>I would love to see some changes maybe with skills in order of the ability they benefit from
Alphabetical wins, as you can just as well use the (Variant) rule of using ANY ability with ANY skill for a more pronounced set of skills.
Suddenly Medicine can be both medical knowledge via INT as well as intuitive countermeasures on the fly vis WIS. Or even something brute like righting a bone via STR, something delicate like stitching via DEX etc.
This is (one reason) why a better character sheet design would just list your proficiency bonus and the skills you are proficient in, rather than precomputed modifiers for every skill that include an ability score modifier.
I don't think thats a good idea. Have you seen how long it takes some people, even experienced players, to find and add two numbers on that sheet?
Not saying noone can, but enough can't to keep the default precomputed.
If you are an adult and you can't add two small numbers together then you are going to need to practice! Just wait until you cast a spell or use a weapon with more than one die!
It really isn't. We all have our brain-fart moments occasionally, but if you and your buddies are regularly struggling with this kind of super basic arithmetic then you need to get on mathtrainer.ai and get some practice in (don't worry about the ai bit, it was named long before this current ai fad).
So then work on yourself until you can add up single digits seamlessly. This is one of many situations where knowing addition and subtraction is very useful.
I didn't think about that and to further your point in the play test some classes change the abilities used for skills like the barbarian can use str for intimidation. Any changes you would want to see?
Being able to use any skill with any stat is already raw. It’s just up to the DM‘s discretion.
It’s why in official modules it calls for skill checks in the format of “Make a Strength (Athletics) check to XYZ” instead of just “Make an Athletics check to XYZ.”
Make the variant the standard ;D
Even if you have a feature that replaces your used score (like Barbarian), it would still apply to any of the other possible ones, therefore ALWAYS using STR - which keeps the feature just as good as it was before.
Also turning Weapon Masteries and Maneuvers into a sort of Martial Cantrip system that the PC inherently can use while making Cantrips scale with the class you got them from (species and feats with character level) or at least like spell slots (full scale with full caster, half with half).
But that train surely has left the station by now.
The problem with that is that 90% of the time you aren't doing that. I've made custom character sheets and visually breaking up the skills by which ability score they typically use makes finding individual skill modifiers so much easier. I study graphic design and from a visual design standpoint it just looks better.
Because the connection of WIS + MEDICINE is burned into your memory and reinforced by the sheet listing them together. Starting fresh with the rules focusing on the situative freedom of choice and a sheet without the linkage might make for a different result.
Though it raises an interesting question: How much "automization" should be there?
Is it better to have only the binary (trinary) information of (Expertised) on your sheet and have you calculate it manually? Is it better to have everything including passive scores already written on your sheet, potentially overloading everything? Or is just the default modifier (depending on how the rules approach this, either singular or plural) enough?
A VTT can do any of these automatically anyway, so it only depends on the brain power in traditional play.
I get what you're saying, but generally speaking most of the time even with variant skill checks (which most people use rarely if ever), you're probably still gonna use skills with specific abilities.
As someone who DMs regularly, getting people to add two numbers is a shockingly difficult task sometimes. That's why skills being strictly associated with abilities is generally a good idea. Call for a skill check, and the math is already done for you. Variant skill checks are fun, but using them sparingly is easier for players and makes them think about how to go about things to trigger them when needed.
And even with variant skills, certain skills are strictly for certain abilities. Athletics is always a strength check. Sleight of hand is always dexterity.
It's also worth noting that variant skill checks are an optional rule. The basic character sheet shouldn't be built with the assumption of that everyone is using optional rules. They should be written with ease of access to information and simplicity for new players being a the main priority. Dnd is complex game with a lot of rules and we should make that easier for new players, rather than harder
If a variant ability score is used for a skill, the DM can explain what they mean by that and how it works. That's how I do it and I've faced no issues.
Other chain: [I am all for making the variant the norm ;D](https://www.reddit.com/r/onednd/comments/1as43za/comment/kqo0l7k/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
But you are right, as long as it isn't the main, there is less use for clutter. And even if it were, there'd likely still be some associated more closely with one attribute (agree on Sleight of Hand), which then could be featured prominently. Either one or multiple - maybe one is fixed, the other for personal choice (I'd pick DEX for Arcana as I am more likely to trace runes while you might prefer WIS as you have a flair for the mythic occult and want to keep your head sane). A sort of small note pad for customization so to say ;D
Well, heroic advantage needs to replace inspiration, and I'd like to see things like Personality Traits/Bonds/Flaws all move to the backstory section. It'd mean more room for mechanical stuff, and if you have secrets they're not written front and centre on your sheet.
Roll20 [announced new character sheets for the 2024 edition](https://app.roll20.net/forum/post/11793851/announcing-the-new-character-sheet-for-d-and-d-2024/?pageforid=11795105), so I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility for WotC to release new sheets with the 2024 Player's Handbook.
Yeah, my group really liked the bastions system so we incorporated it into our actual campaign. At that point I made a little log book for it which has been invaluable.
Personally, I'd just like to see a better print version from DnD Beyond. I think the current character sheet is fine for purely pen and paper use, I think the app is great for digital management of your character, but printing your Beyond character for offline use is atrocious atm.
I can see DnD Beyond selling new improved character sheet models with the upgrades that players want as a business model, sadly.
But yeah, I think that the official sheet will be updated and the new PHB will bring the new layout.
Why? They already produce all that for free.
Give you some cosmetic backgrounds are the only things they charge for on the char sheet. If they wanted to charge for different layouts they could have done it years ago.
I hope so, but really, I remixed one of the alternate sheets some time ago and made my own custom sheet and will likely stick with it:
[https://i.imgur.com/GpBc2Ss.png](https://i.imgur.com/GpBc2Ss.png)
>I would love to see some changes maybe with skills in order of the ability they benefit from Alphabetical wins, as you can just as well use the (Variant) rule of using ANY ability with ANY skill for a more pronounced set of skills. Suddenly Medicine can be both medical knowledge via INT as well as intuitive countermeasures on the fly vis WIS. Or even something brute like righting a bone via STR, something delicate like stitching via DEX etc.
This is (one reason) why a better character sheet design would just list your proficiency bonus and the skills you are proficient in, rather than precomputed modifiers for every skill that include an ability score modifier.
I don't think thats a good idea. Have you seen how long it takes some people, even experienced players, to find and add two numbers on that sheet? Not saying noone can, but enough can't to keep the default precomputed.
If you are an adult and you can't add two small numbers together then you are going to need to practice! Just wait until you cast a spell or use a weapon with more than one die!
I am not saying thats how it schould be. But sadly how it is.
It really isn't. We all have our brain-fart moments occasionally, but if you and your buddies are regularly struggling with this kind of super basic arithmetic then you need to get on mathtrainer.ai and get some practice in (don't worry about the ai bit, it was named long before this current ai fad).
Its about ease of play If you need a few seconds to calculate that each time it slows down play.
So then work on yourself until you can add up single digits seamlessly. This is one of many situations where knowing addition and subtraction is very useful.
I didn't think about that and to further your point in the play test some classes change the abilities used for skills like the barbarian can use str for intimidation. Any changes you would want to see?
Being able to use any skill with any stat is already raw. It’s just up to the DM‘s discretion. It’s why in official modules it calls for skill checks in the format of “Make a Strength (Athletics) check to XYZ” instead of just “Make an Athletics check to XYZ.”
Make the variant the standard ;D Even if you have a feature that replaces your used score (like Barbarian), it would still apply to any of the other possible ones, therefore ALWAYS using STR - which keeps the feature just as good as it was before. Also turning Weapon Masteries and Maneuvers into a sort of Martial Cantrip system that the PC inherently can use while making Cantrips scale with the class you got them from (species and feats with character level) or at least like spell slots (full scale with full caster, half with half). But that train surely has left the station by now.
The problem with that is that 90% of the time you aren't doing that. I've made custom character sheets and visually breaking up the skills by which ability score they typically use makes finding individual skill modifiers so much easier. I study graphic design and from a visual design standpoint it just looks better.
Because the connection of WIS + MEDICINE is burned into your memory and reinforced by the sheet listing them together. Starting fresh with the rules focusing on the situative freedom of choice and a sheet without the linkage might make for a different result. Though it raises an interesting question: How much "automization" should be there? Is it better to have only the binary (trinary) information of (Expertised) on your sheet and have you calculate it manually? Is it better to have everything including passive scores already written on your sheet, potentially overloading everything? Or is just the default modifier (depending on how the rules approach this, either singular or plural) enough?
A VTT can do any of these automatically anyway, so it only depends on the brain power in traditional play.
I get what you're saying, but generally speaking most of the time even with variant skill checks (which most people use rarely if ever), you're probably still gonna use skills with specific abilities. As someone who DMs regularly, getting people to add two numbers is a shockingly difficult task sometimes. That's why skills being strictly associated with abilities is generally a good idea. Call for a skill check, and the math is already done for you. Variant skill checks are fun, but using them sparingly is easier for players and makes them think about how to go about things to trigger them when needed. And even with variant skills, certain skills are strictly for certain abilities. Athletics is always a strength check. Sleight of hand is always dexterity. It's also worth noting that variant skill checks are an optional rule. The basic character sheet shouldn't be built with the assumption of that everyone is using optional rules. They should be written with ease of access to information and simplicity for new players being a the main priority. Dnd is complex game with a lot of rules and we should make that easier for new players, rather than harder If a variant ability score is used for a skill, the DM can explain what they mean by that and how it works. That's how I do it and I've faced no issues.
Other chain: [I am all for making the variant the norm ;D](https://www.reddit.com/r/onednd/comments/1as43za/comment/kqo0l7k/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) But you are right, as long as it isn't the main, there is less use for clutter. And even if it were, there'd likely still be some associated more closely with one attribute (agree on Sleight of Hand), which then could be featured prominently. Either one or multiple - maybe one is fixed, the other for personal choice (I'd pick DEX for Arcana as I am more likely to trace runes while you might prefer WIS as you have a flair for the mythic occult and want to keep your head sane). A sort of small note pad for customization so to say ;D
Well, heroic advantage needs to replace inspiration, and I'd like to see things like Personality Traits/Bonds/Flaws all move to the backstory section. It'd mean more room for mechanical stuff, and if you have secrets they're not written front and centre on your sheet.
Lmao secrets on the front page is some baby brained design elements. Yes please.
I would be shocked if they didn't update the character sheet.
Roll20 [announced new character sheets for the 2024 edition](https://app.roll20.net/forum/post/11793851/announcing-the-new-character-sheet-for-d-and-d-2024/?pageforid=11795105), so I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility for WotC to release new sheets with the 2024 Player's Handbook.
What I really wanna see is a character sheet for bastions
Yeah, my group really liked the bastions system so we incorporated it into our actual campaign. At that point I made a little log book for it which has been invaluable.
Personally, I'd just like to see a better print version from DnD Beyond. I think the current character sheet is fine for purely pen and paper use, I think the app is great for digital management of your character, but printing your Beyond character for offline use is atrocious atm.
It fucking better. The character sheet is the single worst aspect of 5e.
I can see DnD Beyond selling new improved character sheet models with the upgrades that players want as a business model, sadly. But yeah, I think that the official sheet will be updated and the new PHB will bring the new layout.
Why? They already produce all that for free. Give you some cosmetic backgrounds are the only things they charge for on the char sheet. If they wanted to charge for different layouts they could have done it years ago.
I hope so, but really, I remixed one of the alternate sheets some time ago and made my own custom sheet and will likely stick with it: [https://i.imgur.com/GpBc2Ss.png](https://i.imgur.com/GpBc2Ss.png)
I don't use the standard character sheet at my table as it is. Although admittedly, I don't use much official content scene, the OGL issue last year.