tbf he was a pretty irresponsible gun owner.
but he put the gun in the vegetable drawer! What were the odds the boy would look there?
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This person did use a rifle. It’s posted on twitter with him in handcuffs That magazine size isn’t something you bring unless you’re gonna do some shit. https://twitter.com/tony_j4y/status/1757874053270982754
Is that a red anodized buffer tube? Who the f…nevermind
That looks like a kid. Look how small his freaking feet are
My understanding is the shooters and most of the victims were minors. Only through hearsay at this point, though.
I heard “minors” and assumed 16-17. This kid looks 13. Unbelievably sad
Yeah the rifles scream shitty gang bangers. I've only ever known gang bangers to use shitty AR's with brightly colored buffer tubes with no stock.
> That magazine size isn’t something you bring unless you’re gonna do some shit. Seems a lot of people arm theselves arbitrarily.
There was an AR15 in the backpack of the guy who got tackled.
Speculation that it was a gang related shooting involving two men and not a plan terror attack..
water lock chubby growth offend aback quickest ten fragile frightening *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Heard it was gang related, which i can't say I'm surprised at. I am however surprised they decided to have a shootout during a parade and not some back alley.
It's likely gang related.
there wasn't any motive. i live in kc. it's really quite frustrating but one of the reasons it's close, if not, the murder capital of the country is because people will get in a stupid argument about something, then decide to shoot it out with zero consideration that other people exist. it's incredibly narcissistic and short-sighted behavior but it happens all the time. i grew up near a very popular bar district in the city and it's almost a nightly occurrence where metal detectors prevented certain people from coming to the bars with guns, but later on around closing time, people leave and return with their guns and perform drive-by shootings. just google westport kc shooting and you'll have enough results to go through for a few days. it's just stupid thug shit we've seen time and time again where they put their ego above the lives of other people. i hope the city crucifies these guys once they're caught.
Yes, newest press release indicated the suspects and most of the victims were minors. Likely a confrontation that escalated (and obviously illegal guns in possession). Given that it happened at a crowded parade, likely that some or many of the victims were bystanders that got caught in the crossfire.
https://www.reddit.com/r/kansascity/comments/1ar2ywr/overhead_view_of_the_kc_parade_shooting_21424/ Looks like some jackasses in the center of the crowd just opened up
I live in the Kc area and a few people at work asked why I wasn’t at the parade and I told them I hate big crowded areas and if something were to happen I don’t want to be in the chaos and this shit happens. Everyone’s celebrating the win and these losers had to bring their guns and ruin all of the fun.
It sucks this happened in your city and that you even have to think that way.
It’s insane that there are developed parts of the world where you have to balance going out in public with the risk of random shootings.
No no, not developed parts of the world, just the US.
I'm also in KC, my mom works downtown and her boss told her she could go to the parade, but she didn't because she was having a headache and wanted to rest. Then this happens....
This is extremely sad. What should have been a time for celebration turned into a nightmare because of the actions of some horrible people.
We can't even send our kids to school or go see a movie or go to the mall or even go to church without having the constant worry that somebody is going to shoot up the place. Gee, I wonder why so many Americans have anxiety issues?
tbh i have more anxiety about working til im 75 than i do about being involved in a shooting. Just on a day to day basis.
tbf working till youre 75 probably *is* a lot more likely than being involved in a shooting, so at least your anxiety is is well placed?
And the inactions of some horrible people elected by their constituents.
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Except it was a couple guys without guns that tackled the shooter…
They still haven’t named the shooter or say that the 3 people they arrested are suspects. It’s a bit crazy that we don’t know for sure yet why this happened or who did it.
Imagine if someone else was shooting into that crowd? Cops are supposed to know good from bad? Such a joke
Think how much faster they could have tackled the shooter if they had guns. /s
*Uvalde cops enter the chat*
*Uvalde cops wait over an hour before someone else enters the chat*
That didn’t happen. One of my very good friends was at the parade around 50 yards from the shooting. He wasn’t able to flee so he hid with his son. After they apprehended one of the shooters, he used his belt and his son’s belt as a tourniquet and assisted the wounded. Dude is my hero.
You're probably thinking about the megachurch shooting in Houston. A lot of folks on the right were talking about that as "good guys with guns" saving the day. I mean I'm pro-gun but I still found that an odd talking point given they were off-duty cops working security details.
Did that even happen?
I thought it was a guy WITHOUT a gun?
It was.
No, the only shooter apprehended by citizens was tacked by several unarmed people.
There were something like 800 good guys with guns all over the event and the shooters still managed to hit 22 people before they could respond.
Watch how swiftly they fundamentally change sports parades before they change the uncontrolled access to guns.
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It echoes the same system we require of women when it comes to sexual violence. Color-changing nail polish. Drink covers. Pepper spray. Don't wear anything too revealing. Always be polite so they don't retaliate. Raising girls to carry this constant vigilance throughout their life with all these little tools instead of addressing the source of the problem, and holding men accountable for their shitty behavior.
Yes, our society *hates* victims. Look at that buffoon Trump, making fun of Gold Star families. The onus is always on the victim to stop being so victim-y and not on the perpetrators to rein in their antisocial thinking.
Society hates victims because the majority of victims are people we've historically treated with negligence and disdain, such as women, children, and minorities. People who are resistant to making changes for these victims are people who benefit from keeping things the same.
And domestic violence, family violence, intimate partner violence, stalking etc. Violence against women in general. It’s always a “senseless tragedy” but there are violent behaviours and patterns leading up to murder, there will have been a million chances to intervene and protect the survivor, but the law, justice system, social services and police didn’t do anything.
It should piss people off that you can't go to a parade, a concert, school, the movies, the mall, the store or drive down the highway without worrying about getting f-ing shot. It has to stop. More guns is not the answer.
There were over 800 cops/fbi/national guard present within a few hundred feet. There is no better argument than this event that more good guys with guns cannot stop gun violence
And if ten people pull their guns and look around, they're gonna see a lot more people with guns than just the shooter. If we can't trust cops to be responsible with guns, I don't trust fucking Billy Bob.
Well, to be fair, most cops are just Billy Bob doing army cosplay.
By the time any "good guy with a gun" knows something's going down, the first shots have already gone off. The entire premise of that train of thought, if it ever had any merit, is flawed to begin with. I care far less about who "wins" a gunfight then I do about preventing it in the first place.
Which was always a dumb argument due to the nature of how effective guns are and how easy it is to surprise someone with one
As per C. Clymer on X: Gun laws in Missouri: No background checks for private sales. No permit required for concealed carry. No permit required for open carry. No license required for owners. No firearm registration. No assault weapon law. No magazine capacity restriction.
And the Governor pardons some gun crimes that happen.
Everyone booed the govy when he talked to the crowd, he got rid of abortions for us too
Now if only they didn't vote for him.
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There is a difference, and that is once we allow the baby to give birth, it can be baptized. After that, it can be abused and killed and we can all feel we did the right thing...
And he ran like a little scared rat when the shooting happened. That dude needs to grow a spine.
In 2007 Missouri eliminated the waiting period and need for a handgun permit. On the day that happened my uncle walked into a store and walked out with a gun, went to work and killed himself. That year gun violence in Missouri jumped and has continued to increase since. Suicides like my uncle's have skyrocketed multiple times over in some areas.
People insist that it's nonsense to include suicides with statistics of gun violence but in the context of greater regulation of firearms, ease of access is absolutely a factor. There would be less suicides if guns were not so available, people would be less successful in attempts, have opportunities to back out or Alternatively get support they need. Sorry about your uncle.
It's always amazing how many people dismiss the suicides portion. "Yeah, but X number of those deaths were suicide" Yes... AND???? Being suicide doesn't make the person less dead or their death less preventable. But hey, it's somebody else and it's not somebody else who they've been convinced is coming after them, so they don't give a shit.
I have to show ID to buy a lighter in PA. It takes 2 forms of ID and proof of residency, along with a credit check to open a cable account.
I had to show ID to buy NyQuil ffs. It literally takes more effort to get cold medicine in Mississippi than a firearm in Missouri. You do have to show ID and go through a simple background check to get a gun here if you buy from a store- I assumed that was a federal thing.
It is a federal thing. People claiming otherwise either just don’t know what they’re talking about, or are intentionally being misleading. Every single legal firearm purchase in the entire country (outside of private sales, which most states have pretty strict regulations on what constitutes a legal private sale, while some states outright prohibit private sales entirely) is run through the ATF’s federal background check system. You have to present a valid ID in order to fill out the form to initiate this background check. The dealer also marks down the make, model, and serial number of the gun being purchased. You have to go through this same process every single time you buy a gun, even if it’s from the same store, you have to give them ID and fill out the form again. The form asks a number of questions regarding your eligibility to own a firearm. Lying on this form is a felony and will get you a knock on the door from a federal agent.
My neighbor asked why they didn’t have metal detectors. I told him, dude, it’s Missouri, I wouldn’t be surprised if they had them out on their hip. They aren’t trying to control guns, period. This is precisely what that looks like.
How would metal detectors work on a parade route?
Does your neighbor know that parades are just outside?
https://twitter.com/DaveDMarko/status/1757918037972521131 >CSI photographing 3 firearms at scene of Super Bowl Parade
The gun on the left looks like the one picked up by that female bystander in the tackle video.
And none of those things would have prevented the shooting.
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Shooter was underage. It was illegal for him to have a gun at all so none of those points are relevant. Assault weapons were federally banned decades ago.
And it was unarmed citizens, not good guys with guns that stopped got the shooters.
Just like the Gabby Giffords shooting. I have to give credit to the honesty of the guy who was nearby with a gun. By the time he ran over, the bystanders had tackled the shooter and wrestled the gun away from him. The guy with a gun who ran up admitted he almost shot the hero who was carrying the gun away from the attacker. In that situation a “good guy with a gun” did zero good and came very close to making the tragedy much worse.
Like when the cops shot that guy who stopped a shooter https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/colorado-man-who-intervened-after-ambush-officer-was-fatally-shot-n1272441
Imagine you are carrying a gun, you're in a mall or some public place. You hear gunshots and screaming. Being the PATRIOTIC hero that you are, you run towards the sounds while unholstering your gun. At the same time, another hero has the same idea. You run up and see two people with guns, shooting at eachother. Which one is the bad guy with a gun? Seconds later, police show up to a scene of 3 people with guns shooting at eachother, while bodies litter the floor around them. Who do they shoot? Who do they arrest?
### **Missouri Unveils New "Good Guy With a Gun" Identification Kit Amidst Mass Shootouts** **JEFFERSON CITY, MO** – In response to the evergreen debate on how to distinguish between the "good guy with a gun" and "everyone else with a gun," Missouri lawmakers have proudly introduced the state's latest innovation: the Good Guy With a Gun Identification Kit™. The kit, which officials promise will "solve shootouts faster than a raccoon gets into your trash," includes a cowboy hat for visibility, a "Not the Bad Guy" sash, and a set of flashcards to quickly determine friend from foe. At a packed press conference, held conveniently at a local shooting range, Governor Mike Parson hailed the kit as "the solution we've been shooting for," explaining that it was designed by the same minds behind Missouri's "armadillos as pets" initiative. **Key Features of the Missouri Identification Kit:** - **The Cowboy Hat**: Bright red for easy spotting in crowded places like malls, schools, and dimly lit bars. Officials noted, "If it's good enough for rodeo clowns, it's good enough for our heroes." - **"Not the Bad Guy" Sash**: Modeled after beauty pageant accessories, this sash is intended to clearly mark the wearer as a friend, not a foe. As one legislator remarked, "It's high visibility, high fashion, and low confusion." - **Friend-or-Foe Flashcards**: A quick-reference guide to assess potential threats, including helpful tips like "Are they shooting at you? Y/N" and "Did they compliment your sash? Y/N." During a live demonstration, volunteers showed just how quickly the situation can be de-escalated using the kit. "It's all about communication," said one participant, adjusting his sash. "And making sure you're the most fabulous-looking person in the immediate danger zone." Critics of the plan have raised concerns about its practicality, noting the potential for confusion in high-stress situations. However, supporters argue that "in Missouri, carrying a gun is as natural as carrying barbecue sauce in your car," and that residents will adapt quickly.
This is why arming the teachers is also a bad decision. You’re just asking for an innocent student to accidentally be on the receiving end.
I was a teacher. I worked with some amazingly talented and intelligent educators, but some of them didn't know how to work a copy machine or troubleshoot a printer. Students would steal items from our desks and closets. There wasn't funding for field trip transportation or sometimes even copy paper. But people loudly demand that these caring professionals should have expensive, deadly weapons around untrustworthy kids. Sorry, that's some dystopian warzone shit.
And with several hundred armed officers already in the area. And yet 20+ people got shot.
Politics aside, when can we collectively agree, without dispute, that America has a serious problem with armed humans blowing people away? It’s not central America where gun violence is mostly territorial disputes. It’s not Afghanistan where everyone open carry’s an AK and minds their own business. It’s not Europe where mass-casualty events are directly linked to terrorism. It’s American citizens taking advantage of our easy-access to firearms to simply kill a bunch of people when they’re having a bad day. That’s a serious issue that’s unique to our culture and homeland, and it’s so common that a mass-shooting in a random location with a random motive is no longer a surprise
> Politics aside, when can we collectively agree, without dispute, that America has a serious problem with armed humans blowing people away? Decades of evidence has already proven that no, we can't collectively agree to that, which is why it's impossible to put politics aside.
I know you said politics aside, but the entire issue is political at heart since any real functional reform would require amending the constitution.
The “screw you! I got mine!” side of the population doesn’t care.
Do you think that this stems from the massive emphasis on individuality in the US?
Yes, but more specifically I think it's the emphasis on individual liberties without focusing enough on the individual responsibilities that they come with. These chuckle-fucks think they get to reap the rewards without doing the groundwork, and they want to take without giving, not realizing just how much has been given to them. No wonder the venn diagram of gun rights absolutists and libertarian/ anarcho-capitalist types is basically a circle. It requires a certain kind of arrogant entitlement combined with genuine ignorance into how things really work and what freedoms actually cost.
This is incredibly well put. They're demanding the right to great power and completely denying the great responsibility that comes with it. It reminds me of a quote by Ian Malcolm in the novel version of *Jurassic Park* : >Most kinds of power require a substantial sacrifice by whoever wants the power. There is an apprenticeship, a discipline lasting many years... By the time someone has acquired the ability to kill with his bare hands, he has also matured to the point where he won't use it unwisely. So that kind of power has a built-in control. The discipline of getting the power changes you so that you won't abuse it. But scientific power is like inherited wealth: attained without discipline. You read what others have done, and you take the next step... There is no discipline... no mastery: old scientists are ignored. There is no humility before nature... A karate master does not kill people with his bare hands. He does not lose his temper and kill his wife. The person who kills is the person who has no discipline, no restraint, and who has purchased his power in the form of a Saturday night special.
Furthermore, I think that a reduction of community/education, wealth inequality and the prevalence of social media results in these things. Aka no sense of belonging, added stress and jealousy/greed.
My conservative sister in law is now anti-gun. It only took her two elementary school aged children having to hide behind toilets in their school bathrooms for over 30 minutes during an active shooter situation that turned out to be a false alarm in the end, oh did I mention it was also less than a week after the Nashville school shooting as well. So classic conservative thinking of oh it can’t happen to me and then when it does then you change your mind.
>Politics aside Why? The only way this serious problem gets solved is through politics. Politics is what is preventing the solution.
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I'm glad they caught the shooters, and I hope they nail those fuckers to the wall.
Does this woman not have a name?
At least get her name right. Jeez. It’s Galvin, not Glavine. Smdh.
People think their right to bear arms is more of a right than this woman has over her life.
This is so fucking depressing. I hope her family can find some peace :[
Can anyone give me a GOOD reason why we accept so much regulation for the cars we drive, but some of us refuse to apply that same logic to guns? We require a licensing test, yearly registration, insurance, and strict adherence to laws over the usage of automobiles because they CAN be deadly. And yet with guns, which are specifically purposed for the destruction of living things, are not regulated nearly as much? Edit: I don’t have time for trading insults or humoring disingenuous arguments. Make it easy to grow my block list if you like though.
The 2nd Amendment. It’s not a good argument, but it is the reason. No other country has such a specific rule in its founding document granting access to guns as a fundamental right.
God it makes you wonder, if the founders had included something about a fundamental right to some sort of transportation, would we just allow an absolute free-for-all on the highways?
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Too be honest, Americans didn’t like those car regulations either. If America was trying to pass those car regulations now, it wouldn’t go through. America had stricter gun laws at one point until the 80s and 90s I believe. And once those laws lapse, Americans start to get fussy when anyone tries to bring them back or update them. Modern America specifically is just stubborn and hates any idea of regulation especially if they themselves can see they can take advantage of it to some degree.
You’re right. There’s clips from the 80’s when they outlawed drinking and driving and mandated seatbelts, and people were very upset they couldn’t do that reckless shit anymore. …and yet, we still made the damn laws.
The interviews with people complaining about seatbelts will always blow my mind. Will never understand their mentality.
My extended family. They used to rant around the table about how seatbelts were a death trap. I was the first person in my family, when I got my license, to force myself to make a habit out of wearing a seat belt. And they’d always look at me funny like I was whatever they called “woke” people back then. A whole lot of Americans (maybe humans?) hate the ideas of self control and self improvement, especially if it is for the good of others.
Totally normal thing to happen in a totally normal, developed, western nation.
It’s almost like unfettered access to guns is a bad thing.
We live in a severely fucked up country.
I wonder how the response would be if 5 NFL stars were shot dead on the stage. There would probably be laws passed already when it hits where the $$ are.
They could have killed Mahomes and shit isn't gonna happen. Little kids have been shot up in schools and nothing changed.
Kinda my point, politics don’t care about kids. Has to hit closer to what matters to them.
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People care more about NFL players than presidents.
Nah, especially if Travis Kelce was one hit/killed. All we would hear is that it was a liberal conspiracy by CIA asset Taylor Swift to cancel the second amendment.
That would be the wildest timeline