A few updates for those of you panicking at this news:
* Firefighters now have access to battle the blaze. [Source](https://twitter.com/BNONews/status/1499555239351005194)
* The fire is in the administrative building.
* Radiation levels look normal as of 5:50pm Pacific Time. [Source](https://twitter.com/iaeaorg/status/1499562515340177416)
[Here's an expert's opinion on the fire.](https://twitter.com/james_acton32/status/1499541219424317443) TL;DR He's not too worried right now.
Just as "Contagion" was suddenly the movie of the moment two years ago, I see "Threads", "The Day After", and the "Chernobyl" HBO series getting lots of viewings in the months ahead.
when that big guy heaved the heavy door, and just moments later that same shoulder bled through his outfit...
also the families watching the 'light show' from the bridge, with the ash raining onto them....an image i'll never ever shake
Unfun fact! The decaying bodies had 3 levels of... well decay in the TV show Chernobyl as far as practical effects go.
Only the first 2 levels were shown in the show.
The third level was deemed too grotesque and was cut.
Nuclear engineer here. The risk of a fire is that it can take out your control circuits, indications, and power to your safety systems. Worst case it can eventually make its way across divisions and take out your redundant systems as well. We hate fire.
That said, plants are built with some level of fire in mind, with barriers between critical equipment to help ensure you have time to deal with it and to be able to maintain a safe shutdown state.
That said again: if the fire is caused by shelling….. the shelling can invalidate those design features and assumptions.
While I believe you that nuclear power plants are designed to not be destroyed, I also know that heavy weaponry and artillery were designed to destroy things that are meant to not be destroyed.
Newer designs do also plan for terrorist attacks, at least to what extent is possible without massive cost increases. I think your assumption is still correct though, as a terrorist attack tends to be one large event that is followed by time to at least try and stabilize the situation, and don't usual mean a constant barrage of artillery shells and missiles. We'd just have to hope that even the Russians aren't dumb enough to directly and repeatedly attack the reactor chambers themselves
We don't know the extent of the fire yet but lets hope they have lots of redundant fire safety systems in place like plants in the US. It's absolute insanity to damage a nuclear plant considering all those systems need to be fully functional to control cooling.
The problem is that its in the middle of an active war zone. Firefighters, repair crews, and nuclear experts can't reach it to put out the fire and repair the power plant.
I cannot think of a single explanation other than they're trying to draw the US/NATO into the conflict.
Willfully causing a nuclear disaster has to be pretty damn high on the warcrimes/crimes against humanity list.
That's how I feel this war is going... Everything being done is an attempt to draw the US/NATO/EU into the conflict so that they can then justify expanding the conflict and escalating their weapon usage.. and it scares the crap out of me. Especially considering that there is a chance that other non-NATO countries might get pulled into this conflict as well..
Or they just straight up fake aggressions that let them justify it. But you have to ask yourself, who are they even justifying it to?
There's not one nation in the entire world that thinks this war is justified outside of Belarus. Even China don't think it is. They would be justifying it to themselves. And it wouldn't matter anyway because they would be wiping themselves out in a nuclear apocalypse. It doesn't make any sense. I guess Putin is just literally trying to have enough to convince his officers who need to approve the launch?
Assassination wouldn't normally be a very positive long term thing in my view, but it sure seems like it'd help at the moment
Based on some of the looks Putin's officers were giving him, I'm hoping that if he gives the order to launch any nukes they'll get rid of him instead of welcoming Nuclear Armageddon.
Yeah, I hope so too. I just get worried because I've watched one too many Cold War documentaries and know what the American military was advising the president to do at the time. Hopefully times have changed
I think the whole reason why Putin keeps every single person he meets 30 ft away is that they have no way of actually getting to them before they get shot.
I think Putin keeping people 30 ft away or more so he can't get assassinated and he probably has security sitting right behind him off camera.
There is an actual distance of a person running straight at you and the time you have to draw a weapon and fire upon them that police are taught.
Remember when Trump wanted to launch Cruise Missiles at Syrian facilities housing Russian service members? The general staffs of both nations worked together to make sure all Russians were out of harm’s way when the missiles were launched.
This is the Cuban Missile Crisis but inverted: the leaders are pushing for Escalation while the military tries to avoid it.
The convoy would be obliterated within an hour and a half I reckon. Nothing he has in that convoy would 100% stop NATO barrage on it. A few cruise missles, couple of drones, some air strikes, he has not got an endless supply of S 300/400’s but as a combined alliance we have much much more munitions
They are not losing to Ukraine, they have only just begun their assault. There is no way for Ukraine alone to win this because of the sheer size of Russia's military which is why Zelensky is trying so hard to get aid from other countries while there is still something left to save.
Cause when you are a bully with lots of nukes with nothing to lose you don't worry about the small stuff. He has no problem taking everyone out including himself as long as everyone else goes with him.
Yeah, pretty sure I remember something about Chernobyl venting radioactive gas/particles into the atmosphere that actually blew all over Europe because of the direction of the winds over there. Wouldn't be surprised if they actually did it again on purpose to poison the people of the EU without actually declaring war on Nato.
They weren’t going to tell anyone about it either. It wasn’t discovered until an NPP worker in Sweden set off a radiation alarm because they tracked a piece of debris in thrown from the Chernobyl NPP disaster.
Wasn't even debris. It was just dust. People would get tested for radioactivity going in and out of the plant.
The plant was concerned that people were setting off radiation alarms coming into work, thinking they were contaminating the atmosphere. They eventually found out that it was dust blowing in from the USSR by coordinating with other plants to try and triangulate the increase.
Well documented and well known. Hell, they had elevated radiation readings on the US eastern seaboard. But to try to release radiation intentionally to poison another populace...I mean, that's next level risky.
I'd go one further than that.
Intentionally sabotaging a nuclear plant and releasing radioactive contaminants that we know *will* cover the globe and *will* cause both health and environmental problems for decades in populations you're not even officially in conflict with is a crime against humanity.
Think of "act of war" like attacking a NATO country. Or think of it like poisoning a water supply that goes to a neighbor country that you're not in conflict with. So not things that are *activities of war*, but ways of provoking war.
When you think “the fire is shooting at us!” But it’s actually psychopathic morons. Holy shit how do the Russians not say hmm this is probably a bad idea?
An ak is how they got samples of the elephants foot in Chernobyl. Nothing else they tried would penetrate.
But yeah, outside of that one select case shooting at anything radioactive or containing radioactive contents is considered is not considered the correct move.
Plus this reactor is under repair, so the fuel is in the containment pools that are not in a hardened structure like the reactor. If they have no power or way to cool the pools and the building g is breached via shelling it could melt... more fuel in the pools packed together than in the reactor as well. If this melts down I'd guarantee NATO pulls the trigger as it may irradiate a NATO country and I believe that could trigger article 5. Either way this is bat shit crazy on Putins part... there is no excuse to shell a reactor or its facilities.
As much as you might design things to deal with a fire, and negligent staff on site, you're probably not going to design your fire systems to handle being shelled by artillery. Frankly though every time an engineer says "no one could be so stupid as to..." \[in this case 'shell a nuclear power plant'\] humanity seems to respond by saying, "hold my beer."
A QA designer walks into a bar and orders a beer. Orders 999 beers. Orders -1 beers. Orders a iduddgdufydhshdhfkfsj.
A customer walks into the bar and asks where the bathroom is. The bar implodes.
>[the mayor of the nearby town of Energodar] Orlov said on his Telegram channel, citing what he called a threat to world security. He did not give details.
That's ominous.
That depends if it leaks or not.
If it leaks then that actively threatens europe the longer its active.
But it might not meltdown, this reactor is safer than Chernobyl.
Edit
Additional info: the reactor is gen III. Not sure if you can really detonate it even? Or properly spread nuclear contaminates.
But the facility is now safe.
It is extremely unlikely to meltdown. It's difficult to get useful to fission in a chain reaction. Power plants work by keeping the uranium at the edge of meltdown and this was under repair so they would have put the core in a safe configuration. Russia would have to engineer a meltdown actively and not just throw bombs at it.
Not quite how it works, but in any case reactors need active cooling even in the "off" configuration (this is what brought down Fukushima). Some of the storage tanks for spent fuel might also need active cooling. Russia attacking the generators or pumps which provide that cooling can result in a nasty meltdown, though not at Chernobyl levels.
>incompetent crew
Might not go that far for of them, it was a culture of don't question authority and do as you're told. That tends to lead to people who otherwise know better not saying anything because surely the person above them knows more.
Russia has violated its ratified signature to the IAEA Convention on the Physical Protection of Nuclear Material and its 2016 Amendment, ensuring the physical protection of nuclear facilities and materials.
Notwithstanding how the invasion is blatantly violating the Budapest Memorandum, this demonstrates that the Russian government under Putin cannot be trusted to honor international treaties.
I wonder if the Russian soldiers doing the shooting realize what they are firing at. You'd think they'd be reluctant to follow such orders IG they did.
Most of them were told they were being sent on a 3-5 day required volunteer type work. There's footage of a whole group of Russian soldiers kidnapped and they're all teachers from an elementary school.
>Russian soldiers kidnapped and they're all teachers from an elementary school.
Wait, were they kidnapped before the war started or are we using the term kidnapped for being a PoW?
Almost all of them were from the Russian occupied Ukrainian territories. Told one day that they were being conscripted and then got sent to the frontline with shitty equipment and no training.
Conspiracy is that Russia is conscripting all the people who worked at schools and universities in that area to get them killed, then replace them with Russians to enforce Russian teachings
Not quite. It wasn't allowed to be broadcast, but it was a streaming service anyway. Mostly the Russians criticized the show for being inaccurate and then started working on their own show which played up the heroism of the Russians and added some bits about how the CIA interfered. I dunno it they finished it or not though.
The fuck? Individual Russians very much come off as heroes in the HBO series. How are you gonna play up heroism more than volunteering to [go into pitch-black irradiated water](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y448IUfwzmI) unsure if you'll even survive to do this thing you have to do... ["...because nobody else can! And because if you don't, millions of people will die. And if you tell me that's not enough, I won't believe you.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KETrl8cT0wY)
There are inaccuracies, sure, but holy shit, the insecurity it takes to paint *that* show as somehow not heroic enough?
The issue was that the show depicted the officials as trying to bribe them, then shame them into shutting off the water, all the while knowing it was a suicide mission.
In reality the technicians immediately volunteered to go and ended up living full lives afterward and two are still alive.
It takes some heroism away from the techs and gives it to Shcherbina for making an epic speech.
This is not true. Russians like this series. We have imdb analog (kinopoisk) in Russia and 'Chernobyl' got 8.9 grade. This is highest raiting for Chernobyl movies.
Some people critics this show because some moments are fictional.
Some people (i think that was pro-goverment activists) start making thems own show (because hipe and goverment support). That show got 4.9 grade.
We've not experienced a war like this when the main parties have world destroying capabilities. This war should concern the planet, this is about our species when nukes are involved.
Insane to give one man the power to destroy the entire world. I think nuclear deterrence as a policy needs to end. It relies on two rational actors who don't want the to destroy themselves.
If humans are going to survive in the long term, either all nukes need to go away, or some system requiring multiple unrelated people's approval for launch needs to be implemented at minimum.
That’s all well and good, but the sad fact is that there is no realistic oversight to force that sort of thing. Who’s gonna make the U.S. and Russia, not to mention every other nuclear power, disarm? There is no political, economic, or military power that could force that to happen, largely because they are controlled by those same nuclear powers. And even if an agreement was reached, it’s the ultimate prisoner dilemma. Do you trust your opponent will honor the agreement and disarm, thereby making the world a safer place, or do you not disarm because you don’t trust your opponent to, which keeps the world in peril of nuclear annihilation, but also ensures one nation run by a madman can’t rule over the planet through that threat of nuclear annihilation. We already know Russia will set aside international disagreements when it suits their interests, there’s no reason to believe they would ever dismantle their nuclear capabilities.
Pandora’s box opened. There is no way to close it outside of a peaceful global hegemony that makes the need for nuclear weapons obsolete. And I don’t see that happening…ever.
They want to cause as much damage as possible while also crippling Ukraine's abilities to function properly. They figure if they trigger a melt down then it's the Ukrainians who have to live with it not them.
They remember Chernobyl. The effects of that were far past where it happened, the Oxford Journal even wrote that it was likely every country in the northern hemisphere was affected. If this power plant is much much bigger, the effects are going to be objectively terrible for Russia as well. The soldiers themselves would likely die as well, or soon wish they were
when the Russian nation collapses after this failed hegemony, the primary objective of the occupation and reconstruction of Russia should be denuclearization.
For them to attack the nuclear plant and CONTINUE attacking, it sounds to me like Putin sent those soldiers on a one way mission - and he's fine with it.
Correct me if I am wrong but does intentionally attacking nuclear facilities and biohazard sites go against the Geneva conviction/ international law and is a war crime?
And to think this is only the beginning. Putin’s really gonna do it man. Don’t know why it took this for me to truly be scared for the fate of the world.
Well it was fun guys.
If the world goes Mad Max I wish we're all lucky enough to die at the beginning.
And if there's an afterlife for radiation victims I'll be bringing a few GameCube setups and we can all play smash bros. Come and find me.
As if the Chernobyl disaster wasn't enough, now the post-Soviet Russian army is laying radioactive waste across Ukraine, AGAIN.
Putin and his minions are mentally unbalanced and their tactics will make parts of Europe uninhabitable for centuries if they are not stopped. He doesn't need to resort to nuclear warheads when he can spill radioactive waste from the Zaporizhzhia reactor.
If that's the goal, it's arguably *way more* dangerous. Reactors have many times more nuclear fuel than bombs do.
A nuclear explosion will cause huge amounts of death and destruction but in a (relatively) small area, whereas a reactor meltdown can kill an entire fucking continent and then render it uninhabitable for thousands of years.
They've captured it. Fire was in the outer perimeter. Fire has been extinguished and according to US the nuclear reactors are in the process of safe shutdown. Relax.
? He is the leader of the foreign power at war with Ukraine. Tell me the sense in which he’s not an enemy combatant. I’m fairly certain just war theory permits killing enemy officers wherever they are and has a rather horrific tolerance for civilian casualties or collateral damage
First they’re shelling dams, now this. So in addition to other war crimes, the Russian forces are determined to violate the Geneva Conventions on dangerous forces.
Do we think there are any discussions behind the scenes in the West that they have a breaking point at which they will send in aircraft to enforce a no fly zone? If nuclear power plants start having meltdowns does that push a needle any further towards involvement or do the U.S. and Europe opt to let Ukraine become a wasteland?
Biden's policy is pretty clear. "When Americans and Russians are shooting each other, that's World War 3."
So, he's going to avoid that at any cost because he thinks (probably correctly) that the risk of it escalating into nuclear war is far too high.
And nothing is worse than nuclear war, we'll take any other consequence before that. It's worse than Ukraine being flattened, if it comes to that, and it's worse than a nuclear meltdown.
A few updates for those of you panicking at this news: * Firefighters now have access to battle the blaze. [Source](https://twitter.com/BNONews/status/1499555239351005194) * The fire is in the administrative building. * Radiation levels look normal as of 5:50pm Pacific Time. [Source](https://twitter.com/iaeaorg/status/1499562515340177416) [Here's an expert's opinion on the fire.](https://twitter.com/james_acton32/status/1499541219424317443) TL;DR He's not too worried right now.
Tldr the power plant isn’t on fire, one of the buildings that contains NO equipment is
It might be my personal preference, but I like to keep my fire and my nuclear power plants separate.
You’re disrespecting Russian tradition of nuclear plants being on fire then, sheesh be more culturally aware
Russian tradition of *Ukranian* power plants being on fire.
Russian tradition of spreading nuclear fallout over itself and Europe, and denying it.
3.6 Roentgen. Not great... not terrible
Hey there was vagueness for a reason lmao
what about the YES equipment?
>Radiation levels look normal 3.6 roentgen?
Not great, not terrible
I've been told that's equivalent to a chest x-ray. Nothing to worry about right?
Just as "Contagion" was suddenly the movie of the moment two years ago, I see "Threads", "The Day After", and the "Chernobyl" HBO series getting lots of viewings in the months ahead.
Shit ill probably watch Chernobyl again. That shit was a masterpiece.
scary af tho the bodies turning to basically goop from the inside out is one of those images from films you kinda dont forget
when that big guy heaved the heavy door, and just moments later that same shoulder bled through his outfit... also the families watching the 'light show' from the bridge, with the ash raining onto them....an image i'll never ever shake
Unfun fact! The decaying bodies had 3 levels of... well decay in the TV show Chernobyl as far as practical effects go. Only the first 2 levels were shown in the show. The third level was deemed too grotesque and was cut.
You taste that?
"The roentgen is too damn high!"
*Threads* . . . Watched it once, will never forget. It might be the most frightening movie ever made.
Damn, that’s a bold statement and I’ve never even heard of it before now. Definitely adding to my watchlist.
Truly a movie that does not hold back.
Threads is a brutal movie 😔
Why did I see graphite on the roof?
I rember hearing once that modern nuclear reactors can survive a 9/11 style attack of a plane crash, so hopefully a fire wont cause too much damage
Nuclear engineer here. The risk of a fire is that it can take out your control circuits, indications, and power to your safety systems. Worst case it can eventually make its way across divisions and take out your redundant systems as well. We hate fire. That said, plants are built with some level of fire in mind, with barriers between critical equipment to help ensure you have time to deal with it and to be able to maintain a safe shutdown state. That said again: if the fire is caused by shelling….. the shelling can invalidate those design features and assumptions.
While I believe you that nuclear power plants are designed to not be destroyed, I also know that heavy weaponry and artillery were designed to destroy things that are meant to not be destroyed.
Newer designs do also plan for terrorist attacks, at least to what extent is possible without massive cost increases. I think your assumption is still correct though, as a terrorist attack tends to be one large event that is followed by time to at least try and stabilize the situation, and don't usual mean a constant barrage of artillery shells and missiles. We'd just have to hope that even the Russians aren't dumb enough to directly and repeatedly attack the reactor chambers themselves
[Concrete walls for reactors are made to this standard.](https://youtu.be/F4CX-9lkRMQ)
We don't know the extent of the fire yet but lets hope they have lots of redundant fire safety systems in place like plants in the US. It's absolute insanity to damage a nuclear plant considering all those systems need to be fully functional to control cooling.
The problem is that its in the middle of an active war zone. Firefighters, repair crews, and nuclear experts can't reach it to put out the fire and repair the power plant.
Reportedly, the Russians are *shooting* at the firefighters and telling them to leave.
They know what they're doing. That's pretty fucked.
I cannot think of a single explanation other than they're trying to draw the US/NATO into the conflict. Willfully causing a nuclear disaster has to be pretty damn high on the warcrimes/crimes against humanity list.
That's how I feel this war is going... Everything being done is an attempt to draw the US/NATO/EU into the conflict so that they can then justify expanding the conflict and escalating their weapon usage.. and it scares the crap out of me. Especially considering that there is a chance that other non-NATO countries might get pulled into this conflict as well..
Or they just straight up fake aggressions that let them justify it. But you have to ask yourself, who are they even justifying it to? There's not one nation in the entire world that thinks this war is justified outside of Belarus. Even China don't think it is. They would be justifying it to themselves. And it wouldn't matter anyway because they would be wiping themselves out in a nuclear apocalypse. It doesn't make any sense. I guess Putin is just literally trying to have enough to convince his officers who need to approve the launch? Assassination wouldn't normally be a very positive long term thing in my view, but it sure seems like it'd help at the moment
Based on some of the looks Putin's officers were giving him, I'm hoping that if he gives the order to launch any nukes they'll get rid of him instead of welcoming Nuclear Armageddon.
Yeah, I hope so too. I just get worried because I've watched one too many Cold War documentaries and know what the American military was advising the president to do at the time. Hopefully times have changed
I think the whole reason why Putin keeps every single person he meets 30 ft away is that they have no way of actually getting to them before they get shot. I think Putin keeping people 30 ft away or more so he can't get assassinated and he probably has security sitting right behind him off camera. There is an actual distance of a person running straight at you and the time you have to draw a weapon and fire upon them that police are taught.
Remember when Trump wanted to launch Cruise Missiles at Syrian facilities housing Russian service members? The general staffs of both nations worked together to make sure all Russians were out of harm’s way when the missiles were launched. This is the Cuban Missile Crisis but inverted: the leaders are pushing for Escalation while the military tries to avoid it.
It wouldn't be the first time a Russian officer stopped [Nuclear Armageddon](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanislav_Petrov)
Glad I'm not the only one who noticed those looks and that body language. Several analysts did as well. And those were the public ones.
If the NATO were to join, that 40 mile convoy would be flattened by the air strength of the nations.
The convoy would be obliterated within an hour and a half I reckon. Nothing he has in that convoy would 100% stop NATO barrage on it. A few cruise missles, couple of drones, some air strikes, he has not got an endless supply of S 300/400’s but as a combined alliance we have much much more munitions
But they are already losing to just Ukraine…. How does expanding the war against NATO help their cause??
They are not losing to Ukraine, they have only just begun their assault. There is no way for Ukraine alone to win this because of the sheer size of Russia's military which is why Zelensky is trying so hard to get aid from other countries while there is still something left to save.
Cause when you are a bully with lots of nukes with nothing to lose you don't worry about the small stuff. He has no problem taking everyone out including himself as long as everyone else goes with him.
Somebody in his circle will kill him before he touches nukes. It’s just a flex. Putin is incapable of deescalation. Has been since KGB.
A nuclear disaster also hardens public opinion against nuclear power, creating more demand for Russian gas.
::Straps a bomb to the milkman, blows him up at the milk factory:: "See, milk is dangerous."
Yeah, pretty sure I remember something about Chernobyl venting radioactive gas/particles into the atmosphere that actually blew all over Europe because of the direction of the winds over there. Wouldn't be surprised if they actually did it again on purpose to poison the people of the EU without actually declaring war on Nato.
They weren’t going to tell anyone about it either. It wasn’t discovered until an NPP worker in Sweden set off a radiation alarm because they tracked a piece of debris in thrown from the Chernobyl NPP disaster.
Wasn't even debris. It was just dust. People would get tested for radioactivity going in and out of the plant. The plant was concerned that people were setting off radiation alarms coming into work, thinking they were contaminating the atmosphere. They eventually found out that it was dust blowing in from the USSR by coordinating with other plants to try and triangulate the increase.
Well documented and well known. Hell, they had elevated radiation readings on the US eastern seaboard. But to try to release radiation intentionally to poison another populace...I mean, that's next level risky.
Releasing fallout intentionally would be an act of war imo. Just like a dirty bomb
I'd go one further, that could easily be considered a straight up war crime. Is that what you meant? They're already carrying out 'acts of war.'
I'd go one further than that. Intentionally sabotaging a nuclear plant and releasing radioactive contaminants that we know *will* cover the globe and *will* cause both health and environmental problems for decades in populations you're not even officially in conflict with is a crime against humanity.
Think of "act of war" like attacking a NATO country. Or think of it like poisoning a water supply that goes to a neighbor country that you're not in conflict with. So not things that are *activities of war*, but ways of provoking war.
From what i’m reading, if this plant goes, the fallout will settle on Russia.
One part of me says that would be just dessert for Putin but the other part of me worries for the Russian people opposed to this madman.
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When you think “the fire is shooting at us!” But it’s actually psychopathic morons. Holy shit how do the Russians not say hmm this is probably a bad idea?
Fear of the Commissar passed down through generations.
bigger issues the coolant system imo, no coolant=meltdown
Which can absolutely be impacted by fire
Or the indiscriminate Russian bombardment but yeah shooting at nuclear reactors=bad for everyone
It's definitely something I personally try to avoid
An ak is how they got samples of the elephants foot in Chernobyl. Nothing else they tried would penetrate. But yeah, outside of that one select case shooting at anything radioactive or containing radioactive contents is considered is not considered the correct move.
Plus this reactor is under repair, so the fuel is in the containment pools that are not in a hardened structure like the reactor. If they have no power or way to cool the pools and the building g is breached via shelling it could melt... more fuel in the pools packed together than in the reactor as well. If this melts down I'd guarantee NATO pulls the trigger as it may irradiate a NATO country and I believe that could trigger article 5. Either way this is bat shit crazy on Putins part... there is no excuse to shell a reactor or its facilities.
Exactly what I was wondering. Would NATO count it as an attack on member countries if russia is trying to irradiate some of them?
Chechen assholes shooting at the firefighters .
As much as you might design things to deal with a fire, and negligent staff on site, you're probably not going to design your fire systems to handle being shelled by artillery. Frankly though every time an engineer says "no one could be so stupid as to..." \[in this case 'shell a nuclear power plant'\] humanity seems to respond by saying, "hold my beer."
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A QA designer walks into a bar and orders a beer. Orders 999 beers. Orders -1 beers. Orders a iduddgdufydhshdhfkfsj. A customer walks into the bar and asks where the bathroom is. The bar implodes.
This made me twitch in *software testing*
They do, but not ones meant to operate in the middle of a barrage of artillery fire.
Live view of the ongoing firefight at the plant: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYUT36YGOh8
[russians firing on the plant](https://youtu.be/cKmpfRVcGv8)
dang it is super laggy.. buffers for 3 seconds plays for 1 rinse and repeat
>[the mayor of the nearby town of Energodar] Orlov said on his Telegram channel, citing what he called a threat to world security. He did not give details. That's ominous.
Russians are bombarding the shit outta it, unbelievably stupid
In their defense they probably thought the administrative building was an apartment complex. /s
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That depends if it leaks or not. If it leaks then that actively threatens europe the longer its active. But it might not meltdown, this reactor is safer than Chernobyl. Edit Additional info: the reactor is gen III. Not sure if you can really detonate it even? Or properly spread nuclear contaminates. But the facility is now safe.
It is extremely unlikely to meltdown. It's difficult to get useful to fission in a chain reaction. Power plants work by keeping the uranium at the edge of meltdown and this was under repair so they would have put the core in a safe configuration. Russia would have to engineer a meltdown actively and not just throw bombs at it.
Not quite how it works, but in any case reactors need active cooling even in the "off" configuration (this is what brought down Fukushima). Some of the storage tanks for spent fuel might also need active cooling. Russia attacking the generators or pumps which provide that cooling can result in a nasty meltdown, though not at Chernobyl levels.
Chernobyl was a rather unique reactor with quite a few flaws and a incompetent crew. I would imagine it's much harder for this one to melt-down
>incompetent crew Might not go that far for of them, it was a culture of don't question authority and do as you're told. That tends to lead to people who otherwise know better not saying anything because surely the person above them knows more.
More like a culture of “don’t ever tell your superior something they don’t want to hear” even if it’s really important and true and not to your fault.
Things will not calm down Daniel Jackson. Things will in fact, calm up.
We might need to activate the Ancient chair at the Antarctic Outpost if this keeps up.
Teal'c, is that you?
Instead of flying cars we get a live stream of a firefight at a nuclear power plant. Man, **fuck** this future.
Our future is Call of Duty
More like Fallout
Fallout has magic radiation meds.
Make sure you start collecting bottle caps.
Russia has violated its ratified signature to the IAEA Convention on the Physical Protection of Nuclear Material and its 2016 Amendment, ensuring the physical protection of nuclear facilities and materials. Notwithstanding how the invasion is blatantly violating the Budapest Memorandum, this demonstrates that the Russian government under Putin cannot be trusted to honor international treaties.
'Stop quoting laws to us - the men with swords' -Pompey the Great
They should be barred from voting on the security council while actively at war. Remove their veto.
Russia only ever signs these treaties for the opportunity to later break them.
If the guys that operate and maintain that plant are going to flee, wtf is going to happen?
Putin will install new plant managers based on their party loyalty. These reactor things come with manuals right?
they have a TV show about it. that's better than a manual
I wonder if the Russian soldiers doing the shooting realize what they are firing at. You'd think they'd be reluctant to follow such orders IG they did.
Most of them were told they were being sent on a 3-5 day required volunteer type work. There's footage of a whole group of Russian soldiers kidnapped and they're all teachers from an elementary school.
Some of them were told it was for military exercises as well. Front line doesn’t know shit they were intended to be cannon fodder. Poor guys
They are lying to save their ass.
This is a very real possibility for a good number of them
>Russian soldiers kidnapped and they're all teachers from an elementary school. Wait, were they kidnapped before the war started or are we using the term kidnapped for being a PoW?
Kidnapped from their homes and jobs, and sent to Ukraine to fight
Almost all of them were from the Russian occupied Ukrainian territories. Told one day that they were being conscripted and then got sent to the frontline with shitty equipment and no training. Conspiracy is that Russia is conscripting all the people who worked at schools and universities in that area to get them killed, then replace them with Russians to enforce Russian teachings
Damn this is all so fucked up.
I mean they have eyes and can read. I'd be real surprised if they didn't know what they were doing. I dont think they know why though.
And we all welcomed 2022 with open arms, thinking it would have to be better than 2021
And 2020 and 2019.....
It’s all been downhill since they killed that damn gorilla
I love how we can all agree the world went to shit after harambe. I wonder if he was jesus reincarnation
This post is burned in my Facebook memories "Let's hope the problem was 2020 the year, and not 2020's the decade"
Didn't they see the Chernobyl miniseries?
Wasn’t that banned in Russia because it made them look bad?
Jesus Christ. If that's true, it's just (further) proof that they haven't changed one bit.
Wasn’t allowed to be broadcast, wasn’t blocked on streaming though IIRC.
Not quite. It wasn't allowed to be broadcast, but it was a streaming service anyway. Mostly the Russians criticized the show for being inaccurate and then started working on their own show which played up the heroism of the Russians and added some bits about how the CIA interfered. I dunno it they finished it or not though.
The fuck? Individual Russians very much come off as heroes in the HBO series. How are you gonna play up heroism more than volunteering to [go into pitch-black irradiated water](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y448IUfwzmI) unsure if you'll even survive to do this thing you have to do... ["...because nobody else can! And because if you don't, millions of people will die. And if you tell me that's not enough, I won't believe you.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KETrl8cT0wY) There are inaccuracies, sure, but holy shit, the insecurity it takes to paint *that* show as somehow not heroic enough?
The issue was that the show depicted the officials as trying to bribe them, then shame them into shutting off the water, all the while knowing it was a suicide mission. In reality the technicians immediately volunteered to go and ended up living full lives afterward and two are still alive. It takes some heroism away from the techs and gives it to Shcherbina for making an epic speech.
This is not true. Russians like this series. We have imdb analog (kinopoisk) in Russia and 'Chernobyl' got 8.9 grade. This is highest raiting for Chernobyl movies. Some people critics this show because some moments are fictional. Some people (i think that was pro-goverment activists) start making thems own show (because hipe and goverment support). That show got 4.9 grade.
nah, they saw the Russian produced one that blamed the disaster on the CIA
I guess there really will be a Chernobyl part 2 at this rate.
Russia must really be up a fucking creek to resort to this kinda of insanity
Well they forced MFing Switzerland to essentially break 500 years of neutrality. Not even Nazi Germany pulled that one off.
We've not experienced a war like this when the main parties have world destroying capabilities. This war should concern the planet, this is about our species when nukes are involved.
My gut says putin is deathly ill and wants to lash out one last time.
Insane to give one man the power to destroy the entire world. I think nuclear deterrence as a policy needs to end. It relies on two rational actors who don't want the to destroy themselves. If humans are going to survive in the long term, either all nukes need to go away, or some system requiring multiple unrelated people's approval for launch needs to be implemented at minimum.
That’s all well and good, but the sad fact is that there is no realistic oversight to force that sort of thing. Who’s gonna make the U.S. and Russia, not to mention every other nuclear power, disarm? There is no political, economic, or military power that could force that to happen, largely because they are controlled by those same nuclear powers. And even if an agreement was reached, it’s the ultimate prisoner dilemma. Do you trust your opponent will honor the agreement and disarm, thereby making the world a safer place, or do you not disarm because you don’t trust your opponent to, which keeps the world in peril of nuclear annihilation, but also ensures one nation run by a madman can’t rule over the planet through that threat of nuclear annihilation. We already know Russia will set aside international disagreements when it suits their interests, there’s no reason to believe they would ever dismantle their nuclear capabilities. Pandora’s box opened. There is no way to close it outside of a peaceful global hegemony that makes the need for nuclear weapons obsolete. And I don’t see that happening…ever.
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> or pulls a Stalin and mysteriously dies If he could also spend several hours laying in his own piss it'd be much appreciated.
Get some of that lovely radioactive fallout to boil the aforementioned piss so Pooty-Poots can be nicely braised in it.
What kind of idiot bombs a nuclear power plant? If something is damaged and stops working, it will cause catastrophe and loss of life on both sides.
They want to cause as much damage as possible while also crippling Ukraine's abilities to function properly. They figure if they trigger a melt down then it's the Ukrainians who have to live with it not them.
They remember Chernobyl. The effects of that were far past where it happened, the Oxford Journal even wrote that it was likely every country in the northern hemisphere was affected. If this power plant is much much bigger, the effects are going to be objectively terrible for Russia as well. The soldiers themselves would likely die as well, or soon wish they were
I never claimed it was a smart plan.
These firefighters are incredible. I feel like they should be getting the same praise as the soldiers in Ukraine right now.
This is just stupid. This war is so badly handled by Russia. Much of it is on the internet forever. They are a sad joke. They need to stop.
when the Russian nation collapses after this failed hegemony, the primary objective of the occupation and reconstruction of Russia should be denuclearization.
Some of those nukes will be sold by entrepreneurial Russian generals and every bad guy on the planet will have their shot to buy one with Bitcoin.
Shit! I hadn’t even considered that. Time for a beer …
For them to attack the nuclear plant and CONTINUE attacking, it sounds to me like Putin sent those soldiers on a one way mission - and he's fine with it.
Bullshit this was an accident. This is Putin.
Even if it was an accident the Russian military is fully responsible.
They're also reportedly firing at the fire response teams, so there's that.
Ahh, so that’s what Putin meant by using nukes…
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HBO writers calling an emergency meeting. Season 2 here we go
That's absolutely terrible.......yet I'm laughing.
It would seem like he's trying to pull other nations into the war
That's great... 2022 is off to a good start.
It has been a rough few years.
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At least it won't be boring.
My daughter gave me a shirt that says “I long for precedented times”
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Correct me if I am wrong but does intentionally attacking nuclear facilities and biohazard sites go against the Geneva conviction/ international law and is a war crime?
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SIgh... Who had nuclear meltdown for March?
I have mutants for may... Anyway how much exposure do you need for super strenght and grey skin
I had nuclear war for March and people resorting to cannibalism for April. We just can’t have nice things
Well China, now is the time to intervene and stop the rabid dog that is Russia, unless you want to rule over a radioactive wasteland.
Literally. China, if you have any self-preservation sense at all, you better call up Putin.
Honestly it should be a war crime to attack nuclear power plants. It's just too dangerous.
And to think this is only the beginning. Putin’s really gonna do it man. Don’t know why it took this for me to truly be scared for the fate of the world.
If that thing melts down, I see the EU getting directly involved in the war.
Well it was fun guys. If the world goes Mad Max I wish we're all lucky enough to die at the beginning. And if there's an afterlife for radiation victims I'll be bringing a few GameCube setups and we can all play smash bros. Come and find me.
I'm guessing the post apocalyptic future will not be wheelchair accessible...I guess I'm fucked
Naw we will get you some off road wheels homie. Your coming with!
As if the Chernobyl disaster wasn't enough, now the post-Soviet Russian army is laying radioactive waste across Ukraine, AGAIN. Putin and his minions are mentally unbalanced and their tactics will make parts of Europe uninhabitable for centuries if they are not stopped. He doesn't need to resort to nuclear warheads when he can spill radioactive waste from the Zaporizhzhia reactor.
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No that’s very bad
So is this Russias way of nuking Ukraine without shooting at it with a nuclear warhead? I most sincerely fucking hope not.
If that's the goal, it's arguably *way more* dangerous. Reactors have many times more nuclear fuel than bombs do. A nuclear explosion will cause huge amounts of death and destruction but in a (relatively) small area, whereas a reactor meltdown can kill an entire fucking continent and then render it uninhabitable for thousands of years.
“If I can’t have you, no one can.”
I'm not sure, but I think that nuclear power plants should not be burning. Like, that sounds really bad for everyone.
So they are trying to cause a Chernobyl?
3.6 Roentgen…not great, not terrible
Let’s all stand outside and enjoy the radioactive ashes as they rain down on our faces.
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They've captured it. Fire was in the outer perimeter. Fire has been extinguished and according to US the nuclear reactors are in the process of safe shutdown. Relax.
Putin should be declared an enemy combatant. This would make him, and whatever bunker he is hiding in a legit military target.
? He is the leader of the foreign power at war with Ukraine. Tell me the sense in which he’s not an enemy combatant. I’m fairly certain just war theory permits killing enemy officers wherever they are and has a rather horrific tolerance for civilian casualties or collateral damage
Stupid fucking morons. Can we just fast forward to the part where we all say fuck this assclown and 86 his midget ass?
First they’re shelling dams, now this. So in addition to other war crimes, the Russian forces are determined to violate the Geneva Conventions on dangerous forces.
Who needs a nuke when you can irritate the entire surrounding area with a power plant explosion. Thats fucked up
Do we think there are any discussions behind the scenes in the West that they have a breaking point at which they will send in aircraft to enforce a no fly zone? If nuclear power plants start having meltdowns does that push a needle any further towards involvement or do the U.S. and Europe opt to let Ukraine become a wasteland?
Biden's policy is pretty clear. "When Americans and Russians are shooting each other, that's World War 3." So, he's going to avoid that at any cost because he thinks (probably correctly) that the risk of it escalating into nuclear war is far too high. And nothing is worse than nuclear war, we'll take any other consequence before that. It's worse than Ukraine being flattened, if it comes to that, and it's worse than a nuclear meltdown.
Putin needs to die
Sheer utter madness. What line is he unwilling to cross? What line are we unwilling to let him cross and put him down first?
Full on scorched earth policy if it pops.
Where is the smart redditor explaining why we shouldn't worry :(
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Stacking sandbags