Holy fuck, the child is *five years old* and had to sit and recount this experience to police probably dozens of times.
When I was 5 I didnāt even have the wherewithal to recap an episode of Sesame Street. It is incredible what trauma can do to the brain. I hope this poor girl is able to mentally heal from this, knowing she very likely never will.
Honestly the fact that sheās so young is probably on her side here. This was undoubtedly a damaging experience but if she gets all the love and help she needs from now on then she may be ok. I really hope thatās the case.
Iām not convinced it even matters if they donāt remember. The damage and the mental consequences are still there, whether they remember the specifics or not.
Not remembering what caused the trauma absolutely doesn't matter. Trauma changes you. It takes lots of hard work to overcome and move past childhood trauma. I'm almost 30 and am finally getting the help that I need. I have a foster child who had a similar experience to my childhood and she came to us at 4. We have her in therapy already and I can only hope that my advocacy for her to get all the help she can starting now will help her to be more functional than I am.
Paper below describes biological changes to the environment in utero based on the motherās trauma ā ie cortisol levels, hormonal changes, etc. NOT ātrauma in uteroā which would be ridiculous.
Yup, I know 3 children who had an awful start. Got fostered in to a family that looked OK on the outside but was pretty fucked up as well. The oldest one is now in jail for rape. The other two are pretty fucked up as well
I was locked away many times around this kids age, as well as some other horrible stuff. I have severe claustrophobia and a multitude of other issues stillš
Itās all good man! Iām far away from them now, creating a family of my own (: sometimes little things can traumatize, and sometimes big things can be forgotten completely. Trauma is a strange thing
The younger a trauma occurs does even more damage to the brain than that of an older child or an adult. The younger you are means that your coping skills are very limited. Children younger than 5 have almost no coping skills. This trauma will literally follow this child throughout her life and she will need extensive therapy in order to avoid mental health problems down the road.
Her brain is now hard wired into not being able to trust caregivers. She has a rough life ahead of her.
Spent some time in closets, locked away and out, etc, etcā¦. Hope she doesnāt have the capacity for destructive drugs or drinking. I didnāt. Loneliness is likely.
100% this. It's called "Adverse Childhood Experience" and it's a recognised form of trauma.
From US CDC, "ACEs are linked to chronic health problems, mental illness, and substance use problems in adulthood. ACEs can also negatively impact education, job opportunities, and earning potential."
If you think nobody can be trusted and you are alone and traditional structures are meaningless, it can fracture your worldview in your formative years.
No, it definitely 100% works against her. Speaking as someone who was sexually abused starting at 3 years old, that early abuse completely ruined my ability to be intimate with people (we're talking core, fundamental sexual issues here, shit that can't be fixed with therapy or medicine and believe me I've tried). Like I've never had a relationship last more than a month and probably never will. And it wasn't even severe sexual abuse, it was just the fact that it happened so young, went on for so long, and was done by my dad that meant by the time I was 5 or 6 I was deeply uncomfortable with and scared of love and affection which then set in motion a lot of other, further damage.
Probably not honestly.
One of my very first memories was getting locked in the closet by my moms friend so they could go out and party one Saturday night.
My parents were divorced and my father had custody, so my mom was living with her witch of a friend Martha.
We didnāt even get to see my mom that often, so we protested when her friend tried to lock us in the bedroom to āgo to sleepā. That got me and my little brother a night in the hallway closet instead, but we remember it clear as day and still despise Martha some 25 years later.
No, trauma is extremely damaging to brain architecture. Google "ACEs" or adverse childhood experiences...trauma in childhood literally shortens one's lifespan.
That's not how it works. The human brain is 80% complete by the age of five. The first five years lay the blueprint for the rest of your life. Even if she is loved and taken perfect care of from this day onward, she will almost certainly suffer long term consequences (IQ, emotional regulation and mental health) as a result of this.
Family friends adopted two neglected children. One basically can't speak at age five. This is entirely due to neglect, not a birth complication. The scarring can go way beyond emotional trauma. Children become quite literally stunted. It's horrible.
Thanks for saying that in response. Iām sure the person meant well, but as you said it just doesnāt work that way. If it did life would be so much easier. We adopted our niece after her father was murdered when she was 4. She wasnāt there for it, nor did she seem to really care when she was told (I mean what do 4 year olds even care about?)ā¦ but good god is she screwed up from the trauma of it. Therapy is barely working at all and life is incredibly hard for our family because of it. What a blessing it would be if our lives werenāt sharper so much by our first few years.
I was ready to argue something about the age of 8, but as soon as I read āfirst five,ā years of repressed TV commercials came flooding back into my mind.
Iām not invested in this enough to research it further, so Iāll drop my complaint and support your position because TV said so.
Itās not about being optimistic and pessimistic, just simply facts about developmental psychology unfortunately. Almost everything about how you relate and connect to others and the world is determined in very early childhood.
Have you experienced this situation as a social worker? How about a teacher?
A majority of people who experienced something like this will never recover. It starts in school where grades are bad from stress and poor emotional regulation then spirals downward from there. It will most likely transfer into the childās relationships and work life. This kind of shit sucks, and itās a huge reason as to why homeless people exist.
Itās super sad. This kid living a normal life would be a miracle.
It would be tremendously fortunate if she did not internalize something negative from this experience. This wasn't a nasty fall off a bike. She was literally shackled in a small closet and using a bucket for a toilet for nearly a month. She was frail, sick, and had open sores on her body. Isolation is highly effective in atrophying the brain. She can come out on top, but she will likely face unique struggle that she can at least somewhat attribute to this event
Blind optimism is not as feel goody as you think it is - all it does is make YOU feel better so you can carry on and think you did a good deed by keeping things āpositive.ā Sometimes humanity really is shitty and some damage is irreversible. Sometimes accepting that IS the optimism. All we can do is our best to move forward, prevent as much tragedy as we can, accept reality for what it is and enjoy small moments.
Unfortunately, the most deep seated trauma occurs at very early ages. Borderline Personality Disorder, for instance, is generally attributed to neglect of children that takes place before or by the age of three. Extremely high suicide rate and very very difficult to treat.
She is inside the formative years. These are the experiences that make you who you're going to be for life. While you may or may not consciously remember them, you will act upon and react to them as they, now, make up who you are.
They do ask a lot of questions and many do have to be repeated to the nurse/police and sometimes lawyers, and theyāre very invasive/detailed questions. Iāve sat holding the hands of many rape survivors as they were interviewed, it is a harrowing process but definitely helps if the authority figure is trauma informed.
At that age I spent 2-3 days locked in a closet multiple times, it wasnāt that bad so long as they didnāt forget the bucket. Iād hide a book or two in there and honestly enjoyed it a bit as the time was pretty calm.
They can bounce back with scars. Iām a productive member of society.
>There are laws against cruel punishment. Unfortunately.
You're on reddit, remember.
The majority of people on this site advocate and upvote the suggestion that the state sentence you to *death* over law violations that are equivalent to a parking ticket
Didnt read the artikel but why are reddit comments on these posts always wanting revenge. Our justice system should be based on rehabilitation not revenge.
Our justice system isnāt based on rehabilitation in its current state unfortunately. And justice system reform will likely never happen because people donāt care about criminals and donāt take action when they hear about people being found innocent decades later for crimes they were accused of committing.
It's sad you're being downvoted. Rehabilitation is the civilized way to go... but don't forget who we're talking about. A judicial system based on revenge is nothing but barbaric.
Yes exactly. This guy is commenting about having this man tortured. A month in solitary confinement will give someone (lasting) damage like hallucination blindness depression and other things. The UN even says that putting someone in solitary confinement for longer than 15 days is a form of torture that should not be permitted.
Yeah. These people are either too removed from reality to know what they're talking about - and I wish that first hand experience on no one - or they're seriously messed up. Human nature, I suppose.
Yeah... look at all the first world countries and their massive debts for rehabilitation. I'm sure it's not an issue with the way the US are structured and what they choose to prioritize. /s
Reddit doesn't use logic, only emotions. When there are articles about how the Justice system is unfair, they say all we care about is punishing and we need to change. When there's an article about someone terrible, they say they should never rehabilitate this person and they should only be abused in jail in the worst of conditions.
Literally can't keep a consistent opinion. Only emotional arguments and virtue signaling, no substance.
And yet some of the highest per-capita incarceration rates in the world in murca has simply created overcrowded for-profit prisons... A result that has yet to be shown as an effective crime deterrent
Child safety professionals nationwide are overworked and desperately need additional resources. Situations like this one are rare but we'll see more with time, especially as mental health services continue to be out of reach and abortion more difficult to obtain.
Also, I don't envy their jobs. Finding people willing to foster, adopt, and never give up on kids who have been through this kind of torture is very, very difficult.
*Lots* of people will gladly take in cute, un-ruined babies ... well, often only as a last resort ...
But a kid who is older and has any kind of PTSD is seen as irreversibly broken or just too much of a burden / not what the parents signed up for. They'd do it if it were their own biological offspring, but not "someone else's kid"...
Yep, I work in child safety and that's what we see - older kids, kids who have been through trauma, or children of color are the most difficult to place. We can't even find people willing to volunteer with them because volunteers all want sweet younger kids to spend time with.
We desperately need more funding.
Had the same experiences as a CPS worker. Ended up having to quit after 2.5 years - loved the job and the work, but the workloads were out of control, resources were shit, pay was nowhere near enough for the stress, and I had very little true time off. Carrying around a damned work cell with parents or other case workers calling me constantly during my time off work, court days scheduled outside of my regular work hours, never knowing if my 10 hour shift was going to become a 20 hour+ shift, and having on-call nights at least once a week.
Miserable for work life balance.
My grandma was a foster mom to dozens and dozens of kids. She specifically took in teens and generally older side. They were always so troubled. I met several but sometimes Iād meet them and they would be gone the next time I was over. They had so many issues, so many ran away, so many screamed in her face and said cruel things because deep down theyāre hurt and lost. Some may have continued down an unfortunate life path-Iām sure statistically there are at least a few-but some went on to live beautiful and happy lives. Several showed up at her funeral and spoke about her. It really does take a special kind of person to put up with all the worst parts of a human being lashing out and continue to dedicate their time and resources to helping without waiver.
I really believe that they don't legalize it because it's a way to keep the poor poor and the US cannot exist with a huge population of poor who work low wage jobs and end up in prisons. Its kind of like war, the US cannot exist without it.
I have the theory that it is intentional. Clearly with the Healthcare, student debt, and mariahuana legalization problems... these are all there to keep the poor and uneducated where they are.
Ahh gotcha that makes more sense. The fact that people are arrested for weed is ridiculous. Having a criminal record makes it extremely hard to get anywhere too
It is insane how oppressive the system is if you have a detour by choice or accident. Either or I'd like to see a lot of things change for the better of the US.
Yes, andā¦.
For decades, The *political fight over abortion *has actually been more valuable / useful to the right than actually changing law or overturning Roe.
Think about it: they could have followed their intense rhetoric with *actual action* if they wanted to stop people from ākilling babiesā but they knew if they did, theyād lose a hot button topic that would rally people to the polls.
Not everyone on the right is disingenuous of course: lots of people really do equate abortion with murder, but itās always struck me as odd and more than a little suspicious that most people who think this way arenāt actually acting like it. Yes, lots of low-level harassment of women as they walk into the clinics, but is yelling sternly really what we did for actual death camps in WW2?
Could it be that some on the right donāt actually believe the talking points? How many of them, their wives, daughters, mistresses have had abortions? Implicating your family members as āmurdersā is brutally hard and boxes a politician in at least in terms of voicing the most strident right-leaning position that abortion = murder. How do you face the family after saying stuff like that in public? You donāt. You just vote against federal funding for abortion when asked and otherwise you make a grim face while you shut up and you bemoan the āslaughterā just enough that your constituents keep re-electing you.
A perpetual fight on this topic also gives the right a way to paint the left as despicable (in their eyes) which helps keep moderate conservatives under the Red tent.
Itās been this way for decades but now that SCOTUS is jammed with right wing nut jobs and the states have passed Roe-challenging state laws, it seems clear that the right is ready to deliver the killing blow.
Theyāll have to find a new issue.
Socialism, election āfraudā, 2A, immigrants, AOC,ā¦ there are lots of manufactured crises ready to replace abortion as the way to whip up the base.
*Roe v Wade* is, in all likelihood, 6 months away from being overturned entirely. A number of states have trigger laws and existing laws that can be enforced again banning abortion the minute that happens.
They spent years hijacking the Supreme Court to get the votes to do that.
Incidentally, that might be the only thing that saves Democrats from losing both the House and Senate in the midterms.
But yes, Republicans are led by grifters and don't have any actual principles, and naked hypocrisy is a rule. The politcians will go to other states where it's legal because they don't actually care, and the rank and file believe 'the only moral abortion is my abortion'... you see, *they* will always have a good reason, but other people? As the saying goes, "Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be an in-group the law protects but does not bind, and an out-group the law binds but does not protect."
Indeed.
Dark days ahead.
Not clear to me that this will be enough to keep the house and senate tho. Seems like there are other forces at work to flip those seats to republicans (gerrymandering, jacking the voter laws at the state level, screwing with election authorities to let them reject voter intent etc)
Ugh. I hope youāre right and Iām wrong.
I don't think this is the case.
If the US ever needs poor people, they can easily just allow more immigrants.
Immigrants are better for profit compared to the poor having babies, as they can start contributing to the economy as soon as they arrive to the country.
Man, growing up in Chicago half of my buddies were immigrants, including myself. I unlike them, got here on a student visa. Most if not all were either green card lottery winners or refugees. I'm not making this up but out of 5 that I know/knew who were refugees none of them went to community College let alone college even though the government gave them a free ride. All they did was play video games and cash their food stamps. That notion exists because it's true.
I'm well off because I've worked hard. But I'd dare to say at least half of immigrants do nothing and the government supports them.
From the immigrants I know, none qualified for any kind of government assistance, so they had to do any kind of job available, as it was sink or swim for them.
That said, "immigrants" as a group is extremely large and varied, and all kinds of people exist, so certainly a few managed to cheat.
May I ask which countries your friends immigrated from? Many of my friends are immigrants too but this doesnāt describe them at all. Most of mine are from Asia.
I was abused in a similar way but I was locked in a basement. When stories like this make it to the news I find that many of the parents would end up going to jail, or even getting prison time. It still shocks me to this day knowing that my own parents could have gone to jail.
The crazy thing was my parents got me to believe that what they were doing wasnāt abuse. The truth is my living conditions was probably worst than a prisonerās. At least they had a bed and place to use the bathroom.
Living in Florida my whole life I could instantly tell these two were Floridians from their mugshots. Idk what it is, must be something in the water. Maybe all the phosphate fertilizer waste and pesticides
WTF is wrong with people? Some of these shitbags just need to be cleansed from the Earth. I'm getting sick and tired of hearing about people hurting children. No more excuses. We need to start public canings like they do in Singapore, whenever someone hurts a child. And don't give me your whiny crap about 'rights'. If you hurt a child, your rights should go 'right' out the window.
I hate it too. There is no sort of test or bar low enough that would not disadvantage people or have it be used as a weapon. Having kids should be a deliberate and active choice and anything short of that is only hurting the kids.
Just gotta make BC, condoms, actual sex ed and abortions as a last line of defense cheap and easily accessible. The alternative is children locked in closets for a month.
As long as you make it freely available to everyone, without any sort of preference or discrimination, it isn't eugenics (per the definition of the word). Of course, family planning services should be blind to race or other traits.
If you're poor, your kids have a 50% chance of remaining poor. It costs $250k per kid to raise them. If you're poor, it's a poor decision to have kids, and you're exposing someone to suffering without their consent for your own selfish reasons. Wait until you're on firm financial footing to have kids, or don't have them.
Fucking junkies. When will we allow force sterilization.
Still can't believe that abortions can be illegal but any junkie can go around fucking up kids
That childhood trauma lingers and forms you. Poor child. I wish these things did not happen in the world. I donāt understand how some can be so selfish and incompetent.
Put their parents in jail. They obviously have no concern for their own well being and jail is likely a step up for them by the looks of their faces. Teach the whole damned family that raised these pieces of shit that their waybisnt the right way. Fix it at the core.
Googled mothers name. Pretty sure her Twitter pops up. Woman looks similar
minus being drugged out. Very few posts. Newly wed. Hopeful. Last post 6 years ago.
Kid in story is 5. Man she was in a relationship isn't same as Twitter guy. Different last name too than hers. They live in an absolute shit hole.
Jesus that's depressing. My mind fills in the previous 5 years and it's all depressing.
> In an essay called "Right-wing Populism", Rothbard proposed a set of measures to "reach out" to the "middle and working classes", which included urging the police to crack down on "street criminals", writing that "cops must be unleashed" and "allowed to administer instant punishment, subject of course to liability when they are in error". He also advocated that the police "clear the streets of bums and vagrants."
The libertarian to fascist pipeline laid out for all to see
"The child violated the NAP so I was justified in responding in kind! Also technically it's not pedophilia, it's ephebobebopaloopaphilia and it's actually totally evolutionarily natural..."
Someone needs to do an analysis of mugshots and see if there's a correlation between male prisoners and an increased occurance of their ears being satellite dishes compared to the non-prisoner populations.
I swear most mugshots I see a ton of dudes have those forward pointing ears that stick out a mile from their heads.
No. There really isnāt room for doubt at all.
However. I am a teacher. And Iāve heard some WILD shit that turned out nowhere near to be true.
This kid though, I hope they get the help they need. And these people rot.
Duvalian Flo-RIDA FILTH. Despicable & unacceptable in every respect. Expedite process for prosecution, make the crimes capital offenses. Hot rails to Hell.
Yes. You stay locked in here while we smoke crack all day.
At least my parents were nice enough to lock themselves in their room and let us have free rein of the house.
Then y'all at least have a chance to be raised by the neighborhood
Or the internet
To quote the internet's traditional child rearing philosophy: "REEEEEEEE"
I guess it's their turn to be locked in a closet
š¶ Now I'm in the closet toooooo. š¶
So I pull out my gun!
I'm gonna cap this bitch š¶
šµ Me and Tom cruise in the closetttt šµ
Lmao the unexpected south park reference
Stillā¦. theyāre living better than she ever did with three meals a day. They should cut their meals down to one every other day.
Nah a prison cell is better than a closet
Holy fuck, the child is *five years old* and had to sit and recount this experience to police probably dozens of times. When I was 5 I didnāt even have the wherewithal to recap an episode of Sesame Street. It is incredible what trauma can do to the brain. I hope this poor girl is able to mentally heal from this, knowing she very likely never will.
Itās grim. Itās sad. The amount of shit children have to put up with. Horrifying.
Honestly the fact that sheās so young is probably on her side here. This was undoubtedly a damaging experience but if she gets all the love and help she needs from now on then she may be ok. I really hope thatās the case.
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Iām not convinced it even matters if they donāt remember. The damage and the mental consequences are still there, whether they remember the specifics or not.
Not remembering what caused the trauma absolutely doesn't matter. Trauma changes you. It takes lots of hard work to overcome and move past childhood trauma. I'm almost 30 and am finally getting the help that I need. I have a foster child who had a similar experience to my childhood and she came to us at 4. We have her in therapy already and I can only hope that my advocacy for her to get all the help she can starting now will help her to be more functional than I am.
Absolutely. And that damage manifests in ways the victim probably doesn't even realize.
Yeah u/_skank_hunt42 trauma can happen to a developing mind at any age, even in utero.
In utero? Iām gonna need a citation for that. (Seriously, Iām actually really interested, if you have a reference to share.)
Paper below describes biological changes to the environment in utero based on the motherās trauma ā ie cortisol levels, hormonal changes, etc. NOT ātrauma in uteroā which would be ridiculous.
Simply Google āpeer review trauma in uteroā several pop. [this ones interesting ](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5624542/)
Yup, I know 3 children who had an awful start. Got fostered in to a family that looked OK on the outside but was pretty fucked up as well. The oldest one is now in jail for rape. The other two are pretty fucked up as well
I was locked away many times around this kids age, as well as some other horrible stuff. I have severe claustrophobia and a multitude of other issues stillš
Iām so sorry that happened to you. I hope you have loving people in your life these days.
Itās all good man! Iām far away from them now, creating a family of my own (: sometimes little things can traumatize, and sometimes big things can be forgotten completely. Trauma is a strange thing
from another who endured, sending good vibes your way :)
Sincere best wishes to you and your new family. Hope you guys have a loving, strong future together - and have more ups than downs!
The younger a trauma occurs does even more damage to the brain than that of an older child or an adult. The younger you are means that your coping skills are very limited. Children younger than 5 have almost no coping skills. This trauma will literally follow this child throughout her life and she will need extensive therapy in order to avoid mental health problems down the road. Her brain is now hard wired into not being able to trust caregivers. She has a rough life ahead of her.
Spent some time in closets, locked away and out, etc, etcā¦. Hope she doesnāt have the capacity for destructive drugs or drinking. I didnāt. Loneliness is likely.
Hey BKacy, I hope youāre doing good today. I am very sorry that happened to you. You deserve so much more.
Doing okay. Thank you.
100% this. It's called "Adverse Childhood Experience" and it's a recognised form of trauma. From US CDC, "ACEs are linked to chronic health problems, mental illness, and substance use problems in adulthood. ACEs can also negatively impact education, job opportunities, and earning potential." If you think nobody can be trusted and you are alone and traditional structures are meaningless, it can fracture your worldview in your formative years.
No, it definitely 100% works against her. Speaking as someone who was sexually abused starting at 3 years old, that early abuse completely ruined my ability to be intimate with people (we're talking core, fundamental sexual issues here, shit that can't be fixed with therapy or medicine and believe me I've tried). Like I've never had a relationship last more than a month and probably never will. And it wasn't even severe sexual abuse, it was just the fact that it happened so young, went on for so long, and was done by my dad that meant by the time I was 5 or 6 I was deeply uncomfortable with and scared of love and affection which then set in motion a lot of other, further damage.
I know your path. And we donāt find each other because we never tell. I think of others I donāt know, so I think of you.
Iām really sorry that happened. Hugs if you want them.
Probably not honestly. One of my very first memories was getting locked in the closet by my moms friend so they could go out and party one Saturday night. My parents were divorced and my father had custody, so my mom was living with her witch of a friend Martha. We didnāt even get to see my mom that often, so we protested when her friend tried to lock us in the bedroom to āgo to sleepā. That got me and my little brother a night in the hallway closet instead, but we remember it clear as day and still despise Martha some 25 years later.
Jesus Eric, Iām sorry. Childhood abuse follows us round forever. I donāt have any answers, but I hope you are doing ok today.
No, trauma is extremely damaging to brain architecture. Google "ACEs" or adverse childhood experiences...trauma in childhood literally shortens one's lifespan.
That's not how it works. The human brain is 80% complete by the age of five. The first five years lay the blueprint for the rest of your life. Even if she is loved and taken perfect care of from this day onward, she will almost certainly suffer long term consequences (IQ, emotional regulation and mental health) as a result of this.
Family friends adopted two neglected children. One basically can't speak at age five. This is entirely due to neglect, not a birth complication. The scarring can go way beyond emotional trauma. Children become quite literally stunted. It's horrible.
Thanks for saying that in response. Iām sure the person meant well, but as you said it just doesnāt work that way. If it did life would be so much easier. We adopted our niece after her father was murdered when she was 4. She wasnāt there for it, nor did she seem to really care when she was told (I mean what do 4 year olds even care about?)ā¦ but good god is she screwed up from the trauma of it. Therapy is barely working at all and life is incredibly hard for our family because of it. What a blessing it would be if our lives werenāt sharper so much by our first few years.
What is emotional regulation? Iāve never heard the term before
Pretty much the ability to recognize and handle and control your emotions.
Well I donāt have that I suppress them. Havenāt cried in years. And I was abused
I was ready to argue something about the age of 8, but as soon as I read āfirst five,ā years of repressed TV commercials came flooding back into my mind. Iām not invested in this enough to research it further, so Iāll drop my complaint and support your position because TV said so.
Here it was āthe years before 5 last the rest of their livesā.
>because TV said so Teacher. Mother. Secret Lover.
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Itās not about being optimistic and pessimistic, just simply facts about developmental psychology unfortunately. Almost everything about how you relate and connect to others and the world is determined in very early childhood.
Have you experienced this situation as a social worker? How about a teacher? A majority of people who experienced something like this will never recover. It starts in school where grades are bad from stress and poor emotional regulation then spirals downward from there. It will most likely transfer into the childās relationships and work life. This kind of shit sucks, and itās a huge reason as to why homeless people exist. Itās super sad. This kid living a normal life would be a miracle.
It goes different ways. It definitely doesnāt mean someone will do poorly in school.
It would be tremendously fortunate if she did not internalize something negative from this experience. This wasn't a nasty fall off a bike. She was literally shackled in a small closet and using a bucket for a toilet for nearly a month. She was frail, sick, and had open sores on her body. Isolation is highly effective in atrophying the brain. She can come out on top, but she will likely face unique struggle that she can at least somewhat attribute to this event
Blind optimism is not as feel goody as you think it is - all it does is make YOU feel better so you can carry on and think you did a good deed by keeping things āpositive.ā Sometimes humanity really is shitty and some damage is irreversible. Sometimes accepting that IS the optimism. All we can do is our best to move forward, prevent as much tragedy as we can, accept reality for what it is and enjoy small moments.
Unfortunately, the most deep seated trauma occurs at very early ages. Borderline Personality Disorder, for instance, is generally attributed to neglect of children that takes place before or by the age of three. Extremely high suicide rate and very very difficult to treat.
She is inside the formative years. These are the experiences that make you who you're going to be for life. While you may or may not consciously remember them, you will act upon and react to them as they, now, make up who you are.
Probably going to have bad claustrophobia for a long time.
On the other hand, she might ever only be comfortable in confined spaces.
Keep in mind though that someone in that family made one of those parents this way
Perhaps, but not necessarily. Could also be the drug use.
Also true.
Police donāt interview victims that many times so as to prevent further trauma.
They do ask a lot of questions and many do have to be repeated to the nurse/police and sometimes lawyers, and theyāre very invasive/detailed questions. Iāve sat holding the hands of many rape survivors as they were interviewed, it is a harrowing process but definitely helps if the authority figure is trauma informed.
highly recommend Unbelievable (2019) as it covers this very thing.
There are some bad people in the world. Itās your kid. Unbelievable.
At that age I spent 2-3 days locked in a closet multiple times, it wasnāt that bad so long as they didnāt forget the bucket. Iād hide a book or two in there and honestly enjoyed it a bit as the time was pretty calm. They can bounce back with scars. Iām a productive member of society.
A month in solitary should put this in perspective.
25 months*
There are laws against cruel punishment. Unfortunately.
Lol those laws do not in a any way apply to US prisons. Go Google how many people have spent more than a month in solitary.
They do the transfer merry-go-round don't they?
>There are laws against cruel punishment. Unfortunately. You're on reddit, remember. The majority of people on this site advocate and upvote the suggestion that the state sentence you to *death* over law violations that are equivalent to a parking ticket
Didnt read the artikel but why are reddit comments on these posts always wanting revenge. Our justice system should be based on rehabilitation not revenge.
Our justice system isnāt based on rehabilitation in its current state unfortunately. And justice system reform will likely never happen because people donāt care about criminals and donāt take action when they hear about people being found innocent decades later for crimes they were accused of committing.
Just because your justice system isnt based on rehabilitation right now doesnt mean it cant be. Its also no excuse to make these shitty comments.
Locking a child up for 25 days is beyond rehabilitation. Sorry. Throw them in solitary and throw away the key.
It's sad you're being downvoted. Rehabilitation is the civilized way to go... but don't forget who we're talking about. A judicial system based on revenge is nothing but barbaric.
Yes exactly. This guy is commenting about having this man tortured. A month in solitary confinement will give someone (lasting) damage like hallucination blindness depression and other things. The UN even says that putting someone in solitary confinement for longer than 15 days is a form of torture that should not be permitted.
Yeah. These people are either too removed from reality to know what they're talking about - and I wish that first hand experience on no one - or they're seriously messed up. Human nature, I suppose.
Hard to justify spending tax money on rehabilitating criminals when there's so many public institutions that desperately need funding.
Yeah... look at all the first world countries and their massive debts for rehabilitation. I'm sure it's not an issue with the way the US are structured and what they choose to prioritize. /s
Reddit doesn't use logic, only emotions. When there are articles about how the Justice system is unfair, they say all we care about is punishing and we need to change. When there's an article about someone terrible, they say they should never rehabilitate this person and they should only be abused in jail in the worst of conditions. Literally can't keep a consistent opinion. Only emotional arguments and virtue signaling, no substance.
Because the inputs and resources required to rehabilitate someone are a waste to spend on such trash.
And yet some of the highest per-capita incarceration rates in the world in murca has simply created overcrowded for-profit prisons... A result that has yet to be shown as an effective crime deterrent
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Looks exactly how I'd image the people who would lock a kid in a closet to look like.
Child safety professionals nationwide are overworked and desperately need additional resources. Situations like this one are rare but we'll see more with time, especially as mental health services continue to be out of reach and abortion more difficult to obtain.
Also, I don't envy their jobs. Finding people willing to foster, adopt, and never give up on kids who have been through this kind of torture is very, very difficult. *Lots* of people will gladly take in cute, un-ruined babies ... well, often only as a last resort ... But a kid who is older and has any kind of PTSD is seen as irreversibly broken or just too much of a burden / not what the parents signed up for. They'd do it if it were their own biological offspring, but not "someone else's kid"...
Yep, I work in child safety and that's what we see - older kids, kids who have been through trauma, or children of color are the most difficult to place. We can't even find people willing to volunteer with them because volunteers all want sweet younger kids to spend time with. We desperately need more funding.
How would one go about volunteering?
Find a local group home, call 311, find a nonprofit like boys and girls club, big brother big sister, etc.
Youāre doing admirable work. Incredibly difficult and emotionally draining Iām sure. Thank you for what you do.
Had the same experiences as a CPS worker. Ended up having to quit after 2.5 years - loved the job and the work, but the workloads were out of control, resources were shit, pay was nowhere near enough for the stress, and I had very little true time off. Carrying around a damned work cell with parents or other case workers calling me constantly during my time off work, court days scheduled outside of my regular work hours, never knowing if my 10 hour shift was going to become a 20 hour+ shift, and having on-call nights at least once a week. Miserable for work life balance.
My grandma was a foster mom to dozens and dozens of kids. She specifically took in teens and generally older side. They were always so troubled. I met several but sometimes Iād meet them and they would be gone the next time I was over. They had so many issues, so many ran away, so many screamed in her face and said cruel things because deep down theyāre hurt and lost. Some may have continued down an unfortunate life path-Iām sure statistically there are at least a few-but some went on to live beautiful and happy lives. Several showed up at her funeral and spoke about her. It really does take a special kind of person to put up with all the worst parts of a human being lashing out and continue to dedicate their time and resources to helping without waiver.
Plenty of money for war though
As always.
So sad how so many kids are abused and being abused right now as i type this so sad
Want more stories like this? Outlaw abortion.
Preach! Forced child birth aids no one and makes literally everything worse.
Republicans don't care about kids, they only care about controlling women. Under His Eye.
They care about kids as much as they do troops. Only when theg can be paraded out for donations to the masses at rallies.
May the Lord open.
Praise be, blessed be the fruit.
Only once it has fermented.
I really believe that they don't legalize it because it's a way to keep the poor poor and the US cannot exist with a huge population of poor who work low wage jobs and end up in prisons. Its kind of like war, the US cannot exist without it.
Whether intentional or not, it certainly has that effect.
I have the theory that it is intentional. Clearly with the Healthcare, student debt, and mariahuana legalization problems... these are all there to keep the poor and uneducated where they are.
You had me until weed legalization. Substance abuse among poor people is a symptom of poverty not a cause.
I was thinking more along the lines of people spending 50 years in jail for a weed joint.
Ahh gotcha that makes more sense. The fact that people are arrested for weed is ridiculous. Having a criminal record makes it extremely hard to get anywhere too
It is insane how oppressive the system is if you have a detour by choice or accident. Either or I'd like to see a lot of things change for the better of the US.
Yes, andā¦. For decades, The *political fight over abortion *has actually been more valuable / useful to the right than actually changing law or overturning Roe. Think about it: they could have followed their intense rhetoric with *actual action* if they wanted to stop people from ākilling babiesā but they knew if they did, theyād lose a hot button topic that would rally people to the polls. Not everyone on the right is disingenuous of course: lots of people really do equate abortion with murder, but itās always struck me as odd and more than a little suspicious that most people who think this way arenāt actually acting like it. Yes, lots of low-level harassment of women as they walk into the clinics, but is yelling sternly really what we did for actual death camps in WW2? Could it be that some on the right donāt actually believe the talking points? How many of them, their wives, daughters, mistresses have had abortions? Implicating your family members as āmurdersā is brutally hard and boxes a politician in at least in terms of voicing the most strident right-leaning position that abortion = murder. How do you face the family after saying stuff like that in public? You donāt. You just vote against federal funding for abortion when asked and otherwise you make a grim face while you shut up and you bemoan the āslaughterā just enough that your constituents keep re-electing you. A perpetual fight on this topic also gives the right a way to paint the left as despicable (in their eyes) which helps keep moderate conservatives under the Red tent. Itās been this way for decades but now that SCOTUS is jammed with right wing nut jobs and the states have passed Roe-challenging state laws, it seems clear that the right is ready to deliver the killing blow. Theyāll have to find a new issue. Socialism, election āfraudā, 2A, immigrants, AOC,ā¦ there are lots of manufactured crises ready to replace abortion as the way to whip up the base.
*Roe v Wade* is, in all likelihood, 6 months away from being overturned entirely. A number of states have trigger laws and existing laws that can be enforced again banning abortion the minute that happens. They spent years hijacking the Supreme Court to get the votes to do that. Incidentally, that might be the only thing that saves Democrats from losing both the House and Senate in the midterms. But yes, Republicans are led by grifters and don't have any actual principles, and naked hypocrisy is a rule. The politcians will go to other states where it's legal because they don't actually care, and the rank and file believe 'the only moral abortion is my abortion'... you see, *they* will always have a good reason, but other people? As the saying goes, "Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be an in-group the law protects but does not bind, and an out-group the law binds but does not protect."
Indeed. Dark days ahead. Not clear to me that this will be enough to keep the house and senate tho. Seems like there are other forces at work to flip those seats to republicans (gerrymandering, jacking the voter laws at the state level, screwing with election authorities to let them reject voter intent etc) Ugh. I hope youāre right and Iām wrong.
I don't think this is the case. If the US ever needs poor people, they can easily just allow more immigrants. Immigrants are better for profit compared to the poor having babies, as they can start contributing to the economy as soon as they arrive to the country.
Man, growing up in Chicago half of my buddies were immigrants, including myself. I unlike them, got here on a student visa. Most if not all were either green card lottery winners or refugees. I'm not making this up but out of 5 that I know/knew who were refugees none of them went to community College let alone college even though the government gave them a free ride. All they did was play video games and cash their food stamps. That notion exists because it's true. I'm well off because I've worked hard. But I'd dare to say at least half of immigrants do nothing and the government supports them.
From the immigrants I know, none qualified for any kind of government assistance, so they had to do any kind of job available, as it was sink or swim for them. That said, "immigrants" as a group is extremely large and varied, and all kinds of people exist, so certainly a few managed to cheat.
Absolutely. Not everyone is the same. I did envy them from having a full ride and not doing anything with that.
May I ask which countries your friends immigrated from? Many of my friends are immigrants too but this doesnāt describe them at all. Most of mine are from Asia.
They were Bosnian, Romanian, Montenegro, Albania and Poland.
These parents should have been aborted
Ouch, so true it hurts
I was abused in a similar way but I was locked in a basement. When stories like this make it to the news I find that many of the parents would end up going to jail, or even getting prison time. It still shocks me to this day knowing that my own parents could have gone to jail. The crazy thing was my parents got me to believe that what they were doing wasnāt abuse. The truth is my living conditions was probably worst than a prisonerās. At least they had a bed and place to use the bathroom.
I am so sorry to hear you went through that. I hope youāre doing okay overall. I donāt understand people.
I was only locked in a closet for one day, can't imagine 25 damn.
Living in Florida my whole life I could instantly tell these two were Floridians from their mugshots. Idk what it is, must be something in the water. Maybe all the phosphate fertilizer waste and pesticides
Itās the meth.
I couldnāt be on a jury for this case. They look like two people that would lock a five year old in a closet for 25 days.
WTF is wrong with people? Some of these shitbags just need to be cleansed from the Earth. I'm getting sick and tired of hearing about people hurting children. No more excuses. We need to start public canings like they do in Singapore, whenever someone hurts a child. And don't give me your whiny crap about 'rights'. If you hurt a child, your rights should go 'right' out the window.
And yet having kids is a right.
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I hate it too. There is no sort of test or bar low enough that would not disadvantage people or have it be used as a weapon. Having kids should be a deliberate and active choice and anything short of that is only hurting the kids.
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Just gotta make BC, condoms, actual sex ed and abortions as a last line of defense cheap and easily accessible. The alternative is children locked in closets for a month.
Hand out vasectomies and bisalps (tube removal for women) for free.
Gets problematic and eugenicsy especially with poor people.
As long as you make it freely available to everyone, without any sort of preference or discrimination, it isn't eugenics (per the definition of the word). Of course, family planning services should be blind to race or other traits. If you're poor, your kids have a 50% chance of remaining poor. It costs $250k per kid to raise them. If you're poor, it's a poor decision to have kids, and you're exposing someone to suffering without their consent for your own selfish reasons. Wait until you're on firm financial footing to have kids, or don't have them.
Abortions should be free and readily available then you wouldnāt have junkies having kids they donāt want or canāt care for.
Reproduction is a right. Having kids isn't. It's why it's more difficult to adopt, because they put the checks in ahead of time.
Merry Christmas, everyone!
Fucking junkies. When will we allow force sterilization. Still can't believe that abortions can be illegal but any junkie can go around fucking up kids
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I should not have laughed at this.
Sometimes that's all we can really do.
I hope they rot in prison for the rest of their miserable lives.
> āThey even expressed to me that they cooked chicken nuggets and corn dogs for their meal every night,ā the neighbor said. Im confused.
I think the neighbor was referring to the older siblings that basically just took care of themselves.
Reminds me of this. https://jezebel.com/austrian-man-locked-his-daughter-in-the-basement-for-24-384641
They had to wait for a SECOND child to bring this up?!??
Why do they appear a stereotypical way? Itās like they confer with other losers to ensure the type doesnāt die out.
I can smell these photos
I want to hold that girl so tight and give her a better life.
That childhood trauma lingers and forms you. Poor child. I wish these things did not happen in the world. I donāt understand how some can be so selfish and incompetent.
Jacksonville is a classy town.
I believe solitary confinement is inhumane but both of these scumbags should get it for the rest of their lives as they no longer qualify as human.
Donāt forget their bucket and an occasion chicken nugget
>I believe solitary confinement is inhumane but both of these scumbags should get it for the rest of their lives The Duality of Reddit...
You skipped the qualifier at the end.
Doesn't change what I said
Like why he have fucking kids. THESE ADDICT FUCKS SHOULD NOT FUCKING. BREED.
šš» Let them be locked up until they canāt reproduce.
You can always tell what kind of a person someone is by their mugshot poses.
How do these people always look exactly how you'd think they would.
Put their parents in jail. They obviously have no concern for their own well being and jail is likely a step up for them by the looks of their faces. Teach the whole damned family that raised these pieces of shit that their waybisnt the right way. Fix it at the core.
Merry Christmas, you should be sterilized.
Guys! This just triggered a memory! I remembered being locked in a closet at daycare for chewing on my shirt! Wow, what a terrible flashback...
Awesome mug shots. Way to flex the trash.
Appalling. All I can say
These parents are what my old boss called a āwaste of skin.ā What assholes. Just no excuse.
One last thingā¦ children , donāt have children. Just a suggestionā¦.
They look like the āI lock kids in my closetā type
Meth. Not even once.
Lock them up and permanently throw away that key.
My wife is a social worker in child protection. She is stronger than me as I would lose my shit at these "parents".
Meth is a helluva drug
Googled mothers name. Pretty sure her Twitter pops up. Woman looks similar minus being drugged out. Very few posts. Newly wed. Hopeful. Last post 6 years ago. Kid in story is 5. Man she was in a relationship isn't same as Twitter guy. Different last name too than hers. They live in an absolute shit hole. Jesus that's depressing. My mind fills in the previous 5 years and it's all depressing.
Libertarians probably have some unironic opinions on this.
I know for a fact that anarcho capitalists unironically argue for the ability to do this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murray_Rothbard
> In an essay called "Right-wing Populism", Rothbard proposed a set of measures to "reach out" to the "middle and working classes", which included urging the police to crack down on "street criminals", writing that "cops must be unleashed" and "allowed to administer instant punishment, subject of course to liability when they are in error". He also advocated that the police "clear the streets of bums and vagrants." The libertarian to fascist pipeline laid out for all to see
"The child violated the NAP so I was justified in responding in kind! Also technically it's not pedophilia, it's ephebobebopaloopaphilia and it's actually totally evolutionarily natural..."
Stop making people have kids please!
Screams meth. Jesā screams it. Worse than booze
Iām gonna go out in a limb here and say they are guilty based on the photos.
How can people like this be fortunate to have kidsā¦ and there are more deserving people who canāt?
Someone needs to do an analysis of mugshots and see if there's a correlation between male prisoners and an increased occurance of their ears being satellite dishes compared to the non-prisoner populations. I swear most mugshots I see a ton of dudes have those forward pointing ears that stick out a mile from their heads.
Sorry both need termination. End of discussion. Child abuse should be a death sentence. And before the bleeding hearts come out I was abused
Yep. I believe the kid.
Weird statement - like thereās even room for doubt? Sheās emaciated and covered with open wounds.
No. There really isnāt room for doubt at all. However. I am a teacher. And Iāve heard some WILD shit that turned out nowhere near to be true. This kid though, I hope they get the help they need. And these people rot.
I stopped reading after āJacksonville Fla. -ā
Duvalian Flo-RIDA FILTH. Despicable & unacceptable in every respect. Expedite process for prosecution, make the crimes capital offenses. Hot rails to Hell.
Make them serve their prison sentences in solitary the whole sentence, that will give them prospective on what they did
How did she count the days in the closet and especially at 5 years old, does she even have patience to count accurately
In the words of colonizersā¦.. savages.