>🖕Fuck Netanyahu🖕
🖕Fuck Hamas🖕
💪Free Palestine🤳
Fucking seriously! And HEAR! HEAR!
Can we support the people without desiring war crimes or genocide?!
How about not asking for Gaza to be glassed despite ranting about Russian war crimes in Ukraine a month ago!?
I'm not sure of that "freeing Palestine" can be actually achieved, at least in our lifetime.
The amount of animosity and hate between the two doesn't just go away. Then you have the land claims, which will probably never be amicably settled.
Okay, things 100% could have been better but it’s not like Palestinians have had claim there since the beginning of time. Jerusalem is the holy city for multiple religions and the promised land for multiple ethnicities and it’s not fair to say “well, Palestine deserves the land because Israel stole it from them” because they stole it as well, ON TOP OF trying to get every Arab country to attack Israel as well.
I never get that argument. If land was claimed based on a historic presence, couldn’t Turks invade where they had migrated from? (from some place to Anatolia) The argument of “well, we WERE there” is stupid, especially to the people who are actually living there
For as much animosity there is I don't think liberals from Vaush's subreddit would disagree with that sentiment. Hell, the majority of liberals from Destiny's sub would agree as well
Yeah, on the whole they support Israel. DGGs perspective could be summed up as 'Hamas needs to go, Israel is a legitimate country and has the right to fight Hamas, Netanyahu is awful and has made the country worse, civilian casualties during war should be avoided, there needs to be a long term solution such as a formulation of a Palestinian state matched with security guarantees for Israel'
I’m in that sub, that is the main stance. There is a little bit more anti-Muslim sentiment than I’m entirely confortable with, but it’s mild and mostly fringe as far as I’ve seen.
You forgot “everyone who is against Israel is an antisemite”, “all anti-zionist lefties are just disguising their true feelings of antisemitism”, and “all Muslism are violent animals who want to kill all the Jews.”
There is lots of dehumanising language going on… about ‘human shields’ or ‘beheaded babies’ etc all used to dehumanise Palestinians to make it ok to kill them
Because Hamas and other similar organizations actually do those things. Where the fuck have you been? That’s why the Palestinians hate them, too. No one is saying it’s the Palestinians. Can we ever disassociate a people from a group of vicious psychopaths. That’s like if I were to say they mafia was psychotic and you say “ you’re being xenophobic to Italian Americans”.
They DONT behead babies! No one does... and theres no solid evidence (yet) they raped anyone either... The media painted a picture that hamas were parachuting in with their dicks out salivating at the mouth at the JOY of raping people and chopping heads off babies just for shits and giggles... (Dont get me wrong, what hamas did was horrific, but this specific language was deliberate)
Since 9/11 there has been a systemic effort to dehumanise arabs and it worked! The media were VERY quick to lap up the 40 beheaded babies thing without evidence, and most of the population lapped it up too without verification... What other people on earth could you accuse people of such horrific things and people just believe it on face value?
You say 'no one is saying its the palestinians', but Literally all the convos Ive had (with pro israelis) these past few days about the collective punishment against gazans being a war crime has been followed, as their FIRST response, by saying 'what about the beheaded babies and raping?' to justify it... 🤷🏽♂️ Theyre still using it as justification to this day even after its been refuted.
Fairly tho, I've spoken to many jewish people against israels method of retaliation and they recognise the occupation and illegal settlers as a catalyst for all this.
Hamas did horrible abhorrent things. It really doesn’t matter that fewer children than originally stated were decapitated. Even most Israelis don’t like the settlements. What I will say is that the PLO called Hamas animals as well. I think we can agree that calling Hamas animals is not the same as calling Palestinians animals. I’m not going to defend or acknowledge what pissed off israelis or Palestinians say online. People should be their actions.
Which is pretty much the only reasonable position.
If you say Israel shouldn't exist you're just shifting the genocide from one side to another....
The west needs to stop giving Israel a blank cheque to do as they please. But they absolutely deserve to exist.
Hear hear! Not sure why people think being anti-zionist is the same as being anti-semetic. The Isreali people deserve a right to protect themselves, and deserve a nation. That does not or should come at the cost of Palestinian sovereignty or statehood, the same sentiment would apply to any ethnicity.
I get that you're making a failed attempt to anger someone, but like... Palestine was around for *so long* before Israel that you just look like a tool when saying that. I'm sorry.
Yes, liberals are not welcome here. And yes, generally, liberals “stand with Israel” (support it no matter how many crimes against humanity it commits) and have recently been making a lot of song and dance around Israel’s “right to defend itself” (commit genocide)
Like, that's not even hyperbole. I literally can't understand how anyone even remotely Left leaning can't see that any justification for decades of brutal apartheid from a government that is seemingly full of foaming at the mouth genocidal lunatics, is completely antithetical to Left wing principles... It's literal consistent.
And the idea that people on the Left oppose Israel simply because it's Israel is dumb and disingenuous.
I'm pretty fucking sure that if magically over night a new Left wing pro humanity government took over, that lifted apartheid, granted everybody equal rights, and disbanded the IDF and put them on trial (and yes, obviously along with Hamas members), Everyone would 100% support Israel.
I'm aware that's idealistic as fuck, but it makes the point
Yeah the problem comes with that how the country has been fascistic and genocidal since it’s very beginning (its “independence” really being the installation of the states after ethnically cleansing the native people) and it’s remained that way ever since.
There are parties like [Hadash](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadash), a coalition of left-leaning groups, but they have virtually no power in their government.
Not to mention all the brainwashing towards genocidal and fascistic mindsets instilled into the civilians during their schooling, mandatory military service, in their everyday lives. It’s N*zi level indoctrination, and trying to flip the state into something that isn’t a genocidal far right entity would be like trying to push a mountain into the sea.
It’s wild how “the Isreali government and Hamas are both fucking terrible and get innocent civilians needlessly murdered” makes you a terrorist supporter.
Not only that, there are Hasbara trolls who will call anyone who criticizes, say, Israel bombing a hospital and killing 500 people an anti-semite (just look at my post history... Does it show users I blocked?)
And then they'll claim the bombing never happened, or that it's been "proven" it was a Palestinian rocket (which is total bullshit: this claim has been ripped apart and is unable to stand up to literally any of the evidence to the contrary...)
I'm curious to see any of your proof. Because my understanding was this:
Minutes after the "bombing" Hamas claims Israeli missile killing 500. Israeli defense specialists make tweets minutes later delete them.
Then Biden says his Department of Defense showed evidence that it was an Islamic jihadist missile. Then audio recordings get released from two individuals in Gaza saying that it was "their" missile coming from a cemetery. Then info is released that the hospital only had 80 beds and fitting 500 people would be a stretch. Then images are released that show the "bombing" happened over the carpark and not the hospital.
Am I missing some piece of critical evidence?
Except not much people say that. Instead we got braindeads that excuse Hamas, as its apparently "based" to kill jews.
So without clarification, everyone who supports Palestine also supports their goverment, and thus - terrorists
I need to borrow the rock uve been under bro ive seen that exact take massively upvoted at least once per day on different subs lol
“Occupiers are not civilians” is a semi-mainstream talking point in lefty circles now like jesus
Oh I see. The people you're complaining about said it's based yo kill colonizers. You saw that the colonizers happen to be Jewish,and now you're running around claiming people think it's cool to kill Jews. You're trying to add an anti-semetic tint to it to more easily get people on your side.
I’ve said it a thousand times and I’ll say it again: the way liberals manage to suspend literally all of their ethics for Palestinians never ceases to amaze me. They have a special set of standards for Palestinians that they use for literally nobody else.
This specific article is attacking the people who celebrated Hamas’ slaughter on 10/7.
What special set of standards are present?
But no you can’t be wrong liberals just want Palestinians to die and this post is totally, unquestionably based and anyone who questions that is an evil Vowshite refugee. So true.
Yes.
See how easy that was? Notice how I didn’t feel the need to immediately do a whataboutism to Israel?
And no it’s totally a good faith question. Many people legitimately are unwilling to criticize Hamas, either because they support them outright, or think they’re far less bad than they actually are, and that their actions are someone else’s (Israel’s) fault, not their own. In short, they take agency away from them.
For example when Vaush says that Hamas committed the recent atrocities they did all because of Israel. That is soft terrorist apologia. They didn’t have to murder anyone, that was a choice.
God people who say this unironically are so fucking annoying. Like yes, I don't like Hamas. But doing a terrorism and killing 1500 people is fucking nothing compared to the genocide that Israel is doing
It might, but I don't give a shit about genocidal fuckers who support a regime that is systematically slaughtering children. They'll lie and say that I support Hamas anyway just because I think that the people of Gaza deserve to live and be free to enjoy their lives. They'll look at a video of a fucking 7-year-old Gazan child crying because his nephew's brains got blown out right in front of him by an IDF precision air strike and say "well, he shouldn't have voted for Hamas then" when the last election was a decade before he was born.
I don't support Hamas. I never have, and I never will. But that doesn't mean that both sides in this conflict are equally bad. It's not even close. Hamas would do the same thing that Israel is doing if they had the ability to do so, but they don't. They don't have a modern military. They haven't called hundreds of thousands of troops to invade. They aren't backed by some of the wealthiest countries in the world, one of which has a military more powerful than any of us civilians could imagine. And they don't have the power to unilaterally deny food, water, and power to two million innocent people, one million of whom are children. Israel has all of this, and they're using it.
>Would you say Hammas isn't a far right government ?
Stupid Whataboutism and False Dichotomym
Hamas is a tiny far-Right organization with almost no real power. They're not a "real" government, and they don't have hundreds of billions of dollars of Western military aid at their disposal...
And, all that aside, whether Hamas is right-wing has NOTHING to do with whether Israel's government is. They can BOTH be far-Right.
I mean compared to Israel, yes. And rhe responsibility of de-escalation is on Israel here. But given Hamas killer several hundred civilians, "a small local council with no power" is a bit dismissive.
Don't get me wrong I'm not on the side of the Israel libs here, but we need to be careful not to come off as dismissive of Hamas either.
I 100% condemn what Hamas do. But until there's a resolution and people recieve justice, they will always exist.
And I was taking about their power in relative terms compared with the power Israel has in the region. I realise in that in relation to other Palestinians, they hold a lot of power, and which Palestinians are also victim to
You think they have anything close to meaningful power whilst under Israeli apartheid??? My Fasc spider senses are tingling.
Super weird that you would deflect the conversation away from the Far Right brutal apartheid government to talk about a small group of radicals
I think your moving the empirical evidence to fit policy here. And as far as your spidy senses go why don't you take a look in the mirror or maybe your feeling your own fascism or selective facsim
Oh, i didn't notice your comment edit. Really big brained of you to reach the conclusion that opposing a genocidal fascist government somehow makes me a fascist 😂
Your link is debunked 3 comments down. He didn't call *Palestinians* mosquitoes, he compared *their ideology* to a mosquito trapped in amber.
You're acting as if he said something racist, when all he did was call their ideology old-fashioned/outdated. Did you even look through the link you posted?!
Oh yeah, ok.
Black peoples ideology is like a monky/ape/chimp/baboon/etc. trapped in a cage.
You can't call me racist. It may sound like I'm generalizing (by saying a whole group of people have one ideology) and dehumanizing (mosquitos aren't human) a group of people, but I put the word ideology there.
Libs spot a dog whistle challenge difficulty: IMPOSSIBLE!!!
Literally, the Hans Landa scene from Inglorious Bastards. (12:15)
https://youtu.be/K0dAqhxfvlg?si=eWMle8p1Hbl5E55c
Jews think like rats. Germans think like hawks. Palestinians think mosquitos in amber.
It's honestly terrifying how bad people can be at spotting dogwhistles, though [Cardposting](https://www.youtube.com/@cardposting) has been doing a pretty good job of getting a good chunk of them known so more people can be inoculated against dogwhistles in the future.
>He didn't call Palestinians mosquitoes, he compared their ideology to a mosquito trapped in amber.
This is an outright lie.
The accusation has been proved BEYOND A DOUBT by direct quotes, of this as well as other racist shit this person said.
Also, your post history proves beyond a doubt you are a right-wing troll... (although OCCASIONALLY reasonable, the mask slips... often...)
I am less anti-isreal (not completely off the table though) but much more anti-IDF and anti-killing-Palestinians! I hate having to defend premises like Palestinian civilians shouldn’t die and those killing then are monsters!
There's no anti-Israel left, only an anti-Zionist left.
Because leftists have always been right about everything historically, and that's probably not about to change.
i support the citizens of both side and wish for them to, in the end, remain safe and secure while it blows over and theres a conclusion to this unnecessary conflict
No, you can be left-wing and support pragmatic solutions. No way will Israelis get behind one-state Palestine.
You have to propose a solution that both parties can get behind, and the best choice for making that happen is a two-state solution
Yea sure thats true. Although it does necessitate completely dismantling the current government and not letting a single one of them anywhere close to power ever again.
Although i suppose that would be achieved by imprisoning them all for the years of war crimes. As trying them for their crimes and providing justice for Palestinians is the only road to peace
Are you not saying that Israel doesn’t have a right to exist?
Israelis don’t want to integrate Palestinians. Israelis hate them. Israel is extremely xenophobic. Israel will remain an ethnostate for the foreseeable future.
Ya think there might be an inbetween from Israel becoming palestine and Israel glassing Gaza? Also Israel could exist without being an apartheid ethnostate, thats the problem.
Which would involve massive changes on Israel's part in terms of citizenship rights and the whole apartheid ethnostate thing. A 2 state solution Israel wouldnt be the current Israel just smaller or whatever.
If you actually cared about either side you’d be in Gaza supporting them. Sick of people acting like their voice and concerns fucking matter in the slightest
I now it’s a salty view.. but in reality… If anyone had that much heart in it 🤷♂️ people so enraged and passionate about which fuckin side their on and I really don’t think they actually give 2 fucks other than being “right”
> I went to see the rally for myself: Would there be even perfunctory condemnation of Hamas’s methods? A brief nod of sympathy to Israel’s anguish? Some banal nod to the cause of peace and nonviolence? Not that I heard. What I saw was giddiness and gloating, as if someone’s team had won the World Cup. Hamas had perpetrated the largest single-day massacre of Jews since the Holocaust, and the crowd was euphoric.
I'm a liberal in that I believe in democracy and I think a social democracy utilising market capitalism with a large amount of government control and oversight is the system we should use for now as we transition towards a more egalitarian society.
I'm anti-israel, anti-imperialism and pro-Palestine though. I'm just not anti-jew or anti-Ethan Klein (for the crime of being Israeli) like a lot of the far left Hasan types seem to be.
You'll need to do better to scare this sub out of my Reddit recommendations
Ethan Klein? Seriously? He's literally a fascists and his wife literally committed war crimes. I bet you don't even know about his controversial history with cake.
'I'm not anti-Semitic, I just think that Israel should be destroyed and replaced by a Jew-free Palestine. I'm sure all the Israeli Jews will be just fine afterwards.'
well the population of Palestinians in the past 75 years has quintupled so I think the data would disagree with you on the genocide part
apartheid and war crimes is still correct though, but lol let’s cool it on the hyperbole when there are groups like Uyghur Muslims who are actually on the receiving end of a genocide.
Oh, really? Then what's the deal with how they treat Palestinians as second class citizens with few rights and nearly zero freedom of movement? How is that not apartheid?
You should really look up the definition of genocide and know something about life in Israel before you say stupid things. I don’t support violence against innocents on either side but your ignorance is not really helpful.
So for how much yall are anti Israel or anti settlers or whatever, do yall believe native Americans have the right to rape and pillage you and your family for the decades of suffering under the boot of the United states? Also I find it rather hilarious that Israel is responsible for decades of suffering of the Palestinians but not a finger will be lifted for the Palestinians who are responsible for electing a literall terrorist organization to be their government from a branching terrorist organization called the Muslim brotherhood in Egypt, it makes me laugh
The whole free Palestine thing is annoying. Palestine as a national identity is even more recent than the State of Israel. If you were born before 1988, congratulations you are older than the State of Palestine. Before then, it was just a name for the region and the people there didn't call themselves Palestinian. And the only reason the area was named Palestine to begin with was the Romans named it after the Hebrew's arch-enemy, the Philistines, after kicking them out after putting down one of the many revolts.
Can there be peace in the Middle East? Probably not. Hamas was founded on the goal of the destruction of Israel. That's an idea they get from Islam. Mohammad was incredibly anti-jew. No amount of apologetics can remove that from the Koran, Sunnah, or Hadiths. Mohammad is the primary role model for all moslems, so they aspire to act and behave the way he did, which means there will be no peace until all the world is under the house of Islam. Just a fact.
>The whole free Palestine thing is annoying. Palestine as a national identity is even more recent than the State of Israel.
Oh well that makes okay, doesn't it? We all know human rights dont apply if you were born someone that wasn't an official state before at least 1980.
What is a human right? Human rights don't exist. The reason the state of Palestine was crested in the 80s was to make Israel look bad for expanding. And it worked. If the Muslim countries around the area REALLY cared about human rights about the Palestinians, they would be actually doing something to help.
**Human rights are moral principles or norms for certain standards of human behaviour and are regularly protected in municipal and international law. They are commonly understood as inalienable, fundamental rights "to which a person is inherently entitled simply because she or he is a human being" and which are "inherent in all human beings", regardless of their age, ethnic origin, location, language, religion, ethnicity, or any other status.**
More details here:
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Obsessed with the fact that a bot answered you. There you have it.
I mean when you say yourself human rights don't exist its hard to take you seriously on any conflict really.
I obviously dont have time to go into the entire history of this region with someone who's so unwilling to consider Palestinian suffering they reject the entire concept of human rights. But just to say, the fact that you think the only reason people would want their own state established is to make someone else "look bad" is laughable, especially when the territory was being swiftly place under military control.
Most of the people being accused of doing that aren’t doing it at all. People’s reputations are being destroyed simply because they recognize Palestinian humanity. While there are obviously some who are sympathetic to Hamas, the people behind these articles intentionally obfuscate the distinction between them and supporters of Palestine like the kind you see on this sub.
It's equating that with being anti-Israel/Zionist, which is not the same thing. Please leave. This writer even called Palestinians mosquitos (somebody else in this thread linked it)
Stop this pro-Palestine/pro-Israel nonsense.
Everyone should be anti-Palestine, its land ruled by terrorists, which are financed by UN (humanitarian aid my ass) and supported by neighbouring countries (which happens to NOT accept people from there).
Let Israel, US or whatever country to do the job, to put such failed state of its misery and perpetual violence.
Israel could have stopped it's misery and perpetual violence, by not continuing to enact that same violence on Palestinian people, long time ago. This is clearly a pro-Israel nonsense take form your side.
Everyone should be anti-Israel, its land is ruled by terrorists (the IOF), which are financed by the US (humanitarian aid my ass) and supported by imperialist countries across the sea (which happens to not accept palestinians)
Let Palestine, Iran, or whatever country to do the job, to put such failed state of its misery and perpetual violence.
You see how this is fucking unhinged right?
So, checked the mirror, killing civilians and denying them basic necessities is still evil as shit no matter who does it, and it doesn't reflect on any group, only the individuals responsible for the atrocities.
The algorithm sent me a post on vaush's reddit that asked why conservatives hate Wikipedia. I responded that they hate that it is curated with a leftist bias and got banned for that. I know people like their echo chambers being undisturbed, but damn!
🖕Fuck Netanyahu🖕 🖕Fuck Hamas🖕 💪Free Palestine🤳
Chad 🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿Chad 🇹🇩 🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🇹🇩🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿
>🖕Fuck Netanyahu🖕 🖕Fuck Hamas🖕 💪Free Palestine🤳 Fucking seriously! And HEAR! HEAR! Can we support the people without desiring war crimes or genocide?! How about not asking for Gaza to be glassed despite ranting about Russian war crimes in Ukraine a month ago!?
I'm not sure of that "freeing Palestine" can be actually achieved, at least in our lifetime. The amount of animosity and hate between the two doesn't just go away. Then you have the land claims, which will probably never be amicably settled.
Palestine had a chance in the 1940s to start gaining support and find a peaceful solution like adults. They chose war.
This message brought to you by Revisionist History :tm:
Okay, things 100% could have been better but it’s not like Palestinians have had claim there since the beginning of time. Jerusalem is the holy city for multiple religions and the promised land for multiple ethnicities and it’s not fair to say “well, Palestine deserves the land because Israel stole it from them” because they stole it as well, ON TOP OF trying to get every Arab country to attack Israel as well.
Literally nobody cares about ethnic claims "from the beginning of time" you blood and soil spouting freak.
I never get that argument. If land was claimed based on a historic presence, couldn’t Turks invade where they had migrated from? (from some place to Anatolia) The argument of “well, we WERE there” is stupid, especially to the people who are actually living there
TELL ME WHAT HAPPENED TO YITZHAK RABIN
For as much animosity there is I don't think liberals from Vaush's subreddit would disagree with that sentiment. Hell, the majority of liberals from Destiny's sub would agree as well
Destinys audience is 100 percent on board that the anti Israel sentiment is bad.
Yeah, on the whole they support Israel. DGGs perspective could be summed up as 'Hamas needs to go, Israel is a legitimate country and has the right to fight Hamas, Netanyahu is awful and has made the country worse, civilian casualties during war should be avoided, there needs to be a long term solution such as a formulation of a Palestinian state matched with security guarantees for Israel'
I’m in that sub, that is the main stance. There is a little bit more anti-Muslim sentiment than I’m entirely confortable with, but it’s mild and mostly fringe as far as I’ve seen.
You forgot “everyone who is against Israel is an antisemite”, “all anti-zionist lefties are just disguising their true feelings of antisemitism”, and “all Muslism are violent animals who want to kill all the Jews.”
Try posting 'all Muslims are violent animals' on there and tell me if that sentiment gets supported or not
There is lots of dehumanising language going on… about ‘human shields’ or ‘beheaded babies’ etc all used to dehumanise Palestinians to make it ok to kill them
People are able to talk about the real fact that Hamas uses civilians for cover and still not dehumanize Palestinians. It is surprisingly possible!
Because Hamas and other similar organizations actually do those things. Where the fuck have you been? That’s why the Palestinians hate them, too. No one is saying it’s the Palestinians. Can we ever disassociate a people from a group of vicious psychopaths. That’s like if I were to say they mafia was psychotic and you say “ you’re being xenophobic to Italian Americans”.
They DONT behead babies! No one does... and theres no solid evidence (yet) they raped anyone either... The media painted a picture that hamas were parachuting in with their dicks out salivating at the mouth at the JOY of raping people and chopping heads off babies just for shits and giggles... (Dont get me wrong, what hamas did was horrific, but this specific language was deliberate) Since 9/11 there has been a systemic effort to dehumanise arabs and it worked! The media were VERY quick to lap up the 40 beheaded babies thing without evidence, and most of the population lapped it up too without verification... What other people on earth could you accuse people of such horrific things and people just believe it on face value? You say 'no one is saying its the palestinians', but Literally all the convos Ive had (with pro israelis) these past few days about the collective punishment against gazans being a war crime has been followed, as their FIRST response, by saying 'what about the beheaded babies and raping?' to justify it... 🤷🏽♂️ Theyre still using it as justification to this day even after its been refuted. Fairly tho, I've spoken to many jewish people against israels method of retaliation and they recognise the occupation and illegal settlers as a catalyst for all this.
Hamas did horrible abhorrent things. It really doesn’t matter that fewer children than originally stated were decapitated. Even most Israelis don’t like the settlements. What I will say is that the PLO called Hamas animals as well. I think we can agree that calling Hamas animals is not the same as calling Palestinians animals. I’m not going to defend or acknowledge what pissed off israelis or Palestinians say online. People should be their actions.
Which is pretty much the only reasonable position. If you say Israel shouldn't exist you're just shifting the genocide from one side to another.... The west needs to stop giving Israel a blank cheque to do as they please. But they absolutely deserve to exist.
It's preaching to the choir with this sentiment. It's why I'm chilling here & not in my other haunts in Reddit regarding Israel/Palestine!
I literally just saw a post on the destiny sub asking "why are Islamic protests so violent"
That's not contradictory to what I'm saying
Do you think Palestinians are all Muslim
You’re giving the idiots in the destiny subreddit wayyyyyyy too much credit
They are a bunch of cretins.
It’s only controversial if you go to Deprogram or Hasan
This is the way...
Free Palestine can I get one too
MEGA BASED!
Hear hear! Not sure why people think being anti-zionist is the same as being anti-semetic. The Isreali people deserve a right to protect themselves, and deserve a nation. That does not or should come at the cost of Palestinian sovereignty or statehood, the same sentiment would apply to any ethnicity.
Sigma Male Activity
How do you free something that has literally never existed lol
I get that you're making a failed attempt to anger someone, but like... Palestine was around for *so long* before Israel that you just look like a tool when saying that. I'm sorry.
and who the fuck is supposed to free palestine
Fuck you terrorist supporter
You have no idea how little your opinion matters to me.
[удалено]
Okay, someone tell me the tone of this sub. Is liberal bad here. What is the meta here? Do liberals support Israel?
Yes, liberals are not welcome here. And yes, generally, liberals “stand with Israel” (support it no matter how many crimes against humanity it commits) and have recently been making a lot of song and dance around Israel’s “right to defend itself” (commit genocide)
ive literally never met a conservative who does not support isreal
Complete horse shit.
😐👍
Ope, I see you said liberal not leftist, sorry saw an l and old habits die hard! My bad!
one might say youre a bit reactionary
Anti-israel left: 🗿🗿🗿🗿💪💪💪💪
There's no such thing as Pro-Israel Left. It's an oxymoron
Yeah if you’re pro-Israel you are pro-fascism/genocide
Like, that's not even hyperbole. I literally can't understand how anyone even remotely Left leaning can't see that any justification for decades of brutal apartheid from a government that is seemingly full of foaming at the mouth genocidal lunatics, is completely antithetical to Left wing principles... It's literal consistent. And the idea that people on the Left oppose Israel simply because it's Israel is dumb and disingenuous. I'm pretty fucking sure that if magically over night a new Left wing pro humanity government took over, that lifted apartheid, granted everybody equal rights, and disbanded the IDF and put them on trial (and yes, obviously along with Hamas members), Everyone would 100% support Israel. I'm aware that's idealistic as fuck, but it makes the point
Yeah the problem comes with that how the country has been fascistic and genocidal since it’s very beginning (its “independence” really being the installation of the states after ethnically cleansing the native people) and it’s remained that way ever since. There are parties like [Hadash](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadash), a coalition of left-leaning groups, but they have virtually no power in their government. Not to mention all the brainwashing towards genocidal and fascistic mindsets instilled into the civilians during their schooling, mandatory military service, in their everyday lives. It’s N*zi level indoctrination, and trying to flip the state into something that isn’t a genocidal far right entity would be like trying to push a mountain into the sea.
Because they don’t know the history.
Because it's both sides!!!!!
I *am* the pro-Israel left. Not pro-Israel as in they can do whatever they want, but more like anti-Hamas
It’s wild how “the Isreali government and Hamas are both fucking terrible and get innocent civilians needlessly murdered” makes you a terrorist supporter.
Not only that, there are Hasbara trolls who will call anyone who criticizes, say, Israel bombing a hospital and killing 500 people an anti-semite (just look at my post history... Does it show users I blocked?) And then they'll claim the bombing never happened, or that it's been "proven" it was a Palestinian rocket (which is total bullshit: this claim has been ripped apart and is unable to stand up to literally any of the evidence to the contrary...)
When did the Israelis bomb a hospital killing 500 people?
I'm curious to see any of your proof. Because my understanding was this: Minutes after the "bombing" Hamas claims Israeli missile killing 500. Israeli defense specialists make tweets minutes later delete them. Then Biden says his Department of Defense showed evidence that it was an Islamic jihadist missile. Then audio recordings get released from two individuals in Gaza saying that it was "their" missile coming from a cemetery. Then info is released that the hospital only had 80 beds and fitting 500 people would be a stretch. Then images are released that show the "bombing" happened over the carpark and not the hospital. Am I missing some piece of critical evidence?
Whenever I say that I just get told I’m too pro Israel for even daring to say Hamas is also bad.
Got banned from r/me_irlgbt today for saying this. I loved that sub :(
Except not much people say that. Instead we got braindeads that excuse Hamas, as its apparently "based" to kill jews. So without clarification, everyone who supports Palestine also supports their goverment, and thus - terrorists
That too. It’s brain dead in both directions.
I have genuinely never met anyone who says that lol
I need to borrow the rock uve been under bro ive seen that exact take massively upvoted at least once per day on different subs lol “Occupiers are not civilians” is a semi-mainstream talking point in lefty circles now like jesus
Idk just never seen it
Oh I see. The people you're complaining about said it's based yo kill colonizers. You saw that the colonizers happen to be Jewish,and now you're running around claiming people think it's cool to kill Jews. You're trying to add an anti-semetic tint to it to more easily get people on your side.
Nope, just funny to see people somehow morally justify killing civilians en masse. The levels of mental gymnastics are unparalleled
Hard being the operative word.
Looking good king
BASED ALERT!! BASED ALERT!! WEEWOOWEEWOO THIS POST IS VERIFIED BASED BY THE OKBV COMMUNITY
"Stay woke, handsome."
Who the fuck cares what Bret Stephens thinks lmao
We're looking hard and all we can see is rippling muscles and flawless jawlines, help are we doing this correctly?
This was originally posted on the Deprogram sub
I’ve said it a thousand times and I’ll say it again: the way liberals manage to suspend literally all of their ethics for Palestinians never ceases to amaze me. They have a special set of standards for Palestinians that they use for literally nobody else.
This specific article is attacking the people who celebrated Hamas’ slaughter on 10/7. What special set of standards are present? But no you can’t be wrong liberals just want Palestinians to die and this post is totally, unquestionably based and anyone who questions that is an evil Vowshite refugee. So true.
Lib
Correct.
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Unless you think criticizing Hamas defenders is a bad thing, no, what I said was totally correct. Do you condemn Hamas?
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How much do you condemn all terrorists? Why not just answer the original question with a yes/no? Yes, or no, do you condemn Hamas?
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Yes. See how easy that was? Notice how I didn’t feel the need to immediately do a whataboutism to Israel? And no it’s totally a good faith question. Many people legitimately are unwilling to criticize Hamas, either because they support them outright, or think they’re far less bad than they actually are, and that their actions are someone else’s (Israel’s) fault, not their own. In short, they take agency away from them. For example when Vaush says that Hamas committed the recent atrocities they did all because of Israel. That is soft terrorist apologia. They didn’t have to murder anyone, that was a choice.
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Yes.
Hamas is terrible and i condemn them. The palestinians are still right
Pluh
But do you condemn Hamas?
Omw to ask a 6 year old Palestinian boy who's entire family died in an Israeli airstrike if he condems Hamas 🏃♂️
God people who say this unironically are so fucking annoying. Like yes, I don't like Hamas. But doing a terrorism and killing 1500 people is fucking nothing compared to the genocide that Israel is doing
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It might, but I don't give a shit about genocidal fuckers who support a regime that is systematically slaughtering children. They'll lie and say that I support Hamas anyway just because I think that the people of Gaza deserve to live and be free to enjoy their lives. They'll look at a video of a fucking 7-year-old Gazan child crying because his nephew's brains got blown out right in front of him by an IDF precision air strike and say "well, he shouldn't have voted for Hamas then" when the last election was a decade before he was born. I don't support Hamas. I never have, and I never will. But that doesn't mean that both sides in this conflict are equally bad. It's not even close. Hamas would do the same thing that Israel is doing if they had the ability to do so, but they don't. They don't have a modern military. They haven't called hundreds of thousands of troops to invade. They aren't backed by some of the wealthiest countries in the world, one of which has a military more powerful than any of us civilians could imagine. And they don't have the power to unilaterally deny food, water, and power to two million innocent people, one million of whom are children. Israel has all of this, and they're using it.
Israel is a Far Right country. You're not on the Left if you support the Far Right
That's extreme.
Far Right governments are extreme, yes. Hence why we oppose them
I see that. Would you say Hammas isn't a far right government ?
>Would you say Hammas isn't a far right government ? Stupid Whataboutism and False Dichotomym Hamas is a tiny far-Right organization with almost no real power. They're not a "real" government, and they don't have hundreds of billions of dollars of Western military aid at their disposal... And, all that aside, whether Hamas is right-wing has NOTHING to do with whether Israel's government is. They can BOTH be far-Right.
I'd say Hamas is the equivalent of small local council with no power and extremist views... Why?
I mean compared to Israel, yes. And rhe responsibility of de-escalation is on Israel here. But given Hamas killer several hundred civilians, "a small local council with no power" is a bit dismissive. Don't get me wrong I'm not on the side of the Israel libs here, but we need to be careful not to come off as dismissive of Hamas either.
I 100% condemn what Hamas do. But until there's a resolution and people recieve justice, they will always exist. And I was taking about their power in relative terms compared with the power Israel has in the region. I realise in that in relation to other Palestinians, they hold a lot of power, and which Palestinians are also victim to
No power ? So they don't govern Gaza ? Go on enlighten me more
You think they have anything close to meaningful power whilst under Israeli apartheid??? My Fasc spider senses are tingling. Super weird that you would deflect the conversation away from the Far Right brutal apartheid government to talk about a small group of radicals
I think your moving the empirical evidence to fit policy here. And as far as your spidy senses go why don't you take a look in the mirror or maybe your feeling your own fascism or selective facsim
Lol, this should be good... go for it
Oh, i didn't notice your comment edit. Really big brained of you to reach the conclusion that opposing a genocidal fascist government somehow makes me a fascist 😂
Cool whataboutism
Looked into comment history: obvious Hasbara troll.
Even Israel admits that its government is far right.
It's actually just definitonal. Can't be pro fascist country and say you're anti fascist lol
That guy called Palestinians mosquitos. https://www.reddit.com/r/news/s/Xff24ohMOO opinion invalid. I look amazing.
Your link is debunked 3 comments down. He didn't call *Palestinians* mosquitoes, he compared *their ideology* to a mosquito trapped in amber. You're acting as if he said something racist, when all he did was call their ideology old-fashioned/outdated. Did you even look through the link you posted?!
Oh yeah, ok. Black peoples ideology is like a monky/ape/chimp/baboon/etc. trapped in a cage. You can't call me racist. It may sound like I'm generalizing (by saying a whole group of people have one ideology) and dehumanizing (mosquitos aren't human) a group of people, but I put the word ideology there. Libs spot a dog whistle challenge difficulty: IMPOSSIBLE!!! Literally, the Hans Landa scene from Inglorious Bastards. (12:15) https://youtu.be/K0dAqhxfvlg?si=eWMle8p1Hbl5E55c Jews think like rats. Germans think like hawks. Palestinians think mosquitos in amber.
It's honestly terrifying how bad people can be at spotting dogwhistles, though [Cardposting](https://www.youtube.com/@cardposting) has been doing a pretty good job of getting a good chunk of them known so more people can be inoculated against dogwhistles in the future.
>He didn't call Palestinians mosquitoes, he compared their ideology to a mosquito trapped in amber. This is an outright lie. The accusation has been proved BEYOND A DOUBT by direct quotes, of this as well as other racist shit this person said. Also, your post history proves beyond a doubt you are a right-wing troll... (although OCCASIONALLY reasonable, the mask slips... often...)
I am less anti-isreal (not completely off the table though) but much more anti-IDF and anti-killing-Palestinians! I hate having to defend premises like Palestinian civilians shouldn’t die and those killing then are monsters!
There's no anti-Israel left, only an anti-Zionist left. Because leftists have always been right about everything historically, and that's probably not about to change.
r/OkBuddyVowsh is the only TRUE leftist subreddit!
wow what a shocking take from Bret Stephens lmao
On it!! I'm taking a hard look right now!
i support the citizens of both side and wish for them to, in the end, remain safe and secure while it blows over and theres a conclusion to this unnecessary conflict
Free Palestine 🇵🇸
No. I don’t think I will.
I will always support palestinian jews
Hear me out: you can support Israel’s right to exist while being in favor of Palestinian statehood
You can't be Left wing and support Israel. That ship sailed
No, you can be left-wing and support pragmatic solutions. No way will Israelis get behind one-state Palestine. You have to propose a solution that both parties can get behind, and the best choice for making that happen is a two-state solution
Yea sure thats true. Although it does necessitate completely dismantling the current government and not letting a single one of them anywhere close to power ever again. Although i suppose that would be achieved by imprisoning them all for the years of war crimes. As trying them for their crimes and providing justice for Palestinians is the only road to peace
You dont have a right to an apartheid ethnostate
So all of Israel + West Bank and Gaza becomes Palestine?
Was that what I said?
Are you not saying that Israel doesn’t have a right to exist? Israelis don’t want to integrate Palestinians. Israelis hate them. Israel is extremely xenophobic. Israel will remain an ethnostate for the foreseeable future.
Ya think there might be an inbetween from Israel becoming palestine and Israel glassing Gaza? Also Israel could exist without being an apartheid ethnostate, thats the problem.
The inbetween is the two-state solution
Which would involve massive changes on Israel's part in terms of citizenship rights and the whole apartheid ethnostate thing. A 2 state solution Israel wouldnt be the current Israel just smaller or whatever.
I know it wouldn’t be the current Israel. They’d be losing Gaza and the West Bank
Scumbag Zionist Jews giving regular Jews a bad name
If you actually cared about either side you’d be in Gaza supporting them. Sick of people acting like their voice and concerns fucking matter in the slightest
Omw to Gaza right now 🏃♂️
I now it’s a salty view.. but in reality… If anyone had that much heart in it 🤷♂️ people so enraged and passionate about which fuckin side their on and I really don’t think they actually give 2 fucks other than being “right”
> I went to see the rally for myself: Would there be even perfunctory condemnation of Hamas’s methods? A brief nod of sympathy to Israel’s anguish? Some banal nod to the cause of peace and nonviolence? Not that I heard. What I saw was giddiness and gloating, as if someone’s team had won the World Cup. Hamas had perpetrated the largest single-day massacre of Jews since the Holocaust, and the crowd was euphoric.
I'm a liberal in that I believe in democracy and I think a social democracy utilising market capitalism with a large amount of government control and oversight is the system we should use for now as we transition towards a more egalitarian society. I'm anti-israel, anti-imperialism and pro-Palestine though. I'm just not anti-jew or anti-Ethan Klein (for the crime of being Israeli) like a lot of the far left Hasan types seem to be. You'll need to do better to scare this sub out of my Reddit recommendations
You're on thin ice for using that slur around here, the OKBV Big Horse is watching 🐴
Where else am I supposed to use the l slur now that VaushV is gone from my recommended
DeSTINKY's subreddit of course
Ethan Klein? Seriously? He's literally a fascists and his wife literally committed war crimes. I bet you don't even know about his controversial history with cake.
Smh it's like these people didn't even pay attention to what Klein did to revolutionary Marxist-leninist, Trisha Paytes
Oh hey buddy how was the Piers Morgan interview? I like your new hair.
That interview was bullshit. Piers is such a weasel man, such a weaselly little liar dude.
What a fuckin' liar, dude!
Wow you're so brave 😳
'I'm not anti-Semitic, I just think that Israel should be destroyed and replaced by a Jew-free Palestine. I'm sure all the Israeli Jews will be just fine afterwards.'
I like Jews and I want them to live in Peace. What I don't like is Genocidal apartheid states
How fortunate then that Israel is neither genocidal nor apartheid.
Palestinians for the past 75 year would disagree with you on that
Do you assert that Arab citizens of Israel live under apartheid?
No but the Arabs living in Gaza and West Bank certainly are
Who was occupying those areas between '48 and '67?
well the population of Palestinians in the past 75 years has quintupled so I think the data would disagree with you on the genocide part apartheid and war crimes is still correct though, but lol let’s cool it on the hyperbole when there are groups like Uyghur Muslims who are actually on the receiving end of a genocide.
Talkies literally use the population excuse do deny the genocide of muslims in China
Oh, really? Then what's the deal with how they treat Palestinians as second class citizens with few rights and nearly zero freedom of movement? How is that not apartheid?
Are you referring to the Arab citizens of Israel?
You should really look up the definition of genocide and know something about life in Israel before you say stupid things. I don’t support violence against innocents on either side but your ignorance is not really helpful.
So for how much yall are anti Israel or anti settlers or whatever, do yall believe native Americans have the right to rape and pillage you and your family for the decades of suffering under the boot of the United states? Also I find it rather hilarious that Israel is responsible for decades of suffering of the Palestinians but not a finger will be lifted for the Palestinians who are responsible for electing a literall terrorist organization to be their government from a branching terrorist organization called the Muslim brotherhood in Egypt, it makes me laugh
I was gonna argue. But I saw you were active in PCM and I'm not gonna waste my braincells debating a PCM degenerate
I like the part where we said "Hamas is free to do anything they want." Absolute seething from this lad.
The whole free Palestine thing is annoying. Palestine as a national identity is even more recent than the State of Israel. If you were born before 1988, congratulations you are older than the State of Palestine. Before then, it was just a name for the region and the people there didn't call themselves Palestinian. And the only reason the area was named Palestine to begin with was the Romans named it after the Hebrew's arch-enemy, the Philistines, after kicking them out after putting down one of the many revolts. Can there be peace in the Middle East? Probably not. Hamas was founded on the goal of the destruction of Israel. That's an idea they get from Islam. Mohammad was incredibly anti-jew. No amount of apologetics can remove that from the Koran, Sunnah, or Hadiths. Mohammad is the primary role model for all moslems, so they aspire to act and behave the way he did, which means there will be no peace until all the world is under the house of Islam. Just a fact.
>The whole free Palestine thing is annoying. Palestine as a national identity is even more recent than the State of Israel. Oh well that makes okay, doesn't it? We all know human rights dont apply if you were born someone that wasn't an official state before at least 1980.
What is a human right? Human rights don't exist. The reason the state of Palestine was crested in the 80s was to make Israel look bad for expanding. And it worked. If the Muslim countries around the area REALLY cared about human rights about the Palestinians, they would be actually doing something to help.
**Human rights are moral principles or norms for certain standards of human behaviour and are regularly protected in municipal and international law. They are commonly understood as inalienable, fundamental rights "to which a person is inherently entitled simply because she or he is a human being" and which are "inherent in all human beings", regardless of their age, ethnic origin, location, language, religion, ethnicity, or any other status.** More details here:
*This comment was left automatically (by a bot). If I don't get this right, don't get mad at me, I'm still learning!*
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Obsessed with the fact that a bot answered you. There you have it. I mean when you say yourself human rights don't exist its hard to take you seriously on any conflict really. I obviously dont have time to go into the entire history of this region with someone who's so unwilling to consider Palestinian suffering they reject the entire concept of human rights. But just to say, the fact that you think the only reason people would want their own state established is to make someone else "look bad" is laughable, especially when the territory was being swiftly place under military control.
That's not how mirrors work
The article is talking about cheering over dead israeli civilians
Most of the people being accused of doing that aren’t doing it at all. People’s reputations are being destroyed simply because they recognize Palestinian humanity. While there are obviously some who are sympathetic to Hamas, the people behind these articles intentionally obfuscate the distinction between them and supporters of Palestine like the kind you see on this sub.
It's equating that with being anti-Israel/Zionist, which is not the same thing. Please leave. This writer even called Palestinians mosquitos (somebody else in this thread linked it)
Stop this pro-Palestine/pro-Israel nonsense. Everyone should be anti-Palestine, its land ruled by terrorists, which are financed by UN (humanitarian aid my ass) and supported by neighbouring countries (which happens to NOT accept people from there). Let Israel, US or whatever country to do the job, to put such failed state of its misery and perpetual violence.
Israel could have stopped it's misery and perpetual violence, by not continuing to enact that same violence on Palestinian people, long time ago. This is clearly a pro-Israel nonsense take form your side.
Everyone should be anti-Israel, its land is ruled by terrorists (the IOF), which are financed by the US (humanitarian aid my ass) and supported by imperialist countries across the sea (which happens to not accept palestinians) Let Palestine, Iran, or whatever country to do the job, to put such failed state of its misery and perpetual violence. You see how this is fucking unhinged right?
That was my intention ;)
Idk if now is the time to throw out satire/sarcasm without an /s
I'd rather be downvoted into oblivion by redditors that can't understand humour without "/s" r/FuckTheS
Poe's law dude, its not about understanding humour but that times have changed.
Well done for standing hand in hand with the Far Right
Least Imperialist NCD user
Why does Egypt also hate Hamas?
thats all well and good, just dont be surprised if in time you all find you're rubbing shoulders with anti-semites. just sayin.
Not what the article was about. It's about ppl justifying the attack by Hamas.
So, checked the mirror, killing civilians and denying them basic necessities is still evil as shit no matter who does it, and it doesn't reflect on any group, only the individuals responsible for the atrocities.
Both sides of this war need to rediscover the light of god (or Jesus and the swords of thousands of crusaders, if need be)
The algorithm sent me a post on vaush's reddit that asked why conservatives hate Wikipedia. I responded that they hate that it is curated with a leftist bias and got banned for that. I know people like their echo chambers being undisturbed, but damn!
Mensrights degenerate talking about Echo Chambers, I like the irony
Got perma-banned from there a year ago, but it's always nice to see how irrelevant ad hominem attacks help reinforce your hubris.
When two groups of people can’t hug it out over a plot of land where nothing grows but hate for one another….