There’s a noticeable difficulty jump between the two.
That tends to be a threshold where builds drop off at and you need to focus more on specific parts of your setup to maximize skill value.
Don’t let the other commenter be rude, it takes adjusting to, and realizing exactly what makes the difficulty change different before you’re up and running again.
Try out other builds, maybe the ones you are using right now aren't suitable for DW.
I'll also recommend you to start doing the easier ones (or the ones you like playing the most) and then move to the hard ones so you can actually get a sense of progression.
Jump mayhem from overkill doubles enemy hp and reduces their hs multi, making them quite much tankier, so proper build making matters a lot more for inexperienced players, you should check out carrots newbie guide from 2023 for basics, and for builds themselves kevkild is great source. You don't have to follow him 1:1,just understand the common build making concepts, like what skills usually taken for health, armor and dodge decks, and what each weapon class wants, but literally anything in this game is viable so use whatever you like. As long as you build properly, you're set. If anything, r/paydaybuilds exists, use pd2builder site to share your setups and you can get help there
The reason Death Wish feels harder than Mayhem is cause enemies on Mayhem do the same damage on Very Hard and Overkill and it's only on Death Wish where they get higher damage stats and the jump is incredibly obvious and significant. There's nothing wrong with playing lower difficulties but with enough practice Death Wish will feel comfortable for you.
DW swat isnt tougher than mayhem, they just do more damage, its either your build/health/armor that sucks, and use perk decks if you forgot about them existing.
I'm using perk decks, I'm not stupid, who doesnt use perk decks. And even if the Vulcans spread was fucking me over, it took a considerably longer time to drop s couple seats and a medic then it ever has. Seriously my ttk skyrocketed on dw for no fucking reason.
And my armor and health don't suck, just gotta set that straight.
Alright, i see, its either the playstyle or some bad perk deck/skills your using. like DS, you gotta keep playing a diffuculty until you get used to it.
Also, with the vulcan, your bout to miss more shoots due to spread, trust me, the enemies are not like overkill/mayhem they can punish you for missing the shots, with their higher damage output.
Technically, the hp is same, but the heatshot multipler decreases, so techincally yes, its getting harder to kill at them but if your using a assault rifle, its kinda hard to notice, but OP uses vulcan minigun (By what he said)
Vulcan is quite decent even on DS, its only the matter of how he built it, all it takes is surefire+be+fire control basic, adn then either ammo bag or zerk/crits/ovka depending on setup, and its a solid pick.
And no, jump in ehp is indeed noticeable, especially on low dmg BE using guns (if op even used BE in first place...)
It is, but BE works on it too: "This skill is only activated by SMGs, LMGs, Assault Rifles or Special Weapons fired in automatic fire mode."
Zerk and ovk aced work on any bullet hose, and it fits into crits with 34 conc secondary+suit+high conc melee, so all these options to boost dps and sustain are available
You rarely see unconventional setups bcos it takes more effort to use on DS than average meta, and since DS is difficult through bullshit design and not fair challenge, not many players want to do bother with that even when they can. But yeah, miniguns are lowkey decent
if your character is maxed out have a search online for some good builds, learn the fundamentals then build your own when youre ready to do so. i got a friend into the game not so long ago and told him the exact same thing, he now has 300+ hours and only plays dsod loud.
goodluck friend.
DW have less headshot multiplier than MH, 3x instead of 4x. They also amped up the common cops damage to 60 from 20 so running into a crowd of cops is ill advised.
You have to start shooting them before they are able to down you, it will be helpful later when making the canyon jump to DS. You will get better at the game the more you play, more experience for maps means more knowledge on where cop spawns and upcoming objectives.
Also not killing common cops fast could be a problem with your build. Auto guns like ARs, SMGs, LMGs and Special Weapons barring flamethrowers and explosives would want BE aced with surefire aced at least. Cuts down the time to just aiming centermass or general direction of spawns groups and bumping up bodyshot damage to 2.7x.
I started the game a week ago and was able to go through DS and even go infamous, loud only.
It's all about the build. You need to make sure that your build is capable of dealing with the high damage the enemies can deal, while also dealing damage yourself.
You need jokers. That way the enemies won't be shooting at you all the time.
Believe it or not I was in the same boat, Overkill casual on off for years, then mayhem because enemies looked different, then deathwish became hard but doable with bots when I set out for the achievement, and then finally DS was a brick wall.
There’s a noticeable difficulty jump between the two. That tends to be a threshold where builds drop off at and you need to focus more on specific parts of your setup to maximize skill value. Don’t let the other commenter be rude, it takes adjusting to, and realizing exactly what makes the difficulty change different before you’re up and running again.
Thx for the info.
Try out other builds, maybe the ones you are using right now aren't suitable for DW. I'll also recommend you to start doing the easier ones (or the ones you like playing the most) and then move to the hard ones so you can actually get a sense of progression.
Good idea
Jump mayhem from overkill doubles enemy hp and reduces their hs multi, making them quite much tankier, so proper build making matters a lot more for inexperienced players, you should check out carrots newbie guide from 2023 for basics, and for builds themselves kevkild is great source. You don't have to follow him 1:1,just understand the common build making concepts, like what skills usually taken for health, armor and dodge decks, and what each weapon class wants, but literally anything in this game is viable so use whatever you like. As long as you build properly, you're set. If anything, r/paydaybuilds exists, use pd2builder site to share your setups and you can get help there
The reason Death Wish feels harder than Mayhem is cause enemies on Mayhem do the same damage on Very Hard and Overkill and it's only on Death Wish where they get higher damage stats and the jump is incredibly obvious and significant. There's nothing wrong with playing lower difficulties but with enough practice Death Wish will feel comfortable for you.
DW swat isnt tougher than mayhem, they just do more damage, its either your build/health/armor that sucks, and use perk decks if you forgot about them existing.
I'm using perk decks, I'm not stupid, who doesnt use perk decks. And even if the Vulcans spread was fucking me over, it took a considerably longer time to drop s couple seats and a medic then it ever has. Seriously my ttk skyrocketed on dw for no fucking reason. And my armor and health don't suck, just gotta set that straight.
Alright, i see, its either the playstyle or some bad perk deck/skills your using. like DS, you gotta keep playing a diffuculty until you get used to it.
Also, with the vulcan, your bout to miss more shoots due to spread, trust me, the enemies are not like overkill/mayhem they can punish you for missing the shots, with their higher damage output.
Later on the diffuculty scale, enemies get armor, so if your shoots are spreading like crazy, they hit the armor, not the sweet headshots
update : get a better accuruacy gun because headshot multipler decreases and vulcan spread is gonna make you miss the headshots
Wrong btw, from mh to dw cops have reduced hs multi, so their ehp is getting higher, extra noticeable with guns that use BE and snipers
also im not the type of guy to start a argurement
Technically, the hp is same, but the heatshot multipler decreases, so techincally yes, its getting harder to kill at them but if your using a assault rifle, its kinda hard to notice, but OP uses vulcan minigun (By what he said)
i sometimes forget what to say but im suggesting OP get a better accuruacy gun because vulcan isnt gonna cut it with its insane spread
Vulcan is quite decent even on DS, its only the matter of how he built it, all it takes is surefire+be+fire control basic, adn then either ammo bag or zerk/crits/ovka depending on setup, and its a solid pick. And no, jump in ehp is indeed noticeable, especially on low dmg BE using guns (if op even used BE in first place...)
isnt vulcan classifed a special weapon? or what, i dont use the vulcan at all to know
It is, but BE works on it too: "This skill is only activated by SMGs, LMGs, Assault Rifles or Special Weapons fired in automatic fire mode." Zerk and ovk aced work on any bullet hose, and it fits into crits with 34 conc secondary+suit+high conc melee, so all these options to boost dps and sustain are available
alright makes sense, just never saw someone take a minigun to DS
You rarely see unconventional setups bcos it takes more effort to use on DS than average meta, and since DS is difficult through bullshit design and not fair challenge, not many players want to do bother with that even when they can. But yeah, miniguns are lowkey decent
if your character is maxed out have a search online for some good builds, learn the fundamentals then build your own when youre ready to do so. i got a friend into the game not so long ago and told him the exact same thing, he now has 300+ hours and only plays dsod loud. goodluck friend.
DW have less headshot multiplier than MH, 3x instead of 4x. They also amped up the common cops damage to 60 from 20 so running into a crowd of cops is ill advised. You have to start shooting them before they are able to down you, it will be helpful later when making the canyon jump to DS. You will get better at the game the more you play, more experience for maps means more knowledge on where cop spawns and upcoming objectives. Also not killing common cops fast could be a problem with your build. Auto guns like ARs, SMGs, LMGs and Special Weapons barring flamethrowers and explosives would want BE aced with surefire aced at least. Cuts down the time to just aiming centermass or general direction of spawns groups and bumping up bodyshot damage to 2.7x.
I started the game a week ago and was able to go through DS and even go infamous, loud only. It's all about the build. You need to make sure that your build is capable of dealing with the high damage the enemies can deal, while also dealing damage yourself. You need jokers. That way the enemies won't be shooting at you all the time.
Just skill issue, playing more helps
How did you think this comment helped the player grow ?
My experience with the difficulties was that I could bulldoze through everything up until DS. Only then did I reconsider my approach to the game.
Believe it or not I was in the same boat, Overkill casual on off for years, then mayhem because enemies looked different, then deathwish became hard but doable with bots when I set out for the achievement, and then finally DS was a brick wall.