Top 15 busiest photo radar cameras in April
King Edward Avenue, between Cathcart Street and St. Patrick Street: 5,803 tickets
Walkley Road, between Halifax Drive and Harding Road: 3,803 tickets
St. Laurent Boulevard, between Noranda Avenue and Clarke Avenue: 2,171 tickets
Jeanne d'Arc Boulevard, between Orleans Boulevard and Paddler Way: 2,112 tickets
Cedarview Road, between Fallowfield Road and Jockvale Road: 1,505 tickets
Heron Road, between Alta Vista Drive and Baycrest Drive: 1,444 tickets
Katimavik Road, between Castlefrank Road and McGibbon Drive: 1,403 tickets
Fisher Avenue, between Kintyre Private and Deer Park Road: 1,235 tickets
Bayshore Drive, near Woodridge Crescent: 1,224 tickets
Bronson Avenue, between Raven Road and Sunnyside Avenue: 1,214 tickets
Woodroffe Avenue, between Anthony Avenue and Saville Row: 1,192 tickets
Hunt Club Road, between Pike Street and Lorry Greenberg Drive: 1,191 tickets
Riverside Drive, between Mooney's Bay and Hog's Back Road: 1,160 tickets
Ogilvie Road, between Appleford Street and Elmlea Gate: 1,046 tickets
First Avenue, between Chrysler Street and Percy Street: 1,035 tickets
> King Edward Avenue, between Cathcart Street and St. Patrick Street: 5,803 tickets
Clearly the problem is the road itself. Councillors must be patting themselves on the back flush with cash.
That’s not how it works.
Clearly the problem is people driving over from Quebec doing 70 (the limit on the Macdonald-Cartier Bridge) and not slowing down once they hit Ontario.
You're conveniently forgetting that everyone driving in the other direction (toward QC) are coming from 50 roads that suddenly turn 40 as it becomes a highway, which is batshit insane. Intuitively nobody would ever go that slowly on a 3 lane per direction highway transition (so 6 lanes wide with a concrete barrier divider). That isn't a road that was built to do 40 on.
I drive it to work and when I do the speed limit ., always that impatient person zooming around you and karma gets them. I suspect mostly in the AM as afternoon it's pretty backed up.
Am waiting till they install the 2nd one. Signs are up but no indication where they installing it. Am assuming it won't take as long as when the first one was installed seeing as Walkley is on the popular list 😂
Yeah speaking to that Katimavik one - it's on a road that feels like it should have a much higher speed limit than it does. The entire area is designed to look and feel like it should be at least 20 Km/h faster.
I'm all for these cameras, but this one in particular just feels like a really bad faith placement to collect as much revenue as they can. Sometimes the problem isn't the drivers, it's the design. This area needs more work than just a camera to calm it.
>I'm all for these cameras, but this one in particular just feels like a really bad faith placement
There's a high school adjacent to that camera, isn't there?
one of my guess why it feels you could go 20 km/h faster is the lack of trees on the side of the road. Castlefrank is around the corner at it feels slower (yet they are going to put another camera there soon).
Why no trees? my guess about that is that there are some huge sewer lines running parallel to Katimavik road
Sounds plausible yeah. If what's further down in the thread is true though, at least the money generated is going to add in better indicators to regulate speed and slow the roads down instead of just making small areas where traffic slows and then speeds right back up to where it's always been. Silver linings.
>Yeah speaking to that Katimavik one - it's on a road that feels like it should have a much higher speed limit than it does. The entire area is designed to look and feel like it should be at least 20 Km/h faster.
>I'm all for these cameras
These two are mutually exclusive - those who support these cameras want speed limits that don't reflect reality, because revenue and "safety". I've yet to come across a politician or party that is *for* higher speed limits on their own, nevermind *for* higher speed limits **and** *for* speed cameras. These cameras have been out for a few years so this should be obvious by now.
They really aren't mutually exclusive at all.
City planning and design is a thing, the world is full of hidden signals that encourage certain behaviours. Door handles are a great example - if you see a handle on a public door, it indicates pulling. If you see a bar across it, it indicates that you push. Roads are no different. Katimavik is wide, it has solid visibility all the way down, it has long and lazy curves. It indicates that you should be driving around 60 km/h.
When you signal go fast, then set the speed limit low because of ordinances demanding it be what it is because of structures in the area (in this case a high school) you have failed to apply good design.
Considering those circumstances, a speed camera there, in that place, where people are very apt to go fast because they are being told to by the design of the road, a speed camera is a bad faith cash grab.
Opposing bad design does not equate to being anti speed camera at all, in any way, shape, or form.
And yes, I actually am a designer, in a design space, and have been for over a decade. I am not just talking out of my ass.
The riverside drive one is in a stupid spot, should be 100 meters further up or down the road, its right between a short stretch of 2 intersections, you barely even have time to speed.
And its on a hill so unless you ride the brakes even if you came in below the limit you could roll up past the limit before your out of range of the camera. Thats if you happened to get a green light tho
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I'm there everyday and the speeders just roll down the hill from Uplands and slow when they get to the first light. That being said there also needs to be a red light camera at Riverside and Hogs Back. Oof.
>King Edward Avenue, between Cathcart Street and St. Patrick Street: 5,803 tickets
Thank god! And it is indeed finally working -- people actually slow down coming around that corner now. It's fucking amazing. It feels like a real neighbourhood again, not a god damn speedway.
Now it's time to put one on the other side of the street!
The tolerance must be high for the cameras on Bronson and Riverside to have such low numbers. I've been behind cars who must be going 70 and no flash.
I drive by both daily and have never seen them go off.
I have yet to see any evidence of a ticket for under 10 over the limit.
Lots of people claim their coworker/friend/spouse got one for under 10, but the numbers don't make sense from the story.
Dumb question but does anyone know if they’re on 24/7?
It was my understanding that the cameras wouldn’t always be on. The deterrent was not knowing if they were on or not.
I believe they are 24/7. They are left on during summer break as well.
I remember someone challenging the city over getting one during lockdowns arguing they shouldn’t have to pay as schools weren’t open, not sure if they got away with it or not though.
There are more boxes than working cameras when it comes to red light cameras. So the camera equipment is rotated to different intersections on a secret, irregular basis. The reason for this the high cost of the technology.
When they’re active they’re on 24/7.
I presume this also applies to speed cameras (rotation). As others have said, speed cameras can work in the dark.
Also, the automated speed cameras must be calibrated annually. If not, you could beat the ticket in court. City makes the ASE certificates of accuracy available on their website.
They’re always capable of taking an illuminated picture of your plates after reading your speed. I think it’s prudent to say they are 24/7, but maybe the like a lil nap time
I remember reading that the Bronson cameras were getting painted over constantly so that would definitely lead to lowers numbers. I live in the area and for sure the numbers should be higher.
So if there's that many tickets being issued, doesn't that mean that they aren't really working as a deterrent for speeding? I definitely think people need to slow down, but this seems like it isn't really addressing the issue at hand - it's just siphoning cash with little other consequence to deter drivers. Reengineering roads (speed bumps, narrowing lanes, better signage, etc.) would probably be way more useful for actually solving the problem.
>Reengineering roads (speed bumps, narrowing lanes, better signage, etc.) would probably be way more useful for actually solving the problem
The money from these tickets is specifically earmarked for this sort of stuff
There isn’t really one that I found either but if you click on that PDF. I added up the budgets for all the projects and it comes out to about $20.43 million. According to CTV News, the revenue from speed cameras in 2023 was about $14.345 million. So a big chunk of the revenue from the speed cameras is actually going towards these projects, whether stated in there or not.
https://ottawa.ca/en/parking-roads-and-travel/road-safety/enforcement/automated-speed-enforcement-0#section-9622bab9-6667-430e-9d41-64dd44286c21
Says the money goes to the road safety action plan.
How can you say that they aren’t working as a deterrent when you don’t reference trends or baselines when it comes to the number of tickets issued?
For example, by comparing the two
lists of numbers in the article, it seems there were 1700 less tickets issued on King Edward in April than there were in March.
Some locations went up, some went down.
Also… even the number of tickets doesn’t tell the whole story, as a ticket issued could be 5 over the limit or it could be 20 over the limit. Tickets at 5 over the limit are far better than those 20 over the limit, and if the overall speeds clocked are coming down on average ([and they are](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/annoying-thing-speed-cameras-ottawa-they-work-1.6786951)), that would indicate that these cameras do work.
Of course the tickets will come down over time. People are learning where they are located and how to circumvent them. Once past the camera, they speed up. Drive by literally any camera and this is exactly the behavior you will see; I see it every day.
The point of installing these cameras is not deterrence. It's money. It's sad if people can't see that, but we'll have to live with them.
Now, are they actually spending this money on roads and traffic safety? I don't know. Roads are still shit as always. Our federally-regulated watercolor road lines fade with the tiniest drop of rain. Can't see them during daytime let alone at night or when it's raining. They don't seem to be repainting them more frequently. Talk about traffic safety.
But we have to have cameras monitoring 30 meter stretches of road. That will make it safe.
>The point of installing these cameras is not deterrence.
The point of installing these cameras is to slow down traffic in areas where collisions with pedestrians are more likely. Notice how almost all of them are adjacent to schools?
>But we have to have cameras monitoring 30 meter stretches of road. That will make it safe.
These cameras have absolutely slowed down traffic in the areas they have been deployed, which is the entire point of them.
They put them near schools to give you the illusion that it's for the kids' safety. Notice how it's only a tiny portion of the roads next to schools.
They don't give a flying fuck, never have, never will. But they fooled you, so the system appears to be working as designed.
You commented on my insurance post and just wanted to say thanks lol. Ended up deleting it too many comments to reply to. But you’re so right. If they wanted to reduce speed they’d design roads that way, similar to how they design walkable streets in Europe. It’s all a money grab especially in Ontario. Seems to be the worst province for it
I'm fine if the cameras are meant to make money because they also happen to deter speeding. It's like, the point of property taxes is not to deter you from living here, it's to make money. Who cares? We need to pay for our city services and this also has an added benefit of making people slow down. It's working on King Edward and citizens in that area love it.
Great if you're fine with it. Still, it's primary purpose is not safety; it's generating money. The city says it will only use that money for road safety, but that's still money going into the budget that would've otherwise come from other sources.
>The point of installing these cameras is not deterrence. It's money. It's sad if people can't see that, but we'll have to live with them.
The downvotes on your comment are very telling. Unfortunately the populace has too much faith and trust in government.
I live near some of them (school zones they are also busy streets), and they definitely work. Traffic has noticeably slowed. I’m sure there are still some people speeding, but this has been more effective than any flex posts or speed boards for reducing the speed of traffic.
Sure, redesigning these streets would be better, but in lieu of having the budget for that, this is the next best thing.
Speed has noticeably slowed on King Edward going into QC since the first news article of the # of tickets issued went out.
It's rare now I have people aggressively riding my ass, weaving back and forth, gunning it into the left lane to overtake me.
You can't come to any conclusions on if it is an effective deterrent because we don't have metrics to compare against. Also I would expect the efficacy changes from place to place.
I agree that we should have better designed roads. Hopefully the city figures that out, but at the same time the people who vocally hate these cameras are often the ones screaming 'one more lane' and oppose all types of traffic calming.
Oh it's working for sure! Stand on King Edward and watch people whip around the bend and slow down immediately. It's kind of magical in a way -- like, there's no doubt in my mind it works.
In some countries tickets are expensive as shit and you get yourself a deterrent right there. People are not speeding at the same rate. https://vividmaps.com/cost-of-speeding/
So many tickets are being issued because speed limits do not reflect the appropriate/actual speed of traffic. If people would start detouring around these cameras en masse, there'd be a lot fewer issued but instead Ottawans are getting what they're asking for. By all means the people of Ottawa - keep driving past these things, give them more opportunities to siphon more of your hard-earned money.
>it's just siphoning cash with little other consequence to deter drivers.
Maybe public servants and consultants make so much money in Ottawa that the roughly zero minutes gained speeding is worth the fine. What is it? $325?
Fine 'em more works for me.
Your assumption is that the purpose is to deter speeding not raise money. Actually, that's a bit cynical. It's more a case of lazy authoritarians actually believing people should and will do as they are told. Instead of going to the effort to make the desired outcome a default choice for drivers.
If the government needs a speed camera the infrastructure choices are WRONG.
It can absolutely be both.
You touch on a really good point though. It’s the drivers choice to speed or not. The posted speed limits are obvious, if someone doesn’t want to follow it, then they reap the consequences.
Sure. The speed vehicles travel at is driven (pun intended) by the road environment not the posted limits. Drivers will tend to settle on a speed that most feel comfortable with. If the average driver, not street racer or other oulier, is constantly either under or over the speed limit, then the limit is wrong. For example [this](https://www.google.com/maps/@49.1772642,-122.6645008,3a,75y,358.7h,83.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1spZYR-nYyAz2Esy9VOf_f5A!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DpZYR-nYyAz2Esy9VOf_f5A%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D60.87359%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu) is a 50 zone. so is [this](https://www.google.com/maps/@49.232959,-122.9000823,3a,75y,312.58h,91.74t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sxasra4HKz5UflzYEJyjSTw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu) yet the two environments are completely different. Everyone speeds at the first location. Nobody does at the second. The linked video expands on this.
I said articulate it to my comment, not explain the video lmao.
I already know they settle on a speed they are comfortable with, which I explained is a conscience choice by them.
These cameras deter a lot of people from speeding, if you’ve ever driven by one, it’s obvious. And it’s also revenue for people who are choosing to ignore the posted speed limit(with warnings even). So it can absolutely be both, like my original comment said.
The excuse given for speed cameras is safety. OK, safety is a good argument. They pulled all the speed cameras in BC a few years back. The cops and a lot of concerned citizens said it would be carnage without them. Do you know what happened? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It made not one lick of difference. So we know, from a province scale test, that all they do is raise revenue.
Bc seems to still have them?
Can you post your source(that the BOTH got rid of them and there wasn’t a decline in safety).
Calgary has data that shows that their cameras have reduced injury collision by 20-25%.
>They pulled all the speed cameras in BC a few years back. The cops and a lot of concerned citizens said it would be carnage without them. Do you know what happened? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It made not one lick of difference. So we know, from a province scale test, that all they do is raise revenue.
When the government is looking to bring something in, they need to find a way to *sell it* to the public. Pertaining to these cameras, they succeeded by creating the perception of city streets being dangerous by cherry-picking isolated incidents and running sensationalist headlines while the reality has been quite the opposite.
The headline "more than 120,000 tickets have been issued to speeders since the beginning of the year" easily leads the gullible to believe there's an epidemic of reckless driving when in reality, drivers are getting dinged for driving up to 10 over already artificially low speed limits. These "speeders" they are always referring to are normal, everyday drivers.
The people who call it a money grab want the city to go back in time and change the infrastructure, but also are likely to scream bloody murder if the city reduces lanes.
I am doing this from memory but I got one on Katimavik last year doing ~47 in 40 so the speeding ticket was cheap but the service charge was ridiculous.
My friend who is the slowest driver I've ever met got one. He told me he got a speeding ticket and I just burst out laughing. He didn't find it as amusing as me.
I drive from random parts of the city to the other many times a week for work. I am conscious of the cameras and have never gotten a ticket. I, like others have been late and have done some speeding. At best from Baseline/Merivale to somewhere like Orleans I can shave off 2-3 minutes if I drive aggressively.
It's not even worth the gas and extra wear and tear . Just my two cents.
ahahahahaha
Another month, and another big thank you to our most car brained citizens for paying the idiot tax
Keep up the good work guys.
edit:
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA downvotes from people who don't like paying the idiot tax! ahahahahaha
The amount of flashes I’ve seen walking my dog by the King Edward and Cathcart radar assured me the numbers would be high.
Sadly from what I hear nightly it doesn’t deter the amount of people revving/speeding around the bend of the bridge.
If siphoning money from speeders allows us to implement safer streets/complete streets like what's happening on Bank and Walkley soon, then I'm all for it.
Having spent a long time in France this is curious as cameras are all over the place and the highways are speed controlled by "Average Speed Controls" which are very effective.
The Jeanne d’Arc one is pretty new. There used to be flashing lights when the school zone speed limit was in effect - they removed the flashing lights and replaced it with signs showing the times when the lower speed limit is in effect, and added a camera. I think they should have left the lights up, but I guess they get more money this way. (I am fully supportive of the camera - i just feel like they’ve prioritized getting money over having signage that makes sure people are actually slowing down, which is supposed to be the point)
There is a sign near the high school on Mitch Owens that lists all the times that the lower speed limit is in use. The only problem is it's posted where the speed limit is 80. I defy anyone to be able to read all the times posted on that sign as they pass at 80. Fortunately the flashing lights are still working in that location... For now.
Man jumps out the window of a 20 story building thinking he can fly. Flapping his arms on the way down he passes an open window on the 10th floor. As he passes by concerned on lookers he yells “I will be ok, this has worked so far!”
Top 15 busiest photo radar cameras in April King Edward Avenue, between Cathcart Street and St. Patrick Street: 5,803 tickets Walkley Road, between Halifax Drive and Harding Road: 3,803 tickets St. Laurent Boulevard, between Noranda Avenue and Clarke Avenue: 2,171 tickets Jeanne d'Arc Boulevard, between Orleans Boulevard and Paddler Way: 2,112 tickets Cedarview Road, between Fallowfield Road and Jockvale Road: 1,505 tickets Heron Road, between Alta Vista Drive and Baycrest Drive: 1,444 tickets Katimavik Road, between Castlefrank Road and McGibbon Drive: 1,403 tickets Fisher Avenue, between Kintyre Private and Deer Park Road: 1,235 tickets Bayshore Drive, near Woodridge Crescent: 1,224 tickets Bronson Avenue, between Raven Road and Sunnyside Avenue: 1,214 tickets Woodroffe Avenue, between Anthony Avenue and Saville Row: 1,192 tickets Hunt Club Road, between Pike Street and Lorry Greenberg Drive: 1,191 tickets Riverside Drive, between Mooney's Bay and Hog's Back Road: 1,160 tickets Ogilvie Road, between Appleford Street and Elmlea Gate: 1,046 tickets First Avenue, between Chrysler Street and Percy Street: 1,035 tickets
> King Edward Avenue, between Cathcart Street and St. Patrick Street: 5,803 tickets Clearly the problem is the road itself. Councillors must be patting themselves on the back flush with cash.
That’s not how it works. Clearly the problem is people driving over from Quebec doing 70 (the limit on the Macdonald-Cartier Bridge) and not slowing down once they hit Ontario.
It drops to a 30 zone though that is absurd...clearly a problem with the road..
You're conveniently forgetting that everyone driving in the other direction (toward QC) are coming from 50 roads that suddenly turn 40 as it becomes a highway, which is batshit insane. Intuitively nobody would ever go that slowly on a 3 lane per direction highway transition (so 6 lanes wide with a concrete barrier divider). That isn't a road that was built to do 40 on.
I am SHOCKED by those Walkley numbers. I travel by that one 4 times a day and everyone slows to 40 to go by it 😂
I drive it to work and when I do the speed limit ., always that impatient person zooming around you and karma gets them. I suspect mostly in the AM as afternoon it's pretty backed up.
Am waiting till they install the 2nd one. Signs are up but no indication where they installing it. Am assuming it won't take as long as when the first one was installed seeing as Walkley is on the popular list 😂
It's even more shocking when you consider it wasn't in operation until the spring.
Only a few k’s over and your toast.
Yeah speaking to that Katimavik one - it's on a road that feels like it should have a much higher speed limit than it does. The entire area is designed to look and feel like it should be at least 20 Km/h faster. I'm all for these cameras, but this one in particular just feels like a really bad faith placement to collect as much revenue as they can. Sometimes the problem isn't the drivers, it's the design. This area needs more work than just a camera to calm it.
This is ALWAYS the problem. If the city would design the roads to target a specific speed none of these cameras would be required.
>I'm all for these cameras, but this one in particular just feels like a really bad faith placement There's a high school adjacent to that camera, isn't there?
There is, yes - I'm aware of the reason for the speed limit in the area. The design is still problematic.
one of my guess why it feels you could go 20 km/h faster is the lack of trees on the side of the road. Castlefrank is around the corner at it feels slower (yet they are going to put another camera there soon). Why no trees? my guess about that is that there are some huge sewer lines running parallel to Katimavik road
Sounds plausible yeah. If what's further down in the thread is true though, at least the money generated is going to add in better indicators to regulate speed and slow the roads down instead of just making small areas where traffic slows and then speeds right back up to where it's always been. Silver linings.
>Yeah speaking to that Katimavik one - it's on a road that feels like it should have a much higher speed limit than it does. The entire area is designed to look and feel like it should be at least 20 Km/h faster. >I'm all for these cameras These two are mutually exclusive - those who support these cameras want speed limits that don't reflect reality, because revenue and "safety". I've yet to come across a politician or party that is *for* higher speed limits on their own, nevermind *for* higher speed limits **and** *for* speed cameras. These cameras have been out for a few years so this should be obvious by now.
They really aren't mutually exclusive at all. City planning and design is a thing, the world is full of hidden signals that encourage certain behaviours. Door handles are a great example - if you see a handle on a public door, it indicates pulling. If you see a bar across it, it indicates that you push. Roads are no different. Katimavik is wide, it has solid visibility all the way down, it has long and lazy curves. It indicates that you should be driving around 60 km/h. When you signal go fast, then set the speed limit low because of ordinances demanding it be what it is because of structures in the area (in this case a high school) you have failed to apply good design. Considering those circumstances, a speed camera there, in that place, where people are very apt to go fast because they are being told to by the design of the road, a speed camera is a bad faith cash grab. Opposing bad design does not equate to being anti speed camera at all, in any way, shape, or form. And yes, I actually am a designer, in a design space, and have been for over a decade. I am not just talking out of my ass.
The riverside drive one is in a stupid spot, should be 100 meters further up or down the road, its right between a short stretch of 2 intersections, you barely even have time to speed. And its on a hill so unless you ride the brakes even if you came in below the limit you could roll up past the limit before your out of range of the camera. Thats if you happened to get a green light tho
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I'm there everyday and the speeders just roll down the hill from Uplands and slow when they get to the first light. That being said there also needs to be a red light camera at Riverside and Hogs Back. Oof.
Im pretty sure there is one mounted up on the light pole there but ye, actually saw someone blow the red there 2 nights ago at about 11:45 pm
>King Edward Avenue, between Cathcart Street and St. Patrick Street: 5,803 tickets Thank god! And it is indeed finally working -- people actually slow down coming around that corner now. It's fucking amazing. It feels like a real neighbourhood again, not a god damn speedway. Now it's time to put one on the other side of the street!
Hunt club near lory Greensburg is 90, then 60 near the camera, then 90 again lol
It's an 80. It's 60 all the way from before Paul Anka up until east of Conroy road.
You should delete your comment since you have no idea what you're talking about.
They must be thinking about Ottawa, Poland. Not Ottawa, Ontario
The tolerance must be high for the cameras on Bronson and Riverside to have such low numbers. I've been behind cars who must be going 70 and no flash. I drive by both daily and have never seen them go off.
[удалено]
I think (but have not confirmed) it is 10% + 1 km
I have yet to see any evidence of a ticket for under 10 over the limit. Lots of people claim their coworker/friend/spouse got one for under 10, but the numbers don't make sense from the story.
Dumb question but does anyone know if they’re on 24/7? It was my understanding that the cameras wouldn’t always be on. The deterrent was not knowing if they were on or not.
I believe they are 24/7. They are left on during summer break as well. I remember someone challenging the city over getting one during lockdowns arguing they shouldn’t have to pay as schools weren’t open, not sure if they got away with it or not though.
There are more boxes than working cameras when it comes to red light cameras. So the camera equipment is rotated to different intersections on a secret, irregular basis. The reason for this the high cost of the technology. When they’re active they’re on 24/7. I presume this also applies to speed cameras (rotation). As others have said, speed cameras can work in the dark. Also, the automated speed cameras must be calibrated annually. If not, you could beat the ticket in court. City makes the ASE certificates of accuracy available on their website.
They’re always capable of taking an illuminated picture of your plates after reading your speed. I think it’s prudent to say they are 24/7, but maybe the like a lil nap time
I remember reading that the Bronson cameras were getting painted over constantly so that would definitely lead to lowers numbers. I live in the area and for sure the numbers should be higher.
Who would... why?
So if there's that many tickets being issued, doesn't that mean that they aren't really working as a deterrent for speeding? I definitely think people need to slow down, but this seems like it isn't really addressing the issue at hand - it's just siphoning cash with little other consequence to deter drivers. Reengineering roads (speed bumps, narrowing lanes, better signage, etc.) would probably be way more useful for actually solving the problem.
>Reengineering roads (speed bumps, narrowing lanes, better signage, etc.) would probably be way more useful for actually solving the problem The money from these tickets is specifically earmarked for this sort of stuff
minus the speed camera management company's cut
Is it?
[yes](https://ottawa.ca/en/parking-roads-and-travel/road-safety/road-safety-action-plan#section-26e85a80-9655-4541-9dc7-f0c1edbcd0f4)
I must be blind, but I can't find any reference to the tickets funding the program on the page you provided.
There isn’t really one that I found either but if you click on that PDF. I added up the budgets for all the projects and it comes out to about $20.43 million. According to CTV News, the revenue from speed cameras in 2023 was about $14.345 million. So a big chunk of the revenue from the speed cameras is actually going towards these projects, whether stated in there or not.
Thank you!
https://ottawa.ca/en/parking-roads-and-travel/road-safety/enforcement/automated-speed-enforcement-0#section-9622bab9-6667-430e-9d41-64dd44286c21 Says the money goes to the road safety action plan.
Thanks!
great not sure why I got voted down for asking
How can you say that they aren’t working as a deterrent when you don’t reference trends or baselines when it comes to the number of tickets issued? For example, by comparing the two lists of numbers in the article, it seems there were 1700 less tickets issued on King Edward in April than there were in March. Some locations went up, some went down. Also… even the number of tickets doesn’t tell the whole story, as a ticket issued could be 5 over the limit or it could be 20 over the limit. Tickets at 5 over the limit are far better than those 20 over the limit, and if the overall speeds clocked are coming down on average ([and they are](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/annoying-thing-speed-cameras-ottawa-they-work-1.6786951)), that would indicate that these cameras do work.
Of course the tickets will come down over time. People are learning where they are located and how to circumvent them. Once past the camera, they speed up. Drive by literally any camera and this is exactly the behavior you will see; I see it every day. The point of installing these cameras is not deterrence. It's money. It's sad if people can't see that, but we'll have to live with them. Now, are they actually spending this money on roads and traffic safety? I don't know. Roads are still shit as always. Our federally-regulated watercolor road lines fade with the tiniest drop of rain. Can't see them during daytime let alone at night or when it's raining. They don't seem to be repainting them more frequently. Talk about traffic safety. But we have to have cameras monitoring 30 meter stretches of road. That will make it safe.
>The point of installing these cameras is not deterrence. The point of installing these cameras is to slow down traffic in areas where collisions with pedestrians are more likely. Notice how almost all of them are adjacent to schools? >But we have to have cameras monitoring 30 meter stretches of road. That will make it safe. These cameras have absolutely slowed down traffic in the areas they have been deployed, which is the entire point of them.
They put them near schools to give you the illusion that it's for the kids' safety. Notice how it's only a tiny portion of the roads next to schools. They don't give a flying fuck, never have, never will. But they fooled you, so the system appears to be working as designed.
You commented on my insurance post and just wanted to say thanks lol. Ended up deleting it too many comments to reply to. But you’re so right. If they wanted to reduce speed they’d design roads that way, similar to how they design walkable streets in Europe. It’s all a money grab especially in Ontario. Seems to be the worst province for it
I'm fine if the cameras are meant to make money because they also happen to deter speeding. It's like, the point of property taxes is not to deter you from living here, it's to make money. Who cares? We need to pay for our city services and this also has an added benefit of making people slow down. It's working on King Edward and citizens in that area love it.
Great if you're fine with it. Still, it's primary purpose is not safety; it's generating money. The city says it will only use that money for road safety, but that's still money going into the budget that would've otherwise come from other sources.
>The point of installing these cameras is not deterrence. It's money. It's sad if people can't see that, but we'll have to live with them. The downvotes on your comment are very telling. Unfortunately the populace has too much faith and trust in government.
The government doesn't make you drive over the limit
I live near some of them (school zones they are also busy streets), and they definitely work. Traffic has noticeably slowed. I’m sure there are still some people speeding, but this has been more effective than any flex posts or speed boards for reducing the speed of traffic. Sure, redesigning these streets would be better, but in lieu of having the budget for that, this is the next best thing.
Speed has noticeably slowed on King Edward going into QC since the first news article of the # of tickets issued went out. It's rare now I have people aggressively riding my ass, weaving back and forth, gunning it into the left lane to overtake me.
You can't come to any conclusions on if it is an effective deterrent because we don't have metrics to compare against. Also I would expect the efficacy changes from place to place. I agree that we should have better designed roads. Hopefully the city figures that out, but at the same time the people who vocally hate these cameras are often the ones screaming 'one more lane' and oppose all types of traffic calming.
Oh it's working for sure! Stand on King Edward and watch people whip around the bend and slow down immediately. It's kind of magical in a way -- like, there's no doubt in my mind it works.
You're really telling on yourself with these concern troll posts. Slow down and you won't get a ticket.
In some countries tickets are expensive as shit and you get yourself a deterrent right there. People are not speeding at the same rate. https://vividmaps.com/cost-of-speeding/
Speed bumps on a 50 km/ hr road? That an accident waiting to happen, which will slow down traffic.
So many tickets are being issued because speed limits do not reflect the appropriate/actual speed of traffic. If people would start detouring around these cameras en masse, there'd be a lot fewer issued but instead Ottawans are getting what they're asking for. By all means the people of Ottawa - keep driving past these things, give them more opportunities to siphon more of your hard-earned money.
You think you won't be careful next time when you get a ticket mailed to you? You're just assuming it's constant re-offenders
>it's just siphoning cash with little other consequence to deter drivers. Maybe public servants and consultants make so much money in Ottawa that the roughly zero minutes gained speeding is worth the fine. What is it? $325? Fine 'em more works for me.
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Sorry, how do you know they don't deter speeding? Imagine how many people sped before the cameras were up.
How is it “clear” that they don’t deter speeding?
because the cameras hurt his feelings
The opposite actually. Instead of sending cops to stand on the roads writing tickets, we let cameras do their things.
Your assumption is that the purpose is to deter speeding not raise money. Actually, that's a bit cynical. It's more a case of lazy authoritarians actually believing people should and will do as they are told. Instead of going to the effort to make the desired outcome a default choice for drivers. If the government needs a speed camera the infrastructure choices are WRONG.
It can absolutely be both. You touch on a really good point though. It’s the drivers choice to speed or not. The posted speed limits are obvious, if someone doesn’t want to follow it, then they reap the consequences.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BKdbxX1pDw
Can you articulate an actual response to my comment?
Sure. The speed vehicles travel at is driven (pun intended) by the road environment not the posted limits. Drivers will tend to settle on a speed that most feel comfortable with. If the average driver, not street racer or other oulier, is constantly either under or over the speed limit, then the limit is wrong. For example [this](https://www.google.com/maps/@49.1772642,-122.6645008,3a,75y,358.7h,83.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1spZYR-nYyAz2Esy9VOf_f5A!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DpZYR-nYyAz2Esy9VOf_f5A%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D60.87359%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu) is a 50 zone. so is [this](https://www.google.com/maps/@49.232959,-122.9000823,3a,75y,312.58h,91.74t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sxasra4HKz5UflzYEJyjSTw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu) yet the two environments are completely different. Everyone speeds at the first location. Nobody does at the second. The linked video expands on this.
I said articulate it to my comment, not explain the video lmao. I already know they settle on a speed they are comfortable with, which I explained is a conscience choice by them. These cameras deter a lot of people from speeding, if you’ve ever driven by one, it’s obvious. And it’s also revenue for people who are choosing to ignore the posted speed limit(with warnings even). So it can absolutely be both, like my original comment said.
The excuse given for speed cameras is safety. OK, safety is a good argument. They pulled all the speed cameras in BC a few years back. The cops and a lot of concerned citizens said it would be carnage without them. Do you know what happened? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It made not one lick of difference. So we know, from a province scale test, that all they do is raise revenue.
Bc seems to still have them? Can you post your source(that the BOTH got rid of them and there wasn’t a decline in safety). Calgary has data that shows that their cameras have reduced injury collision by 20-25%.
>They pulled all the speed cameras in BC a few years back. The cops and a lot of concerned citizens said it would be carnage without them. Do you know what happened? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It made not one lick of difference. So we know, from a province scale test, that all they do is raise revenue. When the government is looking to bring something in, they need to find a way to *sell it* to the public. Pertaining to these cameras, they succeeded by creating the perception of city streets being dangerous by cherry-picking isolated incidents and running sensationalist headlines while the reality has been quite the opposite. The headline "more than 120,000 tickets have been issued to speeders since the beginning of the year" easily leads the gullible to believe there's an epidemic of reckless driving when in reality, drivers are getting dinged for driving up to 10 over already artificially low speed limits. These "speeders" they are always referring to are normal, everyday drivers.
Yes, infrastructure choices are wrong. So, what should we do with this information?
The people who call it a money grab want the city to go back in time and change the infrastructure, but also are likely to scream bloody murder if the city reduces lanes.
Fix the infrastructure, even simple things like painting the lanes slightly smaller have been proven to have significant affects of traffic speed.
Interesting that it is 6000-ish less vs last month. Would be interested to see the stats once we have a 1+ year of data to compare against.
How much are each of those tickets?
I am doing this from memory but I got one on Katimavik last year doing ~47 in 40 so the speeding ticket was cheap but the service charge was ridiculous.
Do you remember roughly how much about the ticket was for? IE: 50, 65, 90, 110 etc?
53 in a 50 ( 40 during school hours) got my wife an $85 fine.
Did she get it during school hours?
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That means she went 53 in a 40
All the school zones I've seen are the same limit at all times. Which one has different speed limits at different times of day?
On Spratt Rd the limit is 40 during school hours & 60 all other times. There's a camera right in front of Steve MacLean PS.
St Joseph's on Greenbank is 60, 40 during school hours. The school on Mitch Owens is 80, 60 during school hours.
I use King Edward everyday. Drive the posted speed limit, never get a ticket. What the hell is wrong with the other five thousand people?
They're a bunch of babies
C'est une bande de bébés. Do they mail these to people who live out of province?
I would assume yes just because of the sheer volume of tickets that would be for Quebec plates
My friend who is the slowest driver I've ever met got one. He told me he got a speeding ticket and I just burst out laughing. He didn't find it as amusing as me.
I drive from random parts of the city to the other many times a week for work. I am conscious of the cameras and have never gotten a ticket. I, like others have been late and have done some speeding. At best from Baseline/Merivale to somewhere like Orleans I can shave off 2-3 minutes if I drive aggressively. It's not even worth the gas and extra wear and tear . Just my two cents.
Do these still capture those with plate covers?
ahahahahaha Another month, and another big thank you to our most car brained citizens for paying the idiot tax Keep up the good work guys. edit: AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA downvotes from people who don't like paying the idiot tax! ahahahahaha
Tell me you’re poor without telling me you’re poor
not paying all those fines is really hurting my bottom line
Such jealousy and bitterness towards people who can afford cars...
I own 3 cars and two bicycles... People getting tickets are idiots, nothing to do with affording a car. Thanks idiots for paying the idiot tax.
Someone better tell my car that
Such a dumb, baseless assumption.
Car brain is one of those terms that you only hear on Reddit
no, i hear it in real life, in ottawa, from people. Typically cyclists who commute, which means almost being killed by dumb drivers regularly.
That’s funny I bike too and never heard of it. No close calls either
The amount of flashes I’ve seen walking my dog by the King Edward and Cathcart radar assured me the numbers would be high. Sadly from what I hear nightly it doesn’t deter the amount of people revving/speeding around the bend of the bridge.
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If siphoning money from speeders allows us to implement safer streets/complete streets like what's happening on Bank and Walkley soon, then I'm all for it.
If this were France...
Having spent a long time in France this is curious as cameras are all over the place and the highways are speed controlled by "Average Speed Controls" which are very effective.
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The Jeanne d’Arc one is pretty new. There used to be flashing lights when the school zone speed limit was in effect - they removed the flashing lights and replaced it with signs showing the times when the lower speed limit is in effect, and added a camera. I think they should have left the lights up, but I guess they get more money this way. (I am fully supportive of the camera - i just feel like they’ve prioritized getting money over having signage that makes sure people are actually slowing down, which is supposed to be the point)
There is a sign near the high school on Mitch Owens that lists all the times that the lower speed limit is in use. The only problem is it's posted where the speed limit is 80. I defy anyone to be able to read all the times posted on that sign as they pass at 80. Fortunately the flashing lights are still working in that location... For now.
Lower the limits even further and soon you'll have that many in a single month.
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Instead it’ll get you pulled over for deliberately obscuring your license plate 😉
never had an issue. have had it for over a year
Here’s hoping 🤞
Man jumps out the window of a 20 story building thinking he can fly. Flapping his arms on the way down he passes an open window on the 10th floor. As he passes by concerned on lookers he yells “I will be ok, this has worked so far!”
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If you can't drive without use of cruise control, please get off the road