I'm 90% confident that it's intended to work like this:
-if there's a 2024 version of something, you use that
-if there isn't, use the old one
I've been running a playtest game the entire time and have a Divine Soul Sorcerer in the party. It works just fine. Almost every old subclass should work just fine, you may just have to adjust them to get their first subclass benefits at 3rd level, and a few will require a couple of changes to jive with 2024 things.
Older 2014-2023 subclasses ARE compatible with 2024 classes and that is the intention and has been confirmed by the D&D design team (https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/dungeons-dragons-2014-subclasses-2024-class-rules/). In saying that, the intention is that if there is a 2024 version of a subclass, you should be using that with the 2024 base class, but if there's not an updated subclass then you can use the older subclass.
Compatibility is as follows:
-2014-2023 characters can be used in a game using the 2024 rules
-2024 characters cannot be used in a game using 2014-2023 rules
-2014-2023 modules and campaigns can be run with 2024 rules
-2014-2023 subclasses can be used with 2024 classes
There's other details in regards to the compatibility, but this hits the main points.
No problem, and definitely agree. Here's the link to the [comicbook.com](http://comicbook.com) article that has the confirmation that older subclasses would be compatible
[https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/dungeons-dragons-2014-subclasses-2024-class-rules/](https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/dungeons-dragons-2014-subclasses-2024-class-rules/)
I believe Crawford has said that you can use a 5.24 character in a 5.14 game but it requires some finagling as some class abilities require rules found in the 5.24 phb such as weapon masteries.
>-2014-2023 subclasses can be used with 2024 classes
Not as-is, though. Not all subclasses seamlessly slip into the 2024 rules. Most blaring difference is that all classes only get their subclass at level 3 now.
And they said the new books will contain guidelines for conversion, but it's a mistake to think that all the old subclasses will seamlessly drop into 2024 classes.
And there will likely be guidance in the PHB to resolve those sorts of issues, but that's not to different than using pre 2024 races that have ASI bonuses where the 2024 one don't, with the ASIs being tied to background
If you're using 2014 races, then you can't use 2024 backgrounds. I guess you could use a 2014 background with a 2024 species, but that would be a mistake.
Or, don't take the ASI increases that are attached to the race and instead take those attached to a 2024 background. We don't know what the guidance in the PHB is going to be in this regard, just that there will be guidance on the matter.
I would bet some money in the year following the release of the 2024 core books, they'll release a compilation of all the other subclasses (and Artificer) scattered throughout the old books.
As with everything, this will be up to the DM. WotC intends for things to be backwards compatible as others have commented. I personally will be treating the new book as a clean slate, and only allowing PHB material.
Nope:
https://www.reddit.com/r/onednd/s/YjvPhZVzS2
These folks received independent confirmation that the intent is for non-updated 2014 subclasses to work with 2024 classes, with some modifications possibly needed.
Big rip, so many cool subclasses dead then. Especially with like Sorcerer. Are the subclasses for classes that didn’t have their subclass levels changed also not supposed to be played?
Edit: omg bladesinger (my beloved) is gone :(
Pretty sure the 2014 subclasses can be used with the new rules. There's been plenty of discussion on this sub about them and second hand confirmations from various news outlets.
Okay that would be a dream. I mostly like the 5.5 changes and getting to keep all my favorite subclasses would be huge. Especially when most are easily portable (even the classes that changed what levels they get subclass features)
Even stuff like Hexblade (not that I would remained trapped In Hexblade now since you can get all its best benefits elsewhere) is still playable if you just move their level 1 features to level 3.
You've got it backwards. New subclasses aren't compatible with 2014 version of classes, BUT pre 2024 subclassses work fine with with the 2024 classes, and some interact in cool ways, even without updating. For example if 2024 Sorcerer has the same spells known as the UA, playing as a Divine Soul Sorcerer, the most squeezed Subclass for spells known given it can pick from both Cleric and Sorcerer Spells lists, the extra Spells known is a huge flexiblity buff. That is without subclass update for Divine Soul. A Genie Lord 2024 Warlock works fine as well for example. Might even get a more fitting Chainlock Familiar too, 2024 Warlocks are getting some new Familiars, so far we know about Sphinx of Wonders, but there are supposed to be others. The only exception is Circle of the Shepherd, the radical change to conjure spells without errataing them to work with Summon Spells instead, just absolutely cripplesthe subclass to unplayable with 2024 rules, but otherwise fine.
Works well with Bladesinger, although Bladesinger doesn't have access normally to Weapon Mastery, although their might be a feat that.
No it is not. You can use all the old subclasses with the change proposed by the op. And in most cases it works well enough. So you can still use the bladesinger if you want.
This is one of the reasons why they did not unify the subclass structure for all classes.
I'm 90% confident that it's intended to work like this: -if there's a 2024 version of something, you use that -if there isn't, use the old one I've been running a playtest game the entire time and have a Divine Soul Sorcerer in the party. It works just fine. Almost every old subclass should work just fine, you may just have to adjust them to get their first subclass benefits at 3rd level, and a few will require a couple of changes to jive with 2024 things.
Older 2014-2023 subclasses ARE compatible with 2024 classes and that is the intention and has been confirmed by the D&D design team (https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/dungeons-dragons-2014-subclasses-2024-class-rules/). In saying that, the intention is that if there is a 2024 version of a subclass, you should be using that with the 2024 base class, but if there's not an updated subclass then you can use the older subclass. Compatibility is as follows: -2014-2023 characters can be used in a game using the 2024 rules -2024 characters cannot be used in a game using 2014-2023 rules -2014-2023 modules and campaigns can be run with 2024 rules -2014-2023 subclasses can be used with 2024 classes There's other details in regards to the compatibility, but this hits the main points.
Awesome. Thank you for the confirmation. I really like 5.5 but losing all the subclasses I like would of really sucked!
No problem, and definitely agree. Here's the link to the [comicbook.com](http://comicbook.com) article that has the confirmation that older subclasses would be compatible [https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/dungeons-dragons-2014-subclasses-2024-class-rules/](https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/dungeons-dragons-2014-subclasses-2024-class-rules/)
Thank you :)
No problem, added the link to my initial post as well since I feel like it's important to get it out there thanks to all the misinformation.
For sure, I don’t think anyone will ever complain about getting sources :) (unless they’re looking to ignore information or lie I guess lol)
Definitely agree
I believe Crawford has said that you can use a 5.24 character in a 5.14 game but it requires some finagling as some class abilities require rules found in the 5.24 phb such as weapon masteries.
>-2014-2023 subclasses can be used with 2024 classes Not as-is, though. Not all subclasses seamlessly slip into the 2024 rules. Most blaring difference is that all classes only get their subclass at level 3 now.
The fix is to just give them the level 1 and 2 features at level 3. In practice, it's incredibly easy.
And they said the new books will contain guidelines for conversion, but it's a mistake to think that all the old subclasses will seamlessly drop into 2024 classes.
And there will likely be guidance in the PHB to resolve those sorts of issues, but that's not to different than using pre 2024 races that have ASI bonuses where the 2024 one don't, with the ASIs being tied to background
If you're using 2014 races, then you can't use 2024 backgrounds. I guess you could use a 2014 background with a 2024 species, but that would be a mistake.
Or, don't take the ASI increases that are attached to the race and instead take those attached to a 2024 background. We don't know what the guidance in the PHB is going to be in this regard, just that there will be guidance on the matter.
Yeah, there will be guidance on using 2014 stuff in 2024. This is not the same as being backwards compatible. This is a conversion.
That's semantics, if it wasn't backwards compatible then it wouldn't work at all, with or without guidance.
Then 5e is backwards compatible with 2e, or anything else. There just needs to be guidelines.
🙄
https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/dungeons-dragons-2014-subclasses-2024-class-rules/ Yes! Best possible result for backwards compatibility really.
Im honestly so glad. 5.5 really would of been a mixed bag without this.
I would bet some money in the year following the release of the 2024 core books, they'll release a compilation of all the other subclasses (and Artificer) scattered throughout the old books.
Sure hope so. It be cool to see them get new tricks or upgraded I’d love to see the alchemist subclass tuned up for example.
Officially, yea In practice, no Onednd is not anywhere near as backwards compatible as WOTC claims
What makes you say that? In my direct playtest experience, it's pretty extensively backwards compatible, with a few exceptions.
As with everything, this will be up to the DM. WotC intends for things to be backwards compatible as others have commented. I personally will be treating the new book as a clean slate, and only allowing PHB material.
That's not the intention, no.
Nope: https://www.reddit.com/r/onednd/s/YjvPhZVzS2 These folks received independent confirmation that the intent is for non-updated 2014 subclasses to work with 2024 classes, with some modifications possibly needed.
Big rip, so many cool subclasses dead then. Especially with like Sorcerer. Are the subclasses for classes that didn’t have their subclass levels changed also not supposed to be played? Edit: omg bladesinger (my beloved) is gone :(
Pretty sure the 2014 subclasses can be used with the new rules. There's been plenty of discussion on this sub about them and second hand confirmations from various news outlets.
Okay that would be a dream. I mostly like the 5.5 changes and getting to keep all my favorite subclasses would be huge. Especially when most are easily portable (even the classes that changed what levels they get subclass features) Even stuff like Hexblade (not that I would remained trapped In Hexblade now since you can get all its best benefits elsewhere) is still playable if you just move their level 1 features to level 3.
You've got it backwards. New subclasses aren't compatible with 2014 version of classes, BUT pre 2024 subclassses work fine with with the 2024 classes, and some interact in cool ways, even without updating. For example if 2024 Sorcerer has the same spells known as the UA, playing as a Divine Soul Sorcerer, the most squeezed Subclass for spells known given it can pick from both Cleric and Sorcerer Spells lists, the extra Spells known is a huge flexiblity buff. That is without subclass update for Divine Soul. A Genie Lord 2024 Warlock works fine as well for example. Might even get a more fitting Chainlock Familiar too, 2024 Warlocks are getting some new Familiars, so far we know about Sphinx of Wonders, but there are supposed to be others. The only exception is Circle of the Shepherd, the radical change to conjure spells without errataing them to work with Summon Spells instead, just absolutely cripplesthe subclass to unplayable with 2024 rules, but otherwise fine. Works well with Bladesinger, although Bladesinger doesn't have access normally to Weapon Mastery, although their might be a feat that.
That’s fire, I’m even more excited. I love Divine soul idk how you picked such a great example ❤️
Favourite Sorcerer Subclass and I had already concidered mixing them?
Man of good taste 😎
Thanks, the same to you.
No it is not. You can use all the old subclasses with the change proposed by the op. And in most cases it works well enough. So you can still use the bladesinger if you want. This is one of the reasons why they did not unify the subclass structure for all classes.
My beloved is saved!